S02.E03: En Garde Avant Garde

[formerlyfreedom]

In their first team challenge, the designers must create avant-garde looks inspired by Tim Gunn's most recent passion, fencing.

[Primetimer]

The season's first team challenge brings out the worst in one designer.

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[NYGirl]

What the hell?  I can't believe Tim Gunn used his TGSave already!  Apparently the kids felt the same way because now they actually have to...."work hard".  

Anyway I felt Akai was not very good and should not have been saved.  Whoever sewed that skirt should have gone.  Truth be told I was reading something while watching so I'm not sure who did which garment.

As far as the winner...yikes..that poor model couldn't even move.  It reminded me of a robot or the marshmallow guy from from Ghostbusters.

Was that a lilac colored turd on Kelly Osbourne's head?

[Straycat80]

I really felt for A'Kai and Hawwaa this challenge because I don't understand avant-garde either. To me it's costume but then the judges say it's not suppose to look costume-y. So...they didn't work well together and it showed. I'm on the fence about A'Kai getting the TGS. He was in the bottom last week too. I agree with the girl who said the save was used too soon.

I liked the look that won. Tieler and Molly. It was very high fashion.

I thought the all black look was cool too.

I liked the coat Rene and Chris did. Yeah, the heart appliqué was cheesey but overall it looked cool. 

[auntlada]

A'kai did the skirt.

About halfway through the show I knew Tim was going to save A'kai, even if it wasn't tonight. He fits the profile of a Tim Gunn save, all sad and lost looking.

I understand the use of the save here, but I'm not sure A'kai really deserves it. I don't think his problems were caused by Haawaa. I think he's just not cut out for this competition. I don't think he has the skills to achieve his vision yet.

[MrsClaus]

I figured Tim was going to use his save.  

When the girl said they were going to have to work hard since the save was used, I just wanted to ask if they had all been coasting in hopes he'd use it on one of them.

[mauras]

I hope people don't see Hawwaa as the villain in this episode, because she wasn't wrong, even if she could have been a little gentler about expressing her frustration. A'kai does take way too long on the skirt, he did have construction issues (as did Hawwaa, to be fair), and he didn't really communicate. He seems like a very sweet and sensitive kid, but he also seems kind of out of his depth. I knew as soon as he had his talk with Tim that he'd be sent home and that Tim would use his save, but I agree with the designers that it's way too early to save anyone.

I didn't dislike anything on the runway, really, though Chris and Rene"s jumpsuit was in no way avant garde. I loved the winning outfit and Chelsea and Allie's look, especially. Chelsea is my favorite personality-wise so far--she's so quirky and likeable. I hope she goes far.

Edited January 7, 2017 by mauras
Autocorrect sucks

[Eliza422]

I loved the winning look - even when it was in the workroom my jaw dropped when I saw it.

 

this did put the most recent adult version of the avant-garde challenge to shame.

[DHDancer]

I was quite angry (before it turned to disillusionment) hearing A'kai talking about  "throwing under the bus".  Maybe I'm too old-fashioned but kids should be kids IMO: even KNOWING the term at that age is just so wrong on many levels. And count me in with those who think A'kai is still not long for this competition: he just doesn't have the skills.

[vibeology]

That coat is maybe my favourite garment ever on any Project Runway. The sleeve detail, the way the back looked as amazing as the front, the beautiful wide legged pants. Damn. It's art. Blown away.

 My other favourite part of the show was the moment when Christian said "I don't like red and black it looks like Medieval Times" and the editors cut to the Seventeen Magazine woman in her red blazer and a little black dress.  

I like that most of those kids knew who David Bowie was. That was surprising. 

As for the drama, neither was an innocent. Hawwaa was bossy but A'kai was slow and not communicating well. Changing the skirt that dramatically without talking to your partner is not okay. Either could have gone home and no one should have been saved but I knew it was coming when Tim called A'kai a statesman. And that bs about saving Hawwaa was definitely dubbed in to try to calm some of the potential criticism coming their way.

[DeLurker]

I figured A'kai was going to be saved because of the Tim Gunn chat. I hate his talking heads as the repetitive speech seems staged.

I like Chelsea too but her striped top at judging made me insane - the stripes didn't line up at the seams!  

I have warmed to Izzy after she said flips the table when someone, Molly I think, didn't know who David Bowie was other than a dead celebrity. 

[Knuckles]

That effort by Molly and Tieler was fabulous. Beautifully imagined and executed. Just wonderful. One of the best things I have ever seen on this show.

[njbchlover]

6 minutes ago, Knuckles said:

That effort by Molly and Tieler was fabulous. Beautifully imagined and executed. Just wonderful. One of the best things I have ever seen on this show.

That was beautifully done. expertly executed and tailored, and perfect for an avant-garde challenge.  Not so perfect when tackily done, with shiny, sequinned embellishments on ugly pink fabric for everyday wear (are you listening, Erin - winner of this season's regular PR?)

I thought they were smart in their fabric choices - they used industrial felt, which I assume is very heavy and lends itself to stiff structuring.  

This design and the all black futuristic fencing uniform were clearly the best, and it was nice to see that these designs were almost identical to the original sketches.

[izabella]

I thought the winning team did great - their proportions for the coat and pants were perfect when it could have gone so wrong. 

I felt most of the designers embraced the idea of avante garde, and put on a good runway.  Fencing was an odd choice of inspiration, but they did well.

I thought both Hawaa and A'Kai should go home, so I was fine with Tim using his save on a team challenge.  I don't mind that he used it so soon since I've never been a fan of the save.   

Edited January 6, 2017 by izabella

[windtrix]

The Groucho Marx eyebrows and multiple piercings juxtaposed with the modest dress and hijab....distracting.

[LennieBriscoe]

I don't care for Hawwaa because I don't like seeing those awful nose things! 

[millennium]

Tim Gunn, gay blade!

Hawwaa's voice grates on me.   Combined with her negative attitude from the very start, I was rooting for her to go.  Interestingly, it appears a bit of dialogue was added to the lounge scene in post-editing, where Tim states (off-camera, and apparently recorded elsewhere) "Hawwaa if you had been the one sent home I would have saved you too."

Never did I imagine twenty years ago while rocking out to "Shot in the Dark" that I would pay for it by having Ozzy's famous-for-no-reason daughter foisted on me later in life.  I roll my eyes when they introduce her as "author, fashion designer, rocket scientist, etc." because without her family ties no one ever would have given her the time of day.

Do you think Tim Gunn waits in that little room with the shoes all day, just in case he's needed?   They should give him a chair at least.

Edited January 6, 2017 by millennium

[Jextella]

I tuned in late and missed most of the drama (thank goodness).  I agree with the judges that this was a great avant garde challenge.  Most rose to the occasion and I'm feeling good about S2.  The vibe is not the same as last season, but I think there are some good designers in the mix - enough to pull me along to the next episode.  The top two teams did an amazing job.

[Phebemarie]

There was another side-eye moment from Christian when Tim Gunn commented that this was probably the best avant-garde challenge in Project Runway history.  

Christian and Chris March's winning avant-garde challenge dress.

Edited January 6, 2017 by Phebemarie

[Kitty Redstone]

These kids are much more talented than many of the adults that have competed the last few seasons.  They are seriously impressive. 

I'm glad the Tim Gunn Save is out of the way.  And A'Kai is such an earnest little guy.  Hopefully he'll find his groove in the next challenge. 

[HunterHunted]

3 hours ago, Eliza422 said:

I loved the winning look - even when it was in the workroom my jaw dropped when I saw it.

 

this did put the most recent adult version of the avant-garde challenge to shame.

It was sickening!

http://m.imgur.com/gallery/n78zRWK

[Pepper Mostly]

I have no problem with Tim using the save. Its a clunky device in any case, so let him use it any way he pleases. It would be hard to see Akai go under such a cloud, poor little guy. He's out of his depth but I have no beef with giving him another chance. His and Hawwaa's pairing was a fail from the beginning. I wish Tim had spoken with her also, though. A few minutes of tough love from Tim could have at least gotten them to limp through to the finish line together. I felt terrible for both of them. A'kai was overwhelmed and Hawwaa felt that she wasn't being heard and spiraled down fast. Show! Don't do that! I watch this to see bright, lively, talented kids stretch themselves, embrace challenges with enthusiasm, work hard and have a great experience. I do not watch to see children cry! Stop it! 

[Sarnia]

I'm also good with Tim using the save. Now it's out of the way and that's good, and probably it lifted A'kai's spirit a little bit. I think A'kai is not mature enough for this competition and it is a bit painful to watch, but now when he goes away for good (which shouldn't take long) at least he hopefully will feel relief in Tim believing in him.

Both top looks were quite stunning.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I loathed any kind of group projects when I was in school and I hate them on reality shows too. Even though collaboration is something that happens in real life, I feel like these team challenges are just designed to create drama. It's bad enough when they do them on regular competition shows but I that they're doing it to kids on this show. I was surprised that Hawwaa and A'kai were the only ones who really got into it.

Tim nailed Chelsea and Allie's gladiator warrior princess look when he said it would look like black asparagus. For me, avant garde means weird and this was definitely a an avant garde look. It was weird but interesting and it looked well made.

Chris and Rene's look wasn't very avant garde to me. It looked like a basic tank top and pants you would find at the mall with a messy looking jacket on top. The best part about their look was the conrast of the red against the black on the sleeves and hood. Were the producers deliberately trying to hide how plain the actual outfit was because I felt like we barely saw it on the runway? Most of the screentime was the model standing sideways at the end of the runway. I had to laugh when Christian said more than once than red and black was Medieval Times and a bad combination when Aya was wearing red and black! I really disliked the painted heart. It was just too literal.

I agreed with Tim's assessment of Hawwaa and A'kai's design in the workroom - they really needed to pump up the volume. I understand Hawwaa's frustration with A'kai. He was seriously going to make the entire skirt in muslin first? Dude, you have ONE DAY for this challenge. Ain't nobody got time for a practice skirt! And it was just a simple circle skirt so I don't know why he thought he needed to make it out of muslin first. I can't believe he didn't leave enough room for a zipper either. Just those two things alone would have made me really frustrated with him. I did not like the red satin bow at the neck. It gave me too much of a Little Red Riding Hood vibe.

Izzy and Cartier's look was more red carpet than avant garde. The only thing that was even remotely avant garde was the asymmetric neckline. It wasn't a horrible dress but it was not avant garde in my opinion.

Molly and Tieler's look reminded me of all of Melissa's high necked coats from a few seasons ago. I guess I should be glad that they aren't on Heidi's "everything has to be short and sexy" train but man was that voluminous. They made smart choices from beginning to end. The proportions were good, the fabric was used properly, etc.

I was fine with A'kai's elimination because all he did was make a skirt, and a very poorly constructed one at that. I think it's way too early in the season for the Tim Gunn save. The voiceover of Tim saying he would have used his save on Hawwaa if she had been eliminated seemed fishy to me.

I am glad so many of the kids knew who David Bowie was (although I did wonder how many of them knew who he was before he died - I suspect some of them only learned about him when there was a glut of stuff about him on the internet after his death). But someone please tell them who Frida Kahlo is!

[Diane Mars]

I L.O.V.E.D Molly and Tieler look ! That coat (take some notes, Erin, as you always take "your ideas" form someone else) !!!! Even from the "upper view"  (does that makes sense ?) it was amazing ! The tailoring, the proportions, the execution ! Fabulous ! (Have we already seen that kind of "view from the ceiling" for any challenge / runway / season ?)

Regarding the TGS, I think it's OK to have used it that way, and so early in the competition. It's now done :)

[DEL901]

As much as I like A'kai, I think he's just too young for the competition.  He needs a couple of years seasoning.  Some 13 YOs might be okay, but he has to work on construction skills and speed.

I don't know if the Tim Gunn save will ultimately help or hurt him.  I think a second elimination, especially if it comes quickly, will really hurt his confidence.

[candall]

Sorry, but to me, A'kai is even young for his age (13 y.o.) and it makes me unhappy and uncomfortable to watch him struggle.  I really don't want to see a little boy trying hard to be brave as he negotiates a situation beyond his maturity level, swiping away tears with his sleeve cuffs clutched in his little fists.  (I was also a little stunned when it turned out he expects to whipstitch all the clothes onto his model, like a kid with a Barbie doll.)

Hawwaa's dismay at getting stuck with the weakest contestant as a partner was immature, but again--teenage girls aren't "mature."  It would have been pretty amazing if she'd managed to pull off being graceful and kind about needing to go the extra mile for the team, instead of stomping off to the bathroom and slamming the door.

Ha, I guess I've confirmed that Junior versions really aren't for me.

Clothes-wise, I want that black and red duster!  It didn't strike me as particularly "avant garde, since I'd put it right into wardrobe rotation.  The only avant garde stroke, I thought, was that the heart was more Biology than Valentine--but, heh, I liked that funky touch, too.

Agree that the felt and the black were top-notch.  Not sure they were all that splurge worthy as The Best In The History Of Project Runway, but really interesting and responsive to the challenge.

[BusyOctober]

I really did think Tieler & Molly's was the best; it was definitely high fashion, executed well, and I agree it was "art".  However...the inverted cone sleeves reminded me of the tip of the Crayola Crayon costume I made for a college Halloween party. I even used industrial felt!  And that was 15 years ago!  Once I saw that crayon shape, I couldn't un-see it!

Like a few others I think poor A'kai is out of his depth.  Hawwaa was justified in her frustration.  She wasn't comfortable with the challenge in the first place.  She was partnered with a much less experienced sewer who was also confused about how to produce something that fit the challenge.  I think either one of them could have been sent home based on what they sent down the runway.  Hawwaa's top was very basic.  The collar was unnecessary.  The styling/unibrow makeup was distracting.  Her only saving grace was the red arm lacing.  I think A'kai was out because he only did one item and did it poorly.

Is it me or does Chris have "Resting Bitch Face"?  He perpetually looks like he's smelling bad cheese. The heart applique may have been Rene's idea, but Chris should have nixed the matching one on the back of his coat.

I really like Chelsea and Izzy, personality-wise, the most so far in this competition.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Chelsea and Izzie are my favorites so far in the personality department too. They seem like normal fun kids who aren't high maintenance drama queens.

[Pepper Mostly]

1 hour ago, candall said:

Sorry, but to me, A'kai is even young for his age (13 y.o.) and it makes me unhappy and uncomfortable to watch him struggle.  I really don't want to see a little boy trying hard to be brave as he negotiates a situation beyond his maturity level, swiping away tears with his sleeve cuffs clutched in his little fists.  (I was also a little stunned when it turned out he expects to whipstitch all the clothes onto his model, like a kid with a Barbie doll.)

Hawwaa's dismay at getting stuck with the weakest contestant as a partner was immature, but again--teenage girls aren't "mature."  It would have been pretty amazing if she'd managed to pull off being graceful and kind about needing to go the extra mile for the team, instead of stomping off to the bathroom and slamming the door.

 

Yes, this. If I was the mother of either of those kids I would have been pretty upset, seeing them struggle and not being able to help. Poor little A'kai fighting back his tears and Hawwaa's sad frustration just broke my heart. This is not entertaining, show! Adults snarking and misbehaving is one thing. Children--teenagers! in a pressure cooker without the emotional wherewithal to deal with it is too hard to watch.

I lost my heart to Chelsea when she asked Tim if she could hug him. So adorable! She and Izzy are so cute and giggly, I just love them.

[TattleTeeny]

I agree that A'kai is probably a combo of too young and not skilled enough, but Hawwaa was being a raging sourpuss; she seemed to be taking it out on him the fact that avant garde was completely confusing to her*. That said, I do not blame her for being bummed out that he was her partner out of all the others in the room. And I know she's a kid herself so maybe poised diplomacy is not yet an innate skill (though she's much better at it than big fat handful of the adults we've seen on this show!). But, I'm sorry, it was too much venom directed specifically at him, IMO. 

* Me too, a little--at least in the confines of this competition (and I come from an art school background)! I feel like, on one hand, you should be able to make anything at all and have it qualify as avant garde--and "too costumey" should logically not be a much of negative to the judges. So what is then? I guess if it looks too "normal," obviously but what else? I assume that solid construction should play a huge role in a high score? But then again, these are things that no one is expected to wear in everyday life, so is orderly, durable construction actually that big of a deal?

Yikes, I'm rambling...what I am trying to say (I think) is that it's surprisingly easy to feel completely daunted by an assignment that allows too much freedom--maybe more so than one with strict guidelines? I deal with this at work a lot; my office is rife with people who don't know what they want from us (creative dep't--design and copy)...but want it fast.

Edited January 6, 2017 by TattleTeeny

[Lizzing]

When I saw the winning look, all I could see are those suits people wear to train attack dogs.  Perfectly proportioned & well executed, but still a dog bite training suit. 

I'm glad too that the TGS is out of the way. 

[aamankwah]

I was so mad when they decided to eliminate A'kai instead of Hawaa. Then they accuse him of not handling the pressure? Who broke down crying two times? Who was micromanaging and not trusting her partner? Who was so frustrated because she didn't know what Avant-Garde (I don't understand how you can call yourself a fashion-designer and you don't know what that is.) and decided to take it out on her partner? She should have left not him and I wouldn't use the save on her.

[TexasGal]

8 hours ago, Phebemarie said:

There was another side-eye moment from Christian when Tim Gunn commented that this was probably the best avant-garde challenge in Project Runway history.  

Christian and Chris March's winning avant-garde challenge dress.

I saw that too, and was hoping they'd give us a glimpse of that (^^^^^) dress, but of course they didn't.  So thanks phebemarie!

[peachmangosteen]

28 minutes ago, aamankwah said:

I was so mad when they decided to eliminate A'kai instead of Hawaa. Then they accuse him of not handling the pressure? Who broke down crying two times? Who was micromanaging and not trusting her partner? Who was so frustrated because she didn't know what Avant-Garde (I don't understand how you can call yourself a fashion-designer and you don't know what that is.) and decided to take it out on her partner? She should have left not him and I wouldn't use the save on her.

OK good I'm not the only one!

I personally didn't like Hawaa in the first episode and this episode did nothing to change my opinion.

Honestly, I dislike most of these kids. I miss season 1.

Edited January 6, 2017 by peachmangosteen

[backgroundnoise]

13 hours ago, Straycat80 said:

To me it's costume but then the judges say it's not suppose to look costume-y.

I thought the outfit that won looked much more costumey than the red and black one they called a costume.  

The winning look was interesting, but I just kept seeing a Star Wars droid.

Edited January 6, 2017 by backgroundnoise

[auntlada]

15 minutes ago, backgroundnoise said:

I thought the outfit that won looked much more costumey than the red and black one they called a costume.  

The winning look was interesting, but I just kept seeing a Star Wars droid.

I thought the winning outfit looked costumey, as I think most if not all avant garde stuff looks costumey. But I thought the red and black outfit with thw heart looked like a costume I could find at a rental shop or backstage at a community theater. The coat/cape looked Dracula-ish to me. I liked it OK, minus the heart, which I thought looked dumb and gross, but it looked cheap and existing costumey to me.

if they had done all the internal organs instead of just the heart, I might have found that interesting. Sort of a map to the fencers for where to stab.

[cpansy]

Since these are children, it might have been nice for someone to explain -exactly - what the judges think avant-garde IS. Especially since we saw that at least Hawwaa did not grasp the concept.

I did think this was overall the best avant-garde runway in total. The kids really slayed most of the looks, and seemed to do so quite naturally. Now, there have been other designers who, in their seasons, produced really beautiful avant-garde works, but in the totality of looks, give me Project Runway Junior. I find most of these kids very refreshing because they say what they think, and respond to criticism and praise naturally. Although I enjoyed this past season of PR, since it wasn't quite so drama filled (despite Cornelius and Dexter), watching these younger talents is refreshing. Like most of you, while I personally like A'Kai very much, and was sympathetic to his team challenge struggle, I think Tim exercised his save way too early in the competition. (BTW: I thought he should have used his save for Alex in regular PR, who had demonstrated talent in previous challenges and looked like he could really have brought something to the rest of the competition.) I think sometimes Tim's warm heart does him in.

And I loved learning that Tim FENCES. That, and froggy-splayed Swatch were definitely worth the watch, even if the designs hadn't been that good. But they were.

[cpcathy]

Color me shocked, but I LOVED the winning look, I just went nuts over it. Tieler for the win.

[hisbunkie]

I do not understand why Ms Grey Gardens from Minnesota dresses that way.  I know she is not Muslim /head cover.

[izabella]

I thought someone looked her up and she actually is Muslim?

[J.D.]

Poor A'kai.  He's the sweetest, kindest contestant ever, but his skill set is not Project Runway ready. I love his gentleness and I hope they bring him back in a few more years. I know he got the TGS,but he's not long for this season

Hawawawawawa....whatever..... has a nasty attitude.  I hope she goes soon.  

[Madding crowd]

I was happy to see Tim Gunn demonstrating his fencing. I follow him on FB and he has been very excited about his new hobby. When I think of Avant Garde, I think of something that is not wearable and over the top, but can be scaled down to a wearable trend like oversized coat and wide pants. I'm not sure that concept is easy to explain to kids though. I liked the winning look a lot, but didn't like the spiky black catsuit. The spikes looked uneven to me and I kept thinking the model couldn't breathe through all that leather. I did feel for A'kai because in so many team challenges their is one person who no one wants to work with and gets treated poorly. I know he kind of shut down, but I think it was because he wasn't listened to and didn't know what to do. I kind of liked the red riding hood heart outfit, but it doesn't reflect a new idea or trend so I can see why the judges didn't like it. 

[njbchlover]

6 minutes ago, Madding crowd said:

I was happy to see Tim Gunn demonstrating his fencing. I follow him on FB and he has been very excited about his new hobby. When I think of Avant Garde, I think of something that is not wearable and over the top, but can be scaled down to a wearable trend like oversized coat and wide pants. I'm not sure that concept is easy to explain to kids though. I liked the winning look a lot, but didn't like the spiky black catsuit. The spikes looked uneven to me and I kept thinking the model couldn't breathe through all that leather. I did feel for A'kai because in so many team challenges their is one person who no one wants to work with and gets treated poorly. I know he kind of shut down, but I think it was because he wasn't listened to and didn't know what to do. I kind of liked the red riding hood heart outfit, but it doesn't reflect a new idea or trend so I can see why the judges didn't like it. 

I wasn't a huge fan of Nick and Rene's outfit.  I agreed with Christian when he said the under pieces (looked like leggings and a small top) seemed almost dated, or something like that.  

I have a feeling that either Nick or Rene are going to be eliminated next week, just because of the Tim Gunn save with A'kai and then the comment about Hawaa (sp-?) that was clearly edited in afterward.  Usually, the person with the TGS is not eliminated the week after the save is used.

Edited January 6, 2017 by njbchlover

[TattleTeeny]

You guys, I confess: I dug the heart applique! I don't know why--maybe my adolescent goth ways and general tendency toward the somewhat morbid? 

[AZChristian]

Didn't get to watch it until after reading comments here.  NO DOUBT that Tim's "I would have saved you if the judges had eliminated you, Hawaa" comment was added in later.  A'kai skills aren't well developed (probably because of his age), but at least he didn't behave badly towards his teammate.  

I just felt like the heart applique was too much like a target for the opponent.  

[JunebugWA]

I almost have nothing negative to say about the designs. They were head and shoulders above the looks created by the normal (vanilla) flavors in S15, even the losing look. They all at least were interesting and the designers put some thoughts into their designs. 

I don't blame Hawaa - she is young and assertive. A'kai would have driven me bananas at Hawaa's age. 

Edited January 7, 2017 by JunebugWA

[leighdear]

Hawwaa is trying way too hard  to come off as creative and quirky.  To me she's just coming off unbalanced.   She's 3 years older than A'kai, but she certainly didn't act like it.  And no, teenagers aren't always known for their sensitivity to others, but she should have had a bit more grace. 

Every time he tried to say something, she stepped all over him.  She wouldn't let him complete a single sentence.  Not once.  So how could he tell her he wanted to change the skirt? She just kept steamrolling over everything that came out of his mouth. 

I'm fine with Tin using his save, as the few talents in that group have already become obvious as have the dead weights.   The few kids in the middle will fluctuate back & forth, but it won't really matter.

And I STILL enjoy it more than the mother show!  *LOL* 

[speac]

I wonder how much the producers edited the events to justify Tim Gunn using his save. 

[Lamb18]

Tim, I respectfully disagree. Season 4 had the BEST avant garde challenge. But this one was pretty good, much better than PR 15 and maybe is 2nd best overall.