Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[floridamom]

Anna and most of these young girls were not allowed to figure out what it is that THEY want when they 'grew up". They were TOLD what it is that they SHOULD want. The idea has never crossed Anna's mind. She is living out the Gothard script and was promised from when she was a little girl that if she followed that script, God would reward her with a perfect husband for her and that she would have a happy and satisfying married life. End of story.   This did not happen for her. She must have questioned why; I am still curious as to what it was that her parents and the Duggar parents told her then. We have not heard what it was that Anna wanted to do to make a bad situation worse.  As a human being, I highly suspect that Anna will never completely trust Joshie and that she will always have a bit of suspicion around things when he leaves the house or when he's on his phone. 

[queenanne]

6 hours ago, floridamom said:

Anna and most of these young girls were not allowed to figure out what it is that THEY want when they 'grew up". They were TOLD what it is that they SHOULD want. The idea has never crossed Anna's mind. She is living out the Gothard script and was promised from when she was a little girl that if she followed that script, God would reward her with a perfect husband for her and that she would have a happy and satisfying married life. End of story.   This did not happen for her. She must have questioned why; I am still curious as to what it was that her parents and the Duggar parents told her then. We have not heard what it was that Anna wanted to do to make a bad situation worse.  As a human being, I highly suspect that Anna will never completely trust Joshie and that she will always have a bit of suspicion around things when he leaves the house or when he's on his phone. 

I imagine the thing Anna wanted to do was ‘file for divorce’, no mystery there for me.  It’s the thing she’d consider the worst thing she could do.  Even Anna couldn’t mean ‘I almost used bad language at him!’ as her worst thing ever.

[JoanArc]

49 minutes ago, queenanne said:

I imagine the thing Anna wanted to do was ‘file for divorce’, no mystery there for me.

Which is why Jim bob and Michelle never let her out of their sight during the scandal, lest she go to her parents or siblings and go through with it. 

[Loves2Dance]

On 1/2/2019 at 11:04 AM, Zahdii said:

Is it time to lure Josh back into the bedroom with a sandwich?

"Here Joshua!  Look!  A sandwich!  Made just for you!  Here boy!  Come and get it!  Good boy!  Now, there's just one little thing you have to do first...

Get up on the bed.  Come on.  Good boy!  Now just close your eyes and think of pastrami.  That's it!  Think of cheese!  Oohh, yes, that's the ticket!  Mustard!  Oh yes, mustard is the best!  Pickles, Joshua, pickles!  We're almost there!  Onion!  Yesss, onion on Rye!  We did it!!!!! 

Joshua, I think you deserve a treat.  After your sandwich, how about we get you some ice cream?"

I don't know if I should applaud you or drink bleach after reading that. 

[andromeda331]

21 hours ago, JoanArc said:

Which is why Jim bob and Michelle never let her out of their sight during the scandal, lest she go to her parents or siblings and go through with it. 

Exactly. They didn't just keep an eye on her they moved her into their home which may come of nice and maybe that's how they worded it to her she'd have Jana to help her with her kids and not be alone. But had her sleep in the girls room. Zero chance to be alone and possibly realize how messed up her situation is and consider divorce. Not even alone in at night in a bedroom. 

Edited January 15, 2019 by andromeda331

[Rabbittron]

20 hours ago, Loves2Dance said:

I don't know if I should applaud you or drink bleach after reading that. 

[awaken]

12 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

Exactly. They didn't just keep an eye on her they moved her into their home which may come of nice and maybe that's how they worded it to her she'd have Jana to help her with her kids and not be alone. But had her sleep in the girls room. Zero chance to be alone and possibly realize how messed up her situation is and consider divorce. Not even alone in at night in a bedroom. 

I think of how good it feels sometimes to be alone in the house when everyone else is at school and work. To take a nap in a quiet house. Or to be at work and close the door and focus on a project. Or the bliss of grocery shopping by myself and sitting with a pastry and latte after. These people haven’t and won’t ever get the chance to know how that can feel!  How confining and stifling. I feel claustrophobic just writing this. 

[lookeyloo]

10 hours ago, awaken said:

I think of how good it feels sometimes to be alone in the house when everyone else is at school and work. To take a nap in a quiet house. Or to be at work and close the door and focus on a project. Or the bliss of grocery shopping by myself and sitting with a pastry and latte after. These people haven’t and won’t ever get the chance to know how that can feel!  How confining and stifling. I feel claustrophobic just writing this. 

I enjoy that too.  When we have house guests, all of whom I love and like having around, when they leave I am totally exhausted from having to make conversation - I enjoy these conversations - its just there is no down time.  It must be like that at the TTH.  Chaos and commotion all the time.  No place for Anna or any of them to get a clear thought going.  Not even the bathroom, I think, because there are two toilets in some of them.  

[Westiepeach]

1 minute ago, lookeyloo said:

I enjoy that too.  When we have house guests, all of whom I love and like having around, when they leave I am totally exhausted from having to make conversation - I enjoy these conversations - its just there is no down time.  It must be like that at the TTH.  Chaos and commotion all the time.  No place for Anna or any of them to get a clear thought going.  Not even the bathroom, I think, because there are two toilets in some of them.  

No! Please tell me you are just playing with me and making that up...

[Darknight]

On 1/2/2019 at 11:04 AM, Zahdii said:

Is it time to lure Josh back into the bedroom with a sandwich?

"Here Joshua!  Look!  A sandwich!  Made just for you!  Here boy!  Come and get it!  Good boy!  Now, there's just one little thing you have to do first...

Get up on the bed.  Come on.  Good boy!  Now just close your eyes and think of pastrami.  That's it!  Think of cheese!  Oohh, yes, that's the ticket!  Mustard!  Oh yes, mustard is the best!  Pickles, Joshua, pickles!  We're almost there!  Onion!  Yesss, onion on Rye!  We did it!!!!! 

Joshua, I think you deserve a treat.  After your sandwich, how about we get you some ice cream?"

O God I just visualized this. Gross. 

[MargeGunderson]

12 hours ago, awaken said:

I think of how good it feels sometimes to be alone in the house when everyone else is at school and work. To take a nap in a quiet house. Or to be at work and close the door and focus on a project. Or the bliss of grocery shopping by myself and sitting with a pastry and latte after. These people haven’t and won’t ever get the chance to know how that can feel!  How confining and stifling. I feel claustrophobic just writing this. 

The whole never be alone or have some privacy is just another way that fundy parents exert control over their kids. If you never have a minute to yourself it's pretty hard to develop an independent thought or reflect on how screwed up everything is. They have perpetual accountability partners - first their parents and siblings, then their spouses. I would have absolutely withered in that environment. 

[Churchhoney]

4 hours ago, Westiepeach said:

No! Please tell me you are just playing with me and making that up...

I think one of them is a child's size toilet. .....

When a normal person creates a bathroom like that, it's just because they don't want to have a bathroom that ONLY has a child-sized toilet....Because then nobody bigger can use that bathroom......

And that may be the case with the Duggars, too. However, since they're the Duggars, who'd even know what their intention (or ordinary usage pattern) would be?!

[Zella]

Just now, Churchhoney said:

And that may be the case with the Duggars, too. However, since they're the Duggars, who'd even know what their intention (or ordinary usage pattern) would be?!

This made me laugh so hard that simply liking it was insufficient!

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

Let me say, I'm not throwing shade at Anna for gaining some weight, because after having babies post-30, I have gained-lost-gained-etc.  And even though she's gained weight, she's hardly obese or anything.

I know for me, a lot of weight gain has to do with my mental health.  When I'm depressed, I'm more likely to gain weight or eat my feelings.  At times when I've felt like many things were out of my control, food was something I could control (whether it be to eat better or worse or more or less).  Sometimes people who have been abused will (perhaps unconsciously) gain weight as a way to make themselves unattractive to the person who abuses them.  I think any of these things are possible with Anna: depression, feeling like she can't control how her life worked out, not wanting Josh to bug her (or worse) for sex, or just plain trying to make herself unappealing to Josh because she finds him as gross as we do (or maybe is even over having kids).  It could be some form of self-protection.

It could be that Josh likes her thin and she's gained weight to passively do something/be something he doesn't like.  It could be she realized he long ago decided he didn't need to be assed to stay fit and trim to be attractive for her, so why should she deprive herself of junk food and the like to stay then for him? It could be the only kind of subterfuge that Anna (thinks she is) able to do.  

My husband used to be much more naturally thin and athletic (for years, he could get up off the couch with no training in months and run a 5K faster than I could with months of training; that's not the case any more after he hit 35).  He used to be able to eat all the garbage and drink all the booze without gaining any weight.  Even now, he's only maybe 10-15lbs overweight, and I'd be huge if I ate like he does. However, I have felt the pressure to really maintain a "thin" weight wane as he's gained a little weight in the past couple of years.  Let me be clear - he's never pressured me to be thin or even really "noticed" I've gained weight or cared.  It was all me and my perception that I needed to be thinner since I was with this guy with a nice, athletic build so we'd "fit" together aesthetically as a couple (which is stupid I know, but I felt the pressure from society anyway). I feel much less pressure about staying as thin as I once did now that he's not quite as svelte as he once was.  So I give into indulgences more and more often (and have less time to exercise as I did pre-kids and at the level I was at before kids/medical issues).  Since Josh hasn't been thin or actively caring about his own diet/exercise/weight to remain "physically attractive" to Anna for years, I kinda say "GO ANNA" if she's just decided she doesn't have to give any Fs about being super thin for her husband (as the Gothard cult emphasizes women should be) since Joshua obviously gives no Fs about staying thin for her.  Obviously, I'd love for her to do the healthy thing and address these issues clearly with him (and divorce him). I also assume that since she isn't on TV anymore much, she also doesn't feel the need to be "TV-thin" and that makes it easier for her to be more lax about what she eats. 

In any case, I hope Anna can find a way to deal with any issues in a more healthy way than through food/weight gain, but I can't knock on her for gaining a few pounds in her position.  Anna also seems to gain weight like I do.  I gain weight in my face and upper body and it sucks because it's hard to hide in photos when it's in your face and upper body. 

Edited January 16, 2019 by MyPeopleAreNordic

[Christina87]

On 1/16/2019 at 5:03 PM, MyPeopleAreNordic said:

Let me say, I'm not throwing shade at Anna for gaining some weight, because after having babies post-30, I have gained-lost-gained-etc.  And even though she's gained weight, she's hardly obese or anything.

I know for me, a lot of weight gain has to do with my mental health.  When I'm depressed, I'm more likely to gain weight or eat my feelings.  At times when I've felt like many things were out of my control, food was something I could control (whether it be to eat better or worse or more or less).  Sometimes people who have been abused will (perhaps unconsciously) gain weight as a way to make themselves unattractive to the person who abuses them.  I think any of these things are possible with Anna: depression, feeling like she can't control how her life worked out, not wanting Josh to bug her (or worse) for sex, or just plain trying to make herself unappealing to Josh because she finds him as gross as we do (or maybe is even over having kids).  It could be some form of self-protection.

It could be that Josh likes her thin and she's gained weight to passively do something/be something he doesn't like.  It could be she realized he long ago decided he didn't need to be assed to stay fit and trim to be attractive for her, so why should she deprive herself of junk food and the like to stay then for him? It could be the only kind of subterfuge that Anna (thinks she is) able to do.  

My husband used to be much more naturally thin and athletic (for years, he could get up off the couch with no training in months and run a 5K faster than I could with months of training; that's not the case any more after he hit 35).  He used to be able to eat all the garbage and drink all the booze without gaining any weight.  Even now, he's only maybe 10-15lbs overweight, and I'd be huge if I ate like he does. However, I have felt the pressure to really maintain a "thin" weight wane as he's gained a little weight in the past couple of years.  Let me be clear - he's never pressured me to be thin or even really "noticed" I've gained weight or cared.  It was all me and my perception that I needed to be thinner since I was with this guy with a nice, athletic build so we'd "fit" together aesthetically as a couple (which is stupid I know, but I felt the pressure from society anyway). I feel much less pressure about staying as thin as I once did now that he's not quite as svelte as he once was.  So I give into indulgences more and more often (and have less time to exercise as I did pre-kids and at the level I was at before kids/medical issues).  Since Josh hasn't been thin or actively caring about his own diet/exercise/weight to remain "physically attractive" to Anna for years, I kinda say "GO ANNA" if she's just decided she doesn't have to give any Fs about being super thin for her husband (as the Gothard cult emphasizes women should be) since Joshua obviously gives no Fs about staying thin for her.  Obviously, I'd love for her to do the healthy thing and address these issues clearly with him (and divorce him). I also assume that since she isn't on TV anymore much, she also doesn't feel the need to be "TV-thin" and that makes it easier for her to be more lax about what she eats. 

In any case, I hope Anna can find a way to deal with any issues in a more healthy way than through food/weight gain, but I can't knock on her for gaining a few pounds in her position.  Anna also seems to gain weight like I do.  I gain weight in my face and upper body and it sucks because it's hard to hide in photos when it's in your face and upper body. 

Oh i hope it is subterfuge! I would feel the same way, though. Josh isn't worth being married to, and clearly isn't attracted to her enough. Why diet when he is stuffing his face, and he will never gaze adoringly at her no matter what she does? I hate when guys expect you to keep up with them on the junk food front, but also magically stay thin, and I bet joshley is like this. 

Too bad leaving and finding a man who cherishes her is out of the question. 

[Normades]

On ‎1‎/‎16‎/‎2019 at 1:39 PM, Churchhoney said:

When a normal person creates a bathroom like that, it's just because they don't want to have a bathroom that ONLY has a child-sized toilet..

I just have never understood why they felt a child sized toilet was necessary at all.  I know they have lots of kids, but I raised two with regular toilets and they're almost normal.  More normal than any Duggar could hope to be.  Anyway, it's like they thought they would perpetually have young children.  Did Boob and MEschelle think Jesus loved them so much that they would continue to have babies into their eighties???  Children grow!!  

After that babies into their eighties comment, now I need brain bleach!!! And I did it to myself!

[Churchhoney]

14 minutes ago, Normades said:

I just have never understood why they felt a child sized toilet was necessary at all.  I know they have lots of kids, but I raised two with regular toilets and they're almost normal.  More normal than any Duggar could hope to be.  Anyway, it's like they thought they would perpetually have young children.  Did Boob and MEschelle think Jesus loved them so much that they would continue to have babies into their eighties???  Children grow!!  

After that babies into their eighties comment, now I need brain bleach!!! And I did it to myself!

This is exactly what I thought! .... And I don't know anybody who ever put a child-sized toilet in their house. 

I wonder whether they just did it because they were getting the house for free, so they could have everything so why not toilets in all sizes? 

Of course, I've also heard that they put in the one big kitchen because they were thinking of having some kind of public church-y events at the house.....So maybe they had those toilets put in because they were anticipating strangers or near-strangers attending events there? The only time I've ever seen child-sized toilets is in bathrooms at schools and in the children's Sunday-school-class area of a church....

[Rabbittron]

On 1/17/2019 at 7:41 PM, Normades said:

I just have never understood why they felt a child sized toilet was necessary at all.  I know they have lots of kids, but I raised two with regular toilets and they're almost normal.  More normal than any Duggar could hope to be.  Anyway, it's like they thought they would perpetually have young children.  Did Boob and MEschelle think Jesus loved them so much that they would continue to have babies into their eighties???  Children grow!!  

After that babies into their eighties comment, now I need brain bleach!!! And I did it to myself!

 

[queenanne]

On 1/15/2019 at 9:59 AM, andromeda331 said:

Exactly. They didn't just keep an eye on her they moved her into their home which may come of nice and maybe that's how they worded it to her she'd have Jana to help her with her kids and not be alone. But had her sleep in the girls room. Zero chance to be alone and possibly realize how messed up her situation is and consider divorce. Not even alone in at night in a bedroom. 

Which also means the chances are high that Anna never got to feel as badly about the betrayals as she wanted to.  Can’t cry in peace, unless you can snatch 30 seconds in a bathroom without some other relation wanting it, or your attention, etc... ‘are you crying, Anna?  Want to talk about it?’ 

[Rabbittron]

I just saw a commercial for worst Cooks in America Anne Burrell says just think of a beautiful sandwich all I could think about this was that  Anna telling Josh this.

[EVS]

8 hours ago, Rabbittron said:

I just saw a commercial for worst Cooks in America Anne Burrell says just think of a beautiful sandwich all I could think about this was that  Anna telling Josh this.

That would be a perfect way for Jill to get back on tv, if her ego would allow her to recognize that she needs help learning to cook.

Edited January 22, 2019 by EVS

[doodlebug]

10 hours ago, queenanne said:

Which also means the chances are high that Anna never got to feel as badly about the betrayals as she wanted to.  Can’t cry in peace, unless you can snatch 30 seconds in a bathroom without some other relation wanting it, or your attention, etc... ‘are you crying, Anna?  Want to talk about it?’ 

If Anna ever expressed her true emotions over her husband's betrayal, let alone cried about it, her in laws wouldn't be asking her to talk about it.  They'd be telling her to cut it out, she needs to wear a happy countenance 24/7 and remember that Josh' bad behavior was all her fault since she clearly was a failure as a helpmeet.  Which is at least part of the reason why Anna undoubtedly keeps her negative feelings to herself.

[jcbrown]

4 hours ago, EVS said:

That would be a perfect way for Jill to get back on tv, if her ego would allow her to recognize that she needs help learning to cook.

Yes, but then she might have to learn from (gasp) a lesbian. You know Anne would pick Jill for her team just to torture her.

[Westiepeach]

14 minutes ago, jcbrown said:

Yes, but then she might have to learn from (gasp) a lesbian. You know Anne would pick Jill for her team just to torture her.

I want to find a way to make this happen. Ratings gold!

[Twopper]

On 1/17/2019 at 9:00 PM, Churchhoney said:

I just have never understood why they felt a child sized toilet was necessary at all.  I know they have lots of kids, but I raised two with regular toilets and they're almost normal.  More normal than any Duggar could hope to be.  Anyway, it's like they thought they would perpetually have young children.  Did Boob and MEschelle think Jesus loved them so much that they would continue to have babies into their eighties???  Children grow!!  

After that babies into their eighties comment, now I need brain bleach!!! And I did it to myself!

I actually thought about it when we were redoing the baby's bathroom, but we decided against it. I think I was suffering from a little "baby brain," but I really did like the cute bathroom redesign I saw in a magazine.  The bathroom had a child-size sink as well, and both incorporated animals --the sink I think was the elephant--into the design.  I have probably blocked out what the toilet was.   This was back in the 80's so maybe they saw the same magazine.   It makes sense to me that the Duggars would have a child size toilet.  Their children don't need them, but surely the 100+ grandchildren they expect to have could use them.

I don't watch this show regularly, so I have lost track of Anna and Josh.  What job does he have now? or are they freeloading with Ma and Pa?

[Bayarea4]

I had always assumed that the child-size toilets made toilet training quicker and easier for the littles. Toddlers might resist using the normal-sized toilets because to a child, they're big and scary. But they might be more willing to use a child-size toilet that is not much bigger than a potty chair. Also, with side-by-side toilets the younger ones can be encouraged to model the behavior of their older siblings, which could speed up the learning curve a bit and save a lot of diaper changes.

[Rabbittron]

https://radaronline.com/exclusives/2019/01/josh-duggar-at-war-with-hometown-officials-over-sex-molestation-privacy-lawsuit/

 will Smuggar ever stop?

Just now, Rabbittron said:

https://radaronline.com/exclusives/2019/01/josh-duggar-at-war-with-hometown-officials-over-sex-molestation-privacy-lawsuit/

 will Smuggar ever stop?

New article. 

[FizzyPuff]

2 hours ago, Rabbittron said:

https://radaronline.com/exclusives/2019/01/josh-duggar-at-war-with-hometown-officials-over-sex-molestation-privacy-lawsuit/

 will Smuggar ever stop?

New article. 

What an idiot. 

[JoanArc]

Jim Bob and Michelle will never stop. If they can make it go away then it never happened and they're perfect parents. They'll be back to being popular and riding high. I'm glad they're wasting money on fool's errands like this.

Edited January 29, 2019 by JoanArc

[Rabbittron]

 I can't believe Smuggar said that he has a common law/ or constitutional law to sexually molest young or little girls.

[Normades]

1 hour ago, Rabbittron said:

 I can't believe Smuggar said that he has a common law/ or constitutional law to sexually molest young or little girls.

The way I understood it, he didn't actually say that.  It's just that the county is saying this is what his actions seem to indicate.  They really hate him to make such a statement!!  Gotta love it!!  I can't help but believe good ol' godly JimBoob is right behind all of this.  I hope it takes him down.  What a bunch of asses!!  No care for those poor girls and what they have endured.  If they were smart they would let it drop and move on.

[Rabbittron]

6 minutes ago, Normades said:

The way I understood it, he didn't actually say that.  It's just that the county is saying this is what his actions seem to indicate.  They really hate him to make such a statement!!  Gotta love it!!  I can't help but believe good ol' godly JimBoob is right behind all of this.  I hope it takes him down.  What a bunch of asses!!  No care for those poor girls and what they have endured.  If they were smart they would let it drop and move on.

Knowing the way Smuggar is I wouldn't be surprised if he said it or said something just like it because we'll never really know what was said in court.

[EmeraldGirl]

I’d actually watch these two on a show if they’d shoot up Josh with some nitrous oxide. 

I see Anna on Instagram showing off their big dog and talking about wanting to be blessed with more children. I’d love a real peek inside that house. What does Anna cook these days? Why is she getting fat? How does she manage school? Her kids are cute, clean, and nicely behaved. 

Unpoular opinion maybe, but cheating was the most normal thing Josh ever did in his life. Not that it’s ok - of course not. But it seemed to get so much attention. I know, because of his hypocrisy. But it almost took the attention off of the incest! And I happen to believe (or maybe just hope) that a young teenager can be rehabilitated. I’d hate to think that life is over and there’s no hope for them in society. Not that the parents really did anything to help though. 

Yeah, I’d kill for a camera in that place. 

Edited January 30, 2019 by EmeraldGirl

[madpsych78]

12 hours ago, EmeraldGirl said:

 Unpoular opinion maybe, but cheating was the most normal thing Josh ever did in his life. Not that it’s ok - of course not. But it seemed to get so much attention. I know, because of his hypocrisy. But it almost took the attention off of the incest! And I happen to believe (or maybe just hope) that a young teenager can be rehabilitated. I’d hate to think that life is over and there’s no hope for them in society. Not that the parents really did anything to help though. 

Yeah, I’d kill for a camera in that place. 

If Josh had not molested his sisters, and the only notoriety he achieved was Ashley Madison and cheating, I bet we would all have a different perception of Josh. Yes, he would still be criticized for hurting Anna, but he probably wouldn't be regarded as pond scum the way he is now. Infidelity is hurtful but it's not a crime. Plus, I regard the cheating as illustrative of the cracks and flaws of their belief system. 

[Zella]

I've always found it psychologically interesting how much more horrifying the Duggars seemed to find the adultery than the molestation. It struck me that it were as if they couldn't fathom why people were offended about the molestations, yet the Ashley Madison scandal seems to have shaken them to their core. I can't figure out if that is because of their deplorable views regarding sexual assault (blame the victim) or because they had no control over the publicity or because they finally realized that Josh's dysfunction wasnt a thing of the past or maybe because, as unselfaware as they are, they still realized they looked like assholes for so strenuously defending him in the past. Maybe all the above.

I think cheating on your spouse is a shitty thing to do--saw it rip apart my own parents' marriage--but it really pales in comparison to MOLESTING your sisters and other young women staying in the family home. The fact that they can't seem to understand this is really telling.

[doodlebug]

1 hour ago, madpsych78 said:

If Josh had not molested his sisters, and the only notoriety he achieved was Ashley Madison and cheating, I bet we would all have a different perception of Josh. Yes, he would still be criticized for hurting Anna, but he probably wouldn't be regarded as pond scum the way he is now. Infidelity is hurtful but it's not a crime. Plus, I regard the cheating as illustrative of the cracks and flaws of their belief system. 

If anything, some of us might feel a little sympathetic to a guy forced into a rigid system of behavior, married off very young with a limited choice of spouse and who then had a bunch of kids right off the bat.  It isn't hard to see how someone in Josh' position might be tempted to cheat on his wife as an outlet for all of the stress caused by the fundie lifestyle he was born into/

[BitterApple]

1 hour ago, doodlebug said:

If anything, some of us might feel a little sympathetic to a guy forced into a rigid system of behavior, married off very young with a limited choice of spouse and who then had a bunch of kids right off the bat.  It isn't hard to see how someone in Josh' position might be tempted to cheat on his wife as an outlet for all of the stress caused by the fundie lifestyle he was born into/

That's how I would've looked at it. If it was just cheating and not cheating/molestation I could've handwaved the situation as a guy forced to marry too young and he got restless. It wouldn't make Josh any less of a jerk, but it happens. Some couples work through it, others can't. Either way, sex between consenting adults is far less scandalous than a teenager molesting five girls. 

[Scarlett45]

2 hours ago, Zella said:

I've always found it psychologically interesting how much more horrifying the Duggars seemed to find the adultery than the molestation. It struck me that it were as if they couldn't fathom why people were offended about the molestations, yet the Ashley Madison scandal seems to have shaken them to their core. I can't figure out if that is because of their deplorable views regarding sexual assault (blame the victim) or because they had no control over the publicity or because they finally realized that Josh's dysfunction wasnt a thing of the past or maybe because, as unselfaware as they are, they still realized they looked like assholes for so strenuously defending him in the past. Maybe all the above.

I think cheating on your spouse is a shitty thing to do--saw it rip apart my own parents' marriage--but it really pales in comparison to MOLESTING your sisters and other young women staying in the family home. The fact that they can't seem to understand this is really telling.

I find this interesting too. The girls he molested are his SISTERS, he was in a position of trust, and Joy was FIVE years old. Five!!!!!!!

People cheat on their spouses- yes it’s jerky, but I wouldn’t say someone who cheated on their spouse with another consenting adult was a morally corrupt individual. I would say that someone who knowling hurt their own sibling is a morally corrupt person. 

2 hours ago, Zella said:

because they finally realized that Josh's dysfunction wasnt a thing of the past or maybe because, as unselfaware as they are, they still realized they looked like assholes for so strenuously defending him in the past.

I think this is the primary reason. 

The secondary reason is “blame the victim” as you said upthread. When Josh was a teen he hadn’t made any promises to God about his sexual behavior. I think the Duggars are more upset that he broke a public promise than the fact that he hurt or could’ve given an STI to Anna. 

[Zella]

2 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I find this interesting too. The girls he molested are his SISTERS, he was in a position of trust, and Joy was FIVE years old. Five!!!!!!

Yes the more info that came out on the molestations, the more horrified I was, especially with their excuses for why it wasn't such a big deal. Everything was just so predatory about it.

I very badly wanted someone to reassure the Duggar girls that THAT was not normal, no matter what bullshit narrative their parents tried to spin. I have three wonderful older brothers, including 2 whom were teenagers when I was born, and on behalf of little sisters everywhere, I was offended at their attempt to make it seem like his actions was just some normal teenaged boy behavior.

And they seemed to conveniently ignore that one of his victims wasn't even a member of a family! Like that poor girl never even existed!

[Nysha]

3 hours ago, Zella said:

I've always found it psychologically interesting how much more horrifying the Duggars seemed to find the adultery than the molestation. It struck me that it were as if they couldn't fathom why people were offended about the molestations, yet the Ashley Madison scandal seems to have shaken them to their core. I can't figure out if that is because of their deplorable views regarding sexual assault (blame the victim) or because they had no control over the publicity or because they finally realized that Josh's dysfunction wasnt a thing of the past or maybe because, as unselfaware as they are, they still realized they looked like assholes for so strenuously defending him in the past. Maybe all the above.

I think cheating on your spouse is a shitty thing to do--saw it rip apart my own parents' marriage--but it really pales in comparison to MOLESTING your sisters and other young women staying in the family home. The fact that they can't seem to understand this is really telling.

The molestation was years ago and Josh had already repented and been forgiven. As far as they were concerned, it was over. Plus, it was partially the victims' fault for not being modest enough, Josh was young, it happens in a lot of families, the girls don't even remember it, and they dealt with it. The Ashley Madison scandal was worse because Josh was an adult and he sought out sin. There wasn't anyone else to blame but Josh, which made it even worse because then it reflected on the whole Duggar brand. 

To Evangelical Christians, repenting and being forgiven means that whatever you have done has been washed away. After all, if God/Jesus has forgiven him, who are we to continue to condemn him? Even now, I'm sure they feel like Josh has been to Jesus Jail, his wife has forgiven him, so why can't he slide back into his place on TLC?

[Zella]

17 minutes ago, Nysha said:

it happens in a lot of families

I remember how they kept harping on this point and found it especially sinister. Of course, given Gothard's own behavior, it probably shouldn't be surprising but still.

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

If he (and JB) had any sense, they'd realize these lawsuits do nothing but keep reminding the public of vile actions, that he's a vile person, & that the Duggar parents failed their kids.  But no....in pursuit of money and all, they will keep drawing attention to his awful acts and how awful he is.   

No.common.sense.

That said, thanks for the reminder for anyone who doesn't regularly follow the Duggars who had forgotten about the scandal and that Josh still sucks. Keep on reminding society why you aren't role models and why your way of life isn't to be copied. 

Also, this is further proof to me that Josh is the Family Prince/Favorite Son. If JB and Michelle had any sense, they'd nix this lawsuit (since they're the ones employing/supporting Josh, they could do so or pressure him to do so).  Instead, they must be still upset that their Poor First-Born Prince Joshua was outed as who he is/what he did.  

The poor M kids. :(

Edited January 30, 2019 by MyPeopleAreNordic

[floridamom]

Does anyone know the status of the Duggar daughters' lawsuit?

[GleamingMist]

8 hours ago, floridamom said:

Does anyone know the status of the Duggar daughters' lawsuit?

I think it got dismissed.

[PikaScrewChu]

7 hours ago, GleamingMist said:

I think it got dismissed.

It was dismissed but I thought they appealed. The hearing for the remaining three defendants finally took place back in December. It says in that article that the lawsuit was dismissed against InTouch so I'm guessing they probably abandoned the idea of getting any $$$ out of InTouch.

[lascuba]

On 1/30/2019 at 4:22 PM, MyPeopleAreNordic said:

If he (and JB) had any sense, they'd realize these lawsuits do nothing but keep reminding the public of vile actions, that he's a vile person, & that the Duggar parents failed their kids.  But no....in pursuit of money and all, they will keep drawing attention to his awful acts and how awful he is.   

No.common.sense.

That said, thanks for the reminder for anyone who doesn't regularly follow the Duggars who had forgotten about the scandal and that Josh still sucks. Keep on reminding society why you aren't role models and why your way of life isn't to be copied. 

Also, this is further proof to me that Josh is the Family Prince/Favorite Son. If JB and Michelle had any sense, they'd nix this lawsuit (since they're the ones employing/supporting Josh, they could do so or pressure him to do so).  Instead, they must be still upset that their Poor First-Born Prince Joshua was outed as who he is/what he did.  

The poor M kids. :(

 

More than anything else, JB wants vindication. He wants to be able to say that a judge and jury ruled that the real criminals in all of this were the people who released those police reports. He's delusional enough to think that will change in anything in the court of public opinion.

Edited February 1, 2019 by lascuba

[Normades]

1 hour ago, lascuba said:

More than anything else, JB wants vindication. He wants to be able to say that a judge and jury ruled that the real criminals in all of this were the people who released those police reports. He's delusional enpugthat will change in anything in the court of public opinion.

And money.  Never underestimate Boob's drive for money.

[queenanne]

22 hours ago, lascuba said:

More than anything else, JB wants vindication. He wants to be able to say that a judge and jury ruled that the real criminals in all of this were the people who released those police reports. He's delusional enough to think that will change in anything in the court of public opinion.

I can also see and imagine someone in IBLP pushing him to help "set a legal precedent" as the stalking horse.  Heck, maybe even Josh is smart enough to figure that angle out, after his stint at the FRC...

[Marshmallow Mollie]

In the Christmas pictures, Josh is wearing a lime green shirt and red shorts. I am all for being festive, but his outfit, nay costume, was over the top “look at me!!!” A Smuggar doesn’t change his stripes.

At some point after the scandals broke but before Anna’s pregnancy, I did feel some sympathy for him. He was a social pariah and likely had no job options beyond his family. He was using his baby to shield his face on TLC. 

All of that should have humbled him (although he also should have gotten real counseling). Instead he seems as smug as ever.

[Sew Sumi]

11 hours ago, Marshmallow Mollie said:

In the Christmas pictures, Josh is wearing a lime green shirt and red shorts. I am all for being festive, but his outfit, nay costume, was over the top “look at me!!!” A Smuggar doesn’t change his stripes.

At some point after the scandals broke but before Anna’s pregnancy, I did feel some sympathy for him. He was a social pariah and likely had no job options beyond his family. He was using his baby to shield his face on TLC. 

All of that should have humbled him (although he also should have gotten real counseling). Instead he seems as smug as ever.

Anna was pregnant with Meredith during the Joshgstes. She didn't get pregnant again for over a year, 6 months of which were spent in the Girls' dorm while Smuggar was in Jesus Jail. I guess you mean after all of that transpired when he used one of his younger spawn (want to say it was Marcus) as a human shield at Jinger's wedding? Remember the mysterious flash in an outdoor shot that wiped him out of that shot? 

I had no sympathy for him. He got nothing less than he deserved, then got a new car lot handed to him close to his newly refurbished digs. Remember how his brothers banded together to spruce up his fixer upper after he was forced out of DC? His family gave him the Golden Son treatment all the way up to Ashley Madison. Cheating and porn were the straws that broke even Boob's back. Because we all know that left to his own devices, Smuggar never would have gone to Jesus Jail. That had Boob written all over it.