S16.E11: One on One (Part 1)

[Joan of Argh]

8 minutes ago, Claire Voyant said:

My mother had an affair and felt I was more her friend than just her daughter, so I was dragged into it.  I loved my dad and it was a horrible thing my mother asked of me. 

It's not something any child, no matter their age, needs to be privy to.  Not ever.  I was so relieved when my dad found out. 

It's been years and my parents have been dead for many years and I'm still stuck with that memory.  Not fun.   I don't blame Mariah for any "hard" feelings she may have.  You don't just get over anything like that.   Your parents are still your mom and dad and no kid needs that shit.  My heart always hurts for Mariah.  Meri is a class-A, self-absorbed bitch.  

As for Meri and Kode the Toad, they deserve each other.  I wonder if he has to house her on his planet in the afterlife or does she get her own planet where she can build her own house in the trees or not in the trees or only partly in the trees, but maybe next to some polluted pond?   At this stage of their relationship, I'd say that their heaven doesn't sound like much fun.  Eternity, here we come.  

Ah yes.  Polygamy.  I wonder how things will go for Kode the Toad and Sobyn who claims she married him for the polygamy lifestyle?   Wouldn't it be great if she left him for a guy named Sam who had a penchant for bananas and had lots of wives to keep him busy and out of her house?  Here ya go, Toady, you got abandoned.  Ha! 

 

I’m so sorry you had to go through that!

my best friend lived through the same thing, her mom actually expected her to lie for her… her mother was having an affair with the husband of longtime friends, the couple would come over to play cards and she’d see her mom and the husband playing footsie and stroking each other’s legs under the table while her dad and the man’s wife were both oblivious!

When her dad would go out of town on business on his return he would ask her occasionally if anyone had been over while he was out of town and she’d lie to him and say “No” and she felt terrible doing it….then one night when the other couple was there for “card night” the wife cornered her in the hallway and asked if her husband ever came over by himself…. She wanted to run and hide but she again lied and said “no”

obviously her father and the other man’s wife were getting suspicious which made “card night” a living hell for my friend…sometimes she’d ask if she could stay at my house and avoid it.

Her parents have been dead for a long time but she’ll still talk to me about it sometimes and how awful it was to be put in that position by her mother 😢

Meri involving Mariah in the “affair” was disgusting!

[tinderbox]

15 hours ago, TurtlePower said:

This. Christine has a spine, is brave and speaks plainly (unlike Meri). 

All very true, but from the day Kody married Robyn, jealousy took over every thinking part of Christine and it festered.  We saw it season after season.  She became completely insecure in her marriage and she questioned her importance in the family.  That green eyed monster is what brought the end to her marriage to Kody.  (I think she’s still jealous of Robyn!)  It did for Meri, as well,  but for Meri the jealousy happened years earlier with Kody’s marriage to Janelle.

Edited February 1, 2022 by tinderbox

[Yeah No]

10 hours ago, steff13 said:

Christine has six kids and no education.  Was she supposed to support them with a minimum wage job a McDonald's?  I don't agree that she was unhappy before Robyn, I think she was happy taking care of kids and time-sharing a husband, but even if she was, the idea of leaving, having to support herself and all those kids, and going against her religion would have felt insurmountable I'm sure. 

I agree.  I remember Christine acted blindsided by the level of jealousy she felt when Kody married Robin.  She said something to the effect that she suddenly went from being the hot-wife to the not-wife overnight.  It was obvious from the beginning that he was ditching the previous wife every time he married another one.  And the rest of them were left figuring out how to feel about it and handle it.  

8 hours ago, MamaGee said:

Finally, what exactly is a husband's commitment to his wives in polygamy? He can't leave but he doesn't have to see them, have sex with them, or support them financially, emotionally, etc. So he can abandon (get over it, Kodouche) them, hold them hostage to their religious commitment but not do anything else for or to them??

It's becoming bitterly obvious that this is indeed true.  There is no hiding it now.  So much for love being multiplied and not divided!  It's not even divided, just abandoned for the next new shiny object.  The women are expected to accept this situation as their lot in life or what God wants from them.  It is emotional abuse and self serving to a degree I don't think a lot of us really wanted to believe was the case.  I wonder if that is really what Kody's faith would say is the right thing to do.  It is certainly a very un-Christian way to be.   I think Kody is manipulating his religion to serve his misogynistic, narcissistic needs.  Unless his religion really does promote victimization and abandonment of women.  

8 hours ago, Joan of Argh said:

I agree it would benefit Meri the MOST if she’d just sit there and OWN IT ALL!… Don't be ashamed! Don’t mealy mouth around and try to whimper, spin and avoid the truth!

I’d like to see Meri tell the interviewer that “HELL YES I was looking for affection and YES I was going to leave when I thought I’d found it!..Because Kody ABANDONED me emotionally and physically long before the catfish and he treated me like shit!”

but we’ll never see that because Meri isn’t a “strong woman” “boss babe” …. She’s a coward, she was only ready to leave when she thought she had another MAN to run off with.

When Meri was head wife she was good at bullying her sister wives and their children and Kody let her get away with it because he didn’t love those wives or children, he enjoyed the wives jockeying for his affection but now it’s different, he loves Robyn and he won’t allow it.

Meri sucks up and defends Robyn because it pleases Kody, she fawns over Robyns kids because it pleases Kody… she makes me sick. 🤮

Meri is still acting like a victim and coming from a place of victimhood and that's why she's still not able to come out and act on the offensive, like Christine is starting to do.  I can understand how hard it would be to rise above that when you've basically bought into a religion that makes you think accepting victimization is going to get you into Heaven.  I think Meri is locked into a self blame thing where she is buying into the guilt Kody is putting on her for the catfish situation and that is what is holding her back from saying, "Screw you, asshole, you drove me to that!".  It is why she lies and acts like she is pining away waiting for him to turn around.  In doing that it shows me she is accepting the blame but is unwilling to admit it.  I agree with @Tuxcat above that she shouldn't have to admit to him or the world any blame but come at him on the offensive and blame him first for driving her to that.  I'm sure he was responsible for the brainwashing that made her accept polygamy in the first place, and guilty of piling on the guilt big time every time she had a problem with it.

[Yeah No]

2 hours ago, Joan of Argh said:

Meri involving Mariah in the “affair” was disgusting!

It was disgusting, but the actions of a brainwashed victim trying to have the strength to overcome her oppression.  I see Meri being the bitch to the other wives, Meri demanding big houses and the infamous wet bar, Meri succumbing to the catfish, and Meri involving her daughter in the catfish situation as the actions of a person not strong enough to shake loose her emotional shackles to that soul crushing situation and acting out to try to get what they really want in selfish ways born of desperation.  She's an extremely unhappy person in that situation, unable to rise above it but clawing instead in inappropriate ways to fulfill herself because she is so full of guilt and oppression that she can't fully stand up to it.  Too bad she didn't have the strength of character that Christine has had to retain her integrity in dealing with her own form of abuse.  And not that I want to look for more reasons to "excuse" Meri, that's not the point here, but we don't really know the level of manipulation and guilt Kody put on these women to keep them down and from getting too "uppity".  Meri may have been even more susceptible to being brainwashed by it because she was the first wife and very much in love with him.  Who knows what BS he spun and empty promises he made to keep her from growing a spine?  It is so bad that even now, when he has made it clear that there is no hope for their relationship that she is still holding onto him and laboring under the delusion that this is somehow OK with her or that she wants to be there in case he turns around.  That's some guilt there she's working off of.  And Robin making her think there is hope is just self serving on her part.  

Edited February 1, 2022 by Yeah No

[Yeah No]

2 hours ago, tinderbox said:

All very true, but from the day Kody married Robyn, jealousy took over every thinking part of Christine and it festered.  We saw it season after season.  She became completely insecure in her marriage and she questioned her importance in the family.  That green eyed monster is what brought the end to her marriage to Kody.  (I think she’s still jealous of Robyn!)  It did for Meri, as well,  but for Meri the jealousy happened years earlier with Kody’s marriage to Janelle.

Not sure what you feel here but  I'm not willing to blame the end of Chrstine's marriage to Kody on her jealousy, as if jealousy is a bad thing and she pushed him away.  I think she had every reason to feel jealous given how Kody pretty much dumped her for Robin right away.  She had every reason to ask him to pay more attention to her, to consider her needs and to work on their marriage.  He only gave in to keep up appearances but made her look like an incessant nag to justify his disinterest and lack of effort.  No, she was just advocating for herself, her marriage and her needs. 

I also don't blame her for still being jealous of Robin.  She has reason to feel that way and there's nothing wrong with that.  In the monogamous world we like to think that one reason polygamy doesn't work is precisely because of jealousy and that jealousy is par for the course and a normal reaction in these situations.  So I don't blame her for feeling jealous nor would I expect her to deal with that jealousy to allow her husband to basically dump her for another woman.  I thought that the line of crap Kody was selling the world (and probably them) is that taking on a new wife wasn't supposed to mean dumping the old one, but continuing to value and work on each relationship.  For all his talk about being a polygamist I think we have all figured out that Kody is really not a polygamist, but a serial monogamist.  And that's really not fair to any woman, even a polygamous one.

[TurtlePower]

On 2/1/2022 at 2:58 AM, Yeah No said:

It was disgusting, but the actions of a brainwashed victim trying to have the strength to overcome her oppression.  I see Meri being the bitch to the other wives, Meri demanding big houses and the infamous wet bar, Meri succumbing to the catfish, and Meri involving her daughter in the catfish situation as the actions of a person not strong enough to shake loose her emotional shackles to that soul crushing situation and acting out to try to get what they really want in selfish ways born of desperation.  She's an extremely unhappy person in that situation, unable to rise above it but clawing instead in inappropriate ways to fulfill herself because she is so full of guilt and oppression that she can't fully stand up to it.  Too bad she didn't have the strength of character that Christine has had to retain her integrity in dealing with her own form of abuse.  And not that I want to look for more reasons to "excuse" Meri, that's not the point here, but we don't really know the level of manipulation and guilt Kody put on these women to keep them down and from getting too "uppity".  Meri may have been even more susceptible to being brainwashed by it because she was the first wife and very much in love with him.  Who knows what BS he spun and empty promises he made to keep her from growing a spine?  It is so bad that even now, when he has made it clear that there is no hope for their relationship that she is still holding onto him and laboring under the delusion that this is somehow OK with her or that she wants to be there in case he turns around.  That's some guilt there she's working off of.  And Robin making her think there is hope is just self serving on her part.  

This is a fair assessment. And I wouldn’t have any issue with Meri if she’d stop lying and pretending she’s “strong, brave, boss up, etc”, because by this observation, she is a brainwashed, quivering pile of goo. It’s ok to feel scared, afraid of change and not have confidence—just be real about it. It’s relatable actually! But Meri takes it and instead of making herself relatable, she makes herself an airbrushed jerk. 

I see what Meri is doing—it’s what people with no actual confidence do when they feel marginalised—but it’s all fake. It’s what bullies do also, and she’s been known to be mean to her LLR customers. 

Meri isn’t going anywhere because she’s too afraid to. She covers by saying she still loves Kody—and I believe she does—but she cannot do what Christine did (yet). Meri then covers even more by “brave” this and “boss” that and filtered photos. It’s pathetic. 

Everyone has a breaking point, though—maybe Kody ignoring her long enough and saying they’re never, ever, ever getting back together—will be the catalyst. 

Now Taylor Swift’s song is in my head. 

 

Edited February 2, 2022 by TurtlePower
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[laurakaye]

For once, I need this interviewer to see through Robyn's constant tears.  She cried in Part One, and we know she is going to cry in Part Two and Three.  At some point, if your interview subject turns on the waterworks after every single question, wouldn't you have to assume that she's using it as a ploy and a way to get around really answering?  It's like, "Robyn, how are you doing today?"  Robyn: (bottom lip trembles, delicately dabs away an eye booger).  "Robyn, I like your blouse - did you buy it at JC Penny in 1983?"  Robyn: (looks up, frowns until her lower lip touches her chin, asks for a tissue).  I want to see this interviewer just freakin' toss her a box of Kleenex after her very first question and say, "girl, just put these on your lap, I know you're going to need them."  Seriously, the pandering and simpering everyone does in the presence of Robyn's fake tears is beyond belief.

[kassa]

16 hours ago, sharkerbaby said:

And you know what?  I think this sounds like a dream arrangement.  Call him if I have some heavy lifting that needs to be done then maybe feed him and send him on his way.  I can get help when I need it but otherwise, I can get back to the business of doing whatever I want to do.  All the benefits and none of the hassle.  

I know several middle aged women whose "boyfriends" moved into the same building/condo complex so they each have their own space, retain their individual assets, plus a committed partnership and that's my dream scenario. Especially in the pandemic it's worked out nicely since they are not doing all their work zoom calls on top of each other.  

11 hours ago, all4mom2 said:

It's because it now suits HER to move.

That's generally when anybody does anything, isn't it? When it suits them? Lots of factors have to align -- financial independence, ability of minor children to adjust to a new living situation/school, availability of external family support, and just plain moral courage. I think seeing her older children grow into happily functioning monogamous adults has bolstered her confidence that she can survive. I don't know what her mom's life was like after she left, but presumably it was not something she wanted to emulate. Now maybe she sees a different outcome for herself.

Turning years of sublimated simmering rage into action is a painful process. Menopause is a powerful energy source, however.

Is Paedon the one who is 10 feet tall? He was pictured in some of the snapshots of recent family gatherings an episode or two ago. 

[laurakaye]

3 minutes ago, kassa said:

Is Paedon the one who is 10 feet tall? He was pictured in some of the snapshots of recent family gatherings an episode or two ago. 

That's him.  I keep waiting for Kody to flounce over to Christine and try to throw his weight around, only for Paedon to emerge from another room, pick Kody up by his weave, and throw him out the door.

Not saying Paedon has a violent bone in his body, but I just love the fact that Christine's only son could take on Mr. Big Time Wrestler with one hand tied behind his back if he wanted to.

 

[all4mom2]

My point is...she's not leaving because of indignation over Kody's bad treatment, which is what everyone's applauding her for; if that were the case, she'd have left a long time ago.

[steff13]

19 minutes ago, all4mom2 said:

My point is...she's not leaving because of indignation over Kody's bad treatment, which is what everyone's applauding her for; if that were the case, she'd have left a long time ago.

We all change and grow.  She may not have seen it as bad treatment in the past.  Just because we could see it, doesn't mean she could.  Maybe him admitting that he would never have an intimate relationship with her again was the straw that broke the camel's back.  I think that's fair enough; that would be a deal breaker in a marriage for me, too. 

[bichonblitz]

16 hours ago, Joan of Argh said:

I’d like to see Meri tell the interviewer that “HELL YES I was looking for affection and YES I was going to leave when I thought I’d found it!..Because Kody ABANDONED me emotionally and physically long before the catfish and he treated me like shit!”

Perfectly said. Why can't she do that? 

[Sandy W]

11 minutes ago, bichonblitz said:

Perfectly said. Why can't she do that? 

I too would be delighted to hear her make that declaration, only if she added --- I am not the #StrongWoman I purport to be.  I lingered in misery until I thought Prince Charming was available to look after me.

[LilyD]

10 hours ago, tinderbox said:

All very true, but from the day Kody married Robyn, jealousy took over every thinking part of Christine and it festered.

This goes for all the wives. Just stumbled upon an episode from last season where they discussed the pros and cons of the big house. Not a single wife wanted to see Kody leaving on a date with one of the others… and you will see it if you share a house.

So far for sharing a husband and fully embracing polygamy. They’re not happy about Kody spending quality time with one of the others and only manage to accept it if they can conveniently ignore it or cannot see it.

[magemaud]

On 1/31/2022 at 6:01 AM, Pooky said:

Meri is like a puppy dog starved of affection begging for love.

Next we’ll see her in one of those heart-wrenching ASPCA commercials with the sad music 

[Mother of Odin]

1 hour ago, steff13 said:

We all change and grow.  She may not have seen it as bad treatment in the past.  Just because we could see it, doesn't mean she could.  Maybe him admitting that he would never have an intimate relationship with her again was the straw that broke the camel's back.  I think that's fair enough; that would be a deal breaker in a marriage for me, too. 

That's my dream marriage. Except Kody and the other wives. Just the sexless marriage part. I have no desire left for that.

[steff13]

10 minutes ago, Mother of Odin said:

That's my dream marriage. Except Kody and the other wives. Just the sexless marriage part. I have no desire left for that.

I think it is for a lot of people (not me).  But it has to be something both parties agree to.  

[Cetacean]

On 1/31/2022 at 10:02 AM, Tuxcat said:

Seriously what is wrong with his picture? Are we living in the days of Hester Prynne? Meri was targeted, lured, deliberately exploited, and publicly shamed for entering into an emotional relationship with a man who was in fact a predatory woman. 

And we want to give more power to Kody in this situation by damning Meri for her vulnerability? Who the hell cares if Meri was going to leave him. She should have. 

I agree with your points....to a point.

Meri's life was horrible, the emotional abuse by Kootie was intolerable.  And if she wanted to find someone else, more power to her.  But ultimately she needs to own it.  Stand up and stop with the fabricated stories about "danger to the family",

She was catfished, not her fault - she's the kind of women that catfishers target.  And she has no need to apologize for that.  She was looking for happiness and thought she had found it.  No apologies necessary, especially to Kootie.  He was the root cause of the issue.

But lying about it is what gives Kootie the power.  It makes her cower and look weak when she should be telling him to go suck an egg, it was his fault from the get go and she had every right to try to find a way out.  Make him own the fact that he drove her to it.

[TurtlePower]

27 minutes ago, Cetacean said:

I agree with your points....to a point.

Meri's life was horrible, the emotional abuse by Kootie was intolerable.  And if she wanted to find someone else, more power to her.  But ultimately she needs to own it.  Stand up and stop with the fabricated stories about "danger to the family",

She was catfished, not her fault - she's the kind of women that catfishers target.  And she has no need to apologize for that.  She was looking for happiness and thought she had found it.  No apologies necessary, especially to Kootie.  He was the root cause of the issue.

But lying about it is what gives Kootie the power.  It makes her cower and look weak when she should be telling him to go suck an egg, it was his fault from the get go and she had every right to try to find a way out.  Make him own the fact that he drove her to it.

THIS x1,000! 

[magemaud]

21 hours ago, OldWiseOne said:

Did anyone else think Meri has had a lot of botox? Her forehead was super smooth and didn't move at all, nor did her eyebrows. Once I started looking at it I couldn't see anything else!

I never can get past her shiny leather face! 

[jacourt]

wouldnt it be great to get the reaction to the whole situation from a functional polygamous family?

[NoWhammies]

18 minutes ago, jacourt said:

wouldnt it be great to get the reaction to the whole situation from a functional polygamous family?

I don't think the failure here is a function of polygamy, per se. It's a failure of the participants in the relationship(s) for multiple reasons. So a functional polygamous family wouldn't necessarily have any more of an accurate take on it than anyone else does. Just because I am currently in a monogamous relationship doesn't mean from my observational standpoint I can truly know why another monogamous relationship has failed. I can have my suspicious, but I'm not in the relationship, so the truth is I have no idea. 

All kinds of relationships can work--monogamous, polyamorous, polygamous, polyandrous, asexual, or whatever type. How well they function is entirely reliant on the participants--on all participants, not just one. It's about mutual respect, love, mutual consent, agreement on the boundaries, compassion, willingness to forgive and work through things, ability to effectively communicate, etc. etc. etc. It takes a ton of emotional intelligence and maturity, communication skills, thoughtfulness, ability to compromise, and empathy (among other things) to build any functional relationship.

Many, if not all, of the participants in the Brown marriage(s) seem to lack most (if not all) of these important fundamentals. It sounds like they never even really agreed what they were getting into in the first place when they married other than to gather wives and have babies. If there's no plan, or if any participant doesn't abide by any part of the plan, then the relationship will struggle.

In this case, there's no plan and even the minimal planning they had isn't something that they all agree on or abide by. Add to that some apparent personality disorders, some undiagnosed mental health issues, an oppressive religious framework, money problems, and low emotional intelligence, and it's amazing it's taken this long. I suspect television is the glue that held the Brown fambily together.

TL/DR: When the bones are good, the rest don't matter. When the Browns are the bones, it's bound to shatter. 

Edited February 1, 2022 by NoWhammies

[lamadeleine]

Just thinking about the whole Christine leaving when she did situation. The wives have said repeatedly through the series that jealousy is a part of the deal when you enter into a polygamous relationship- the managing of that jealousy (aka, stuffing it down, sublimating it, pretending it doesn't exist, etc) is part of their "job" as a sister-wife because the bigger pitcher is doing whatever needs to be done to keep family unity and harmony so they can all go their heavenly planet/s at the end of the day. There seems to be a lot of importance placed on how successfully one does or doesn't manage negative fillings, and baked into that is the idea that those fillings are each and every wife's responsibility to dil with on their own without any ril support from the other wives. It also doesn't seem required that the husband do anything to help because that's part of the wife's personal responsibility. For someone so indoctrinated into this lifestyle, I can imagine Christine spending years hating herself and thinking she was a bad person and terrible sister-wife because of these very human fillings that she couldn't quite get past. Also add to that for years, I believe Christine felt some huge responsibility to show this lifestyle off in its best light, even if all of us could see the sham that it was/is. Kody spun some tale about how this show was going to normalize polygamy and that they were going to be the beacon of light for all these "good polygamists" hiding in the shadows...so keep sweet and don't let any cracks show. As her world expanded, ironically via the show, and as it became more and more apparent that Kodster was barely keeping up his mandated ends of the bargain, I think her idealism started to shift and she started to finally see that jealousy for what it was...a sign that this lifestyle doesn't work for her anymore.

[Roslyn]

4 hours ago, laurakaye said:

For once, I need this interviewer to see through Robyn's constant tears.  She cried in Part One, and we know she is going to cry in Part Two and Three.  At some point, if your interview subject turns on the waterworks after every single question, wouldn't you have to assume that she's using it as a ploy and a way to get around really answering?  It's like, "Robyn, how are you doing today?"  Robyn: (bottom lip trembles, delicately dabs away an eye booger).  "Robyn, I like your blouse - did you buy it at JC Penny in 1983?"  Robyn: (looks up, frowns until her lower lip touches her chin, asks for a tissue).  I want to see this interviewer just freakin' toss her a box of Kleenex after her very first question and say, "girl, just put these on your lap, I know you're going to need them."  Seriously, the pandering and simpering everyone does in the presence of Robyn's fake tears is beyond belief.

I suspect that the interviewer a.) took lessons in Brown Family Therapy Speak and b.) was given specific directions on how she is allowed to talk to both Kody and Robyn because of his anger issues and her histrionics.

[Mr. Miner]

When POS Kody comes on my TV screen, my mind wanders and all I can see is horrible things happening to him.

[deirdra]

23 hours ago, xwordfanatik said:

I seem to remember Meri saying she had a miscarriage when Mariah was, I think, 12?  So apparently Kootie was still being conjugal with her up until then.  

Kody & Meri both saying they hadn't been intimate in 10 yrs and his strange choice of an analog for how to avoid Covid - "if you don't want to get pregnant, don't have sex!" made me wonder for the first time if not all of Meri's problems with fertility were hers.  Did Kootie also freeze her out when she "deceived him when they got married" and when she had the miscarriage?

[eskimo]

1 hour ago, lamadeleine said:

Just thinking about the whole Christine leaving when she did situation. The wives have said repeatedly through the series that jealousy is a part of the deal when you enter into a polygamous relationship- the managing of that jealousy (aka, stuffing it down, sublimating it, pretending it doesn't exist, etc) is part of their "job" as a sister-wife because the bigger pitcher is doing whatever needs to be done to keep family unity and harmony so they can all go their heavenly planet/s at the end of the day. There seems to be a lot of importance placed on how successfully one does or doesn't manage negative fillings, and baked into that is the idea that those fillings are each and every wife's responsibility to dil with on their own without any ril support from the other wives. It also doesn't seem required that the husband do anything to help because that's part of the wife's personal responsibility. For someone so indoctrinated into this lifestyle, I can imagine Christine spending years hating herself and thinking she was a bad person and terrible sister-wife because of these very human fillings that she couldn't quite get past. Also add to that for years, I believe Christine felt some huge responsibility to show this lifestyle off in its best light, even if all of us could see the sham that it was/is. Kody spun some tale about how this show was going to normalize polygamy and that they were going to be the beacon of light for all these "good polygamists" hiding in the shadows...so keep sweet and don't let any cracks show. As her world expanded, ironically via the show, and as it became more and more apparent that Kodster was barely keeping up his mandated ends of the bargain, I think her idealism started to shift and she started to finally see that jealousy for what it was...a sign that this lifestyle doesn't work for her anymore.

Exactly this!  The women are taught from birth that marriage is supposed to suck (for the women).  The more horrible your experience, the better.  It means you're overcoming....something or other.... by staying, even if you don't actually overcome anything.  The real point is to lift the man up on a pedestal, don't annoy him, and stuff it until you die.  And as a reward?  You get to spend eternity with the man who made your life a living hell.  Yay!

[Kellyee]

Quote

I wish Maddie would've gone into more detail when she referred to Meri as a monster who terrorized her her entire childhood and how happy she was to be away from her and her ugly personality.

I wonder if Meri is as bad as Maddie made it seem, or if Maddie is prone to exaggeration like her father (Christine MURDERED our intimacy with betrayal!).  I'm sure Meri was a bitch, but I question whether she was really a monster. And if she was, then Janelle left her kids in a house living with a monster, which makes her just as bad as Meri.

 

 

 

 

[Granny58]

4 hours ago, bichonblitz said:

Perfectly said. Why can't she do that? 

I would LOVE to see her say this.  She and all of us would feel such a relief!

[Pickleinthemiddle]

14 hours ago, tinderbox said:

All very true, but from the day Kody married Robyn, jealousy took over every thinking part of Christine and it festered.  We saw it season after season.  She became completely insecure in her marriage and she questioned her importance in the family.  That green eyed monster is what brought the end to her marriage to Kody.  (I think she’s still jealous of Robyn!)  It did for Meri, as well,  but for Meri the jealousy happened years earlier with Kody’s marriage to Janelle.

I don't think it was the jealousy, I think it was that things changed.  I think right from the start Kody was spending more time at Robyn's than anyone else's house.  I think there was obvious favoritism toward Robyn and her kids.  I think for the first time in his life Kody was in love.  I think she worked at trying to make her marriage to Kody better for years.  Finally realizing that no matter what she did it was never going to be enough to make him want to be here and present in the moment when he was with her and her children.  At some point she decided her happiness was more important that the family.

[Jeanne222]

I think being on this show ruined them.  Too much money.  Too much social influence.  Too much of everything. 

"Didn't we almost have it all!"

[kimaken]

1 hour ago, Kellyee said:

I wonder if Meri is as bad as Maddie made it seem, or if Maddie is prone to exaggeration like her father (Christine MURDERED our intimacy with betrayal!).  I'm sure Meri was a bitch, but I question whether she was really a monster. And if she was, then Janelle left her kids in a house living with a monster, which makes her just as bad as Meri.

THIS! Also, wasn't it in their book and mentioned in an earlier season (7? 8?) that when Maddie was born, Janelle couldn't breastfeed her so, since Meri had recently given birth to Mariah, she took on breastfeeding Maddie, too. I also recall when Maddie got engaged and came home to tell the family, she included Meri in the announcement to Janelle and Kody--so I don't think Meri was all that horrible awful all the time. I think after the catfishing, and then later Meri probably criticizing Maddie's work ethic in regards to LLR sales, that Maddie lashed out in anger and more than likely over-exaggerated things.

I think the truth lies somewhere in between "good mother-figure" and "mean, hateful monster". We all know that Meri is selfish and self-centered so I don't think she was a fantastic 2nd mon, but I can't buy that she's a truly awful monster, either.

[Teafortwo]

17 hours ago, Soobs said:

My takeaway is that none of these people have the emotional maturity or insight to figure out these relationships in a somewhat healthy way. The fact that they went on this long is a testament to their religious TLC programming.

FIFY 

[magemaud]

3 hours ago, lamadeleine said:

the managing of that jealousy (aka, stuffing it down, sublimating it, pretending it doesn't exist, etc) is part of their "job" as a sister-wife because the bigger pitcher is doing whatever needs to be done to keep family unity and harmony so they can all go their heavenly planet/s at the end of the day.

I still can't figure out why any of these people would want to spend eternity with the others since they can barely stand each other now here on Earth. 

[LilyD]

4 hours ago, NoWhammies said:

Many, if not all, of the participants in the Brown marriage(s) seem to lack most (if not all) of these important fundamentals. It sounds like they never even really agreed what they were getting into in the first place when they married other than to gather wives and have babies. If there's no plan, or if any participant doesn't abide by any part of the plan, then the relationship will struggle.

 Brilliant analysis and spot on! I thought I should elaborate a little on one thing that you said (I put it in bold): It seems they wanted polygamy and everything it entails, just not the hassle of having to deal with other women who happen to love your husband too. They’ve said so on multiple occasions on the show:

• You don’t want to see your husband leave the house to go on a date with another wife.
• You don’t discuss your relationship with him with any of the others.
• It’s awkward to receive a text from him in front of the other wives.
• If Kody calls one wife, she leaves the rest to talk in private.
• It’s awkward when he shows affection to a wife in front of the others

The list of examples is endless, I only named a few.On top, they don’t want to share a huge mansion, let alone share a kitchen or spend time together unless they really have to. Well, maybe apart from Christine and Janelle?

 There’s nothing in their characters, beliefs and visions on what a relationship should look like, that is even remotely close to a polygamous lifestyle…. So why did they choose it and struggled with it for decades? They were dysfunctional from the start!

[Bmglmr]

9 hours ago, TurtlePower said:

This is a fair assessment. And I wouldn’t have any issue with Meri if she’d stop lying and pretending she’s “strong, brave, boss up, etc”, because by this observation, she is a brainwashed, quivering pile of goo. It’s ok to feel scared, afraid of change and not have confidence—just be real about it. It’s relatable actually! But Meri takes it and makes herself an airbrushed jerk. 

I think the reason she does all of that is for self preservation. She likely doesn’t really believe any of it but is desperately trying to. I agree with @Yeah No…I think she has been manipulated and brainwashed for so long that she is paralyzed with fear. This is her way of try to control an uncontrollable situation.

[WhatsUpDummy]

3 hours ago, Kellyee said:

I wonder if Meri is as bad as Maddie made it seem, or if Maddie is prone to exaggeration like her father (Christine MURDERED our intimacy with betrayal!).  I'm sure Meri was a bitch, but I question whether she was really a monster. And if she was, then Janelle left her kids in a house living with a monster, which makes her just as bad as Meri.

 

 

 

 

I wonder if it's as simple as Meri being the disciplinarian and Maddie views her as the "bad mom" who was all about timeouts, yelling, or spanking (No idea if the Browns spanked their kids, just me wondering).  Christine was all sunshine and rainbows, Janelle has said she didn't do much in terms of discipline, and we all know Kody's f---ing useless.  That leaves Meri with the not so fun job of being the tough parent.  We saw it on the Fourth of July episode back in the earlier seasons; one of Robyn's kids was crying because someone hit her and all the parents are standing around doing nothing and Meri had to take charge and lay down the law and tell the other kids to knock it off.  I really don't see Meri being abusive to children and I'd love to hear more details from Maddie. 

Edited February 1, 2022 by WhatsUpDummy

[WhatAmIWatching]

2 hours ago, Jeanne222 said:

I think being on this show ruined them

I don't believe that the show was the sole reason, but I can agree that it was a factor.

  I cannot imagine how awful it is for them to see (on a globally viewed tv show) what their husband or other wives -or even the kids- really think about them when they view the TH's.
 

  It would crush my heart to have heated moments -with my husband/family/friends- and have off-the-cuff statements made in anger, captured for eternity, and made available for public consumption. Especially if I hadn't known how upset someone was in the original moment.
 

Kody gives zero effs about humiliating his wives publicly (except one!) and it makes me want to kick him until he cries. The fact that the TH's are taped months after the fact makes everything that much worse. You'd think he'd have the decency or kindness to soften his words by then, but nope. He's such a dirtbag.

[Tuxcat]

13 minutes ago, WhatsUpDummy said:

I wonder if it's as simple as Meri being the disciplinarian and Maddie views her as the "bad mom" who was all about timeouts, yelling, or spanking (No idea if the Browns spanked their kids, just me wondering).  Christine was all sunshine and rainbows, Janelle has said she didn't do much in terms of discipline, and we all know Kody's f---ing useless.  That leaves Meri with the not so fun job of being the tough parent.  We saw it on the Fourth of July episode back in the earlier seasons; one of Robyn's kids was crying because someone hit her and all the parents are standing around doing nothing and Meri had to take charge and lay down the law and tell the other kids to knock it off.  I really don't see Meri being abusive to children and I'd love to hear more details from Maddie. 

I also think we really need to factor in how the show shaped the children's views over time. It's common of course for families to identify "scapegoats" and "black sheep." There will always be power dynamics and shifting alliances - even in normal families. Bonding over the common hatred of one or two members is unfortunately normal in the group process.

Meri was branded almost from the beginning in part by Janelle whose coping mechanism was to avoid avoid avoid. So Meri by default was seen as aggressive with pretty much anything she said or did from that point forward. Neither were skilled at negotiation. Both were problematic. But Meri gets the label that sticks. Mean Meri. Whereas Janelle gets unbothered logical Janelle. These labels stick despite both women making some seriously questionable decisions over the years and both women still - never learning to communicate effectively.

And over the years as Meri was pushed further and further out of the family dynamic (because Christine and Janelle had 12 freaking children and ARE the family), Meri was the odd one out. Labeled unlovable. And the show reinforces this narrative over and over and over again season after season. Meri is selfish. Meri is a brat. Meri is a monster.

Of course there is truth to the story and a bit of chicken and egg. Was she that way because...or was she that way anyway. But either way the children were taught by their moms, and by their father, and by the show, that Meri is insufferable.  So anything she ever said and did would be viewed through this lens. 

 

 

 

[b2H]

27 minutes ago, WhatAmIWatching said:

I don't believe that the show was the sole reason, but I can agree that it was a factor.

  I cannot imagine how awful it is for them to see (on a globally viewed tv show) what their husband or other wives -or even the kids- really think about them when they view the TH's.
 

  It would crush my heart to have heated moments -with my husband/family/friends- and have off-the-cuff statements made in anger, captured for eternity, and made available for public consumption. Especially if I hadn't known how upset someone was in the original moment.
 

Kody gives zero effs about humiliating his wives publicly (except one!) and it makes me want to kick him until he cries. The fact that the TH's are taped months after the fact makes everything that much worse. You'd think he'd have the decency or kindness to soften his words by then, but nope. He's such a dirtbag.

Kodouche is entitled.  Pure and simple.  Nothing matters but what HE wants and if someone gets hurt along the way, it’s too bad, so sad.  At some point, he will maybe figure out that the world doesn’t revolve around him, but I wouldn’t hang by the neck waiting for that revelation.

[Teafortwo]

55 minutes ago, WhatsUpDummy said:

I wonder if it's as simple as Meri being the disciplinarian and Maddie views her as the "bad mom" who was all about timeouts, yelling, or spanking (No idea if the Browns spanked their kids, just me wondering).  Christine was all sunshine and rainbows, Janelle has said she didn't do much in terms of discipline, and we all know Kody's f---ing useless.  That leaves Meri with the not so fun job of being the tough parent. 

It's possible that Maddie observed Meri's (mis)treatment of her mother, and perhaps her mother's private reactions to it.

[MMEButterfly]

On 1/31/2022 at 9:25 AM, TeeMo said:

Can we keep the first part of your question and then add “What.does.the.nanny.do????”

If those questions are not asked and answered the whole one-on-one is a complete waste of time. 

[Cetacean]

6 minutes ago, MMEButterfly said:

If those questions are not asked and answered the whole one-on-one is a complete waste of time. 

Every single Tell All Nothing has been a complete waste of time.  The moderators chosen are obviously given parameters, not one has ever asked the hard questions.

It's all meaningless fluff, all promise but no delivery which is exactly why it's a mystery to me as to why there are a zillion viewers.

[LilyD]

5 hours ago, Kellyee said:

I wonder if Meri is as bad as Maddie made it seem, or if Maddie is prone to exaggeration like her father (Christine MURDERED our intimacy with betrayal!).  I'm sure Meri was a bitch, but I question whether she was really a monster.

This! And  Maddie is as stubborn as Meri, so neither is going to give in during an argument. And Maddie isn't particularly good in dealing with criticism nor could she handle it when someone put her in place like Meri would do when needed.

Meri, like her or not, indeed had the very ungrateful task of being the one to rein in chaos and to tell the kids off as someone else noted. Janelle never really bothered and Christine was often so occupied with other things such as the little ones that she often missed what was going on with the older kids.

[goofygirl]

7 hours ago, jacourt said:

wouldnt it be great to get the reaction to the whole situation from a functional polygamous family?

IS there a functional polygamous family??

[mscav]

On 1/30/2022 at 10:05 PM, SuzieQ said:

OMG!!  Kody is basically begging Meri to go and SHE'S STILL WAITING!!  His last comment of "How could that be enough for anybody?" says it all.  She is pathetic to stay!

I think she stays to be a thorn in his side. My guess is when the show is gone so is she.

[mscav]

On 1/30/2022 at 10:39 PM, Tuxcat said:

Kody again mentioned the moment that "changed us" was when Truely almost died. But no follow up question? Makes me wonder if she was iced out a long time ago too. She definitely was always in the doghouse with him unless she did the "happy, fun, sweet, life of the party Christine." He was so annoyed with her when she dared to try to advocate for herself or her kids.

Christine most likely called him out on almost killing her daughter and napping at Robyn's while she took her to the ER. You know in that asshat's mind it was Christine's fault for expecting him to watch her to being with. Also for someone who keeps talking about being scared of his kids dying so much (WTF????) He never wants to spend a dime on medical care for them. Why pay for insurance or a wellness visit when you can be buying up plague property and some of the ugliest home interior trinkets and furniture on earth.

[Absolom]

50 minutes ago, Cetacean said:

Every single Tell All Nothing has been a complete waste of time.  The moderators chosen are obviously given parameters, not one has ever asked the hard questions.

It's all meaningless fluff, all promise but no delivery which is exactly why it's a mystery to me as to why there are a zillion viewers.

It baffles me, too.  I believe this was so far the highest rated show of the season.  It may have been a dull night on TV or people think skip the season and watch a recap show.

[mscav]

On 1/31/2022 at 1:10 PM, NoWhammies said:

This 100%. Meri did what she did. What puts her on the back foot is that she's playing defense when all along she should've been playing offense..."Of course I sought out intimacy elsewhere you massive douche. You dumped me and treated me like garbage. You left me so I left you even though I didn't leave the family. I apologize for my dishonesty but not for what I did. Now where's my apology for how you treated me?" Instead, she makes her self pitiable by begging to be let back in the family and she makes herself wrong by refusing to be honest with herself or anyone else. It's not a good look. 

If she ever said that I'd actually gain respect for her.

[truebluesmoky]

Questions I wish the interviewer would ask:

”Robyn, you are in a unique position in the family because all five of your children live at home and do not need to leave the house to work or attend school. Would you have been as “compliant” with Kody’s rules if Dayton worked outside the home or Aurora was living in a college dorm and still wanted to see you?”

This has driven me crazy all season, because their situations aren’t at all comparable. Christine had Ysabel’s surgery and a pregnant Mykelti. Janelle had two working sons and a daughter with special needs kids and a husband who works a ton.

”Kody, you seem to resent the term “abandonment” but how else would you describe your behavior with regard to Ysabel’s surgery? Or being there for your pregnant daughter or your grandchildren? Or even going to visit Meri as a “friend” while she was following your rules? Or making anywhere near the effort for Truely that you make for Sol and Ari?”