S38.E14: I See the Million Dollars

[Ms Blue Jay]

If Devens voted for Gavin because Gavin is a traditional Survivor player that wasn't voted out, then okay, but that means that Devens would have to agree that he should not have won, either.

Otherwise, yes, Gavin's name was never written down, but I'm not sure why he's seen as a much better player than Julie?  He received 4 votes and she received none, I think.

[meep.meep]

Because Julie was chosen by many to be the goat to bring to final tribal.  She was never going to win a single vote ever.  Even if none of the EoE players were left, she was not going to get any votes.

[mikewho]

17 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

I think Probst's wardrobe reflects the overall feeling of this season.  He clearly didn't care enough to not look like he's ready to go do yard work.

I think he's still trying to look younger and 'hip'. (It's an old term).

[survivinmt]

I don't think this is a horrendous season or anything but a few thoughts:

Devens has mostly the jury to blame for his precarious situation for the final ?? 6 Tribal Councils or whatever. The jury made it clear that they were pulling for him which is what made him such a threat. If they had better (or any at all) poker faces Devens might not have been in such trouble all the time.

I thought Gavin deserved to win because while his game WAS mellow, he actually had to play it the whole time. People made him mad, he had to work around that; he was picked and resented for being picked for the family reward and had to maneuver with that; it really does mean something for him to say "I WAS PLAYING". That actually is a lot harder than sitting around reading your own letters on EOE. I think he should have said something like this at the Final Tribal though: "I know you all are empathizing with Chris right now, because you could be him. But imagine if you were me - stayed in the game, playing, the entire time, having no votes against you -- and then lose to someone who played for 8 days. Wouldn't THAT feel wrong?" He'd really have to sell it though, like Michael McConaughey in Time to Kill.

Chris's situation reminds me of my friend when she was divorcing her husband. She was hard up for a sympathetic ear and chose to confide in another guy who secretly liked her. He started doing all the things she complained that her husband wasn't doing for her. She came to me amazed, "I didn't know there were men out there like this." Me: "Really? It's like you're feeding him the answers to the test. How could he get it wrong?" Same as asking all the people on EOE, what would it take for you to vote for me if I returned to the game? Kudos for him for following through as I think it took some guts to give up the necklace but it felt like he had less to lose than Gavin (and Julie) at the end, having already been voted out. So he could play more recklessly. 

Hated that Julie made the finals. ANY other woman at the end would have been my preference, including Reem. I LOVED how WarDog shot down her "big emotional move" with, "Then you waited for WarDog to step in?" or whatever he said. Hahahaha! busted!

[survivinmt]

Didn't 3 people get voted off in the end without going to EOE? Lauren, Victoria and Devens? Their reward for making it longer in the game should have been that each got to vote off one person from the jury. Maybe that would make the jury not so chatty at EOE and Tribal Councils. Not that I want to see that continue but 13? was WAY too many jurors and something needed to change to make not so many pocket votes for returnee.

[OldWiseOne]

39 minutes ago, survivinmt said:

Didn't 3 people get voted off in the end without going to EOE? Lauren, Victoria and Devens? Their reward for making it longer in the game should have been that each got to vote off one person from the jury. Maybe that would make the jury not so chatty at EOE and Tribal Councils. Not that I want to see that continue but 13? was WAY too many jurors and something needed to change to make not so many pocket votes for returnee.

Devens was at EOE earlier and won his way back. But I like your idea of narrowing down the jury somehow.

[Maggie Mae]

I think there was a big difference between what Ron did to Devens and what Devens did to Lauren and Julie with respect to fake idols.  Ron was telling Devens that the idol was real and was pretending that he was allied with him. There was never any alliance between D and Lauren/Julie. Those fake idols might never have been found either. Kudos to him for playing the game. He came off as a bit arrogant but he played the best game without a doubt. He'll be back

[TVFan1]

I hope I never have to see or hear from Rick again. He better not ever be back. Loved seeing him lose the fire making challenge.

[jhummerbird]

I think the only way to make EoE work would be cost-prohibitive (and possibly psychologically dangerous): send each bootee to their own individual section of the island, where they have to survive by themselves. Nobody finds out anything about the game until the merge when they have a competition to get back. Mayyyybe after that they can all come to tribal councils as the jury, where they'll see who is left in the game, and then get sent back to isolation. They could be sent some "rewards" in exchanges for a penalty at the final competition...or even in exchange for advantages. ("You can either: eat this sandwich now or get an immunity idol good for one tribal council after the winner gets back.")

Otherwise, I agree with huskerj12 that the editors did a really bad job of showing what was going on at EoE -- Kelly revealing Lauren's idol wasn't shown during the main portion of the show but a pre-commercial bumper, and the Devins/Chris reconciliation also wasn't shown at all, right? I actually figured that the winner didn't come from EoE because they spent so little time on what was going on there after the merge.

And other random thoughts: I hate Jeff's hard-on for Joe and I thought Aurora really got shafted in that segment. She was in the lead or at least top three for almost all of the final competition, and she might have been just as close as Joe was...we never really saw how she did with the second ball. But not only was she one of the few who got totally skipped in the EoE losers interview, Joey Amazing even got a special live segment for being "second place." Blech. Lauren and Victoria also got pretty screwed, although that was partly Lauren's fault for believing Chris and playing her idol incorrectly. I would have been really interested in seeing a Vic/Gavin/Julie final three just to see if Vic would have gotten the credit she deserved. 

[LanceM]

1 hour ago, jhummerbird said:

I would have been really interested in seeing a Vic/Gavin/Julie final three just to see if Vic would have gotten the credit she deserved. 

Victoria would have won in a landslide. There is no doubt about that. She was the threat that Chris said she was. In her Ponderosa video David mentioned how he thought she was playings so well  like it was her 3rd time out there and not her first. Julia and Auarora also had high praise.  Even the Warthog in a tweet today said there was no player's game this season he respected more than hers. Stuff like this makes me even more miffed that they did not feathre her more but I guess it was more important to them to puff up Rick because he finds idols and Chris beat him fire to get to the final 3.

Edited May 17, 2019 by LanceM

[PumpkinPK]

I am just happy that blowhard Rick Devens did not win.

Edited May 17, 2019 by PumpkinPK
Eta: I hope we never see EoE again.

[Euriph]

I love survivor but this whole season fell apart in many ways. The winner, Chris, was basically a new player on the last episode. This was absolutely irrational because all he need to do was get through 2 votes and a fire making challenge. He didn't need any social gameplay just advantages and fire skills. Even worst by him winning, it made everything building up to the final pointless. 

Rick's strategy point out another problem in this season and that is the idol gameplay. Idol's can make a situation interesting and protect a good player from going home. The problem is the idols returns once played making a strategy just to find the idols. It throws away social gameplay for 10 mins of idol hunting (or a whole episode on idol hunting). Let alone keeps a player in far longer than they should subtracting the possibility of more interesting social gameplay/blindsides. It even ruins the edit because they only pay attention to the guy finding idols instead of feeling out the other players. (oh and it also looks like the production is manipulating from behind the scene)

another just small opinion but I still hate the fire challenge at the end. I rather have the voting. it leads to the possibility of a final three or final two. It also to me shows who played the best game not a gimmick that keeps a player that everyone would vote out. Also if they keep this in (which they probably will) at least ban idols for the last two votes. 

[30 Helens]

19 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

I hate the fire challenge.  I hate that someone can outwit, outlast and outplay for 38 days and then watch his game go up in smoke over something as random as the wind.

But without the fire challenge, the person who played the best game will never make it to the final 3 unless they win the final immunity challenge. Because the person who does win final immunity will never pick the best player to sit beside them. Well, unless their name is Colby. Or Woo. But you know what I mean.  So I understand why they do the fire challenge now, to at least give that “best” player a fighting chance. That said, I don’t like it either.  I don’t know why.  

17 hours ago, DakotaLavender said:

 I think the problem was production. They only allowed 2 players who were voted out to return and the 2nd player returned too late in the game and we saw it on finale night.

So we saw very little of Chris during this season and then he goes on to win. This is actually absurd and an embarrassment. 

16 hours ago, MKL122788 said:

I cannot handle that someone gets to return to the game that late with having had numerous opportunities to bond with people outside the game and then those same people get to be on the jury. That is unacceptable from a design perspective.

These 2 quotes sum up the problem for me. If Chris had returned even 2 rounds earlier, I think more people would have accepted that he was there long enough to justify a win.

Of course, he was playing, he was just doing it off screen. Where we couldn’t see. And why not?? They knew who the winner was; all they had to do was edit in more footage from Misfit Island. We saw Chris spear a fish once, and I assume we saw him cry. (We saw EVERYBODY cry.) But we didn’t see him strategizing with the other Toys, we didn’t see him working his salesman mojo on his future jurors, we didn’t see anything to make us remember and like him. That was the biggest failure of the season, IMO.

So we basically had 2 games going on: one that we saw, and one that happened off-screen and involved built-in jury tampering. The fact that the off-screen game won just makes it that much more unsatisfying.

But I don’t blame Chris. He just played the hand he was dealt. So no asterisk from me, either. I would also have been happy with a Rick win. I don’t have the hate for him that others have. I do think he found too many idols, but that wasn’t his fault, either.  

I just really hope that production learns from this failure, and from the other problems that are starting to tarnish the show in a real way— I’m talking about all the idols and advantages. A few, used well, make for a thrilling season. Too many, piled on top of one another, make none of them seem special and can actually nullify good game play. Cirie understands.

10 hours ago, dizzyd said:

 I think both Rob and Sandra are funny and as long as they're not playing, I think they can make next season quite entertaining. After this season, let's hope. I haven't lost faith in this show yet. We've had some pretty good seasons lately before this one. 

And that’s why I haven’t lost hope, either. With so many seasons, there’s bound to be an occasional dud.  A few minor tweaks, less reliance on gimmicks, and they can be totally back on track. I’m both nervous and excited about the next season, though. I find both of these Giant Heads amusing, and their presence could be a lot of fun. BUT, the concept is gimmicky and it could easily be a trainwreck.  Back-to-back disasters could be too much to overcome, I fear.

But I will watch, and if nothing else, the opportunities for snark should be endless. See you all then!

[SVNBob]

On 5/15/2019 at 11:42 PM, Richness said:

Devins also mentioned that he got something put in his bag from Production, but I don't recall him saying or showing what it was.

He was talking about the same idol.  Literally.  The one he got when he returned from EoE and split with David. 

That's how Rick "knew" Chris had something.  He just didn't know it was the exact same thing he'd got.

[jay741982]

17 hours ago, tvfanatic13 said:

Hated this season so very much. But, damn, Victoria is simply gorgeous cleaned up!

Definitely! I was like "Hubba Hubba" "Wolf Whistle" lol. Of course I also thought Lauren Aurora Julia and Kelley were looking Goregous as well

[JudyObscure]

31 minutes ago, jay741982 said:

Definitely! I was like "Hubba Hubba" "Wolf Whistle" lol. Of course I also thought Lauren Aurora Julia and Kelley were looking Goregous as well

I thought they all looked gorgeous too but I also wondered what weight of spackling it took to cover up all that sun damage we saw on Kelly and Aurora.  That wasn't just suntan it was Chloasma, a type of pigment-gone-wild that I once had, to a much lesser degree, and it took five years to go away.

[blackwing]

I’m not even sure if this would have been possible, but at the final five, what would have happened if all of them had immunity?  Suppose Lauren hasn’t played her idol for Chris at the previous tribal.  And somehow Julie found a real one.  Rick wins immunity.  He plays his other idol for Gavin.  Chris plays his rejoined idol.  Everyone is immune.  

Then no one goes home?  Or would there be some other procedure?  Has this ever happened?  The closest I remember is when Cirie was the only non-immune one and went home despite not receiving any votes.  

[Carolina Girl]

On 5/15/2019 at 8:20 PM, me5671 said:

I miss Survivor. Not this manufactured nonsense they've been putting out lately, I mean the real survivor that was more strategy than digging for idols and hunting down advantages. When's that show coming back on?

You know, I wonder how great the ratings would be if we got a season of 16 players, divided into two tribes, who merge at a 10-player count, with NO immunity idols, no "opportunity to come back"?  Because I would watch that one.  I imagine the idea of throwing in twists came about because of the player swap in Africa, when Playskool was becoming insufferable and needed to have its ass roundly kicked.  I agreed with that one, and I think the powers that be did it to save the season because they were smart enough to know that a final 10 of these assholes was not something anyone wanted to see.  They seem to have lost the idea that at the end, you need to have at least ONE player standing that the audience wants to see win.  

If they want to keep the "hidden immunity idol" then plant one at each camp.  No clues.  You know it's there, we ain't helping you.  Once used, that's it.  No new one to replace it.  

[ProfCrash]

I think there are ways to keep the swaps and idols in play but limit them. Instead of choosing to do something like not rehiding idols after they have been used, TPTB have responded by adding more and more idols and advantages.

I think my biggest issue with EoE, ok so one of many issues, was that the people on EoE were able to directly affect the game by giving advantages to people. That was simply bogus.

At its core, EoE completely changed the game. Not only were people still in the game after they were voted out, they were able to mess with tribal dynamics and tribal council by handing out advantages.

It was simply too much.

[dsteele]

On 5/16/2019 at 8:58 AM, MKL122788 said:

1. Way. Too. Many. Idols. In particular, I want them to go back to the rule they used to have where if there were any idols still in play, they didn't hide more.

This! x1000%

[valandsend]

Like many in this forum, I've watched every single season of Survivor, but this was the first time I haven't watched the episodes as they aired. I watched the first three episodes, got bored with the cast, and kept putting off watching the rest on demand until this weekend, when I binge watched everything up to the penultimate episode. I didn't get caught up until last night at about 12:30 a.m.

I thought that maybe by slogging through so many episodes in quick succession instead of with a week between them, I'd be more familiar with the cast. Yet I still had a hard time getting to know most of them, other than Rick (who I never did understand why they had to call him by this last name -- was there another Rick? And why not differentiate between Julie and Julia that way? It was hard to keep straight which was which sometimes. I miss the opening credits that served as a reminder of the cast member's names.)

There were some minor standouts. Ron seemed to get the villain's edit, although Gavin actually had the face of an old-time movie villain. I came to identify Aurora as the one depicted as unstable. Victoria and Lauren could have been the same person if not for their hair color. Julia was the one who seemed way too sure of herself, and Julie was the neurotic one (as she identified herself at jury). Wardog was the pretender, just as the idiotic name implies, so thanks for that! The returning players, I remembered from before but couldn't recall much of their gameplay. Just meh. If the show still showed the cast in the opening credits, the rest could have been summed up as "and the rest," just like in the first season of Gilligan's Island.

Of course, spending so much time with the evicted players at the EOE detracted from time that could have been spent on character development for those still playing the game. I found myself rooting for Chris for the shallowest of reasons -- because he was the prettiest -- although when he got back into the game, I was impressed by his introspection, game knowledge  and, of course, the amazing move that almost redeemed the season for me.

I haven't watched all of the reunion, but questions remain:

(1) Was Chris' move to prove himself as worthy purely his own idea, or was it planted by someone on the production team?

(2) Is there any chance Rick Devens WON'T be back for a future season?

(3) And finally, how did Chris' handsome thighs remain untanned after over a month on the beach and wearing his underpants for the entirety? Along those (tan) lines, it seemed that none of the cast got swimwear after the first few episodes of having to parade around in their undies.

[ljenkins782]

On 5/16/2019 at 8:27 AM, DakotaLavender said:

Chris was the 3rd voted out on day 8. He was the 2nd player to return on day 35. I think the problem was production. They only allowed 2 players who were voted out to return and the 2nd player returned too late in the game and we saw it on finale night.

So we saw very little of Chris during this season and then he goes on to win. This is actually absurd and an embarrassment. How does that even happen? I was shocked. 

Somewhere out there, the chick that won Aubry's first season is handing off the crown of most invisible winner. I barely remembered Chris, then he comes back in with 3 days left and wins? WTF? This season sucked so hard.

What a sucky way for Victoria to go out and Lauren too, though her decision to play her long-held idol for Chris was bizarre. The reunion becomes more and more of a waste of time every year, they used to be interesting, but not anymore.

[SunshineOnMe]

Chris spent the last 28 days making good friends with all of the jurors--going through his apology tour, patching things up, making friendships that wouldn't be affected by any backstabbing game play, feeding them, etc. I just don't see how that could be fair. 

[Boilergal]

I am sooooo sick of the idols, I'm tired of one person finding 5 idols - especially when they put out another idol with 4 people left.   It just seems like a production favorite kind of deal, and it just pisses me off.  

As far as Chris, he obviously played the social game hard.   It could have been, when people were snuffed and got to EoE and talked about camp the last three days -  they didn't talk about Gavin or Julie, or during the tribal councils it didn't look like Gavin and Julie were doing anything noteworthy.   

I think if Devens went to the end against Chris, Devens would have won.

Edited May 17, 2019 by Boilergal

[ProfCrash]

7 minutes ago, SunshineOnMe said:

Chris spent the last 28 days making good friends with all of the jurors--going through his apology tour, patching things up, making friendships that wouldn't be affected by any backstabbing game play, feeding them, etc. I just don't see how that could be fair. 

5 minutes ago, Boilergal said:

I am sooooo sick of the idols, I'm tired of one person finding 5 idols - especially when they put out another idol with 4 people left.   It just seems like a production favorite kind of deal, and it just pisses me off.  

As far as Chris, he obviously played the social game hard.   It could have been, when people were snuffed and got to EoE and talked about camp the last three days -  they didn't talk about Gavin or Julie, or during the tribal councils it didn't look like Gavin and Julie were doing anything noteworthy.   

I think if Devens went to the end against Chris, Devens would have won.

24 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

Somewhere out there, the chick that won Aubry's first season is handing off the crown of most invisible winner. I barely remembered Chris, then he comes back in with 3 days left and wins? WTF? This season sucked so hard.

What a sucky way for Victoria to go out and Lauren too, though her decision to play her long-held idol for Chris was bizarre. The reunion becomes more and more of a waste of time every year, they used to be interesting, but not anymore.

Yup. Victoria and Lauren were screwed over by information from EoE. Julie said in an interview that Chris had a note from Ron saying that she could trust Chris. Not only that, but Chris knew about Lauren's idol, even though none of the players in the game knew, because Kelly had told everyone at exile. Chris also knew that Rick and Victoria were the two players in contention to win the whole thing.

So Chris comes back, late in the game, with information that is important for other people, ie vote out Victoria to Gavin and Lauren, and notes affirming his trustworthiness.

Oh, and then there was the split idol which he was able to hand over to Rick, who was desperate for an ally. Telling people that Victoria was going to win based on the jury conversation on EoE destroyed Victoria's ability to work with Gavin, Lauren and Julie.

It is a giant cluster. If you are going to do EoE, the contestants have to have their own area where they do not interact with the other contestants. Give them a serving of rice and beans but they have to make their own fire and their own shelter and survive solo. Space the camps out along the beach so that they each have a place to go fishing and hang in the water but far enough away that they cannot talk to each other or signal each other. Either you survive in the isolation or you leave but no information sharing, no stupid advantages to hand out to the players in the game, no bonding.

[bunnyface]

Mr. Bun asked me last night if the show was over finally (he hates) and what I thought of the ending.  I said something flip about the season being a dumpster fire and how horrible the twist was, etc.  I swanned about for a bit. 

His response was "and yet you watched every minute." 

He's not wrong.  I've thought about it.  I was a late comer to Survivor.  I can't tell you what season I first fully watched.  A watched a few seasons part way through, because fewer people were less confusing to me, but I came to realize not watching from the beginning was also confusing because there were underlying issues I didn't know because I hadn't seen.

Anyhoo, sorry, tangent, he's right.  I didn't like this twist and if they do it again, I will shut it down.  I have no illusions about any influence.  They don't give a tinker's ass if I ever watch again.  I have to stand up for myself.  If I let them hurt me like this, I'm part of the problem, not the solution. 

[Nashville]

4 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

Yup. Victoria and Lauren were screwed over by information from EoE. Julie said in an interview that Chris had a note from Ron saying that she could trust Chris. Not only that, but Chris knew about Lauren's idol, even though none of the players in the game knew, because Kelly had told everyone at exile. Chris also knew that Rick and Victoria were the two players in contention to win the whole thing.

So Chris comes back, late in the game, with information that is important for other people, ie vote out Victoria to Gavin and Lauren, and notes affirming his trustworthiness.

Oh, and then there was the split idol which he was able to hand over to Rick, who was desperate for an ally. Telling people that Victoria was going to win based on the jury conversation on EoE destroyed Victoria's ability to work with Gavin, Lauren and Julie.

It is a giant cluster. If you are going to do EoE, the contestants have to have their own area where they do not interact with the other contestants. Give them a serving of rice and beans but they have to make their own fire and their own shelter and survive solo. Space the camps out along the beach so that they each have a place to go fishing and hang in the water but far enough away that they cannot talk to each other or signal each other. Either you survive in the isolation or you leave but no information sharing, no stupid advantages to hand out to the players in the game, no bonding.

Total agreement.  

I retract my earlier statement that Chris’s win should not be asterisked; in terms of the excesses permitted by the current extremely lax arrangement, much of Chris’ victory appears to be due to the Survivor equivalent of insider trading.  

Someone in Production should’ve thought much harder and longer before putting this POS out into the wild.

[LoveLeigh]

8 hours ago, ljenkins782 said:

The reunion becomes more and more of a waste of time every year, they used to be interesting, but not anymore.

The reunions used to be good. Remember when Jeff traveled on the subway train with that urn holding the votes? I also hate the final episode having Jeff and the audience shoe horned in. 

This show changed. The thrill is gone and as I said already: a final two is way more exciting to see who the final person pics in his or her million dollar decision. 

[Fake Jan Brady]

2 hours ago, DakotaLavender said:

The reunions used to be good. Remember when Jeff traveled on the subway train with that urn holding the votes? 

Remember when Rosie O’Donnell hosted? Remember when Jeff started ignoring half the cast to favour the season showboat? Or ignoring the winner if she was a woman? Remember the randoms in the audience Jeff would interview? 

[ByaNose]

Now, the reunions are a 1/2 hour long. At best, 20 minutes including 5 minutes for an upcoming season preview. I don’t even get angry about the reunions anymore. I watch the final vote and tune out. Jeff couldn’t even talk game with Chris because he didn’t have one. That’s pretty embarrassing. The reunions used to be a full blown affair and quite epic. It won’t be long till the winner is announced via a tweet. 

[SVNBob]

Finally read through the live thread, and didn't see anyone say this.

Yes, Lauren made a mistake in playing her idol for Chris.  But saving it also would have been a mistake.

She should have popped up first when Peachy asked about idols at F6#2 and played hers...for Rick.

Doing that would have done two things.  First of all, it would have been playing her idol "correctly", since he did get the majority of the votes.  But more importantly, it would have changed the story.   With Rick saving himself with his own idol, he was going through the same story as Ben.  But if Lauren had saved him, she'd take away that power and change the narrative.  Now Rick looks like he owes his position at F5 to Lauren, which elevates her over him to some degree.

It also means that the idol is not re-hidden, and Lauren can ask for quid pro quo after Rick wins the next challenge.

[Kenzie]

On 5/15/2019 at 8:20 PM, me5671 said:

I miss Survivor. Not this manufactured nonsense they've been putting out lately, I mean the real survivor that was more strategy than digging for idols and hunting down advantages. When's that show coming back on?

I think we'll see this again but only for the very last show.

Jeff will trot out "Survivor, Back to Borneo!" No idols! No food! Interesting challenges! All Newbies! No planted castaways!

Join us for the final, the ultimate, the original - BACK TO BORNEO!

[dstann]

22 hours ago, SVNBob said:

Finally read through the live thread, and didn't see anyone say this.

Yes, Lauren made a mistake in playing her idol for Chris.  But saving it also would have been a mistake.

She should have popped up first when Peachy asked about idols at F6#2 and played hers...for Rick.

Doing that would have done two things.  First of all, it would have been playing her idol "correctly", since he did get the majority of the votes.  But more importantly, it would have changed the story.   With Rick saving himself with his own idol, he was going through the same story as Ben.  But if Lauren had saved him, she'd take away that power and change the narrative.  Now Rick looks like he owes his position at F5 to Lauren, which elevates her over him to some degree.

It also means that the idol is not re-hidden, and Lauren can ask for quid pro quo after Rick wins the next challenge.

Rick was the biggest threat in the game, while he did have the most votes, so the idol would have been played "correctly", it was a bad move because she would be saving the biggest threat in the game.  To me it doesn't really change the Rick narrative as Rick would just revealed at the next tribal council that he had an HII, he could have saved himself but is able to use it now.  It would change the Lauren narrative as she made a confusing move to save the biggest threat in the game.

If she had saved it and played it on herself at final 5 she would have played it correctly and made final 4.

[KimberStormer]

On ‎5‎/‎17‎/‎2019 at 12:30 AM, 30 Helens said:

But without the fire challenge, the person who played the best game will never make it to the final 3 unless they win the final immunity challenge. Because the person who does win final immunity will never pick the best player to sit beside them.

Then they're not the best player.  From Richard Hatch onward, a lot of winners got took.  Some great winners like Denise, Parvati, Earl, Natalie Anderson, Sandra twice!  I think getting taken to the end and winning is an impressive way to win.

[valandsend]

On 5/17/2019 at 9:56 PM, Fake Jan Brady said:

Remember when Rosie O’Donnell hosted? Remember when Jeff started ignoring half the cast to favour the season showboat? Or ignoring the winner if she was a woman? Remember the randoms in the audience Jeff would interview? 

I also remember when the winner was announced, it was covered with a $1 million check presentation the next morning on the CBS morning show. I'm not sure if they mentioned it, not even in their 90-second news clip review.

[gritz]

On 5/16/2019 at 1:44 AM, Steph Sometimes said:

Bullshit. This season was bullshit.

Can't be said or written enough.

If I were an upcoming contestant? I'm giving shout-outs, nods and winks, singing Zero 7 songs...whatever it takes to get Sia's attention, since that side game pays as much as being a legit runner-up.

[MerBearHou]

Chris winning Survivor = Game of Thrones final King

Such a letdown and so unearned IMO.

Edited May 20, 2019 by MerBearHou

[ljenkins782]

On 5/16/2019 at 4:32 PM, survivinmt said:

I don't think this is a horrendous season or anything but a few thoughts:

Devens has mostly the jury to blame for his precarious situation for the final ?? 6 Tribal Councils or whatever. The jury made it clear that they were pulling for him which is what made him such a threat. If they had better (or any at all) poker faces Devens might not have been in such trouble all the time.

I thought Gavin deserved to win because while his game WAS mellow, he actually had to play it the whole time. People made him mad, he had to work around that; he was picked and resented for being picked for the family reward and had to maneuver with that; it really does mean something for him to say "I WAS PLAYING". That actually is a lot harder than sitting around reading your own letters on EOE. I think he should have said something like this at the Final Tribal though: "I know you all are empathizing with Chris right now, because you could be him. But imagine if you were me - stayed in the game, playing, the entire time, having no votes against you -- and then lose to someone who played for 8 days. Wouldn't THAT feel wrong?" He'd really have to sell it though, like Michael McConaughey in Time to Kill.

Chris's situation reminds me of my friend when she was divorcing her husband. She was hard up for a sympathetic ear and chose to confide in another guy who secretly liked her. He started doing all the things she complained that her husband wasn't doing for her. She came to me amazed, "I didn't know there were men out there like this." Me: "Really? It's like you're feeding him the answers to the test. How could he get it wrong?" Same as asking all the people on EOE, what would it take for you to vote for me if I returned to the game? Kudos for him for following through as I think it took some guts to give up the necklace but it felt like he had less to lose than Gavin (and Julie) at the end, having already been voted out. So he could play more recklessly. 

It also just wasn't that huge a risk with the firemaking challenge in the mix. Yes, there could be an element of luck if someone who hasn't made fire that much before caught a lucky gust of wind or something, but he was the clear favorite to win that. Had he given up immunity with the risk of being turned on and voted out, that would have been a hugely ballsy move.

As for Devins, I think it was just a risk/reward gamble to play so obviously to the jury. Had he made it, it would have been worth it. But if he hadn't played the big moves out loud, he might have been sitting there in the end without much to say for himself. Hard to say. 

Quote

I think the only way to make EoE work would be cost-prohibitive (and possibly psychologically dangerous): send each bootee to their own individual section of the island, where they have to survive by themselves. Nobody finds out anything about the game until the merge when they have a competition to get back. Mayyyybe after that they can all come to tribal councils as the jury, where they'll see who is left in the game, and then get sent back to isolation. They could be sent some "rewards" in exchanges for a penalty at the final competition...or even in exchange for advantages. ("You can either: eat this sandwich now or get an immunity idol good for one tribal council after the winner gets back.")

That's what I said too. Being completely alone would likely have caused at least a few more people to raise that sail. Especially those who aren't great at challenges, knowing the slim possibility of returning would make that solitude and fending for yourself seem a lot less appealing. As it was, it was basically just a Survivor-adjacent experience. A tribe of people, trying to exist together but without challenges or rewards. 

[Otherkate]

I've had this finale on my DVR since last Wednesday and just couldn't seem to get myself to watch it. I finally just gave up and came in here to see who won and now I'll never watch it. Nothing against Chris, but what a waste of a season. I wish I hadn't watched any of it. I've watched every single episode of Survivor from day 1 except for this one and I don't regret it. Good riddance to this season, this terrible editing and this cast.

[HappyDancex2]

I miss the gross food challenges.  And challenges that don’t end in puzzles.  I think they have found enough elements where strength is not necessarily the type owned by the male contestants.  I’d like to see some pure endurance ones.  I really wanted to see someone like Reem come up with some excuse on why she couldn’t stand on a log for 10hours.  Or maybe one where they have to be quiet lol.

[Kel Varnsen]

What a painful and irritating season. On top of all the other bullshit (100's of idols, players coming back) I thought itvwas garbage that in the final 4 Chris gave up the necklace then still got to pick who made fire. Once you give up the immunity, the person you give it to should have the choice (not that Julie would have picked anyone else).

On 5/16/2019 at 6:12 PM, TVFan1 said:

I hope I never have to see or hear from Rick again. He better not ever be back. Loved seeing him lose the fire making challenge.

I am sure he will be back and annoying as ever. The only way having him back would be tolerable is if it was in a season with no hidden idols, where Probst announced right at the start that there were no idols.

On 5/17/2019 at 7:08 AM, jay741982 said:

Definitely! I was like "Hubba Hubba" "Wolf Whistle" lol. Of course I also thought Lauren Aurora Julia and Kelley were looking Goregous as well

Lauren is probably in my top 5 best looking Survivor contestants ever (Victoria (who seemed super bored at final tribal) and Aurora are super attractive too). Although who was the 13 year old operating the camera in the voting booth for the final vote. Because the camera shot right down Lauren's top as she voted made me laugh.

[SVNBob]

7 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Although who was the 13 year old operating the camera in the voting booth for the final vote. Because the camera shot right down Lauren's top as she voted made me laugh.

That shot cannot be blamed on a human.  They show shots from those angles on a regular basis.  Typically it's either for the voting confessional from "the deciding voter" that is just vague enough to apply to either side, or for the reading the vote over the shoulder shots.  To have a cameraperson stationed there for those angles would be silly, so it makes more sense that there's a stationary camera (or two; one over each "shoulder") mounted in the ceiling of the voting booth near the doorway. 

So a cameraman cannot be blamed for that shot.

But, an editor can be blamed for using that angle instead of the front-facing one.  I mean, I get why they'd want to cut to that camera during a 13-person voting montage... it's at least different and adds visual interest.  But specifically going to it for Lauren adds a different kind of visual interest.

However, given that there's a slight and unimportant rumor that says that the reason they kept cutting to that weird audience shot during the reunion (the semi-static uninterested crowd shot) is because Lauren kept having wardrobe malfunctions during the reunion.  (And CBS takes those seriously...since it is their fault that phrase even exists.)  So it might be that something similar happened during the voting, and the over-the-shoulder angle was actually the better option.  (I doubt that, but it is possible.)

[Special K]

There were plenty of salacious shots of Lauren's body throughout the season.

[peachmangosteen]

11 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

... I thought itvwas garbage that in the final 4 Chris gave up the necklace then still got to pick who made fire. Once you give up the immunity, the person you give it to should have the choice (not that Julie would have picked anyone else).

That really annoyed me, too.

2 minutes ago, Special K said:

There were plenty of salacious shots of Lauren's body throughout the season.

Seriously. But then there were a lot of shots of Chris that were salacious as well. So I guess props to them for their equality in being gross.

[Kel Varnsen]

6 hours ago, SVNBob said:

That shot cannot be blamed on a human.  They show shots from those angles on a regular basis.  Typically it's either for the voting confessional from "the deciding voter" that is just vague enough to apply to either side, or for the reading the vote over the shoulder shots.  To have a cameraperson stationed there for those angles would be silly, so it makes more sense that there's a stationary camera (or two; one over each "shoulder") mounted in the ceiling of the voting booth near the doorway. 

So a cameraman cannot be blamed for that shot.

But, an editor can be blamed for using that angle instead of the front-facing one.  I mean, I get why they'd want to cut to that camera during a 13-person voting montage... it's at least different and adds visual interest.  But specifically going to it for Lauren adds a different kind of visual interest.

Yea I didn't think there was an actual person, 13 years old or otherwise, operating that camera for the over the shoulder down the top shot. I just thought it was hilarious that the director/editor or whoever chose to use it.  Not that I am really complaining, she looked awesome.

Edited May 23, 2019 by Kel Varnsen

[lh25]

4 hours ago, Special K said:

There were plenty of salacious shots of Lauren's body throughout the season.

And that bothered me a bit during the show, feeling like maybe she was being filmed from angles she may not like, until I saw her in that pink dress in the first shot of finale.  She clearly doesn't mind showing her body.  No judgement from me on that, just noting that she is fine showing her body.

[fishcakes]

27 minutes ago, lh25 said:

And that bothered me a bit during the show, feeling like maybe she was being filmed from angles she may not like, until I saw her in that pink dress in the first shot of finale.  She clearly doesn't mind showing her body.  No judgement from me on that, just noting that she is fine showing her body.

I thought the same when she wore that super tiny top on the jury. I don't judge her either -- her body is amazing and if mine had been that good when I was her age, I'd have been showing it off too -- so I think she probably doesn't mind too much that the editors played it up. She's seen the show before so she could have predicted this would have happened.

In general, though, I wish the players were allowed to have more or more useful clothing during the game, so if someone is a little shyer about showing themselves, they have the option to be more covered up.

[Archery]

Once Victoria was voted out, I really didn't care who won as long at it wasn't Devens. His wacky trickster schtick got very old.  However, Chris's fire-making move won me over.  I also liked:

Chris helping Julie balance her puzzle.  Maybe it was gameplay; maybe it was him being decent (since he wasn't going to win that challenge).  

Julie taking Chris on reward, noting that he had had nothing to eat but coconut and rice for 35 days.  Ditto on the decency/gameplay.

The reveal of the cleaned-up jury. Yikes, some of those people were beautiful.  (Much more attractive than the over-made-up versions at the Reunion.)

I agree that no more Idols would be a good thing going forward.  

[TV Anonymous]

On 5/16/2019 at 9:49 AM, RedbirdNelly said:

2. that being said, EOE should not have happened and it messes with the game for Chris to win. If they keep this horrible twist there would be some wisdom behind getting yourself voted out early-ish as a strategy--granted one that puts a ton of trust in winning your way back which you could easily lose

Not exactly EoE but Ozzy did this in South Pacific. He wanted to be voted out to Redemption Island. Upon his return however, Cochran turned on his alliance and eventually voted Ozzy out.

[Superpole2000]

On 5/16/2019 at 9:14 AM, peachmangosteen said:

I think this had to be the smuggest jury I've ever witnessed. A bitter jury I enjoy, one where nearly every person is up on their high horse thinking they're hot shit and the people who outplayed them are beneath them is a bit too much for me to handle.

The worst part of that jury was Kelley Wentworth and her scolding of Chris when Chris dared to ask Gavin a question. Why can't Chris ask Gavin a question? It gives everyone insight and moves the conversation forward. But of course, that would make Kelley feel less important. The fact that others on the jury agreed with Kelley's complaint was really pathetic.