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Season 2 Discussion


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23 hours ago, mansonlamps said:

I don't think he seems very hands on.   In fact it has irritated me in several episodes because Bow seems to have the more demanding job and still appears to do most of the home stuff.

Compared to Bow, yes she's more hands on than Dre. I was comparing Dre to his Dad. We've seen in flashbacks how Dre parents were to him. Dre grew up poor and he wanted better things and a better relationship with his kids than what he had with his parents especially with Pops. In past episodes we've seen that with Dre and his kids. So him claiming to miss out on his kids seemed odd. 

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You know what would be brave territory for a show that likes to push boundaries... Dealing with a miscarriage and the effect that it has on a family unit with kids who are old enough to be well aware of everything. Taking us through the typical aspects of them preparing for this change and then dealing with the after effects and coping would be right up there with the Police Violence episode in my opinion.

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I just need to share this with y'all because I know (most of?) you like Jenifer Lewis as much as I do. 

I was home sick yesterday so caught up on a lot of TV. I am apprehensive about the baby, I won't lie. The episode had a lot of funny moments, but the addition of a new cuter kid has ruined a lot of shows (looking at you, Raven-Symone), and I don't really think the show needs that. I also thought it was a bit unrealistic that there was no "HOLY SHIT" moment, because I think a couple in their 40s with 4 kids, one of whom is two years from leaving home, would be a lot more panicked about starting over.

But all the flu stuff was great. "I don't like youuuuuuu!"

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On 5/13/2016 at 10:08 PM, peeayebee said:

I didn't pick up at all on Bow's nausea being due to pregnancy. Usually I do. Anyway, with this show I'm not worried about the pregnancy/new baby ruining things.

I didn't catch on until Ruby said she hadn't thrown up in 36 hours...then I was like, uh-oh!

19 hours ago, Traveller519 said:

You know what would be brave territory for a show that likes to push boundaries... Dealing with a miscarriage and the effect that it has on a family unit with kids who are old enough to be well aware of everything. Taking us through the typical aspects of them preparing for this change and then dealing with the after effects and coping would be right up there with the Police Violence episode in my opinion.

This would be really, really interesting.

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My ability to predict what is going to happen on a show, while I watch the show, not very good.  However, I have found that the ads for the show often spoil the outcomes.  DVRs are a blessing.  Unfortunately, I saw an ad for Black-ish where the announcer said that there was going to be a big surprise and Bow and Dre were sitting on the couch (I don't remember if it also mentioned the family being sick, I woudl assume it did since that was the bulk of the episode) - I immediately thought "Oh crap! Bow's pregnant? They can't be going there."  Then as I watched and the characters were throwing up, I thought "Oh crap! Bow's pregnant. They are going there."  Then Bow shows Dre the pee stick and I thought "Oh crap!"

I hope they can make this work.

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This reminds me of the episode where she saved some guys life in her kitchen, and no one, not even Dre, gave her props for being as awesome as she is. 

That was during the episode  "The Real World", the one with Bow giving the party  with her "friends" and Dre gets upset that Bow had so many previous boyfriends/hook-ups.  Bow can't even win for losing.

I agree with your assessment of Ruby being the root of this episode's problem.

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On 5/13/2016 at 8:35 PM, kylies-lips said:

This is not the move a pretty popular show does in its second season. We all know the baby storyline is trotted out when a show is on its last leg and they want to up the cute factor.

 

That was my thought too.  It's a little early for the baby story line.  The twins are still cute (and cute is Jack's specialty).  It'll be interesting to see what they do with the baby thing.  

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On ‎5‎/‎14‎/‎2016 at 0:28 AM, Traveller519 said:

You know what would be brave territory for a show that likes to push boundaries... Dealing with a miscarriage and the effect that it has on a family unit with kids who are old enough to be well aware of everything. Taking us through the typical aspects of them preparing for this change and then dealing with the after effects and coping would be right up there with the Police Violence episode in my opinion.

This is what I thought too until I read that the show's creator & his wife are due with the 6th kid. I think that would be a little close to home.

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(edited)

I am SO  EXCITED. I loved Good Times as a kid and it was only as an adult that I really grasped the complexity & not-so Good Times they were having & that the theme song told of. :(

ETA: Season finale?  booooo

Edited by DrSparkles
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When has a sitcom ever improved with the addition of a baby?

Maybe it's going to be part of a bigger story arc.

Dre's job woes haven't been too compelling because because the family could live comfortably if not lavishly on either parent's earnings, but suppose Bow can't work? She has to keep running out to vomit, she'll have more and more trouble staying on her feet, and she may well have to go on bed rest -- so much can go wrong at her age. If Dre lost his job or had to take a big salary cut, they'd have to face the fact that their drunken-sailor spending had landed them in a hole.

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Who is dressing Laurence Fishburne? That purple monstrosity Pops wore was hideous.

What about that weirdness Bow was wearing? Looked like someone's first attempt at sewing. Diane's wig in the first scene was atrocious. Ruby's was, too. 

I haven't seen this show in a while. My only chuckle was when they were hoping the murderer wasn't black. Otherwise, a lousy episode. I wish the TV season for all shows was down to only 12 episodes. Material would be less stale and sophomoric. 

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It was good, but I feel that I would have  gotten more if I actually knew more about  the show. As it is I know next to nothing about Good Times so apart from Florida, James and JJ I was in the dark as to who everyone was supposed to be and how faithful it was to the show.

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Good Times was long before the internet made it possible to watch any American show within minutes after it finishes airing in America and I don't think it ever aired here in The Netherlands. I'd heard of the show's name, but other than that I'm completely unfamiliar with it. That made this one of my least favorite episodes of the show. But I liked Charlie at the beginning when he thought he was being fired.

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1 hour ago, Ina123 said:

I would have liked to hear Junior's "dy-no-mite".

Haha, I on the other hand was ecstatic that they didn't do that.  I hated it even as a kid.  I do remember the first time I realized that TV stars weren't all wealthy for life and living like royalty was when I went to a restaurant/bar near my house after Good Times run was over and JJ Walker was the comedy headliner that night.  In my regular little town.  It was an aha moment for me.

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It was funny, I really enjoyed it.

But I wish they hadn't done a gimmick episode right after the pregnancy reveal. This show is too good and too smart to keep doing tricks that distract from that.

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When Bow asked Dre if she was too old to be pregnant (when they were in the sofa), I thought that was the actress asking an Executive Producer about the validity of this storyline...  

I'm not sure exactly how old Bow is supposed to be, but Tracee Ellis Ross is 43 and Anthony Anderson is 45. If I recall correctly, Bow got pregnant with Zoey when she was in med school, so Bow's age is probably pretty close to Tracee's age. Lots of women have children in the 40s (I know several women in real life who had babies when they were over 40 without any problems) so my issue was less about Bow's age and more about the fact that their oldest is going to college in a year and they're about to have another kid. It's a huge commitment to know you are going to do this all over again for the next 18 years. When you add to that the fact that Dre and Bow recently discussed that they spend more money than they should and need to get their finances in order, adding the expense of another kid seems like it's not the greatest idea. It's not that they can't afford it, but everyone in the family will need to make some adjustments to the way they've been living if they're going to have another kid.

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4 hours ago, Ina123 said:

I would have liked to hear Junior's "dy-no-mite".

That's weird -- I saw him saying that in a promo for the show. 

 

2 hours ago, Tiger said:

I loved Ruby dissing CBS.

I missed that.

I thought this was a fantastic ep. It's been a looooong time since I watched Good Times. I'm old enough to have watched it originally. I don't quite remember all the characters. Laurence Fishburne was John Amos. Jenifer Lewis was Esther Rolle. Junior was JJ. TER was Thelma. I don't quite remember the others. Ah, looking at IMDB I'm reminded that Penny was played by Janet Jackson. Here was that Zoe or Diane?

Anyway, I loved all the dated references, the clothes, the way the scenes were processed so they looked like it was shot in the 70's. The audience's laughs, applause, and groans were right on. 

All the stuff about what white people have was great, too, like dessert, or sweet night breakfast.

Marcus Scribner (Junior) was so good as JJ. Of course, he's always good. Everyone is.

Charlie's hulk moment at work was fantastic. I knew that he wasn't going to get laid off. Poor Lucy. Never appreciated.

Jack: You're welcome to some of my allowance. I mean, it's not much, but that's on YOU.

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(edited)
9 hours ago, peeayebee said:

I thought this was a fantastic ep. It's been a looooong time since I watched Good Times. I'm old enough to have watched it originally. I don't quite remember all the characters. Laurence Fishburne was John Amos. Jenifer Lewis was Esther Rolle. Junior was JJ. TER was Thelma. I don't quite remember the others. Ah, looking at IMDB I'm reminded that Penny was played by Janet Jackson. Here was that Zoe or Diane?

Anyway, I loved all the dated references, the clothes, the way the scenes were processed so they looked like it was shot in the 70's. The audience's laughs, applause, and groans were right on. 

All the stuff about what white people have was great, too, like dessert, or sweet night breakfast.

 

Marcus Scribner (Junior) was so good as JJ. Of course, he's always good. Everyone is.

Charlie's hulk moment at work was fantastic. I knew that he wasn't going to get laid off. Poor Lucy. Never appreciated.

Jack: You're welcome to some of my allowance. I mean, it's not much, but that's on YOU.

 

Shame on you! Diane was Penny, and for me, she wasn't a very good Penny, because Penny was a very sweet girl who had a crush on JJ.

Zoe was Willona, Florida's best friend and neighbor and again, for me, she didn't quite have Willona's edge. Junior and Pops were the only believable JJ and James.  Ruby's Florida was a mixture of the two, but we did get the "Damn!Damn!Damn!" even though used in a different context. Tracy could have been a bit more hostile, since JJ and Thelma had a lot of friction. And Jacjk's Michael should have been sweeter. And of course, in the original, James had been killed before Keith joined the show. ?

Loved Charlie as Bookman.

Why yes, I did watch this show, along with [All in the Family, Maude, The Jeffersons...[/i] as a child.

i was beyond THRILLED that Pops was in the finale. I love how he loves Bo, whenever he calls her "Sweetheart" and I got the feels when Dre learned Pops has a picture of Dre as a baby in his wallet.  And then snorted when Pops said:

"It came with the wallet."

But I, too, was hoping for a cameo from Walker and D'bois.

Edited by GHScorpiosRule
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I never watched Good Times (it was before my time), but I still enjoyed this. I loved all the 70s clothes and references, and everyone seemed like they were having fun changing things up a bit. 

I am just thrilled that Pops was back! I love how much he sticks up for Bow, and his picture of Dre as a baby, and his banter with Ruby. 

Also thrilled that Charlie isn't gone. Never leave us again Charlie. I am not thrilled about the baby plot (dont sitcoms only drag kids into the story after 4 seasons, when the kids are too old to be cute and the writers have become desperate?), but I will still miss this show until it comes back.  

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4 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I am so glad that Charlie didn't get fired because I thought the same thing as he was saying it: you brought him back just to fire him? HELL NO!

Hee, and I can't wait for Girl Twin to find out that Charlie is back.

Her character welcomed him back on her twitter.

DEON COLE Retweeted Marsai Martin

Thank u.......Diane

Marsai Martin @cailamarsai

Welcome back... Charles #blackish

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I guess I shouldn't be surprised at the fact that. for a lot of people, Good Times was before their time. The show did go off the air 37 years ago, after all.

I do remember when it first aired, and I have watched it in syndication ever since. And while I think Black-ish kind of strained more than a bit to make it work, I enjoyed this episode overall.

At first I was amazed Dre wasn't playing James, but then I realized, when you have an actor of Sir Laurence Fishbourne's caliber in the cast, you go with the obvious choice.

The nitpicking part of me remembered all too well that Keith and James did not appear on Good Times at the same time, James having died after 3 seasons, whereas Keith did not show up until the end of season 5. For that matter, Penny and James also never were in the cast together.

And while Jenifer Lewis is a force of nature, she wasn't going to make anyone forget Esther Rolle, not by a longshot. So I am glad her Florida was far more Ruby-ish.

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Good Times was one of my favorite shows growing up. I agree they kind of strained it trying to fit the Blackish characters into Good Times rolls, I had the hardest time with Zoe as Willona. It was odd seeing them play different family relations though, like Zoe was her Ruby's bff, Ruby was Bo's mom, Bo and Junior were brother and sister. Very odd. But I thought the stand outs were obviously Pops/James, Junior/JJ and Ruby/Florida.

I am sad Lucy got the ax. I like her.

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(edited)
18 hours ago, Ina123 said:

I would have liked to hear Junior's "dy-no-mite".

But I got my "Damn, damn, damn!"  I was hoping for a good drawn out "Jaaaymzz!" and one "Daddy, boy is a white racist word!"  Clearly I loved Good Times!

I thought it relied a little too much on past/future jokes ("He's gonna be the next OJ Simpson!") but overall I enjoyed it. Sad it's the finale though.

Edited by Deanie87
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1 hour ago, Mabinogia said:

I am sad Lucy got the ax. I like her.

 

8 hours ago, Dee said:

I hope Lucy isn't gone for good. She was a nice counterpoint for the misogyny of work scenes.

I'm kinda hoping Lucy will still be there next season because she's been documenting all the misogyny and other inappropriate shit the boss has said and HR will force him to keep her on instead of dealing with a law suit. 

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Okay, I’m going to step into this racial minefield, walk onto the lake thinly covered in ice, eggshells, etc. If anyone was objections to my post, please comment. I think this is important.

Growing up in Los Angeles in the ‘70s, I watched Good Times and Mama’s Family and The Jeffersons, Chico and the Man, Sanford & Son, and even Welcome Back, Kotter (two true stories: 1, my dad was a stagehand at ABC studios and brought home a fantastic beer stein with the Mama’s Family logo and a graphic of a brick wall on it, and 2, as a tot, I was genuinely freaked out by Juan Epstein climbing into the classroom through that window. Thug! Yikes!).

At the time, the media talked about “the ghetto,” a word not used anymore. It was understood that black and Latino people, and many whites, although “ghetto” was reserved for people of color, lived very close to the bone. It was REVOLUTIONARY to depict such lives on television. Talk of welfare, childcare, decaying municipal infrastructure—there had never been anything on TV like it before or, in sitcoms, since.

The Cosby Show changed everything, and after that you had shows depicting comfortable middle and upper-middle class (and upper-class, see: Fresh Prince of Bel-Air) blacks, and suddenly there was nothing between gritty cop shows in which a black actor was hired to, as Ice T once said to me (show-off!) “run down the street with an afro and a TV” and unicorn-and-rainbows depictions of UMC people of color. Yes, it was a good thing that there were more brown folks on the screen, but why everybody gotta be rich? I’m thinking of Benson and the late-lamented High Hopes, sort of transition shows, if you will.

For Black-ish to nod to those times is something you wouldn’t see in any other show, not even The Carmichaels, which in its way is a timid one-issue-per-episode thing. I respect both shows, because I think as a nation Americans have an obligation to not forget the past, to rake over and over the toxic soil of our history. We need to talk about racism, about ghettos, about poverty and welfare and food stamps and rats and the lack of street lights, the way the Germans need to keep dialogue about the Holocaust vibrant. (This is why I read a lot of postwar German fiction. I’m a weirdo. Yay for Gunter Grass and Peter Handke, but I digress.)

All that said, as much as I enjoyed the costumes and sets—the color palette alone was Emmy-worthy—it’s a tad disingenuous for Black-ish, with their Cosby-derived formula, to ape those times just because Dre is afraid of losing a job he hasn’t actually lost.  I did enjoy the episode, but the breeziness of it, the way we were supposed to applaud each current character being plugged into a past one, felt like cutting corners to me. They sold the subject short. I still adore the show, but I feel they could have done so much more with not the similarities between Dre’s family’s situation and that of the one in Good times (which, pffft), but their difference. That would have been amazing.

Rant over.

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I'm going to rain on the parade and say I didn't like the revelation that Bow is pregnant. It's not an addition I think the show needs.

I love children, love, love, love, babies, and I'm sure their interactions and displays of parenting an infant/toddler will be riotous, but it left me with a "really? what the fudge? why?!" reaction.  

Scrooge McScroogerson, signing off here.

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(edited)

I was a fan of Good Times when I was a kid so this was very fun for me, even if some of the kids got little to do (like Zoe as Willona). What I love is that GT has been criticized because it was a show about poor black people written by rich white people. And it definitely showed sometimes with the plots and the JJ-ification of it. But now we have this show which was created by a black man and it's a great representation of the culture today - something GT probably never could've done.

My only complaint is thought the room at the end of the hallway was the parents room and the bathroom was off to the side. They switched it here which seems odd to me, as they paid so much attention to detail. I could be wrong - it's been years since I've watched GT.

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I'm going to rain on the parade and say I didn't like the revelation that Bow is pregnant. It's not an addition I think the show needs.

I totally agree with you. I thought it was going to end with the reveal that Bow is entering early menopause or something like that. I'm not feeling a baby. 

Edited by xander874
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it’s a tad disingenuous for Black-ish, with their Cosby-derived formula, to ape those times just because Dre is afraid of losing a job he hasn’t actually lost.  I did enjoy the episode, but the breeziness of it, the way we were supposed to applaud each current character being plugged into a past one, felt like cutting corners to me. They sold the subject short. I still adore the show, but I feel they could have done so much more with not the similarities between Dre’s family’s situation and that of the one in Good times (which, pffft), but their difference. That would have been amazing.

I would argue that the reason the episode did not go in depth about the differences in the lives of the Evans family and that of the Johnsons is because Black-ish has spent it's two seasons on air (two very successful seasons at that) portraying what life for the Johnsons is like. If Good-ish Times were the first episode of Black-ish one had watched, it would be fair to say that it is disingenuous to suggest the situations on Black-ish and Good Times are similar. But the show is well known enough, certainly to it's regular viewers, that such explanations are not really needed. No one watching is really under the impression that Dre losing his job would relegate the Johnson's to ghetto life. But we are versed enough to know the insecurity Dre has about what he has achieved in life, because we know all too well that Dre started out far closer to the Evanses than to his current situation. He has been there, and no matter how successful one gets, there is always the fear you'll end up right back where you started. So it isn't so out there that he would use Good Times as a signifier of that fear. Although in truth, he would have thought of himself as James, not Keith. But the show has to use the cast as best it can, and utilizing Sir Laurence Fishbourne as James is to be expected. So Dre becomes Keith. If anything, that might be why the larger points didn't exactly hit dead center.

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Attica, I had the same thought this morning waiting for the train.  Every time I think about I chuckle.

I know Dre can be way over the top, but sometimes he has these one-liners that just crack me up. Just yesterday I was browsing my grocery store's most recent flyer and noticed tilapia was on sale -- immediately my brain heard Dre's wail, "IT'S TRAAAAAASH! TRASH FISH!" LOL.

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So it's kind of weird that the show suddenly is trying to act as if Dre is a non-factor in the kid's lives due to his job.

I took it more as a statement that he's hands-off when the kids are sick (so he has missed out on the rewarding part of taking care of his kids). Given that he's apparently got a "go bag" (LOL) and takes off so that he doesn't get sick himself. "I HAVE TO LIIIIIIVE!" Heee. But I do think he's hands-on in other ways. Just not when they're sick. So he "learned" something in this ep.

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When Bow asked Dre if she was too old to be pregnant (when they were in the sofa), I thought that was the actress asking an Executive Producer about the validity of this storyline...  

I actually thought that was a smart comment because if they don't want to go through with the pregnancy and she miscarries, they remind us that her age could be a factor. Women in their 40's can have tougher pregnancies.

I think if any show could handle a newborn storyline, it's this one. I don't think a newborn will be too precious - everyone's fodder for mockery on this show.

At the same time, I wouldn't be sad if they decided not to pursue it all the way and instead had Bow miscarry. It's not uncommon, it's a thoughtful thing to acknowledge for all the women who have gone through it, and other sitcoms have handled serious topics with a good blend of humor and gravity. (See: Maude's abortion, for example, which was pretty huge given the time it was explored, when no one dared speak on tv about such things. Pretty serious stuff for a sitcom, but from what I've heard it was handled very well.)   Or what Traveller519 said.  ;)

Edited by sinkwriter
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 I also thought it was a bit unrealistic that there was no "HOLY SHIT" moment, because I think a couple in their 40s with 4 kids, one of whom is two years from leaving home, would be a lot more panicked about starting over.

I feel like the HOLY SHIT moment is still to come. The news came at the last minute end tag, and they were still wrapped up in feeling in the family love (Bow connecting with Ruby, Dre connecting with the kids, the two of them watching the kids feeling better and playing together). So I could see them being good with the baby news in the haze of all that (plus Bow on cold meds and defenses weakened from being sick). But next week? I could totally see the panic kicking in and Dre and Bow freaking out. (I say as someone who has not yet seen the next episode.)

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I just need to share this with y'all because I know (most of?) you like Jenifer Lewis as much as I do. 

Empress1, thank you for posting that! I love her, and that was pointed and marvelous.

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I kept waiting for Bow to encourage Ruby to get back to singing in clubs. There must be somewhere in their area where jazz and old standards and Broadway are still being performed for club-setting audiences?

Empress1, just for you - I believe that's Jenifer as the mermaid on the far right, yes? 

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Never leave us again Charlie.

Deon Cole's other show (Angie Tribeca) got a second season which has already been taped. If it gets renewed for a third I imagine he'll bounce in and out of Black-ish as his schedule requires. I hope Black-ish continues to accommodate him because he makes a huge difference in those office scenes. Wanda's good but maybe these weren't the shoes for her to try to fill.

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I appreciated that the quality of the film looked like a show made int he 1970's - that sort of grainy, definitely not high def, look.  

On 5/19/2016 at 4:49 AM, docmatt said:

But I wish they hadn't done a gimmick episode right after the pregnancy reveal. This show is too good and too smart to keep doing tricks that distract from that.

Last week, I thought the pregnancy reveal episode was the last one of the season - it seemed like a season-ender kind of episode. I was surprised that there was one more episode to go.  However, after watching the GT episode, it all makes sense - Thelma/Bow being pregnant and how to afford their growing family tied their lives and the dream together.  Therefore, the GT take-off had to be after the pregnancy reveal. 

On 5/19/2016 at 11:34 AM, reggiejax said:

The nitpicking part of me remembered all too well that Keith and James did not appear on Good Times at the same time, James having died after 3 seasons, whereas Keith did not show up until the end of season 5. For that matter, Penny and James also never were in the cast together.

I can be very nitpicky, but this didn't bother me because it was all Dre's dream and my dreams rarely get all the details straight (typical of me re-telling a dream - "We were in our living room and heard a noise in the kitchen and walked in to find a german shepherd standing on the island, so it must have been my mom's kitchen because we don't have an island, but I am pretty sure it was our living room because the walls were blue, well, anyway, the german shepherd..." - which also explains why no one ever wants to hear me tell them about a dream I had).

On 5/19/2016 at 3:58 PM, Mabinogia said:

Good Times was one of my favorite shows growing up. I agree they kind of strained it trying to fit the Blackish characters into Good Times rolls, I had the hardest time with Zoe as Willona. It was odd seeing them play different family relations though, like Zoe was her Ruby's bff, Ruby was Bo's mom, Bo and Junior were brother and sister. Very odd. But I thought the stand outs were obviously Pops/James, Junior/JJ and Ruby/Florida.

The parts were mixed up age wise, but I thought the personalilties were a pretty good fit.  If Zoe was Thelma, then Bow either becomes Willona and Dre has no part to play, or Dre and Bow play James and Florida and then Pops has no part (and Ruby is Willona?).  I think Ruby, Pops, Junior, Dre, Bow, and Charlie all played the characters that suited their personalities best.  Zoe was Willona by default.  However, I think personality-wise, cute little Jack should have played cute little Penny, and Diane was a closer to match to Michael, but I certainly can understand not switching up the sexes of the characters. 

On 5/20/2016 at 9:23 PM, lallalla said:

I'm going to rain on the parade and say I didn't like the revelation that Bow is pregnant. It's not an addition I think the show needs.

I love children, love, love, love, babies, and I'm sure their interactions and displays of parenting an infant/toddler will be riotous, but it left me with a "really? what the fudge? why?!" reaction.  

Scrooge McScroogerson, signing off here.

I think your view agrees with the vast majority of viewers - I have not heard or read a single comment saying that Bow being pregnant is a good idea.  Most are just trying to stay optimistic that this show can make it work out fine.  

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5 minutes ago, needschocolate said:

 However, I think personality-wise, cute little Jack should have played cute little Penny, and Diane was a closer to match to Michael

OMG now I wish they had done that. I would love to have seen Diane as civil rights activist Michael and they could have come up with some cute jokes about Jack being Penny. Hey, he has moves like Michael, why not play a character that was Janet. lol but I get why they didn't. But I do wish they had. And yeah, Zoe just kind of had to be Willona because who else was she gonna be?

I loved it regardless because, Good Times!

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(edited)

I'm 45 and to this day, I can't look at an iron without thinking about the episode where we learn Penny's bio mom uses one to abuse her. Still don't own an iron... Am glad that wasn't referenced in Dre's dream.

Edited by QQQQ
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