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The Duggalos: Jinger and the Holy Goalie

frenchtoast

By frenchtoast
in Counting On

cm-soupsipper
Message added by cm-soupsipper,

Closure Notice: This Thread is now closed due to the name (and much of the posting within it). Please be mindful going forward by naming topics in a way that invites a healthy community conversation. If you name something for a cheap laugh, this thread may be closed later because it encourages discrimination and harm. 

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Spencer Hastings
Spencer Hastings

Tough crowd!  She's wearing modern shoes with closed toes, pants, and a shirt that literally calls back to her family's ridiculous rules and there are still 35 things wrong with what she's doing. 

Churchhoney
Churchhoney

That's okay. He's forgotten it a few times himself. 

GeeGolly
GeeGolly

My push presents after having my kids were my kids. 

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McManda

McManda

1 hour ago, DragonFaerie said:

wtf is up with that cheap, wrong size blind???

I don't think it's the wrong size, though he should have taken care to actually pull it up correctly.

If you mean not fitting at the top, I think because the top of the window is a semicircle one would need a fan blind to fill that space. I don't think it's uncommon to leave the top open, at least around here, provided you're only using the blind for privacy and not as a light shield.

  • Love 21
DragonFaerie

DragonFaerie

I get that it needs the top fan part, but from this angle it looks like instead of sort of sitting in the window frame it's just tacked up a bit unevenly on the outside.  Reminds me Jessa nailing curtains on her windows, plus it's sort of askew.  Maybe it's my orderly obsession couple to the fact that as a house cleaner in the past I have learned to despise blinds like these.  The dust - OMG.

queenanne

queenanne

5 hours ago, allonsyalice said:

 i do the open laptop//writing longhand thing all the time. Research, copying notes, watching a movie while i work on my novel in the notebook. I think its a pretty common student type thing.

Yeah, sometimes the thoughts just won't flow without the proper writing medium.  I can't "get behind" the idea of doing these things with a stylus on a touch screen, because my handwriting is so abysmal.  I had a Galaxy Note 4 tablet and it never understood anything I scrawled, I wonder that folks actually really get any work done with Microsoft Surface, despite all those pretty commercials.  They've even got e-pens where you can fake doodle handwritten notes on your jeans, bedspread, etc. and it claims technology translates them accurately and successfully right into Word as typed language; I've got my doubts.  

  • Love 5
Zella

Zella

46 minutes ago, queenanne said:

Yeah, sometimes the thoughts just won't flow without the proper writing medium.  I can't "get behind" the idea of doing these things with a stylus on a touch screen, because my handwriting is so abysmal.  I had a Galaxy Note 4 tablet and it never understood anything I scrawled, I wonder that folks actually really get any work done with Microsoft Surface, despite all those pretty commercials.  They've even got e-pens where you can fake doodle handwritten notes on your jeans, bedspread, etc. and it claims technology translates them accurately and successfully right into Word as typed language; I've got my doubts.  

Oh I'd like to see it try to translate mine! I've never worked anywhere where my atrocious handwriting wasn't commented on and the subject of much confusion. At my current job, they started a rule that made typing up notes mandatory entirely due to my penmanship.

My excuse is I'm a natural lefty who was forced to be a righty. I do a modified version of the whole lefty hook hand thing but do it right handed and to the side instead of above. The results aren't pretty. I also still manage to smear tons of ink. I'm legitimately impressed when people can read my writing. Sometimes, I can't. :(

  • Love 6
Happyfatchick

Happyfatchick

As someone who has made some mention (couple hundred thousand maybe) of Jinger wearing pants - it’s not about whether she’s being fundy or not.  It’s about how she is giving a visual “no thanks” to all the crazy she grew up with.  For alllllll the times we all wished someone would give JB the side step - well, SHE DID!  

Actually, I “think” Jinger and her husband associate with Southern Baptists.  Southern Baptists really, truly, aren’t fundamentalists (fundy) in the same sense we consider the Duggar family.  There are many differences between being Southern Baptist and Independent (Fundamental) Baptist.

  • Love 8
becca3891

becca3891

4 hours ago, Happyfatchick said:

As someone who has made some mention (couple hundred thousand maybe) of Jinger wearing pants - it’s not about whether she’s being fundy or not.  It’s about how she is giving a visual “no thanks” to all the crazy she grew up with.  For alllllll the times we all wished someone would give JB the side step - well, SHE DID!  

Actually, I “think” Jinger and her husband associate with Southern Baptists.  Southern Baptists really, truly, aren’t fundamentalists (fundy) in the same sense we consider the Duggar family.  There are many differences between being Southern Baptist and Independent (Fundamental) Baptist.

I'm not sure it's nearly as much of a statement to JB as you're making it out to be. They already changed their modesty standards pretty drastically over the years, before any daughters moved out. If it really is a visual "no thanks," I am thrilled -- I'm just not so sure!

As for fundamentalism, I very much disagree with you that Southern Baptists aren't. (Although, Jeremy and Jinger's church is actually non-denominational, but their very long statement of beliefs makes it clear they meet all the requirements.) They are biblical literalists, who believe that any person who has not accepted Jesus as their savior will spend an eternity in hell. They believe in the creation story, all the biblical miracles, and oppose same sex marriage. They agree with the verses stating that wives should submit to their husbands and must not be allowed to speak or lead in church.

Your personal definition of fundy may include skirts and avoiding birth control, but that doesn't line up with the commonly understood definition. Still, I am obviously glad if they are indeed planning to control the size of their family!

  • Love 8
Ohiopirate02

Ohiopirate02

(edited)
3 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

I've always felt with all organized religions there's a spectrum. For instance, many folks who identify as Catholic aren't pro-life, anti-gay or against birth control. Is this not true for Fundies? Can they identify as Fundy but hold personal beliefs that are different?

I really don't find that to be the case.  Usually when a fundie begins to question their pastor's belief, they end up finding another church like a nondenominational Christian church.  They don't have the tradition and culture that Catholics have.  I would say as a pro-coice Catholic who sees nothing wrong with gay marriage and birth control that I have changed Catholic churches to find one that fits my beliefs more.  My priest focuses more on Catholic social teaching and avoids only hammering on being anti abortion.  Being pro-life means more than only stopping abortion.  We have a more expansive theology that can allow for this. 

Also, Catholics don't have many options for changing churches.  If there was a church that stayed away from the abortion issue, allowed for gay marriage, followed Catholic social teaching and believed in Transubstantiation; then I would join that church.  The only way for that church to exist is for the Roman Catholic Church to change, and all I can do is pray that it will.   Protestants do not have these theological issues that can keep them in their church. 

Edited by Ohiopirate02
added more about Catholic theology
  • Love 13
Churchhoney

Churchhoney

(edited)
8 hours ago, Happyfatchick said:

As someone who has made some mention (couple hundred thousand maybe) of Jinger wearing pants - it’s not about whether she’s being fundy or not.  It’s about how she is giving a visual “no thanks” to all the crazy she grew up with.  For alllllll the times we all wished someone would give JB the side step - well, SHE DID!  

Actually, I “think” Jinger and her husband associate with Southern Baptists.  Southern Baptists really, truly, aren’t fundamentalists (fundy) in the same sense we consider the Duggar family.  There are many differences between being Southern Baptist and Independent (Fundamental) Baptist.

They don't go with the Southern Baptists, actually. That's Derick and Jill who are at Cross Church, Arkansas. It's the church Derick grew up in. 

Jer affiliates with two basically independent churches -- a Grace Community in San Antonio -- the planting church of his Laredo living room-- helmed by Tim Conway, and then another Grace Community in LA -- the one helmed by John MacArthur -- which is behind Jer's seminary and whose conferences he's also attended. ... Those are both independents, and MacArthur's is huge and gets called a megachurch .......Both call themselves "reformed" so they're kinda sorta Calvinist evangelical, and they're both heavily into the "sufficiency of Scripture" -- the "we're purely Bible-based" stuff. They're also both into the "complementarian" thing. But they're apparently not affiliated with each other and are not affiliated -- emphatically! -- with any denomination. Just have theological similarities... Chuck Vuolo's persuasions are similar.

So both Jer and Der are in the chips-off-the-old-block school of theology choosing, it appears.

Edited by Churchhoney
  • Love 9
doodlebug

doodlebug

2 hours ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

I really don't find that to be the case.  Usually when a fundie begins to question their pastor's belief, they end up finding another church like a nondenominational Christian church.  They don't have the tradition and culture that Catholics have.  I would say as a pro-coice Catholic who sees nothing wrong with gay marriage and birth control that I have changed Catholic churches to find one that fits my beliefs more.  My priest focuses more on Catholic social teaching and avoids only hammering on being anti abortion.  Being pro-life means more than only stopping abortion.  We have a more expansive theology that can allow for this. 

Also, Catholics don't have many options for changing churches.  If there was a church that stayed away from the abortion issue, allowed for gay marriage, followed Catholic social teaching and believed in Transubstantiation; then I would join that church.  The only way for that church to exist is for the Roman Catholic Church to change, and all I can do is pray that it will.   Protestants do not have these theological issues that can keep them in their church. 

This.  I saw Springsteen on Broadway a couple weeks ago and he spent a lot of time talking about being raised in the Church.  At the end of the show, he told a story about going back to his childhood home and discovering the tree that he’d loved as a kid had been cut down, but, when he looked down the street, his childhood church was still there.  He laughed about how, no matter how much he might change, how much of it he disagreed with; he was born a Catholic and there was no escaping it.  Then, he recited The Lord’s Prayer (Catholic version) and said goodnight.  That’s me in a nutshell.  I don’t know a lot of Protestants who feel that way about their specific denomination.

  • Love 21
Nysha

Nysha

My hope is that along with pants Jinger is allowed to have opinions and to disagree with Jeremy. Every church I've attended has believed that husbands are the head of the house and wives are to be submissive, but none of them ever took it to the extent that the Duggars and Gothard followers do. My last pastor, who homeschooled his kids and didn't have a television, even preached a sermon on the idea that while wives were supposed to be submissive, husbands were to be loving, gentle, and use common sense. If his wife disagreed with him, he needed to give her ideas as much thought as his because there was a good chance she may be right. 

  • Love 17
queenanne

queenanne

8 hours ago, Nysha said:

My hope is that along with pants Jinger is allowed to have opinions and to disagree with Jeremy. Every church I've attended has believed that husbands are the head of the house and wives are to be submissive, but none of them ever took it to the extent that the Duggars and Gothard followers do. My last pastor, who homeschooled his kids and didn't have a television, even preached a sermon on the idea that while wives were supposed to be submissive, husbands were to be loving, gentle, and use common sense. If his wife disagreed with him, he needed to give her ideas as much thought as his because there was a good chance she may be right. 

Yeah, fundies like to forget that one, the same way they forget that after "Children, obey your parents", the verse also says parents shouldn't exasperate their children, which I for one have always taken to mean "Choose your battles and learn when something is trivial and not worth arguing with them over".  Mine liked to exasperate me so much daily that I couldn't wait to get away from them, by objecting to just about anything anyone could possibly object to - grades, being in church every time the door was open, manner of dress, music, reading material, patterns of speech, and so forth.

  • Love 17
DangerousMinds

DangerousMinds

On 6/2/2018 at 6:49 AM, queenanne said:

Yeah, fundies like to forget that one, the same way they forget that after "Children, obey your parents", the verse also says parents shouldn't exasperate their children, which I for one have always taken to mean "Choose your battles and learn when something is trivial and not worth arguing with them over".  Mine liked to exasperate me so much daily that I couldn't wait to get away from them, by objecting to just about anything anyone could possibly object to - grades, being in church every time the door was open, manner of dress, music, reading material, patterns of speech, and so forth.

It’s shocking to me that none of the Duggar kids have had that same reaction and run for the hills.

  • Love 7
Churchhoney

Churchhoney

(edited)
1 hour ago, DangerousMinds said:

It’s shocking to me that none of the Duggar kids have had that same reaction and run for the hills.

I blame TeeVee money and fame for the total reluctance. If they couldn't bask in the glory of having tens and even hundreds of social-media followers and were still as financially shaky as they were before TeeVee, I'm convinced at least a few of them would have jumped ship long since. 

As it is, there are some powerful temptations alongside the brainwashing and the lack of education and job training that keep whispering "stay....stay...stay...." 

I also think that at least half and maybe more of the marryers-in we have so far would NOT have married in, were the above the case. 

Edited by Churchhoney
  • Love 19
Loves2Dance

Loves2Dance

On 5/19/2018 at 7:27 PM, McManda said:

I'm a sucker for the tall, dark, and handsome trope so I'd say Jeremy is attractive. But like you he opens his mouth and I remember why I'd never be able to date him.

Maybe that's why I don't mind his model-inspired Instagram. I think he's easy enough on the eyes, but at the very least he's visually inoffensive.

I think Jeremy is hot and if I were his age and we were in college together, I would have probably looked twice. Stared even. 

It's not until he opens his mouth that he becomes un-attractive to me. 

  • Love 10
Scarlett45

Scarlett45

(edited)
2 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

I blame TeeVee money and fame for the total reluctance. If they couldn't bask in the glory of having tens and even hundreds of social-media followers and were still as financially shaky as they were before TeeVee, I'm convinced at least a few of them would have jumped ship long since. 

As it is, there are some powerful temptations alongside the brainwashing and the lack of education and job training that keep whispering "stay....stay...stay...." 

I also think that at least half and maybe more of the marryers-in we have so far would NOT have married in, were the above the case. 

 

I trust your opinion @Churchhoney, but even as someone with no personal experience in this area I agree with you. Had their been no tv show/trips/social media fans etc, a few of the older children would’ve jumped ship.

My money is on Josh first (cause they couldn’t have bought him a wife), then Jessa/Jinger would’ve left together. Also probably Josiah/Joy-Anna. Joe I think would’ve done his own thing, but maintained a distance from his parents without jumping ship.  I think they would’ve needed Jill to go out and earn an income, if she met a guy who was nice to HER as an individual she would’ve been gone too. Jana/JD may have still stayed out of duty to the littles, counting down the days. 

Edited by Scarlett45
  • Love 9
Temperance

Temperance

2 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

I trust your opinion @Churchhoney, but even as someone with no personal experience in this area I agree with you. Had their been no tv show/trips/social media fans etc, a few of the older children would’ve jumped ship.

My money is on Josh first (cause they couldn’t have bought him a wife), then Jessa/Jinger would’ve left together. Also probably Josiah/Joy-Anna. Joe I think would’ve done his own thing, but maintained a distance from his parents without jumping ship.  I think they would’ve needed Jill to go out and earn an income, if she met a guy who was nice to HER as an individual she would’ve been gone too. Jana/JD may have still stayed out of duty to the littles, counting down the days. 

I'm not sure they couldn't have found a wife for Josh. I think a lot of youngish fundies marry even without money. I also think Jill would have stayed, because she really like being a Duggar and I'm not why she would have needed to work more than any of the others. I agree with you about the others although I'm not sure of Jana/Jd's motivations. I also think the -iah twins would be gone/leaving soon. 

  • Love 1
Scarlett45

Scarlett45

1 hour ago, Temperance said:

I'm not sure they couldn't have found a wife for Josh. I think a lot of youngish fundies marry even without money. I also think Jill would have stayed, because she really like being a Duggar and I'm not why she would have needed to work more than any of the others. I agree with you about the others although I'm not sure of Jana/Jd's motivations. I also think the -iah twins would be gone/leaving soon. 

I see what you’re saying. I do think without “fame & fortune” josh’s Rep would’ve made it harder to find him a wife even in fundy circles. My comment about Jill is rooted in without money/fame they would’ve HAD to have some kidults earning an income to keep the fridge stocked. Jana still probably would’ve been the mom substitute but the other Jslaves would’ve had to earn an income to keep the family afloat (like Lawson Bates supported his family). 

  • Love 2
Normades

Normades

I think they stay out of guilt and fear.  If they left, it would damage their parents' brand and hurt their siblings.  They are also in fear of most of the world.  I would have thought having a teevee show would actually help them to leave, since there is some money there for a fresh start.  Of course, JimBoob has ensured he has complete control of the purse strings.  I just think if you compare the Duggars with the Rodrigues, the Duggars have actually had some experience in the secular world and traveled.  The Rods must be scared to death of everyone not related to them, probably even their fellow church members.  I also think any Duggar that leaves could earn some pretty big bucks with a tell all, but they can't cut those apron strings because they've been brainwashed into the belief system.  I keep thinking Josh would be in a much better position if he took off and wrote a book.  If Anna didn't want to go, he'd probably be even happier.  The only thing I can think of that keeps him in line is possibly that he's the only child who really bonded with MEschelle and he can't do it to her.  He obviously doesn't care much about his siblings.  I think the other kids stay out of various combinations of guilt and fear, oh and ignorance. Can't forget that.

  • Love 4
Scarlett45

Scarlett45

2 hours ago, Normades said:

I think they stay out of guilt and fear.  If they left, it would damage their parents' brand and hurt their siblings.  They are also in fear of most of the world.  I would have thought having a teevee show would actually help them to leave, since there is some money there for a fresh start.  Of course, JimBoob has ensured he has complete control of the purse strings.  I just think if you compare the Duggars with the Rodrigues, the Duggars have actually had some experience in the secular world and traveled.  The Rods must be scared to death of everyone not related to them, probably even their fellow church members.  I also think any Duggar that leaves could earn some pretty big bucks with a tell all, but they can't cut those apron strings because they've been brainwashed into the belief system.  I keep thinking Josh would be in a much better position if he took off and wrote a book.  If Anna didn't want to go, he'd probably be even happier.  The only thing I can think of that keeps him in line is possibly that he's the only child who really bonded with MEschelle and he can't do it to her.  He obviously doesn't care much about his siblings.  I think the other kids stay out of various combinations of guilt and fear, oh and ignorance. Can't forget that.

Josh being the scum he is also knows out in the world he’s a confessed child molester of his 5yrs old sister- not exactly a popular position to be in. I think he will leave eventually, within the next 10yrs for certain. People can only pretend for so long. They will probably have 3 more M kids by then though. 

I believe Jill is unhappy, and Josh- for the rest of the over 18s who knows. 

  • Love 2
DragonFaerie

DragonFaerie

On June 3, 2018 at 3:40 PM, Scarlett45 said:

I see what you’re saying. I do think without “fame & fortune” josh’s Rep would’ve made it harder to find him a wife even in fundy circles. My comment about Jill is rooted in without money/fame they would’ve HAD to have some kidults earning an income to keep the fridge stocked. Jana still probably would’ve been the mom substitute but the other Jslaves would’ve had to earn an income to keep the family afloat (like Lawson Bates supported his family). 

I definitely think that without the fame and teevee money, the older kids would have had to go out and get real jobs.  Maybe Jessa would have been able to go to cosmatology school like Ben's sister and have a real skill and be able to make money.  I could see Jana still being the "Mom" but I think the rest of the elders - JD, Josh, Jill, Jessa, Jinger, and Joe would need real jobs to put food on the table and the lights on.  Let's face it, can the used car dealership even support one kid and a small family?Meaning the Howlers would have needed to step up and instead of mowing yards once a week or so, they would have needed to take over cleaning and laundry duties and mow.

I also wonder about something - and I know it's not going to be a popular thought.  Josh's molestation happened before teevee fame, and he was sent to alert about the time they filmed 14 kids, I think?  If they had never had fame; if they had never been on teevee for years; if they hadn't been telling everyone how godly there were; would Josh's secret have ever come out? And if it did would anyone have heard about it? - I mean sure those in Arkansas might have, but the rest of the world?  Doubtful. So I'm not sure it would have been difficult to find him a wife.

  • Love 1
Christina87

Christina87

(edited)

It might have been good for Jill if they'd needed the money. Maybe she could have done some variation of nursing (obviously not an RN, with her SORDRT education), like maybe a CNA. I feel like her self-esteem would have skyrocketed if she'd been allowed to do that when she was single and not quite as entrenched in her ditzy persona. Jessa could maybe have done cosmetology, Jinger could have worked at a coffee shop, and joy could have gotten her hands dirty. I think they would all be a lot happier! When they got married, they could have been SAHM's if they'd wanted, but they would have some skills and self-esteem building life experience under their belt. And it wouldn't be quite so shameful that they can't cook or clean!

Edited by Christina87
  • Love 11
GeeGolly

GeeGolly

I think if TLC hadn't come calling, besides the money, the biggest lifestyle difference would be for the males. The females would be married, probably to inner circle Fundy men much like the Bates daughters. Jill might still be doing midwifery for the money and maybe Jinger would do engagement photos on the side. Jessa would still be a stay at home mom because the over 18s were told they could choose to do online higher ed, so she wouldn't be able to do a cosmetology course.

The boys however would all need jobs because JB wouldn't have the money to pay them all. I'm guessing cars and real estate. Josh's car lot wasn't very successful, but JB's parents did okay in the real estate business.

Poor Jinger and her husband would probably be living in the Guest Shed next to Jessa and her husband in the Guest Shack while Grandma Mary would have been thrown out so Jill and her husband could live in her room. Michelle would be walking around mumbling under her breath, "but what about leave and cleave".

  • Love 4
questionfear

questionfear

12 hours ago, DragonFaerie said:

I definitely think that without the fame and teevee money, the older kids would have had to go out and get real jobs.  Maybe Jessa would have been able to go to cosmatology school like Ben's sister and have a real skill and be able to make money.  I could see Jana still being the "Mom" but I think the rest of the elders - JD, Josh, Jill, Jessa, Jinger, and Joe would need real jobs to put food on the table and the lights on.  Let's face it, can the used car dealership even support one kid and a small family?Meaning the Howlers would have needed to step up and instead of mowing yards once a week or so, they would have needed to take over cleaning and laundry duties and mow.

I also wonder about something - and I know it's not going to be a popular thought.  Josh's molestation happened before teevee fame, and he was sent to alert about the time they filmed 14 kids, I think?  If they had never had fame; if they had never been on teevee for years; if they hadn't been telling everyone how godly there were; would Josh's secret have ever come out? And if it did would anyone have heard about it? - I mean sure those in Arkansas might have, but the rest of the world?  Doubtful. So I'm not sure it would have been difficult to find him a wife.

Alternately, without TV, would Josh have been welcomed back into the home? He was hidden because they were trying to be famous. If they weren't famous and didn't need to trot him out, I wonder if they would have given him the boot at 18 and never looked back. 

  • Love 1
Normades

Normades

(edited)
4 hours ago, questionfear said:

Alternately, without TV, would Josh have been welcomed back into the home? He was hidden because they were trying to be famous. If they weren't famous and didn't need to trot him out, I wonder if they would have given him the boot at 18 and never looked back. 

Maybe he would have gotten some real help without fame in the picture.  I know it's not a popular opinion, but I feel that his parents were a huge part of what caused Josh's problems.  Being isolated, crammed into a tiny home, and told everything about sex is sinful while you're a young man going through puberty is abusive.  Yes, what Josh did was awful and I don't condone it, but I also don't think they should have denied him real help.  Throwing him out at 18 to suffer more, improves the lives of his horrible parents by removing a problem and not holding them accountable. Of course, the girls also should have been given real therapy, too.  It's easy to hate Josh, but JimBoob and MEshelle need to take their part of the blame.  Throwing out an 18 year old kid with no education or means of support and mental health issues only pushes his problems on an unsuspecting society.  I can't get out the pitchforks for that idea.

Edited by Normades
feel not fell
  • Love 20
Albanyguy

Albanyguy

6 hours ago, questionfear said:

Alternately, without TV, would Josh have been welcomed back into the home? He was hidden because they were trying to be famous. If they weren't famous and didn't need to trot him out, I wonder if they would have given him the boot at 18 and never looked back. 

Under those circumstances, I could see Jim Bob wanting to be the badass patriarch and kick Josh to the curb, but Michelle would never allow it. Josh seems to be one of the very few members of her brood that she genuinely loves. I think Josh, as her firstborn, was the one she really bonded with before the Great Laundry Room Meltdown and all the subsequent Gothard craziness. When all the scandals broke and TLC cancelled their show, I think that she defended him when Jim Bob was ready to murder him and that it's because of her that he's been kept in the loop and has become an increasingly visible presence.

  • Love 5
Marigold

Marigold

9 minutes ago, Albanyguy said:

Under those circumstances, I could see Jim Bob wanting to be the badass patriarch and kick Josh to the curb, but Michelle would never allow it. Josh seems to be one of the very few members of her brood that she genuinely loves. I think Josh, as her firstborn, was the one she really bonded with before the Great Laundry Room Meltdown and all the subsequent Gothard craziness. When all the scandals broke and TLC cancelled their show, I think that she defended him when Jim Bob was ready to murder him and that it's because of her that he's been kept in the loop and has become an increasingly visible presence.

Who knows?  Maybe Michelle has guilt or  did something happen to Josh?  Michelle has always seemed to actually be a mother to Josh.  Clearly, they are close. 

Total speculation, of course.  But @Albanyguy comment just jumped out at me.  

  • Love 2
Scarlett45

Scarlett45

8 hours ago, questionfear said:

Alternately, without TV, would Josh have been welcomed back into the home? He was hidden because they were trying to be famous. If they weren't famous and didn't need to trot him out, I wonder if they would have given him the boot at 18 and never looked back. 

 

3 hours ago, Normades said:

Maybe he would have gotten some real help without fame in the picture.  I know it's not a popular opinion, but I feel that his parents were a huge part of what caused Josh's problems.  Being isolated, crammed into a tiny home, and told everything about sex is sinful while you're a young man going through puberty is abusive.  Yes, what Josh did was awful and I don't condone it, but I also don't think they should have denied him real help.  Throwing him out at 18 to suffer more, improves the lives of his horrible parents by removing a problem and not holding them accountable. Of course, the girls also should have been given real therapy, too.  It's easy to hate Josh, but JimBoob and MEshelle need to take their part of the blame.  Throwing out an 18 year old kid with no education or means of support and mental health issues only pushes his problems on an unsuspecting society.  I can't get out the pitchforks for that idea.

I don’t think they would’ve gotten him real help. I think that their pride would’ve gotten in the way. 

I do think if they hadn’t been yearning for tv fame, after sending Josh to “work” as a punishment they may have sent him to stay with someone else (maybe his Duggar Grandparents). Not disowning him but JB May have said he couldn’t sleep under their roof any longer and to appease Michelle he could live with his grandparents. 

Many a parent have sent the child who was abused to live with a relative because they couldn’t/wouldn’t leave the abusive spouse or step parent and this was the way of protecting the child but keeping up appearances and the status quo. So I can see it working the other way. 

  • Love 4
DragonFaerie

DragonFaerie

13 minutes ago, Mollie said:

I'm glad she didn't pack on the pounds like Jill, Jessa and Joy.  Maybe she will have a more average weight baby and an easier delivery.

Yes.  I'm also wondering if Jill and Joy were gestational diabetic.  Hopefully, fingers and toes crossed, Jinger is seeing an actual OB or a CNM and will have a safe birth. 

  • Love 17
Marigold

Marigold

1 hour ago, DragonFaerie said:

Yes.  I'm also wondering if Jill and Joy were gestational diabetic.  Hopefully, fingers and toes crossed, Jinger is seeing an actual OB or a CNM and will have a safe birth. 

I truly believe the same thing.  

 

I had very large babies.  10 pounders.  I'm small.  After the first 10 pounder, I was checked with the routine gestational diabetes test.  I was then tested in the 3rd trimester to make SURE I was not diabetic.  No one was monitoring these Duggar girls.  Joy even looked unwell for the last part of her pregnancy...you could just see that she was suffering and miserable. 

  • Love 7
DragonFaerie

DragonFaerie

1 hour ago, Marigold said:

I truly believe the same thing.  

 

I had very large babies.  10 pounders.  I'm small.  After the first 10 pounder, I was checked with the routine gestational diabetes test.  I was then tested in the 3rd trimester to make SURE I was not diabetic.  No one was monitoring these Duggar girls.  Joy even looked unwell for the last part of her pregnancy...you could just see that she was suffering and miserable. 

I've had friends that were small and had 10-12 lb babies just fine.  And then I've known co-workers that had 6-8 lb babies and had g.d and had to be put on bedrest for the later part of their pregnancy.  The fact that no one was checking these girls is just plain scary and I totally agree that Joy just looked miserable.

  • Love 14
Nysha

Nysha

16 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

I don’t think they would’ve gotten him real help. I think that their pride would’ve gotten in the way. 

I do think if they hadn’t been yearning for tv fame, after sending Josh to “work” as a punishment they may have sent him to stay with someone else (maybe his Duggar Grandparents). Not disowning him but JB May have said he couldn’t sleep under their roof any longer and to appease Michelle he could live with his grandparents. 

Many a parent have sent the child who was abused to live with a relative because they couldn’t/wouldn’t leave the abusive spouse or step parent and this was the way of protecting the child but keeping up appearances and the status quo. So I can see it working the other way. 

1

I think they believe they got him real help. He confessed, he was repentant, he had consequences, he was forgiven, according to their beliefs it was over. I agree with @Scarlett45, though, that without TV he probably would have gone to live with the Duggar grandparents or someone else. Partially to protect the girls, but mainly to keep CPS out of their lives. 

  • Love 10
cm-soupsipper
Message added by cm-soupsipper,

Closure Notice: This Thread is now closed due to the name (and much of the posting within it). Please be mindful going forward by naming topics in a way that invites a healthy community conversation. If you name something for a cheap laugh, this thread may be closed later because it encourages discrimination and harm. 

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