Jessa, Ben and Their Brood: Making a (Diaper) Mountain out of a Mold House

[GeeGolly]

I just watched Alyssa Bates' recent YouTube video. Two things that stood out to me involved SM and money. Alyssa claims they are not super wealthy, but alluded to filming - the show & YouTube, as significant sources of income, although they're not on the show as much.

Both Alyssa and John said they dedicate a lot of time to "filming" for SM and YouTube and spend every Saturday "filming". I've only seen a couple of their YouTube videos, so I'm not sure what they film all day and they never mentioned editing.

But anyway, the reason I'm posting this in the Seewald thread, it seems there is money to be made YouTubing, but it also sounds like it takes time and effort. I'm not sure Jessa or Ben have what it takes to make it work, but then again, what other options do they realistically - in their world, have?

John basically works a 9 - 5, M - F and then spends Saturdays "filming" and Sundays churching. Carlin has mentioned that her husband spends a lot of time editing YouTube and SM stuff during the evenings after work.

If Ben is not on board, it seems like Jessa will have a lot of work to do, in addition to the four kids because it appears YouTube is a little more work than a side hustle. Between groceries, plants and toys, Jessa likely spent $200 - $300 during her Walmart visits. They're going to need some type of real income.

[Nysha]

Being a SM influencer is like any other job, if you want to be successful you have to work hard. You also have to find your niche and build on that.

It's okay if Jessa wants to 'SAH christian mom who homeschools, but she has to do a better job of filming her stories. She needs to start with her story and write out the scene in a way that is pleasing to her viewers. Like trying to show that she's giving Spurgeon a quality education would be by filming him sitting at the table or at a desk, away from the other kids, doing more than just mindless paperwork using dollar store workbooks. She claimed she was using the Charlotte Mason homeschooling method, so she needs to show what that means. 

[GeeGolly]

15 minutes ago, Nysha said:

Being a SM influencer is like any other job, if you want to be successful you have to work hard. You also have to find your niche and build on that.

It's okay if Jessa wants to 'SAH christian mom who homeschools, but she has to do a better job of filming her stories. She needs to start with her story and write out the scene in a way that is pleasing to her viewers. Like trying to show that she's giving Spurgeon a quality education would be by filming him sitting at the table or at a desk, away from the other kids, doing more than just mindless paperwork using dollar store workbooks. She claimed she was using the Charlotte Mason homeschooling method, so she needs to show what that means. 

Just those few tasks would be a lot for Jessa. First she'll have to realize that the way she homeschools Spurge is not ideal. She'll also have to know that a "whole person" is more than religion and reading, writing and arithmetic. Haphazard chaos is not usually appealing to viewers, but I'm not sure Jessa knows that's how they live, or knows its not appealing to others. IMO, Jessa has a lot to overcome, to make a real go at it.

[ginger90]

Most videos I watch on YouTube involve animals. I find the content to be more enjoyable than most with people.

[Minivanessa]

6 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

But anyway, the reason I'm posting this in the Seewald thread, it seems there is money to be made YouTubing, but it also sounds like it takes time and effort. I'm not sure Jessa or Ben have what it takes to make it work

 

6 hours ago, Nysha said:

Being a SM influencer is like any other job, if you want to be successful you have to work hard. You also have to find your niche and build on that.

So true. I follow a few YouTube channels regularly. It's obvious that the creators work at it - and I mean work. Like - a JOB. Almost all of them release new videos on a regular schedule - anywhere from once a week to daily - and present content worth my time to watch. [A few are outdoor travel adventurers who post periodically but fairly frequently about their travels.]

Their work includes editing the video footage after they shoot it. I'm no YT expert of course, but I have seen enough to understand that there's work behind the content I consume there. I just don't see that Jessa has the energy or the attitude to make the most of her built-in social media following. The leg humpers will love whatever scraps she tosses out, and that may make her all the money she wants. The built-in fan base is a fringe benefit of her parents' having put their family on cable TV for all those years, so she may as well cash in on it. 

But if she wants to build on that base, she'll have to work at engaging with more people and giving them regular YT and other SM content that will be worth their time and clicks. I could be wrong, but I think she'd have to grow a thicker skin than she's displayed so far when it comes to fielding comments and interacting with people online.

IMO Jessa's too lazy and thin-skinned to maximize her social media presence for money, and Ben isn't into it at all.

[ozziemom]

A lot of YouTubers, including Evan Stewart, talk about all the equipment they have. Special cameras not just iPhone for starters. And all the time spent editing. I don’t see Jessa being able to do this, 1. Because she’s a Duggar 2. Bin doesn’t seem interested 3. She’s not as interesting as she thinks she is.

[BetyBee]

I think Ben not being interested is Jessa's biggest problem with creating SM. It really is difficult to produce decent videos in a too small house, with 4 kids underfoot and a spacey, angry husband who resents when you stick a camera in his face. 

[Zella]

Yeah I don't follow a ton of people on YouTube, but the ones I do clearly put a lot of time and energy into their content. One dude turned down an offer to return to his furloughed job at Disney to work full-time on his channel because he knew he couldn't do both.

The people I all follow are also very good at branding. They're always on brand but without seeming insufferable or calculated about it. I've yet to see a Duggar who truly understands how to market themselves. 

I've just personally not seen Jessa have the personality that it seems to require to do this well. 

Edited November 6, 2021 by Zella

[GeeGolly]

5 minutes ago, Zella said:

Yeah I don't follow a ton of people on YouTube, but the ones I do clearly put a lot of time and energy into their content. One dude turned down an offer to return to his furloughed job at Disney to work full-time on his channel because he knew he couldn't do both.

The people I all follow are also very good at branding. They're always on brand but without seeming insufferable or calculated about it. I've yet to see a Duggar who truly understands how to market themselves. 

I've just personally not seen Jessa have the personality that it seems to require to do this well. 

I don't follow any YouTubers and while I know there's folks who do it full time, like 40+ hours, it seem the Bates sisters, or at least Alyssa, somehow how make some real money, putting in maybe 20 hours a week.

As far as branding, I'm not sure what their brand is beyond being a 'wholesome, Christian Bates', but maybe that's enough of a brand.

But, it will be interesting to see what Jessa does as she makes a go at it.

[Churchhoney]

8 hours ago, Nysha said:

Being a SM influencer is like any other job, if you want to be successful you have to work hard. You also have to find your niche and build on that.

It's okay if Jessa wants to 'SAH christian mom who homeschools, but she has to do a better job of filming her stories. She needs to start with her story and write out the scene in a way that is pleasing to her viewers. Like trying to show that she's giving Spurgeon a quality education would be by filming him sitting at the table or at a desk, away from the other kids, doing more than just mindless paperwork using dollar store workbooks. She claimed she was using the Charlotte Mason homeschooling method, so she needs to show what that means. 

I looked at the comments on the Spurge-does-"schoolwork"-heavily-attended-by-Henry-and-Ivy youtube video, and her current leghumpers are absolutely thrilled with her current homeschooling, according to their many many comments. .....

Person after person praised her for her fantastic work, said that they absolutely loved the way Spurge was interacting with his little brother and sister while studying, and agreed with each other eagerly about how very advanced for their ages Spurge and Henry are in both reading and math.

Somebody even pointed out that there are many kids who graduate from schools who can't do the academic things that Henry and Spurge can do right now today....

So....gonna be hard to convince Jessa she needs to do anything more or different....She's getting really really positive feedback from her fans, and I'm sure they're the people she listens to. 

[iwantcookies]

Ben needs to copy David Rodrigues. Adopt a blank vacant look and an empty creepy smile. Voila a perfect puppet for Jessa.

[BitterApple]

What kills me with Jessa, is the foundation is already there. Followers like good aesthetics. She's pretty. Her kids are pretty. The house is a dump, but that can be improved. She just has to clean herself up and put some effort into it. 

I don't understand why Bin suddenly has a stick up his ass about filming when he deliberately sought out the daughter of a tv family and spent years on the show himself. Jessa has limited opportunities to make money within the framework of her culture. Unless he plans on getting additional jobs, this is it. 

[Zella]

19 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

As far as branding, I'm not sure what their brand is beyond being a 'wholesome, Christian Bates', but maybe that's enough of a brand.

I don't really follow the Bates family like I do some of the other fundies--they just have never morbidly fascinated me in the same way--but they seem to have a better inherent concept of optics than the Duggars. 

[crazycatlady58]

35 minutes ago, Zella said:

Yeah I don't follow a ton of people on YouTube, but the ones I do clearly put a lot of time and energy into their content. One dude turned down an offer to return to his furloughed job at Disney to work full-time on his channel because he knew he couldn't do both.

The people I all follow are also very good at branding. They're always on brand but without seeming insufferable or calculated about it. I've yet to see a Duggar who truly understands how to market themselves. 

I've just personally not seen Jessa have the personality that it seems to require to do this well. 

Tasting history by Max Miller? He is fantastic!!

[lascuba]

15 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

I don't follow any YouTubers and while I know there's folks who do it full time, like 40+ hours, it seem the Bates sisters, or at least Alyssa, somehow how make some real money, putting in maybe 20 hours a week.

As far as branding, I'm not sure what their brand is beyond being a 'wholesome, Christian Bates', but maybe that's enough of a brand.

But, it will be interesting to see what Jessa does as she makes a go at it.

While I don't follow any influencers with any regularity, I do listen to podcasts and watch videos that analyze them (it's bizarre how much I love deep dives on things that have never interested me), and the wholesome Christian brand is huge, whether explicitly Christian or only implied. It's the same with Christian publishing--the audience is desperate for content and they'll glom onto anything that hits the right notes for them. 

[Churchhoney]

29 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

I don't follow any YouTubers and while I know there's folks who do it full time, like 40+ hours, it seem the Bates sisters, or at least Alyssa, somehow how make some real money, putting in maybe 20 hours a week.

 

Well, where you start matters greatly when it comes to how much work you have to do, especially in your early years of doing it.

The people who start out with followings from tv (or the like) have a huge huge leg up over anyone else. A very large amount of the work on youtube is getting the beginnings of your following == going from nothing to, say, 10,000 to 30,000 people or so. And yet many of the people who are succeeding at youtube started with literally no following or only a very small one from social media or from some other job they've had, like as a writer or something. 

The Bateses -- and the Duggars -- get the very considerable benefit of that leg up. What impresses me is the people who build big channels without that assistance, just based on their skills or their charisma or whatever. Because they start out hundreds of thousands of viewers and years of irrational love behind.  So a Bates can probably work 20 hours a week when some of the people building without pre-existing fame have to work 60 hours. 

 

Edited November 6, 2021 by Churchhoney

[Zella]

5 minutes ago, crazycatlady58 said:

Tasting history by Max Miller? He is fantastic!!

YES! He is fantastic. A really fun channel, and I'm glad he decided to stay with it. :) His content is the antithesis of anything Jessa's ever posted.

Edited November 6, 2021 by Zella

[crazycatlady58]

Just now, Zella said:

YES! He is fantastic. A really fun channel, and I'm glad he decided to stay with it. :) His content is the antithesis of anything Jessa's ever posted.

And the comments are always great. Very positive and fun. Of course Jessa would never watch him because HORRORS  he is gay. Her loss.

[lascuba]

7 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

What kills me with Jessa, is the foundation is already there. Followers like good aesthetics. She's pretty. Her kids are pretty. The house is a dump, but that can be improved. She just has to clean herself up and put some effort into it. 

I don't understand why Bin suddenly has a stick up his ass about filming when he deliberately sought out the daughter of a tv family and spent years on the show himself. Jessa has limited opportunities to make money within the framework of her culture. Unless he plans on getting additional jobs, this is it. 

My theory as to why Jessa just can't seem to get it right--other than the fact that she seems genuinely uninterested in doing it--is the "media training" from her parents and TLC growing up. There was a script they all had to follow, because JB and Michelle really believe that robotic children were endearing, and TLC wanted a freak show. I think all of them have a hard time turning  that training off when a camera is in their face. None of them have a good grasp on how to appear natural on camera, how to know which flaws make for good content vs. which will get you mocked for years to come (hi, diaper mountain). 

[Zella]

6 minutes ago, crazycatlady58 said:

And the comments are always great. Very positive and fun. Of course Jessa would never watch him because HORRORS  he is gay. Her loss.

Between him being gay and all the content about pagan Romans, her head would explode. 😂

2 minutes ago, lascuba said:

My theory as to why Jessa just can't seem to get it right--other than the fact that she seems genuinely uninterested in doing it--is the "media training" from her parents and TLC growing up. There was a script they all had to follow, because JB and Michelle really believe that robotic children were endearing, and TLC wanted a freak show. I think all of them have a hard time turning  that training off when a camera is in their face. None of them have a good grasp on how to appear natural on camera, how to know which flaws make for good content vs. which will get you mocked for years to come (hi, diaper mountain). 

Yeah it really stands out to me how often all the kids get in trouble when they try to "be relatable." They have no clue what is normal and what isn't, and it shows. Edited to add: And I guess even feeling the need to prove one is relatable is also a red flag that, deep down, you aren't. 

Edited November 6, 2021 by Zella

[Cinnabon]

3 hours ago, ginger90 said:

Most videos I watch on YouTube involve animals. I find the content to be more enjoyable than most with people.

Same!

1 hour ago, BetyBee said:

I think Ben not being interested is Jessa's biggest problem with creating SM. It really is difficult to produce decent videos in a too small house, with 4 kids underfoot and a spacey, angry husband who resents when you stick a camera in his face. 

And who can blame him? A home should be for relaxing and feeling comfortable, not a place where you feel you must be “on” all the time, with a fucking camera in your face. 

[Cinnabon]

58 minutes ago, Zella said:

Yeah I don't follow a ton of people on YouTube, but the ones I do clearly put a lot of time and energy into their content. One dude turned down an offer to return to his furloughed job at Disney to work full-time on his channel because he knew he couldn't do both.

The people I all follow are also very good at branding. They're always on brand but without seeming insufferable or calculated about it. I've yet to see a Duggar who truly understands how to market themselves. 

I've just personally not seen Jessa have the personality that it seems to require to do this well. 

Does she even have a personality? 🤣

Bin should get a job teaching at a religious elementary school. Some of them don’t even require an a teaching credential, or will let a person earn it while on the job. He may even be able to teach some kind of sport there as well.

[GeeGolly]

1 minute ago, Cinnabon said:

Does she even have a personality? 🤣

Bin should get a job teaching at a religious elementary school. Some of them don’t even require an a teaching credential, or will let a person earn it while on the job. He may even be able to teach some kind of sport there as well.

A teacher needs to care about their students more than their own intellect. I'm not sure Ben can do that, even with kids.

[Cinnabon]

1 minute ago, GeeGolly said:

A teacher needs to care about their students more than their own intellect. I'm not sure Ben can do that, even with kids.

I think he could develop it. But will he bother? 

Aren’t a lot of the Duggar leghumpers middle aged or older women? Their built in fan base is going to be shrinking precipitously the longer the show is off the air. People quickly move on.

 

[Gemma Violet]

As others have said, it takes a lot of work to have a successful Youtube channel.  One of my favorites is about two dachshunds and their human family in the Netherlands.  I always marvel at the professionalism of the videos:  The spot-on editing.  The great camera they use and the camera angles.  The sound.  The narration.  And also helping: the fact that they live in a quiet, peaceful, and beautiful environment.  Their home is spotless (and very minimalistic) even with two dogs and many other animals.  There is a koi pond outside with ducks all around, but you never see any dirt or animal droppings.  The videos are, in places, amusing, and in other places, soothing and inspiring. 

I agree that there's no way Jessa would put in all that work, even if she didn't have four children to tend to.  First off, she would have to take a course in how to do all that.  Secondly, she'd have to want to do it.  Not going to happen.  Her fans are giving her positive feedback and I have a feeling she's satisfied with that.     

[lascuba]

I've heard that a lot of influencers actually rent spaces to uses as their "homes" for filming purposes. As in, there are property owners who essentially rent out model homes like they would event spaces for people to film in. There's this whole behind the scenes economy around influencers and it's wild to me. 

1 hour ago, Cinnabon said:

Same!

And who can blame him? A home should be for relaxing and feeling comfortable, not a place where you feel you must be “on” all the time, with a fucking camera in your face. 

I bet if he were allowed to tell Catholics they were going to hell, he'd be all over being on all the time. 

[xwordfanatik]

2 hours ago, iwantcookies said:

Ben needs to copy David Rodrigues. Adopt a blank vacant look and an empty creepy smile. Voila a perfect puppet for Jessa.

And the acquisition of a huge gut!

🤣

[Jynnan tonnix]

1 hour ago, crazycatlady58 said:

And the comments are always great. Very positive and fun. Of course Jessa would never watch him because HORRORS  he is gay. Her loss.

Cool that there are Max Miller fans here! I just stumbled on his videos about 3 months ago, watched everything I could find over a couple of weeks, and inhale the new ones when they come out. Just as I do with Randy Rainbow. I guess I just have a thing for gay guys!

[Westiepeach]

2 hours ago, Cinnabon said:

Does she even have a personality? 🤣

Bin should get a job teaching at a religious elementary school. Some of them don’t even require an a teaching credential, or will let a person earn it while on the job. He may even be able to teach some kind of sport there as well.

1. Jessa has no personality. I am sure a big part of it was she was never allowed to have a personality… but, nonetheless, she has none now.

2. Jessa does not understand/accept the concept of “work.” 

3. Jessa really has no talent. Nothing. Nada. She is a Mean Girl.

4. She also thinks she is the bomb with an adoring husband who falls more and more in love with her every day, and 4 perfect children who are ever so smart and hardly need school because… you know… and they obey her every word.

I think, and totally IMHO, Jessa thinks she is all that because she is a Duggar. And they are all perfect.

[sheshark]

5 hours ago, iwantcookies said:

Ben needs to copy David Rodrigues. Adopt a blank vacant look and an empty creepy smile. Voila a perfect puppet for Jessa.

I think you mean “Walla a perfect puppet for Jessa.”

Edited November 6, 2021 by sheshark
Quoting

[Ijustwantsomechips]

8 hours ago, BetyBee said:

I think Ben not being interested is Jessa's biggest problem with creating SM. It really is difficult to produce decent videos in a too small house, with 4 kids underfoot and a spacey, angry husband who resents when you stick a camera in his face. 

I used to watch  this lady vlog about her marriage and family on YouTube. It was the basic day in the life of videos.  The husband always seemed distant or annoyed with filming.  Turns out he was very unhappy and ended up divorcing the lady.  Now I don’t know exactly what transpired, there are many things that can go wrong in a marriage, and both parties play their part. Part of me always thinks that maybe, just maybe if she had put that damned camera down and been present with her family,  things may have been different.  

I know Ben isn’t likely to leave, but I can see his Jessa’s marriage headed that way.  He seems to have mentally checked out long ago. 

Edited November 6, 2021 by Ijustwantsomechips

[Tdoc72]

13 hours ago, iwantcookies said:

Ben needs to copy David Rodrigues. Adopt a blank vacant look and an empty creepy smile. Voila a perfect puppet for Jessa.

Jessa, fire up your van and head to Walmart for Ben’s ladypants!

[MunichNark]

13 hours ago, Westiepeach said:

1. Jessa has no personality. I am sure a big part of it was she was never allowed to have a personality… but, nonetheless, she has none now.

2. Jessa does not understand/accept the concept of “work.” 

3. Jessa really has no talent. Nothing. Nada. She is a Mean Girl.

4. She also thinks she is the bomb with an adoring husband who falls more and more in love with her every day, and 4 perfect children who are ever so smart and hardly need school because… you know… and they obey her every word.

I think, and totally IMHO, Jessa thinks she is all that because she is a Duggar. And they are all perfect.

Absolutely this. She is so lazy that she makes Frills Jills look busy by comparison. Actually, Jill must be doing some sort of "work" to badger those Churches to take them on. And the magic pink juice also.

Jessa doesn't do shit. Too lazy to clean, tidy, wash, take out their rubbish, take her children to educational things, cook.......

[Iguessnot]

On 11/1/2021 at 4:15 PM, ginger90 said:

Ben looks thrilled. I saw the video, and it’s not just the still pictures that make me say that. He looked miserable.

Where is the video? I've tried for a week and can't locate it. I'm an old head.

[Lady Whistleup]

20 hours ago, Westiepeach said:

1. Jessa has no personality. I am sure a big part of it was she was never allowed to have a personality… but, nonetheless, she has none now.

2. Jessa does not understand/accept the concept of “work.” 

3. Jessa really has no talent. Nothing. Nada. She is a Mean Girl.

4. She also thinks she is the bomb with an adoring husband who falls more and more in love with her every day, and 4 perfect children who are ever so smart and hardly need school because… you know… and they obey her every word.

I think, and totally IMHO, Jessa thinks she is all that because she is a Duggar. And they are all perfect.

I dislike Jessa intensely but it's not all Jessa's fault that the Seewalds are miserable. Bin is a layabout who doesn't do anything to improve his own life or the lives of his children. 

One thing I admire about Derick (and I don't like Derick either) was that when he realized his lofty missionary goals weren't going to happen he did the practical thing and went back to school and got a job at grubhub. Not glamorous stuff, but it paid the bills. 

[cmr2014]

22 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

I dislike Jessa intensely but it's not all Jessa's fault that the Seewalds are miserable. Bin is a layabout who doesn't do anything to improve his own life or the lives of his children. 

One thing I admire about Derick (and I don't like Derick either) was that when he realized his lofty missionary goals weren't going to happen he did the practical thing and went back to school and got a job at grubhub. Not glamorous stuff, but it paid the bills. 

If I was going to lay this on anyone, it would be Ben's dad.

Ben was 17 and stalking pretty girl that he'd seen on television. Instead of sitting down with his son and talking about projecting his fantasies onto someone else, he drove his son 3 hours each way to the Duggar's "church."

Instead of encouraging his son to finish his education and take things slowly, he encourage a "courtship." Then, instead of acknowledging their incompatibility, he pressed hard for an engagement.

I don't know that Ben is actually a "layabout." He spent years finishing school online and working at dumb jobs at "Duggar Enterprises" because JB didn't want him around other people on a college campus or working for people outside of his "Umbrella of Authority." I think that taken a job outside of "Duggar Enterprises" would be a BIG DEAL and would cause a rift with JB and potential loss of their home and vehicle.

If I were him, I would step out for a quart of milk and just never come back . . .

[xwordfanatik]

25 minutes ago, cmr2014 said:

If I was going to lay this on anyone, it would be Ben's dad.

Ben was 17 and stalking pretty girl that he'd seen on television. Instead of sitting down with his son and talking about projecting his fantasies onto someone else, he drove his son 3 hours each way to the Duggar's "church."

Instead of encouraging his son to finish his education and take things slowly, he encourage a "courtship." Then, instead of acknowledging their incompatibility, he pressed hard for an engagement.

I don't know that Ben is actually a "layabout." He spent years finishing school online and working at dumb jobs at "Duggar Enterprises" because JB didn't want him around other people on a college campus or working for people outside of his "Umbrella of Authority." I think that taken a job outside of "Duggar Enterprises" would be a BIG DEAL and would cause a rift with JB and potential loss of their home and vehicle.

If I were him, I would step out for a quart of milk and just never come back . . .

And get snipped, while he's at it.  

[drafan]

On 11/5/2021 at 8:03 PM, OpieTaylor said:

 plus Ivy got a couple new toys.

Of course she did! I didn't see any pix, but I'm guessing Jessa had to buy some "girl toys" for Ivy and Fern. Can't have them playing with cars and Legos when there are sweeping/cooking/sister-momming  skills to be learned.  Oops, this is Jessa...only the sister-momming. So, yup, baby dolls it is.

[lilwhitelion]

4 hours ago, Iguessnot said:

Where is the video? I've tried for a week and can't locate it. I'm an old head.

It was posted as in Instagram story.  Those only last to be viewed for 24 hours.  You really aren't missing much.  He was in line, holding a stack of five different colored boxes.  The people in line were socially distanced, so he had a man about five feet behind him.  That stare he has in the screenshots is what he did for about 10 seconds.  Didn't move an inch, just glared at her.  She finally panned down to a sleeping Fern.  When she panned up, he looked at her, then slowly turned his head around as if he was looking at others in the coffee shop.  Then he looked forward again.  No smiles at her.  Just a very pissed look the whole time.

[Iguessnot]

3 minutes ago, lilwhitelion said:

It was posted as in Instagram story.  Those only last to be viewed for 24 hours.  You really aren't missing much.  He was in line, holding a stack of five different colored boxes.  The people in line were socially distanced, so he had a man about five feet behind him.  That stare he has in the screenshots is what he did for about 10 seconds.  Didn't move an inch, just glared at her.  She finally panned down to a sleeping Fern.  When she panned up, he looked at her, then slowly turned his head around as if he was looking at others in the coffee shop.  Then he looked forward again.  No smiles at her.  Just a very pissed look the whole time.

Thanks a bunch for the explanation and the full description.

[SMama]

1 hour ago, cmr2014 said:

If I was going to lay this on anyone, it would be Ben's dad.

Ben was 17 and stalking pretty girl that he'd seen on television. Instead of sitting down with his son and talking about projecting his fantasies onto someone else, he drove his son 3 hours each way to the Duggar's "church."

Instead of encouraging his son to finish his education and take things slowly, he encourage a "courtship." Then, instead of acknowledging their incompatibility, he pressed hard for an engagement.

I don't know that Ben is actually a "layabout." He spent years finishing school online and working at dumb jobs at "Duggar Enterprises" because JB didn't want him around other people on a college campus or working for people outside of his "Umbrella of Authority." I think that taken a job outside of "Duggar Enterprises" would be a BIG DEAL and would cause a rift with JB and potential loss of their home and vehicle.

If I were him, I would step out for a quart of milk and just never come back . . .

And when it looked like JB wanted them to wait to marry Pa Seewald posted on his blog about marrying young. He was clearly pissed at JB and wanted full steam ahead with a wedding. Michael Seewald sold Ben out to the lowest bidder because he thought Duggar proximity would propel him and his son into prominent preaching positions. How’s that working out for you, Michael? Pa Seewald still has the life he had pre Duggar association. Ben’s life is on a downward spiral. Thanks Pa.

1 hour ago, drafan said:

Of course she did! I didn't see any pix, but I'm guessing Jessa had to buy some "girl toys" for Ivy and Fern. Can't have them playing with cars and Legos when there are sweeping/cooking/sister-momming  skills to be learned.  Oops, this is Jessa...only the sister-momming. So, yup, baby dolls it is.

Jessa bought a ball and a stick horse for Ivy.

[Cinnabon]

47 minutes ago, SMama said:

And when it looked like JB wanted them to wait to marry Pa Seewald posted on his blog about marrying young. He was clearly pissed at JB and wanted full steam ahead with a wedding. Michael Seewald sold Ben out to the lowest bidder because he thought Duggar proximity would propel him and his son into prominent preaching positions. How’s that working out for you, Michael? Pa Seewald still has the life he had pre Duggar association. Ben’s life is on a downward spiral. Thanks Pa.

Jessa bought a ball and a stick horse for Ivy.

Mr Seewald also seemed extremely concerned that Bin was suffering from not being able to have sex as a teen with raging hormones. Does anyone else remember this?

[iwantcookies]

5 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

Mr Seewald also seemed extremely concerned that Bin was suffering from not being able to have sex as a teen with raging hormones. Does anyone else remember this?

Well there is Master Bates ... but it’s frowned upon... so married life it is!

[Cinnabon]

I found the comments Mike Seewald made that I was thinking of.

 

Michael concluded that neglecting the pursuit of marriage as a young adult only leads to “inordinate temptation and unhealthy singleness, being unhappily alone, or worse, becoming sexually immoral.”

https://starcasm.net/ben-seewalds-fathers-essay-on-marrying-young-may-offend-the-duggars/

[Nysha]

8 hours ago, lilwhitelion said:

It was posted as in Instagram story.  Those only last to be viewed for 24 hours.  You really aren't missing much.  He was in line, holding a stack of five different colored boxes.  The people in line were socially distanced, so he had a man about five feet behind him.  That stare he has in the screenshots is what he did for about 10 seconds.  Didn't move an inch, just glared at her.  She finally panned down to a sleeping Fern.  When she panned up, he looked at her, then slowly turned his head around as if he was looking at others in the coffee shop.  Then he looked forward again.  No smiles at her.  Just a very pissed look the whole time.

Why would she post that? Yes, it makes Ben look petty, but it makes her look even worse. There is this little thing called consent and I'm willing to bet that Ben did not consent to being filmed. 

[emmawoodhouse]

Jessa probably thought she was being cute. Just another example of her utter lack of a sense of humor.

[madpsych78]

9 hours ago, Cinnabon said:

I found the comments Mike Seewald made that I was thinking of.

 

Michael concluded that neglecting the pursuit of marriage as a young adult only leads to “inordinate temptation and unhealthy singleness, being unhappily alone, or worse, becoming sexually immoral.”

https://starcasm.net/ben-seewalds-fathers-essay-on-marrying-young-may-offend-the-duggars/

Well, that didn't work for Josh. He was pretty young when he got married as well.

Instead they are unhappily paired - in contrast with Jana who appears happily alone.

IIRC, Jessa and Ben's courtship lasted for about a year. I thought it was maybe Ben's age, but now I wonder if there was something more to the story there. I remember that Jessa and Ben announced their courtship before Jill and Derick, but Jill and Derick got engaged WAY before Jessa and Ben. In fact, I wonder if Jill and Derick's engagement/wedding was what pushed Jessa and Ben to go forward with the marriage.

[satrunrose]

I remember the split in opinion at the time was pretty even between people who thought JB was being weird and putting the brakes on and those who thought Jessa liked the attention and keeping up with Jill, even if she wasn't wild about Ben. I think we also found out around then that courting sister moms were freed up from many of their jurisdictions so they could plan the wedding or something ridiculous. Then, Papa Seewald's blog post made the rounds and all of a sudden the melty ice cream wedding was on. 

Basically, I agree that most of the blame falls on Ben's dad and his complete lack of understanding that there's a good reason most 18 year olds are discouraged from making life-altering decisions like marriage. The rest falls on the stupid cult who believes it's sinful to spend some time alone with a guy to see if you click before you start churning out babies. 

[Scarlett45]

30 minutes ago, satrunrose said:

I remember the split in opinion at the time was pretty even between people who thought JB was being weird and putting the brakes on and those who thought Jessa liked the attention and keeping up with Jill, even if she wasn't wild about Ben. I think we also found out around then that courting sister moms were freed up from many of their jurisdictions so they could plan the wedding or something ridiculous. Then, Papa Seewald's blog post made the rounds and all of a sudden the melty ice cream wedding was on. 

Basically, I agree that most of the blame falls on Ben's dad and his complete lack of understanding that there's a good reason most 18 year olds are discouraged from making life-altering decisions like marriage. The rest falls on the stupid cult who believes it's sinful to spend some time alone with a guy to see if you click before you start churning out babies. 

I could see it being a little bit of both. Ben was young, but likely Jessa wasn’t crazy about him but wanted the attention of a courtship. JB and Michelle married very young but they were into each other. JB either wanted to see Ben mature or Jessa lose interest. 
 

I think Jessa wanted to be married and Ben was there. He didn’t repulse her (I believe she thought he was attractive, he is!) so she went with it. 

[BigBingerBro]

6 hours ago, satrunrose said:

I think we also found out around then that courting sister moms were freed up from many of their jurisdictions so they could plan the wedding or something ridiculous.

Oh yes, they were basically free to spend their time curling their hair, putting on makeup, taking selfies and texting and facetiming with the guys they were courting.  MeShell made it very clear that when her older girls were courting, they did not have the time to help out anymore.....