S17.E11: New York City of Dreams

[Thumper]

Brandon was a contestant once?

I have no memory like the rest of you!

[CraftyHazel]

8 minutes ago, Thumper said:

Brandon was a contestant once?

I have no memory like the rest of you!

Not Brandon Maxwell, a different Brandon.  And there was a female in that finale, which was won by Kentaro.

Irina’s winning season also had an all-female final three.

[QuantumMechanic]

12 hours ago, hula-la said:

Heck, I'm Canadian, and we use the metric system, but I could quickly tell you that there are 48" in 4 yards.

There are actually 144" in 4 yards 🙂

[hula-la]

9 minutes ago, QuantumMechanic said:

There are actually 144" in 4 yards 🙂

My bad. I’m thinking inches in a foot, not a yard. This is why I like metric.  

[30 Helens]

7 hours ago, Day2Day said:

Oh, how I wish... and was actually, angrily talking to my TV ... that Nina would have pursued the pink/black issue with Tessa. She knew Tessa had lied and should have stated that the judges had seen that interview she had with her "client".  

Had they seen it, though? I’ve often wondered if the judges had any advance knowledge of how the garments came to be, aside from seeing them on the runway.

I really like the Real Woman challenges, but somebody always gets screwed and I always feel bad for that woman (in this case, 2 women). I guess it’s Jamal’s inexperience, but he should have been able to gently guide his client away from the prom cliches into something more sophisticated. All she wanted was a pretty dress that made her look good—if you can’t do that, you’re basically worthless as a designer.

And Tessa...grrr. I really didn’t understand her issue with using pink. Color doesn’t dictate the design. All she had to do was design a lovely black dress, but just make it with pink fabric. How hard is that?

Like many of you, I thought there should have been a double elimination. But Tessa should have gone over Jamal. He at least wanted to fulfill the challenge, while she pushed against it as hard as she could.

I can’t imagine climbing up and down all those stairs at Christian’s place every day. All I could think was, I hope there’s an elevator tucked away somewhere, because that store does not look ADA friendly!

[Samwise979]

I can't believe half (HALF!!) the designers think they can just design what they want and the people that like it will buy it and the people that don't won't and they don't need to compromise or evolve to reach a broader audience or please a specific client. Good luck with those 3 whole people that want a plz die hat or a jacket that looks like a duvet. 

I liked Garo's but I think Bishmi's was better and would have had him and Sebastian as top two instead. With Sebastian as the winner of course. 

So, throughout the whole competition Tessa has said unfinished hems are her thing and she does it on purpose because she likes the look. Brandon finally asks her point blank if the unfinished hems are a purposeful thing and finally she admits it's just due to not enough time. 

[nb360]

Isn’t it interesting that Karlie chose this challenge to wear “a short pink dress” to the runway?

Hmmmm...

[ElectricBoogaloo]

15 hours ago, HurricaneVal said:

From the beginning Tessa was the designer they showed roaming the workroom, offering mentor-ish criticisms to the other designers about their designs.  They also used her talking head sessions to critique her fellow designers work.  I just thought she was being used as the narrator of the season.  That she was a strong woman with a strong opinion, and there's nothing wrong with that.   No.  She's just that person.  You know, the hypercritical one who can't keep their mouth shut, has no filter, and thinks they're the most expert and best at whatever is at hand.

Yup. I got really annoyed this week when she wandered over to look at Sebastian's dress and said, "It's pretty, but it's not fashion."

11 hours ago, oceanview said:

I saw that coming when the client said she liked PINK.    Then client went on to mention gray and black and of Tessa zoned in on that.  God Forbid, Tessa used a "color" other than black.   And when she started spieling that she did not use black all the time, I wanted to choke her.  The pictures proved it and she weaseled around her choices by saying I WORE black all season.

10 hours ago, caitmcg said:

It was actually Tessa who brought up gray and black, telling her client she usually designed in those colors only, in response to the client saying pink was her favorite color. Then the client told Tessa she was okay with gray and black, but that there were certain dark colors she didn't like, which Tessa then used to excuse the lack of color to the judges (after her client said on the runway that she loved pink).

Tessa consulting with her client:

Maria: I'm very girlie. Pink is my favorite color.
Tessa: My aesthetic as a designer is I typically design in blacks and greys.
Maria: ...I'm okay with grey and black.

On the runway:

Tessa: When we met and we discussed her dream dress, she didn't really have anything specific in mind except that she said she likes black and charcoal. She does not like dark blue, she does not like dark green, she does not like red, she does not like burgundy, she does not like purple.
Nina: But she said she liked pink.
Me: [cackling]

10 hours ago, meep.meep said:

I don't know a single adult woman whose favorite color is pink.  And they managed to corral three or four women for this one challenge whose favorite color is pink?

My 88 year old grandmother's favorite color is bright deep pink! Two women I know loved fuchsia pink so much (the bright kind, not the color that Hester chose for her client's dress) that they used it as their wedding color and had their bridesmaids wear fuchsia dresses. It was close to this color that Jessica Alba wore:

9 hours ago, jackjill89 said:

How many times has Jamall had to give up making sleeves for his garment because he ran out of time?

I think he really does have a time management problem, but I am also beginning to think that he just doesn't know how to set sleeves properly and that's why he is avoiding it.

[jacksgirl]

No doubt in my mind that producers had these real women fill out lengthy questionnaires re color preference,  styles, likes and dislikes,  etc. and then pair them with the designer. No button bag this time. Tessa was a setup, and we got the fun. I, too wanted a double elimination.

[Emkat]

I have such a crush on Bishme. 😍🤗

[sasha206]

How boring would you be as a designer if your aesthetic is to only design in grays and black?  

Pink isn't my favorite color, but I have clothing that is pink.  There are so many different hues of pink, like any color, that to act as though it's impossible to design with this color just shows their limitation as a designer.

[ML89]

8 hours ago, 30 Helens said:

And Tessa...grrr. I really didn’t understand her issue with using pink. Color doesn’t dictate the design. All she had to do was design a lovely black dress, but just make it with pink fabric. How hard is that?

Exactly. Minimalist doesn't have to mean black and charcoal, it can mean one color. That dress in pink would have been fine. Well, okay, that belt was still a crime against fashion. I was lukewarm towards Tessa but I definitely left that train - she just rode roughshod over that woman.

Jamall's dress was just hard down ugly. It didn't fit his poor client, it was the wrong fabric, it was a terrible color. He went home because he has been coasting along as much as Tessa. 

Hester's was badly made too, although she was trying. But I don't see any indication that anything she's made on the show is punk, unless you want to say making an ill fitting swimsuit is punk.

Loved Sebastian's. I think it's funny that Dmitry can make peasant dresses with flounces from the 70s/50s and be considered on trend but Sebastian makes that pretty dress the client loves and it's retro. 

Garo's client loved that dress and he was great with her, and Bishme with the teacher was terrific too - although I was baffled by the math problem since I could swear the original example was 1 bat and 1 ball, not 1 bat and 2 balls. 

[hoodooznoodooz]

Have they ever given a Real Person Client the dress/outfit she requested? Bishme, Garo and Sebastian made their clients so happy, I like to think they were able to wear the dresses to an actual party/event. 

I suppose the dresses remain the property of Bravo or whichever production company is responsible for PR. 

Edited May 25, 2019 by hoodooznoodooz

[hoodooznoodooz]

14 minutes ago, ML89 said:

Garo's client loved that dress and he was great with her, and Bishme with the teacher was terrific too - although I was baffled by the math problem since I could swear the original example was 1 bat and 1 ball, not 1 bat and 2 balls. 

I think it was one bat, one ball. Total was $1.10. Bat cost one dollar more than the ball.

ball $.05

bat $1.05

—————

total  $1.10

[ML89]

19 minutes ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

I think it was one bat, one ball. Total was $1.10. Bat cost one dollar more than the ball.

ball $.05

bat $1.05

—————

total  $1.10

AHHHHH! Okay, THAT makes sense! <says the sheepish non math person> Now I get it. Sigh. 

[chitowngirl]

If Tessa spent less time walking around critiquing everyone, maybe she’d have time to finish her hems! 😁

[TVbitch]

FINALLY. But I still think they don't want Sabastian to win. 

I think Jamall was the correct auf. When he is not using his volumizing draped comforter technique (which I hated anyway), this is the result. 

I hope Tessa can get over herself and have some kind of breakthrough, cuz she is talented.  

[Josette]

1 hour ago, ML89 said:

Bishme with the teacher was terrific too - although I was baffled by the math problem since I could swear the original example was 1 bat and 1 ball, not 1 bat and 2 balls. 

 That was the original problem we heard, but when Bishme was retelling it he kept saying a bat and two balls. 

[Pepper Mostly]

13 hours ago, WaltersHair said:

Re: the pink. Hasn't Nina said in seasons past that she hates that color? I remember her chastising someone over the very color that went down that runway. Maybe the wrestling challenge (again from Christian's season).

She loved the "millennial pink" Brandon Kee was using in season 16.

The Color of Death on Project Runway is that washed out, dusty rose. I always scream when someone picks it. 

There's pink and there's pink. Pink doesn't mean Barbie pink. Tessa could have tried to work with pink and black, or a super pale pink. She just didn't want to. Everyone knows that "make a pretty dress" is sure to come up at least once as a challenge! fine if its not your wheelhouse, but make an effort.

[Maya S]

2 hours ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

Have they ever given a Real Person Client the dress/outfit she requested? Bishme, Garo and Sebastian made their clients so happy, I like to think they were able to wear the dresses to an actual party/event. 

I suppose the dresses remain the property of Bravo or whichever production company is responsible for PR. 

I remember in season 12, Justin had a client who was Mormon and wanted to be comfortable and modest.  Justin gave her a dress that was just that and had her sign her name so he could stitch her signature on the dress to make it unique.  Helen, the winner of that challenge, gave a whole Princess Diaries makeover to her client and made her a red carpet dress.  

There was also season 10 where Fabio's client was a tomboy who wasn't fond of dresses because she didn't want to be feminized.  Fabio made a nice dress that wasn't typically girly and it was also professional for her job.  

[Token]

During judging, how was Hester (along with Bishme) immediately deemed to be safe?  She made an awful pink monstrosity that was basically the same as the swimsuit she made a while back, but with a bit more material at the bottom.  It was terrible.

I used to try and defend Tessa but not anymore.  She is just an awful person and completely clueless about how she comes across.  Her levels of arrogance and being self-absorbed are just off the charts.  And she has no talent to back that up.  She has no insight into how many excuses she comes out with constantly and loves to throw others under the bus.  Nothing is ever her fault or responsibility.

Jamal.… how do you manage to make a quite beautiful gown out of a duvet one week, then you can't make a simple dress the next?  He seemed to have a client who was pretty open and laid back, yet he couldn't make anything.  Odd.  He really deserved to go, for making that young woman so uncomfortable.

Garo - Meh.  He did what he usually does.  I'm glad he makes his clients so happy.  But his designs, though well made, do nothing for me.

Sebastian - I really liked his one.  His client looked so happy.  I didn't like some of the comments made by the judges about the client or the dress, I thought they were kind of snotty and rude.  It was a cute, well made dress that made the client happy.

BIshme - I really thought this dress should have won.  I vaguely remember a judge having a problem with the colour, but I loved the colour.  And I loved the design.  

[nb360]

Flashback: Hester & Bishme return to the room after Hester wins the “Blame it on Rio” Challenge...

*

Bishme: Hester won!

Tessa (flatly): We love you but we did not love that look.

Bishme (annoyed): Why can’t you just congratulate her?

Tessa: I did! That ‘s just what I did!

*

This woman has serious issues.

[leocadia]

3 hours ago, ML89 said:

Hester's was badly made too, although she was trying. But I don't see any indication that anything she's made on the show is punk, unless you want to say making an ill fitting swimsuit is punk.

I think Hester has confused having a "punk" aesthetic with having a "Punky Brewster"aesthetic.

[caitmcg]

44 minutes ago, Token said:

During judging, how was Hester (along with Bishme) immediately deemed to be safe?  She made an awful pink monstrosity that was basically the same as the swimsuit she made a while back, but with a bit more material at the bottom.  It was terrible.

Because her dress was clearly the least worst of the worst. The judges declared her safe when talking amongst themselves, but let her know she was in the bottom more than once before sending her off the runway as safe. 

[kirklandia]

Assuming that the clients get to keep the dresses -  someone needs to make Dream Dresses for the ones who, whether it was bad luck or producer shenanigans,  drew the short straw and ended up in the bottom looks.  Maybe Christian could invite them to his atelier...

[VintageJ]

1 hour ago, Token said:

BIshme - I really thought this dress should have won.  I vaguely remember a judge having a problem with the colour, but I loved the colour.  And I loved the design.  

i loved Bishme’s dress and thought it should have won but am okay with Sebastian winning.  And that blue was pretty (and i’m not a blue person). it was much better than the light or sky blue the client wanted. that would have washed her out.  Bishme’s color looked great against her skin. 

Edited May 25, 2019 by VintageJ
spelling

[Ashforth]

I think Jamal knew that he couldn't wrap his client in a gigantic puffy red comforter, so he tried to emulate Garo's expert corsetry. Didn't they show him asking Garo about how to use boning to keep the top of the dress from falling down? My sense is that he tried, but his skill set just isn't there. As at least one other poster has said, it appears that he doesn't know how to make sleeves, so he didn't even try - but why not try to make a nice wide strap to help the look and the comfort of his client? Along with some kind of a wrap around her upper arms? The wrap could have been a subdued version of his signature puff. 

I thought his fabric looked pink on the runway, but in the photos on the Bravo website, it does look red.

[hoodooznoodooz]

I hope it’s okay to say that I think Bishme is beautiful, on the inside and the outside. 

And Sebastian is just wonderful. I love the way he responded to Tessa saying her only goal was to please Brandon. He is so gracious. 

[Tabbygirl521]

I just have to say I am really enjoying Christian as the mentor, but then I got a kick out of him during his season also. He could be a bitch but he made me laugh a lot. He did have that major fail on his “real woman” challenge but he is so very talented. I’m glad he’s had the chance to prove that to the world, and that he has the opportunity to impart some knowledge to the contestants. 

[Token]

1 hour ago, caitmcg said:

Because her dress was clearly the least worst of the worst. The judges declared her safe when talking amongst themselves, but let her know she was in the bottom more than once before sending her off the runway as safe. 

No, it clearly wasn't.

[Ms Blue Jay]

5 hours ago, ML89 said:

Loved Sebastian's. I think it's funny that Dmitry can make peasant dresses with flounces from the 70s/50s and be considered on trend but Sebastian makes that pretty dress the client loves and it's retro. 

Oh my god, you're reading my mind.  

5 hours ago, sasha206 said:

Pink isn't my favorite color, but I have clothing that is pink.  There are so many different hues of pink, like any color, that to act as though it's impossible to design with this color just shows their limitation as a designer.

I notice whenever I wear pink, a man compliments me.  Some men just really like the femininity, I think.  I'm a woman who prefers stereotypically boyish colours, but when I dress girlier, men notice!

[Ms Blue Jay]

4 hours ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

I think it was one bat, one ball. Total was $1.10. Bat cost one dollar more than the ball.

ball $.05

bat $1.05

—————

total  $1.10

It took you writing it out like this for me to understand it.

[hoodooznoodooz]

28 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

It took you writing it out like this for me to understand it.

I think the only reason we don’t understand it more quickly is because we’re all more used to straightforward math: Sally spent $1.10 on a new bat and ball. The bat cost $1.05. How much did the ball cost?

[carrps]

2 hours ago, caitmcg said:

Because her dress was clearly the least worst of the worst. The judges declared her safe when talking amongst themselves, but let her know she was in the bottom more than once before sending her off the runway as safe. 

1 hour ago, Token said:

No, it clearly wasn't.

As she said she was the best of the worst. 

[Token]

31 minutes ago, carrps said:

As she said she was the best of the worst. 

And I disagree.  She was not the best of the worst.

[dleighg]

1 hour ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

I think the only reason we don’t understand it more quickly is because we’re all more used to straightforward math: Sally spent $1.10 on a new bat and ball. The bat cost $1.05. How much did the ball cost?

The OCD people among us might write it as an algebra problem. But the more practical way is to "try something" and then iterate. I think that's they way the teacher was trying to get the kids to think, since most of us out in real life don't write down algebra problems. (I'm an engineer so I tend toward the OCD way, though I've seen this problem before so didn't need to). 

[Ashforth]

25 minutes ago, Token said:

And I disagree.  She was not the best of the worst.

My opinions are that Hester's garment was bad with poor construction but she tried to please her client, Tessa's was bad with poor construction but the top was pretty (I think she' done it before?) and she disregarded her client's desires and then lied about it, and Jamall's was so terribly constructed that it looked like it was going to fall off as his client walked the runway and it was ugly and he also disregarded what his client wanted - sleeves. So I would place them as bad, worse, and worst.

But we're talking about opinions, not facts, so I'm not right and @Token or anyone else who disagrees isn't wrong. We simply have different opinions. It's all good.

[Pallida]

One additional thing about Tessa’s is that her client was very clear about not wanting something that would make her look shorter (and thus why she wanted a short dress). I think a good designer should know what shapes will work, and I thought Tessa’s garment failed miserably. It made her torso look stumpy. Looking at pics on Tom and Lorenzo, she looks like there’s no space between breast and waist and then waist and legs. I’m not good at describing it, but I don’t find it flattering, and I’m sure a different shape would have worked infinitely better. 

[jackjill89]

Designers who don't understand basic sewing, fabrics, etc. aren't going to do well on this show. They aren't really going to be good designers in general because they don't understand how it all comes together. I feel like Tessa, Jamall and Hester are these kind of designers. They have their niches but they haven't studied basic technique. Kind of like a chef who hasn't taken basic cooking technique classes. You might be good in your wheelhouse, but once you get out of it, you can't function. 

Garo has a wheelhouse, but he's also a heck of a technician. 

Edited May 25, 2019 by jackjill89

[Fukui San]

I generally “like” Tessa in that I find her antics amusing on my screen. Wouldn’t want to work with her in any capacity. But the combination of a minimalist, clean aesthetic and “I like unfinished hems” is the damnedest thing. I can’t even equate it to anything else. She’s made of cognitive dissonance  

If we could name her thread, I’d suggest “Black is the New Black”. 

[Ashforth]

3 minutes ago, Fukui San said:

I generally “like” Tessa in that I find her antics amusing on my screen. Wouldn’t want to work with her in any capacity. But the combination of a minimalist, clean aesthetic and “I like unfinished hems” is the damnedest thing. I can’t even equate it to anything else. She’s made of cognitive dissonance  

If we could name her thread, I’d suggest “Black is the New Black”. 

Or maybe "Unhemged" (like unhinged?). Or the brilliant, imo, moniker that someone used in a different episode thread, "No Hem Tessa"!

[Diane Mars]

18 minutes ago, Ashforth said:

Or maybe "Unhemged" (like unhinged?). Or the brilliant, imo, moniker that someone used in a different episode thread, "No Hem Tessa"!

Or : "Who needs a hem ?"

[violet and green]

14 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

It was close to this color that Jessica Alba wore:

They used to call that color Shocking Pink.

[violet and green]

3 hours ago, Ashforth said:

Or maybe "Unhemged" (like unhinged?). Or the brilliant, imo, moniker that someone used in a different episode thread, "No Hem Tessa"!

That was me. *bows modestly*

[Maya S]

4 hours ago, Ashforth said:

Or maybe "Unhemged" (like unhinged?). Or the brilliant, imo, moniker that someone used in a different episode thread, "No Hem Tessa"!

NO SEWN HEMS EVER!

[Ashforth]

1 hour ago, violet and green said:

That was me. *bows modestly*

[Beden]

Quote

They used to call that color Shocking Pink.

Schiaparelli coined that phrase back in the day and was the one who made it popular back in the 30's. My mother always referred to that shade as 'whorehouse pink'. But that was my mother.....

[bitchin camaro]

I really take issue with the judges assertion that Jamal listens and learns while Tessa does not. Tessa defends (read: gets defensive) when she probably shouldn’t. Jamal stands there with a blank look on his face, then does exactly what he wants to next time showing absolutely no evidence that any of it sunk in. Neither one listens, but the one who keeps his mouth shut gets a better reaction. They both suck.

I loved Sebastian again this week. Even with the win, he got dinged for listening to his client. So I guess they’re supposed to listen, but not TOO much. But even these biased judges had to admit he made something impeccable that was perfect for the client this time. 

I still like Garo too. He clearly knows how to dress a woman’s figure and I bet he’s wonderful to work with, even if his style isn’t your thing. He’s a pro. 

[pasdetrois]

Tessa should move to corporate America. She would thrive there.

Most of these designers are one-trick ponies, not true designers. Only Hester and Sebastian know how to design and tailor. Garo is experienced, but we keep seeing that corset and those weird shoulders.

The over-the-top flattery of the larger women felt a bit patronizing. But I'll take that over the barely-restrained disgust we've seen in some designers on this show.

[sasha206]

12 hours ago, LucindaWalsh said:

I really hope that Jamall's lady got her dream dress. She was so beautiful and could have rocked a dress that enhanced her instead of that ridiculousness that that sad sack brat Jamall put on her. She was so darn gracious when the judges asked about her liking it. She said she did like it and just wanted to not fall out of it. I do hope the show has plans for her (that would have come about after editing the show together I guess, and seeing how horribly she was treated by Jamall) because I noticed how she was highlighted during the make up scenes and also featured in the Maybelline ad. I think she touched a lot of people on the show.  I thought from the first she was beautiful but was like Daaaamn! she's strikingly model beautiful when the makeup was put on her. And it pisses me off more remembering that now, that Jamall didn't elevate her with her dress. 

OMG yes!  She was absolutely gorgeous!  Would be cool if one of the clothing companies, particularly a plus size one, picked her up for modeling.