S39.E04: Plan Z

[TVbitch]

This is the second week my DVR cut off the end bit. Can somebody fill me in on what Chelsea had to say about her outser? 

You could tell Probst was trying not to smile after Noura got benched. 

[CloudySky]

I thought Sandra was being sarcastic about Elaine "this one never knows anything" said tongue in cheek.

This season is pretty funny and entertaining so far. I like Missy but she needs to dial it back a tiny bit. She's on the bottom of her alliance with Elizabeth/Elaine and they could turn on her quick.

I really like Kellee. Her facial expressions and Noura commentary cracked me up. The bun idol move remains brilliant and she got herself out of a sticky Dan situation early on very diplomatically.

A lot of people who were on the bottom that first episode seem to have found their place in the thribe. Jason and Elaine or instance. Noura being the exception of course.

[fishcakes]

8 hours ago, sigmaforce86 said:

Question about Survivor rules - Once Chelsea was voted out and got the "bring me your torch" was she allowed to pull the idol out of her bag and give it to Dean?

I kind of remember someone here talking about this, saying that once the votes are read, the player is officially out of the game and therefore the idol is dead and can't be passed on to someone else. I don't know if that's the official rule, but it makes sense.

Quote

I missed the majority of the episode - everything from just after Rob's comment that Noura is the last person who should be a blindfold challenge caller to the losing teams arrival at tribal.  I could go back and watch on demand but my only real question is how in the world did big mouth Noura manage to keep quiet about what really goes on at idol island. 

So you missed her Great Lie about how she knew what the challenge was but was only allowed to tell them if they let her pick her role? It was quite the spectacle. She thought she fooled them, which was  crazy because they were openly skeptical and questioning her and poking holes in it immediately at which point she was like, "IT'S TOO LATE I'M THE CALLER NO MORE TALKING!" Kellee's face was particularly priceless because she knew that Noura had dug herself into such a big hole that she would never be able to reveal what really happened at idol island, so that made Kellee's secret safe too. Then her tribe benched her at the challenge, which was was hilarious.

2 hours ago, phlebas said:

I'm in, but would CBS air a whole season of people just getting hit in the nuts over and over? 

America's Funniest Home Videos has been on for 30 years and it's pretty much just guys getting junk-punched and the occasional nitrous oxide video.

Aw man, those clips from early seasons made me sad because Jeff's pre-Botox face was so gorgeous. As long as they were showing old clips, I wish that when Chelsea was talking about how she enjoyed blindsides, they had dropped in the one of One World Kat saying the same thing a few minutes before she got blindsided and went out crying.

I'm pretty impressed with Missy, Elaine, Kellee, and maybe Lauren, who seemed to be the one behind benching Noura. Janet seems promising too, although she was mostly invisible this episode. I'm not getting much from any of the guys yet though, but Jason was so collected during the challenge and seems to have recovered from being on the outs early on, so he could go far.

Edited October 17, 2019 by fishcakes

[Rachel RSL]

58 minutes ago, TVbitch said:

This is the second week my DVR cut off the end bit. Can somebody fill me in on what Chelsea had to say about her outser?  

Basically she just lamented the fact that she was blindsided and didn't even make the merge.

9 hours ago, amazingracefan said:

The editors virtually always show us the potential names for elimination upfront, Missy  wasn't mentioned at all.

After Missy spoke to Elaine, there was a confessional from Elaine saying that she didn't really trust Missy after seeing how easily she switches her target (paraphrasing, of course) and it was one of the last confessionals before they went to TC so Missy was definitely on the radar.

5 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

No, and this season is making me see more and more how much Survivor has rewarded ruthless behavior from women.  That little clip of  Parvati saying she was going to lie and flirt her way into getting what she wanted and giggling about it, then setting up that poor kid for humiliation and all the women laughing at him -- ugh! It might work, but it gives me the Mike Boogie creeps.

Sandra, on the other hand, always played the game like she had no heart and people admire her for it. I doubt if she would be as well liked if she were a man.

I don't think Survivor has rewarded ruthless behaviour from women.  And I definitely don't see how flirting is considered ruthless. (Especially in Parvati's case, her flirting was so mild, she never even got close to being in a showmance) In that particular example you mentioned, nobody set Erik up for humiliation.  They presented Erik with the most preposterous plan in order to convince him to give up his immunity and it was so absurd, only a complete moron would have fallen for it.  They weren't laughing at him to be mean, they were laughing (just like all the viewers at home) because they couldn't believe he actually fell for it. Honestly, he was a nice kid but he deserves to be mocked for all time for that bonehead move. 

As for Sandra having no heart, if you read almost any interview from people who have played the game with her, almost everyone has said how well-liked Sandra was.  So while she may play a strategic/non-emotional game, she definitely isn't heartless when it comes to the people she's playing with. 

4 hours ago, MrsR said:

Rob didn't like the shelter they gave them so he rebuilt it. 

Ha! I remember in one of his earlier seasons, they provided them with wood and tools and, while the other tribe tapped together a few sticks of wood, Rob basically built his tribe a fancy condo complete with a porch swing.

Edited October 17, 2019 by Rachel RSL
Pavarti is a cheese

[Ms Blue Jay]

31 minutes ago, Rachel RSL said:

Basically she just lamented the fact that she was blindsided and didn't even make the merge.

And that she was a superfan, I think.  

52 minutes ago, fishcakes said:

Aw man, those clips from early seasons made me sad because Jeff's pre-Botox face was so gorgeous.

Dimples McGee!

He definitely spends way too much time in the sun, so I guess that's why he's so concerned about aging.  After all these years/seasons, I'm shocked that nobody else has ever subbed for him.  This guy's a workhorse.

[MissEwa]

I got an inkling Chelsea was going the second she started talking about how comfortable she was, although I have to admit I would have preferred Dean. I feel like whenever there's a showmance that needs breaking up it's automatically the woman that gets targeted and so I was quite happy early on when they were looking to buck that trend. Alas. 

TC was interesting though. Given they were trying for a blindside, there was too much talk about how the plan changed and that really should have made her nervous - and her reactions made it seem like it did, but I know they splice them in randomly so who knows? On the other hand, she's never been to IotI so I don't think anyone thought they had to worry about an idol.  

29 minutes ago, Rachel RSL said:

After Missy spoke to Elaine, there was a confessional from Elaine saying that she didn't really trust Missy after seeing how easily she switches her target (paraphrasing, of course) and it was one of the last confessionals before they went to TC so Missy was definitely on the radar.

Yep. They definitely planted the seed there but it was so last-minute it seemed like an afterthought. I would have been surprised but not shocked if she'd gone. 

Flashbacks to Boston Rob in early seasons really emphasise how long this damn show has been running. He looked like an actual child in that All Stars clip. 

[truthaboutluv]

Quote

If it didnt' mean Noura would get booted I kind of wanted Purple to loose just as karma as reniging on their agreement to name her as the caller. What made them think they could violate what for as far as they knew were official rules connected with Idol Island? It just left a bad taste in my mouth and portrayed them as jerks.

Except that's just it. Noura sucked so badly with her lie that no one bought the crap she was selling and so the tribe saw through that "I have to be the caller" nonsense. Then she compounded it by sucking during the practice challenge. Sorry, but how were they jerks for simply being perceptive enough to realize that one, Noura was full of it with that having to be the caller crap and two, that she sucked at it and would have made them lose.

The tribe sitting Noura down was the best thing they could have done for her. Because had she been the caller, they for sure would have lost, which would have put an even bigger target on her back, to go along with the existing one. And worse, she would have lost her vote, so she would have had even less power to try and save herself. 

Quote

So far no one really stands out to root for...damn I miss Christian and Gabby...memorable, likeable players.

Christian sure, Gabby no. We have Karishma this season for the role of whiny player who boo-hoos all the time about not being liked, they're about to go home, etc. Plus I'm still bitter at the way dumbass Christian went along with Gabby's whiny ass plan that blew up his game. 

Quote

That moment was perfect and almost lets me forgive the editors for failing again to show any interaction between the two people on a tribe that have gone to IOI. Seriously- you show Kellee talking about wanting to build a bond with whoever it is and Noura goes, and we know this woman's filter is faulty at best.... and they show us nothing!?

I have to just assume that the editors are not showing these conversations for now because they had no bearing on the game. Last week we saw that Vince was immediately eliminated, so really no point in showing the conversation he and Elizabeth had about it. And unless something came out of any convo Noura and Kellie had, I can see why they would figure it's not worth showing. 

Quote

The editors virtually always show us the potential names for elimination upfront, Missy  wasn't mentioned at all.

Not always. I can remember clearly that when Jeremy was blindsided in his first season, his name was never shown being discussed before the tribal council. The only hint suggesting that Jeremy might have been eliminated was that for the first time in the season, they showed him discussing feeling mentally and physically spent. 

Quote

It was even worse, I think it was something sort of like, "Noura is very perceptive, but she can't really perceive correctly." 

I think Rob was just playing on the "perception is reality" expression which is essentially saying that one's perception is their reality but it may not be another person's perception and by that token, their reality. And that's why after his Noura is perceptive comment, he added the "but is it reality". So I guess you can argue that the expression may not make sense but I did get what Rob was saying. 

Quote

If you can manage it, pre merge Kumbaya Survivor is a great thing.  Going into the swap and merge with a united tribe is a huge advantage.

This exactly. It's part of why Rob won Redemption Island. And that season Sophie won. Coach and others made sure that tribe was as tight as possible. Same with Kim's winning season. 

Quote

Then we have the obvious contrast of Rob and Sandra.  Rob was repeatedly kind to people.  I remember how understanding Rob was to Sue Hawk after she felt disrespected by naked Richard Hatch (and Probst).  Rob was also very gentle with a few people whose  mental illness was starting to surface. 

Yeah Rob can be kind but the thing about him, he also can unleash in his ITM's and that's come back and bite him in the ass at times. I remember he was genuinely sad over losing his friendship with Grant. And the friendship ended because as the season was airing, Grant saw some comments from Rob and things he didn't know had been said that upset him. That said, his kindness towards Philip was definitely how he helped wrangle Philip's crazy and kept him loyal to him. 

[amazingracefan]

2 hours ago, ohcomeon said:

I agree. I watched him on his first season of Survivor but not any of the returning ones and I don't have a clear memory of him on that one. I really didn't like him on Amazing Race. But like all of us, he's matured over the years. I find his and Sandra's insights funny.

I liked him on The Amazing Race.  I didn't see his first Survivor season, didn't really like him that much on later seasons, he just seemed too cocky.  But on TAR I thought him and Amber were a great team, one of the best of that period of the race.  I would guess that people didn't like the idea of gameplay on TAR and some just rooted against them as they were seen as cashing in on their fame. 

But I never had any of that background as I had never seen them before.  Just good competitive racers who didn't get involved in silly arguments.  A lot of the audience seem to really want villains on reality shows, but reality shows are more interesting portraying people as complex rather than simple heroes/villains, leave that for blockbuster films and comic books.

The comments from the 'gallery' at tribal are really quite sparse and don't seem that important to me.  Just a couple of brief one liners an episode.

I saw Sandra on her seasons and she never really appealed to me, just not much character there.

[ljenkins782]

24 minutes ago, truthaboutluv said:

Except that's just it. Noura sucked so badly with her lie that no one bought the crap she was selling and so the tribe saw through that "I have to be the caller" nonsense. Then she compounded it by sucking during the practice challenge. Sorry, but how were they jerks for simply being perceptive enough to realize that one, Noura was full of it with that having to be the caller crap and two, that she sucked at it and would have made them lose.

The tribe sitting Noura down was the best thing they could have done for her. Because had she been the caller, they for sure would have lost, which would have put an even bigger target on her back, to go along with the existing one. And worse, she would have lost her vote, so she would have had even less power to try and save herself. 

Noura's attempt to sell her tribe on making her the caller was comically bad. Just way overplayed her hand. If you're going to pretend you have critical information to share, perhaps you should think up some actual information to supply. Plus, once the information was shared, there was no imperative for them to follow through on making her the caller. 

Regarding that challenge, I didn't love the water element. When you're blindfolded and disoriented, a giant vat of water hitting you out of the blue would be incredibly jarring, particularly for the person who wasn't pulling the cord and therefore didn't know when it would be happening. If you happened to be looking up, that blindfold isn't going to be much protection against the sting of all that water in your eyes.

Quote

Flashbacks to Boston Rob in early seasons really emphasise how long this damn show has been running. He looked like an actual child in that All Stars clip. 

The flashbacks to Sandra on HvVs reminded me that she never looked better than in that season. That was the best shape she's been in and her best haircut too. 

She and Rob look like they'd both benefit from the standard Survivor diet for the time they're out there.

[Special K]

My favorite part of this season so far has been Sandra's zingers from the spy shack.  I LOL every time.

[willco]

2 hours ago, TVbitch said:

This is the second week my DVR cut off the end bit. Can somebody fill me in on what Chelsea had to say about her outser? 

You could tell Probst was trying not to smile after Noura got benched. 

CBS has a sneaky habit of doing that with a lot of shows ! A couple different ones I watch, after the last line I switch the channel and a show on another network has already started. I don't think it's much on Survivor, perhaps a minute, but it does mess things up a little. I watch a lot of stuff live, so I do notice it. 

I think the biggest things for me with this season is that I don't really have strong feelings about any player, good or bad. And usually by this time, there's at least one player I really hate ! Maybe there is still a chance for that to happen, once the tribes get whittled down a little more.

[Rachel RSL]

40 minutes ago, amazingracefan said:

Just good competitive racers who didn't get involved in silly arguments

Or silly little things like stopping to help a team who had been in an accident and whose car was flipped upside down even though every other team that came upon the scene stopped to make sure everyone was ok.  I'm thinking that's the reason people might have been rooting against them on TAR, not because of any sort of gameplay.    I like Rob (never cared for Amber) but that was a dick move all around.

[Ms Blue Jay]

2 hours ago, TVbitch said:

This is the second week my DVR cut off the end bit. Can somebody fill me in on what Chelsea had to say about her outser? 

You could tell Probst was trying not to smile after Noura got benched. 

My PVR gives me the option to end every tape 5 minutes late (or 15, or 30!  Or start early!).   I only just started using this option and I LOVE IT.  

33 minutes ago, willco said:

I think the biggest things for me with this season is that I don't really have strong feelings about any player, good or bad. And usually by this time, there's at least one player I really hate ! Maybe there is still a chance for that to happen, once the tribes get whittled down a little more.

I was thinking that too.  It's a good cast.  

Edited October 17, 2019 by Ms Blue Jay

[amazingracefan]

2 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

Or silly little things like stopping to help a team who had been in an accident and whose car was flipped upside down even though every other team that came upon the scene stopped to make sure everyone was ok.  I'm thinking that's the reason people might have been rooting against them on TAR, not because of any sort of gameplay.    I like Rob (never cared for Amber) but that was a dick move all around.

There's likely some dick move by every racer at some point, but I still feel like people were ready to hate on them, like they were meant to be villains, and scrutinize every moment and not see the humour in some other moments as well.

[peachmangosteen]

10 hours ago, ohcomeon said:

I don't think [Missy] cared who went home as long as it wasn't Karishma, Jason or Jamal.

Jason and Jamal aren't on Missy's tribe.

Quote

The Noura thing was hilarious. I loved it when they voted to sit her down. But does this mean she loses her vote in the next tribal council?

I wondered about that, too. Did she lose her vote only if they had been to this TC or just in the next TC she goes to?

[mojoween]

2 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

Or silly little things like stopping to help a team who had been in an accident and whose car was flipped upside down even though every other team that came upon the scene stopped to make sure everyone was ok.  I'm thinking that's the reason people might have been rooting against them on TAR, not because of any sort of gameplay.    I like Rob (never cared for Amber) but that was a dick move all around.

MeatBlock came first and whoo boy was that polarizing.  Personally I loved it.

Rob in Marquesas was the spawn of Satan and when he and Sean were bounced I partied like it was my birthday. But somehow on All-Stars, I fell in love.  Probably because of the shelter.  I’m a sucker for a handyman.  And in the clip they showed it reminded me of how damn good-looking he was.  Not that he isn’t now, but he’s older, and I’m older, and we all look...softer.

Also speaking of good-looking, because I am apparently that shallow, but damn Karishma is so pretty.

[Tdoc72]

6 hours ago, fishcakes said:

As long as they were showing old clips, I wish that when Chelsea was talking about how she enjoyed blindsides, they had dropped in the one of One World Kat saying the same thing a few minutes before she got blindsided and went out crying.

Was Kat the one who cried saying no one would date her b/c she didn’t make the merge? 

5 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

And that she was a superfan, I think.  

Dimples McGee!

He definitely spends way too much time in the sun, so I guess that's why he's so concerned about aging.  After all these years/seasons, I'm shocked that nobody else has ever subbed for him.  This guy's a workhorse.

Going to an island paradise for 80 days & working like every 2 days must be nice!  I’d want that gig.  (I know he’s a producer and probably works more than that.) 

[Scatterbrained]

One thing I noticed this episode is that Elizabeth and Elaine seem to be each other’s “fall guy”.  They are a tag team.  Each targets a small group for private gameplay conversation (name naming) and then refuses to go along with anything until talking it over with the other.  Then one will blame the other for not agreeing to the plan.  They, plus “dad”/Ronnie (who is probably part of their group) will probably go far.  

On the other team, I think Janet, Kellee, and Jason will go far.

i expected more from the Rob/Sandra twist.  I expected, at the very least, some straight talk that might get the contestants to really think hard about their gameplay.  Instead, it’s like the producers feared being blamed for influencing the game, so we get something that feels really bland.  I wonder how things might get changed up in the future.  I also wonder how things might shift once merge happens.

[lilabennet]

On 10/16/2019 at 7:08 PM, North of Eden said:

If it didnt' mean Noura would get booted I kind of wanted Purple to loose just as karma as reniging on their agreement to name her as the caller. What made them think they could violate what for as far as they knew were official rules connected with Idol Island? It just left a bad taste in my mouth and portrayed them as jerks.

I think they were testing Noura.  They came to the decision to bench her really quickly, so I'm pretty sure there must have been a conversation at camp along the lines of: "We know we have to sit someone out.  We'll pick Noura and, if we are allowed to bench her, then we'll know for sure that she's full of it."

I was on board with Missy up until the point that she started belittling Karishma at TC.  What was the point?  To force her to switch sides at the first opportunity?  To lose a jury vote?  Missy lost about 25 IQ points in my estimation from the beginning of the episode to the end.

[fishcakes]

48 minutes ago, Tdoc72 said:

Was Kat the one who cried saying no one would date her b/c she didn’t make the merge? 

Ha, yes. She was also the one who was afraid that Colton's appendicitis might be contagious.

[DEL901]

7 hours ago, ljenkins782 said:

She and Rob look like they'd both benefit from the standard Survivor diet for the time they're out there.

Rob has always bulked up before the season starts.   I imagine Sandra does the same.  

[PhoneCop]

Noura has now become that player some seasons have where they're so bad at the game that I kind of want them to stick around a while just because their fuck-ups are so entertaining. I think Chris from Ghost Island was the most recent example of this? I guess it's the Dead Fish archetype but with comical flailing. Dead Flounder?

My one disappointment is that as Chelsea was walking away, nobody yelled out, "Sorry. Thanks for playing!"

[SVNBob]

On 10/16/2019 at 8:05 PM, vb68 said:

Poor Erik. Still getting called out for his bad idol play all these years later.

To be fair, that play is still the best example of someone(s) in Survivor persuading someone else to do something against their best interest.  (Rob's convincing Lex to save Ambuh is the second.) And at least the Black Widows' persuasion was the focus of clips, not Erik's foolishness like it usually is.

On 10/16/2019 at 9:10 PM, Lantern7 said:

Sorry about that. I’m not keeping track.

But I am.  Idols are are also part of my Tribe Tracker thread posts.

16 hours ago, ohcomeon said:

The Noura thing was hilarious. I loved it when they voted to sit her down. But does this mean she loses her vote in the next tribal council?

That was the bet.  She had to be the caller in the challenge, or she lost her vote.  So the next time she's at TC, she can't vote.  And given the way she understands things, she'll probably reveal that publicly when Peachy calls for her to go vote.

16 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

 That little clip of  Parvati saying she was going to lie and flirt her way into getting what she wanted and giggling about it, then setting up that poor kid for humiliation and all the women laughing at him -- ugh!

Those were two separate clips, and Parvati was barely in the first.  The first was the Black Widows (mainly Cirie and Natalie) convincing Erik to give up the necklace.  The second was from her first appearance on Cook Islands, where she did play a flirtier game.

12 hours ago, Nashville said:

Have to disagree a bit - Noura may be excellent at perceiving or detecting data, and still be absolute shit at processing it into meaningful information.  Kinda like seeing rain clouds at the top of a nearby mountain, but not extending that observation to realize that means the dry wash she’s standing in now could have a 10’ high wall of water rushing down it within the next ten minutes or so.

Is that a reference to AO?  If so, well done.

9 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

Or silly little things like stopping to help a team who had been in an accident and whose car was flipped upside down even though every other team that came upon the scene stopped to make sure everyone was ok.  I'm thinking that's the reason people might have been rooting against them on TAR, not because of any sort of gameplay.    I like Rob (never cared for Amber) but that was a dick move all around.

They were getting hate long before the Jeep flipped, simply for existing on TAR, and being competent to boot.

56 minutes ago, PhoneCop said:

My one disappointment is that as Chelsea was walking away, nobody yelled out, "Sorry. Thanks for playing!"

My guess is that they're saving that for Dean.

[ljenkins782]

6 hours ago, DEL901 said:

Rob has always bulked up before the season starts.   I imagine Sandra does the same.  

Why would they do that for this season though, when they’re not playing? They get regular food and hotels, I’m sure.

[JudyObscure]

15 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

And I definitely don't see how flirting is considered ruthless. (Especially in Parvati's case, her flirting was so mild, she never even got close to being in a showmance) 

Parvati had a  bit of a showmance with Nate in Cook Islands and a definite showmance with James in Micronesia which lasted until  James realized he was being used after she and Amanda blindsided Ozzy.  Ozzy went out saying he had fallen in love with Amanda. It was there, that  I thought Amanda and Parvati crossed a line, it just seemed so calculating and was implying a promise that went beyond the game. 

I have a (typical) memory of Parvati saying she was going to get Coach to change his mind about something and then following him into the ocean and offering to wash his back with that big Pit Bull grin.  I know it's not against the rules and some people find it cute and enjoy watching it, but it makes my skin crawl.

[Mr. Miner]

Jamal could use a good "bro" or a "mansierre", you know, for a little support up there.

[Bryce Lynch]

On 10/16/2019 at 10:08 PM, North of Eden said:

Missy is playing way TOO HARD and could easily wind up undateable as a pre-jury boot.

If it didnt' mean Noura would get booted I kind of wanted Purple to loose just as karma as reniging on their agreement to name her as the caller. What made them think they could violate what for as far as they knew were official rules connected with Idol Island? It just left a bad taste in my mouth and portrayed them as jerks.

So far no one really stands out to root for...damn I miss Christian and Gabby...memorable, likeable players.

Someone needs to add a laugh track to Sandra's bit at the end about Chelsea wanting a blindside. That would be awesome.

So, they are "jerks" for not falling for Noura's ridiculous and horribly sold lie?  

I think they were 99% sure Noura was full of crap.  They tested this by saying she would sit out.  If Noura had been telling the truth, Probst would have said, "Sorry, but according to the agreement you made to get an advantage, Noura must be the caller."   Probst said nothing, confirming that Noura, that in addition to be an idiot, extremely annoying and a horrible caller, was a liar.  

[Rachel RSL]

OMG I forgot about Chris from Ghost Island.  ("You're trash........at rapping.")  I want Noura, Angelina and Chris back on the same season.  And any other ridiculously oblivious players we can think of.

3 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

 Ozzy went out saying he had fallen in love with Amanda. It was there, that  I thought Amanda and Parvati crossed a line, it just seemed so calculating and was implying a promise that went beyond the game. 

In all fairness, Amanda and Ozzy did date for quite a while after the season was over so those weren't empty promises.

[Rough Draft]

1 hour ago, Mr. Minor said:

Jamal could use a good "bro" or a "mansierre", you know, for a little support up there.

When he's wearing Banlon, there appears to be some jiggling.
 

[ozziemom]

1 hour ago, Rachel RSL said:

In all fairness, Amanda and Ozzy did date for quite a while after the season was over so those weren't empty promises.

Also Amanda was not told of the Ozzy vote so she was blindsided too. That was Cirie and Parvati running that vote.

I don’t think Noura will be able to persuade anyone to do anything.

[meep.meep]

10 hours ago, SVNBob said:

To be fair, that play is still the best example of someone(s) in Survivor persuading someone else to do something against their best interest.  (Rob's convincing Lex to save Ambuh is the second.) And at least the Black Widows' persuasion was the focus of clips, not Erik's foolishness like it usually is.

It's God's work you do with these....

Persuading Eric to give up the necklace was one of the best example of strategic decision making I've ever seen on the show.  They were down to 6, 2 people had immunity, and the four women knew that if they didn't do something one of them was toast.  So, led by Cirie, they cold bloodedly considered all their options to get to where they wanted to be.  And getting Eric to give up his immunity was their best option.  Then they executed the plan.  And for once the show actually showed it all.

I hope no one is thinking of Noura as a goat because she is going to be terrible to watch for the rest of the season.

[NutMeg]

I'm thinking this convos with Rob and Sandra are not helping anyone. Except Kellee, so far (who was clever to hide the II in her hair and go full on Actor's Studio on her tribemates).

That's not to say I don't like seeing Rob and Sandra, even though I think they don't add much - but it kind of make me want for see them in Jeff's role. What would add more is having them discuss strategy with who comes up, hear what the dynamics are, advice based on the strengths and weaknesses they see in the person they meet, and to maximise strengths/minimise weaknesses. But that's not what Survivor is supposed to be, just a wish in case we have to have living Idols and how I want to use them better.

What mostly caught my attention were the flashbacks to previous seasons. Poor Erik has to be there again, but those were very good examples on how you play on what someone wants to influence them. Less so were the examples of Parvati. Once again, she's shown as having a strategy of flirting. But really, she too gave everyone what they wanted, and in that respect she's one of the best influencers in the game: she convinced Cirie to join her when Cirie was the swing vote, she made friends with the newbies to help her get to the end (and they voted for her), but she still kept her promise to Cirie and Amanda to go to the end; she even was clear with James that she needed an all female finale. So I know she said she was going to flirt, and TBTB sure run with that to make her seem one note, but really that was just one note of her sonata (I agree she's not a full orchestra, but she's a damn good sonata). Her first season, she had Becky and Sandra wanting to keep her further, which scared Yul - she is very much the female equivalent to Boston Rob, getting more flack because she's using some 'female wiles', when he was doing just the same.

Back to the current players,  I really like the cast, and enjoying the episodes - and the outcomes surprised me. But it seems they think they HAVE to make big moves/engineer blindsides. What's fun for the viewers isn't necessarily what's best for the players, and based on the gameplay we've seen or the editing, only a few contestants are really playing well without looking to make big moves.

Oh, and that hidden idol? looked like a real fake!! How are poor hamsters to know what's fake and what's not? 

Edited October 18, 2019 by NutMeg
to clarify stag

[sigmaforce86]

22 hours ago, fishcakes said:

Quote

I missed the majority of the episode - everything from just after Rob's comment that Noura is the last person who should be a blindfold challenge caller to the losing teams arrival at tribal.  I could go back and watch on demand but my only real question is how in the world did big mouth Noura manage to keep quiet about what really goes on at idol island. 

So you missed her Great Lie about how she knew what the challenge was but was only allowed to tell them if they let her pick her role? It was quite the spectacle. She thought she fooled them, which was  crazy because they were openly skeptical and questioning her and poking holes in it immediately at which point she was like, "IT'S TOO LATE I'M THE CALLER NO MORE TALKING!" Kellee's face was particularly priceless because she knew that Noura had dug herself into such a big hole that she would never be able to reveal what really happened at idol island, so that made Kellee's secret safe too. Then her tribe benched her at the challenge, which was was hilarious.

I watched it On Demand yesterday, totally worth it.  Seeing her dig herself into that half thought out lie with her tribe mates making increasingly confused WTF faces.  To me the best part was the practice session:  "Walk toward me".  "Don't say that, you'll be behind us",  "Oh, OK let's start again...Walk toward me",  "No you'll be behind us",   "I don't get it".  They figured out pretty quick to not let her be the caller.  Rob is a blowhard but he's perceptive and he was certainly right about her living in Nouraland.

[himela]

I hate Elizabeth for saying "I don't want to give Karishma the privilege to stay in the game". Wow you stupid bitch, first of all you are 26 and you look more than 40. Second of all, shut up. You don't know the game and you are so stupid you accepted to challenge Boston F-ing Rob in a fire making challenge. Idiot. Who made you the queen who decides who deserves to be there or not? Shut up.

[himela]

On 10/17/2019 at 4:08 AM, BusyOctober said:

Boston Rob has forever sealed my undying admiration with his character summation of Noura.  “She’s the LAST person who should be Caller!  She can’t coherently explain anything! She’s living in Nouraland!”  All the Boston Rob haters can keep on hating, but they’d have to admit; the guy can see through & read people as if he were looking at their xrays.

And how do you know he doesn't know them already? Do you really believe he meets them on the island for the first time? I bet he has seen their bios, maybe even some footage from their game play. Would you think the producers would just let their hero become humiliated by "reading a character" wrong? That's naive to think. Rob and Sandra are there on vacation, they live in a nice hotel with the rest of the producers and they just go to the island to film when someone comes there. It will never be confirmed but I bet it's true.

On 10/17/2019 at 4:08 AM, Eolivet said:

Oh, Chelsea. Wanting to get on Survivor since she was eight years old, applied for, what, nine years, finally gets on the show, finds an idol, and ... gets in a showmance.

You know, maybe there's a reason it took her nine years to get cast on the show.

She said in interviews there was no showmance, nothing ever happened, and she is upset that she got this edit of going out due to a showmance.

Edited October 18, 2019 by himela

[Rachel RSL]

44 minutes ago, himela said:

She said in interviews there was no showmance, nothing ever happened, and she is upset that she got this edit if going out due to a showmance.

She can be as upset as she wants to be but that is exactly the reason she was voted out. Even if it's true that there was no actual showmance, perception is reality, and we clearly saw the footage of them cuddled up together when they were sleeping.  I distinctly remember that was one of the things Boston Rob said after his win - pay attention to who is sleeping next to each other because those are the real alliances you need to watch out for.  As a self-proclaimed superfan, she should have known better.  

[Bryce Lynch]

41 minutes ago, himela said:

She said in interviews there was no showmance, nothing ever happened, and she is upset that she got this edit of going out due to a showmance.

But, her denial was kind of like, "Yeah, Dean and I were spooning and hanging out all the time, but I hung out with the ladies sometimes, too."   She seemed clueless to the fact that she and Dean were giving the impression that they were in a showmance.  

[watch2much]

I actually met a couple who raced with Rob and Amber on TAR.  They said people were always helping them and giving them money because they recognized them.  However,  I will always remember how when Rob couldn't do the eating meat challenge and he was able to convince others not to do it as well so he and Amber weren't the only one getting a time punishment.  He somehow knows how to manipulate people and whether you like him or not, he is good.

[peachmangosteen]

4 hours ago, himela said:

I hate Elizabeth for saying "I don't want to give Karishma the privilege to stay in the game". Wow you stupid bitch, first of all you are 26 and you look more than 40. Second of all, shut up. You don't know the game and you are so stupid you accepted to challenge Boston F-ing Rob in a fire making challenge. Idiot. Who made you the queen who decides who deserves to be there or not? Shut up.

+1. I hate Elizabeth more with each episode.

[Nashville]

4 hours ago, himela said:

I hate Elizabeth for saying "I don't want to give Karishma the privilege to stay in the game". Wow you stupid bitch, first of all you are 26 and you look more than 40. Second of all, shut up. You don't know the game and you are so stupid you accepted to challenge Boston F-ing Rob in a fire making challenge. Idiot. Who made you the queen who decides who deserves to be there or not? Shut up.

Well... so far as the question of who Elizabeth will or will not vote to evict goes, Elizabeth is the Lord God Almighty.  😁

[LanceM]

7 hours ago, himela said:

I hate Elizabeth for saying "I don't want to give Karishma the privilege to stay in the game". Wow you stupid bitch, first of all you are 26 and you look more than 40. Second of all, shut up. You don't know the game and you are so stupid you accepted to challenge Boston F-ing Rob in a fire making challenge. Idiot. Who made you the queen who decides who deserves to be there or not? Shut up.

The show Survivor. She is playing a game where you vote out other players for whatever reason you want to vote them out. It is also part of the game to try to convince others to vote the same way you do. In this case its because Karishma does absolutely nothing around camp. And to answer your question if the majority of the tribe votes the way she wants to vote than it is the tribe that made her the queen.

And from where I am standing this person "who doesn't know the game" is probably playing the best game on the Lairo tribe (along with Elain) as she is successfully playing the middle with no hints that nobody wants to vote her off at all.

Edited October 19, 2019 by LanceM

[Calamity Jane]

I’m enjoying this season a lot so far..lots of fun moments and big surprises. 

NHL guy Tom, though, distracts me whenever he’s on screen because he looks like Putin’s older, kindlier, actually normal brother. The resemblance is uncanny. 

Edited October 20, 2019 by Calamity Jane

[cleo]

I want Sandra to up the snark a bit and then be a commentator on every tribal. I would love it if Sandra was host instead if Probst.

The best part of the advice each week is watching how it fucks up the players with the supposed advantage of special guidance.

[princelina]

On 10/18/2019 at 5:22 PM, watch2much said:

I actually met a couple who raced with Rob and Amber on TAR.  They said people were always helping them and giving them money because they recognized them.  However,  I will always remember how when Rob couldn't do the eating meat challenge and he was able to convince others not to do it as well so he and Amber weren't the only one getting a time punishment.  He somehow knows how to manipulate people and whether you like him or not, he is good.

From what I recall he was also the first one ever to ask locals to take them someplace, rather than just trying to get directions.  

[Scatterbrained]

1 hour ago, princelina said:

From what I recall he was also the first one ever to ask locals to take them someplace, rather than just trying to get directions.  

I recall other racers in previous seasons doing this.  In one instance, a couple of racing girls pretty much kidnapped the (teenage?) son of a family they had gotten directions from.

The girls were confused about the directions given, so they finally exclaimed “can we just take him?!?”.  The whole family looked incredulous at the request, but the next scenes showed him in the middle of the backseat of their car, third wheel for the rest of the leg.  LOL!  I always wondered how far he was from home by the end of the day, and HOW he got home at the end of the day!

[SVNBob]

6 hours ago, princelina said:

From what I recall he was also the first one ever to ask locals to take them someplace, rather than just trying to get directions.  

No, there had been Ferns before Romber Raced.  Romber just had the advantage of many of their Ferns self-cultivating, while other teams had to go find Ferns on their own.

[Lamb18]

12 hours ago, princelina said:

From what I recall he was also the first one ever to ask locals to take them someplace, rather than just trying to get directions.  

Sorry, Oswald and Danny had Fern to help them in season 2.