S01.E03: Enter Number Two

[cmahorror]

Mare did give Frank plenty of opportunity to talk to her away from everyone. She asked him several times to speak with her outside before finally saying why she wanted to speak with him and, even then, she didn't drop the big bomb, just told him she knew he lied to her. Then Frank left the door open for everyone to hear what was going on, including his daughter. That is some passive-aggressive assholery of the first order there. It makes Mare look like the bad guy for questioning Frank even though he was the one in the wrong to lie to her in the first place.

Does Mare want to get fired? Does she want to lose custody of her grandson? Is she such a master at self-sabotage that she managed to do both things in one action? I'm interested to see how this plays out.

[HeddaGabler]

46 minutes ago, roughing it said:

Seriously, if you're not drunk at your high school reunion, you should be.  Those things are rough *shudder*, never again.

I don't mind the scenes with Siobhan, they provide another dimension to the story.  Maybe it will lead to something significant that we don't see yet, or maybe it's just showing Siobhan.  Anyway, as yet, it looks like Siobhan is the least f-ed up family member.  But is she really?

Interesting family life differences - at Mare's house it's FUCK YOU, NO FUCK YOU, NO FUCK YOU MORE, NO FUCK YOU MORE....etc.  Then across the yard at Frank's house, laughter and board games, "Hey it's your turn" HA HA

Frank does not have any day-to-day responsibilities with his daughter or grandson, or with a hostile parent. No pressures there. If he did feel sorry for Erin and bought her diapers and baby formula out of pity, he didn’t need to lie to Mare, but he did. I’m sure Mare sees the bad side of everyone because of her job, and Frank’s lie would be pretty painful, I’m sure. 

I like this show. I don’t see Mare as being bad at her job, I see her being pretty good at her job (finding the bullet, taking charge at the crime scene, being diligent) but she is cracking under pressure, and no one (except maybe her boss) seems to notice or care. 

[cardigirl]

1 hour ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

It's an assignment for documentary editing so I think she chose to make it about her brother in the hopes that it would be cathartic. I don't think her intention was to actually unravel the mystery of who else may have been at the beach with him, but I think she may end up inadvertently finding some information that will help her understand what happened.

I should have been more clear regarding Siobhan's motives with the documentary. I meant I didn't know why she is taking the tack that she is. She seems to think that Mare is at fault for Kevin's demise. So does Carrie.  And of course, dear Brianna shouted it at Mare in the interrogation room. 

Apparently Frank blames her too, or they couldn't agree on something or reach each other through their grief (she won't talk about Kevin with him apparently) because the marriage dissolved, yet he keeps close by. 

I had a lot more sympathy for Mare this episode (until she raided evidence to plant drugs on Carrie) as she's carrying a lot. Still, I'm in for the rest of the episodes (4 more!) and hope it's more satisfying than "The Undoing."  (A low bar, I know.) 

 

[ShadowHunter]

I assume Colin Zabel is going to keep Mare in the loop about the investigation. 

[DoubleUTeeEff]

I'm totally baffled as to why Mare would go to such extremes to plant drugs on Carrie and be so stupid as to leave the drugs with the stamp on them. I would think a move like that would mean she wanted to get suspended for some reason but she seemed genuinely upset when the chief suspended her. Did she think she would get away with it or was she just so desperate it was a hail mary pass?

So Kevin was with someone else at the beach. Was it Katie? Do we think that Mare suspects or knows that Carrie and/or Kevin had something to do with Katie's disappearance and that's why she's so desperate to keep Drew away from Carrie? It might also explain why she hasn't solved Katie's case if she wanted to keep Kevin out of it. And it might explain why Kevin committed suicide. Mare conceded that she wasn't a very good mother this episode so it makes me wonder why she wants to hold onto Drew so badly. Is it just because she failed Kevin and wants to make it up to him by taking care of his son? Is it because she wants a do-over? Is she genuinely concerned about Carrie being an even worse mother than she would be? Or is it more than that? She seems very adamant about keeping full custody and not even considering to allow Carrie anything.

I'm totally into this show but I had to laugh at the literal handing over of the badge and gun. Someone could make a good compilation of all the cliches in this show. Murder in a small town, world-weary detective with a mess of a personal life, plays fast and loose with the rules, doesn't play well with others, has to hand in gun and badge, continues to work on case after suspension, etc.

I thought Dylan looking at DJ was Dylan wondering if DJ actually was his son. If he's not, what's going to happen to him? I don't think Kenny is up for the job. At least Dylan's parents seem invested in him.

I feel like the show is going to want to surprise us with whodunnit so whenever Mare and Zabel speculate about someone being the murderer, I think, well it can't be him (or her) then. So far they've mentioned Brianna, Dylan and Kenny, I think.

So, Siobhan has a girlfriend and she's made a date with someone else? Where is this headed? A confrontation with the girlfriend and their involvement in Erin's murder somehow? A parallel between her and Kevin?

She's going to piss off her mother with that documentary she's working on.

[BingeyKohan]

I had to laugh a little the first time they showed Siobhan working on her edit, recording into a microphone, then pulling back to show she was in a computer lab with an entire class. That audio isn't going to be great! 

[lakin1013]

I am sorry, but this episode came so close to jumping the shark, I was hiding behind my sofa, cringing.  Yes, of course, I will keep watching.

1. Mare tells Frank about the evidence that he is the father.  He asks who told her that and she tells him Lori.  NO.  No cop would identify a witness to the accused.  Srry, that is so unprofessional as the be impossible to be believed.

2. Mom Helen calls social services to find out what Carrie has to do to get Drew back.  NO.  That is betrayal of magnitudes so large I cannot even guess at them.

3. Mare steals out of the evidence locker, apparently plants drugs on Carrie, and is surprised to be caught.  NO.  Mare seems to be alot of things but stupid is not one of them.

Possible theory: Colin Zabel has a much loved father/uncle/cousin who was an esteemed detective somewhere.  Mare found out they were dirty and put them in prison for the rest of their lives.  Zabel changed his name and is out to get Mare, on a day by day basis.  He took the drugs out of the locker to frame her.  We have seen this in a zillion cop shows. 

 

 

[Penman61]

What does the title refer to? Was Gordon Lightfoot's "If You Could Read My Mind" on the soundtrack somewhere? 

[Irlandesa]

12 hours ago, gesundheit said:

Yeah, I still can't figure it out other than her extremely prickly attitude and being consumed by work. But somehow going over to her ex-husband's house immediately to ask him if he possibly raped a recently murdered teenage girl because it was reported that he had done so? Actually quite appropriate. That's not a next-day, after-the-board-game kind of situation. But somehow she was the asshole there according to her daughter and everyone else? I don't know. And Faye didn't look at all surprised by the accusation. Interesting.

I'm with @freebie on this one.  What about the question couldn't wait?  Wouldn't it be better to talk to Lori's source instead of relying on the patchwork of information that came second hand?   Plus, she has too many feelings wrapped up in her ex, for better or for worse.  It's the kind of situation where she should have gotten more information and then had someone like Zabel bring him in for more questioning and confronting him on his lie. 

And if Mare were a good cop, she should have caught his lie right away last week.  Didn't he say that he barely spoke with her but that he had her in his class? 

10 hours ago, Cheezwiz said:

 iI does bring up the possibility that there could be two completely different killers circulating in town. Even without that sinister possibility, it's just yet another GIANT RED FLAG. Seriously Mare, even if this writer dude isn't a murderer, he's bad news - run away! Guy Pearce has always creeped me out, so it's good casting, I guess.

I think there are going to be two killers as well.  I only hope we get answers to both mysteries and they don't try to be "realistic" in that we don't always get answers to murder mysteries. 

You guys have pointed out all the obvious red flags about this guy.  But did you know he wrote a book?  I mean you may have missed it because he only had his book at his apartment during their sexy times and he is having an anniversary party surrounding his book and oh, a lot of women wanted him because he was a published author.  He's not at all embodying the cliche of a one-hit-wonder published author. 

 

[cpcathy]

I think two killers is a huge cop out, so I will be disappointed if this is the case. 

[DoubleUTeeEff]

I can't think of a reason why Frank would lie about knowing Erin and so freely give a DNA test unless it's because he does know who the real father of Erin's baby is and he knows it's not him or anyone he is related to. Is he related to John Ross somehow? I'm suspicious of John Ross not for any hard facts but because he's

A) Julianne's Nicholson's husband

B) He made a big show of being hungover to Lori the morning after Erin's murder

C) He went out of his way to show Mare that he was an alibi for Frank the night of Erin's murder (showed her the pic of Frank completely passed out-which coincidentally would give him time to do something nefarious)

Of course, I lose track of who is who and how they are related on this show.

[Penman61]

4 minutes ago, DoubleUTeeEff said:

Of course, I lose track of who is who and how they are related on this show.

Like Colin, I just now assume everyone is related to everyone, has had sex with everyone, and has married and divorced everyone. Even the high-schoolers. It's just...easier.

[paigow]

55 minutes ago, Penman61 said:

What does the title refer to? Was Gordon Lightfoot's "If You Could Read My Mind" on the soundtrack somewhere? 

Dude, you must win a lot of radio contests...

Deacon Mark must have transferred from Allentown

[Cheyanne11]

1 hour ago, lakin1013 said:

Possible theory: Colin Zabel has a much loved father/uncle/cousin who was an esteemed detective somewhere.  Mare found out they were dirty and put them in prison for the rest of their lives.  Zabel changed his name and is out to get Mare, on a day by day basis.  He took the drugs out of the locker to frame her.  We have seen this in a zillion cop shows. 

 

But we saw Mare do it, so I don't see how this would work.

[Joana]

Gah, I immediately knew Mare was going to do that and still hoped she wouldn't. The way I see it, stealing and planting the evidence tells more about Mare's state of mind than it does about her work capabilities. Even the most brilliant minds are capable of making some astoundigly stupid decisions when faced with dire enough circumstances, as she said it herself, Mare feels like her life is falling apart. That's not to say I think she is (or is supposed to be) a brilliant detective by any means, simply competent and well-versed in what being a detective in small town entails on daily basis, and that's just fine. 

Her family dynamics are truly messed up, but I don't see any extreme hostility towards her. I mean, her mom moved in with her, her daughter still lives with her and her ex-husband is literally next door. If they all truly despised her so much (I wouldn't exactly take it for granted Kevin did either), it would be easy for them to abandon her, but no one's done that. 

As for why there's such animosity, I don't think there's some great mystery beneath. Raising a son like Kevin is extremely difficult, it takes a huge toll and she obviously didn't handle it too well, damaging her relationships with others around her. It's kind of a situation that makes everyone feel short-changed at some point. Coming from a somewhat similar family background, I can definitely relate. While I never blame my parents for anything as I really believe they truly did their best, I definitely wish they had done some things differently, and I'm pretty certain they feel the same way about some of the things I've done,

Also, I admit I might be a bit biased because this is Kate Winslet, damnit! I'd defend anything her characters do! 😁 Which is why I still refuse to ever watch Heavenly Creatures.

[lakin1013]

8 minutes ago, Cheyanne11 said:

But we saw Mare do it, so I don't see how this would work.

After Mare looked at the drugs while sitting in the bar, she changed her mind and decided not to go through with it.

[Cheyanne11]

8 minutes ago, lakin1013 said:

After Mare looked at the drugs while sitting in the bar, she changed her mind and decided not to go through with it.

But what I'm saying is we saw her take the drugs from the locker and, per the captain, the evidence was only missing the amount she took, so I'm still not following.

[tennisgurl]

If Mare is going to try to get her sons baby mamma in trouble, she should really be more sneaky about it. Why not just sign your own name on the log out sheet with little smiley faces on it? Or doodles of Carrie with devil horns on her head? You would think she could just wait it out, Carrie might be the mom and is doing better but she is still living at a halfway house, she presumably needs a place to stay and a job before she gets full custody of her son anyway. That's messed up, while I can appreciate them giving their main character flaws, that's a pretty messed up thing to do. 

We have heard some of what happened with Mare's son, it sounds like Mare struggled with having a son with various medical problems and Siobhan and her ex both seem resentful towards Mare for his suicide. The story Siobhan told about how they had to leave Harry Potter when Kevin had a fit and someone called him weird seems to say that Mare didn't know how to deal with his illness and found him frustrating and embarrassing, although we only have Siobhan's interpretation of events. Maybe Mare took them out of that theater because she didn't want her son to have his feelings hurt? Mare seems to think she failed as a parent, but that could just be the guilt and grief and not anything she really did. There is also some mystery surrounding his death and who was there during it, which means there will probably be more to it. As of now I don't mind Siobhan's dating life or her video project, I feel like it could end up being relevant to the story. 

Word to everyone impressed by Evan Peters playing drunk, that's a lot harder than it sounds like it should be, he really nailed that "rambling drunk who thinks they make total sense but are actual talking nonsense" kind of vibe. I don't think that this means Colin is a drunk screw up, getting wasted at your reunion where you ran into your ex fiancé seems like a pretty normal thing to do. He seems like a pretty decent guy so far and I like his out of towner point of view of the town and how Mare is related to pretty much everybody, but that makes me automatically suspect him. I hope he isn't sketchy, but that would certainly be a twist that its the one person who seemingly has no motive for murder. 

I would normally say that Mare was really unprofessional when accusing Frank of sleeping with Erin, but she gave him plenty of time to go out and talk to her and he kept blowing her off and that is the kind of thing that really needs talked about. He also shouldn't have lied, and I am not sure what the point of the lie was. I guess because he didn't want any suspicion of a connection between him and Erin, and while I don't think he's the killer I cant blame Mare for being annoyed with him. He always wants to make Mare the bad guy in really passive aggressive ways. 

Dylan's parents actually seem pretty nice, I am both that Dylan survived and that he was upset that the baby wasn't his. He seems pretty uninterested in the baby and I would think he would have been fine passing the kid off on someone else. 

[pasdetrois]

Quote

If Mare is going to try to get her sons baby mamma in trouble, she should really be more sneaky about it.

I initially thought Mare was stealing the drugs for herself. I thought Ecstasy, given the way she sucks down the vapes.

Maybe the fiance did it.

Edited May 3, 2021 by pasdetrois

[BingeyKohan]

I have no idea how evidence lockers should look but still somehow my observation is that evidence locker looked 'fancy' for such a small-seeming precinct. (i.e. couldn't it just be a locked closet? I guess they wanted the more dramatic effect of Mare being visible through the grating.

[preeya]

4 hours ago, SnazzyDaisy said:

she can take her bf to a fancy salon in Easttown

I think a fancy salon in Easttown would be called a barber shop.

[blixie]

Quote

If I were in her position, I would want all my ducks lined up before trying to get custody because I wouldn't want to give the court any reason to say no.

Yeah, ultimately IF she jumps through all the hoops Mare won't win, but most likely she will have to prove that she's got her own place AND a job and to have had it for a quite a while probably 6 months if not a year, I can see her wanting to get the long drawn out process kicked into gear though so maybe she thinks by the time they get to a decision point she'll be ready. That is what she'd have to do even if Mare wasn't actively fighting her, hell one of my cousins has lost her child TWICE and it's taken at least a year to even get to the point they'll consider giving her special needs child back.

 

Quote

If they all truly despised her so much (I wouldn't exactly take it for granted Kevin did either), it would be easy for them to abandon her, but no one's done that. 

Yeah it's why I think Carrie is full of shit, Mare said Drew has lived with them his whole life, and we now know for sure he and Carrie broke up (at least were off/on), but were ostensibly living in Mare/Frank's house from Drew's birth so if you fuckin' hate her that much why are you both exposing the child to her? Like yes Frank's around, but like make it make sense Carrie. Mare does herself no favors by being a curmudgeon but I think her family has settled into a dynamic where everything is her fault even when it isn't. Like that scene at Frank/Fayes, she gave you several opportunities to take it private after you lied in an murder investigation, she could have dragged your ass to the station or pressed charges. 

Really good thoughts on why Lori's husband is also a good suspect, I hadn't thought of him because they directed us so hard at Billy, but between his reaction and the fact they cast Nicholson who is also a really great actress, I'd imagine she's there to do more than nag Mare from making dumb decisions. 

[aghst]

I doubt anyone planted the drugs on Mare's behalf.

For one thing, she didn't argue too much when the chief asked her for her gun and badge.

Mare doesn't seem like the type of person who'd meekly comply if she was innocent.

[Irlandesa]

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

If Mare is going to try to get her sons baby mamma in trouble, she should really be more sneaky about it.

Yep.  But I did like that it was a sloppy frame-up. While I do enjoy a good supervillain story, there was something very realistic about Mare's tunnel vision once she decided to set up Carrie.  It likely never occurred to her that a fellow officer or prosecutor would even consider listening to a known drug addict's claim she was framed by another cop.  Mare was so focused on the end game, she missed all the ways her plan was ill conceived.

[roughing it]

3 hours ago, Penman61 said:

What does the title refer to? Was Gordon Lightfoot's "If You Could Read My Mind" on the soundtrack somewhere? 

Ha - the second I read this, this song came up on my Pandora.  How random....

[blixie]

Quote

He seems pretty uninterested in the baby and I would think he would have been fine passing the kid off on someone else. 

In my experience a brother who had a baby at 17, I would say teenage parents can have a very strong attachment even with a shallow engagement (parents picking up all of the slack). I'd say his parents realize he's a Mulligan and are happy to have a second pass at the job. LOL.

[paigow]

2 hours ago, Joana said:

Also, I admit I might be a bit biased because this is Kate Winslet, damnit! I'd defend anything her characters do! 😁 Which is why I still refuse to ever watch Heavenly Creatures.

She killed Jack in Titanic... Mythbusters proved both of them would fit...

 

[paigow]

3 hours ago, ShadowHunter said:

I assume Colin Zabel is going to keep Mare in the loop about the investigation. 

Mare is the less sophisticated version of Carrie Mathison from Homeland... Zabel is now an asset that can be manipulated with sexy time...

[Snazzy Daisy]

3 hours ago, ShadowHunter said:

I assume Colin Zabel is going to keep Mare in the loop about the investigation. 

I assume Colin Zabel is going to end up sleeping with Mare at some point 🤭

[Quickbeam]

Aw I was so disappointed in the evidence locker-plant drugs-“your badge and your gun” story line. It’s just so old. And having been in law enforcement in a small town, drugs are never left in evidence lying around like that nor is the evidence locker accessible at will. 
 

I just don’t want Mare to end up in a Ned Stark scenario. And it’s looking like a deep dive here. 
 

 

[Quickbeam]

18 minutes ago, paigow said:

2 hours ago, Joana said:

Also, I admit I might be a bit biased because this is Kate Winslet, damnit! I'd defend anything her characters do! 😁 Which is why I still refuse to ever watch Heavenly Creatures.

Heavenly Creatures is one of the best movies I’ve ever seen. Both Winslet and Lynskey are brilliant.

[gesundheit]

3 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

I'm with @freebie on this one.  What about the question couldn't wait?  Wouldn't it be better to talk to Lori's source instead of relying on the patchwork of information that came second hand?   Plus, she has too many feelings wrapped up in her ex, for better or for worse.  It's the kind of situation where she should have gotten more information and then had someone like Zabel bring him in for more questioning and confronting him on his lie. 

I guess for me it was just everything about the question that couldn't wait -- a man she knew who was in that exact current moment in a house full of kids was potentially someone who raped a kid and was linked to a murder of that kid. It certainly wasn't clever detective work or anything at all, but I imagine most people with any concern for the safety of others would've felt it couldn't wait one single second. I'd be more worried about a detective in that position with those relationships being emotionally detached enough to say "well, guess there's nothing to do at the moment, we'll handle this by the book tomorrow, strategically." That would've really thrown me. So yes, bad police work, good human-ing? (That's the best way I can put it.)

 

I'm wondering as was mentioned above if Frank does know that the kid isn't Dylan's but is trying to protect the real bio-father. Erin may have let her friend think it was Frank when she was seen with him as a way to throw her off the real culprit, that's certainly happened in situations like these before. Well, on TV at least! Probably at least 14 times on SVU.

 

[peachmangosteen]

 

24 minutes ago, gesundheit said:

I'm wondering as was mentioned above if Frank does know that the kid isn't Dylan's but is trying to protect the real bio-father. 

This would make even more sense if Joe Ross is the real dad since he and Frank seem like pretty good friends.

At this point, I think Joe is the prime suspect for bio-dad/killer. He's always around and there are some clues but he's not super obvious and/or hasn't been directly linked to it yet. 

I'm reading Dylan differently than most it seems. In the first ep, when DJ was crying, he picked him up and imo tried to comfort him. And then when he asked for DJ in this ep, I got the sense it was because he was thinking about the possibility of him not being the dad and feeling wistful about it. To me, he kinda seems like he wants to be close to DJ but he also resents that he is a dad, which makes sense to me. But the promo is trying to make it seem like he is going to attempt to kill DJ. I imagine that's misleading though but we'll see.

Another UO but I didn't think Evan Peters was very good in the drunk scenes. Otherwise though I think he's been excellent. I really hope his character isn't the killer. It just feels like a cop out to me.

[gesundheit]

6 hours ago, ShadowHunter said:

Echo the love for Evan Peters when he was drunk. That alone deserved an Emmy. Im not holding out hope since he has never been nominated for one. 

He's definitely getting some love for this one, though! Hopefully it'll matter. It was truly a hell of a feat.

[Kirsty]

18 hours ago, FemmyV said:

Who was the grafittist on the video tape, and why did Mare think the best thing to do was let them off the hook?

These are good questions that I'm hoping someone here will answer!

16 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Throwing her bike off the bridge put him right back into the suspicious as fuck category.

It does seem too early in the show to have found our killer, so I'm guessing it's not deacon Mark. I take it he disposed of Erin's bike like a killer because his reputation would never recover if the bike was found at his place.

16 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

One of the good thing about Mare being suspended is she won't have to deal with the cranky old lady anymore!

You know Mrs. Carroll will still call Mare's phone early in the morning!

16 hours ago, freebie said:

Zabel as a drunken mess was an interesting choice, since he's been portrayed up until now as sane, organized, good at his job, generally just together.

Zabel has also been portrayed as earnest, uptight, nervous, self-conscious, and eager to make a good impression. He's been trying really hard, so it makes sense to me that we would see a different side of him the one time he's had enough alcohol to drown out all of that. And the show made sure it was a significant occasion (ie. his school reunion) and not just a regular Tuesday, to give him cover to get very drunk without appearing to have a drinking problem. Not that we saw a dark side of him here or anything. Basically, he has a personal life and he flirted with Mare. And he might be embarrassed about it when he's sober! Actually, to me he looks like a much better romantic prospect than Richard, but maybe there's too much of a power imbalance between him and Mare.

9 hours ago, BingeyKohan said:

We're spending so much time with Siobhan - I wonder if she will stumble into a connection to or lead on the Katie case

Oooh, I hadn't thought of that.  Great idea.

I kind of liked Mare storming off next door to explode at Frank even though it wasn't professional. It rang true. She thinks of him as family so she would want to deal with him herself. And it's such a terrible allegation that I think she wanted him to reassure her that it was false. Also, Mare's style seems to be hot-headed open confrontation. On the upside, she's direct and you know where you stand with her, because if she has a problem she'll shout it to your face! On the downside, she really knows how to make a scene and she doesn't care who witnesses it. And she doesn't stop to think before going into battle, so to speak.

Quote

I'm totally baffled as to why Mare would go to such extremes to plant drugs on Carrie

I don't know how realistic it is, but on this show Carrie is entitled to custody of her child. And at some level, Mare knows that. I think that's why she went to such extremes. I'm mad at her for risking her job by planting evidence though! And I certainly wasn't expecting her to lose her badge three episodes in. What's her role now? What's this show going to be now? I enjoyed watching her work, and I thought that was the show, so I'm disappointed.

Quote

But did you know he wrote a book?

Lol, nice. I still can't see the point of Richard, much less of such a high profile actor playing the part.

Edited May 3, 2021 by Kirsty

[12catcrazy]

I'm enjoying the series (I watch a lot of dark British crime dramas) but man, are they showing us Mare going off the rails or what?   When she was in the evidence locker and taking some of the drug packets, at first I thought that she was going to use them, but then thought, oh God, she's going to try and frame her nemesis grandbaby mama.    And then, it's like, "What the hell is she thinking?".   Maybe the evidence storage has a camera, or somebody sees her go in there... and to not even put the drugs into a different glassine envelope!   That is some kind of total Police entitlement or whatever it would be called.  Like NOBODY is going to dare accuse her of doing that, or the cops in that town have gotten away with shit like that and nobody questions it.    As it is, the chief is giving her an out by not arresting her for this.  And maybe we are being shown how she can act like judge and jury when it suits her.   She'll let some people off the hook but then pull a stunt like this and probably feels justified because she knows that the grandchild is better off with her and not with his mother.  

I do not think that Erin killed herself and still wondering who the real father of her child is.  It would be a kicker if it turns out to be Mare's dead son and at this point, I'm wondering if he really did kill himself or if he were murdered and it was made to look like a suicide.  I think the priests know something but are not the killers.  And still trying to figure out what the deal is going to be with the writer.  Will they REALLY have an actor like Guy Pearce in what is basically a cameo part?  

[lakin1013]

3 hours ago, Cheyanne11 said:

But what I'm saying is we saw her take the drugs from the locker and, per the captain, the evidence was only missing the amount she took, so I'm still not following.

My thinking - She took the drugs.  She sat at the bar thinking, looked at the drugs again, then changed her mind and intended to put them back early next day.  When the captain came to her door to relieve her of duty, she went along meekly because -- while Mare is messy, impulsive, and complicated -- she is not stupid.  She now knows that somebody else has framed her.

Again, I am working the Zabel theory because the show is not giving us much, or giving us too much.  Big named actors generally sign on cuz their part has significance.  Jean Smart (Helen) is going to move the story about Drew and Carrie. Guy Pearce, with his odd advice also re: Carrie seems in with that storyline.  The priests are red herrings, too obvious. Right now, I am going with Zabel or Frank.  Or maybe the Carrie story is going to be THE story....

[I Want My MBTV]

2 hours ago, gesundheit said:

I guess for me it was just everything about the question that couldn't wait -- a man she knew who was in that exact current moment in a house full of kids was potentially someone who raped a kid and was linked to a murder of that kid. It certainly wasn't clever detective work or anything at all, but I imagine most people with any concern for the safety of others would've felt it couldn't wait one single second. I'd be more worried about a detective in that position with those relationships being emotionally detached enough to say "well, guess there's nothing to do at the moment, we'll handle this by the book tomorrow, strategically." That would've really thrown me. So yes, bad police work, good human-ing? (That's the best way I can put it.)

IDK - for me there really wasn't any "evidence" here. The friend said Erin told her that Dylan wasn't the father (who knows if Erin just told her that because it's true or because Dylan's an asshole) but she said Erin did not say who the real father is (again could be because it's Dylan) but the friend "thought" it might be Frank because she say him drop Erin off with baby stuff? That's pretty weak. 

[Snazzy Daisy]

20 hours ago, FemmyV said:

Who was the grafittist on the video tape, and why did Mare think the best thing to do was let them off the hook?

Could it be the peeping Tom? Mare’s decision to delete that footage will come back & bite her especially when that peeping Tom isn’t just a peeping Tom.

[Cheezwiz]

6 hours ago, DoubleUTeeEff said:

I can't think of a reason why Frank would lie about knowing Erin and so freely give a DNA test unless it's because he does know who the real father of Erin's baby is and he knows it's not him or anyone he is related to. Is he related to John Ross somehow? I'm suspicious of John Ross not for any hard facts but because he's

A) Julianne's Nicholson's husband

B) He made a big show of being hungover to Lori the morning after Erin's murder

C) He went out of his way to show Mare that he was an alibi for Frank the night of Erin's murder (showed her the pic of Frank completely passed out-which coincidentally would give him time to do something nefarious)

Of course, I lose track of who is who and how they are related on this show.

I like this guy for the suspect as well - especially what you pointed out about him showing the photo of Frank passed out. I'm honestly getting the beardy secondary cousin/uncle characters all mixed up. Other beardy guy was of course, acting shifty as well. Perhaps Mare's friend Lori should be in the suspect pile as well - no obvious connections so far...

I'm also wondering about Mare's clergyman cousin. He looked awfully anxious to know how things went when Deacon sketchy returned from being interviewed.

Like others I'm assuming Siobhan is getting so much screen time because she will probably stumble upon something significant - not sure how this will tie into who she's dating. 

I thought the casting for Dylan's parents was odd - they looked a bit too Beaver Cleaver for a dolt like Dylan, and the Dad looked waaay young. It almost seemed like Dylan's & Erin's parental figures should have been swapped.

 

[paigow]

33 minutes ago, Cheezwiz said:

Like others I'm assuming Siobhan is getting so much screen time because she will probably stumble upon something significant - not sure how this will tie into who she's dating. 

Is the college radio station at the same college where Richard teaches?

Siobhan is going to a concert with the college drug dealing boss! Mare will have to steal the remaining drugs from evidence lock-up if she wants to see Siobhan again... This will connect back to Katie somehow... 

[Xantar]

40 minutes ago, paigow said:

Is the college radio station at the same college where Richard teaches?

I don’t think so. The station is identified as a Haverford College station (fun fact, I went to Swarthmore a few exits away from Haverford. And they also name dropped Bryn Mawr which is also nearby).

[paigow]

28 minutes ago, Xantar said:

And they also name dropped Bryn Mawr

Is this why the PA accent is unique? The lack of vowels?

[hoodooznoodooz]

20 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

One of the good thing about Mare being suspended is she won't have to deal with the cranky old lady anymore!

I liked that her husband tried to convince her that she was overreacting because what the vandal drew didn’t even look like her breasts.

[blixie]

I thought initially the graffiti person was Bethy's brother, because Mare obviously cares about him and didn't want him to get busted for something so small time, but on a rewatch it really was the next door neighbor kid, but again I think she thinks Betty is PITA and that the kid is just having some kid type shenanigans. Definitely could come back to bite her though since she doesn't seem to actually know him like she knows every single other body in this town.

John is for sure at the top of the suspect list, but if Frank knows than he's motherfucker too, way to cover for your child rapist buddy. I don't think Frank knows though. I agree though that the bike scene is dirty pool, it's going to be hard to explain why the Deacon has the bike but has no involvement in her actual murder. Even if she stopped by his place and then got picked up, which then leads me back to her dad is the father, her dad picked her up from the Deacon (and its why he didn't give her a ride home) and the Deacon is doing what he can to protect DJ from all of this/maintain the veil of confession/incestuous abusive dad. But like you are also protecting her murderer/covering his own ass? It's a big stretch big big stretch. 

[SnarkEnthusiast]

22 hours ago, gesundheit said:

That said, ALL THE AWARDS for Evan Peters in that bar scene, that was spectacular. One of the more spot-on uber-drunk performances I've ever seen. to the point that I felt that irritated knot in my stomach that I get when some people in my life are that lit and still trying to converse. (But it was also hysterical.)

Agreed! I've never seen a performance that accurate. I didn't recognize Evan Peters with the dye job and the fact that he looks much older than his other roles, but that was a masterclass. He's really holding his own opposite Kate Winslet and it's a fucking delight. He's rapidly becoming my favorite character.

21 hours ago, SnazzyDaisy said:

Drunk, devious, flirty Colin in the bar is creepy.

To each their own. I thought it was a moment of genuine vulnerability that gave his character a great deal of depth beyond "straight- laced sidekick who gawks at Mare's brashness." He has struggles and disappointments too and indulges in a bit of self-pity while still extending empathy and concern for Mare. It added a lot of complexity to their dynamic. And it could just be because I'm becoming very attracted to Evan Peters (see above), but the end of that exchange was pretty sexy, even if he was sloppy drunk. "Maybe I wanna stay with you" was a very coy way of laying his ambiguous attraction out there without seeming cringeworthy or desperate.

I never thought my main viewing objective would be hoping Kate Winslet and Evan Peters hook up, but here we are.

20 hours ago, freebie said:

Ugh. I did not at all like the turn this episode took. Having Mare plant those drugs is very, very close to shark-jumping territory for me.

I know! So we're just supposed to chalk that up to a minor character misstep and...keep rooting for her? When she planted drugs on an (estranged) family member who's in recovery to retain custody of her small child? And Mare is still supposedly an anti-hero? ...Okay. Her characterization is really OTT unlikable sprinkled with all these  Mary Sue moments, which is an odd combo.

13 hours ago, BingeyKohan said:

We're spending so much time with Siobhan - I wonder if she will stumble into a connection to or lead on the Katie case but will end up having nothing to do with the Erin case.

I'm getting a heavy Sharp Objects vibe from Siobhan. I wouldn't be surprised if she turns out to be involved in either case.

 

[For Cereals]

43 minutes ago, paigow said:

Is this why the PA accent is unique? The lack of vowels?

After spending so much time with my in-laws over the years, Kate Winslet is the only one who has the accent down consistently.

 

[Snazzy Daisy]

1 hour ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

I liked that her husband tried to convince her that she was overreacting because what the vandal drew didn’t even look like her breasts.

Totally agreed with Betty’s husband, I only see two papayas... 🤣🤣🤣

[JeanJean]

22 hours ago, Cheezwiz said:

 iI does bring up the possibility that there could be two completely different killers circulating in town. Even without that sinister possibility, it's just yet another GIANT RED FLAG. Seriously Mare, even if this writer dude isn't a murderer, he's bad news - run away! Guy Pearce has always creeped me out, so it's good casting, I guess.

Whenever I see Guy Pearce, I think of the line "With a wrecking ball" from L.A. Confidential.
This show could use a periodic lightness break, like the teenagers being questioned last episode. It's sometimes too relentlessly bleak. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

1 hour ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

I never thought my main viewing objective would be hoping Kate Winslet and Evan Peters hook up, but here we are.

I'm always pro relationships with an older woman because we always have to see the reverse!