S02.E01: Everything Is Great! (1) / S02.E02: Everything Is Great! (2)

[ElectricBoogaloo]

9 minutes ago, topanga said:

“My good friend Kanye frequently wears cargo pants.”

Ha! A+ (although now that I think about it, I can imagine old Tahani saying, "I've only worn cargo pants once before today, but that's only because I was doing a favor for my good friend Kanye when he asked me to be a runway model for his new collection during fashion week").

[Chippings]

12 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

This series really is an interesting modern retelling of No Exit, in a lot of ways. Michael really seems to be banking on the whole "Hell is other people" philosophy to torture the fab four. However, unlike in No Exit, the main characters are actually capable of real change and personal growth, even after their memories of what changed them has been wiped. In between all the wacky jokes and sight gags, there are some interesting philosophical questions here about the afterlife, redemption, and humanities capacity for self improvement in spite of insurmountable odds. 

Plus, we get Tahani and her off the rack cargo pants filled with shrimp!

Whoa !  How many message boards are there where you get references to Jean Paul Sartre ?  And indeed, in how many network comedies?  This was amazing.  I'm embarrassed it didn't occur to me after seeing the episodes last night, but - Yes, exactly.   Thank you Tennisgurl for making the connection.  

[CleoCaesar]

So happy this clever, hilarious show is back, and with such a great premiere. I love how quickly they sped through the reset - I didn't want half a season of Eleanor looking for Chidi or piecing things together. And since Sean said this is Michael's last chance, I don't think there will be another reset after this one.

Loved the insult to Chidi "you walk around like a nerd trying to get his personal best on his Fitbit." Not that I've ever done anything like that myself...

Tahani killed it with the lines this episode. I wish she was Eleanor's soulmate, that sexy skyscraper.

 

 

1 hour ago, cpcathy said:

Danson plays frustration so well, go nearly any episode of Cheers in its first season and him being frustrated with Diane is a thing of beauty, acting wise.

Let's not forget Becker! Dr. Becker was annoyed and frustrated every single episode.

[Notwisconsin]

45 minutes ago, chitowngirl said:

I could see the Fab Four becoming the Scooby Squad and help Michael against Sean.

I could see the Fab Four becoming the Scooby Squad and help Sean against Michael. or have them find out in three or four episodes that  this was not try three but was 134, and having them rebel in some other fashion. Counter-punking, if you will.

[CherithCutestory]

Quote

Was it ever explained why someone like Chidi deserved hell?  (This show is about hell, right?  I'm honestly confused).  Earth Chidi was terribly indecisive, that's all I can remember, but it doesn't seem like enough.  And Tehani, what, she was just envious of her sister?

In the first episode they made it clear that only the best of the best get into the Good Place. It's not enough to be a basically decent person. You have to actively achieve enough points to get into the Good Place. I think we can take the point system as true because Janet is privy to it and she isn't in on the lies. The question isn't "what did Chidi do to deserve this" but "what did Chidi do deserve to be in the Good Place?" And the answer is not a whole lot. He was so in his own head that he never ended up actually helping a single person before he died. And his selfishness lead to the people around him being hurt.  And being worried about his own morality even when he's told repeatedly that it annoys everyone around him is selfish.

Obviously he's basically a good guy. But that's just not enough in this world.

But  they say at first that no one religion was totally right. So, I think it's dangerous to assume it's a very strict heaven v. hell dynamic. Not even all Christians believe that. Catholics are taught that a few people are sent right to heaven and a few right to hell but most souls suffer punishment in purgatory to expunge their sins before moving on to heaven (or being cast into hell.)

I don't think any of us should assume the Good Place=heaven and the Bad Place=hell as a straight dynamic.

Quote

Jianyu make Tahini look good though.  If her soulmate was a Buddhist monk, it means she's deeper and more thoughtful and her existence has more meaning.  Of course she tried with the person who made her look better.

 

Totally, I loved this plot point and how they explored it. On the surface, last season Tahani got the perfect afterlife. The huge mansion and perfect clothes meant she could throw parties and be admired. A Buddhist monk demonstrated that she really was a spiritual person. Otherwise why would she land such a soulmate? She even had Eleanor to feel superior to.

She couldn't really say anything or be openly disgruntled because it would reflect poorly on her if she couldn't get along with a forking monk.

This time she has nothing to cling to.

Quote

Tahani killed it with the lines this episode. I wish she was Eleanor's soulmate, that sexy skyscraper.

 

Maybe she, Eleanor and Chidi are tri-soulmates. All three belong together!

 

Quote

This series really is an interesting modern retelling of No Exit, in a lot of ways

Except for poor Michael it's turning out have the opposite impact. Eleanor/Chidi/Tahani only make each other better with just a little torture of each other along the way. 

In reality they are each others' karass like in Cat's Cradle rather than each others' hell.

Edited September 21, 2017 by CherithCutestory

[tennisgurl]

23 minutes ago, Chippings said:

Thank you Tennisgurl for making the connection.  

Awwwww thanks! I am always excited to have a chance to break out my Sartre references!

[The Companion]

15 hours ago, meatball77 said:

I laughed every time Elenor's soulmate said he was going to the gym and ripped his shirt off.

This gag did not get old for me. I loved when he did it at the end. 

 

14 hours ago, possibilities said:

I think Tahani actually comes off worse this round than before. She was incredibly rude to her "soulmate" this time, where in Round 1 she tried with Jianyu.

The demons all seem so dimwitted! I didn't notice that before. Trevor's demons seemed snide but not necessarily incompetent.

I think a lot of people have pointed out a lot of great points for this, so I will try not to overlap. One of the things that made sense in last season was that Eleanor was given a house that she would have hated, but the reason was that real Eleanor would have loved it. The yogurt/yurt also fit this theme, but Tahani's house did not. She believed she should be there (she clearly wasn't confused for someone else), so it didn't make sense that she would be put into the house she got.  It was a huge tell for the characters that the Good Place wasn't all that good.  

I do think her behavior was consistent with her character from last year, namely that she thrives in her comfort zone but struggles when things don't go her way. 

 

13 hours ago, Dots And Stripes said:

I think they seem incompetent because they're out of their element. They have to pretend to be nice (no biting or twisting).

interesting Eleanor caught on so quickly. I wonder if Michael will eventually see his interests align with the 4. He can avoid retirement if they all go in on a ruse against Sean. 

I kind of missed the sense of danger this time. Knowing the twist kind of took away some of the suspense. The end restore that again to an extent. The show had a brisk pace last season and I hope to see that continue.

The irrational irritation at little things is possibly my favorite part of this show. The references to odd forms of torture was a funny addition this time. 

I loved the references to torture, does that mean I am headed to the Bad Place? No thanks on the butthole spiders, though.

11 hours ago, DrScottie said:

Their triggers were set off in the same day.  They'll need to dial it back.  It just so happens that everything in their lives that would torture them are present in so-called paradise on the day they arrived.  That's too coincidental.  Plus, it was never going to survive Eleanor knowing to contact Chidi anyway. 

I agree. Their mistake is making it too obvious that things are not all great in the Good Place. They really needed to start off slowly and then have bad things creep in. Suddenly that perfect soul mate eats with her mouth open or hogs the covers or has a really specific fetish. People keep misunderstanding things you say and getting offended. That type of thing. It was really entertaining, however, to watch as an audience member in the know. 

11 hours ago, loki567 said:

That's crazy. I loved the first season of Joe Schmo and that was primarily for Matt who in my opinion, was a funnier and more engaging character than any of the improv comics around him. I can't even imagine how much that situation must have fucked with his head though.

 

I agree. He came across as a lovely person. 

6 hours ago, Chaos Theory said:

I am liking the demons.  They seem more like corporate drones and Michale seems like that executive who wants to shake things up but only makes things more difficult for the drones who just want to go into work and do their job.  "This job is weird.   It's all talk and no twisting." 

I am so in for a demon corporate retreat. 

4 hours ago, Linny said:

Hawaii 5-Dough serving everyone Hawaiian pizza was some kind of perfect, because there's nothing more befitting the Bad Place than pineapple on pizza. 

Loved Chidi's aside about his dilemma building an ice cream sundae. The actor completely nails Chidi's neuroticism but still makes him likeable. 

The only thing more evil than pineapple on a pizza is an oatmeal raisin cookie. Chidi is not wrong about the ice cream sundae bar. You gotta commit early or you end up with a mess.

 

Holy shirtballs it is good to have this show back. I loved the set-up and the quick disintegration of Michael's plan. It was really fun to get to see behind the scenes, so to speak. I don't know where we are headed next, but I am fully on board.

[chitowngirl]

2 hours ago, Notwisconsin said:

I could see the Fab Four becoming the Scooby Squad and help Sean against Michael. or have them find out in three or four episodes that  this was not try three but was 134, and having them rebel in some other fashion. Counter-punking, if you will.

Either way, or a totally new thing that we haven't figured out yet, I'm in 'til the end! And hopefully, there will be and end and not a sudden cancellation or it sputters and whimpers to the finish line.

[thuganomics85]

The Good Place is back!  Naturally, the special premiere had to be when I was at work, but I'm glad its normal spot it Thursdays, when I will be able to watch it live.

Anyway, pretty fun start.  I loved how each segment focused on the main four being "welcomed to the Good Place", and everything that led to their moments at the party and interactions.  And then the final segment follows the real Michael and how he tried to implement his failed attempt at a diabolical plan to recreate what happened last season.  Glad that it already has been exposed, but I'm curious to see how version 3.0. will fare and what changes could be made.  Even without the note, will Eleanor still be able to assess that something is wrong?  Or will one of the other three figure it out?  Curious to see how it all goes down.

It really is hard to single out someone here, because I honestly think the entire main cast is perfect.  Every single one of them had great moments and moments to shine, and just work spectacular together.  But if I was forced to, I think my favorite moments what Chidi's awkward double date to find out who is his "true soulmate", all of Eleanor and Chidi's interactions, and Tahani's drunken speech.  But I can't wait to see more of them in the upcoming episodes and hopefully get more flashbacks (really want to know how Tahani died.)

Janet continues to be the best.  And I love that Jason is already falling for her again.  Yeah, I'm rooting for those two!  Speaking of which, Eleanor did seem attracted to Chidi even if expressed it in her normal, Eleanor-ish way, but she once again made another remark about how hot Tahani is.

Glad that Vicky a.k.a. "Real Eleanor" will continue to play a part, although I'm actually wondering if Michael ignoring her and her complaints is really going to come back to bite him.

So, Shawn really is Michael's boss and wasn't just a part?  And it sounds like if Michael doesn't pull this off, he really will be "retired" this time.  It will be interesting to see Michael with his back against the wall.

Can't wait till next Thursday!

[OtterMommy]

4 hours ago, morgan said:

No!  Classic mistake so many American tv shows fall into.  And one of my favorite throw away lines from season one when Tahani talks about her favorite long running British shows....she had seen all 30 episodes!  The Brits are so smart and know when to pull the plug.

I cannot agree with this more.  No show should go on indefinitely, no matter how good it is!  I would much rather see a show have a short, but complete, run and go out on a high note than sit around, watching season 13 of a show that has lost it's way and realizing that the only thing keeping you tuned in is habit.

But, back to this show...what a fun episode!  I binged the first season a few months ago (I already knew that the Good Place was actually the Bad Place) and I was a little apprehensive that season 2 would just be a reset of season one...and I'm glad to see that wasn't the case.  I'm actually more interested now to see where this season is going than I was before seeing the premiere.  

I also really liked that the show is less Eleanor-centric now--not that I have anything against Kristen Bell (I actually quite adore her), but I think the show is better now that it has expanded its scope a bit.  And I think making the once "real" Eleanor, now pizza making Denise a more integral part of the show is a smart move.  It's no longer Michael vs. the humans, but Michael having to deal with the humans on one side and a potential mutiny on the other.

[possibilities]

Thanks for the reactions to my comments about incompetent demons-- initially I had thought it was a comment on stupid and evil overlapping, but I love the idea that they're just out of their comfort zones. Also pondering the suggestion that they're plants by Sean to torture Michael.

Also, re Tahani, maybe another reason she's acting more rude is that she's actually becoming more authentic and less obsessed with her image. In a way, she was being real, even if the real of her isn't actually very likable. For someone like her, it might be a weird sort of awkward progress for her to drop the facade and let people know who she really is, even if it was stimulated by being deliberately tormented.

This show is funny, but it's also really thoughtfully put together. I don't think much of it's an accident.

[Charlesman]

5 hours ago, morgan said:

No!  Classic mistake so many American tv shows fall into.  And one of my favorite throw away lines from season one when Tahani talks about her favorite long running British shows....she had seen all 30 episodes!  The Brits are so smart and know when to pull the plug.

And the clincher on that gag: that it ran for 16 years and they did 30 episodes. So devastatingly accurate.

[ThoughtAFool]

3 hours ago, The Companion said:

I am so in for a demon corporate retreat. 

Expect the most painfully awkward team-building exercises ever!

[tennisgurl]

I love that even when her memory has been erased, Eleanor seems to be kind of into both Tahani and Chidi, with her calling Tahani gorgeous when she was announcing that she has figured out what Michael was up to, AND admitting that Chidis "pick up line" about books was kind of working!

Maybe they're a real life triple soul mate match! 

[possibilities]

There's a lot of world building going on in the background, so if they seriously wanted to keep going, I could see more seasons. If, for example, they "graduate" from this place to another level somewhere, and that introduces a whole other kind of challenge. I don't particularly think this will happen, but I am open minded to see if they have any stories up their sleeves that don't mean repeating themselves and being stagnant. They haven't disappointed me yet, so I'm not going to worry about the end game at this juncture. There are probably an endless number of types of neighborhoods and rewards/punishments/missions/developmental challenges they could throw at a crop of characters, including newcomers and shifting roles of various kinds. They could do a season from the point of view of the demons, and show how they became who they are. They could show any number of configurations of good/bad/ambiguous entities.

Edited September 21, 2017 by possibilities

[eXiled]

2 hours ago, OtterMommy said:

I cannot agree with this more.  No show should go on indefinitely, no matter how good it is!  I would much rather see a show have a short, but complete, run and go out on a high note than sit around, watching season 13 of a show that has lost it's way and realizing that the only thing keeping you tuned in is habit.

But, back to this show...what a fun episode!  I binged the first season a few months ago (I already knew that the Good Place was actually the Bad Place) and I was a little apprehensive that season 2 would just be a reset of season one...and I'm glad to see that wasn't the case.  I'm actually more interested now to see where this season is going than I was before seeing the premiere.  

I also really liked that the show is less Eleanor-centric now--not that I have anything against Kristen Bell (I actually quite adore her), but I think the show is better now that it has expanded its scope a bit.  And I think making the once "real" Eleanor, now pizza making Denise a more integral part of the show is a smart move.  It's no longer Michael vs. the humans, but Michael having to deal with the humans on one side and a potential mutiny on the other.

Sam and Dean Winchester do not agree with you.

This show is so smart and is so great at surprising me that I hope it goes out on a high. If that means only four seasons, so be it. That's enough episodes for syndication. Hell, I know of shows that barely lasted a season and years later have a rabid fan base. If this show keeps running on all cylinders, it will be a classic.

Oh, and I'm really starting to ship Eleanor/Tahani. Improbable, sure. But Eleanor seems to have developed a love/hate thing for the vapid Barbie doll. My favorite relationships are ALWAYS the improbable ones.

[Chaos Theory]

1 hour ago, nosleepforme said:

 

I mean, the explanation with the incompetent demons works for this season, but they were all perfectly fine and believable last season when we didn't know about the big twist, so I feel like they're actually making the writing appear much weaker by having them be so incompetent all of the sudden (even though it makes for some great jokes, I particularly laughed at Denise and at the gym guy.)

 

If by the Gym Guy you mean Eleanor's new "Soul Mate" he has a bigger part now that might be to complicated for him.  This is a guy who likes his simple job of twisting people.  I don't think the writing is weaker.  I think it has the potential to be stronger because we are dealing with some of the demons just don't want to be doing Michael's grand new scheme and watching them back stab each other to get bigger (like the former real Eleanor) or smaller parts.    

I mentioned something before of this feeling to me like a corporate setting where everyone got use to doing something in a certain way and might even like their jobs then a new guy with bold new schemes shows up that does nothing but makes everyones life more complicated.  Gym guy seems like a guy who doesn't particularly want a complicated job like being Eleanor's fake soul mate.  

[KHenry14]

I've said it before, this is one of the most original ideas for a TV show that I can remember.  With that said, with the storyline such as it is, I don't see a 7 year run for this show. Probably 4 season tops.

 

But i think I'll enjoy it however long it lasts       ;)

[Mabinogia]

9 hours ago, Linny said:

Hawaii 5-Dough serving everyone Hawaiian pizza was some kind of perfect, because there's nothing more befitting the Bad Place than pineapple on pizza. 

I loved Chidi asking what could possibly be on the Bad Place pizza of the good place has only Hawaiian (which is NOT real pizza. Sorry. I'm a pizza snob). but I do love the name of the shops in the Good Place. I have to rewatch just to look at all the names of things. 

As I was watching I kept thinking "how are they going to make a season out of this with everything escalating so quickly" and even thinking that I did NOT see Eleanor figuring it out happening so good on you show! 

I loved seeing the same day played out through each of their storylines. 

I know he's a demon, and his whole goal seems to be finding better ways to torture humans, but I can't help but root for Michael. He just wants his experiment to work so badly that I almost want it to work for him. 

Not only do I love the humor on this show, it is just wonderfully absurd, but I love that I have absolutely no idea what is going to happen next. Is attempt 3 going to fail? Who are going to be the soulmates this time? What half assed food will be featured next. First fro-yo, then Hawaiian pizza. What's next? 

This episode (pair of episodes) did not disappoint. I am so happy the Good Place is back!

[chaifan]

5 hours ago, The Companion said:

The only thing more evil than pineapple on a pizza is an oatmeal raisin cookie. Chidi is not wrong about the ice cream sundae bar. You gotta commit early or you end up with a mess.

Companion, I'm sorry but you are not my soulmate.  Not only do I actually like pineapple on a pizza (but not ham, it has to be pepperoni and pineapple), but I just love a chewy oatmeal raisin cookie.  I'm glad we found this out now.

1 hour ago, nosleepforme said:

I mean, the explanation with the incompetent demons works for this season, but they were all perfectly fine and believable last season when we didn't know about the big twist, so I feel like they're actually making the writing appear much weaker by having them be so incompetent all of the sudden (even though it makes for some great jokes, I particularly laughed at Denise and at the gym guy.)

I agree, Nosleepforme.  I rewatched the first season hoping to find some sign that everyone was in on it - people breaking character in the background, someone running into a scene late, etc.  Stuff we wouldn't have noticed on first watch, but now in context makes sense.  But nope, nothing like that.  If you think back to how all the demon extras handled the restaurant sink hole or the flying day or the giant flying shrimp fiasco, they were all perfect.  Now they're bumbling, verging on screwing things up at every turn.  That is the only thing that bugs about the premiere.  But, I can get past that, and otherwise I love this show!

[CherithCutestory]

Quote

I mean, the explanation with the incompetent demons works for this season, but they were all perfectly fine and believable last season when we didn't know about the big twist, so I feel like they're actually making the writing appear much weaker by having them be so incompetent all of the sudden (even though it makes for some great jokes, I particularly laughed at Denise and at the gym guy.)

But last season they barely had to interact with the main four. The exceptions were the swinging couple, who nailed it again this season, and Vicky, who will be the first to tell you she is an excellent capital A Actor.

The rest of them only interacted with them for short periods of time and seldom one on one. Most of them were just in the background. Last season the whole point was that the four were supposed to torture each other. The demons were just there to setup little scenarios for them to do so. This season the demons have to pick up the heavy lifting (but not biting). And they are out of their depth.

Also, a lot of them were great. Chidi's two soulmates were good at their parts. I think I fell in love with Angelique a little bit, myself. And Glen was great/horrible as always.

Quote

Glad that Vicky a.k.a. "Real Eleanor" will continue to play a part, although I'm actually wondering if Michael ignoring her and her complaints is really going to come back to bite him.

Definitely! He's made a huge mistake by not giving in and giving her a better "role". She'll be gunning for him now. And that he didn't tell Shawn isn't too hard to figure out. Fake Eleanor is a lot like Real Eleanor.

Also, her being annoyed that she doesn't get to torture Chidi was the best.

Quote

he yogurt/yurt also fit this theme, but Tahani's house did not. She believed she should be there (she clearly wasn't confused for someone else), so it didn't make sense that she would be put into the house she got.  It was a huge tell for the characters that the Good Place wasn't all that good.  

Yes, absolutely. And the picture of her sister was way too much. I do understand what Michael is going for, that she's too phony to ever admit she hates her sister and that house. But this is paradise and she's miserable. She's not an idiot. She knows that's off. Similarly, Jason, who is an idiot, had incentive to keep quiet much of last season. Tahani may have annoyed him but she is still crazy hot. And he had his budhole to blow off steam. Why would this Jason stay in that yurt more than a day?

Michael is being way too over-confident that it was the note that unraveled everything.

Tahani didn't know anything about the note. She unraveled all on her own within a day. Jason didn't know anything about the note. And he started talking.

And some of the stuff Eleanor figured out was nothing to do with the note. She knew people were trying to get her drunk. And Eleanor being Eleanor she won't do anything if she thinks someone wants her to do it. She knew her soulmate was off. She automatically felt a connection to Jason.

Even after she figured it out twice Michael is still greatly underestimating Eleanor here. 

Also, I don't think he reset Janet again. She brought Jason to Eleanor not because of any note.

Edited September 22, 2017 by CherithCutestory

[chaifan]

I think the great twist reveal at the end of Season 2 would be to find out that Tahani is really Sean's boss.  This is why we still don't know why she died.  She's pulling an "undercover boss" on Sean and Michael and the rest of the demon underlings. 

OK, I realize that (probably) isn't going to happen, but it did cross my mind...

[Kel Varnsen]

Fun episode, although there is one thing I don't really get; why does Elenor figuring out it's The Bad Place automatically lead to a reset? Even if she knows, living with those people in that situation would still be torture. And it doesn't seem like she would be able to find a secret way to get from The Bad Place to The Good Place.

 

8 hours ago, morgan said:

No!  Classic mistake so many American tv shows fall into.  And one of my favorite throw away lines from season one when Tahani talks about her favorite long running British shows....she had seen all 30 episodes!  The Brits are so smart and know when to pull the plug.

Of course British TV has the benefit of being able to fill any spaces in their schedule with American shows, with 1000's of gnome different shows to choose from.

[Mabinogia]

1 hour ago, CherithCutestory said:

Also, I don't think he reset Janet again. She brought Jason to Eleanor not because of any note.

I totally forgot about her bringing Jason to Eleanor, telling them they have something to discuss, alone. That could only be one thing. So yeah, Janet knows what is going on. Maybe she will get Eleanor to the truth this time around, since clearly the note is gone. 

Michael does underestimate Eleanor, and I think humans in general. He laid it all on way too thick this time around. I like that he is trying to work out the right balance. First try, putting them together to torture each other didn't work. Second try, using the demons and the set up to torture them didn't work. I wonder if he will have them as soulmates again, but switch them around. If Jason and Eleanor are together there is no one to teach them ethics and make them better people. If Tahani and Chidi are together they won't necessarily befriend Eleanor and Jason. Who knows. I can't wait to see what's next. 

If Michael really wants to torture them, play them this show but make them wait a whole week for the next episode. I can attest to how torturous the wait truly is. 

Edited September 22, 2017 by Mabinogia

[SomeTameGazelle]

This was a fun episode. I found the reset at the end invigorating since it raised the stakes for Michael as well as for Eleanor. They could have made it harder for Eleanor to find Chidi even with the note and prolonged things that way, but this way we got a taste of everyone and can now take a few more twists and turns.

2 hours ago, possibilities said:

There's a lot of world building going on in the background, so if they seriously wanted to keep going, I could see more seasons. If, for example, they "graduate" from this place to another level somewhere, and that introduces a whole other kind of challenge.

I like the concept of the show as a video game -- as long as the resets don't happen every episode. Maybe a reset (or leveling up) is a necessity at the end of every season though.

23 hours ago, Fukui San said:

The second season [of The Joe Schmo Show] (Dating competition show) had two marks, and one figured it out midway through.

I loved Ingrid. And the bafflement and frustration of the production staff who couldn't comprehend the amount of thinking she was capable of doing just as a matter of course. Michael has more on the line though.

[SmithW6079]

7 hours ago, The Companion said:

This gag did not get old for me. I loved when he did it at the end. 

I loved the references to torture, does that mean I am headed to the Bad Place? No thanks on the butthole spiders, though.

The only thing more evil than pineapple on a pizza is an oatmeal raisin cookie. 

Gym guy was gorgeous. Dim, but hot.

I, too, liked all the different tortures they casually dropped in there, like Jason's "soulmate" whose job is lighting people on fire. And those butthole spiders are "enormous."

ITA -- pineapple pizza is an abomination against humanity, second only to oatmeal raisin cookies.

[MrWhyt]

2 hours ago, chaifan said:

Not only do I actually like pineapple on a pizza (but not ham, it has to be pepperoni and pineapple), but I just love a chewy oatmeal raisin cookie.

Marry me?

[Mojeaux]

BUTTHOLE SPIDERS!!!!

*whew*

What a fabulous ride. I am so glad this show’s back. I like bizarre shows, and this is the only comedy I watch.

[jumper sage]

Wait a minute!  Was it one hour long show, 2 hour long shows or 2 1/2 hour shows?  I watched 1 hour.  Did I miss something?

Edited September 22, 2017 by jumper sage

[Zanne]

3 hours ago, chaifan said:

Not only do I actually like pineapple on a pizza (but not ham, it has to be pepperoni and pineapple), but I just love a chewy oatmeal raisin cookie.  I'm glad we found this out now.

Pepperoni, pineapple, and mushroom pizza!

[calliope1975]

3 hours ago, Chaos Theory said:

I mentioned something before of this feeling to me like a corporate setting where everyone got use to doing something in a certain way and might even like their jobs then a new guy with bold new schemes shows up that does nothing but makes everyones life more complicated.  Gym guy seems like a guy who doesn't particularly want a complicated job like being Eleanor's fake soul mate.  

That's also what it seemed like to me. The first time was novel for them and kinda fun to watch the humans squirm. But it didn't work, and now their boss wants them to do it again. I get why the enthusiasm and commitment has dropped. Gym guy just wants to twist people! Not any of this acting and subterfuge. 

[Amarsir]

This show is back and people here are talking about Joe Schmo? Am I in the Good Place?

22 hours ago, MarquisDeCarabas said:

Michael pushed way too hard on tehani and Jason.  Jason wouldn't have been able to hold up the deception 24/7, and tehani wasn't taken down a peg she was shoved off the ladder. The giant picture of her sister was good, but the rest was too much for her to handle

It was a weird choice given that the explicit purpose of a reset was to stretch the experience out longer. I really like the Michael / Mike Schur parallel now if we think of Michael as a studio head creating a sequel. He's ramping up stuff that doesn't need to be juiced and as a result not capturing the original magic.

3 hours ago, Chaos Theory said:

I mentioned something before of this feeling to me like a corporate setting where everyone got use to doing something in a certain way and might even like their jobs then a new guy with bold new schemes shows up that does nothing but makes everyones life more complicated.  Gym guy seems like a guy who doesn't particularly want a complicated job like being Eleanor's fake soul mate.  

It's worth remembering that Michael's pitch for all of this was "The afterlife can be more fun ... for us." His scenario is turning out not to be fun for them. Which means he could plausibly fail even without the 4 humans figuring it out. That could add a lot of drama to the show even the torture is working properly and thus there isn't much new Eleanor development.

18 minutes ago, jumper sage said:

Wait a minute!  Was it one hour long show, 2 hour long shows or 2 1/2 hour shows?  I watched 1 hour.  Did I miss something?

The standard show is a half hour. This was a double length full hour. (I'm not sure where exactly the cut would be if it was split.)

[possibilities]

Butthole spiders! I'm so glad you all have better hearing than I do. I thought they said "butthole spreaders"-- which might actually be worse.

[arc]

5 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Fun episode, although there is one thing I don't really get; why does Elenor figuring out it's The Bad Place automatically lead to a reset? Even if she knows, living with those people in that situation would still be torture. And it doesn't seem like she would be able to find a secret way to get from The Bad Place to The Good Place.

Well, the design was to have them torture each other, which would only work long-term if they didn't know they were doing it. Like Shawn said in the s1 finale, it was very hard to get humans to even pull each others' teeth. I guess naturally they would aggravate each other, but if they knew they were in the Bad Place, and they knew the plan was for them to torture each other, then they might try to hold back their worst selves.

Also, what's to stop all four humans plus Janet from taking the train to at least the Medium Place? I guess by the rules, the Bad Place probably has some claim on the four, but it's not clear whether or not they could extradite from the Medium Place...

 

18 hours ago, Milburn Stone said:

The way you phrased that made me realize something for the first time. Michael isn't just the name of Ted Danson's character; it's the name of the show runner. Who also is working constantly to orchestrate the movements of all the characters. Michael (Ted Danson) views all the inhabitants of The Good Place (the place) as pieces to move around the chessboard; while Michael (Schur) views all the inhabitants of The Good Place (the show) as pieces to move around the chessboard. Coincidence? I think not.

The name was coincidence, though Schur acknowledges there may have been something subconscious going on. Michael was named for the archangel Michael, because Schur saw some art at Notre Dame cathedral. Potential mild spoilers for s2: http://www.vulture.com/2017/09/the-good-place-michael-schur-season-2-premiere-interview.html

[millahnna]

The demons not being great at the gig this time around works for me on multiple levels; they're getting sick of Michael's creative interpretations of The Bad Place and want their old jobs back.  His second (and third) attempts at his vision are more desperately thrown together than the first; it's not as polished.

 

Which reminds me... I keep thinking about the fact that Michael has a creative idea for this stuff at all and how his affection for human things (or at least interest in) seems genuine.  I wonder if much like the four humans he's supposed to be torturing, Michael isn't capable of ethical growth.  It seems like one of the possible long term plot points could be him realizing he could be a better being legitimately just like Eleanor et al. 

[AllyB]

10 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

What half assed food will be featured next. First fro-yo, then Hawaiian pizza. What's next? 

Michael told Sean that he'd replaced all the proper coffee with pod coffee.

[Mabinogia]

42 minutes ago, AllyB said:

Michael told Sean that he'd replaced all the proper coffee with pod coffee.

I love how fairly mundane the tortures are. Hawaiian pizza, froyo, pod coffee. Why bring out the fire and brimstone when you can slowly chip away at a man's soul by ruining the things he loves. It is truly diabolical. Michael is an evil genius. 

I actually love that Michael is really this middle management guy to change the system. And he's getting push back from the higher ups, but also the corporate drones who like things the way they are because that's the way they've always been. OMG, it's like my office! YIKES! It's just such a wonderfully everyday look at how the afterlife works. 

[tiramisue]

19 hours ago, morgan said:

20 hours ago, cpcathy said:

Really enjoyed this episode! If I were the head of NBC, I would call Mike Schur and tell him to keep going as long as he wanted to.

 

No!  Classic mistake so many American tv shows fall into.  And one of my favorite throw away lines from season one when Tahani talks about her favorite long running British shows....she had seen all 30 episodes!  The Brits are so smart and know when to pull the plug.

I actually agree, with the first quote.

BUT, in the way that Michael Shur should have complete control over the length of the show. He should stop it when it's over without the network saying "but it has viewers, keep going!!" and he should be able to make it without the threat of cancellation. Shows that end on their own terms are just better than those, that stop suddenly or go on for too long. The arc often feels more natural and it has more of a resolution because it doesn't have to leave a door open for another season.

Since he already said he only wanted 13 episodes for S1 and not more, I'd trust him to know when to end it.

Edited September 22, 2017 by tiramisue
formatting of nested quotes...

[Milburn Stone]

6 hours ago, arc said:

The name was coincidence, though Schur acknowledges there may have been something subconscious going on.

Not to be argumentative, but Schur acknowledging the possibility of a subconscious link between the name of The Good Place's "show runner" (the Danson character) and the name of The Good Place's show runner (Schur) is exactly the evidence that supports it not being a coincidence.

Edited September 22, 2017 by Milburn Stone

[Blakeston]

13 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Fun episode, although there is one thing I don't really get; why does Elenor figuring out it's The Bad Place automatically lead to a reset? Even if she knows, living with those people in that situation would still be torture.

A big part of the torture for them is not being able to be themselves, and living with their secrets. Eleanor was miserable pretending to be a goody two-shoes, and Jason was miserable having to be silent. If they don't have to pretend anymore, it won't be nearly as torturous. (Plus they're torturing Chidi by making him feel guilty about his soulmate decision, which won't work as well if he knows it was all a ruse.)

As for the demons seeming more incompetent than before - I think that's just because we didn't get to see their behind-the-scenes interactions with Michael last season. They were probably struggling with the lack of twisting and biting just as much back then.

Edited September 22, 2017 by Blakeston

[morgan]

How many episodes is season 2?

[KHenry14]

Just now, morgan said:

How many episodes is season 2?

I'm pretty sure its 13

Edited September 22, 2017 by KHenry14

[iMonrey]

I didn't realize how much I missed this show. It's just so clever and original. I'm glad they showed these two episodes in a one hour block. I'm assuming they were meant to be shown that way because there was no obvious break between them. The resets from all the different perspectives made it easy to catch up on where everyone was, and that was such an interesting way of doing it. Like how we saw Eleanor giving those shots away at the party and didn't realize she was giving them to Tahani until the third iteration of that story. 

I guess ordinarily I'd be a little concerned about the sustainability of a show like this, but the people writing and producing it have done such an excellent job so far I'm just going to give them the benefit of the doubt. Can't wait to see where this season goes.

[possibilities]

Hawaiian pizza, pod coffee and froyo seem like Medium Place features to me. It's hilarious and wonderful that the show is basically saying that annoyance and mediocrity and having to fake being good is a worse fate than total deprivation, "butt spiders" and other physical torments.

[sacrebleu]

Quote

Michael's idea sounds good in theory that I'm sure the demons were excited by it at first but now it seems like a lot of work. 

maybe what they don't know is that they are the worst at what they do-- which is why they get stuck on the project with Michael-- who apparently not a favorite of upper management.  (This might be torture for all of them-- if all the complaining about their current gigs is any indication)

I'm hoping that at some point- the set-up for our heroes is to be told they are in the MEDIUM place and will be judged on their behavior to determine if they are sent to the good place or the bad place. (p.s. only one of the four will be picked for the good place)

Eleanor: torn between what she wants to do and eternal torture

Chidi: racked with indecision over what the best thing to do is -- in any given circumstance

Jason: just clueless about how to behave

Tahini: only does good if it reflects well on her

 

I'm sure Michael could get alot of mileage out of putting these people in direct competition- putting them at odds might make it more difficult for them to figure out Michael's plot.

[Delphi]

3 hours ago, sacrebleu said:

maybe what they don't know is that they are the worst at what they do-- which is why they get stuck on the project with Michael-- who apparently not a favorite of upper management.  (This might be torture for all of them-- if all the complaining about their current gigs is any indication)

I'm hoping that at some point- the set-up for our heroes is to be told they are in the MEDIUM place and will be judged on their behavior to determine if they are sent to the good place or the bad place. 

I was thinking that they might eventually make the neighborhood a medium place,  or perhaps despite the antics and stuff it will end up with them being groomed for the Good Place or eventually improve themselves enough that by the end of the series the neighborhood is transformed into a Good Place. 

[Kel Varnsen]

9 hours ago, Milburn Stone said:

Not to be argumentative, but Schur acknowledging the possibility of a subconscious link between the name of The Good Place's "show runner" (the Danson character) and the name of The Good Place's show runner (Schur) is exactly the evidence that supports it not being a coincidence.

There is also of couse Michael Scott (who Schur wrote a lot of stories about) who was also good at his original job (paper salesman) but ridiculously incompetent when promoted to regional manager.

7 hours ago, Blakeston said:

A big part of the torture for them is not being able to be themselves, and living with their secrets. Eleanor was miserable pretending to be a goody two-shoes, and Jason was miserable having to be silent. If they don't have to pretend anymore, it won't be nearly as torturous. (Plus they're torturing Chidi by making him feel guilty about his soulmate decision, which won't work as well if he knows it was all a ruse.)

I get that, but even knowing it is the Bad Place, an eternity with people, demons and things that annoy you would still be torture. 

[DEM]

• CHIDI (to Michael): My soulmate will be books.

Later...

• CHIDI (to Eleanor): I know that book. ... I've never seen you before... but I think, somehow, that we know each other.

Very clever! I am so happy this show is back.

[theatremouse]

On 9/21/2017 at 5:38 PM, CherithCutestory said:

Also, I don't think he reset Janet again. She brought Jason to Eleanor not because of any note.

My immediate reaction to her bringing Jason to Eleanor was two things:

1) He said he was lonely. Janet knows everything. So Janet knows Eleanor's "soulmate" keeps running off to the gym. So she decided to bring Jason to her because she was also alone.

2) Janet knows everything and knows they're not who they say they are, and thus brought them together so they could "be themselves" together.

[Kromm]

Brilliant. That was even better than I'd hoped it would be.

The moment I realized they had the guts to scuttle Good Place 2.0 within the scope of one episode and make that the plot I knew we'd be getting something both true to last season's spirit, but also wildly different. If they'd just done a slow burn thing it would have been lame. But proving how clever our characters are (well two of them) gave us an immediate hook back into cheering for them. Similarly, we got to see Tahani being genuine instead of fake fairly quickly (when she apologized to Eleanor and came off as very vulnerable). I think that was necessary to keep us invested in liking her character, since her initial character was so unlikable and it was only later last season that she showed her lovable side. Jason, of course, is just there to be an absurd joke. That hasn't changed.

All that said, Danson was the MVP, because he got to play his role so differently than last time.

By the end of last season I'd fallen a bit from loving the show to merely liking it a lot. I had guessed pretty much everything which happened in the finale long before, so while I loved the concept, and it was still damn funny and reasonably clever, I fell short of loving it. But this episode? I loved it. I didn't expect ANY of what we saw, and that really engaged my attention and demanded my respect.