B&B: What's Up Today at Forrester Creations? - Daily Chat

[Gudzilla]

These 2 stories are killing me, I don't even have the energy to make fun of them.

 

Thanks KLovestoShop for also noticing the swayback thing.

[blackwing]

I am continually annoyed at the rooftop gym and the apparent need for all male Forrester employees to work out shirtless.  There are tables there and this area also appears to be some sort of break area or outdoor seating area for a (presumably indoor) cafe.  It is mixed company and a sexual harrassment lawsuit waiting to happen.  I get that it's a soap opera, but still, it bugs.

 

Can someone refresh my recollection on Caroline's parentage.  I know she has two moms, Karen Spencer and the one played by Crystal Chappell.  Which one is the biological mom?  Is it Karen?  Did they ever say who the father is?  A sperm donor or an ex of Karen before she got together with Crystal Chappell?  If she is the daughter of both Karen and Crystal at birth, how come she only has Karen's last name?  I think it would be a hoot if it is revealed that Eric is her biological father.  Which would be ok incest-wise since Ridge isn't a biological Forrester.  If they can retcon Ridge's parentage when he was a 50 year old man, they can retcon anything.  Eric and Karen had a drunken fling and it was never spoke of again.  Eric doesn't remember it and Karen kept her mouth shut all these years.

 

By the way, where are Karen and the other mom?  Don't they live in town?  How come they never stop by?  She is never seen talking to them.  Do they even know she got married?  Is she going to tell them she is pregnant?  This show in particular is the pits when it comes to explaining where people are when they aren't onscreen.  For example, where on earth is Oliver?  Did he leave town after Aly died?  Haven't seen or heard from him.  Bradley is horrible at this.  Contrast with Y&R... Jill showed up after months offscreen and there was a throwaway line from Jack about how she has been in Hong Kong for months.

[LittleIggy]

I loved what Julius said to Maya about whether all of them were just supposed to there at her disposal. He really rocked it! Of course Myron and Little Ricky don't understand that you don't have to be holding a loaded gun at someone's head to be pressuring them.

[KerleyQ]

I believe Karen and CC's character live in New York.  I think that is where Caroline got in her accident and stayed with them while LG was off screen recovering from her accident.  And I think that it's never been revealed who her father is.  

[AussieBabe]

Papa Avant said exactly what needed to be said. Is he the most politically correct or diplomatic? No, but that's where Mumma Avant comes into play. She brings the calm to his sting. I'm glad someone is saying it. They were wrong to ask, and I can't say a baby being born out of favour would ever work.

I keep thinking...what if something happens that causes Nicole to be infertile or if she has complications? What about if they decide they want another child and want them to have Forrester/Avant genes? Where would it end?

[Kitty Redstone]

Mr. Avant was awesome today. 

 

First, for pointing out that a giving away your baby is a little different than giving away your one of a kind, handknitted sweater.  I have no idea why Mrs. Avant and Zende are harping on Nicole giving away her youth when that is beside the point.  What Maya and Rick are asking is incredibly selfish, and the only way I'll even tolerate this story is if Nicole gets pregnant and then both Maya and Rick are killed off.  But really, this just needs to stop right now.  Whether it's the spumor that Nicole is adopted or that she finally comes to her senses, something needs to happen to end this horrible story. 

 

Second, for pointing out Maya's ridiculous sense of entitlement.  She does indeed act like everyone else only exists to give her what she wants, and if they don't comply it's because they're haters.  I despise this character so very much. 

 

 

Speaking of goofy soap names, AMC took a prize when they named a kid "Spike". No, it wasn't a nickname, his mommy (who was Erica Kane's daughter) actually put that on his birth certificate.

 

And yet, it's still better than Zarf.  When I first started watching soaps in my aunt's basement at the ripe ol' age of nine, AMC was my favorite.  It's pretty sad to think about how bad it got for the last eight or nine years of its run.

[Joimiaroxeu]

It is mixed company and a sexual harrassment lawsuit waiting to happen.

Not to mention the random beads of sweat flying into your food or drink. Ugh. That sounds like a needed visit from the public health inspector.

 

It wasn't "grief sex" nor was Caroline "drunk in love" IMO because both of those things would have required at least some verbal consent from Caroline and IIRC, she gave none.

Thank you. The lack of clear consent is the bottom line for me too, despite Caroline's apparently wanting to assume most of the blame due to the pills.

 

Ditto comments upthread, I wonder about Nicole's dull affect too, especially since it's a 180 degree departure from the dancing twit she was for a while. The actress seems way too young for it to be Botox so I wonder if they're directing her to act like that?

[Petunia13]

What the hell is with Maya's pathological hysteria about having "an Avant Forrester baby" and the genetics? Why does it have to be biologically exactly related to each of them?

As someone who constantly talks about being born less than perfect and feeling like her childhood she didn't belong and with a supposed former kinda sorta adopted daughter; she sure is being close minded about adoption or foster parent hood.

Maya and Rick were vaguely planning marriage before Nicole hit the scene and they were seriously estranged. Soooo what was Ms Entitled planning in her her head for her perfect "Avant Forrester baby"?

Edited October 27, 2015 by Petunia13

[AussieBabe]

I can't really say much on the Caroline/Thomas situation. From what little we've been shown, I can't jump to screaming rape. I used the DIL reference because the artist asked how did xyz happen the morning after. (Is it rape when a university student gets drunk and wakes up next to somebody and can't recall the details? And if the other person was drunk/taking pills? Two impaired people under the influence of whatever just isn't clear cut to me.) Unless they show more, it's not black and white. Was she aware of him undressing her, or was she passed out cold? Outside of that kiss, what made him think it was ok to go further? I would be able to call it that if he had slipped her drugs, was aware of her impaired state, and then decided to have his way with her knowing she would have no recollection of the events. I'm curious about how the law where I would live would handle this. Off to do some reading.

[Cupid Stunt]

Papa Avant said exactly what needed to be said. Is he the most politically correct or diplomatic? No, but that's where Mumma Avant comes into play. She brings the calm to his sting. I'm glad someone is saying it. They were wrong to ask, and I can't say a baby being born out of favour would ever work.

 

Obba Babatundé and Anna Maria Horsford are the central focus of any scene they play; so talented and creating fully believable characters. Julius is absolutely correct to question Maya, Nicole and Rick about their intentions. Both Julius and Vivienne pointed out becoming pregnant and carrying a baby to term, under the best circumstances, is a profoundly personal and engrossing experience for a woman, which seemed to barely reach Nicole emotionally (I find Reign Edwards acting simple-minded and flat) -- She was undemonstrative.

 

I'm not sure what I'm supposed to think about Nicole other than she's an untrustworthy simpleton. I can't imagine that Nicole's emotional immaturity wouldn't be a red card for the doctor's analyzing the surrogacy. She would have never come up with the idea to carry a child for Rick and Maya on her own. Hell, she hasn't considered carrying a child for herself, and whoever her significant other happens to be ... Zende, another selfish twonk, who has chosen not to act because of the baby request, he's a gentleman or whatever is holding him back from a willing partner ... <yawn> ... Get on with it or bugger off, and stop musing about things you won't follow though on.

 

 

 

I keep thinking...what if something happens that causes Nicole to be infertile or if she has complications? What about if they decide they want another child and want them to have Forrester/Avant genes? Where would it end?

 

Nicole goes through with the surrogacy, and there are complications. Nicole ends up unable to carry another pregnancy to term and then the real problems start.

 

 

 

 

First, for pointing out that a giving away your baby is a little different than giving away your one of a kind, handknitted sweater.  I have no idea why Mrs. Avant and Zende are harping on Nicole giving away her youth when that is beside the point. 

 

Let's sort out Zende first: He wants Nicole for himself alone, to be her first lover and impregnate her ... and they live happily ever after -- No baby interference with Rick and Maya. Ever.

 

Mrs. Avant has a point about a baby changing your life and perspective, and it changes a woman physically, for good and for ill. The one thing the Avant's seem to unaware of is that Los Angeles is the center of the universe for vaginal rejuvenation (porn performers and religious women prepping for traditional marriage after time living outside of traditional mores) and skin resurfacing (stretch marks). Nicole could go on a post-baby makeover vacation and be rebuilt nearly as good as new, maybe better.

Edited October 27, 2015 by Cupid Stunt

[Cupid Stunt]

Is Caroline going to give up the ghost? Thomas you gave up any right to know if the child is yours after RAPING Caroline. Caroline already told you that you were in the clear so STFU. Thomas can eat shit and die!!

 

Why is Caroline advocating for Thomas with Ridge again? When is Ridge going to start questioning Caroline for defending her rapist?  The only way Ridge's self-inflicted and rickety I'm the father of my grandchild with my Beautiful Wife lie is going to stand up if Thomas is banished to Paris, Hong Kong ... Antarctica and he stays there. No fashion shows. No Thanksgiving dinner, Christmas Eve sing-alongs, no right of return. Period.  

 

Caroline could easily fall apart, riffing on the Bluto Blutarsky excuse to Ridge after the fact: "You fucked up. You trusted me." 

 

I see Ridge imploding first. Too much betrayal by Thomas and "My Beautiful Wife" parading around the office. Too many inquiries why Thomas is back. Too many lies. Too much stress. Too much humiliation. Too much jealousy and resentment. Thomas trying too hard to close the gap between himself and Ridge through Caroline. Too many ways to fail.

[Petunia13]

Julius and Vivienne made several excellent points and I thought they were tactful.

I really liked the wardrobe today- I covet Vivienne's pretty scarf and Caroline's dress and Maya always looks good in black and white. It was a nice compliment in the scenes seeing Julius in that suit and dapper tie, with Rick who is also a very neat, groomed, fashion plate.

Thomas was giving me a strange vibe when he followed Caroline to her office and confronted her about the paternity.

"Ok Pam. This is kinda a sensitive situation and we wanna keep it quiet a while until I'm comfortable announcing the news."

"Ok"

.....

Immediately Pam blurts the news to anyone in earshot.

Then plays it off in a cutesy "ain't I a little stinker?" way. All her previous tantrums and violent acting out and peculiar fixations and highpitched vocal effect are starting to remind me of Stuart from Mad TV or the boy in Problem Child .

Edited October 27, 2015 by Petunia13

[SiouxB]

Ok Pam. This is kinda a sensitive situation and we wanna keep it quiet a while until I'm comfortable announcing the news."

"Ok"

Immediately Pam blurts the news to anyone in earshot.

Then plays it off in a cutesy "ain't I a little stinker?" way

 

Good God, I loathe this character with the heat of a thousand suns

[ByTor]

Maya and Rick were vaguely planning marriage before Nicole hit the scene and they were seriously estranged. Soooo what was Ms Entitled planning in her her head for her perfect "Avant Forrester baby"?

In her defense, Maya didn't know the writers were going to make her transsexual ;-)

[catalogrrr]

I am continually annoyed at the rooftop gym and the apparent need for all male Forrester employees to work out shirtless. There are tables there and this area also appears to be some sort of break area or outdoor seating area for a (presumably indoor) cafe. It is mixed company and a sexual harrassment lawsuit waiting to happen. I get that it's a soap opera, but still, it bugs.

THANK YOU!! This has bugged me for ages. Outdoor gym/conference room/cafeteria doesn't work for me. I would not want to be working out where people eat nor would I want to work out outside in SoCal where (I imagine, with my Canadian brain) it is hot and humid all the time. Wouldn't it be uncomfortable? Edited October 27, 2015 by catalogrrr

[PsychedelicTrip]

Papa Avant took me to CHURCH!.  

 

When he told Maya she'd already done what she wanted to her body but she didn't get to now decide what would be done with Nicole's, I was Yes...yessireeee!    Those folks needed to fall on their knees and say Jayzus...I am HEALED!  Then turn away from their selfish sinful ways.  

 

I think Maya's father has had Enough!  He's not playing now and if Rick isn't careful he's gonna get a sex change himself, because that man is coming for his ass.  Those damn Forresters are corrupting his children.  

 

I hate that Hans Klopek is back, but I was never feeling this lie that Ridge wants Caroline to hold on to.  I want them to all come clean with each other and for Caroline to get some testing done asap, so Ridge can be declared the father once and for all.    Then Brooke and her trifling ass can go away and stop meddling.  Maybe she can get drunk and Hans can come over  and comfort her.  

 

On the subject of Steffy's ass-ets,  I"m gonna go with she was wearing a booty bump, that or she deliberately was popping that thing out so the camera would get it.   

Edited October 27, 2015 by PsychedelicTrip

[ch1]

Papa Avant told no lies.  The man is trying to deal with his son now being his daughter and on top of that he has to deal with his other daughter being the aunt to her own child.  Its too much and he was right that there are limits in life and Maya needs to start accepting the ones that she chose when she decided to live the way she does.  Maya is a woman who used to be a man.  If she lived as a man she would be a gay man.  Sharing a biological child with her partner is an impossibility.  She does need to accept that.

 

And Maya to me is a master manipulator.  She is playing Nicole IMO and someone needs to call her out on it.  The moment they asked they put pressure on her because her saying no will come with guilt and feeling like she is denying her sister something that really is not her responsibility or something she owes her. 

Edited October 27, 2015 by ch1

[grisgris]

THANK YOU!! This has bugged me for ages. Outdoor gym/conference room/cafeteria doesn't work for me. I would not want to be working out where people eat nor would I want to work out outside in SoCal where (I imagine, with my Canadian brain) it is hot and humid alł the time. Wouldn't it be uncomfortable?

 

What's up with Carter leering at the interns? That was creepy and as FC's general counsel, he of all people, should know better. He's a sweat-drenched sexual harassment suit waiting to happen. I've worked for companies that had on-site fitness rooms and you NEVER saw upper management/executives working out there with the peons. (I'd be embarrassed to pump iron with my boss.) 

 

Amen to everything Papa Avant said and ITA with those who think Nicole looks and acts like a dim bulb. She's kind of good in scenes with just her mother and her, but otherwise... ZZZZzzzzz (ende, too, on that note.)  I despise Maya.

 

I guess I am the solo poster who doesn't mind NuThomas. He's a better actor than his successors (which isn't saying much) and when he was making the bugged cray-cray intense eyes at Caroline yesterday, he totally resembled Taylor during one of her rants.

[CountryGirl]

Papa Avant said exactly what needed to be said. Is he the most politically correct or diplomatic? No, but that's where Mumma Avant comes into play. She brings the calm to his sting. I'm glad someone is saying it. They were wrong to ask, and I can't say a baby being born out of favour would ever work.

I keep thinking...what if something happens that causes Nicole to be infertile or if she has complications? What about if they decide they want another child and want them to have Forrester/Avant genes? Where would it end?

I could absolutely see Rick and/or Maya pushing for Nicole to be the egg donor/surrogate just one more time pllleeeeeeeaaassseee so that Raya baby #1 has a sibling or, God forbid, if Raya baby #1 isn't a boy, then of course, they need to try for a Rick Forrester III. 

 

I can see it now, 12 years and 6 pregnancies later, Nicole finally produces the Forrester heir and comes upon Zende to tell him, "Okay, I'm ready now" and he's as squinty-eyed as Brooke as he asks, "Ready for what? And who are you?"

 

On the subject of Steffy's ass-ets,  I"m gonna go with she was wearing a booty bump, that or she deliberately was popping that thing out so the camera would get it.   

She was booty-tooching. Ty-Ty (RIP ANTM) would be proud.

[ByTor]

I guess I am the solo poster who doesn't mind NuThomas.

I'm ok with him. He's not great, but I've seen worse.

[AussieBabe]

CountryGirl, I can see it, too. "Nicole, I just want you to do what you feel comfortable with, and if you do not want to give us babies 2-5, I'll get it. It's just being a mumma to little xyz was the greatest gift ever. We want all babies to have the same bio parents. No pressure." Nicole is so ambivalent and beholden that she'd probably do it every time they asked. Ugh. Nicole has her head so far up Maya's bum that she cannot see the light.

Papa Avant and Mumma Avant were on it. I'm happy to see them on the show. I've been a fan of both for years. They bring a different flavour to the show.

It's only a matter of time before Thomas finds out. I've never seen a place where they're always talking about private issues within earshot. All they need is Nutty Lemonhead Pam to overhear and everybody will know. Did they forget she is right outside of Ridge's office? I hate the role of Pam, but I love her as an actress. It must suck to play that role. Such an incredible waste of talent.

[Waldo13]

CountryGirl, I can see it, too. "Nicole, I just want you to do what you feel comfortable with, and if you do not want to give us babies 2-5, I'll get it. It's just being a mumma to little xyz was the greatest gift ever. We want all babies to have the same bio parents. No pressure." Nicole is so ambivalent and beholden that she'd probably do it every time they asked. Ugh. Nicole has her head so far up Maya's bum that she cannot see the light.

Papa Avant and Mumma Avant were on it. I'm happy to see them on the show. I've been a fan of both for years. They bring a different flavour to the show.

It's only a matter of time before Thomas finds out. I've never seen a place where they're always talking about private issues within earshot. All they need is Nutty Lemonhead Pam to overhear and everybody will know. Did they forget she is right outside of Ridge's office? I hate the role of Pam, but I love her as an actress. It must suck to play that role. Such an incredible waste of talent.

Mr Avant keeps hitting the nail on the head with his analysis, of Maya, but like driving a nail into a block of cement, Nicole's head, it usually is a fruitless task. Maya could of just ask Nicole to be an egg donor and she could have all the babies she wants. My daughter was an egg donor for her sister with a live birth and 6 eggs still in the freezer. Every time Maya says she is not pressuring Nicole her nose grows a little more.

Rick looks absolutely ridiculous with that stupid haircut and that beard enhances his shit eating grin.

Edited October 27, 2015 by Waldo13

[catalogrrr]

I just don't think any ethical physician should allow Nicole, at the age of 19 (she is just 19, right? Or have I imagined that?) and who has never had children, be a surrogate, especially for someone who is a relative and, consequently, would have to see that child grow up. I think it's very selfish and cruel of Maya and Rick to ask Nicole to do this when there are so many other legitimate options that do not have the potential of ruining bland, slo-Nicole's life.

Just like I thought they missed a lot of beats in the telling of the transgender story that could have made it more powerful and useful, I think the writers are doing the same thing here by basically giving spoiled Rick and Maya what they want and painting anyone who asks questions as being in the "wrong side" of this situation.

[Anna Yolei]

THANK YOU!! This has bugged me for ages. Outdoor gym/conference room/cafeteria doesn't work for me. I would not want to be working out where people eat nor would I want to work out outside in SoCal where (I imagine, with my Canadian brain) it is hot and humid alł the time. Wouldn't it be uncomfortable?

As a SoCal resident, I can answer this: it depends where in SoCal. San Diego averages 65 to 75 degrees year-round (our schools cancel class when the temp go above 85 to 90) and LA in summer gets a bit hotter because it's further inland.

In short, no people do not work outside as a thing and outside of Venice Beach I don't know of any other outdoor gym.

[bannana]

I was laughing my ass off when Papa Avant was telling Nicole that she would be all stretched out and bloaty and while she may not mind (I don't believe that for a second) Zende might!  She's an idiot and Raya are disgusting.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

Maybe it is just me but Maya's ever so cutesy wutsey high squeaky voice is driving me nuts, never mind the dribble that she is spewing! 

[Gudzilla]

She was booty-tooching. Ty-Ty (RIP ANTM) would be proud.

It's embarrassing how much googling I had to do to understand this sentence. ;) 

 

I think it may have been asked before but is Jolly Green Thomas wearing lipstick ? I could swear it was the same shade as Caroline's.

 

Papa Avant continues to be gold. I'd play golf with him.

[AussieBabe]

The thing is Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dumb don't want to bring in a gestational carrier and just use Nicole's eggs. I'd be more open to that because Nicole wouldn't have to grow attached to a child and feel him/her/them growing inside of her. She wouldn't have to feel kicks or those first little flutters when the bub moves. They're insisting on using her body like an unrelated surrogate couldn't give birth to the super speshul (intentionally spelled like this) snowflake of a bub.

[LittleIggy]

I wish Mama Avant had talked to Numbskull Nicole about holding your child and bonding with him/her, then handing him/her over to Maya and having to pretend the baby isn't hers.

[grisgris]

Bets on who Brooke will wring a confession out of first? Thomas or Ridge?

[ByaNose]

I actually thing Reign Edwards is doing a great job. She's a lot better than when she started. I have always been fasinated by the young ingenues who start in daytime. It seems like 6 months later they are total veterans and hold their own with the senior cast members.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Mama Avant and Pops Avant can talk to Nicole until they run out of breath but it probably won't do any good. She's at that age where ain't nobody gonna tell her nothing--at least nothing she doesn't want to hear. I imagine if anything turns Nicole around it'll be Zende's reaction and subsequent behavior toward her. Wait until she sees him sniffing around another girl.

 

Bets on who Brooke will wring a confession out of first? Thomas or Ridge?

I bet she'll work Thomas like marionette. Ridge has gotten wise to the power of the squinty eyes.

 

(our schools cancel class when the temp go above 85 to 90)

LOL, the schools don't have A/C?

 

Rick looks absolutely ridiculous with that stupid haircut and that beard enhances his shit eating grin.

He also looks to me like he's developed a bit of a gut.

 

We want all babies to have the same bio parents. No pressure."

Heh, Nicole'll become a Raya baby factory. They'll just turn her bed into a maternity conveyor belt so she can shoot the babies right out of her uterus into Maya's waiting arms.

 

I could absolutely see Rick and/or Maya pushing for Nicole to be the egg donor/surrogate just one more time pllleeeeeeeaaassseee so that Raya baby #1 has a sibling or, God forbid, if Raya baby #1 isn't a boy, then of course, they need to try for a Rick Forrester III.

Or it'll be a critical health issue where baby #2, 3, or 7 will be needed give some biological spare parts to baby #1.

[AussieBabe]

My only gripe with Viv and Julius is that they didn't describe the emotional side of things. He was harping on the bloating and morning sickness and the physical aspects. I would've loved for Viv to tell her what it feels like to hear your baby's cry the first time or to hold your baby and immediately know what unconditional, irreplaceable love feels like. I knew she was completely naive when she was talking to Zende and saying it wouldn't be "her" baby. It would be Rick and Maya's. She can't comprehend any of the emotional aspects because she's never had a child, and I find it hard to believe that she'll be able to part with that child after being changed by the experience. This spells recipe for disaster.

 

It irks me when Maya says no pressure but goes on to harp about how it's the greatest "gift," and how Nicole would be doing them a huge favour or whatever. That's pressure. Nicole idolises her and would never want to do anything to disappoint her. The problem with that is Nicole is not consenting unencumbered and of her own free will. She's doing it to appease the likes of Maya and to stay in her good graces. Maya reminds me of someone with Covert-Aggressive Personality. She is exploiting Nicole's vulnerabilities and manipulating/coercing her into succumbing. 

 

Again, what kind of medical professionals have they paid off to cosign to this?

Edited October 28, 2015 by AussieBabe

[AussieBabe]

Heh, Nicole'll become a Raya baby factory. They'll just turn her bed into a maternity conveyor belt so she can shoot the babies right out of her uterus into Maya's waiting arms.

 

Or it'll be a critical health issue where baby #2, 3, or 7 will be needed give some biological spare parts to baby #1.

 

Haha. Of course one wouldn't be enough. Nicole better get ready to be asked again when little Avant-Forrester wants a little brother or sister. Aunt-Bio Mummy Nicole will have to put her life on hold again to make it happen, and of course she will because she kisses the ground Maya walks on. Get ready, duckie. You are going to be a glorified baby factory.

[blackwing]

What on earth happened to Thomas' hair in Paris? How many cans of hairspray are used to each morning to create this laughable "look"? And is that what is considered stylish on the younguns these days?

Also, I thought pregnant women aren't supposed to dye their hair. Is that why Caroline's dark roots look worse than ever or is it just poor work?

Edited October 28, 2015 by blackwing

[Oly]

OK--fine I loathe Thomas and his stoopid hair and as time goes on I pretty much hate Caroline too---aaarrrggghhh- I will always be in TKs corner from other shows but that is not even the issue---I will continue to HATE Thomas with the fire of a 1000 suns and that does not actually touch TK or Caroline---it is all about him as an ICK---and the longer Caroline sniffles in his direction the more I will hate her---my love is all about TK---these low volts do not matter---ugh and I hate to say so but Thomas sucks A LOT

[SweePea59]

I was laughing my ass off when Papa Avant was telling Nicole that she would be all stretched out and bloaty and while she may not mind (I don't believe that for a second) Zende might!  She's an idiot and Raya are disgusting.

I thought that when Papa Avant told Numbskull that she would get big and no man would want her he was talking about her va-jay-jay. I was semi-surprised that they went there, but I haven't read anyone here thinking that's what he said.

[RuntheTable]

I have nearly lost rational thought when it comes to Maya and Rick. Have there ever been two more reprehensible characters in the history of daytime? The effrontery that has been going down inside the Forrester Manse could easily fill a novel the width and breadth of War and Peace. The one thing that is standing out for me is that this baby isn't even a reality yet, and Maya is already using it as a weapon. I watched the play of emotions on her face when she was ramping up to lower the boom on her father. She knew he would react negatively, so she presented it as a weapon, going overboard in her description of "well, we will take Rick's sperm and have it fertilize Nicole's egg.....". And after hitting her dad over the head with this, she then triumphantly turns her big, innocent doe eyes on everyone as if to say "I told you he hasn't excepted me!" And why didn't she allow her parents their time with Nicole? Why did she have to come back downstairs and start interjecting? Well, because she knows what she is doing, and she knows she is asking too much, but the deal is sealed now, and she doesn't want her parents having any sway over Nicole. Even though that isn't about to happen since Nicole has already crossed the finish line and is now firmly ensconced in Maya's behind. Rick and Maya's passive/aggressive actions have Nicole going in circles, and I think she is being driven more by a need to prove to her parents that she is an "adult", who can handle herself with this request, but who more importantly understands that they are responsible for all of Maya's unhappiness. She feels Maya has given her everything; when in reality, Maya has given her nothing. When Nicole first showed up in LA, Maya couldn't close the door in her face quick enough. Nicole was a reminder that there are people in this world who refuse to bow down to Maya's Sainthood. When Rick asked Nicole to move in the mansion, Maya disapproved, when she wanted to work at Forrester Maya disapproved. Any happiness Nicole is enjoying now has nothing to do with Maya, but I notice as Nicole highlights all her good deeds, Maya never contradicts her, instead basking in the glow of Nicole's adoration.

 

I wasn't aware that California had become a Sovereign State governed by Maya. Mama and Papa A should have done their homework and requested a Green Card to enter the state's borders, and of course they should have requested residency permission from Maya first.

 

And I positively guffawed out loud when Nicole and Maya were discussing bullies!

 

Oh, I have had to move all of my meters; Rage-O-Meter, Give-A-Fuck, Bitch-Inda-House, Dick-O-Lert, Fuck-It-All, out to the shed because they were pinging on all cylinders, and the cacophony was becoming deafening. 

 

As much as I love CaRidge is as much as I am glad that Caroline is finding her voice. Ridge cannot expect to keep this dour demeanor if he also expects to keep this secret. And Pam? Dear Lord, would someone cram about twenty Lemon Bars in her mouth? I don't care if they use the pink ones, or the blue ones, or the regular old yellow ones, as long as someone shuts her up. I love Alley Mills, and I don't dislike Pam, but she has not only crossed that invisible line of appropriateness, she has taken a sledge hammer to it. Why do I feel like we are getting hit with anvils here? Is this leading up to something? Pam has gone off the rails before, and I can't help wondering why she has never mentioned her missing pills. Is this gonna be something where Pam is off her meds cause they went missing, and now she is going Coo Coo for Cocoa Puffs again? I mean seriously, not two seconds after she was asked to keep her mouth shut, she is blabbing to Thomas! If the show thinks Pam's behavior has been "cute", well they need to think again. There is nothing cute about getting someone a pregnancy test, and presenting it to them if front of other employees at work. There is nothing cute about stealing a couples right to announce their own pregnancy, in their own time. I really hope they are going somewhere with this, because otherwise it is just Pam having a raging case of the butinskys. 

Edited October 28, 2015 by RuntheTable

[tricknasty]

Caroline sold that lie to Thomas smooth as butter. Now that's the Caroline I used to loathe, not the new Caroline with the perpetual deer in headlights look whenever Thomas' name is brought up. Did I miss something? When did Ridge say it was okay for Thomas to stay in LA? Why bother banishing him to Paris then?

[Callie]

I could absolutely see Rick and/or Maya pushing for Nicole to be the egg donor/surrogate just one more time pllleeeeeeeaaassseee so that Raya baby #1 has a sibling or, God forbid, if Raya baby #1 isn't a boy, then of course, they need to try for a Rick Forrester III. 

 

I can see it now, 12 years and 6 pregnancies later, Nicole finally produces the Forrester heir and comes upon Zende to tell him, "Okay, I'm ready now" and he's as squinty-eyed as Brooke as he asks, "Ready for what? And who are you?"

LMAO, that was the funniest thing I've read all day.

 

Raya's out of luck, though. There already is a RIck Forrester III, Deacon and Becky's kid that Rick and Amber raised.

Edited October 28, 2015 by Callie

[KerleyQ]

I was laughing my ass off when Papa Avant was telling Nicole that she would be all stretched out and bloaty and while she may not mind (I don't believe that for a second) Zende might!  She's an idiot and Raya are disgusting.

 

Have any of them pointed out to her the possibility of twins (or more)?  And how much more of a toll that will take on her body?  Because if the doctor gives her the hormone treatment to increase the likelihood that she'll conceive (and you know Raya will want to do everything to up the odds of the insemination being successful), it will also increase the likelihood of a multiple pregnancy.  Mama Avant, as someone who has actually given birth, needs to sit Nicole down and talk to her about all of the emotional and physical effects of a normal pregnancy and then explain how the treatments she'll receive and the fact that this won't be her own baby when it's all over will amplify those effects.  Because, clearly, Raya have found some quack who's willing to do this to a 19 year old virgin without really relating all the risks and the physical and emotional toll this will take on her, so someone needs to step in and lay some truth on this girl. I don't think she remotely gets what she'd truly be in for here.  And, yes, most women who have given birth say they'd do it all over again (well, eventually they say that), but those women are coming at it from a point of view of "yes, a lot of gross and painful stuff happened, but I got my child out of that."  Nicole's pot of gold at the end of that rainbow is to watch her biological child, the one she carried for 9 months and bonded with, be raised as her niece/nephew.  

 

And, yes, to everyone who has pointed out the likelihood that this won't be one and done.  I hope someone brings up the idea to her that, after she births this child, Raya will be back to her saying "well, it's really important to us that all of our kids have the same genes, and, have we ever mentioned that we want a big family?"  

 

I'd love to see someone point out to Maya that she, of all people, should understand that, sometimes, biology makes a mistake, so why the hell is she so damn focused on biology now?  I know the show would never go there, outside of, possibly, Papa Avant (and he'd be painted in the wrong to say it, of course).  But, seriously.  

[Waldo13]

I thought that when Papa Avant told Numbskull that she would get big and no man would want her he was talking about her va-jay-jay. I was semi-surprised that they went there, but I haven't read anyone here thinking that's what he said.

I got that gist also. I would imagine that Mr Avant is sure Nicole is a virgin and that, in his world, men want their wives to be a virgin. In a way he is also saying that her first sexual experience should be with a man and not a turkey baster.

Thomas' concern, as to the baby father, was, once again, all about himself. Deep down he knows he took advantage of Caroline and was only interested in pleasing himself and getting away with it. This is evident by not considering Caroline's condition, he planted his seed not knowing if Caroline was using birth control, and even if he did, he didn't bother to put a helmet on his soldier. Thomas most likely was with quite a few woman, in Paris, and for all he knew he could be transmitting a STD.

[sugarbaker design]

There already is a RIck Forrester III, Deacon and Becky's kid that Rick and Amber raised.

 

Why would Deacon continue to call his son Eric Forrester III?  When everyone thought he was Rick's kid they called him Little E, when his true parentage was revealed he was renamed Deacon Sharpe Jr aka Little D.

Edited October 28, 2015 by sugarbaker design

[Joimiaroxeu]

I thought that when Papa Avant told Numbskull that she would get big and no man would want her he was talking about her va-jay-jay. I was semi-surprised that they went there, but I haven't read anyone here thinking that's what he said.

<meekly raises hand>I thought that but decided to keep it to myself. Then someone upthread mentioned how LA is the mecca for surgical vajayjay "rejuvenation" and body "reshaping" so in the writers' minds the intimate physical effects on Nicole are probably a non-issue (or at least not ones to be spoken of in polite company). It's a shame though, IMO, that a teenager beginning what should be the most fun years of her independent life would even need to be considering such things.

 

This is evident by not considering Caroline's condition, he planted his seed not knowing if Caroline was using birth control, and even if he did, he didn't bother to put a helmet on his soldier. Thomas most likely was with quite a few woman, in Paris, and for all he knew he could be transmitting a STD.

That's what always bothers me about the "oops, I got pregnant!" storylines in this day and age. I know contraception can fail but so often it seems the concerned couple got together without any protection at all. Pregnancy isn't the only thing which can result from that but soaps never address it unless they're specifically doing the rare STD storyline. It was never clear to me whether Caroline was even using birth control or at what point she may have stopped using it so she and Ridge could "try" to have children. I'm with squinty Brooke on that score: the timing seems way off.

[ByTor]

How stupid is Thomas that he didn't even think hmmmm...Dad is all pissy with me all the time...Dad banished me with no real explanation...Caroline is all defensive all the time...maybe Dad knows about Caroline and me! After he asked if the baby is his, he mentioned that Ridge could never know. How could he not consider that maybe he DOES know?

[KerleyQ]

How stupid is Thomas that he didn't even think hmmmm...Dad is all pissy with me all the time...Dad banished me with no real explanation...Caroline is all defensive all the time...maybe Dad knows about Caroline and me! After he asked if the baby is his, he mentioned that Ridge could never know. How could he not consider that maybe he DOES know?

 

I think he's coming at it from a petulant child standpoint of "God!  Dad is such an asshole all the time!" without giving it any thought as to what, specifically, set him off this time. 

[grisgris]

Odd that the Avants haven't yet wrapped their heads around the fact that this miraculous baby is going to be their grandchild, as well.

[thewhiteowl]

I always expect Rick and Myra to be entitled, selfish, inconsiderate twits with not a moron's intellect combined. So totally in character and on ff. I don't really give a crap about dim, dancing Nicole or Zende but I m enjoying all the ranting. If they go through with this it will all turn out well for Myra because the show won't disappoint their transgender princess. That would be so non-after school special.

[blackwing]

Odd that the Avants haven't yet wrapped their heads around the fact that this miraculous baby is going to be their grandchild, as well.

 

I don't get their behaviour either.  For all they know, Nicole might not ever have children.  It's important to Maya that the Avant genes, those of her parents, get passed down to the next generation.  I don't understand why they aren't over the moon at the possibility that Maya's baby could have Avant genes, which is something they had thought wouldn't be possible.  Instead, Julius is all, it's gonna stretch out your ladyparts, and Rick is rich they can adopt.

 

Nicole wants to do this for her sister, so it should be her choice and her choice alone.  As for Zende?  She's known the dude for a month.  If he doesn't understand and can't accept why this is so important to her to help out the sister that has helped her so much in life, then there will always be another guy.

[LittleIggy]

When is Maya's buddy Nick going to show up and lecture the Avants on how Maya the Transgendered Saint is entitled to whatever she wants?