S01.E04: Episode 4

[ramble]

I love this show. It's like cheap vodka. It burns at first & you wonder if you should have had the classier stuff, but then after a couple, it's the best drink ever!

[MarkHB]

I loved the cheesy porn music during the massage sequence.

 

I also have to wonder when Kalon did his confessionals.  They were so OTT that I'm thinking he may have done them after every woman shot him down for the date, and he knew how he was going to get portrayed so he ran with it.

 

One more thing I loved: AshLee giving her TH speech about how she tries to do the right thing, be a good person, be there for everyone, etc., etc., capped by the camera tracking her into the bedroom and her exclamation of "Bitch!" TPTB must have rented every bus in Yucatan to throw these people under.

[Etta Place]

"From the first second I got here, I put all my eggs in your basket."

 

I almost hyperventilated from laughing at that.

 

 

I will put on my flame proof suit and ask if we are sure Marquel is straight? Seems like he doesn't even try with the women and I see no chemistry with any of them.

My husband asked the same question about Marquel. I guess he's just super-reserved? I don't know.

[ramble]

"From the first second I got here, I put all my eggs in your basket."

I almost hyperventilated from laughing at that.

I loved that! The whole my eggs & basket discussion was bizarre but when Zack made that statement I decided it was perfect for these folks!

Question: I could've sworn one of the thousand coming up on BiP segments showed a couple hugging & someone said "I've waited three & a half years for mumble mumble blurg." Did I imagine that? Did that happen & I missed it? I feel like Ashlee looking for her character, I can't find it!

[Andromeda]

Sarah was openly making fun of Kalon, right? ("what's 'SPER-lunking'?")  If so, I totally love her. On the other hand if she was genuinely asking what spelunking is, that's considerably less awesome. One can never really tell with these hamsters.

I got the strong impression Sarah was being stupid because she is.

 

Kalon should have taken one of the other guys on the speelunking trip.

I know!! I would have jumped at the chance to escape that stank "resort," surely one of the guys would want to do that.

 

I hate Zach.   After he told Clare that he didn't know if he would turn down a date card because, "It depends on the girl,"  I really expected her to walk away from him and never look back.  Go toward the Cody, Clare!  Zach doesn't have your back, he's only there until something better comes along and he doesn't have time to listen to your problems even when there's no ESPN.  Run. Away.

 

Yeah, it was pathetic that Clare ran back to him and turned down Cody, when I clearly heard a guy (Zach) saying he wants to be free to play the field.

 

AshLee is tacky and  creepy. Clare let her keep Graham and all AshLee has done in return is trash talk her.

 

Yup. I remembered when that happened in the first episode, I think it was. Ashlee doesn't deserve a friend like Clare, and Michelle, who knows Graham well, knew he would be happy about her behavior.

 

I don't know, Cody seems like a guy who has a closet full of matching cowboy boots and denim hot pants. Maybe a little cowboy hat and little cowboy vest to complete the look. But I admit, I might be alone in thinking that.

LOL, you’re so not alone. Total meathead. But he seems nice enough.

 

One more thing I loved: AshLee giving her TH speech about how she tries to do the right thing, be a good person, be there for everyone, etc., etc., capped by the camera tracking her into the bedroom and her exclamation of "Bitch!" TPTB must have rented every bus in Yucatan to throw these people under.

Dang, I missed the bitch part! Must listen for that.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Andromeda

[Pollock]

How does one sleep with someone in the ocean, anyway?

According to Courtney, the one who sexed with Ben in the ocean on camera : not easily if you go, like them, too far off shore. 

[rozen]

I think in AshLee's mind, Claire was super unfair because she assassinated AshLee's on-camera character on purpose, while she trashed Claire's inadvertently. I guess she was hoping to use this as an audition for The Bachelorette, sucks to be you, your edit sucked to begin with. 

 

What is with these dudes and their inability to manage a tense situation (probs why they're single)? "Depends on the girl" is the absolute dumbest possible response he could have had to Claire's question. She just flippin told you she's been burned by being over-committed while the guy was still playing the field, and your response is you might maybe play the field if the girl is like super hawt. And then he follows it up by basically shrugging and going 'ladeeeey problems' when AshLee's trashes his on-camera gf to his face. I get the feeling that any emotion other than smexy times is 'drama' to him.

 

Claire did not put her hair into a ponytail when AshLee pulled her aside! I thought she might snatch her by the scalp and drag her screaming into the ocean. Too bad we'll never get to see her on BP, I bet she would be competitive as all get out and make a real run at it.

Edited August 26, 2014 by rozen

[jhill]

Does anyone know the name of the band that played on Jackie's date? I need to know!!! It was such a great song!

 

According to Chris Harrison's Twitter, the name of the performer is Andrew Ripp.

[CindyBee]

Question: I could've sworn one of the thousand coming up on BiP segments showed a couple hugging & someone said "I've waited three & a half years for mumble mumble blurg." Did I imagine that? Did that happen & I missed it? I feel like Ashlee looking for her character, I can't find it!

 

Its Michelle and Cody hugging but I'm not sure when it takes place; maybe in tonight's episode when they go on a date.  And I'm not even sure if the "I've waited three years" is Cody as it could be spliced in from a sound bite from someone else.   Fleiss and his editors are tricky like that.

[JudyObscure]

 

I got the strong impression Sarah was being stupid because she is.

Thank you for going there.  I have tried so hard to like Sarah but I am currently finding her insufferable.  She seems like such a high-school crowd follower.  When Dylan liked her but all the other girls liked Robert -- she went after Robert.  When Kalon was getting shot down by Jackie, she was obviously dying for the chance to do the same thing. She is always ready to cast, "I wasn't brought up that way,"  judgment or,  we're all defending X-person, depending on how the wind blows.

 

I'm wondering how Marquel's love life goes. First date, "You are so beautiful, I love how you dress.  Do you like my style?  Your shoes are fabulous.  I usually don't kiss on the first date."  Second date, "Hi.  I was up all night compiling a list of your faults.  Maybe if you perfect these flaws we could move forward with the relationship."  I don't know if he's gay or frightened or what, but he really works hard at pushing the women away.

 

All during Sean's season, I just raved about AshLee's flawless  beauty, but the minute she said Clare wasn't even pretty, it jumped out at me that ashlee's forehead was too low.  Almost Neanderthal, really. 

[FlyingEgret]

As I think it is almost impossible, I have to admit I was very interested to see how Sarah would fix her hair into a ponytail when she was on the boat.  It definitely looked a lot neater when she jumped than when she was trying to do it, so I think production provided a helping hand...

[bosawks]

As I think it is almost impossible, I have to admit I was very interested to see how Sarah would fix her hair into a ponytail when she was on the boat.  It definitely looked a lot neater when she jumped than when she was trying to do it, so I think production provided a helping hand...

You know that had me stumped.........

[alexa]

I find this show to be so incredibly boring.  I read magazines and napped my way through it.  Even the relationships are boring because noone really gets to do anything but sit around and talk all day.  And most of the relationships are there just so they can stick around...it is clear they are not really that into each other.  It is just an odd show.  It is kind of like Survivor would be without the challenges to make things more interesting.

[Rainsong]

Kalon was the proverbial skunk at a picnic but he managed, within the confines of the show's premise, to mock that premise and production cliches i.e. the same ones that convince the audience season after season that X & Y are a bona fide love match. Interestingly, the producers played along, perhaps because they had the time blocked out and had nothing else to offer. And so Kalon got the beauty shots and even a Kalon/Kalon dialogue spliced together. He continued the joke ("We're still together!") on Twitter during the remainder of the show (the cast members are obviously under strict orders to comment on current/past episodes only but many of them are quite active during the broadcast) but by then it had probably run out of steam.

 

This new series has been the Clare & Michelle show with others barely getting a look-in.  The effusive praise for Michelle and her 'clever' lines blithely discounts several items:  1) Many or most of them are scripted (by her and/or others), 2) They really aren't that amusing, 3) When not in a near-constant series of interview segments [hers is the de facto replacement for Chris Harrison's narration] she has been desperately pinballing around the males looking for any means of staying on the show, 4) Her above-it-all stance is hypocrisy personified when she breaks into her frequent crying jags.  Her 'looking out for her friend Graham' routine plumbs new depths of insincerity; she merely wants to stir the pot.

 

Fair play to Clare who has, apparently, reversed the opinion of many who disliked her previously but her newfound admirers should recall the horrorshow of Mexican Mama & The Cinderella Sisters back home.  Anyone getting involved with Clare will, inevitably, get involved with her jealous, spiteful family and the apple never falls far from the tree as the AshLee incident demonstrated (AshLee's instigation notwithstanding). Zack is taking a fusillade of 'WRONG ANSWER!' arrows from females that demand he pledge an oath of loyalty to someone he barely knows but it was delicious seeing the wind taken out of Clare's sails at such a critical moment.

 

Sarah was active on Twitter during the episode, fretting about her swimsuit and responding 'I agree' to nasty people who posted 'I hate your voice!'  It was good value seeing her light up at being chosen for a date outright instead of being a safety valve but after the patented Bachlelor Leap Into The Sea we saw precious little of that date.

 

I won't relive the Jackie Debates except to say she poured herself into that red serviette of a dress very nicely.  But Jesse's lines were delivered with such stark, desperate insincerity that if Jackie believes them she deserves whatever fate awaits.  Anyone in his position as a latecomer probably would have done the same but it sounded as if he were reading from a script - which perhaps he was, figuratively.

 

Admittedly, posting about this episode is like reviewing a play at the interval:  we haven't seen the whole thing so any judgment may be premature.  But given our familiarity with the characters and overall plot arc (as well as incessant teasers) we can probably surmise most of the second act.

 

One conclusion we can safely draw now:  this show is running on an absolute shoestring budget.  The lodgings are primitive.  The dates are uninspiring, unimaginative and, above all, cheap.  Walking through a street market or public square is free.  Rappelling into a grotto or walking through ruins involves a nominal fee.  Puddle-jumper flights are relatively inexpensive i.e. a fraction of the cost of hiring a Gulfstream.  Mexico in general is the cheapest destination in the Caribbean. Fleiss & Co. have been challenged to prove to network brass they can show a profit from a proverbial summer replacement show so they are being miserly indeed. Unfortunately for them, if they gave a couple the occasional lavish date it would create jealousy, speculation, resentment, etc. among those left behind and, in turn, create drama beyond the usual catfights from bored, cooped-up cast members but there simply isn't enough cash available.

 

AshLee isn't everyone's cup of tea but it's clear that she felt genuine guilt about her comments even if she had no one to blame but herself.  In a Big Brother-style setting one should assume the cameras are always rolling. Speaking of cameras, it's interesting that the episode hinged on 'camera talk' given that Bachelor casts are generally instructed NOT to call attention to the cameras, production staff etc.  I do hope for her sake that the ambulance is merely a precaution, but fear that a panic attack or worse will only serve to convince Graham to look elsewhere.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Rainsong

[jette]

Michelle braided Sarah's hair for her. In the next scene, Sarah totally trashes Michelle while out on the boat with Robert --- while playing with the braid in her hair. And then calls Ash (she's not even going to get the last three stupid letters from me) out on being two faced in front/away from the cameras. Hypocrite, much?

[kia112]

According to Chris Harrison's Twitter, the name of the performer is Andrew Ripp.

 

I LOVE Andrew Ripp.  His voice is sick and I was beyond shocked (and really happy) when he popped up on the show.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Rhondinella
to clarify context

[leighdear]

 

AshLee isn't everyone's cup of tea but it's clear that she felt genuine guilt about her comments even if she had no one to blame but herself.

I agree, she felt genuine guilt.  However, I felt her seemingly remorseful apologies were intense backpedaling and a desperate attempt to cover her own ass.  

 

"Oh damn, I got caught! Time to act regretful and apologetic.....hmmm...maybe I can squeeze out some tears to make it look genuine...I wonder if she'll buy it?"

Edited August 26, 2014 by leighdear

[seacliffsal]

I agree that Ashlee felt bad-but it's because she realized that she was caught on camera.  It was interesting to hear from other participants that Ashlee really pays attention to where the cameras are-her conversation with Zack proves that, and her surprize that there were cameras throughout the 'resort' proves that.  She established her character in the very first episode when she ranted about Clare asking out Graham on that date.  Clare, while a bit crazy, showed who she is by taking back the invitation due to Ashlee's rant.  Ashlee seems to craft her on screen persona very carefully.  While many think she's beautiful and should be able to find someone, I think that she is able to get the dates/relationships, but that after a while her true self comes out and while she is very physically attractive so are many other women who might not bring as much drama.  Drama on this show is fabulous!  Drama in real life....not so much.

[Dlevron]

I LOVE Andrew Ripp.  His voice is sick and I was beyond shocked (and really happy) when he popped up on the show.

 

Thank you guys! I'm so in love with his voice!

Edited August 26, 2014 by Rhondinella
to clarify context

[MsPH]

AshLee is such a two-faced bitch. Clare's been nothing but nice to her, yet she has to talk trash as soon as she thinks she's not being recorded. Just how insecure is she? Newsflash, AshLee: Being yourself isn't supposed to be hard work! So if you have to work hard on being a nice person (on camera), then you simply aren't. This is why she's still single. No amount of hotness is gonna make up for the craziness and nasty character. And I don't even think she's that hot. A stick insect with obvious fake boobs. After the first episode on Twitter, she was blaming editing for the "She's not even pretty!" comment. Yeah, like anyone believes that, AshLee. Run, Graham, run!

 

I kind of feel bad for Zack. I think he really does like Clare, but they've only been romantically involved for a few days. He's not quite ready to get engaged to her yet and he was just being honest about it. It's a dating show and she's been on dates with how many guys now? 3 or 4? He's barely had a chance to look around. Doesn't mean he's not serious about a relationship, just most relationships don't begin as love at first sight. They're still in the getting to know each other stage. I do hate it when guys are so scared of confrontation that they won't even stick up for you, but I wouldn't wanna tattle on AshLee either. I'd be too scared for my life.

 

Marcus is still creepy. The way he looks at women he's into, it's like he's on drugs or something. I would be scared too if I was Lacy. I can barely listen to the conversations between those two, because they're soooo inane.

 

Michelle keeps getting more pathetic. I think Robert made his choice loud and clear with the rose already, not sure why she had another breakdown about the date. Get a grip, woman! I hope things work out with Cody though. He seems like a nice guy, but pretty dim and his excitement is just too much. Like an excited puppy. I just can't take him seriously.

 

Jackie really isn't brightest if she was buying anything Jesse was selling. He was so transparent!

 

Kalon is disgusting, so I took immense pleasure in seeing him get turned down by three women. The solo date was funny though and definitely the best choice for him.

[waving feather]

This show is so entertaining. I had my doubts during the first episode because it was dreadfully boring but it has gotten better as it went on. And once again, can we have Clare for Bachelorette please? She's not an "American sweetheart" like Desiree or "Successful lawyer" like Andi but she would be 100x more entertaining.

 

I defended AshLee during Sean's season but man, she's crazier than I had imagined. Wow. And it's not genuine guilt if the only reason you felt bad about it was because you were caught. She would not have felt a single thing if there weren't cameras or she wasn't found out. Clare has amazing confrontational skills. I've noticed it since Juan Pablo's season where she shut him down during the FRC. And I liked the way she handled AshLee too. 

 

I want to join the editing team just based on how much fun they seem to be having on this show. With the Bachelor/Bachelorette, they can't go too crazy because of "right reasons" but are they having a blast on BIP or what?! I feel like they could get away with anything. Also laughed at the way Clare tied her hair into a pony tail during her confrontation with AshLee. If she had started taking out her earrings.... Still amazing that so many guys came on just to meet her. I didn't think her edit during Juan Pablo's season was that flattering. But who knows...

[PetuniaP]

I could write a book about Clare and how she handled that AshLee situation. It was amazing! She hears the gossip and then tells AshLee she wants to talk to her later. But she refuses to do it in the moment. Then she smoothes things over with Zach and says nothing to AshLee...she just sits in Zach's arms and glares. Meanwhile, AshLee...who was full of bravado about how she was going to take Clare down when she approached her, is getting more and more nervous that Clare HASN'T approached her. So what does she do? Approach Clare! Talk about making your enemy come to you. That's one point for Clare. AshLee then proceeds to ask Clare if she's upset with and claims to not know why. Clare does not enter the fray at that point and lay out her grievance, she just says " you don't know why I would be upset?" forcing AshLee to admit she said something. Point two for Clare! AshLee, clearly broken at that point proceeds to tell Clare how nice she's been and how they are friends and then Clare comes out with the knockout punch..."we are not friends". It was masterful to watch, a Machavellian lesson on how to crush your foes. Clare's only mistake is to continue bothering with Zach who is so ineffectual that it's a shame to watch. I really hope that now that the gloves are off with AshLee, that Clare goes for Graham. He seems like a good guy and a much better person than Zach. 

Edited August 26, 2014 by PetuniaP

[Dirtybubble]

I will put on my flame proof suit and ask if we are sure Marquel is straight? Seems like he doesn't even try with the women and I see no chemistry with any of them.

 

My husband asked the same question about Marquel. I guess he's just super-reserved? I don't know.

My gaydar wasn't going off with him anytime he was on this show or on Andi's season so my guess is he is just reserved.  Or maybe he simply doesn't have a strong connection with anyone he meet.  I was kinda surprised he and Jackie didn't hit it off more.  I was expecting some couple time with them considering he broke his sacred I don't kiss on the first date rule.  I don't know but I get the feeling alot of stuff is happening off camera that isn't being shown.  I kinda hope they have a reunion or something so maybe everyone can explain why their relationships didn't work.

 

Despite what happened last night I still like Sarah.  I do genuinely believe she is here "for the right reasons" but maybe she is just getting caught up in the he said she said business on the island.   Without the distraction of t.v.s, computers, or cell phones I guess it's easy to do.   And as much as I do like her & Robert together I'm still getting a luke warm vibe off their relationship.  I suppose I've gotten used to people making out so quickly after they've meet and because I haven't seen them even kiss (or did I miss something?) I just get the impression they are kinda so-so.

 

 

[FamilyVan]

I can't wait for Jackie to see this episode air and realize how bad she was being played. 

 

Ashlee - so busted with that camera.  Why were her and Zack sitting out there on that hammock anyway?  That looked a little weird to me, seemed sort of cozy for two people who are involved with others, but hey I guess they get bored lying around all day.  I honesly don't care at all what Clare did on other seasons.  Anything she did with JP was like things she did with an ex-boyfriend, so I don't even think those things could be held against her or smear her "reputation".  Per the premise of the show she and JP were a dating couple in a relationship, and what they did together is no ones business.  Totally desperate and below the belt for Ashlee to even bring it up.  And then later whan Lacy was saying it didn't happen, Ashlee said she didn't know if it did or did not happen.  So then if you don't know, don't talk about it!

 

I don't even know why Michelle is there at all.  I guess they can just make up the rules as they go here that someone can give out a pity rose to someone they are not actually interested in, and people who form no connection can stay just for the heck of it.  Producer manipulation!

 

So if Graham says no to the rose that means he leaves?  So he got stuck with this woman from day one, thereby missing any opportunity to meet or connect with anyone else, and then when he wants to reject her, he has to leave?  Raw deal.

[aenea]

 

 

I want to join the editing team just based on how much fun they seem to be having on this show. With the Bachelor/Bachelorette, they can't go too crazy because of "right reasons" but are they having a blast on BIP or what?! I feel like they could get away with anything. 

 

 

I love how in the 'preview' clips for tonight they're saying things "Drama like you've never seen" with an immediate clip to the raccoon.  

[LakeGal]

Michelle is acting like she is Aunt Michelle.  The older female the other females all confide in and get advice from.  Aunt Michelle has to keep up on all the action and gives us the play-by-play of what is happening.

 

I started expecting to see several of them carrying baskets around.  So much talk about putting eggs in baskets.

 

AshLee is pretty until she opens her mouth.  I always wondered why she needed this show to find a man.  But I expect she has a lot of first dates and then the men run.  She is very insecure.  I believe she is still steaming about Clare having the nerve to ask Graham on that date at the beginning.  She hasn't let it go and hates the competition.  She has to knock Clare down to make herself feel better and secure.  But she also wants to put on the perfect act.  She has her image and she doesn't want anyone to see her fall off her pedestal.  She acts for the cameras.

 

Marquel is getting some of his own actions back.  He ignored Danielle to go with Jackie.  Now Jackie did the same to him to sample Jesse.  Marquel looks nice but his personality is showing and he has really gone down on the likeable scale.

 

What is wrong with Jackie's cleavage?

 

Cody seems like a teddy bear.  Clare should have went out with him.  Zach pretty much admitted he is only with her till someone better comes along. 

[Dittohead]

I found it interesting that Lacy was so happy when Marcus let the L word slip out, but that she didn't tell him she loved him, even though, as she herself admitted, she was dying to.  I think I would have under those same circumstances. 

 

 

So if Graham says no to the rose that means he leaves?  So he got stuck with this woman from day one, thereby missing any opportunity to meet or connect with anyone else, and then when he wants to reject her, he has to leave?  Raw deal.

I am hoping he accepts her rose and then dumps her immediately once it's safe to do so.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Dittohead

[Primetimer]

The dim bulbs on Bachelor In Paradise are treated to "sperlunking," cave music, and more this week. But is any of it worth your valuable time?

Read the story

[riggins]

Claire handled this situation amaaaazingly. It was aggravating me that AshLEE's apologies were of the "I'm sorry....that you were offended" variety. Those kinds of apologies aren't apologies for doing anything wrong, they're apologies about the offended party being sensitve and Claire 100% had a right to be angry at Ashlee.

 

Also, I don't mind bitches on reality tv, like at all. But you should just own the fact that you're bitchy. Laurel on the Challenge? She's pretty much a bitch and doesn't apologize about it and she's definitely one of my favorites. Ashlee's mistake is trying to pretend like she's nice, when she isn't at all. Now you're bitchy AND fake, and I can't get behind that combo.

 

I also don't understand Zach and his belief that he could do a lot better than Claire. Claire is really pretty to me, if I was a straight guy on this show I would be all about her. Shallow, but her waist to hip ratio is insane. And there's life behind her eyes, Ashlee seems pretty much dead behind her clumpy mascara.

[Bugs Meany]

Question: I could've sworn one of the thousand coming up on BiP segments showed a couple hugging & someone said "I've waited three & a half years for mumble mumble blurg." Did I imagine that?

 

Maybe it was Michelle?  It's been about that long since her Bachelor season.

 

Speaking of cameras, it's interesting that the episode hinged on 'camera talk' given that Bachelor casts are generally instructed NOT to call attention to the cameras, production staff etc.

 

They seem more willing these days to break the fourth wall occasionally.  Usually it's when something "dramatic" happens, and you'll see one cameraman (filmed by another cameraman, obviously) chasing after someone or whipping around when something happens outside the frame.

 

I don't even know why Michelle is there at all.

 

Because she's awesome.  Even if her soundbites are not actually that clever, she sells them perfectly.  I just love her.

 

And I'm starting to love Clare as well.  She's endearingly unaffected.

[woodscommaelle]

What is wrong with Jackie's cleavage?

 

Reminds me of Tori Spelling's cleavage.  Surgery gone wrong?

[Stella MD]

 

AshLee isn't everyone's cup of tea but it's clear that she felt genuine guilt about her comments even if she had no one to blame but herself.

I think mileage may vary on this point. I didn't see any evidence of actual remorse, just a girl who felt increasingly panicked for getting caught being a bitch on camera. Even her "apology" to Claire was ridiculous: "I get the sense, that, you're like, mad or me, or something? And I just can't figure out why, or what I did?" Bitch, please, you and everyone else knows exactly what you did. And then of course she had to break out the infamous "I'm sorry, if I said something to offend you" qualifier to her "apology". There's no "if" about it, honey - you said something offensive. Have the decency to own it already, or at least fake it through a 30-second apology.

 

I'm starting to love Claire and her interpersonal skills and would totally watch a season of her on the Bachelorette. The contrast between Claire turning down Cody and Jackie turning down Kalon was like the difference between a valedictorian and a grade-school dropout. 

[RedheadZombie]

I could write a book about Clare and how she handled that AshLee situation. It was amazing! She hears the gossip and then tells AshLee she wants to talk to her later. But she refuses to do it in the moment. Then she smoothes things over with Zach and says nothing to AshLee...she just sits in Zach's arms and glares. Meanwhile, AshLee...who was full of bravado about how she was going to take Clare down when she approached her, is getting more and more nervous that Clare HASN'T approached her. So what does she do? Approach Clare! Talk about making your enemy come to you. That's one point for Clare. AshLee then proceeds to ask Clare if she's upset with and claims to not know why. Clare does not enter the fray at that point and lay out her grievance, she just says " you don't know why I would be upset?" forcing AshLee to admit she said something. Point two for Clare! AshLee, clearly broken at that point proceeds to tell Clare how nice she's been and how they are friends and then Clare comes out with the knockout punch..."we are not friends". It was masterful to watch, a Machavellian lesson on how to crush your foes. Clare's only mistake is to continue bothering with Zach who is so ineffectual that it's a shame to watch. I really hope that now that the gloves are off with AshLee, that Clare goes for Graham. He seems like a good guy and a much better person than Zach. 

 

I think it's very telling that Clare didn't run to Graham and attempt to sabotage Ashlee's situation.  I love that guy after guy walks in and asks Clare on a date.  She's adorable, but that type is often overlooked.  Regarding Graham - I wonder why Michelle doesn't go for it.

What is wrong with Jackie's cleavage?

 

 

 

Bad boob job.

I think mileage may vary on this point. I didn't see any evidence of actual remorse, just a girl who felt increasingly panicked for getting caught being a bitch on camera. Even her "apology" to Claire was ridiculous: "I get the sense, that, you're like, mad or me, or something? And I just can't figure out why, or what I did?" Bitch, please, you and everyone else knows exactly what you did. And then of course she had to break out the infamous "I'm sorry, if I said something to offend you" qualifier to her "apology". There's no "if" about it, honey - you said something offensive. Have the decency to own it already, or at least fake it through a 30-second apology. 

 

Exactly.  Ashlee was still a total bitch when discussing it with Lacy.

[woodscommaelle]

Cody just seems so lovable.  Not my type at all, but I'd rather him be the next Bachelor than Chris.  

 

And I can't remember what the girls were talking about in their room, but at one point they show Lacy completely cracking up.  And I loved her in that moment.  She seemed very real.  

Edited August 26, 2014 by woodscommaelle

[TheFinalRose]

OMG Graham so wants to be done with AshLee that he will grab at any straw (with a vodka and soda attached, ha, that was hysterical) to shake her off.  I mean, yeah, she was a mean gossip but if he was into her he would not let a little gossip like that get in his way and he would talk to her about it later.  When I saw the previews I thought AshLee had said something way worse about Graham and that was what made Graham embarrass her and leave her twisting in the wind with her rose.  But no, just gossip about Claire. 

 

Anyway, Clare rocks. She is delusional about Zack, but I too love her confrontational aplomb! 

 

Marcus looks zoned out, again, but I thought his slip of the lip and saying he loved Lacy was really cute. But that about wraps up their camera time/storyline and Fleiss ought to engineer a way for them to leave the show at this point because they are dead weight and taking up two slots that other famewhores could be using to mix up the pot.

 

I do not remember Jessie from Jillian's season but no wonder as he is not very remarkable. However, he seems to have Ed's sleazy come on line ability that worked like magic on Jackie, so good for him, I guess. Kalon is a joke. But he did provide the only real laugh out loud humor in last night's show.  Looking forward to tonight as the preview at the beginning of the show looks like there is some hidden night camera action which BIP has yet to provide. 

 

[Mabinogia]

They seem more willing these days to break the fourth wall occasionally.

 

 

My favorite breaking of the fourth wall this ep was when Michelle was complaining how everybody around her was getting massages, she means EVERYBODY and they show a shot of some production person getting a massage. IDK if it was a camera person or sound or what, but it wasn't a cast member. Then Ashlee being so stupid as to think there is any such thing as a private conversation on this show. I know that they say that after a while you kind of forget about the giant sound pack you shove in your bikini and the constant cameras but this is a chick they all admit is well aware of the cameras. So she must have suggested the place to talk specifically because she thought they wouldn't be overheard then tells Zach he should play the field. What a calculating bitch! And what was her purpose fort his? Clare doesn't have a spare egg to put in Grahams basket (though I wish she would. I could get behind that pairing, except no, because I really want Clare as the next B'ette) and I assumed Ashlee was tossing her eggs in sure thing Graham's basket, or is she looking to stick one in Zacks? (man this egg/basket analogy can get disturbing really fast).

 

The cliffhanger for me right now is if Graham can somehow manage to stay. I want him to, but I don't want him to stick with Ashlee. She's just so...vacant. Even when Graham walked out and everyone is shocked and looking around like WTF? and, you know, reacting, she, the one he's supposed to be hooked up with now, has no reaction at all. Maybe she was wondering if all the camera's would follow him so she could freely call Clare a bitch again for no rational reason.  

[KR Vermont]

My mileage varies greatly in that I don't see any beauty in AshLee. Fascinating that she tells Zack he shouldn't be hitched to one woman (Clare) while in Paradise, since that's her one-sided deal with Graham, AND said woman was the one who kindly and perhaps foolishly reneged on her anticipated date with Graham in deference to AshLee, so nice to stab someone who did you a big favor she didn't have to at all. Who's the cuckoo bitch now. AshLee can't blame it all on bad editing.

 

Speaking of being hitched to one woman, I didn't hear Marcus say "I love you" to Lacy, but "I love it when you..." which to me is not the same thing. But they both seem to love each other as much as you can while filming in the Bachelor microcosm, so it's all the same to them.

ETA: Having seen Marcus fall in love with Andi, I would guess that him saying "I love it when you..." is probably his way of expressing he loves her without totally scaring her off, being cautiously optimistic after coming off Andi's season.

Edited August 26, 2014 by KR Vermont

[Kbilly]

What's Jesse's last name again? He went by it on Bachelor Pad. I thought he was so hot on that show but seems really dumb here and I feel ashamed. I liked how when he was walking up one of the girls said "he's old."

 

Kalon had all this weird redness in his face that was very off-putting. I thought some of what he said on his date was amusing but I could've done without the making out with himself thing. Did he really make a cave/vagina joke? Tight Mexican spaces or something like that?

 

Zach has no neck but from the no neck down he is extremely attractive. Just put the EggBasket over his head and we're good.

 

I'm super over Michelle's shtick and her sad sack desperation. I was surprised she didn't try to chat up that random bartender who was awkwardly stuck in her and Graham's convo at the bar.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Kbilly

[reggiejax]

I'm starting to love Claire and her interpersonal skills and would totally watch a season of her on the Bachelorette.

 

 

I've loved Clare from day one. She should have been the Bachelorette instead of Andi. Andi, with the perpetual "Who farted?" look on her face. The odds are slim that Clare will be picked to be the next Bachelorette in 2015. It would require a combination of next season's Bachelor women being a complete pack of stiffs, and popular demand that Clare be the Bachelorette. The first part certainly wouldn't be hard, but TPTB are not averse to casting stiffs as the Bachelorette (Ashley, Desiree, Andi). And while Clare is enjoying an uptick in popularity right now, I don't know if it will last until they cast the next season of The Bachelorette. I say enjoy her while we have her. 

 

I agree with the idea that AshLee is attractive, physically. But in all honesty, hers is a very generic brand of attractiveness on this show. I mean all during yesterday's episode, I kept asking myself, "Didn't she leave last week with that Chris guy?". I said the same thing about Lacy as well. I swear, they must pick these women up in bulk at Costco or something. Clare, on the other hand, while not outrageously beautiful, or all that different from the AshLee's, seems to distinguish herself from the others. I can't say exactly why, but she does.

Edited August 26, 2014 by reggiejax

[AV8n]

All these frakkin' eggs in all these frakkin' baskets, and no one makes an omelette?  Last night's episode promised to bring the crazy, and they FedEx'd it right to the door!

You know you're unpopular when even Michelle won't go out with you.  I kept waiting on Kalon to complain about there being so many Mexicans there, but the comments they did air were plenty offensive or just plain crazy.  And the sun lizards agree!

Did someone forget to tell Asshlee that the mic-pack she's wearing will work even when she's out of the camera's line-of-sight?  Girl, they've probably got more of your stuff on tape than you could imagine.  Stick to racial statements - they can't seem to record those!  Way to mess up Clare's suite life dilemma and focus her anger on you, though.  Zach says thanks.  And could you hold some eggs?  His basket is already full.

I kinda felt bad for Cody Code.  First he gets kicked out of Planet Fitness, then rejected by Andi, and now Clare shoots him down before he's even broken a sweat on the beach.  But she couldn't just be like nope, sticking with the egg farmer here.  She gave him hope.  Then crushed it.  I totally thought he was going to ask Marcus out on a date with the little speech he gave, but nice of him to offer up the date card.

[Dirtybubble]

I agree with the idea that AshLee is attractive, physically. But in all honesty, hers is a very generic brand of attractiveness on this show. I mean all during yesterday's episode, I kept asking myself, "Didn't she leave last week with that Chris guy?". I said the same thing about Lacy as well. I swear, they must pick these women up in bulk at Costco or something. Clare, on the other hand, while not outrageously beautiful, or all that different from the AshLee's, seems to distinguish herself from the others. I can't say exactly why, but she does.

ITA!  I live in a small town and if any of these women where to walk into any place the guys here would be tripping over themselves to get a chance to simply stand next to them.  They are all pretty on their own and in different settings but everyone all together like this they do sort of just run into each other where one looks just like the other.

 

Same thing with the guys, any woman where I live would be thrilled to have one of these guys ask them out on a date but in the Bachelor world....enh there is no real excitement or wow, one looks just like the other.

 

On a side note--for Kalon's sake I hope he was simply playing up the douche bag character for T.V.  If he behaves like that in real life...holy geez!  It was almost cartoonish how douche-y he was actin'!

 

Edited August 26, 2014 by Dirtybubble

[Pixel]

But Jesse's lines were delivered with such stark, desperate insincerity that if Jackie believes them she deserves whatever fate awaits.  Anyone in his position as a latecomer probably would have done the same but it sounded as if he were reading from a script - which perhaps he was, figuratively.

 

I have to admit, I couldn't help but like Kalon a little when he was so unabashedly hilarious about everything.

[MsPH]

Claire handled this situation amaaaazingly. It was aggravating me that AshLEE's apologies were of the "I'm sorry....that you were offended" variety. Those kinds of apologies aren't apologies for doing anything wrong, they're apologies about the offended party being sensitve and Claire 100% had a right to be angry at Ashlee.

 

Yeah and then she was like "I'm not upset with you. Don't feel like you did anything wrong" and Clare was just like "I DIDN'T do anything wrong!". AshLee is so delusional it's not even funny. And then she's crying about her feelings being hurt. Bitch, please!

[KR Vermont]

I have to admit, I couldn't help but like Kalon a little when he was so unabashedly hilarious about everything.

I smiled at his sun lizards comment to Sarah and Jackie, though they didn't seem too pleased with it. All those shots of (real) lizards sunning themselves in the hot Mexican sun. ha

 

I too thought Kalon was about to ask Marcus to join him on his spelunking date, and then when he got there I thought it looked like the place Marcus and Sarah had been with her unfortunate swimsuit choice. The one she wore with Robert on the catamaran was different, yes? I presume she's worn a one-piece on her dates because they involved jumping off into water, it's a less challenging choice for her than trying to simultaneously fix an askew bikini top while swimming to the surface?

[NoWhammies]

I was rather impressed with Ashlee's level of delusion that she actually tried to turn that around on Clare somehow and make the whole thing seem like Clare's fault, like "I'm not mad at you." Why the hell would you be mad at me, Crazy Train? Plus, Clare putting her hair up in a ponytail during the Ashlee confrontation was everything. 

 

I know that they say that after a while you kind of forget about the giant sound pack you shove in your bikini and the constant cameras but this is a chick they all admit is well aware of the cameras.

The mic packs are surprisingly easy to forget. I once filmed an episode of Mystery at the Museum for like 10 hours, and by lunchtime I'd forgotten I was wearing it and wore it into the bathroom. Lucky sound guy.

[chocolatine]

If only Clare could assert herself with men the way she does with women, I'm sure the marriage proposals would be pouring in. After Zach's "depends on the girl" comment, she should have dropped him like a hot potato (with a side of scrambled eggs).

 

Can't wait for tonight's continuation of the crazy! I wish I had a bartender to mix me vodka & sodas while I watch the show. 

Edited August 26, 2014 by chocolatine

[violetr]

Both Jackie and Marcus are like limp robots. Are there limp robots? They are so flat and boring. I'd rather have a conversation with spackle than either one of them. Also, I think Marcus will fall in love with anyone who will have him. He'd fall for Twin Peaks's Log Lady if she were into him.
 

I find Cody super gross to look at but at least he brought a little energy into the equation. Although I found it hilarious that he claimed he wouldn't give up on Claire and would be "nipping at her heels" for the rest of the trip, but several hours later he was all in with Michelle. I guess that's just the silly nature of this silly show.

 

I can't even with Kalon or AshLee.

 

Clare for the win! Except...there are no winners in this "paradise." Only sweaty, delusional losers.

[chilis]

I think that Graham's issue wasn't that AshLee was a gossip or acting like a mean girl to Clare, but that she was trying to act like a different person on camera vs. in real life.  I think that if she owned being catty in that moment he wouldn't have had as much of a problem with it.  I know he commented that what is on camera is who you are (shades of Heather B!).  So I thought it was the fakeness that he was having a hard time stomaching and potentially endorsing by accepting a rose.

[JenE4]

So, I was multi-tasking and missed key segments of the show. I did hear what AshLee said to Zack. However, I completely missed what Michelle said to Graham. Was it along a similar vein of you better watch out for this girl whose ovaries are in your basket (I guess eggs/basket was Clare/Zack but whatevs), or was it just like asking him whether he was aware of the drama and then filling him in on what was said?

[seacliffsal]

I think that Ashlee may be used to manipulating situations without reprisal.  She may find friends who are similar and are mean girls together.  When someone they target tries to push back, they do their double talk and turn the situation around to placing blame on their target and then acting as if they were the victims.  Ashlee kept trying to do that with Clair who did not allow Ashlee to control their interaction.  Ashlee tried the typical conditional apology "if I hurt you", then turning around the situation "don't blame yourself" and then even requesting the hug which would have given Ashlee the advantage.  Clair, bless her heart, was having none of that and did not respond as Ashlee had intended or was trying to manipulate.  I don't see this group as backing up Ashlee so she may not really know how to handle this situation.