S15.E06: Week 6: Latvia

[Ms Blue Jay]

17 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Hannah is shocked SHOCKED to find that drama happens when you keep the one guy around that everyone else hates! 

This is something I can't stand about her.

She keeps crying like she doesn't know the cause of the drama.  It is Luke. 

17 hours ago, leighdear said:

Her dress is fabulous, seeing it without the coat.  She really wears those gowns like, um....uh....ya know....a girl that wears gowns......  *LOL*

She looks like she has abs in the white dress.  You can see them through the dress.  I mean, holy crap.

[thesupremediva1]

2 minutes ago, zoltana said:

I hope it's producer manipulation, but 23 is an immature age to be seeing the bigger picture in the long run.  

It's not producer manipulation. She likes Luke. She's probably incredibly embarrassed watching this back, but 23 (IMO) is quite young. In fact, I think it's far too young for any lead. But the producers picked her and she's at least got some gumption. Maybe her choices aren't the best, and she's not nearly as polished as an Emily or Andi or even a Des, but I DO feel like I know her. Whoever ends up with her, they know all about her crazy personality, her flaws, and her Luke attraction. Nothing was hidden. I prefer that to real pageant queens like Caelynn who seem to be reading from a script so they appear perfect at all times.

[b2H]

4 minutes ago, thesupremediva1 said:

It's not producer manipulation. She likes Luke

She is remembering the hot moment in week 1 or 2 when he had his shirt off and she was darned near undressed herself.  She wants to finish this.  She's hot for him and the rest just don't matter.  It's why when she says there's a conflict between her head and her heart, she's missing one more part.

[Ms Blue Jay]

15 hours ago, lizajane said:

Like, this is so firstratink!  

😄😄😄

14 hours ago, HC87 said:

Dear Christ...did I just spend 2+ of the precious finite hours I have on this mortal coil watching and then posting about this show?

Changes may well be called for 🙂

I can't breathe 😄😄😄

[TheFinalRose]

2 hours ago, thesupremediva1 said:

If you're so disgusted that Hannah's into Luke, get up and leave. Arguing with someone who you totally believe is a liar reminds me of my favorite George Bernard Shaw quote: "I learned long ago never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."

Some men (Tyler and Connor) seem to get this - the others are rolling around in mud and seem perplexed that Luke isn't the only one with dirt on his hands. DISENGAGE. Unless you're there for camera time, in which case, I'm glad Hannah told them off. 

Amen. Looking at you Garrett. Now based on the extended dance-mix previews we saw last night Garrett sticks around for a while. Looks like we are in for the Luke and Garrett show from now on.  Unfortunately. I prefer the Jed and Tyler show.

But what was up with the spoiler-ish previews? They've been teasing the Hannah blow up over sex all season and hiding the antagonist but suddenly they show us that it's Luke. It's like someone quit in the editing chair and its replacement had a different idea where they want the show to go from now on so they stopped "the journey" last night, gave us some recaps instead and spoiled part of the rest of the season.  

Why? (Nancy Kerrigan voice).

I want answers!!!

[dirtypop90]

3 minutes ago, b2H said:

She is remembering the hot moment in week 1 or 2 when he had his shirt off and she was darned near undressed herself.  She wants to finish this.  She's hot for him and the rest just don't matter.  It's why when she says there's a conflict between her head and her heart, she's missing one more part.

I honestly think they are still having hot moments that are being cut to protect Hannah.  I think she sees all of Luke and still wants him.  She held on to him until she literally couldn't anymore and save face. 

[rebel2u]

I finally figured out who Grant--when he was leaving--reminded me of--Bill Pullman.

I know I mentioned in an earlier post that I miss MuShu.  I'm going to add Rainsong to the list.

2 of my favorite posters absent.

Was it something we said?   Are you on vacation together?

Come back, you two.

All is forgiven.  

Edited June 18, 2019 by rebel2u

[bobbyjoe]

Next week:  Chris sits down again with Hannah for a clip show recapping this week’s clip show.

[nlkm9]

so my thoughts are Luke S was a big whiny baby and i was happy to see him go--Luke P was dead wrong, but Luke S and all the men have to put on their big boy pants and deal with life and all its challenges, Luke S went from being a cutie to a whining little baby, refusing to take Luke P's albeit fake apology.. Now Garret had become that whiny baby!! Yes i get it Luke P is a JERK. its not fair that hes there. but all you guys bitching and moaning and interrogating him are making it worse and its not a good look. you are there to get to know Hannah--be like Ty (hubba hubba) and concentrate on her, not the person youre allowing to steal the show. maybe its this generation, but these guys are so whiny and strident and they are showing folks how they deal with a problem, and its not productive. as much as Luke P is a jerk, he is a master of getting all the attention but HE is not the one ruining their chances--they are!!! Blech!!!!!😡

[tinkerbell]

3 hours ago, thesupremediva1 said:

I have to respectfully disagree here. I see I'm in the minority, but I wish more B-ettes would step up and let the room know how they feel in one shot like that. I didn't find it disrespectful that she told them how she felt.

She was very clear that she wasn't defending Luke, and that whatever was spoken about was brought up because she asked. If they have issues with that, they should clear out. And she's right - if they are more interested in taking down Luke P. than getting to know her, they should leave. I'd have culled the herd right there. We'd have been at final 4 or 5 after that cocktail party.

I cannot agree with that.  Hannah is talking to one guy at a time,  the rest are all in a room together.  No TV, no reading materials, just each other.  they talk, and an argument starts.  nobody was screaming, but some of them were angry.  So what?   You get a bunch of guys together, they are all dating the same woman, and there is nothing else to do.  Competition makes for some hurt and angry feelings.  

Hannah could have ignored it.  Or she could have listened, maybe learned something about some of the guys - how they speak to each other, how they express themselves, how they handle confrontation.   she didn't need to barge in and tell them to stop.  They weren't hurting anyone.  What was her point in telling them not to argue?  she wants them to compete on physical tasks, they're all competing for her attention, so what if the competition gets verbal? They have literally NOTHING ELSE TO DO. 

[RealHousewife]

25 minutes ago, tinkerbell said:

I cannot agree with that.  Hannah is talking to one guy at a time,  the rest are all in a room together.  No TV, no reading materials, just each other.  they talk, and an argument starts.  nobody was screaming, but some of them were angry.  So what?   You get a bunch of guys together, they are all dating the same woman, and there is nothing else to do.  Competition makes for some hurt and angry feelings.  

Hannah could have ignored it.  Or she could have listened, maybe learned something about some of the guys - how they speak to each other, how they express themselves, how they handle confrontation.   she didn't need to barge in and tell them to stop.  They weren't hurting anyone.  What was her point in telling them not to argue?  she wants them to compete on physical tasks, they're all competing for her attention, so what if the competition gets verbal? They have literally NOTHING ELSE TO DO. 

Bravo Tinkerbell!!! MTE when I watched the show. What on earth did she expect when she agreed to be the Bachelorette? Just being able to date a bunch of hot dudes she’s never met who are each completely devoted to her, manage to live in the same house competing for the very last rose, and not get into any arguments?

This is The Bachelorette. Ideally the guys are in it for all the right reasons, and she will find love. But at the end of the day, it is a TV show that puts the contestants in bizarre circumstances bound to cause drama. This isn’t a personal dating service for Hannah where everyone has to be on pins and needles or else she’ll cry. 

[thesupremediva1]

37 minutes ago, tinkerbell said:

I cannot agree with that.  Hannah is talking to one guy at a time,  the rest are all in a room together.  No TV, no reading materials, just each other.  they talk, and an argument starts.  nobody was screaming, but some of them were angry.  So what?   You get a bunch of guys together, they are all dating the same woman, and there is nothing else to do.  Competition makes for some hurt and angry feelings.  

Hannah could have ignored it.  Or she could have listened, maybe learned something about some of the guys - how they speak to each other, how they express themselves, how they handle confrontation.   she didn't need to barge in and tell them to stop.  They weren't hurting anyone.  What was her point in telling them not to argue?  she wants them to compete on physical tasks, they're all competing for her attention, so what if the competition gets verbal? They have literally NOTHING ELSE TO DO. 

I don't think she'd have intervened if it wasn't affecting her relationships. But as she stated time and time again, the house arguments weren't some separate entity - apparently the animosity kept her relationships from progressing.

Worth noting, none of the men have a problem with the way Luke behaves towards Hannah. None of them are trying to protect or defend her. None of them even have a single "wrong reasons accusation" toward Luke.

He's a liar and an ass - but only toward them. So he doesn't play well in the sandbox. That's a shame. They've all told Hannah as much. LET IT GO. She can find out after she marries him, if that's her prerogative. Last night's argument was about how Luke lied to the guys - again, zero to do with Hannah. It all just feels petty and fake, like they needed a villain after Cam left so now Luke is the anti-Christ. Chad was worse, IMO. 

[JenLily]

9 minutes ago, thesupremediva1 said:

I don't think she'd have intervened if it wasn't affecting her relationships. But as she stated time and time again, the house arguments weren't some separate entity - apparently the animosity kept her relationships from progressing.

My feeling on that is, that's on her if her relationships aren't progressing. She could easily shut each guy down when she has one-on-one time with them if they start whining about Luke. It's easy: "Let's not talk about Luke right now. Let's talk about you. Do you have any pets?" Much like ignoring a child having a temper tantrum, she could ignore what the guys have to say about Luke and deal with him on her own. But she doesn't. Because she's just as caught up in having the guys "approve" of her keeping Luke around as she is in justifying it to herself. I agree that he's a liar and an ass and she'll find out about that on her own, but she doesn't have to let their (perfectly valid) feelings interfere with what she's doing here. She wants everyone to play nice while she waltzes through this "process" and that's just not going to happen. Frankly, if the powers that be wanted to help her out on this, they'd give the guys a pool table or something so they can blow off some steam instead of cooping them all up together. Hell, let them go for a walk.

[b2H]

4 minutes ago, JenLily said:

My feeling on that is, that's on her if her relationships aren't progressing. She could easily shut each guy down when she has one-on-one time with them if they start whining about Luke. It's easy: "Let's not talk about Luke right now. Let's talk about you. Do you have any pets?" Much like ignoring a child having a temper tantrum, she could ignore what the guys have to say about Luke and deal with him on her own. But she doesn't. Because she's just as caught up in having the guys "approve" of her keeping Luke around as she is in justifying it to herself. I agree that he's a liar and an ass and she'll find out about that on her own, but she doesn't have to let their (perfectly valid) feelings interfere with what she's doing here. She wants everyone to play nice while she waltzes through this "process" and that's just not going to happen. Frankly, if the powers that be wanted to help her out on this, they'd give the guys a pool table or something so they can blow off some steam instead of cooping them all up together. Hell, let them go for a walk.

Look, to me, the whole thing is self-inflicted.  She can get everything she wants by booting Luke now, following through to the end, picking one of the other guys and after six months choosing Luke.

We don't have to sit through this.  It is entirely a choice for her and it is easily fixed.  Does no one here remember Molly and Melissa?????

[cinsays]

3 minutes ago, b2H said:

Look, to me, the whole thing is self-inflicted.  She can get everything she wants by booting Luke now, following through to the end, picking one of the other guys and after six months choosing Luke.

We don't have to sit through this.  It is entirely a choice for her and it is easily fixed.  Does no one here remember Molly and Melissa?????

Yeah, it is not like she signed something saying she can never ever see one of the guys she sends home again.  Just let him go.  Enjoy the rest of the season's trips and get back in touch when you are back in real life, after THE JOURNEY is over.

[JenLily]

12 minutes ago, b2H said:

Look, to me, the whole thing is self-inflicted.  She can get everything she wants by booting Luke now, following through to the end, picking one of the other guys and after six months choosing Luke.

Oh, I totally agree. Life would be a lot easier for everyone involved if she'd just get rid of Luke with the understanding that *none* of this is permanent. But I still hold that so much of what's hanging her up right now is subconsciously wanting the other guys to be okay with her keeping him just because she wants to keep him. And that's not going to happen because they straight up do not like him. They could keep fighting and she could go right on her merry way getting whatever she wants out of this if she could just let go of her desperate need for approval. But then again, I'm guessing that's part of what drove her into the pageant circuit in the first place. 🤷‍♀️

[b2H]

1 minute ago, JenLily said:

Oh, I totally agree. Life would be a lot easier for everyone involved if she'd just get rid of Luke with the understanding that *none* of this is permanent. But I still hold that so much of what's hanging her up right now is subconsciously wanting the other guys to be okay with her keeping him just because she wants to keep him. And that's not going to happen because they straight up do not like him. They could keep fighting and she could go right on her merry way getting whatever she wants out of this if she could just let go of her desperate need for approval. But then again, I'm guessing that's part of what drove her into the pageant circuit in the first place. 🤷‍♀️

And Luke seems to know how to keep her happy.  They're meant for each other, despite Luke being a bit of a lunkhead.

[Dejana]

What a weirdly constructed episode, with such obvious filler.  Did the network just come along at the last minute and say, we need an extra episode this season, can you stretch out what you have? 

My feeling about Hannah is that keeping Luke around is a poor decision, but many people, even super famous people who have a good 10-20 years on her and aren't cloistered on reality shows, aren't above making utter spectacles of themselves when it comes to matters of the heart. The previews make it clear that the scales fall from her eyes at some point, so I'll just wait to see how it happens.

Yes, she could kick Luke out and all the fights between the guys would stop. However, the other guys could also just ignore Luke as much as possible because by now they should realize what sort of person he is, and that engaging with him improves nothing. Has whining about the Season Villain ever made the lead say, "You're right, thanks for telling me, you'll get my final rose instead!" Just sit back, be your awesome self and if she doesn't notice, then she wasn't right for you, anyway.

Edited June 18, 2019 by Dejana

[Palomar]

So Hannah is thinking about giving up because of the drama.  The drama IS Luke P.  Simple solution get rid of him, get rid of drama. But she is "attracted" to him even though he is not marriage material and no way wants anything but fame.  He doesn't even care enough about her to talk about anything but HIMSELF.  He will only get worse and make it even more about him.  This is getting boring...plus the guy is not even attractive.

[Just Carol]

The timeline of the episode is confusing me.  Were there any dates in Latvia, or just a rose ceremony?  

I feel so bad for Hannah.  Firstly, she is teetering on the edge, with her sad untold history, her Hannah Beast, etc., which does look like tightly controlled rage.  She went on this "journey" to have fun and find love, but now she is angry.  We have an angry Bachelorette and that sucks for everyone.  All she wants is fun and love and to be the center of attention-- but what does she get?  A bunch of bickering gossips who can't chill out.  I blame Garret as much as Luke.  Its is NO fun to be ganged up on and not pd be allowed to finish a sentence no matter how many half-truths you told.  Especially if Hannah goaded Luke to talk about past incidents, the guys need to STFU.

Folks are saying Production hates her.  I think her Stylists hate her.  She should not wear her hair back off her forehead as she is going later in the season.

The "coming scenes" made it look like F3 were Garret, Mike and Peter.  If this is true, I wonder what happened to Tyler.  Bailed?

Edited June 18, 2019 by Just Carol

[bluestocking]

Somewhat lost in all this is that Hannah DID eliminate Luke.  At their 1-on-1 dinner, she sent him packing and told him to RESPECT HER DECISION.  

Which of course he didn't.  Production could have helped her out by actually putting him into the car and driving him off.  Instead they let him walk through the woods, go to church (!) for five seconds, and come back.  

And yeah, she took him back.  He said the right words, apparently.

But we COULD have been free of Luke if tptb had just whisked him away like all the other guys who got sent home.  

[nutty1]

I don't even think it was Hannah berating the guys that bugged me. I did think some of them were acting like 12 year old girls. It's just....everything. She clearly was not mature enough to take on the role of The Bachelorette. She has so much angst for someone so young. I have thought the same thing listening to interviews with her. I just do not find her likeable.  

I think she has had the hots for Luke since night one. Why, I have no idea, but there has to be stuff on the cutting room floor.  If she dumps him after the blow up we saw in the previews, I wonder if her actual final choice was just an after thought. If she is with someone now, I wouldn't want to be them watching the Luke show back. Awkward!

I am hanging in there to see who I want to root for as the next lead. Seems like Mike, Jed, Pete and Tyler would be the ones being considered, IMO.  When I mention them, I realize she had some really nice guys. Too bad she didn't focus on them.

Chris Harrison has been dating Lauren Zima from Entertainment tonight, for a quite a while. 

Edited June 18, 2019 by nutty1

[saber5055]

47 minutes ago, Just Carol said:

The timeline of the episode is confusing me.  Were there any dates in Latvia, or just a rose ceremony?  

The best part of this episode was at the beginning when it showed the guys sitting down at a picnic table and hoisting some beers. My thought was, wow, that's a bunch of good-looking guys. Me likee.

The remaining 1 hour and 45 minutes was a solid down-hill slide into Drecksville.

As someone else posted, it would be The Best Season Evah if Hannah did indeed quit and was replaced with some other woman, any other woman. Just so this show could get back on track for what it's suppose to be ... Right Reasons (even if fake) Dating/Engagement.

All this other cr*p that's going on is just helping this show Jump The Shark multiple times. I so don't care about Hannah. I hope she doesn't find "happiness" and lives miserably ever after. Meanwhile, let's pick someone hot for next Bach and get on with the Eye Candy.

[GracieK]

One of the most confusing things is why she has so much angst over Luke? She hasn’t appeared to enjoy him since week 2.. in fact she seems annoyed and disgusted by him all the time. I guess there must be something pleasant between them that hasn’t been shown at all since that time. 

He’s such a robot. Oh Hannah said show some emotion.. scream or something. So he comes back and literally goes I’m going to stand back here so I can awkwardly act like I need to scream. Gaaahhh it’s so cringy!!

[reggiejax]

18 hours ago, JenLily said:

It's a special level of arrogance to believe that the only deep conversations you can have with someone are ones where the topic is you.

That's Hannah in a nutshell.

Seriously, for all her talk about how she wants the guys to open up and be real, or "rill" in Hannah-speak, you just know it will all be taken as an excuse for her to pontificate on her favorite subject, herself. Just because she comes at it from the angle of self-reflection (of the shallowest kind) doesn't make it any less narcissistic. 

But credit where credit is due, her laying the smackdown to the guys over their incessant bickering over all this Luke P bullshit was epic, and long overdue for this franchise. Hannah put it best, stay in your own lane.

As or the mid-episode, season recap, there is no better proof that they realize they failed in picking Hannah as Bachelorette. That they even felt the need to stop midway through the season to go over everything, shows what a disaster this season has been. And when the most interesting part of the recap is the time devoted to the booger on Hannah's face that she inexplicably named "Marcus", you know you've got a stinker of a season.

Edited June 18, 2019 by reggiejax

[Pass the Tequila]

Did anyone else catch Luke S jumping into Luke P's arms ala Dirty Dancing? I replayed that in FF slow-motion. Twice. They were still on the playing field by the sidelines. P was heading back towards the centre of the field/game with his back turned to S who was closer to the edge of the playing field. As P is walking away from S, S mouths off to P. P swings back around to face S. S charges P. P crouched to position himself to catch and lift S. S coiled up and springs into P's arms. Then the slam. I didn't see any knee in the head but that part was hard to tell. I'm sure if he were nailed, the producers would mine that for ratings gold and show it, no? I'm so glad they snuck that clip in! 😏

I don't really understand why I am disappointed when I know a lot of this show is fake. (I probably don't like feeling tricked I guess after the Colton Cassie cluster. 😒) Anyway I'm tempted to give up and just go read the spoiler thread from now on ...but it's difficult after so many seasons of my jumping through hoops to not be spoiled. I just don't see the point of my thoughts being so confused because I don't know all of the interesting stuff that is being cut out. 😢 I understand this show is formulaic...in that there is always a villian in the first few weeks that everybody hates...but now I'm wondering if maybe Luke isn't as bad as he's being made out to be? (I mean he's still bad but I don't need to be beaten over the head with it). As per the previews it looks like he's sticking around for awhile ... Am I going crazy? Is the show going to have him redeemed somehow? It's always so anticlimactic when the villian is finally tossed. Wouldn't it be interesting if they went off course and switched things up a bit?

The previews do look interesting but I suspect are presented completely out of context.

I'm sorry I'm so negative lately.

I do however find Hannah's "all in 1000%" approach and her ability to make her needs known, to be refreshing overall. I admire her confidence and wish I had even a tenth of that when I was her age. I am choosing to not consider her entitled..although I do see how much she really does like attention. Then again so did I at that age! 😁

Also...too many instances of "like" inserted into a conversation - between that and the pause after every 5th word or the pause after saying "I"...silence for a beat, then continue the sentence = my ears bleeding. 😞

Edited June 18, 2019 by Pass the Tequila
correcting "some" grammatical errors

[Riplet68]

I think hannah is just an angry cryer. I’m one andbits horrible. You get so angry, frustrated, tears start flowing and it just snow balls from there.

i agree with everything hannah told them. The more sane guys agree also (mike, Tyler, Connor, Peter)

[DEL901]

With regard to this being a weird filler episode.... if the NBA finals had gone to game 7, the game was scheduled for Monday so this episode would have been bumped.   By creating this throwaway episode, they could have tossed it and not hurt the season. 

[Just Carol]

But last week, due to NBA, the network moved TBette to Tuesday.  Why do you not think they would have done the same here?

7 hours ago, DEL901 said:

With regard to this being a weird filler episode.... if the NBA finals had gone to game 7, the game was scheduled for Monday so this episode would have been bumped.   By creating this throwaway episode, they could have tossed it and not hurt the season. 

[JudyObscure]

10 hours ago, Pass the Tequila said:

Did anyone else catch Luke S jumping into Luke P's arms ala Dirty Dancing?

Yes!  I saw that and it did look like Luke P's pick up and slam down of Luke S was a fairly defensive move.  Luke S attacked in anger so he kind of got what he deserved and shouldn't have gone crying to Mama Hannah about it.

I think the panic and drama in production would have made a much better show this year.  At some point they had to see that Hannah was stuck on a dumb meathead, the rest of the men weren't having much fun, and it just wasn't going to be a very romantic or interesting journey for the fans to watch. 

So they went into the editing room, caught the moment she tells Luke, "You don't own me!" and said, "There!  That shall be our theme and we have the great Leslie Gore song to promote it!"  After that they had to edit the whole show to highlight Hannah's "strong woman" moments, even if they were really just hissy fits, bossy lectures and long boring dates where she tries to tell the men, "Let's talk about me!" without really saying it.

We're just stuck with all this until the fantasy suite dates, which promise to make for some really good message board -- which is why I watch in the first place.

[DEL901]

1 hour ago, Just Carol said:

But last week, due to NBA, the network moved TBette to Tuesday.  Why do you not think they would have done the same here?

I guess because of the nature of this episode.  Maybe they didn't want to move the show twice?

[nutty1]

The show is ending one week later than normal. Maybe they just needed filler (that is per Reality Steve).

[Crs97]

Someone earlier asked if Tyler was even in the room when she yelled at everyone.  He is leaning against the door post, as far out of the room as possible without being actually out of it.  When she leaves, he puts his arm around her as he moves to let her pass.  I may or may not keep my focus on him to the exclusion of all others.

[tinkerbell]

15 hours ago, bluestocking said:

Somewhat lost in all this is that Hannah DID eliminate Luke.  At their 1-on-1 dinner, she sent him packing and told him to RESPECT HER DECISION.  

Which of course he didn't.  Production could have helped her out by actually putting him into the car and driving him off.  Instead they let him walk through the woods, go to church (!) for five seconds, and come back.  

And yeah, she took him back.  He said the right words, apparently.

But we COULD have been free of Luke if tptb had just whisked him away like all the other guys who got sent home.  

I think producers allowed and likely encouraged him to "get back in there and fight for your woman."  Other guys aren't allowed to waltz back in after being sent home. 

In the previews to the season, hannah said she was looking for a man who grabs her and says "this is my woman," and fights for her. She wants a guy who is "bold." All the other guys should just walk off and leave her with Luke, who is exactly  the kind of asshole she said she wanted.

[deSchenke]

Luke displays traits of a Narcissist.  He also fits the profile of a potential abuser and stalker. If they indeed have a psychologist on the set, they should have recognized this and never have allowed Luke to return once Hannah sent him home.

[Starlight925]

11 hours ago, DEL901 said:

With regard to this being a weird filler episode.... if the NBA finals had gone to game 7, the game was scheduled for Monday so this episode would have been bumped.   By creating this throwaway episode, they could have tossed it and not hurt the season. 

This makes the most sense of anything.  I kept wondering why all the flashbacks!  I FF'd through, and it was about 45 minutes of Chris Harrison helping Hannah relive her "journey".  Plus all the focus with the guys vs. Luke, which quite frankly, was a big nothing at the end of it.

I re-watched Trista's season on Tubi (1st Bachelorette), and part of Alex Michel's season (1st Bachelor), and they were only like 6 or 7 episodes, very compact, very little drama.  As the series has gotten more popular, they keep extending it, adding drama, and extending some more.

As for Hannah and this particular episode, I think her hurt was that, instead of focusing on her, these guys are fighting with each other.  She'd like the focus to be on how, or why, they are the best candidate for her, not try and settle their issues with Luke.  I get it from the guys' standpoint:  Hey, don't lie to my face and tell me you didn't bring my name up, when clearly you did.  And I get it from hers:  I'm here to find my future husband, not all this middle school B.S.

[jade.black]

I like Hannah so much. I'm surprised to see I'm in the minority, but yeah, the guys were acting like they were in junior high and I would have told them off too. I also would have kicked Garrett out then and there for being a shit stirrer. She flat out told him that she had asked situational questions that required names to come up, and he went back and immediately told the guys Luke was dropping names on his date. Whatever, dude.

My favorite moment (thank you, editors!) was at the rose ceremony when Garrett's talking head went "I feel like this was mostly my fault" and then immediate cut to Luke's talking head going, "This was 100% Garrett's fault." Dying.

Edited June 19, 2019 by jade.black

[SallySarue]

1 hour ago, deSchenke said:

Luke displays traits of a Narcissist.  He also fits the profile of a potential abuser and stalker. If they indeed have a psychologist on the set, they should have recognized this and never have allowed Luke to return once Hannah sent him home.

Totally. And the way he constantly moves his eyebrows bugs the hell out of me.

[shouldbedancing]

This episode was really weird and I didn't like it.

[Jax7917]

50 minutes ago, Sterling said:

This makes the most sense of anything.  I kept wondering why all the flashbacks!  I FF'd through, and it was about 45 minutes of Chris Harrison helping Hannah relive her "journey".  Plus all the focus with the guys vs. Luke, which quite frankly, was a big nothing at the end of it.

I re-watched Trista's season on Tubi (1st Bachelorette), and part of Alex Michel's season (1st Bachelor), and they were only like 6 or 7 episodes, very compact, very little drama.  As the series has gotten more popular, they keep extending it, adding drama, and extending some more.

As for Hannah and this particular episode, I think her hurt was that, instead of focusing on her, these guys are fighting with each other.  She'd like the focus to be on how, or why, they are the best candidate for her, not try and settle their issues with Luke.  I get it from the guys' standpoint:  Hey, don't lie to my face and tell me you didn't bring my name up, when clearly you did.  And I get it from hers:  I'm here to find my future husband, not all this middle school B.S.

Yes but if not for all the middle school BS, there's no show. And I have a different take on her being the lead. Everyone thinks she's cute and quirky because that's just her personality and that may be true to an extent, but I think she wants to be remembered as the most interesting and ballsy female lead. I didn't really care for her one way or another the first few episodes, but this one confirmed how annoying she is. The guys drool over any female lead and the girls drool over any male lead. The shows formula has never changed. You can replace any lead with another one and you'll still get the "I love yous" within 1 or two dates and you'll still get people who stick around even though they're not really interested in the lead. Hannah lectures the guys as if she's their teacher and she cries during every group interaction with them. There's noo way most of them are interested in her. In real life, they would have never given her a text back. She's attractive, but girls got issues.

[tinkerbell]

54 minutes ago, Sterling said:

As for Hannah and this particular episode, I think her hurt was that, instead of focusing on her, these guys are fighting with each other.  She'd like the focus to be on how, or why, they are the best candidate for her, not try and settle their issues with Luke.  I get it from the guys' standpoint:  Hey, don't lie to my face and tell me you didn't bring my name up, when clearly you did.  And I get it from hers:  I'm here to find my future husband, not all this middle school B.S.

Are they really going to sit and talk with each other about that?  Her big reprimand was when she was eavesdropping on their conversation - a bunch of guys in the room talking to each other.  Is the expectation that they will be presenting their case to EACH OTHER about who is best for Hannah?   The whole thing is set up as a competition.  How do guys compete without arguing? 

I disagree with the characterization of this as "middle school BS".  Adults assert themselves and confront bad behavior.  It's not inherently bad to have an argument, or to call someone out on their lies.  

[Jax7917]

11 minutes ago, tinkerbell said:

Are they really going to sit and talk with each other about that?  Her big reprimand was when she was eavesdropping on their conversation - a bunch of guys in the room talking to each other.  Is the expectation that they will be presenting their case to EACH OTHER about who is best for Hannah?   The whole thing is set up as a competition.  How do guys compete without arguing? 

I disagree with the characterization of this as "middle school BS".  Adults assert themselves and confront bad behavior.  It's not inherently bad to have an argument, or to call someone out on their lies.  

Not to mention, Hannah was as middle school as you can get during Colton's season. She only got the title as bachelorette because of the drama she caused on her season. She might not have liked Caelynn ahead of time, but Caelynn didn't do a thing to her during that season so there was no reason for Hannah to be so all over her. She has a very short memory.

[AuntieDiane6]

Quote

Chris Harrison has been dating Lauren Zima from Entertainment tonight, for a quite a while. 

Plenty of longterm girlfriends have been dumped for the pretty young thing...

[JenLily]

2 hours ago, jade.black said:

My favorite moment (thank you, editors!) was at the rose ceremony when Garrett's talking head went "I feel like this was mostly my fault" and then immediate cut to Luke's talking head going, "This was 100% Garrett's fault." Dying.

I totally forgot about that! It was genius editing. I actually choked on my water. 😂

[JudyObscure]

3 hours ago, deSchenke said:

Luke displays traits of a Narcissist.

I looked up those traits:

Narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) involves a pattern of self-centered, arrogant thinking and behavior, a lack of empathy and consideration for other people, and an excessive need for admiration. Sometimes including patronizing behavior.

Sure sounds like our bossy, pageant girl to me.

[dirtypop90]

3 hours ago, Sterling said:

As for Hannah and this particular episode, I think her hurt was that, instead of focusing on her, these guys are fighting with each other.  She'd like the focus to be on how, or why, they are the best candidate for her, not try and settle their issues with Luke.  

The problem with this is that you need both parties engaged to form a relationship, to be able to learn things about each other and decide if you'r compatible.  The show can't just be guys pleading their case to Hannah.  The guys also need Hannah engaged and sharing things about her with them.  It's like she's expecting audition tapes for her to flip through when she's not focused on Luke.

[dirtypop90]

2 hours ago, Jaclyn88 said:

 Hannah lectures the guys as if she's their teacher and she cries during every group interaction with them. There's noo way most of them are interested in her. In real life, they would have never given her a text back. She's attractive, but girls got issues.

100% true.  I don't believe any guy is seriously interested in marrying Hannah except Luke, maaaybe Peter.  The rest...no way, after what she's showed them.

I love my Tyler but his little speech to the guys about them being the problem and ruining her last day in Scotland was...well...fake.  He's seems like a laid-back, drama-free guy.  No way he's not thinking she has issues.  No way he wouldn't run from her in the real world.  JMO  But he's in the bubble.

[nutty1]

6 minutes ago, dirtypop90 said:

I love my Tyler but his little speech to the guys about them being the problem and ruining her last day in Scotland was...well...fake.  He's seems like a laid-back, drama-free guy.  No way he's not thinking she has issues.  No way he wouldn't run from her in the real world.  JMO  But he's in the bubble.

That last sentence. The root of many problems with this franchise!

[nlkm9]

1 hour ago, JudyObscure said:

I looked up those traits:

Narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) involves a pattern of self-centered, arrogant thinking and behavior, a lack of empathy and consideration for other people, and an excessive need for admiration. Sometimes including patronizing behavior.

Sure sounds like our bossy, pageant girl to me.

to be fair, she is starring in a show all about her, broadcast to millions, a show ostensibly about 25 men who come on the show and are all interested in her. Thats pretty heady stuff.

[Biosynth]

She spent a good part of an episode berating Luke to talk to her about his likes, such as Mac and Cheese vs. Spaghetti and Meatballs, and then this episode she yelled at the guys for talking about useless things.  What the heck, Hannah? 

Also, I really hate Luke.  But you know he's going to go off and meet the parents.