Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[quarks]

10 hours ago, emmawoodhouse said:

Would they have to submit tax returns? I'm really curious what Duggar returns look like, especially someone like Smuggar who had no visible sources of income. As if he made money from that shack on the side of a highway. Riiiight.🙄

I don't know if they were required to submit tax returns, but I suspect they did, if only to bolster Anna's claim that she and the M kids were totally dependent on Josh for income. It's also possible that those tax returns are why we got all of this chatter about the widow - that's not just a very suspicious sum to pay out monthly; it's also a sum large enough to be reported on tax forms, and it's the only charity that got mentioned. I think someone - probably Travis Story - told them that they needed some sort of explanation for this amount, the only large charity that they seem to have been supporting.

The strong impression that I've gotten about the car lot is that it only sold a few questionable cars which frequently broke down afterwards, and was making so little money that Josh couldn't afford to pay decent wages - thus he ended up hiring, by his own account, untrained family members, homeless people and felons. So, yeah, I think any income from that car lot was fairly negligible.

I think, however, that he and Anna may have made some money in real estate and/or had real estate when he was arrested. I suspect most of this had to be liquidated or will be liquidated to pay the fines and the attorney bills.

I also don't think there's all that much there - or that much left. My own belief is that, despite popular opinion, JB hasn't been paying Josh's legal bills; Josh has been paying for Josh's legal bills, and JB has provided a house for Anna and the kids to stay in, as well as arranging the whole Reber thing for Josh.  This fine is supposed to be punitive, and unlike the prison time, which was about halfway between the minimum/maximum sentence, the fine is far less than half the maximum fine. I suspect the combined fines will leave Josh and Anna completely broke.

Which is exactly why he should have accepted a plea bargain. I know, I know - he's arrogant enough that he just assumed he could blame someone else and get away with it, and Anna (and the Burgesses and possibly some of the other Kellers) apparently believed that the CSAM was downloaded by Caleb Williams and that the justice system and a jury would figure that out. But the second he was informed that Caleb Williams was nowhere near the car lot on the day the crime was committed, and could not possibly have committed the crime, and that the other potential suspects had also been eliminated, he should have accepted the plea bargain.

Look, I strongly believe that people who believe/know that they are innocent and/or that law enforcement screwed up should absolutely get their day in court. And I'm aware that law enforcement frequently makes mistakes (not here, but in other cases.)  And it's not that I exactly feel sorry that JB and Michelle and possibly other Duggarlings are going to be supporting the M kids for the next few years - lots of grandparents and assorted relatives do this all time. But in this particular case, Josh had no need to add the stress/pain/expense of a very public trial to everything else that his kids - and other relatives - are going through.

This guy just sucks. 

[FizzyPuff]

20 hours ago, all fall down said:

There aren't too many details, but they are listed on page 6 of the Judgment: 

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.arwd.62817/gov.uscourts.arwd.62817.162.0_1.pdf

As noted, the $5000 is for the Justice for Victims of Trafficking Act. 

18 hours ago, quarks said:

The fine is for breaking the law.  That could have been much worse - Josh was looking at possibly paying $100,000 or more here.

The special assessments sometimes cover specific legal/court costs, and are sometimes assessed because of the nature of the crime. 

The defense and prosecution submitted a lot of material prior to sentencing, much of which remained sealed. I assume that financial documents were in the sealed material. 

Thank you both 🙂

[CrazyInAlabama]

It will be interesting where FF ends up, I'm hoping for Supermax, but will probably be disappointed.    

I wonder if Anna will move close to his prison?   

[ginger90]

9 minutes ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

It will be interesting where FF ends up, I'm hoping for Supermax, but will probably be disappointed.    

There’s no reason for him to be assigned to supermax.

[DXD526]

Supermax prisons are inhumane, even if you're Pest. 

[Scarlett45]

Mod Announcement:

The guideline to refrain from speculation on other victims of sexual assault extends to Josh himself. (And other adults in the Duggar family). 
 

Any statement a now adult victim has made public is fair game to discuss, but there continues to be a zero tolerance policy regarding discussion of possible additional minor victims of Josh Duggar. 
 

Unless or until another Duggar adult makes a public statement regarding abuse/assault, such discussion isn’t appropriate. 
 

Several posts have been removed, this is not a warning to a specific poster simply a redirection. 

[Quilt Fairy]

11 hours ago, quarks said:

Which is exactly why he should have accepted a plea bargain.

To be clear, as far as we know, a plea bargain was never officially on the table.  The only reference we have to one is an email where his defense team apparently asked the prosecution lawyers - theoretically - how much time he'd be looking at in a plea bargain and were told that Josh "hit all the enhancements".   So maybe the prosecution declined to offer a plea.  

[quarks]

1 hour ago, Quilt Fairy said:

To be clear, as far as we know, a plea bargain was never officially on the table.  The only reference we have to one is an email where his defense team apparently asked the prosecution lawyers - theoretically - how much time he'd be looking at in a plea bargain and were told that Josh "hit all the enhancements".   So maybe the prosecution declined to offer a plea.  

Plea deals are so standard that only 2% of federal criminal cases even make it to trial. The exceptions are usually cases where the feds don't want to take the death penalty off the table - which wasn't a factor here. So I feel pretty confident that some sort of offer was at least discussed.

[emmawoodhouse]

Oh Anna, this aged like milk. 😂

[dariafan]

On 5/27/2022 at 1:17 PM, SusanM said:

I wonder if she really, deep down, does believe he's innocent.  Maybe she does.  I think though what she is in denial over is exactly what it is that he did.  I think she figuratively sticks her fingers in her ears and goes "la la la I can't hear you" whenever anyone tries to tell her exactly what he has been convicted of.  

I think she hears circus music in her head 

[Zella]

Wasn't there a deadline for him to accept a plea that came and went before the trial? Based on that, I assume there was a plea. I was watching We Own This City this week, and a dirty cop looking at federal charges is advised that the general wisdom is to cooperate with the feds early and often. I thought about Josh and wondered if he got the same warning from his legal team. 

[merylinkid]

"He's working ..."   Once he got booted from FRC when did Josh REALLY work?   That car lot was just to give him something to do during the day and for JB to launder money.    Oh and it got him out of the house and he didn't have to deal with the kids.   It wasn't WORK.   

[iwantcookies]

8 hours ago, emmawoodhouse said:

Oh Anna, this aged like milk. 😂

I’m okay with being single vs being with Joshua 

[emmawoodhouse]

1 minute ago, iwantcookies said:

I’m okay with being single vs being with Joshua 

Anna isn't. She'd have to work AND take out the garbage. 🙄

[Cinnabon]

5 minutes ago, emmawoodhouse said:

Anna isn't. She'd have to work AND take out the garbage. 🙄

I’m sure she’s had one of the kids taking out the garbage for a while now.

[MsJamieDornan]

On 6/1/2022 at 6:57 PM, DXD526 said:

Supermax prisons are inhumane

So is child porn.

[ginger90]

Moving closer to his new residence…..as of when I checked yesterday, there was no information listed. Today:

Edited June 3, 2022 by ginger90

[Notabug]

2 hours ago, ginger90 said:

Moving closer to his new residence…..as of when I checked yesterday, there was no information listed. Today:

Cool!  I wonder if he'll be sending 'I have moved!' announcements to friends and family soon.

[iwantcookies]

22 hours ago, emmawoodhouse said:

Oh Anna, this aged like milk. 😂

My dog she looks smug and saying stupid poop. Let’s see you get a job now and take out the garbage cuz Joshua is in JAIL for a DECADE.

Oh right I bet Mac is doing all the chores now. 

[emmawoodhouse]

Here's Fundie Fridays take on the sentencing. Her Michelle voice as she reads her letter is hysterical. 

[Gemma Violet]

I just saw a Youtube regarding a Tik-tok by someone who claimed to have had a fling with Josh during the Ashley Madison scandal.  It's not the Danica person who sued him.  This one's name is Carley.  On the Youtube, it says what he asked her to do, and if true, it's super creepy, i.e. asking her to put her hair in pigtails, etc.

[Almost 3000]

3 hours ago, Gemma Violet said:

I just saw a Youtube regarding a Tik-tok by someone who claimed to have had a fling with Josh during the Ashley Madison scandal.  It's not the Danica person who sued him.  This one's name is Carley.  On the Youtube, it says what he asked her to do, and if true, it's super creepy, i.e. asking her to put her hair in pigtails, etc.

She looked very young and that happened awhile ago (2015) so she didn't look the right age to me. Also she said and emphasized more than once that he gave her "a lot" of money multiple times. Smuggar spending enough money to make an impression on her sounds suspect too.

[emmawoodhouse]

35 minutes ago, Almost 3000 said:

She looked very young and that happened awhile ago (2015) so she didn't look the right age to me. Also she said and emphasized more than once that he gave her "a lot" of money multiple times. Smuggar spending enough money to make an impression on her sounds suspect too.

I think it would track based on his CSAM viewing history that Smuggar prefers his women to look younger than their actual age. Especially if he has kinks like pigtails. It's disgusting, but there it is.

Edited June 3, 2022 by emmawoodhouse

[cmr2014]

5 hours ago, Gemma Violet said:

I just saw a Youtube regarding a Tik-tok by someone who claimed to have had a fling with Josh during the Ashley Madison scandal.  It's not the Danica person who sued him.  This one's name is Carley.  On the Youtube, it says what he asked her to do, and if true, it's super creepy, i.e. asking her to put her hair in pigtails, etc.

I heard rumors that he had a girlfriend when he was in Jesus jail in Rockford. She was telling people that they were "in love" and that he was going to leave Anna. I don't know if this is the same person . . .

[emmawoodhouse]

Here's the TikTok post.

[Tuxcat]

7 hours ago, Almost 3000 said:

She looked very young and that happened awhile ago (2015) so she didn't look the right age to me. Also she said and emphasized more than once that he gave her "a lot" of money multiple times. Smuggar spending enough money to make an impression on her sounds suspect too.

I don't believe her tbh. Just the timing seems suspect to me. And Danica said Josh didn't even pay her the full amount. But this girl says "a lot"

7 hours ago, emmawoodhouse said:

I think it would track based on his CSAM viewing history that Smuggar prefers his women to look younger than their actual age. Especially if he has kinks like pigtails. It's disgusting, but there it is.

Eww. Probably with others. Maybe with her. But it seems like the TikTok girl might be just trying to build a following.

Edited June 4, 2022 by Tuxcat

[GeeGolly]

Why would anyone, true or not, publicly confess to sleeping with Josh?

[Tuxcat]

16 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Why would anyone, true or not, publicly confess to sleeping with Josh?

She's a pornstar who is likely trying to build a following/generate buzz. In the comments she said it was common for production to put her in pigtails and make her wear children's underwear too so that's why it didn't raise any red flags when Josh did (who she said told her he was separated <<which is sort of hilarious since they supposedly connected through AM>>). I mean maybe it's true - just seems to be weird timing.

[GeeGolly]

59 minutes ago, Tuxcat said:

She's a pornstar who is likely trying to build a following/generate buzz. In the comments she said it was common for production to put her in pigtails and make her wear children's underwear too so that's why it didn't raise any red flags when Josh did (who she said told her he was separated <<which is sort of hilarious since they supposedly connected through AM>>). I mean maybe it's true - just seems to be weird timing.

She's a porn star who was on Ashley Madison? Wasn't AM a site for married hook-ups? She wouldn't have been paid for AM hook-ups.  I noticed a wedding band in the 2 seconds I watched the video, so she's having porn sex, married sex and hook-up sex. How much sex did this woman want?

What does she think now? Billing her as a porn star who boinked Josh Duggar is going to get more hits on her films? I don't think that's going to happen.

Truths or lies, a connection to the FF is not a good connection - this woman is an idiot

[Faceplant]

4 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

How much sex did this woman want?

This really cracked me up for some reason. The answer for your question is all of it. She wanted all the sex!

[quarks]

Josh's attorneys filed a general notice of appeal yesterday, stating that they will be appealing "meritorious" arguments. 

(Which I would like to think will not include that Homeland Security one, but I could easily be wrong there.)

[Tdoc72]

WOACB had pics of Anna in pants.  Color me surprised, she’s probably the last one (well, besides Michelle) I would ever expect to be in pants. I wonder how recent (before/after jail) this is. 

[SMama]

How progressive of JB to allow it. 🙄

[GeeGolly]

5 hours ago, Tdoc72 said:

WOACB had pics of Anna in pants.  Color me surprised, she’s probably the last one (well, besides Michelle) I would ever expect to be in pants. I wonder how recent (before/after jail) this is. 

I think she is the last one, of the Duggar females. Well besides Michelle and the Lost Girls.

[Liddy52]

6 hours ago, Tdoc72 said:

WOACB had pics of Anna in pants.  Color me surprised, she’s probably the last one (well, besides Michelle) I would ever expect to be in pants. I wonder how recent (before/after jail) this is. 

Oh, poor Jill R!!!!! Nurie's sister-in-law wearing that clothing that is ONLY for a MAN!!! How will Jill show her face in her church? It is more than a GODLY woman such as herself should have to bear. She will be SEVERELY traumatized. 

[GeeGolly]

3 minutes ago, Liddy52 said:

Oh, poor Jill R!!!!! Nurie's sister-in-law wearing that clothing that is ONLY for a MAN!!! How will Jill show her face in her church? It is more than a GODLY woman such as herself should have to bear. She will be SEVERELY traumatized. 

I think they had a falling out, so this will give JillR another opportunity to get on her holy high horse and damn Anna.

[dargosmydaddy]

2 hours ago, Liddy52 said:

Nurie's sister-in-law wearing that clothing that is ONLY for a MAN!!!

Didn't seem to bother her when she was grifting the vacation house from heathen, pants-wearing sister-in-law Rebeckah...

[sagittarius sue]

3 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

I think they had a falling out, so this will give JillR another opportunity to get on her holy high horse and damn Anna.

Wouldn't a pissing match between the two be fun.  Anna could counter that at least her children were well fed and dressed.

[madpsych78]

10 hours ago, Tdoc72 said:

WOACB had pics of Anna in pants.  Color me surprised, she’s probably the last one (well, besides Michelle) I would ever expect to be in pants. I wonder how recent (before/after jail) this is. 

According to WOACB, the follower spotted Anna in Missouri last week.

[libgirl2]

2 minutes ago, madpsych78 said:

According to WOACB, the follower spotted Anna in Missouri last week.

FB has pictures of her in pants! 

[BigBingerBro]

[libgirl2]

1 minute ago, BigBingerBro said:

It makes me wonder if she is "over" protecting the brand? I did read the girls were all in pants too. 

[emmawoodhouse]

Mack was in a family picture in a jumpsuit over a year ago. 

[CalicoKitty]

I would not be surprised to find out that all the Duggar girls/women do wear pants regularly and only  wear skirts and pretend to follow the rules when they are paid to do so or for show.  I do not think this is a sincere practice for them.

[libgirl2]

3 minutes ago, CalicoKitty said:

I would not be surprised to find out that all the Duggar girls/women do wear pants regularly and only  wear skirts and pretend to follow the rules when they are paid to do so or for show.  I do not think this is a sincere practice for them.

Or maybe around their parents.  

[MMEButterfly]

30 minutes ago, BigBingerBro said:

That's the best I've ever seen her look. 

[GeeGolly]

Ever the skeptic - I need more proof that is actually Anna. 🤷🏽‍♀️

[awaken]

3 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Ever the skeptic - I need more proof that is actually Anna. 🤷🏽‍♀️

The photo in Missouri is clearly her and shows her face. This mani/pedi one not as clear. 

[emmawoodhouse]

Yeah, I question the spa pic. A little too blonde.

[SMama]

This last picture looks more like Jana to me. The body is just wrong. 

Edited June 5, 2022 by SMama