Joy and Austin: This One Time At Family Camp

[Sew Sumi]

Duggar insider Marci Dauer apparently said that Joy is due in late February, so it looks like she got knocked up about the same time Jill did, maybe about 10 days in while in Switzerland. 

[Beth64]

22 minutes ago, Gemma Violet said:

So she'd be four months along?  To me, she looks more like seven months.  Maybe it's the angle. :/

I was wearing a belt up until 20 weeks with my first and I was 29. She has to be six months along. 

[Annb67]

25 minutes ago, Beth64 said:

I was wearing a belt up until 20 weeks with my first and I was 29. She has to be six months along. 

My good friend's daughter is 6 months pregnant with twins. She is an average-size girl; She is about the same size as Joy is now

[Temperance]

4 hours ago, SMama said:

OMG I'm an idiot! I didn't recognize her. 

Good! Me neither. She looks different especially when it's small.

Who is the blonde near Joy? And who is Joy's partner?

I didn't recognize Jill either. She looked someone else. 

Edited September 16, 2017 by Temperance
I can clearly tell who they are when the photo is big.

[Sew Sumi]

The blonde near Joy may be Kendra's friend Rachel, one of the few non-Duggar/Caldwells in the wedding party. 

And where's Trace Bates? I get that the pic with Smuggar was family only, but the bridal party one cropped out a LOT of people, including Kendra's mother! 

[LilJen]

And in true Duggar fashion, Joy HAS to hold the bump to show "hey, it's a bump! I'm having a baby because I HAD SEX!"

[madpsych78]

7 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

The blonde near Joy may be Kendra's friend Rachel, one of the few non-Duggar/Caldwells in the wedding party. 

And where's Trace Bates? I get that the pic with Smuggar was family only, but the bridal party one cropped out a LOT of people, including Kendra's mother! 

I thought the blonde near Joy (by James) was Mrs. Caldwell!

[BitterApple]

Either twins or Joy got knocked up before the wedding. She is huge for allegedly being four months along.

[lascuba]

Some women really do just carry huge. I witnessed one unfortunate encounter in an elevator when a perfect stranger asked a very pregnant woman how far along she was, and when told 7 months, asked if she was having triplets! Nope just one baby, and she was mostly all baby, not overweight. 

[laurakaye]

On 9/7/2017 at 1:52 AM, galaxychaser said:

Austin isn't cute at all. 

Any Will & Grace fans in the house?  Remember Grace's boyfriend Josh (played by Corey Parker)?  The guy who was weirdly sensitive and new-agey, who brought Grace healing crystals, soup, and whatnot to ease her menstrual cramps, etc?  THAT'S who Austin reminds me of.  It was driving me NUTS.  Whew, I feel better now.

 

14 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

Looks like they croppped him out on the far right. Apparently, he was partnered with Jill who is last in line. It's an obvious crop; why else would Jill not be facing the bride and groom on the far end of a shot?

WTF, I can't stand this straddling the ethical line crap the Duggars have going on...is Josh in or out?  Family or not?  If they did indeed crop him out of the publicity photos, they have a reason for doing so - they know it will infuriate their fans.  So they're aware of the public's reaction towards him.  But we also all know he's there, so might as well have him right freaking there, front and center, and quit trying to hide him behind children and potted plants.  If they've forgiven him, they should own that and all of the crap that will rain down on them for doing so.  Instead, they're being conspicuously sneaky with him.  It's ridiculous.

And why is Joy holding her dress under her belly like she's posing for a pregnancy photo?  I thought this was supposed to be a wedding photo.

GAHHH these people.

Edited September 16, 2017 by laurakaye

[Jynnan tonnix]

11 hours ago, Annb67 said:

My good friend's daughter is 6 months pregnant with twins. She is an average-size girl; She is about the same size as Joy is now

My daughter is about 3 1/2 months, and although she claims that she's getting a bit of a pooch, I still don't see it.

[xwordfanatik]

33 minutes ago, lascuba said:

Some women really do just carry huge. I witnessed one unfortunate encounter in an elevator when a perfect stranger asked a very pregnant woman how far along she was, and when told 7 months, asked if she was having triplets! Nope just one baby, and she was mostly all baby, not overweight. 

At my former workplace, a really snotty supervisor got pregnant and ballooned up huge.  One of the employees asked her if it was quintuplets, and poor thing (!) burst out crying.  I didn't witness it, but have to admit I laughed when I heard about it.

I hope Joy is just carrying big.  She's going to have too many babies as it is, without multiples.

[lianau]

14 hours ago, Gemma Violet said:

So she'd be four months along?  To me, she looks more like seven months.  Maybe it's the angle. :/

Combination of things , pre wedding starvation and a return to normal eating , pushing out her stomach  and the dress down , actual baby .

[Amers]

I get that all women are different but usually you show later with your first. If she got pregnant on her wedding night, at soonest, shed be about 15 weeks here. The baby is the size of a fist, and the uterus is still below the belly button. You do not, no matter how much you eat, get a ROUND baby bump like that, that early. Not that big. Her wedding seemed different than everyone else's. They had less people, the decorations were literally bales of hay. It is in no way comparable to these other gorgeous weddings. It was thrown together. I am probably wrong, but I think she's at least a month or two farther along than what she's telling. They apparently were unsupervised at times or she wouldn't have said she thought they were alone at the engagement. 

[Gemma Violet]

28 minutes ago, Amers said:

I get that all women are different but usually you show later with your first. If she got pregnant on her wedding night, at soonest, shed be about 15 weeks here. The baby is the size of a fist, and the uterus is still below the belly button. You do not, no matter how much you eat, get a ROUND baby bump like that, that early. Not that big. Her wedding seemed different than everyone else's. They had less people, the decorations were literally bales of hay. It is in no way comparable to these other gorgeous weddings. It was thrown together. I am probably wrong, but I think she's at least a month or two farther along than what she's telling. They apparently were unsupervised at times or she wouldn't have said she thought they were alone at the engagement. 

But all the courting girls are watched like a hawk, with chaperones everywhere they go.  Even if Joy wanted to get some alone time with Austin, I don't see how she could manage it, unless they paid off a chaperone to get lost for a few hours, and even then it's improbable as it's been ingrained in Joy's head (and probably Austin's) that you can't do the deed before the wedding.  

Edited September 16, 2017 by Gemma Violet

[doodlebug]

16 minutes ago, Gemma Violet said:

But all the courting girls are watched like a hawk, with chaperones everywhere they go.  Even if Joy wanted to get some alone time with Austin, I don't see how she could manage it.  Unless they paid off a chaperone to get lost for a few hours, and even then it's improbable as it's been ingrained in Joy's head (and probably Austin's) that you can't do the deed before the wedding.  

Since I was so wrong when I predicted Jinger being pregnant a couple months back, I've stayed out of this one.  However, based on the photos, Joy does appear to be farther along than 15 weeks.  She might be short waisted,  she might have abdominal muscles like jello; but it appears to me that the top of her uterus is above her umbilicus.  I suppose she could be doing something with her posing; pushing out her belly, doing the sway back, wearing tops that make her look bigger, clutching under her belly and pushing things up.  However, no matter how big a baby is going to be at birth, all uteruses are virtually the same size until 20 weeks or so.  They really are.  When someone 'shows' is a function of how they're built and how hard they're trying, but the uterus itself doesn't vary much from woman to woman.  Joy's bump appears to be above her belly button in several photos.  Even with twins, that would not be very likely by 15 weeks.  It may well be that, being a Duggar and having bought into all their BS about pregnancy, she is doing stuff to 'enhance' her figure and look bigger; but I do think it is also possible that she could be further along that we're being led to believe.

A classic milestone for measuring gestational age is that the uterus reaches the umbilicus at 20 weeks and, having delivered thousands of kids, I have personal experience with the truth of this statement.  Now, in order to measure properly, we'd have to lie Joy flat, uncover her belly and let me mash on it to find the top of her uterus; but she looks bigger than that in more than a couple of these photos.

As for not having the 'opportunity', I've been practicing OB for 35 years and have seen and heard it all; where there's a will, there's a way.  Somehow, Josh sneaked into his sisters' bedroom while they slept and molested them and nobody knew a thing about it until he confessed.  If Joy and Austin managed to be alone for a few minutes and got carried away before their wedding night, they wouldn't be the first.

Edited September 16, 2017 by doodlebug

[laurakaye]

11 minutes ago, doodlebug said:

Since I was so wrong when I predicted Jinger being pregnant a couple months back, I've stayed out of this one.  However, based on the photos, Joy does appear to be farther along that 15 weeks.  She might be short waisted,  she might have abdominal muscles like jello; but it appears to me that the top of her uterus is above her umbilicus.  I suppose she could be doing something with her posing; pushing out her belly, doing the sway back, wearing tops that make her look bigger, clutching under her belly and pushing things up.  However, no matter how big a baby is going to be at birth, all uteruses are virtually the same size until 20 weeks or so.  They really are.  When someone 'shows' is a function of how they're built and how hard they're trying, but the uterus itself doesn't vary much from woman to woman.  Joy's bump appears to be above her belly button in several photos.  Even with twins, that would not be very likely by 15 weeks.  It may well be that, being a Duggar and having bought into all their BS about pregnancy, she is doing stuff to 'enhance' her figure and look bigger; but I do think it is also possible that she could be further along that we're being led to believe.

As for not having the 'opportunity', I've been practicing OB for 35 years and have seen and heard it all; where there's a will, there's a way.  Somehow, Josh sneaked into his sisters' bedroom while they slept and molested them and nobody knew a thing about it until he confessed.  If Joy and Austin managed to be alone for a few minutes and got carried away before their wedding night, they wouldn't be the first.

Great post.  And I may be wrong, but while Joy may have been slightly fuller-figured than some of her sisters, wasn't she an active, fit girl pre-pregnancy?  I just can't see how a very young, healthy girl can look 7 months pregnant when she claims to be only 4 1/2 months.

And didn't Joy spend time at Austin's family's ranch prior to getting married?  Wondering if a chaperone would've accompanied her knowing that Austin's family would also be there...and perhaps Austin's family isn't quite so severe about making sure the two were constantly monitored.

I guess we'll have our answer somewhere between November and March.

EDIT: @doodlebug...does her boobage give anything away?  Not to be gross, but she sure looks way top-heavy for 4 months.

Edited September 16, 2017 by laurakaye

[doodlebug]

7 minutes ago, laurakaye said:

 

EDIT: @doodlebug...does her boobage give anything away?  Not to be gross, but she sure looks way top-heavy for 4 months.

Not really, unlike uteri, boobs start out varying widely from woman to woman and they grow at different rates during pregnancy, too.

[DangerousMinds]

1 hour ago, Amers said:

I get that all women are different but usually you show later with your first. If she got pregnant on her wedding night, at soonest, shed be about 15 weeks here. The baby is the size of a fist, and the uterus is still below the belly button. You do not, no matter how much you eat, get a ROUND baby bump like that, that early. Not that big. Her wedding seemed different than everyone else's. They had less people, the decorations were literally bales of hay. It is in no way comparable to these other gorgeous weddings. It was thrown together. I am probably wrong, but I think she's at least a month or two farther along than what she's telling. They apparently were unsupervised at times or she wouldn't have said she thought they were alone at the engagement. 

Which Duggar wedding was gorgeous?

[GeeGolly]

I work with a lot of childbearing women. What I have found with some of the women who show early is that they hid they're pre-pregnancy rounded tummies and once they became pregnant all the hiding stopped. Four ladies I work with are pregnant now, ranging from 5 to 16 weeks. One just started 'showing' at 5 weeks. The one who is 16 weeks, already had a bit of a tummy and keeps saying this is not baby its fat. The two ladies that are around 10 - 12 weeks are wearing their normal clothes (some snugger than others), with the exception of one who wears looser fitting clothes on days she is struggling with constipation and she lovingly caresses her "gas baby".

[Sew Sumi]

7 hours ago, madpsych78 said:

I thought the blonde near Joy (by James) was Mrs. Caldwell!

Mrs. Caldwell wore a V-neck, IIRC. This girl is wearing the high neck the rest if the younger ladies and girls wore (Anna also wore a V-neck). 

[Sew Sumi]

2 hours ago, Amers said:

I get that all women are different but usually you show later with your first. If she got pregnant on her wedding night, at soonest, shed be about 15 weeks here. The baby is the size of a fist, and the uterus is still below the belly button. You do not, no matter how much you eat, get a ROUND baby bump like that, that early. Not that big. Her wedding seemed different than everyone else's. They had less people, the decorations were literally bales of hay. It is in no way comparable to these other gorgeous weddings. It was thrown together. I am probably wrong, but I think she's at least a month or two farther along than what she's telling. They apparently were unsupervised at times or she wouldn't have said she thought they were alone at the engagement. 

Don't forget date of last period. That adds two more weeks. If she got knocked up in her wedding night, she'd be 17w1d today. However, a Duggars intimate apparently spilled that she's due in late February, meaning she got pregnant about two weeks after the wedding and actually making her around 15 weeks. .

I really don't want to go back to Jill's Instagram to compare bumps, but someone else feel free. Jill carried large on a taller frame, so a comparison would be interesting. 

[Fuzzysox]

Doodlebug, what are your thoughts on her having multiples like triplets?

[madpsych78]

23 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

Mrs. Caldwell wore a V-neck, IIRC. This girl is wearing the high neck the rest if the younger ladies and girls wore (Anna also wore a V-neck). 

Here's a closer picture, and it doesn't look like Mrs. Caldwell has a V-neck, although I just noticed that it does appear that Jinger's dress has a somewhat different texture than Mrs. Caldwell or Lauren's dresses.

16 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

Don't forget date of last period. That adds two more weeks. If she got knocked up in her wedding night, she'd be 17w1d today. However, a Duggars intimate apparently spilled that she's due in late February, meaning she got pregnant about two weeks after the wedding and actually making her around 15 weeks. .

I really don't want to go back to Jill's Instagram to compare bumps, but someone else feel free. Jill carried large on a taller frame, so a comparison would be interesting. 

Then Joy would be roughly 4 months along. 

In comparison, Jessa at that same point (with Spurgeon, at 16 weeks):

 

I couldn't find one of Jill at 16 weeks, but here is Jill at 19 weeks with Israel, so hypothetically further along than Joy is now, but looks to be about the same size as Joy IMO:

[DangerousMinds]

Are they afraid the babies are going to fall out?

[Sew Sumi]

We can't tell how much Joy is arching her back since it's hidden, but I suspect a lot. Even so, she looks bigger than Jessa, who is also arching in that shot. 

[McManda]

54 minutes ago, DangerousMinds said:

Are they afraid the babies are going to fall out?

No, no, they have to frame the bump so people know they're pregnant. Can't have people believe they're just fat, don't cha know.

[doodlebug]

5 hours ago, Fuzzysox said:

Doodlebug, what are your thoughts on her having multiples like triplets?

Triplets occur something like 1:10000 births wen the mom hasn't taken fertility drugs.  Not very likely.

twins occur naturally about one out of a hundred births.  Even if a woman has .a strong family history for twins, there's about a 95% chance it won't happen.

in other words, I think it's very unlikely that she is carrying multiples 

[Annb67]

So it's a pretty solid statement Joy is not at 15 weeks? She practically looks 7-8 months

[lascuba]

Where there's a will (to fuck), there's a way. Though I do doubt they had sex before marriage, the main reason I don't think Joy is further along than her wedding date implies is that a pre-wedding conception is something both their families would milk for anti-choice points. They made a mistake, but remember, they never said they were perfect! And now they'll do the godly thing and be honest and get married and have the baby. 

Plus, it's such a stupid thing for them to lie about. She's barely sentient but even Joy knows the public is going to be on them about this. Lie--even if just by omission--about how far along she is, and people are going to snigger about the 10 pound 34 weeker. They could put off announcing the birth--the Duggars are good at keeping secrets when they really want to--and never state the birthdate, but how long can they pull that off? 

[mynextmistake]

On 9/4/2017 at 4:50 PM, Catfin said:

How are they going to explain away a group B strep death in a newborn that could have been prevented by a bag of abx being hung?  Or a death in one of their cash cows...er...daughters when they try to VBAC their way to a ruptured uterus?  This is all on JB and Michelle's heads. I'm trying to figure out which of them is the bigger fucknut. Which is driving the crazy-train?

I remember when Jill did the people mag interview after Izzy was born, she said that one of the things they did when she went into labor at home was hang antibiotics because she had tested positive for strep B. That means a) someone had to test her and b) someone had to prescribe them. My guess is that she had prenatal care with Izzy simply because Derrick was still employed by an actual business and they had insurance. I honestly think for most of these girls it's not a holiness or vanity issue, it's a financial one. I doubt Jill (now), Jessa or Joy are insured. 

[MsJamieDornan]

1 hour ago, lascuba said:

They could put off announcing the birth--the Duggars are good at keeping secrets when they really want to--and never state the birthdate, but how long can they pull that off? 

It's a home birth. Who would really know ?

[Temperance]

13 hours ago, MsJamieDornan said:

It's a home birth. Who would really know ?

If possible. Her sisters haven't always able to do that. 

Edited September 17, 2017 by Temperance

[RedheadZombie]

On September 15, 2017 at 9:24 PM, madpsych78 said:

Check out Joy (the one in glasses).

How is Jana ever going to meet someone when they constantly pair her up with her twin brother?

[Mollie]

Joy's wedding was May 26.  This picture was taken 14 weeks later on September 8.

 

[Fuzzysox]

1 hour ago, Mollie said:

Joy's wedding was May 26.  This picture was taken 14 weeks later on September 8.

 

Sadly they hold out their belly because it's their crowning glory to be making a baby for Jesus' army of believers.

[Tabbygirl521]

Just arching your back wouldn't create a large well-defined bump you can put your hand under, would it?? I have a tummy and when I arch my back, I definitely look bigger, but it doesn't look like a baby bump. If I go to hold it up, it looks like what it is - loose skin and fat, not a bump. I dunno - I have never had a three-month pregnancy bump so I am just talking out my rear end  

[doodlebug]

2 minutes ago, Tabbygirl521 said:

Just arching your back wouldn't create a large well-defined bump you can put your hand under, would it?? I have a tummy and when I arch my back, I definitely look bigger, but it doesn't look like a baby bump. If I go to hold it up, it looks like what it is - loose skin and fat, not a bump. I dunno - I have never had a three-month pregnancy bump so I am just talking out my rear end  

I suppose it is possible that Joy is swallowing a lot of air to 'poof' out her intestines and make her bump look bigger, I've seen a couple women with pseudocyesis (psychiatric condition where a nonpregnant woman thinks she is) who did this and looked pretty pregnant until you mashed on their belly and realized it was just a belly and not a uterus.

Joy was never overweight and, in fact, was as thin as she'd ever been at the time of her wedding.  I don't see how she could go from a previously flat abdomen to this in just 15 weeks.  She is short waisted and big boobed, which is going to make her look bigger than a taller, flat chested woman; but that picture makes it look like the top of her uterus is just below her boobs and well above her waistline and that is just not possible.

[Scarlett45]

@doodlebug you think she might be "padding" her stomach to make it look rounder, similarly to how women wear undergarments to enhance their buttocks and hip shape? Given these Duggars I wouldn't put it past her. 

[Darknight]

Her wedding was bumped up right? 

[dargosmydaddy]

4 minutes ago, Darknight said:

Her wedding was bumped up right? 

Her wedding was bumped up from the initial registry date given, but that date (I believe it was Joy's birthday) was supposedly given just to throw off paparazzi, etc. Given that most Duggar courtships are fairly short, the consensus seems to be that they got married when they intended to, and the date was not actually moved up.

[lascuba]

10 hours ago, MsJamieDornan said:

It's a home birth. Who would really know ?

Which is how, if they had to, they'd try to pull if off as long as possible, but they have to know that it's not going to last. They won't outright lie about the birth date, they'd just avoid announcing it, which is going to have people all over Duggar sm harping on it. They'd delay pictures of the baby by however long they have to so s/he doesn't look older than they should, but eventually the eagle eyes of Duggar haterdom is going to notice that the #BabyForsyth6months picture was taken on the same day as a picture of the TTH that a friend of there's posted 2 months before. They can ignore internet speculation but when the tabloids all start reporting on it they're going feel the need to respond. 

I could be giving them way too much credit for thinking ahead, and if Joy did get pregnant on the wrong side of the wedding, she and Austin and their families might think they could pull off not looking like massive hypocrites by being sly with the timing of announcements and pictures. Or they just might be perfectly forthright with the birthdate and such without explaining anything and letting sm and the tabloids run wild with speculation, which I would almost respect. But for now, I'm going with Joy getting pregnant immediately, on top of gorging on food after all the dieting leading up to the wedding. Of course, I maintain the right to change my mind at any time. 

[dargosmydaddy]

And of course there's still the possibility of multiples...

You know Michelle and Jessa would both have aneurysms if Joy had triplets... hell, Jessa would even if it was twins. Unless they both have twins. That would grab some headlines...

(I'm mostly joking. I think.) 

[andromeda331]

12 minutes ago, dargosmydaddy said:

And of course there's still the possibility of multiples...

You know Michelle and Jessa would both have aneurysms if Joy had triplets... hell, Jessa would even if it was twins. Unless they both have twins. That would grab some headlines...

(I'm mostly joking. I think.) 

Plus Jessa would probably lose a couple of her helpers as some of the sistermoms get reassigned to Joy. I doubt that would make her happy either.

[Churchhoney]

2 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

@doodlebug you think she might be "padding" her stomach to make it look rounder, similarly to how women wear undergarments to enhance their buttocks and hip shape? Given these Duggars I wouldn't put it past her. 

Maybe she nabbed one of those tie-on pregnancy pillows that designers put on their dress forms when she was at the bridal shoppe. 

[BunnyBlueBrown]

I can easily have a full rounded tummy after I eat...mixed in with clothing type and my lordosis. I have been escorted in front of many lines 

[Temperance]

8 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

How is Jana ever going to meet someone when they constantly pair her up with her twin brother?

Considering almost everyone in the picture is her sibling they could hardly pair her with somebody who's not. 

4 hours ago, doodlebug said:

Joy was never overweight and, in fact, was as thin as she'd ever been at the time of her wedding.  I don't see how she could go from a previously flat abdomen to this in just 15 weeks.  

I don't think her stomach was flat. I've never had a completely flat stomach. It's genetic and something I would to work hard to get rid of.  I don't think the Duggar girls would have much in the way of abs. It would require possibly defrauding exercises, and awareness of a party of their body they're told it's sinful to show. (bikini)   She also was heavier before her enforced diet.  

I have no idea when she's due. My biggest question is why are they not releasing more information and trying to end the rumors. 

Edited September 17, 2017 by Temperance

[Christina87]

Put me in the camp who thinks she's way more pregnant than she said. Honestly, I doubt the Forsyths monitored them as much, and only one of them wouldn't have had to be willing to break the rules: Austin. 

Austin: "joy, dad's gone. I can't stand it anymore! You wanna have sex?" (Hopefully he would have asked more delicately than that)

joy: "we can have it before marriage? I thought that was wrong."

austin: "I prayed about it, and I feel the Lord is leading us in this direction."

joy: "ok, I'm in!!!"

I could also see them gradually getting to that point while Pa Forsyth went off to get materials. Maybe Joy didn't want the wedding kiss to be awkward, so they practiced kissing just for that reason. Then they liked it, reasoned they had already done it, and kissed while nobody was around. Then one night things went further...and then again the next night. Things happen!

[lascuba]

25 minutes ago, Temperance said:

Considering almost everyone in the picture is her sibling they could hardly pair her with somebody who's not. 

I don't think her stomach was flat. I've never had a completely flat stomach. It's genetic and something I would to work hard to get rid of.  I don't think the Duggar girls would have much in the way of abs. It would require possibly defrauding exercises, and awareness of a party of their body they're told it's sinful to show. (bikini)   She also was heavier before her enforced diet.  

I have no idea when she's due. My biggest question is why are they not releasing more information and trying to end the rumors. 

Because no publicity is bad publicity, and assuming the rumors are false, they know time will tell so there's no need to say anything now. 

[bythelake]

I am so saddened as each girl gets pregnant, because it seems that their whole purpose in life is being a brood mare and nothing else. What have these poor girls done in their lives besides have babies?  They are under-educated, they don't work, they don't volunteer and worst of all is they don't seem to mind this type of existence. They seem to have no curiosity about the outside world. Joy and Jinger are at least out of the family compound and hopefully not dependent on JB, but Jill, Jessa,Jana as well as most of the boys either work for their father or don't work at all.  The old saying is you give your children wings to fly.  What a disservice these parents have done to their children.