S22.E11: Week 10

[Stinamaia]

13 hours ago, Dejana said:

 

 

Gaining new respect for Sean

[KenyaJ]

11 hours ago, LuvMyShows said:

There absolutely had to be something fishy about the breakup filming.  To the best of my knowledge, we haven't had much (any?) film of the 'happy couple' during the period after the proposal and before the airing, and yet this time they showed us several different encounters from that period.  

Yep. That was really weird to me too. TV Critic Damian Holbrook asked Sean on Twitter last night if there was any post-Final Rose filming of his safehouse visits with Catherine. Sean said no and that he didn't know what was up with that. I've never heard of any couple being filmed like that, which makes me suspect that the producers knew from the beginning that something weird was going on with Arie.

[Stan39]

6 minutes ago, JudyObscure said:

Agreed.  I can't see why Lauren is being cast as the horrid home wrecker in this.  Aside from the fact that there is no home and just a several weeks long relationship, Lauren being willing to take Arie back just proves she really did love him, not that she was a party to Becca's "take down."   I did think it was telling that Becca seemed more concerned with how "embarrassing" it all was than about losing Arie.  Becca didn't seem to lose any sleep over how embarrassed Lauren had been standing in the final rose arena fully expecting a proposal.  That and all the times Arie held a rose in his hand while rejecting his date, were all more humiliating and more blindsiding, than Becca's break up, after being warned by Arie that he couldn't get over Lauren.

Arie didn't ask Becca how to handle Lauren in Peru. It was Arie's choice and both girls had to respond to their own relationship with him, independent of each other. But Lauren knew Arie was now engaged and he was calling her conflicted over his feelings. She could have done the honorable thing and told him he needed to figure out his feelings for Becca before she felt comfortable talking about a relationship. But it doesn't seem like she did that. She inserted herself into Becca's and Arie's relationship. I don't think it was out of malice (like Arie I think she's just a self absorbed dimwit who doesn't really think about others). But it was still a poor decision on Lauren's part. 

Ultimately it's probably all for the best (though handled poorly). Arie and Lauren are both so self absorbed and insecure, needing constant reassurance and attention, that it wouldn't be fair for other people to have to put up with either of them. 

[huahaha]

1 hour ago, Losemynumber said:

The DM to Bekah said , “ just realized you were born the same year as my first 2 on 1”

what did I miss? Bekah born in 1995. Arie’s 1st 2 on 1 was not in 1995!

It was probably a homecoming picture or something.

[nutty1]

47 minutes ago, Rainsong said:

 

Say Sean Lowe really fast and it sounds like 'shallow.'  Which he undoubtedly is.

 

And how many of us just said "Sean Lowe" out loud???

[yorklee2]

30 minutes ago, Stan39 said:

But we know that's not what happened. She didn't tell Arie he could call her if things don't work out. We know Arie spoke to her at least once while engaged to Becca. I seriously doubt it was a two second conversation to chat later if things don't work out. As posted before, Arie is pretty weak and spineless. I'm sure he asked for reassurance from Lauren that if he dumped Becca she'd take him back. For Lauren to give him that assurance while he's engaged to Becca is pretty shady. I don't know, I've been interested in women who were in relationships and they've confronted me with questions about our future. Maybe I was an idiot, but I always told them they needed to figure out their feelings for the other person first before I could answer because I didn't think it would be fair to the other guy. I also didn't want to get mixed up in a "love triangle" because I thought the emotions and feelings would be too confusing. 

Good post Stan. You sound like a stand up guy. No your not an idiot glad to know there's people left in the world who consider others feelings and want to do the right thing. Not to mention being smart enough not to get involved in a mess like that. My points exactly. What was Lauren thinking?

[slowpoked]

3 hours ago, Amy Beth said:

As awful as Arie was, I rate Chris Harrison worse. The sheer orgasmic glee over how the show was trending on social media was gross.

i don’t care about the dumb contract. If I were Becca, i’d have let them sue me and asked for a jury of Bachelor viewers.

Why she would ever want to be the Bachelorette is confounding to me. Just walk away with dignity.

This. Not to take anything away from what Arie did, but I wanted to punch Chris Harrison's "awww shucks...." face a lot of times last night. Never mind that they are playing someone's humiliation and heartbreak for everyone to see, but heck, this is the most dramatic thing ever on reality TV show history!!!

He might as well have said during the show: "Do you think Arie could humiliate Becca even more? What else could Arie say that would make things worse? Will we finally see Becca CRY? Find out after the break."

[alexa]

3 minutes ago, slowpoked said:

This. Not to take anything away from what Arie did, but I wanted to punch Chris Harrison's "awww shucks...." face a lot of times last night. Never mind that they are playing someone's humiliation and heartbreak for everyone to see, but heck, this is the most dramatic thing ever on reality TV show history!!!

He might as well have said during the show: "Do you think Arie could humiliate Becca even more? What else could Arie say that would make things worse? Will we finally see Becca CRY? Find out after the break."

And then follow that up with a taped version of the break up of his own (CH) marriage.  I am sure he would love to have everyone see all that went down there....  I know he wants a paycheck, but you would think he could have some actual sympathy.

[Wings]

14 minutes ago, yorklee2 said:

Good post Stan. You sound like a stand up guy. No your not an idiot glad to know there's people left in the world who consider others feelings and want to do the right thing. Not to mention being smart enough not to get involved in a mess like that. My points exactly. What was Lauren thinking?

She wasn't thinking, she is in love!  Well she was probably thinking about her life as his wife in a rainbows and bluebirds way.  

Edited March 6, 2018 by Wings

[nlkm9]

  I remember being so disapointed when CHarlie Oconell got to the final ceremony and told Chris harrison he couldnt choose, and I remember feeling embarassed that the 2 women agreed to keep dating him, knowing he was sleeping with the other--looking back, he was actually pretty smart. And Brad got all kinds of flack for choosing himself. interesting!!

[yorklee2]

3 minutes ago, Wings said:

She wasn't thinking, she is in love!  Well she was probably thinking about her life as his wife in a rainbows and bluebirds way.  

Well some times the best lessons in life are learned the hard way. Like I said she made her bed now she has to lay in it. Arie was already texting other women while he was supposed to be so conflicted and in love with her. Keeping his avenues open you know. Creep.

[Cornhusker12]

1 hour ago, Wings said:

Help me with the timeline.  They met Aries parents in Peru, right?  Did all this go down in Peru?  They never came to the US?  One report said they broke up after a couple of months.   I am vague on the timeline because I have not become interested in this season until now.  :^)

Yeah they weren't super clear on that in the moment, but they left Peru and all of the little clips they showed were from when they were back home having their "secret rendezvous" meetups. They were engaged for about two months after the show ended, then Arie broke it off.

[Stan39]

7 minutes ago, nlkm9 said:

  I remember being so disapointed when CHarlie Oconell got to the final ceremony and told Chris harrison he couldnt choose, and I remember feeling embarassed that the 2 women agreed to keep dating him, knowing he was sleeping with the other--looking back, he was actually pretty smart. And Brad got all kinds of flack for choosing himself. interesting!!

It's about breaking down barriers, sadly. Once it happens once it becomes acceptable for all future iterations. People hated JP (for many reasons) but one in particular was how much he kissed all the women, even in front of each other. And Ben got grief for telling two women he loved them. Even before last night Arie was pretty wretched, doing whatever he wanted, telling the girls whatever he thought they needed to hear to stay with him, and his general disregard for anyone's feelings but his own. I know production sets up a lot of these scenarios, but this is the first bachelor I've seen pretty much do whatever is asked of him. Usually by the end, the bachelor starts pulling women aside prior to the rose ceremony to avoid the embarrassment. I think Arie only did that once, with Kendall? Production may have told him they wanted to film this, but I doubt Arie put up much of a fight. 

 

I'm really interested to see how Arie and Lauren walk in tonight. Are they smiling and waving to the crowd? Completely oblivious to anything unrelated to their "love"? Or do they come in somber, realizing this isn't a great situation? It could go either way. 

[OnTime]

52 minutes ago, jb0495 said:

Everyone seems to be forgetting how ATFR with Jason, Molly & Melissa went down. It all "seemed" to happen live on the ATFR special. There was not a live studiop audience. Just CH, Jason, Molly & Melissa. But Jason & Melissa had already basically broken up, she was already talking to her ex who she ended up marrying.

I remember Jason saying, before he made his choice, that the producers kept telling him Melissa would be great for him and they would have cute kids.

Whatever Arie did or didn't do, the producers made the decision to show it all on TV.

[Jax7917]

1 hour ago, JudyObscure said:

Agreed.  I can't see why Lauren is being cast as the horrid home wrecker in this.  Aside from the fact that there is no home and just a several weeks long relationship, Lauren being willing to take Arie back just proves she really did love him, not that she was a party to Becca's "take down."   I did think it was telling that Becca seemed more concerned with how "embarrassing" it all was than about losing Arie.  Becca didn't seem to lose any sleep over how embarrassed Lauren had been standing in the final rose arena fully expecting a proposal.  That and all the times Arie held a rose in his hand while rejecting his date, were all more humiliating and more blindsiding, than Becca's break up, after being warned by Arie that he couldn't get over Lauren.

I think being proposed to on national tv followed by a couple weeks later being dumped for the runner up ON national Tv is a tad more embarrassing than a random girl not receiving a rose .. but to each their own . And why would becca be concerned for Lauren ? It was even playing field . One of them had to go home . 

[alexa]

I am beginning to think that the common thing in Bachelor shows will now be to say I love you to the final 2 or 3, and that noone will know if they get a proposal if it will "stick".  It seems that there used to be less kissing, and then the new thing was for everyone to kiss the lead.  Now we have 2 seasons of I love you...so we have broken new barriers there.  And lastly we are on 2 seasons of the lead changing their mind... opens the door for the others.

[nlkm9]

1 minute ago, alexa said:

I am beginning to think that the common thing in Bachelor shows will now be to say I love you to the final 2 or 3, and that noone will know if they get a proposal if it will "stick".  It seems that there used to be less kissing, and then the new thing was for everyone to kiss the lead.  Now we have 2 seasons of I love you...so we have broken new barriers there.  And lastly we are on 2 seasons of the lead changing their mind... opens the door for the others.

Shannon on the first season made it to final 3 with no kissing!!!

41 minutes ago, slowpoked said:

This. Not to take anything away from what Arie did, but I wanted to punch Chris Harrison's "awww shucks...." face a lot of times last night. Never mind that they are playing someone's humiliation and heartbreak for everyone to see, but heck, this is the most dramatic thing ever on reality TV show history!!!

He might as well have said during the show: "Do you think Arie could humiliate Becca even more? What else could Arie say that would make things worse? Will we finally see Becca CRY? Find out after the break."

LOL I love that--Chris Harrisons oh shucks face. lol. best line of the day

[truthaboutluv]

1 hour ago, nlkm9 said:

And Brad got all kinds of flack for choosing himself. interesting!!

The hate for Brad from Bachelor Nation was always one of the most baffling things to me. Okay, I didn't actually watch his season so it's entirely possible he was an ass throughout but it seemed like most were mad at him just because he didn't pick someone. And I always thought that was ridiculous because if he knew in his heart he wasn't in love with either woman, was he supposed to propose, fake an engagement, only to dump them a few weeks later and then people would hate him for that?

Yes, a person can change their mind. People break off engagements everyday. The point is though Arie handled this badly in many ways. One, he should not have proposed when he was this conflicted. And I disagree with a comment that he didn't seem that happy during the proposal. Being spoiled about what happened, I paid particular attention to when he let Lauren go and when he proposed. And YMMV but he was beaming to Becca, selling her a fantasy about kids, jumping around with Becca, constant twirling, kissing, etc. And the footage they showed looked like from the days after the proposal when they were probably still in Peru. I know it's been reported that the couple is always given a few days together before they have to go back to the U.S. and not see each other. And in that footage, Arie seemed very comfortable and happy with Becca. 

It just seemed like Arie is always looking over his shoulder for the next best thing. Something his ex, who he dumped only when the show called for him to be the Bachelor, basically said about him. As for those thinking Becca knew more than she was letting on because they acknowledged his confusion over Lauren in the conversation, People Magazine has their interview with Becca up and she said Arie phrased his feelings regarding Lauren as still feeling bad and guilty over how he hurt her. It didn't seem like he ever told Becca, "I think I might still have feelings for her". Becca did say though that she noticed when he started liking Lauren's posts and pictures on Instagram and that did bother her.

And the liking of Lauren's pictures and posts on IG is another example of how, once again, Arie handled this very badly and once again, points to his always looking for the next best thing. Arie chose to propose to Becca but also chose to keep dangling the Lauren option. All his bullshit of not being able to stop thinking about Lauren was, well bullshit and rather he chose to keep her on his mind and in his life with his liking her images and essentially keeping that door open. And no one will convince me he wasn't also DM'ing her. In my opinion, Arie was only focused on Becca in those few days after the proposal, and as soon as he got back home, he started throwing out fillers to Lauren via his IG likes, etc. to see if she might still be interested. And there was probably some private conversations where he realized she pathetically would take him back and at that point, Becca was done. Had Lauren told him to go kick rocks the first time he reached out to her, Arie would probably still be engaged to Becca until he could dump her a few months after the ATFR. 

Well maybe not, if the other Becca had given him an indication she was interested. Some people have made comments that none of those DM's Becca shared shows him hitting on her but seeing as I don't trust Arie for a second, in my opinion, that was probably his attempt to open the line of communication and again, feel out the situation to see if there was a possibility. Dude is a narcissistic player who will always look for the next available woman. And there's always the specter of one Courtney Robertson - his "good friend" who he's also happened to bang numerous times and who makes it clear, as Courtney would do, that things can always move from non-platonic between them. So good luck Lauren. Girl, you'll need it. 

Edited March 6, 2018 by truthaboutluv

[JenE4]

I think Becca knew the break-up was coming or, at the very least, the safe-house visit was on the heels of a fight and perhaps she thought they could work through it but wasn’t too sure where he stood. When the greeted each other, they gave a tepid kiss ON THE CHEEK and a hug with far less enthusiasm than a typical “bro hug.” If they were, to her perspective, happily in love, wouldn’t she have run up to him with a “Bachelor handshake” (straddle hugs) and immediately started making out with him like, you know, the way every date started—let alone supposedly not having seen her loving fiancé for weeks or whatever. She also already knew he still had feelings for Lauren and he had spoken to her. Plus, Becca and Arie apparently had several conversations with Becca as the sounding board to help Arie get over his feelings for Lauren. None of this blindsided her. I’m sure it hurt to hear him flat-out say he loves Lauren and being engaged to her was, you know, cramping his style to woo Lauren back. Maybe until that point there was some back and forth on his conflicted feelings and this could have been the first time he flat-out said: Remember when I said I would keep choosing you? Well, I decided to choose Lauren from here on out. But I think she knew this recorded meeting was going to be him giving her a decision one way or the other...and if it were good news for her, they likely wouldn’t be recording it.

[Black Knight]

1 hour ago, Stan39 said:

Maybe I was an idiot, but I always told them they needed to figure out their feelings for the other person first before I could answer because I didn't think it would be fair to the other guy.

You're not an idiot. But the thing is that that supposed "non-answer" in itself confirmed to them that you were interested, though, because otherwise you would have just said, "No, I'm not interested in you." You would only say "I won't answer until you figure out your feelings for the other person first" if you are interested but trying to be decent about it. But they still get the information they were after, that you want them. There really isn't any way around revealing that information in what you say to that question unless you straight up lie that you're not interested when you are.

So I really put the fault on the person who chooses to ask the question, rather than the person who answers it. The person who asks the question is going to get the information they want either way, unless the other person lies. The questioner should not be asking the question at all, and should be figuring out their feelings for the person they're with, and breaking up with that person without arranging a backup person.

[DEL901]

14 minutes ago, truthaboutluv said:

The hate for Brad from Bachelor Nation was always one of the most baffling things to me. Okay, I didn't actually watch his season so it's entirely possible he was an ass throughout but it seemed like most were mad at him just because he didn't pick someone. And I always thought that was ridiculous because if he knew in his heart he wasn't in love with either woman, was he supposed to propose, fake an engagement, only to dump them a few weeks later and then people would hate him for that?

Yes, a person can change their mind. People break off engagements everyday. The point is though Arie handled this badly in many ways. One, he should not have proposed when he was this conflicted. And I disagree with a comment that he didn't seem that happy during the proposal. Being spoiled about what happened, I paid particular attention to when he let Lauren go and when he proposed. And YMMV but he was beaming to Becca, selling her a fantasy about kids, jumping around with Becca, constant twirling, kissing, etc. And the footage they showed looked like from the days after the proposal when they were probably still in Peru. I know it's been reported that the couple is always given a few days together before they have to go back to the U.S. and not see each other. And in that footage, Arie seemed very comfortable and happy with Becca. 

It just seemed like Arie is always looking over his shoulder for the next best thing. Something his ex, who he dumped only when the show called for him to be the Bachelor, basically said about him. As for those thinking Becca knew more than she was letting on because they acknowledged his confusion over Lauren in the conversation, People Magazine has their interview with Becca up and she said Arie phrased his feelings regarding Lauren as still feeling bad and guilty over how he hurt her. It didn't seem like he ever told Becca, "I think I might still have feelings for her". Becca did say though that she noticed when he started liking Lauren's posts and pictures on Instagram and that did bother her.

And the liking is another example of again, how Arie handled this and points to again his always looking for the next best thing. Arie chose to propose to Becca but chose to keep dangling the Lauren option. All his bullshit of not being able to stop thinking about her, was, well bullshit and he chose to keep her on his mind and in his life with his liking her images and no one will convince me he wasn't also DM'ing her. In my opinion, Arie was only focused on Becca in those few days after the proposal, and as soon as he got back home, he started throwing out fillers to Lauren via his IG likes, etc. to see if she might still be interested. And there was probably some private conversations where he realized she pathetically would take him back and at that point, Becca was done. Had Lauren told him to go kick rocks the first time he reached out to her, Arie would probably still be engaged to Becca until he could dump her a few months after the ATFR. 

Well maybe not, if the  other Becca had given him an indication she was interested. Some people have made comments that none of those DM's Becca shared shows him hitting on her but seeing as I don't trust Arie for a second, in my opinion, that was probably his attempt to open the line of communication and again, feel out the situation to see if there was a possibility. Dude is a narcissistic player who will always look for the next available woman. And there's always the specter of one Courtney Robertson - his "good friend" who he's also happened to bang numerous times and who makes it clear, as Courtney would do, that things can always move from non-platonic between them. So good luck Lauren. Girl, you'll need it. 

Agree with EVERYTHING!

 

BTW, bolding mine.  

[Hpmec]

The dumping of Lauren and subsequent proposal to Becca sequence was exceptionally painful. If he had any feelings for Lauren at all, he would have approached her before she got all gussied up fully expecting to be proposed to by a guy who kept professing his love. However, his enormous ego compelled him to have her stand before him making her own declarations of undying love and devotion knowing full well he was about to blindside her with the "You're number two...I'll walk you to the limo" speech. (I know this is a staple on this show, but once the B or Bette utters the L word, more consideration for the dumpee should be in order.)  Then Becca appeared and he could not even fake any enthusiasm for a marriage proposal he obviously wasn't feeling. Considering he was a Bachelor has been from 5 years ago, he no doubt considered himself lucky and was looking forward to a stint on Dancing With the Stars with Becca cheering him on before inevitably lowering the boom on her. For whatever reason, he couldn't wait and thus, last evening's massive shitshow. This show has jumped the shark so many times and in so many awkward, embarrassing ways those metaphoric beat up water skis should have been retired long ago. However, last night was a new low. If Arie had even the tiniest bit of decency in his DNA, he never would have staged a blindside break up in front of the cameras under the guise of a romantic rendezvous. In the annals of poor Bachelor behavior, he's an all star occupying a position firmly at the top. 

[hnygrl]

The way this show is going? I have a prediction:

How much y'all wanna bet there's gonna be a proposal tonight? New Neal Lane ring and everything?

The man has no class. None. It wouldn't even occur to him that proposing to one girl one (television) day after dumping another would be considered crass and classless to the rest of the civilized world.

Watch...I betcha anything he's gonna take a knee tonight.

And push Flapjack right out of his top 5 worse Bachelors of all time slot. Y'all watch. The man has no tact, no diplomacy, no class. He's gonna do it.

And get BOOO'D for it.

[Token]

This whole episode just smacks of producer manipulation to me.  It seemed obvious, to me anyway, that Arie loves Lauren and his family loved her too.  I was cringing at how his family treated Becca and just drooled over Lauren.  So for him to pick Becca was just ridiculous and made no sense.  The only thing that makes sense to me is that they wanted some crazy drama this season and asked him to pull a Mesnick.  If Lauren actually takes him back, then that will just confirm it for me.  Because no woman with any self respect would take Arie back after how he behaved during this season.

[Irlandesa]

2 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

Becca didn't seem to lose any sleep over how embarrassed Lauren had been standing in the final rose arena fully expecting a proposal.  That and all the times Arie held a rose in his hand while rejecting his date, were all more humiliating and more blindsiding, than Becca's break up, after being warned by Arie that he couldn't get over Lauren.

Becca didn't lose sleep over it because, as far as she knew, Arie and Lauren were doing what was expected of the franchise.  Someone was going to the final rose and the other would not.  There's a sense of knowing what you signed up for.

What happened with Becca and Arie is not supposed to happen.  That's why it's more embarrassing. 

He said he was struggling with his feelings for Lauren which a compassionate person probably gets on some level.  But she didn't expect a total swap as if he didn't love her or would have no problem being with Lauren and not thinking of her.

I thought he and Becca had physical chemistry.  I also think he wanted to go to the bone zone with Bekah.  That's why the DMs are funny to me.  Man, if Lauren had to be reassured before, she's going to really need it after this.

[Stan39]

https://www.theringer.com/2018/3/6/17085902/the-bachelor-season-22-finale-exit-survey

Best quote,

Lindbergh: We’ll all remember where we were when Arie made every other man look better by comparison. 

 

Haha!

[Wings]

1 hour ago, yorklee2 said:

Well some times the best lessons in life are learned the hard way. Like I said she made her bed now she has to lay in it. Arie was already texting other women while he was supposed to be so conflicted and in love with her. Keeping his avenues open you know. Creep.

This is pathological behavior.  

Everyone recovers quickly when out of the bubble so no one is likely to have lasting damage.  And there is always BiP for an image adjustment. :>  All is well and CH is still an asshole.  

Edited March 6, 2018 by Wings

[ljenkins782]

45 minutes ago, Jaclyn88 said:

Quote

Agreed.  I can't see why Lauren is being cast as the horrid home wrecker in this.  Aside from the fact that there is no home and just a several weeks long relationship, Lauren being willing to take Arie back just proves she really did love him, not that she was a party to Becca's "take down."   I did think it was telling that Becca seemed more concerned with how "embarrassing" it all was than about losing Arie.  Becca didn't seem to lose any sleep over how embarrassed Lauren had been standing in the final rose arena fully expecting a proposal.  That and all the times Arie held a rose in his hand while rejecting his date, were all more humiliating and more blindsiding, than Becca's break up, after being warned by Arie that he couldn't get over Lauren.

I think being proposed to on national tv followed by a couple weeks later being dumped for the runner up ON national Tv is a tad more embarrassing than a random girl not receiving a rose .. but to each their own . And why would becca be concerned for Lauren ? It was even playing field . One of them had to go home . 

I'm not understanding the comparison between this completely unnecessary ambush break-up and the rose ceremonies/final rose. Those are all parts of the normal show process and are Arie's choice alone, what was Becca supposed to do, step aside so Lauren wouldn't be embarrassed by not getting chosen.

As for Lauren being cast as a home wrecker, I don't see her that way and it makes some sense to me that she didn't slam the door on the possibility of future relationship just because she didn't get chosen as F1. Considering that the shelf life of F1 relationships is typically around 6 months, it's reasonable enough to assume those 2 weren't making it down the aisle. 

But this spectacle was unnecessarily cruel and is ultimately going to damage whatever relationship they may have from here on out. He's definitely hated and the stink is going to rub off on her, plus this is going to be tabloid fodder for awhile. If she sincerely wants to be with him, there were better ways for him to handle the break-up. 

As for those Bekah M DMs posted above, despite the not overt flirting tone, him continuing to message her is probably not entirely innocent on his part. But she's shredding him on Twitter now, so I think it's safe to say that door is closed forever. 

[OnTime]

1 hour ago, alexa said:

I am beginning to think that the common thing in Bachelor shows will now be to say I love you to the final 2 or 3, and that noone will know if they get a proposal if it will "stick".  It seems that there used to be less kissing, and then the new thing was for everyone to kiss the lead.  Now we have 2 seasons of I love you...so we have broken new barriers there. 

Yep, seems that started with Ben.

Were there any hot tubs this season? Seems there are less of them now, too. I can't remember.

32 minutes ago, hnygrl said:

How much y'all wanna bet there's gonna be a proposal tonight? New Neal Lane ring and everything?

I really doubt that will happen.

[Stan39]

36 minutes ago, hnygrl said:

The way this show is going? I have a prediction:

How much y'all wanna bet there's gonna be a proposal tonight? New Neal Lane ring and everything?

The man has no class. None. It wouldn't even occur to him that proposing to one girl one (television) day after dumping another would be considered crass and classless to the rest of the civilized world.

Watch...I betcha anything he's gonna take a knee tonight.

And push Flapjack right out of his top 5 worse Bachelors of all time slot. Y'all watch. The man has no tact, no diplomacy, no class. He's gonna do it.

And get BOOO'D for it.

You've got to wonder what's going on in Lauren's head and her parents. Weren't they all worried she was going to get hurt again? Now, Arie dumps her on national tv when she thinks she's getting a proposal, then decides he wants her back and brings her into this mess in the worst possible way. Her family can't be excited about their twice engaged 25-year old daughter getting involved with this 36-year old creep. 

[DEL901]

Well, since tonight's show is live, it'll be very interesting how Lauren and her parents react.  Especially considering some of the spoilers out there that STILL haven't been revealed on the show.

[Adeejay]

56 minutes ago, nlkm9 said:

Shannon on the first season made it to final 3 with no kissing!!!

Shannon and Bettina (Brad's 1st season) are my all time favorite Bachelorettes.  I've often wondered how they are doing.    

The fact that only one Bachelor out of 22 went on to marry his chosen one, tells me that the rest most likely regretted their final choice.  They just didn't break up with them on camera.  Heck, Dr. Travis didn't even have an ATFR show.  

I noticed that Lauren took a page directly out of Molly's play book.  After being dumped by the Bachelor, instead of getting angry, she calmly told him that she still loves him and that he is making a huge mistake.  It gave the Bachelor something to think about.  And based on the result, it worked; first on Jason and now Arie.  

[yorklee2]

1 hour ago, truthaboutluv said:

The hate for Brad from Bachelor Nation was always one of the most baffling things to me. Okay, I didn't actually watch his season so it's entirely possible he was an ass throughout but it seemed like most were mad at him just because he didn't pick someone. And I always thought that was ridiculous because if he knew in his heart he wasn't in love with either woman, was he supposed to propose, fake an engagement, only to dump them a few weeks later and then people would hate him for that?

Yes, a person can change their mind. People break off engagements everyday. The point is though Arie handled this badly in many ways. One, he should not have proposed when he was this conflicted. And I disagree with a comment that he didn't seem that happy during the proposal. Being spoiled about what happened, I paid particular attention to when he let Lauren go and when he proposed. And YMMV but he was beaming to Becca, selling her a fantasy about kids, jumping around with Becca, constant twirling, kissing, etc. And the footage they showed looked like from the days after the proposal when they were probably still in Peru. I know it's been reported that the couple is always given a few days together before they have to go back to the U.S. and not see each other. And in that footage, Arie seemed very comfortable and happy with Becca. 

It just seemed like Arie is always looking over his shoulder for the next best thing. Something his ex, who he dumped only when the show called for him to be the Bachelor, basically said about him. As for those thinking Becca knew more than she was letting on because they acknowledged his confusion over Lauren in the conversation, People Magazine has their interview with Becca up and she said Arie phrased his feelings regarding Lauren as still feeling bad and guilty over how he hurt her. It didn't seem like he ever told Becca, "I think I might still have feelings for her". Becca did say though that she noticed when he started liking Lauren's posts and pictures on Instagram and that did bother her.

And the liking of Lauren's pictures and posts on IG is another example of how, once again, Arie handled this very badly and once again, points to his always looking for the next best thing. Arie chose to propose to Becca but also chose to keep dangling the Lauren option. All his bullshit of not being able to stop thinking about Lauren was, well bullshit and rather he chose to keep her on his mind and in his life with his liking her images and essentially keeping that door open. And no one will convince me he wasn't also DM'ing her. In my opinion, Arie was only focused on Becca in those few days after the proposal, and as soon as he got back home, he started throwing out fillers to Lauren via his IG likes, etc. to see if she might still be interested. And there was probably some private conversations where he realized she pathetically would take him back and at that point, Becca was done. Had Lauren told him to go kick rocks the first time he reached out to her, Arie would probably still be engaged to Becca until he could dump her a few months after the ATFR. 

Well maybe not, if the other Becca had given him an indication she was interested. Some people have made comments that none of those DM's Becca shared shows him hitting on her but seeing as I don't trust Arie for a second, in my opinion, that was probably his attempt to open the line of communication and again, feel out the situation to see if there was a possibility. Dude is a narcissistic player who will always look for the next available woman. And there's always the specter of one Courtney Robertson - his "good friend" who he's also happened to bang numerous times and who makes it clear, as Courtney would do, that things can always move from non-platonic between them. So good luck Lauren. Girl, you'll need it. 

 

Totally agree with all this! Why would an engaged man who is already "conflicted" about another woman be convuluting things further by initiating contact with yet another woman? I see at the end of the message he said, "how are you doing" or "hope your well". It sounds innocent enough but that's just a sly way of keeping the line of communication going. As they say around here, " I wouldn't trust him as far as I could throw him". Which ain't far.

Edited March 6, 2018 by yorklee2

[OnTime]

2 minutes ago, Adeejay said:

I noticed that Lauren took a page directly out of Molly's play book.  After being dumped by the Bachelor, instead of getting angry, she calmly told him that she still loves him and that he is making a huge mistake.  It gave the Bachelor something to think about.  And based on the result, it worked; first on Jason and now Arie.  

I always wonder if that was filmed afterwards to fit the story line.  I do wonder more why I keep watching this show!

[slowpoked]

1 hour ago, alexa said:

And then follow that up with a taped version of the break up of his own (CH) marriage.  I am sure he would love to have everyone see all that went down there....  I know he wants a paycheck, but you would think he could have some actual sympathy.

For once, you would think that he would do the right thing, that when Arie came to him to say he changed his mind about Becca, that he advise him to go talk to her in private, just the two of them. But no, he brought the cameras while Arie loaded the mics. 

 

6 minutes ago, DEL901 said:

Well, since tonight's show is live, it'll be very interesting how Lauren and her parents react.  Especially considering some of the spoilers out there that STILL haven't been revealed on the show.

I can't imagine Lauren feeling great after watching that breakup last night, even though she ended up the "winner". I can't imagine any decent human being feeling well watching that breakup, but who the heck knows anymore with this shit show. 

[MakeMeLaugh]

From a People article about Becca, who speaks fluent Bachelor: 

QUOTE

“I just knew it was me — that him and I were going to be together.”

 

But more seriously, I don’t think she was completely blindsided:

QUOTE

“I never thought for a million years that once the going started to get tough that he would throw in the towel and jump ship and say, ‘Oh sorry, I changed my mind.’ I didn’t think we were at that point whatsoever,” says Kufrin

Just very curious imo her comment about “once the going started to get tough” and “I didn’t think we were at that point”—wonder if life together after the final rose wasn’t the bed of roses (hah) it should have been so early in the relationship or if the bloom was already off the rose (double hah). She’ll be just fine.

(note I had put this in the Spoiler thread but it has no spoilers, so moved here as it relates to this episode)

[Lamb18]

I'm just starting to watch this now - on Hulu, as Amazon didn't bother loading the episode, even though I paid for it.

That little alpaca sure is cute! Question: how can this episode be unedited? Wouldn't there be a lot more footage than 3 hours?

What a jerk. He loves them both and either one would be OK.

So none of the dates Lauren's had stand out to her.  Oh, ALL of them stand out to her! Did Arie just call Lauren a possum? Something like "she's been im possum?". Around 8:30 in when meeting the parents. And Lauren looks like Ari's sister in law. She sure is nervous talking to his father. So Arie doesn't want to reassure Lauren continually throughout their relationship. The woman had a good question for him - is Lauren the kind of person he can talk with all night long?

Ari's dad is the personification of tact - he tells Becca he likes her and Lauren equally. I think Ari's mom liked Becca better. And I was right, mom thinks Becca is better for his future because Becca is more confident. Dad thinks so, too. Dad tells Arie sometimes he needs a kick in the ass, ha! Prophetic, by any chance?

Baby alpaca!!! Almost as cute as a baby lamb!

Lauren shows enthusiasm! Machu Picchu! They better not lean over backwards on that bench or they will go over the edge into the foggy abyss.

[Soobs]

3 hours ago, OnTime said:

Of course production took advantage! We've seen the proposal and diamond rings so many times and then the breakup follows.  

They definitely wanted and needed a twist with the "most shocking finale ever". This is now in the news and exactly what the producers like.

It also sets Becca up to be The Most Sympathetic Bachelorette in the history of the show.

[Stan39]

Arie gives an interview to People. Guy still sounds like a prick. 

 

http://people.com/tv/the-bachelor-arie-luyendyk-jr-explains-huge-mistake/

[JudyObscure]

2 hours ago, Stan39 said:

But Lauren knew Arie was now engaged and he was calling her conflicted over his feelings. She could have done the honorable thing and told him he needed to figure out his feelings for Becca before she felt comfortable talking about a relationship. But it doesn't seem like she did that. She inserted herself into Becca's and Arie's relationship. I don't think it was out of malice (like Arie I think she's just a self absorbed dimwit who doesn't really think about others). But it was still a poor decision on Lauren's part. 

I think people are forgetting that Lauren and Becca dated Arie at the same time, they have both known him for the same (short) length of time, they both fell in love with him at the same time and they both went to the proposal spot on the same day, both in love and both expecting a proposal at the same time.. 

Now, just a few weeks later,  because Becca got the proposal and Lauren didn't, we're expecting Lauren to act  and feel like a stranger who is only this minute  meeting a man who is "in a relationship," and she has "inserted herself" into something as sacred as a marriage.  She did not do that. 

I find it odd how many people these days put "in a relationship" in the same category as a marriage.  A marriage is a huge, legal, usually religious, commitment far beyond this thing between Arie and Becca which consists of a grand total of about five actual days together.

[DEL901]

34 minutes ago, Lamb18 said:

 

That little alpaca sure is cute! Question: how can this episode be unedited? Wouldn't there be a lot more footage than 3 hours?

 

Not the episode, LOL, just the footage at the end.., maybe last half hour???

[SassyCat]

I had to delete my post (and replace it with this one) because it was mean. I was dragged into the drama, like the rest of us, and I really don't know any of these three people. I don't know what's in their minds or hearts, and it's unfair for me to criticise Arie so much. He's just a human like  rest of us. Imperfect. Making human mistakes. I wish Becca, Arie and Lauren the love that they have been seeking all their lives. Just like all of us have. 

We are all jerks at one time or another. Some more than others, lol, and I regret not knowing them, the true nature of what each  them was experiencing, and filling in blanks with my own judgemental opinion. I actually have no clue because I have not lived it, like they have.

The best to all  them.

Edited March 7, 2018 by SassyCat
felt badly for what I wrote.

[Wandering Snark]

1 hour ago, Hpmec said:

If he had any feelings for Lauren at all, he would have approached her before she got all gussied up fully expecting to be proposed to by a guy who kept professing his love.

Just thought I'd add this: was her white dress with the icicles supposed to be a nod to the local alpacas? And how uncomfortable was it to sit down in? [/deepthoughts ]

[Stan39]

10 minutes ago, JudyObscure said:

I think people are forgetting that Lauren and Becca dated Arie at the same time, they have both known him for the same (short) length of time, they both fell in love with him at the same time and they both went to the proposal spot on the same day, both in love and both expecting a proposal at the same time.. 

Now, just a few weeks later,  because Becca got the proposal and Lauren didn't, we're expecting Lauren to act  and feel like a stranger who is only this minute  meeting a man who is "in a relationship," and she has "inserted herself" into something as sacred as a marriage.  She did not do that. 

I find it odd how many people these days put "in a relationship" in the same category as a marriage.  A marriage is a huge, legal, usually religious, commitment far beyond this thing between Arie and Becca which consists of a grand total of about five actual days together.

From the reports I've heard, neither Becca nor the other girls are blaming Lauren and seem ok with her. Still, you think it's ok for a woman to keep talking about pursuing a relationship with a man who has a fiance? I get the timeline, but he did propose to Becca. You'd think she'd have some respect for their relationship. Put another way, if the roles were reversed do you think Lauren would be cool with Arie if he proposed to her but then found out Becca was telling him she'd take him back if Arie dumped her? Lauren would go apeshit. 

 

I just dont think Arie or Lauren think about other people. They're both pretty shallow and selfish. I don't think Lauren is responsible for what happened last night, but I don't think she looks good in all of this. 

[Lamb18]

As always Bekah is the font of worldly wisdom.

Arie and Becca are lucky the alpaca or llamas didn't spit at them. Funny if they did after Becca asked the baby its opinion of Arie and Becca as a couple. After watching these two dates, Ari seems more emotionally into Lauren but feels more safe and secure with Becca.

Lauren's proposal dress is very pretty. I do feel sorry for her. She was dumbfounded, but took it with dignity. Arie says he feels like a monster, Well, yeah, don't tell someone you love her unless you fully intend to commit to her.

[seacliffsal]

So, I just realized that maybe I've been too hard on Arie.  After all, he kept telling us that he had to "follow his heart."  Therefore, all the heart-break that he caused is really okay, because he had no other recourse than to follow his heart (end of heavy sarcasm.)

[Mu Shu]

2 hours ago, Jaclyn88 said:

I think being proposed to on national tv followed by a couple weeks later being dumped for the runner up ON national Tv is a tad more embarrassing than a random girl not receiving a rose .. but to each their own . And why would becca be concerned for Lauren ? It was even playing field . One of them had to go home . 

The final rose combatants know exactly what will happen.  Yay, nay, or I choose me. Becca had no idea what was going on, if we are to believe that was real.  Different things, I agree. 

[Stan39]

2 hours ago, Black Knight said:

You're not an idiot. But the thing is that that supposed "non-answer" in itself confirmed to them that you were interested, though, because otherwise you would have just said, "No, I'm not interested in you." You would only say "I won't answer until you figure out your feelings for the other person first" if you are interested but trying to be decent about it. But they still get the information they were after, that you want them. There really isn't any way around revealing that information in what you say to that question unless you straight up lie that you're not interested when you are.

So I really put the fault on the person who chooses to ask the question, rather than the person who answers it. The person who asks the question is going to get the information they want either way, unless the other person lies. The questioner should not be asking the question at all, and should be figuring out their feelings for the person they're with, and breaking up with that person without arranging a backup person.

I get what you're saying, although I disagree with what happens in reality. In my case, I rarely ended up dating the other woman. Either she would recommit to her relationship or break up after too much time had lapsed and our interest had waned. I think there actually is something to telling someone to go figure out their relationship on their own that actually pushes a person to do just that. With a clear head.

 And it was more than just telling someone you're interested in them. I've dated female versions of Arie, they need to KNOW that they will be stepping into a relationship before breaking things off with someone (or just start cheating). It's more than just saying you like someone or are interested. Arie knew Lauren liked/loved him, he was looking for her to tell him she would forgive him and take him back. I really do think had she told him she can't answer that while he's engaged to another woman it would have made Arie think things through on his own. Maybe it's psychological, but not giving them that reassurance really impacts their decision-making. At least in my experience. 

[rebel2u]

I do think that Arie slow-walking in the house and refusing to leave was, as others have said, the TPTB's way of baiting Becca to get more reaction from her---screaming at him, asking tons of questions as to why, what does she have that I don't have, maybe a slap to the face---to make this The Most Dramatic Season's End in Bachelor History!!! 

I think she was further blindsided because she referenced the conversation Arie had with Lauren but thought it was a way for him to put the relationship to bed (see what I did there?) and instead he used it to confirm that his feelings for Lauren were stronger that they were for her.

I had a relationship that mirrors the relationship of Arie and Lauren.  I was shy, quiet, reserved and he said that, little by little, I was letting him in and he was getting to know me.  I also, in retrospect, think he projected a lot onto me, much as Arie seems to be doing with Lauren.  We eventually got married but flamed out in a matter of months for a myriad of reasons but I think one was because once we got married, the relationship was no longer a fun, exciting puzzle and couldn't sustain the day-to-day, mundane life of marriage.

[dleighg]

2 minutes ago, rebel2u said:

I do think that Arie slow-walking in the house and refusing to leave was, as others have said, the TPTB's way of baiting Becca to get more reaction from her---screaming at him, asking tons of questions as to why, what does she have that I don't have, maybe a slap to the face---to make this The Most Dramatic Season's End in Bachelor History!!! 

If I were her I would go into the bathroom (they can't follow you there, right?), draw a nice hot bath, and stay in there for as long as necessary. Hours, even. Just keep adding more hot water.