S05.E09: The Dance Of Dragons

[penelope79]

Well if this wasn’t deserving of an episode 9, don’t know what is!  Definitely ate most of this season’s budget.

 

As much as I hate Ramsay, that was a smart move and only 20 men were needed. 

 

When Stannis sent Davos off, that was a clear sign he was going to sacrifice Shireen. That was just so fucking wrong, I can’t believe they went there!  I was surprised Selyse tried to save her.  Now I can’t wait for Brienne to avenge Renly.

 

I agree.

I saw many rooting for the Boltons now that Stannis crossed the line doing something really unredeemable, but I really can't. No way I'll ever root for them.

I guess that's what is going to happen: Stannis will successfully crush the Boltons like bugs (thanks to my poor, poor Shireen) and I'll be very happy because they did everything in their power to deserve it but then, since Brienne is around, SHE will be the one to kill Stannis and I think he will be even quite happy to die because I feel (and hope) that what he did to his daughter is going to haunt him till the day he dies (which IMO will arrive soon).

I feel terribly sorry for Shireen, I hoped Stannis was better than that. From a narrative POV, though, I can understand why it did happen. At the beginning, they didn't show Stannis as a positive character: he killed his brother, after all. And he was even ready to sacrifice his only nephew. But he did subsequently grow on the audience because 1) a good guy like Davos kept reminding us that, nevertheless, he was such a great person, 2) he looked like the only chance to free Winterfell and the whole Westeros of the Boltons and 3) most of all, he saved the NightWatch and, therefore, Jon Snow, one of the few characters we all still root for.

And  Stannis suddenly grew on me too, I plead guilty of that, even though he was clearly still obsessed by Melisandre and her beloved Lord of Light. Brienne was the only one left to remind us that, regardless, Stannis was, well... still an asshole. If Shireen hadn't died by his hand, we would've still root for him, even just a little bit. But when he'll face Brienne and she'll kill him, we will all feel like he had it coming and, at the same time, that he was not worth the Iron Throne, at all.

 

I think there are only two people, we can reasonable root for to end the game and take on the Whitewalkers; Dany and Jon. They are genuinely good people trying to do their best and be just in terrible situations. I have no problem investing in their stories and cheering them on.

 

ITA.

 

I TOTALLY heard Kill Bill sirens during that one Arya closeup!

 

Ah! This episode made me think about Kill Bill at least twice: with Arya (I totally agree that she will channel the O-Ren Ishii inside of her) and when Daenarys, Tyrion, Jorah & Co. were in the pit. Those hundreds of Sons of Harpy reminded me of the Crazy 88 surrounding The Bride/Uma Thurman. :)

 

Arya's stuff was dull, although I did find it interesting that the Bravoos brothel was fully-clothed.  Can't believe the show resisted the opportunity for more gratuitous nudity.  I wonder if it was simply because they didn't feel comfortable with having Maise Williams in there will all that, so they toned it down.

 

Not surprised Alister let Jon and the Wildings through, because he might be a dick, but he has his limits.  But I still think this is going to cause Jon more problems.  The Nights Watch doesn't seem to understand the concept of looking at the big picture a.k.a. White Walkers are coming!

 

So, yeah.  At this point, I'm either rooting for Dany/Tyrion and dragons to team up with Jon (also maybe Doran, since he seems reasonable... for now), or I would actually be all for the White Walkers just laying waste to these assholes.  Either way, I really hope either Stannis or the Boltons get their asses handed to them big time next week.  Not just deaths in the army: I want someone big to fall hard.

 

Completely agree on this.

And I agree that the fact Maisie Williams was in that scene contributed to the choice of not showing naked prostitutes.

So, the Boobs-Fee-Per-Episode hasn't been paid, this time around!

 

Didn't Dany have a super huge army of Unsullied?  Then why were they outnumbered vs the Harpies?  And if she was going to fly off on Drogon, why have we wasted 2 seasons of her piddling in Essos?  Were we just waiting for the dragons to grow up?

 

The Unsullied made me wonder too, but I guess only a few of them were there, since nobody did expect an ambush. And yes, I think that the only reason why Daenarys can fly off Drogon is because he's now big enough and she's now able to connect with her dragons again.

 

Only 1 episode left: I don't want it to end! :(

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Poor Shireen. She never let go of Davos's gift.  It was so heartbreaking.

Loved their relationship, she made him feel some happiness again.

After losing his son at Blackwater.

Seeing her clutching that gift for dear life, broke my heart.

[DrSpaceman]

Damn you Stannis.  So much for rooting for him. 

 

I have to think though.....was it really a raid on his village that started those fires, or did the evil witch do it to make him more dependent on her?  Or did she help Ramsay somehow with the raid? 

 

So how do the others escape besides Dany from that stadium? 

[BusyOctober]

It's a good thing Father's Day isn't a recognized holiday in Westeros.  However, the Bereavement & Sympathy card market would be a gold mine...

 

"So sorry to hear about the loss of your _________________(insert name of relative or co-worker here). 

    May the _____________________ (insert preferred figurehead of lunatic religious beliefs here) comfort you at this sorrowful time."

[spaceytraci1208]

I don't think anyone is truly rooting for the Boltons...just that Stannis cut to the front of the "Ain't Shit" line and Ramsay's a lock to dole out some violence

[Neurochick]

I'm not surprised at Stannis.  He never seemed to care for Shireen at all, so even though I thought that scene was heartbreaking, it didn't shock me.  I mean, this is Game of Thones and I've been watching for five years now?  Nothing this show does surprises me, beheading, castration, rape, incest, white walkers, dragons.  Nothing this show does surprises me. 

 

I think the point of this story is that no one is safe, it's a violent world and anybody can go at any time for any reason.  

 

Also, I could care less if anybody is root-albe.  I like the story, that's what I'm interested in.  I don't need anybody to root for or identify with, especially in a story like this one.

Edited June 8, 2015 by Neurochick

[Primetimer]

No time to explain! Hop on the nearest winged beast and get the hell out of here before things get any worse.

Read the story

[penelope79]

I have to think though.....was it really a raid on his village that started those fires, or did the evil witch do it to make him more dependent on her?  Or did she help Ramsay somehow with the raid? 

 

Melisandre seemed surprised, though, and she was alone at beginning of the scene, so she didn't even need to fake shock.

Last episode, Ramsey suggested his father that he only needed 20 men to weaken Stannis. After the fires, Davos said to Stannis that their men counted 20 men of the North, so they were Bolton's for sure.

 

I don't think anyone is truly rooting for the Boltons...just that Stannis cut to the front of the "Ain't Shit" line and Ramsay's a lock to dole out some violence

 

See, for me the queue order is important, so Stannis needs to wait for his turn after the Boltons. :)

Edited June 8, 2015 by penelope79

[luckyroll3]

Since you guys have already said everything I was thinking, the only thing left for me to comment on is that Dany's dragon necklace was everything!  Where can I get one of those (and matching earrings)?  I need GoT merchandising to work on that right away.  

[HunterHunted]

Since you guys have already said everything I was thinking, the only thing left for me to comment on is that Dany's dragon necklace was everything!  Where can I get one of those (and matching earrings)?  I need GoT merchandising to work on that right away.

Yes! It gave me life. I literally stopped the episode to find out if was for sale on HBO. It is not. They need to get on that.

[JTMacc99]

No time to explain! Hop on the nearest winged beast and get the hell out of here before things get any worse.

Excellent GIFs!  I saw my kind, gentle, friendly Labrador retriever do that thing with the head shaking to the groundhog.who had been eating my garden.  And just like with the dragon, it was really scary but a little bit satisfying.  (Fortunately, he can't breath fire, but I've seen some really nasty business come out of the other end.)

 

And... I'll show myself out.

Edited June 8, 2015 by JTMacc99

[FlowerofCarnage]

Is there anyone in Westoros who doesn't know about Cersei and Jaime's twincest?

[RadiantAerynSun]

Well... I was never really team Stannis (I mean he clearly wanted to burn Gendry a couple seasons ago, and that, too, is NOT OK) although I did appreciate his Grammar Nazi corrections. The anvils were dropping for poor Shireen but I thought Davos would have a hunch what was coming (well he clearly did, he kept hinting she should come back to the Wall with him) and kidnap her, but nooo. I still didn't think they'd go there and that someone would save the day but I should have learned that lesson at Ned's execution :~(

 

As for Arya... I think Jaqen knows she is up to something and that may not even be a bad thing in his opinion, I'm not totally sure. Yes if you are "no one" you should have no past grudges/loyalty but I'm not sure that means you can't still kill someone who so clearly deserves it. I mean Meryn seems to be the kind of guy, like the Thin Man, that they are interested in taking out anyway. Just not her specific assignment. I'm not even sure Jaqen didn't somehow have a hunch that an opportunity like Meryn Trant would arise and that's why he really sent her to the docks, but maybe I attribute too many mystical powers to him and his Faceless God ;)

 

The fighting pit was so exciting!! I dont' think I have shouted at the screen so much while watching this show since the Red Wedding. This had a much better outcome though. Aww.... sad to learn my boy Hizdar was an honest man only after it was too late LOL. And hurray I think Jorah is back in the fold... if sepsis and greyscale don't get him. I suspect we have seen the last of Meereen for the season though :(

 

I'm not sure what the purpose is of this excursion to Dorne. Was this just so we had an excuse to bring Trystane back to King's Landing and to get Jaime out of the city while Cersei is thrown in jail? I was actually terrified Ellaria had come to kill Jaime when she came to his room.

[Ottis]

Maybe that was the whole purpose of burning Shireen, to divide Davos and Stannis.    I had thought it might be the thing that divided Stannis and Melissandre, but the writers wanted to show us clearly how much Stannis really wants to be king.

 

 

I was really, really hoping that Stannis wouldn't be able to do it, and as a result, that would be the action (inaction?) that created the downfall of his claim to be king and he and his army would be routed. But damn him, he did it.

 

I had to FF through a little of that. I could not fathom it. As a result, I missed that Shireen had the stag, and now that I know, I am even more sad.

[RadiantAerynSun]

I kept wondering, where are the 8000 Unsullied?? I guess maybe she left a contingent in each of the other cities she liberated?

[annsterg]

If Dany is emotionally bonded to her dragons and can communicate with them telepathically -- as seemed to be the case with her closing her eyes and calling and Drogon appearing -- the 2 in prison must be going nuts with anxiety at not being able to respond...

Wonder if Jorah being the only other person whom the dragons have known from birth gives him any influence or at least protection? They have to recognize his scent...

[terrymct]

It looks like Jon managed to get about 1,000-,2000 Wildings onto the ships before the WW attack last week. That was a significant sized group of In the craziness that was Daznak's Pit, I noticed that Dany reached for Missandei twice. The first time when they regrouped running towards the center of the pit and the second time when Dany grabbed her hand as they waited to be killed. It was a nice nod to the fact that these 2 women have been friends/confidants/protector for a while now. 

 

I didn't understand how Dany, Tyrion, and their entourage got from the royal box/stage down into the center of the pit.  Why run that way?

[Philbert]

 

I want Stannis to live to wake up and realize what he's done and have to live with the pain/guilt/self-loathing it will inspire.

 

I think he's already there. The show can be blamed for not spelling this out so everybody follows but he's doing this because Melisandre has convinced him that he's the only man who can stop the White Walkers from destroying the Kingdom but in order to do that he has to become King. Problem is...Melly got it wrong. It's not Stannis. When Stannis finally realize that...oh well.

[LuciaMia]

Shit. shit, shit, shit.  Should know by now that any character with any innocence or decency will eventually get ground up by this show. But the burning of a terrified child....I really think I'm done with GoT.

 

Is there a GoFundMe page for the White Walkers? I'll gladly make a donation if it'll help speed their way south and wipe out Westeros for good!

[SimoneS]

I have been thinking that Arya will poison Trant with the water that kills all people in that temple. She could go undercover as a prostitute and poison his wine to give him the painful death that he richly deserves. I noticed that even Trant's fellow guards looked disgusted when they saw the young girl. What a sick fuck!

 

Oh, forgot to say, kudos to Tyrion for saving Missandei.

[CletusMusashi]

Over the course of the week, there was speculation that Ramsay would bring not only men with him, but also his kennel of hunting dogs. I don't think that happened. For one thing, the operation went down pretty quietly. But more importantly, if there had been dogs involved, I think Melisandre would have said something. Probably something along the lines of "for the night is dark... and full of terriers."

[Lady S.]

I have been thinking that Arya will poison Trant with the water that kills all people in that temple. She could go undercover as a prostitute and poison his wine to give him the painful death that he richly deserves. I noticed that even Trant's fellow guards looked disgusted when they saw the young girl. What a sick fuck!

 

Oh, forgot to say, kudos to Tyrion for saving Missandei.

I doubt that water would give him a painful death, seems like peace is the idea with the people who willingly choose the Many Faced God. She already has the poison meant for the Thin Man though.

Yes, good to see another appearance of Tyrion's chivalry streak. I found that more believable than him being allowed to wail on a slaver while still in chains on the auction block.

[JTMacc99]

I was really, really hoping that Stannis wouldn't be able to do it, and as a result, that would be the action (inaction?) that created the downfall of his claim to be king and he and his army would be routed. But damn him, he did it.

 

I had to FF through a little of that. I could not fathom it. As a result, I missed that Shireen had the stag, and now that I know, I am even more sad.

Ah. I was fortunate enough to be watching the episode about 40 minutes after it started. The second I saw the stake, I grabbed for the remote in a panic. Easily the hardest thing for me to watch on this show, and that is of course saying a lot. 

 

I got the chills when Stannis replied to "is there anything I can do?" with "Forgive me", but it wasn't until I saw the stake that I believed it was going to happen.

Edited June 8, 2015 by JTMacc99

[Ambrosefolly]

I have waited so long to see Dany ride Drogon. This was perfect ....it gave me goosebumps and made my eyes a little teary! Sniff ..... just imagine what she will be able to do when she actually learns to control him and because he is the most dominant, the other two will fall in line...... FIELDS OF FIRE ANYONE??

See her being able to do this makes me not want her to win. What did those who lost in the Fields of Fire want?Their sovereignty, but Aegon decided he was a better ruler just because. I thought Hizdahr had a point when he said that Dany's opinions weren't higher than the people in the pits fighting. I kind of cheered Renly when he pointed out how shitty all of the rulers were, including the people with Dragons that burned everything to the ground when they didn't get their own way.

Edited June 12, 2015 by Ambrosefolly

[SimoneS]

I doubt that water would give him a painful death, seems like peace is the idea with the people who willingly choose the Many Faced God. She already has the poison meant for the Thin Man though.

 

Right, I forgot about that poison. May Trant swallow it and die an agonizing death.

[Drogo]

Daario to Hizdahr:  "Shut your mouth."

 

Instant fan. 

[SimoneS]

I didn't understand how Dany, Tyrion, and their entourage got from the royal box/stage down into the center of the pit.  Why run that way?

 

Because they could not get out through the nearest exit. It was guarded by the Harpies. They were attempting get to another exit across the arena when the Harpies surrounded them. 

Edited June 8, 2015 by SimoneS

[penelope79]

Can someone please confirm whether the Iron Bank boss was Mark Gatiss (one of the authors of my beloved Sherlock, who also plays the role of his brother Mycroft)?

 

I'm probably the only one, but I slowly realized I can't stand Daario.

[Popples]

Can someone please confirm whether the Iron Bank boss was Mark Gatiss (one of the authors of my beloved Sherlock, who also plays the role of his brother Mycroft)?

 

It was, he was on last season when Stannis (boooooooooo) and Davos that the Iron Bank would fund their venture to the Wall.

[annsterg]

Man, that slavemaster who bought Jorah has to be PISSED. This is twice now he's missed a big payday due to shenanigans. Maybe time to go into another line of work? "Shadows and dust, Maximus...."

[Le Renard]

They went there. They really went there. Stannis always said that the lives of the many were more important than one life. If nothing else he's really consistent, in a fucked up kind of way.

 

Remember this scene? "You will betray the men serving you. You will betray your family. You will betray everything you once held dear."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0sx8Yu_n23c

It's become true.

 

I don't know why people want the Boltons to win now. Yes let's root for the house that killed Catelyn, Robb and Robb's wife and unborn child. The house that mutilated Theon, raped Sansa and are just overall psychopaths that skin people alive for fun. Come on, Stannis isn't nearly as bad as that. Best case scenario, they cancel each other out and the knights of the Vale swoop in to take the spoils. Littlefinger winning isn't good but I've always had a soft spot for the evil studmuffin anyway.

[terrymct]

Because they could not get out through the nearest exit. It was guarded by the Harpies. They were attempting get to another exit across the arena when the Harpies surrounded them. 

 

Thank you!  I was still distracted over poor Shireen to track the details well at that point.

[HolmesUltimateQu]

That was wild.   I did wonder if Shireen was destined for a powerful position in the Kingdom but I guess that question has been answered.   Stannis and Mel are truly dark individuals though that's no surprise considering what they were willing to do/and did to Renly.

 

He said he wants' Balon, Joffrey and Robb Stark dead so we knew that he was willing to walk over a large number of corpses to get to the Iron Throne but even Cersei would likely stop at the lives of her children.

 

People have actually switched to hoping House Bolton wins the War of Winterfell.   THAT'S quite a trick from a writing perspective.   

 

You made a good point - Cersei is a horrible human being. I've been waiting for her to get her comeuppance since season 1.  

They made us LIKE Shireen -- she was just a kid. A cute kid who taught Gilly to read and was kind in a world where hardly anyone is genuinely kind -- and her and Stannis had that sweet moment a few episodes ago.

Like you said, Cersei would not kill her children. She LOVES her children if she loves anyone so for Stannis to be WORSE than Cersei... that says a lot.

[Constantinople]

When Jorah was flat on his back and at the second fighter's mercy, the third fighter choose to stab the second fighter in the back rather than wait until after the second fighter killed Jorah.  I'm not sure why the third fighter would have done that unless he figured Jorah was essentially done anyway and better to take out the bigger threat immediately, or least while the bigger threat wasn't moving, as the second fighter would be if he had stabbed Jorah.

[Timetoread]

I don't think anyone is truly rooting for the Boltons...just that Stannis cut to the front of the "Ain't Shit" line and Ramsay's a lock to dole out some violence

 

You got it.  I hate the Boltons for killing Robb's wolf - Yeah I said it.  I couldn't care less about Robb and his idiot mother always writing checks her butt couldn't cash - but I had to fight back salt tears when they killed Grey Wind.  He was a good boy and a better leader than his master.  I still miss him.  I've just grown tired of the random psychosadists.  Jack Gleason did a wonderful job making Joffrey so loathsome that it made his death welcome and sweet.  The Bolton's brand of loathsome is just, at this point, tiresome.  Ramsey is not a person, he's a caricature.  I just want him dead, he serves no real purpose other than to add to the neverending misery that is Sansa's life.

 

I think he's already there. The show can be blamed for not spelling this out so everybody follows but he's doing this because Melisandre has convinced him that he's the only man who can stop the White Walkers from destroying the Kingdom but in order to do that he has to become King. Problem is...Melly got it wrong. It's not Stannis. When Stannis finally realize that...oh well.

 

Yeah, Stannis was growing on me, though I never made it past the fact that he had his own little brother killed.  Mel with one hand on her Fire Bible and the other on Stannis' penis has completely poisoned his mind with Satan's favorite of the deadly sins - pride.  I think he was convinced not only that he's the only one who can stop the White Walkers, but that there was some righteousness in killing Shereen because without her death assuring his win, so many other innocent people would die.  Her sacrifice was to save others.  But the hand was overplayed - there is no coming back from this.  The only thing I regret is that Shereen didn't die near the Whitewalkers so that her charred body could come back to life and kill her father her damn self.

 

I never quite understood the Dany hate and even the Emilia hate. I think she's done a wonderful acting job.  Her scenes staring at Jorah were gripping - you could see the heat rising in her face.  But I also like Dany the leader.  She's done the best that she could in very challenging situations.  I honestly can't think of the RIGHT thing to do to make EVERYBODY happy - last I checked it was impossible (see Jon Snow).  What  makes her great, IMO, is that she WANTS to do the right thing and she makes her decisions based on her conscious and a need to be fair.  That is as good as you can get in a ruler.  Jon does the same, but doesn't get half the hate.  I still think it's a vestige of misogyny - that Dany can't win unless she shuts up and does what the men tell her to do, everything else makes her stupid, a bitch, silly, a loser, blah blah blah - the trope is as old as time. That's why I am rooting for her, although I like a couple of other players.  That and because, dragons.  Oh, and Tyrion.  And Jorah.  And Daario.  And Grey Worm. And Missandrei (who I think is so gorgeous!! I see why Grey Worm is all over that.  Even Tyrion had to give her a once over).  I say this because not only do I judge a ruler by the decisons their hearts make, but by the company they keep.  Dany really does have the A-Team of stand-up men, women, and dragons who are all heart and badass to boot.  My ultimate endgame is that one of the surviving Lords and Ladies of Winterfell make Jon a REAL Stark and that he hooks up with Dany and they combine the houses of the Wolves and the Dragons and all of their people against the Whitewalkers.  That's how I'd write it.

Edited June 8, 2015 by Timetoread

[beeble]

Arya has to be the worst faceless person ever. It's like everything she's learned thrown out the window in an instant. Inspector Clousseau could have been more stealthy than Arya. Very disappointed.

 

Dagnabbit FishyJoe, now that's something I want to see: Peter Sellers as a Faceless Man. "A mahn duz not tell ze lies unleese he iz lying! Merde!"

[Deanie87]

And to think that this was the season that I finally found Stannis attractive.

Welp, I guess Jaime and his incestous, semi-rapey, child-crippling ways aren't looking quite so bad right about now.

"Cockles, clams and oysters" will never not sound completely filthy to me.

[CeeBeeGee]

I never quite understood the Dany hate and even the Emilia hate. I think she's done a wonderful acting job.  Her scenes staring at Jorah were gripping - you could see the heat rising in her face.  But I also like Dany the leader.  She's done the best that she could in very challenging situations.  I honestly can't think of the RIGHT thing to do to make EVERYBODY happy - last I checked it was impossible (see Jon Snow).  What  makes her great, IMO, is that she WANTS to do the right thing and she makes her decisions based on her conscious and a need to be fair.  That is as good as you can get in a ruler.  Jon does the same, but doesn't get half the hate.  I still think it's a vestige of misogyny - that Dany can't win unless she shuts up and does what the men tell her to do, everything else makes her stupid, a bitch, silly, a loser, blah blah blah - the trope is as old as time. That's why I am rooting for her, although I like a couple of other players.  That and because, dragons.  Oh, and Tyrion.  And Jorah.  And Daario.  And Grey Worm. And Missandrei (who I think is so gorgeous!! I see why Grey Worm is all over that.  Even Tyrion had to give her a once over).  I say this because not only do I judge a ruler by the decisons their hearts make, but by the company they keep.  Dany really does have the A-Team of stand-up men, women, and dragons who are all heart and badass to boot.  My ultimate endgame is that one of the surviving Lords and Ladies of Winterfell make Jon a REAL Stark and that he hooks up with Dany and they combine the houses of the Wolves and the Dragons and all of their people against the Whitewalkers.  That's how I'd write it.

 

Preach. It. I think Emilia is fantastic as Dany--she's the only cast member besides Dinklage who's been nominated for an Emmy, IIRC (of course they are all fantastic, I have NO idea why Michelle Fairley didn't get a nom for The Rains of Castamere)--and yes, she's making mistakes in good faith, not just blundering around or acting almost criminally stupidly a la Cersei. And oh my Lord is Missandei gorgeous! I'll have to rewatch to see Tyrion check her out.

[FishyJoe]

The Unsullied made me wonder too, but I guess only a few of them were there, since nobody did expect an ambush. And yes, I think that the only reason why Daenarys can fly off Drogon is because he's now big enough and she's now able to connect with her dragons again.

 

You would think after what happened in Selmy and Grey Worm, they would always be expecting an ambush. The unsullied are proving to be terrible fighters inside the city. 

 

I was also surprised at how easily Drogon was hurt. Dragon skin seems a lot more vulnerable than in other fictional universes. 

[Calamity Jane]

Over the course of the week, there was speculation that Ramsay would bring not only men with him, but also his kennel of hunting dogs. I don't think that happened. For one thing, the operation went down pretty quietly. But more importantly, if there had been dogs involved, I think Melisandre would have said something. Probably something along the lines of "for the night is dark... and full of terriers."

You never disappoint.  Something to make me smile out of this awful business. 

[Timetoread]

I was also surprised at how easily Drogon was hurt. Dragon skin seems a lot more vulnerable than in other fictional universes.

 

But was he actually hurt?  It looked like he had some spears sticking out of him but he was no worse for it.  He was a fire breathing pin cushion.  He's so cute!!  Are the dragons fully grown or will they get even bigger?

[lucindabelle]

You got it.  I hate the Boltons for killing Robb's wolf - Yeah I said it.  I couldn't care less about Robb and his idiot mother always writing checks her butt couldn't cash - but I had to fight back salt tears when they killed Grey Wind.  He was a good boy and a better leader than his master.  I still miss him.  I've just grown tired of the random psychosadists.  Jack Gleason did a wonderful job making Joffrey so loathsome that it made his death welcome and sweet.  The Bolton's brand of loathsome is just, at this point, tiresome.  Ramsey is not a person, he's a caricature.  I just want him dead, he serves no real purpose other than to add to the neverending misery that is Sansa's life.

 

 

Yeah, Stannis was growing on me, though I never made it past the fact that he had his own little brother killed.  Mel with one hand on her Fire Bible and the other on Stannis' penis has completely poisoned his mind with Satan's favorite of the deadly sins - pride.  I think he was convinced not only that he's the only one who can stop the White Walkers, but that there was some righteousness in killing Shereen because without her death assuring his win, so many other innocent people would die.  Her sacrifice was to save others.  But the hand was overplayed - there is no coming back from this.  The only thing I regret is that Shereen didn't die near the Whitewalkers so that her charred body could come back to life and kill her father her damn self.

 

I never quite understood the Dany hate and even the Emilia hate. I think she's done a wonderful acting job.  Her scenes staring at Jorah were gripping - you could see the heat rising in her face.  But I also like Dany the leader.  She's done the best that she could in very challenging situations.  I honestly can't think of the RIGHT thing to do to make EVERYBODY happy - last I checked it was impossible (see Jon Snow).  What  makes her great, IMO, is that she WANTS to do the right thing and she makes her decisions based on her conscious and a need to be fair.  That is as good as you can get in a ruler.  Jon does the same, but doesn't get half the hate.  I still think it's a vestige of misogyny - that Dany can't win unless she shuts up and does what the men tell her to do, everything else makes her stupid, a bitch, silly, a loser, blah blah blah - the trope is as old as time. That's why I am rooting for her, although I like a couple of other players.  That and because, dragons.  Oh, and Tyrion.  And Jorah.  And Daario.  And Grey Worm. And Missandrei (who I think is so gorgeous!! I see why Grey Worm is all over that.  Even Tyrion had to give her a once over).  I say this because not only do I judge a ruler by the decisons their hearts make, but by the company they keep.  Dany really does have the A-Team of stand-up men, women, and dragons who are all heart and badass to boot.  My ultimate endgame is that one of the surviving Lords and Ladies of Winterfell make Jon a REAL Stark and that he hooks up with Dany and they combine the houses of the Wolves and the Dragons and all of their people against the Whitewalkers.  That's how I'd write it.

 

 

YES!

 

I LOVE her! It's her story I'm most interested in, and I think EC does a fine, fine job. She's not wooden, she's playing a character who's reserved. The way she said "get him out of my sight" last week was full of emotion. And her resignation when she thought she was dying. The love on her face with drogon (who, remember, wouldn't be there! she's acting in a vacuum!)

 

I think she's terrific.

[Lady S.]

I think he's already there. The show can be blamed for not spelling this out so everybody follows but he's doing this because Melisandre has convinced him that he's the only man who can stop the White Walkers from destroying the Kingdom but in order to do that he has to become King. Problem is...Melly got it wrong. It's not Stannis. When Stannis finally realize that...oh well.

IA that Stannis-as-messiah hasn't been emphasized enough compared to Stannis-as-the-rightful-king, but Melly did kinda spell it out when she recently broached the topic of sacrificing Shireen for the first time with Stan.

You saw it yourself, my king, when you stared into the flames. A great battle in the snow. .... Trust yourself. .... I trust in the Lord. .... I have seen myself walk along the battlements of Winterfell. I have seen the flayed man banners lowered to the ground. But sometimes sacrifices must be made to ensure victory. I have shown you the power of king's blood. The usurper Robb Stark. The usurper Joffrey Baratheon. .... You must become king before the Long Night begins. Only you can lead the living against the dead. All your life has led us to this moment.

Here's what Stan said to Davos about considering the sacrifice of Gendry.

How many boys live in Westeros? How many girls? How many men? How many women? The darkness will devour them all, she says. The night that never ends. Unless I triumph. I never asked for this. No more than I asked to be king. We do not choose our destiny, but we must do our duty, no? Great or small, we must do our duty. .... I saw a vision in the flames. A great battle in the snow. I saw it. And you saw whatever she gave birth to. I never believed, but when you see the truth, when it's right there in front of you as real as these iron bars, how can you deny her god is real?

Now I agree with bluvelvet that Red Velvet had nothing to do with the Red or Purple Wedding, since Gendry's forced leeching (another instance of male sexual violation btw, Gendry consented to getting his cherry popped by a hot older lady, not to getting his dick sucked by a big fat leech) happened the very episode before Robb's murder and I very much doubt Roose and Walder weren't planning that before Mel got involved. But...she very much did have something to do with Renly's death, and I can somewhat understand Stan thinking king's blood could be as lethal as king's sperm. More likely she saw Robb and Joffrey's deaths in the flames, the same way she foresaw the death of Davos's son and Davos's attempt on her own life at the start of s3, but death premonitions is still a pretty impressive power, as is birthing shadow assassins. And her Red God brought Beric Dondarrion back to life six frickin' times, though it's unclear if she filled Stannis in on that. And now that Stannis has twice thrown away the future of House Baratheon, I think it's doubtful he intends to still survive and sit the Throne post-Long Night 2.0. This isn't to say that his involvement with the Holy R'hollorers isn't horrifying, of course it is, but Melly isn't just some two bit hustler in a revival tent. There's an element of con artistry to her shtick evidenced by showing Selyse her bag of tricks last season, but the woman can get real shit done from time to time, as can her colleague Thoros.

As to the Baratheon soldiers standing by and watching, I think this was less about them being in thrall to Mel and more about them being freezing and starving and, judging by Stan's map, at least a third of them being mercenaries. If they're not yet at the stage of eating their human dead along with the horses, they would be soon enough. Something Stannis almost certainly had to deal with during the siege of Storm's End. Honestly I find it easier to believe that Mel and Stan have a somewhat loyal army than I can believe in men eagerly following Rapey McFlayerson. Rams must have had help from "good men" before this, since I doubt he personally skinned to death every ironman at Moat Cailin so quickly. Removing a person's entire name day suit sounds like a time consuming process.

Other thoughts:

-Our bar for Ser Asshole is super low if not yet resorting to open insurrection is some kind of accomplishment. And telling Jon that his good heart was going to get them all killed was a hell of a backhanded compliment.

-I liked Jaime's paternal side coming out with the comments about Myrcella's dress.

-I think I officially love Lord Muppet Tyrell. I hope Arya takes out Ser Meryn before he carries out any secret orders from Cersei.

-Banker Mycroft doesn't partake of wine? Uh-oh. Maybe it means something less abnormal in Braavos, but in Westeros the only people who can say that are Roose Bolton and the High Sparrow (and presumably his faithful flock).

-Thanks to Lord Muppet, we know now there are at least 4 songs in this world. Wow!

-So Meryn is a kiddie-diddler and a homophobe in addition to all the unchivalrous orders he's carried out for the Lannisters? Of course he is.

-So Hiz wasn't a Harpy, he's still a former slaver extolling the virtues of tradition while carefully avoiding the word slavery. And he was obviously terribly wrong about appeasement by re-opening the fighting pits solving anything. Tyrion saying his father would like Hiz was also a hell of a backhanded compliment since Tywin was terrible until Tyrion murdered him.

-Like Drogo, I appreciated that Daario and Jorah are now bros. And it's good to know Dany's first hubby isn't jealous while he's riding in the night lands.

-Most of the SFX during the big pit scene was really impressive, but the close-ups of Dany on Drogon's spiky neck were taking me out of the moment. There's probably not any way to make dragonriding look 100% believable.

[VCRTracking]

I think the first face Arya chooses will be that sick little girl she mercy killed a few weeks ago. She takes her face as a disguise to go in and be another poor little prostitute for Meryn Trant and that's when she kills him.

[candall]

I'm not surprised at Stannis.  He never seemed to care for Shireen at all, so even though I thought that scene was heartbreaking, it didn't shock me.  I mean, this is Game of Thones and I've been watching for five years now?  Nothing this show does surprises me, beheading, castration, rape, incest, white walkers, dragons.  Nothing this show does surprises me. 

 

I think the point of this story is that no one is safe, it's a violent world and anybody can go at any time for any reason.  

 

Also, I could care less if anybody is root-albe.  I like the story, that's what I'm interested in.  I don't need anybody to root for or identify with, especially in a story like this one.

I've read many comments that last week's episode was terrific and this week was crap, but I feel the opposite.  My attention wanders during long battle scenes, so shove it, Michael Bay.

 

Now this week, I was literally perched on the edge of my seat.  I gasped, cringed, cheered, squee'ed, and even barked out a laugh when Braggy Snake got a sharp smack in the face.

 

Re Shireen:

Years ago, when I didn't have HBO and GoT was nowhere on my radar, I still heard about some main character being beheaded and the rumbles that "man, this show isn't afraid to kill ANYONE."  I think "Red Wedding" references have entered the lexicon in ways that are totally unrelated to the show.  So, yes, little sweetheart Shireen's death was brutal--and I was mad at Davos for asking permission instead of forgiveness--and I was hoping for a last minute reprieve--but that's more or less the standard with this show, isn't it?   We know X won't happen because we've been watching tv all our lives and X's just don't happen on tv. . .and then X happens.

 

So I agree with neurochick that it's a cracking good story, and disagree with her in that I'm constantly surprised, and in the end, those two are basically the same thing.

Edited June 8, 2015 by candall

[Taget]

I don't think anyone is truly rooting for the Boltons...just that Stannis cut to the front of the "Ain't Shit" line and Ramsay's a lock to dole out some violence

 

Exactly.  Let us not pretend that up north there are any good options.  In the battle for Winterfell you've got two at the moment.  On the one hand you've got the guy who likes to flay people alive.  And that is only if you take the glass is half full view since he's delegating more and more to his son who is an outright psychopath who enjoys hunting people and is far worse than "a flayed man tells no secrets" dad.  On the other hand you have forces under control of Taliban North that massacres anyone who does not believe in their own God (which include the vast majority of Westeros) by creating huge human bonfires and believes in human sacrifices including young children.

 

Now you can say a pox on both of them.  I hope they both lose!  So who is there to clean up?  The "raping and reaving" crew from the Iron Islands who want to just enslave and rape everyone.  Don't like them?  Then you have Littlefingers who specialized in pleasing all human pleasures including those who want to torture girls to death.  And would have absolutely no moral qualms in doing any of the atrocities of the other options if it will bring him closer to raw power or serve the purposes of whatever game he is playing.  Because Littlefingers has no morals whatsoever.

 

That leaves us with House White Walker who wants to turn all humans into a zombie horde.  Or should I say most since evidently they need live humans to make more white walkers.

 

The free folk are kinda likable.  And since I find Olly annoying I wouldn't mind seeing him turned into a Thenn burger.  But that very reference should tell you they are at the very least a "mixed" lot.  And administration is not their strong point.

 

And finally Sansa who has no power whatsoever.  If she could organize her own "side" we might have something to root for.  Then again given how much she has been victimized and the amount of anger she has towards everyone involved.  And how save for her father she has seen the most vile role models on how governance is conducted she may be far less likable as someone with actual power.  But assuming she would govern like Papa Stark her entire military force consists of Brienne and Brienne's semi-competent squire.  A theoretical rather than viable option at the moment.

 

So yeah.  No on is cheering on the Boltons.  It's just that Stannis has bought himself an express ticket to the top of many of our hate lists.

Edited June 8, 2015 by Taget

[SimoneS]

Daario to Hizdahr:  "Shut your mouth."

 

Instant fan. 

 

I loved that moment. After all the tension between them over Daenerys, I loved that Daario was rooting for Jorah as much as Tyrion was. Daario also looked very pleased that Jorah had his back and was protecting Dany. I predict a bromance in the making. 

 

I wonder about Jorah taking Danaerys' hand. Did the showrunners, director, and actors forget that he is infected with greyscale or was it deliberate?

 

 

 

I think the first face Arya chooses will be that sick little girl she mercy killed a few weeks ago. She takes her face as a disguise to go in and be another poor little prostitute for Meryn Trant and that's when she kills him.

 

Now that would be crazy good. Better than my scenario. Jaqen is suspicious so Arya better be stealthy.

[the eskimo]

I was trying to make some sort of sense of this story, and about what the "moral" of the tale might be, if there even is one. The only thing I could come up with, is that it is telling the audience that adhering to any sort of extreme is dangerous and wrong. Ned clung to truth and honor even when it destroyed him, Cersei and Bolton are willing to do any horrible thing to get ahead and gain power, the religious fanatics cling to their beliefs no matter what, Stannis is willing to sacrifice innocents for power. I hope that the end will teach us that those (Dany, Jon, Tyrion, Arya) who are essentially good, but who are also willing to do things they don't like to achieve the correct end goal, are the victors in this story. Not a bad lesson for the current, real-life world either.

 

Or everyone who has ever done anything good will die a slow and painful death and the zombies will win.

[Dobian]

I cringed when it looked like Dany's dragon might be killed.  I have a thing for majestic beasts.  I hated watching King Kong fall off the Empire State Building.  I'm sure at least one of her dragons will die eventually, but I hope it's not for a long time.  Watching her climb aboard and say "fly" was the most uplifting thing I've seen on this show in years.

 

I also hate it when they put characters into an impossible situation like being surrounded by an armed and crazy mob and then letting them off the hook by having the mob suddenly become tentative and full of self-preservation.  All they had to do was rush Dany and her protectors and it's over.

 

Stannis, you turned to the Dark Side, it doesn't matter what your intentions are.  Mel is your dark jedi and will lead you to ruin eventually.

[DarkRaichu]

Speaking of dance, did anyone notice the swordman who handled Jorah used the Braavosi water dance a la Arya's dance instructor ?  That was unpredictable and fast which caught Jorah off guard.  Too bad (or good thing ;) ) he took his time killing Jorah.

 

I also thought the black guy with spear (Jorah's 1st kill) was from Dorne, but I could be wrong on that.

 

Or was it just my wishful thinking ? 

Edited June 8, 2015 by DarkRaichu