Jill, Derick & the Kids: Moving On!!

[JenCarroll]

Maybe Izzy was switched-at-birth with a Jewish baby? Then they can say things didn't go as planned, and justify Derrick's post. They'd be flabbergasted if a child was used for a political cause they disagree with, but it's game on if they like it.

 

Selah No-dismembership-abortions Duggar Dillard has a nice ring to it. So does Ireland Protestant Dillard.

What I want to know is, is he circumcised? :-)

[msblossom]

This is sort of o/t, but speaking about all the attention that Jill and Derick have brought on Israel reminds me of an old friend of mine that I mentioned awhile back that went to a Gothard Basic Life Principles event several years ago and tried it out, thankfully it didn't stick. Anyway, this person tends to "try out" several Christian-y things. About 15 years she joined some kind of group that was super Jewish in faith and I can't remember if it was messianic or not. Anyway, the crazy part of the group is that you have to be Jewish to be part of it, meaning you have to be able to trace and prove that you have Jewish blood. So there's some kind of organization that can prove this when you pay them a certain amount of money. Okay, first of all, my friend is not Jewish. But now she claims she is bc this organization that she's paid into has confirmed her blood work and ancestry. It's a scam, but my friend completely identifies as a Jew now. She has turned completely strange. They don't go to synagogue. They meet in someone's house and practice all the Jewish customs and forms of prayer and worship, but never go to synagogue and I don't even know if they are recognized as Jewish in the traditional sense. They have no Rabbi, not formerly trained, just someone in the group who has studied for years. She doesn't go to a regular church anymore and says she won't ever practice an evangelical form of faith again. Her husband is not cool with it. He sort of goes along to get along, but he's super uncomfortable with it and wants to go back to regular church. He's only allowed in as a guest of my friend and has never attempted to turn"Jewish", so he doesn't go much. By the way, I am not speaking of converting to Judaism, when I'm referring to this strange thing my friend is into. She actually believes she's a Jew now.

Edited April 11, 2015 by msblossom

[GEML]

We had friends who did that for awhile. It was a messianic Jewish home church in their case, and they were absolutely desperate to try and prove some link to being Jewish ethnically. (They weren't.)

There's always been a string in American fundamentalism that we are (American Christians) the " new Israel". This was a lot easier to pull off back when there wasn't an actual Israel. The new thing is, as pointed out, the ties to the Second Coming, but I don't even think that is Gothard as much as that might really be coming from Derick and Jill themselves. Jill had been wearing the Star of David for years, and the trip to Israel for Derick and his mother was interesting. I don't even think the Duggars Sr. see it in such serious light.

What is interesting is that both Jill and Jessa really may be absorbing theology from their husbands. Wouldn't that be amusing, Jim Bob!

Edited April 12, 2015 by GEML

[BOOgen3]

Long time lurker, first time poster. These two special snowflakes have finally gotten on my last nerve. Jill and Derrick, it is time to grow up. You are adult parents of a helpless infant. The two of you are not children and have not been for many years. Derrick, a grown man that has procreated needs to learn to drive himself wherever he needs to go. It really is not scary to be in an automobile all by yourself. Jill, you need to go back to the TTH and dig through the communal closet for a pair of big girl panties. You are a grown up now and you need to learn to live like one. Just because you gave birth does not mean you need to have someone braiding your hair for you and staying with you overnight at the hospital. Just like a car, the hospital is not a scary place and is quite safe to be alone. Perhaps you were worried about defrauding someone with that gorgeous Johnny you were wearing or that a male nurse may have needed to check sutures or staples in your neither regions. Again, quite safe. I had my only son 24 years ago by c-section, was hospitalized for 5 days, with just my husband present. He visited during the day, popping in and out from work and went home every night. That was all the quiet family bonding time we needed. I got myself showered and presentable for visitors and enjoyed passing out occasionally on pain meds. There is just something about hearing about people treating any female at any time like a delicate little flower that drives me mad. If only these two would just grow up and act like the mature responsible adults that they believe themselves to be. Sorry for the rant.

[GEML]

I don't get the anger over someone braiding her hair. If you've had a c-section, caring for your hair (especially long hair) is a challenge. Braiding it requires twisting, which would be painful. It's just something kind her sister did.

[Libby96]

What I want to know is, is he circumcised? :-)

I wonder if they will mention it on the VSE, but I bet he is. Considering that the Duggars follow certain Old Testament practices such as abstaining from eating pork and waiting so many days to resume "relations" after birth, I bet circumcision is important to them. I had a friend who is a Christian but definitely not of the Duggar variety who told me in all seriousness that she was having her baby son circumcised as some kind of sign he's set apart for God. They didn't hold a bris or anything, but it seemed to be a big deal to her for that reason. I'm a Christian as well, but my thoughts when my boys were circumcised was "yeah, let's match Dad and have that area as easy as possible to clean since we're going to be changing diapers for a few years."

And I mean this as no disrespect to practicing Jews who have their sons circumcised for religious reasons. I just give the side eye to Christians who claim something other than practical or medical reasons.

[NEGirl]

I was also wondering if the baby was circumcised.

[msblossom]

I don't get the anger over someone braiding her hair. If you've had a c-section, caring for your hair (especially long hair) is a challenge. Braiding it requires twisting, which would be painful. It's just something kind her sister did.

I agree. Kind and thoughtful. Long hair like Jill's will get tangled and matted underneath so easily while she's lying in a hospital bed, so having it braided will prevent that and keep it neat.

[Wellfleet]

Agreed, I have no issue with the Star of David, its not solely a Jewish symbol. But the flag is the symbol of the nation of Israel and in my opinion, isn't an appropriate birth announcement.

 

Agree - it's fine to wear the Star of David, whether you're Jewish or not. It's fine to name your baby Israel David, no matter who you are. But for two people who are neither Jewish nor Israeli to use the flag of Israel for the baby announcement - from which the date is missing BTW - that's just really poor.

[msblossom]

These two are a strange couple. They may be more suited for each other than we think. Very decidedly Jewish first and middle name -- check! Inappropriate birth announcement -- check! What will be next with the Jewish themed baby story? Have a Schindler's List Movie Night at the Hospital? Paint a huuuge Star of David wall mural in Baby Israel's room?

[GEML]

I guess I just disagree that Jill has three other children. She's raised three other children, but they aren't hers. And they certainly aren't Derick's. She's a natural nurturer and could certainly handle raising several more in addition to those she has already. It would be devastating to her to have her fertility taken from her at such a young age, quiverful beliefs or not. And I think it would be cruel to Derick and Cathy too, who were looking forward to more children, even if not the enormous brood that perhaps Jill was picturing.

[snip]

Edited April 14, 2015 by Rhondinella
hysterectomy discussion

[hlemommy]

In the bible it says to circumcise your sons so my he is she had him snipped. I read somewhere jill drives Derek to work bc she likes the time with him but who knows for sure. And to everyone complaining about her hair being braided and someone staying the night with her, my mom stayed with me for all 4 births (one being a home birth) I loved that my mama stayed yo help me. I'm glad someone stayed with jill, the first baby can be scary. I still don't see what's wrong with the baby name or flag, Israel is chosen by God and I love that they incorporate God into everything. Call me crazy Idc tbh just how I was raised I guess

[GEML]

I get that the Israel flag is jarring, and it's probably inappropriate. But ask yourself if they had a daughter and named her Erin and used and Irish flag if you'd think it was just as inappropriate? I ask because in all honesty, their knowledge of the Middle East is probably as extensive of most American's actual understanding of Ireland's. And most American's have no trouble claiming to be Irish or celebrating St Patrick's Day.

Now, right now you can say it's all in good fun, but many of us are old enough to remember when Northetn Ireland was also an actual war zone and the political sides were stark. U2 didn't used to just be pop music back in the day ....

[lookeyloo]

I think the Israeli flag is an odd choice. I would also think the Irish flag accompanying the name Erin would be just as odd.

[NEGirl]

I have no problem either with someone braiding her hair. She just had major surgery and maybe it just made her feel a little better. I also think the flag announcement is to much.  It's not like Derick is going off to fight for Israel or is an Israeli  citizen.

Edited April 12, 2015 by NEGirl

[msblossom]

And then there was the Israeli Army t-shirt that Derick wore with the first picture they took with Israel and Jill. Ugh.

[SusieQZie]

The use of the Israeli flag for the birth announcement is just as tacky as they are. Maybe Uncle Josh was too busy working (heh) to make photo announcements (since he is the family graphic designer and all).

[Mountainair]

So much about that announcement bugs but it's that second hashtag that takes the cake.
I don't see any celebration of their baby here. It just screams Agenda, Agenda, Agenda!!!

[snip]

My best friend had a hysterectomy at the age of 32 after having one child. It started out as pelvic pro lapse at 31 with a surgery to repair. It didn't work and she had a full hysterectomy at 32. Beautiful, single woman never able to have kids again. It's tough news no matter the age or circumstances.

Edited April 14, 2015 by Rhondinella
hysterectomy discussion

[NikSac]

I have no problem either with someone braiding her hair. She just had major surgery and maybe it just made her feel a little better. I also think the flag announcement is to much.  It's not like Derick is going off to fight for Israel or is an Israeli  citizen.

 

Same here. Please forgive me for saying it but I thought the hair braiding was kind of sweet. I've had surgery a few times and I know I felt horrible when my hair was gross. I haven't seen it confirmed yet if she had surgery, but if she did or even if she was just in labor for hours, that was probably a big deal for her. I think it was nice of her daughter - er I mean sister - to do that.

[Ilovemylabs]

Jessa and Ben can say they'll adopt until they're blue in the face, but we all know it'll never happen.

Here's something to think about.  What about some rabid fan having a baby and giving it to them through private adoption?  I have always been suspicious of celebrities who adopt in record time.  How'd they do that?  My kids are adopted and it took a LONG time!

[cereality]

[snip] If she wants to be open to some choices in her life at some point that do not involve child bearing, Derick can run to Target and grab a box of Trojans just like any other guy. Until then -- they can have a kid every 9 months if they'd rather. 

 

I don't really know -- or care -- what the fundie stance is re Israel, but I do think they are messed up in the head -- not just Jill but Derick as well. I don't care if they believe that Israel is 100% politically and religiously correct in everything it does or that Jews are 100% perfect, and the family is immigrating to Israel next year; BUT why would you use your CHILD as a platform for this kind of thing by burdening him with such a "significant" name? Every time his name shows up on a resume or a college application (though who am I kidding -- maybe he won't go to college and will work for Grandpa JB his whole life), there will be presumptions made re his religion, his politics etc. Now if it turns out the kid is 100% on board, great. But what if his child isn't enamored with religion or fundie culture? He's stuck with a name that suggests he is. I mean some of Jill's own siblings are over it -- I'm looking at you Josiah, James, and Joy; does Jill not realize that "culture" weakens over generations? I feel like most "smart" parents try to think about what names sound like for a little kid but also for a 30 yr old profession. Derick goes through life with such an "easy" name, and then burdens his kid with the name "Israel" in a place that isn't exactly as cosmopolitan as NYC?

 

And yes it would be just as weird if they had an Ian or a Sean and had an Irish flag birth announcement as part of a political agenda.

 

As for the hair braiding -- eh. Look -- Joy is essentially Jill's daughter. For days she's probably been getting reports at home that the birth was taking days, they had to head to the hospital, she needs a C-section etc. She was probably sitting at home expecting/fearing the worst -- or even if she was at the hospital with her -- seeing Jill screaming her lungs out was probably unnerving. So after it's over, she probably wants to be around Jill and spend time with her and make sure she is "really" ok. She probably asked -- what can I do for you, and hair is probably the only thing they could come up with. I mean all Jill really needed at that time was sleep (which Joy obviously can't do for her) and food (which was already being brought on trays). This was another "nice" thing to do.

Edited April 14, 2015 by Rhondinella
hysterectomy discussion

[Literata]

Great points, but you forgot that God never tells the Duggars something they don't want to hear. For example, Jchelle's c-sections, preeclampsia and preemie Josie weren't signs to stop having kids. They just needed to try harder.

Exactly. And now, revisionist historian MEchelle is maintaining Josie's early delivery was due to "gallbladder pain."

Edited April 12, 2015 by Literata

[Fostersmom]

 

but my thoughts when my boys were circumcised was "yeah, let's match Dad and have that area as easy as possible to clean since we're going to be changing diapers for a few years."

 

My sister demanded that her sons be circumcised for the same reason and the insurance company actually tried to fight it with her first one. They tried claiming it wasn't medically necessary. Meanwhile my grandfather decided to get himself circumcised when he was like 75 because it's supposed to help ward off prostate cancer. Imagine my mom's surprise when she called his doctor, concerned that he had bleeding and wouldn't tell my mom what it was from. 20 years ago the doctor had no problem telling my mom what the reason was, no HIPAA then to keep that private. 

 

I think it's sweet Jill braided her hair. Even in the best of health, braiding hair that long takes a bit of twisting and your arms can get tired depending on the style. Plus, it usually feels really nice to have someone else brush your hair. I'm never going to turn down someone brushing my hair. It was probably relaxing for Jill and felt good. It's not like Jill was doing Joy's or Michelle's. 

[3 is enough]

 

And yes it would be just as weird if they had an Ian or a Sean and had an Irish flag birth announcement as part of a political agenda.

This is too funny. My two sons are named Ian and Sean.  They are in their 20's now, but I assure you there were no Scottish or Irish flags on the birth announcements.  Heck, we didn't even HAVE birth announcements.  No agenda for us, just wanted short names to reflect their heritage on my side of the family.  DH is Italian with a very long family name.  It may sound silly, but we wanted them to be able to fit their names in the boxes on forms, something my husband has had issues with all his life.  

[JenCarroll]

[snip] 

 

Just because you gave birth does not mean you need to have someone braiding your hair for you and staying with you overnight at the hospital. Just like a car, the hospital is not a scary place and is quite safe to be alone. Perhaps you were worried about defrauding someone with that gorgeous Johnny you were wearing or that a male nurse may have needed to check sutures or staples in your neither regions. Again, quite safe. I had my only son 24 years ago by c-section, was hospitalized for 5 days, with just my husband present. He visited during the day, popping in and out from work and went home every night. That was all the quiet family bonding time we needed. I got myself showered and presentable for visitors and enjoyed passing out occasionally on pain meds.

I'm a grown woman with grown children. I've been hospitalized a number of times, and I'm afraid of staying alone there. I'm okay with sleeping overnight, but during the day (and most particularly, in the ER) I strongly prefer to have someone with me for a number of reasons. Among them, that a lot of doctors and nurses and techs come through, and if you're on meds or really sick, it's great to have someone who can keep track of who they all are and what they tell you. I'm glad you had an uncomplicated hospitalization, but I can't agree that wanting to have someone with you is unreasonable or somehow infantile. Especially when you have people able and willing to to be there.

Edited April 14, 2015 by Rhondinella
hysterectomy discussion

[DoctorWhovian]

Are Jill and derickdillard obsessed or what? A star of David on his instagram? If I were a jewish person, I would be insulted. Either convert or quit going overboard on this stuff already....just shameful, silly and using that child IMO, already.

 

I'm not even that Jewish and I find the whole fundie obsession with Israel to be gross. 

[Hpmec]

If Jill and Derick are enamored with Israel and Judaism, they should consider converting. I think it's offensive for Christian fundamentalists to use Jewish symbols to promote their apocalyptic wet dream.

As for the future, Jill will do whatever it takes to have as many children as she possibly can. I'm betting she'll be pregnant again by summer.

[Arkay]

I think Israel David is a great name. Why shouldn't they have the right to name their child according to their wishes? That's their child and their decision. They are also free to use any symbols that they wish.

[ramble]

[snip] While I don't agree with the Duggar/Dillards on every topic I can easily be thrilled for them over the birth of their child. The name doesn't bother me either. It might not be first on my list but it would come before a lot of other names I've seen. I thought little Iz was cute as can be. I think all babies are usually, even the slightly homely ones are still adorably baby cute.

Edited April 14, 2015 by Rhondinella
hys discussion

[Hpmec]

They can name their child anything they wish. Who's stopping them?

Christian fundamentalists believe that the establishment of the State of Israel is a sign that the end times are near. They believe that when the rapture occurs, Jews will either be converted or destroyed. Use of Jewish symbolism by people who equate Israel with the end of the world and the conversion or destruction of the Jewish people is just IMO wrong.

[elainebenis]

Christian fundamentalists believe that the establishment of the State of Israel is a sign that the end times are near. They believe that when the rapture occurs, Jews will either be converted or destroyed. Use of Jewish symbolism by people who equate Israel with the end of the world and the conversion or destruction of the Jewish people is just IMO wrong.

 

This. Despite all their Bibi ass-licking and #istandwithisrael grandstanding, actual Jews are just collateral damage in their end-times fever dream. Disgusting.

[DangerousMinds]

Wow - I knew they were extreme, but didn't realize they actually believed in a "rapture."

[WalrusGirl]

it seems very 'off' to me that Jill went way past her due date and she was not induced....is that a midwife type of thing, to just wait so long for the baby to come?? Was/could it have been Jill's decision to do that?? I would think she would know better than to go so far past her due date just because she wanted to have a home birth so bad, if that is what happened....I think most dr's would have induced her soon after her due date, especially given the size of the baby.... Any enlightenment/thoughts/ideas on all this would be appreciated!!

A relative's wife (in the US, but not Arkansas) became pretty dedicated to home births after a previous hospital induction. I think their midwife let her go about two weeks past due, then they induced at home with castor oil and had a home birth as planned. (I think going any later past her EDD might have moved her into a higher delivery risk category that would have nixed even trying the home birth, based on their team or state's policies.) That was 10 years ago, so who knows what current "best" home birth practice is (or was then), but natural inductions can be and are done for home births, at home, when the issue is getting too far past due without other concerning factors.

Of course, totally cool with me if someone isn't interested in the castor oil induction method! (Not that any induction is a particular blast.)

Thinking about it, any plans to nationally televise the birth may have also ruled out castor oil for Jill. Quite reasonably so, me thinks. (As I recall, the intestinal cramping triggers uterine contractions, and while I can sort of wrap my mind around people agreeing to televise their delivery, it's a whole other ball of wax to go in knowing it's going to involve an exceptional amount of time on the toilet too.)

I do hope that Jill's extra hospital days weren't due to any infections or serious issues for her or the baby. I see no problem with anyone doing her hair for her in the hospital - she probably couldn't take a real shower, incision-wise, and a braid works great for dirty hair and keeps it out of the way. Plus some girls love doing hair in general. Not a big deal, and a c- is major (if routine) surgery. The weight of the actual infant is pretty borderline in terms of weight restrictions and what most are physically able to do initially.

Re circumcision, I honestly hope they don't address their son's privates at all, as it's none of our business, but all of the home birth/doula/midwife types I know (and therefore the links I see on FB) are pretty universally against infant circumcision, even though there's the expected significant overlap with very religious/evangelical beliefs. I'd guess that religious belief and tradition would win out for Jill and Derek, but it also wouldn't completely stun me if she took a pass. (Since she was planning on a home birth, it also would have been something planned to be dealt with separate from delivery anyway. Did Josh and Anna say whether they took the boys in? If there were complications for the baby, that can also necessarily nix even a plan to circumcise and then it's delayed temporarily or indefinitely.) But I hope it's never addressed.

[ChocolateAddict]

I agree with WalrusGirl.  Poor Izzy is going to have to live with the fact that millions of people will have seen his birth, a fact that will probably come back to embarrass him.  Especially given the media attention on Jill, this kid won't have any privacy for the next few years, or until audiences get bored.  It annoys me no end when reality families put their infant children into the media spotlight without any consideration of how it might impact them later (Keeping Up with the Kardashians, Jon & Kate Plus Eight, 19 Kids & Counting). 

I'm sure that we will no more than enough about Izzy and I certainly hope that we never find out if he is circumcised.  That kid is going to have enough issues, no need to know about his genitals. 

Just writing those last two sentences creeps me out so much!!!!

[SusieQZie]

The Dillards put up a thank you Instagram pic today saying they are home. Jill is in bed and Derek is sitting on the nightstand or something. It kind of looks like an IV line is visible behind Derek- like tubing, and you cant really see Jills arm all the way. Weird.

[graefin]

The Dillards put up a thank you Instagram pic today saying they are home. Jill is in bed and Derek is sitting on the nightstand or something. It kind of looks like an IV line is visible behind Derek- like tubing, and you cant really see Jills arm all the way. Weird.

I noticed that too. There is definitely a drip set in the background, so it seems that she went home on an IV. I'm guessing that this isn't standard protocol following a C-section.

[questionfear]

I noticed that too. There is definitely a drip set in the background, so it seems that she went home on an IV. I'm guessing that this isn't standard protocol following a C-section.

That is definitely not protocol. Eek. Hopefully shes ok.

[Cherrio]

If Jill and Derick are enamored with Israel and Judaism, they should consider converting. I think it's offensive for Christian fundamentalists to use Jewish symbols to promote their apocalyptic wet dream.

As for the future, Jill will do whatever it takes to have as many children as she possibly can. I'm betting she'll be pregnant again by summer.

No Rabbi would convert them.  Even when someone genuinely wants to become a Jew, its a long and serious process requiring a lot of study and counseling. 

       It would never happen.

[Zahdii]

That's bizarre.  The only thing I can think of is that Jill might be on IV antibiotics.  Years ago a woman at my work had some kind of infection that required IV antibiotics.  Since her sister or sister-in-law knew how to change IV bags and was staying with them, this woman came to work with an IV stand that she pulled along with her wherever she went.  She only had to have the bags changed every 12 hours, so she adjusted her schedule to make sure she was home when the exchange needed to be made.  I didn't know her personally, so I don't know any more than that, but that's what people were told when they saw her.  She only needed to keep it up for a couple of weeks, but whatever she had had caused her to miss almost a month of work before she could come back.  After that, she was done and faded into the woodwork as just another one of the worker bees.

 

We also had a guy who was recovering from a broken neck and wore a 'halo' device for a long time.  Someone else kept their insulin in the fridge.  At one point we had a woman who was undergoing some kind of dialysis that didn't require her to go in to a dialysis clinic, but she had bags or something she'd exchange out routinely.  There was a locked cabinet in one of the bathrooms where her supplies were kept.  Eventually it became too much to handle and she went on the more common dialysis treatment.  There were also at least two people who had colostomies.  They used the same bathroom as the dialysis lady, it had a shower attached in case there was a problem emptying their colostomy bags, and there was a change of clothing inside that locked cabinet in case it was needed. 

 

Not every long term (or short term) medical problem needs to be handled inside a hospital.  I had a surgery years ago that required me to give myself shots twice a day in my stomach for 10 days.  I learned how to do it so I could go home.  If Jill's on an IV, either she was taught how to change her med bags out herself, or a visiting nurse is coming in to do it and to check on her.

[hlemommy]

I thought most Christians/jews/etc. Believed in the rapture?? I should probably get out more... I know the rapture is coming but not everyone believes...I hope jill is ok i haven't seen the new pic yet :(

[Fostersmom]

That's an IV drip of some sort, be it antibiotics or fluids. I doubt they would just send her home with IV pain meds. That would be kind of extreme and they wouldn't be in a drip bag quite like that. It's convenient she can use her bedpost as an IV stand. I wish I had that option. I've have MS and twice I've had to do IV steroids at home. It was home or having to be admitted to the hospital for 3 days, which would be entirely stupid since it was literally 1 small IV bag a day, took about 90 minutes each bag. For whatever reason, they can't do it as an out patient kinda thing at the doctors office. The nurse would come, hook me up, and we would make small talk ing my livingroom until the bag was empty. Oddly enough, they had NO issue delivering me a UPS box of the steroid bags to my JOB the last time. Each time I did it, it was a just pain in the ass to keep the cat from trying to play with the hosing or knock the pole over. Now I'm looking around the apartment trying to see what I could use instead of the pole. LOL! 

[frenchtoast]

Folks, talk in here has reached critical mass. You have all had your say about the name, the type of birth, possible complications etc. The dead horse is well and truly beaten. Understandably, it's great big news, but the points have been made several times over and all the talking has become circular.

 

Maybe it would be a good idea if everyone took a break from this thread and came back on Tuesday night after the new episode airs. That way there will be something new to talk about. We really don't want to have to start deleting posts.

 

Thanks your friendly mods!

[Missy Vixen]

Confirmation that the name Israel is agenda-based. 

 

https://instagram.com/p/1WLS1-GCYC/?taken-by=derickdillard

Nice to know that Jilly Muffin and derickdillard believe that co-opting another country's flag for a birth announcement is hunky-dory.

Maybe it would be a good idea if everyone took a break from this thread and came back on Tuesday night after the new episode airs. That way there will be something new to talk about. We really don't want to have to start deleting posts.

 

Thanks your friendly mods!

Sorry, frenchtoast. I didn't see the warning before I posted. And thanks to you, Rhondinella and a cast of thousands ;-) for doing such a great job.

[maraleia]

Nice to know that Jilly Muffin and derickdillard believe that co-opting another country's flag for a birth announcement is hunky-dory.

Sorry, frenchtoast. I didn't see the warning before I posted. And thanks to you, Rhondinella and a cast of thousands ;-) for doing such a great job.

That's OK Missy. We (frenchtoast, Rhondinella and I) just wanted to curb the circular convo going on in here.

[mbutterfly]

They can name their child anything they wish. Who's stopping them?

Christian fundamentalists believe that the establishment of the State of Israel is a sign that the end times are near. They believe that when the rapture occurs, Jews will either be converted or destroyed. Use of Jewish symbolism by people who equate Israel with the end of the world and the conversion or destruction of the Jewish people is just IMO wrong.

Since Scripture doesn't literally say this, it is surprising it is universally believe by Christian fundamentalists. That said, it's fine with me if that is Jill and Derrick's belief. It isn't the worst belief in the world, that's for sure. I'm fairly certain Jill and Derrick haven't contemplated the implication for Jewish people. 

I thought most Christians/jews/etc. Believed in the rapture?? I should probably get out more... I know the rapture is coming but not everyone believes...I hope jill is ok i haven't seen the new pic yet :(

The Rapture concept only goes back to 1830. I suspect Jill and Derrick haven't given this piece of theology much serious thought (nor much of any piece of theology). 

[kaleidoscope]

Does anyone have the Instagram link picture of Jill and Dilly home?  Thank you!

[Sew Sumi]

https://instagram.com/p/1XGu90mCRb/

 

You can see the line running behind DerickDullard's head. 

 

eta: This may have been during labor. Don't forget that while Muffy was in the hospital, Boob drove DerickDullard to the orthodontist to get his braces put on. Jill may have been released before the c-section 96 hour timeframe, and Derick took this before he got his braces on Friday. 

 

eta: Right after I hit send, I realized that DerickDullard may have gotten Invisalign, like Anna. So this may well have been taken last night. Her 96 hours was up right before midnight Saturday; it looks like she may well have been there the entire time, and not released early. 

Edited April 12, 2015 by Sew Sumi

[Wellfleet]

I think Israel David is a great name. Why shouldn't they have the right to name their child according to their wishes? That's their child and their decision. They are also free to use any symbols that they wish.

 

Of course Jill & Derick are free to name their baby whatever they wish. Absolutely anything. But actions create consequences too, Jerick. They also have to accept the consequences of choosing a politically-charged name. Which may be why we don't tend to meet a lot of four-year old Adolfs or Benitos these days.

[GEML]

Being southern, he can always go by I. David Dillard and no one will bat an eye.

[Higgins]

Of course Jill & Derick are free to name their baby whatever they wish. Absolutely anything. But actions create consequences too, Jerick. They also have to accept the consequences of choosing a politically-charged name. Which may be why we don't tend to meet a lot of four-year old Adolfs or Benitos these days.

How is Israel anything like Adolf or Benito?