S08.E11: The Proposal

[Bavct]

I teared up at the song and the adorkable way the proposal came out - even Jill's "yes...totally". 

 

I was a little disheartened to see Derick's brother with a "date" in one of the photos they showed, I was hoping he could be for Jana.  I felt so sad for her when it was her and Joy talking about the engagement "date" - she has to have some happiness for herself soon. 

 

Derick's mother seems like she will be a great influence on Jill as a role model, I did laugh when all we saw of the step-father was a rattling of a newspaper in the background.  I really think he is not happy with the TV show part of this relationship.

 

I really think that Jill's wedding is going to hit Jim Bob pretty hard, it's obvious that he loves his kids and he will have a hard time letting go of his girls.  I'll bet we get a lot of tears at Jill's wedding from him. 

[Fuzzysox]

Did you guys notice the sweet picture of Cathy and Jill at the end of the show? Seems like Cathy has already claimed Jill as her daughter. RUN Jill run into Derick's family. They seem normal! You'll have a wonderful life once your married!

[questionfear]

 

And JB, can't you come out and say that Derick has a degree and ask him what his job will be ....on camera????? Can't get shown up, huh? Geez.

I wondered if Walmart didn't want their name listed, or, more likely, TLC wasn't name dropping Walmart for free. 

[EtheltoTillie]

My guess is Derick is not allowed to mention wal mart on the show. I would guess that's wal mart's stipulation.

Edited June 4, 2014 by GussieK

[BitterApple]

Derick may not be allowed to mention Wal-mart. On Wheel of Fortune a few days ago there was a contestant who worked "for a beverage company in Atlanta." Obviously she worked for Coke, but for whatever reason couldn't say so.

The framed pic of Jill and Cathy was really cute.

[truebluesmoky]

It has to do with advertising. If Wheel of Fortune doesn't have Coke as an advertiser and/or especially has Pepsi as an advertiser, mentioning Coke would be like a free commercial. If 19K&C doesn't have Walmart as a sponsor and/or especially has a store like Target as a sponsor, same deal.

[sheshark]

I enjoyed this episode although I was distracted by a houseguest and a phone call.  I definitely think Jill had an inkling, as I have never noticed her with quite the perfect manicure as she had last night.  When Derick "side-hugged" (yech) her, it looked like he was going to kiss the top of her head at least twice. As he may have with another girlfriend in the past.  I wish them the best, and am thinking this loosening of  rules will only help the Dugg's disassociate from the disgraced Gothard.

[leighroda]

The other thing I thought was odd was when josh went to tell his dad that Michael was sick, Jim-bobs first reaction was "so Anna is going to stay here with him", it makes sense that the mom would stay, but I don't know just the assumption that it would be her and not even "so one of you" would stay back bothered me.

[sunrisepink]

Derrick's proposal was sweet but I was snapped back to Duggar reality as soon as I heard Jill's "yes, totally!" It's just unbelievable that at the time of filming these two are set to be married in 3 months. They are so naive and emotionally stunted. And to go from just side hugs and holding hands to living together and performing the "marital act" on the regular..how can they be ready? Allowing affection to naturally develop in a relationship serves an important function in my opinion.

 

I had a different reaction to Michelle's "I see hand holding!" announcement when Jill and Derrick got back to the compound. I thought she was still experiencing PTSD from the full frontal hug at the airport and had a mini heart attack when she thought they might be breaking yet another courtship rule on camera.

[Readalot]

Michelle is a bitch. Although we can't expect anything different how much would it have hurt her to keep her mouth shut when Dill came in to announce their engagement. For one minute, let a daughter have the spotlight! She gives mothers a bad name. She needs some intense mental counseling.

[Adeejay]

I like Jill and Derick.  And I liked that he asked for Jinger and JoyAnna to go along as chaperones.

 

Actually, the chaperones were Jana and JoyAnna.  I thought it interesting that Derick said he specifically asked for those two.  

[RazzleberryPie]

Who goes wedding dress shopping at 3 months, I was surprised/relieved that Jessa didn't partake in the wedding dress shopping... Someone had some sense.

Yes! We all move at different paces, but I liked that Jessa was like, no ring = no dress show.

Josie ain't right. I don't know if she is delayed/ challenged, feral/howlette or just weird. That talking head with her sisters talking, then her swatting fake flies, staring at her hands, then gulping them, was not normal.

God help me but she reminds me of those SNL skits with the Fake Lawrence Welk Sisters who are all beautiful and sing, then the weird youngest sister comes out with the doll hands and does something bizarre.

[wanderwoman]

Ok. Here we go.

The Good

1. The proposal was very sweet.  I thought the song was very sweet and reflective of their relationship. I think Derek was nervous, thus the mush mouth, but he really does love Jill - you can tell.  I totally thought Jill wanted to kiss him soooooooo bad! You could read it in her eyes.  I truly wanted them to just do it.

2. The ring was nice.  

3. Girlfriend definitely got a better proposal than Anna.

4. LOVE Derek's mom's attitude and relationship with her son.  Comparing that to the weird ass vibe Michelle gave Josh during his courting/engagement throws the family dynamic into sharp contrast.

 

THE BAD

1. What the heck was with Jill's comment about "marrying tomorrow wouldn't be a very good testimony"?  It saddens me that all if their choices are assessed on a "what would make for a better story in church circles".    

2. Jim Bob asking about Derek's finances was lame.  JB claims that he vested Derek before he introduced him to Jill.  You can't tell me that there was no discussion about Derek's ability to provide prior to that couch scene.  

3.  It really bugged me that Michelle spoiled the announcement with her big mouth about hand holding.  Further evidence that she is self centered and phony.  Ridiculous that, choice or not, two twenty something people are "taking a big step" by holding hands.  

4. Wedding dress shopping.  Nuff' said.

.

[NCChic]

I know that Michelle has already used up the NY Say Yes to the Dress episode, but I would love for Jill to be on the Atlanta version. Bring on the Monty and Laurie snark!!

[Howyougetthegirl91]

I thought the proposal was sweet. Jill and Derick seem happy. I did find it laughable when Jill said it felt like she was waiting a long time. Jill IMO went into that courtship instantly wanting an engagement. I feel like she felt 3 months was a long time , which is ridiculous IMO.

[Adeejay]

Considering that Jill and Derick aren't even allowed to hold hands, the three months courtship probably felt like a lifetime.  At one point, they looked as if they wanted to kiss.   Had they been allowed to "date" like normal people, I don't think they would be rushing to the altar.  I am surprised that there weren't any "Bin" sightings.  And given that Jessa was so adamantly about not trying on a wedding dress, I have a feeling they've hit a speed bump. 

[riverblue22]

When Derrick and his mom hugged, I thought "now that is what a mom/son hug should be".  None of this uncomfortable looking side hugging JB and Michelle do with their children.  How on earth can they find anything sexual about frontal hugs among family members?

 

 

 

       I was watching an older episode this morning where Anna and Smuggar went to visit Anna's parents in Florida.  Side hugs all around!  It just looked so stupid to be side-hugging your Mom and Dad.

[Howyougetthegirl91]

Considering that Jill and Derick aren't even allowed to hold hands, the three months courtship probably felt like a lifetime.  At one point, they looked as if they wanted to kiss.   Had they been allowed to "date" like normal people, I don't think they would be rushing to the altar.  I am surprised that there weren't any "Bin" sightings.  And given that Jessa was so adamantly about not trying on a wedding dress, I have a feeling they've hit a speed bump.

I have thought about that. Such strict rules basically forces them(in lack of a better term) to get married as soon possible. Which is sad IMO. However I do think they seem happy. Jessa on the other hand doesn't seem to care either way too much. Right now IMO she seems happy helping Jill along with her wedding instead , lol.

[Almost 3000]

Duggars way of life is Yourself first, Others last, and no one after. It's all about the fame for them. Why would anyone care about Michael? He's over the age that J'Chelle cares about. Maybe Anna is going down the same road. 

Yep, I've always felt they miss the point and fail miserably at living and or even representing the whole J.O.Y. thing they themselves promote.

[3 is enough]

 

Interesting fact, Boob bought the place in 2012 for $95k (on 20 acres!), renovated, and put it back on the market for $1.5 mil. No takers, so it was off the market 6 months after it was put up for sale.

Seriously?  Is rural land in Northwest Arkansas that expensive?  1.5 MILLION????  Guess old Jim Bob figures people will pay a premium to own DUGGAR property.  Yeah, right.

 

Happy for Jill.  Hope she can have some semblance of a normal life.

 

 

God help me but she reminds me of those SNL skits with the Fake Lawrence Welk Sisters who are all beautiful and sing, then the weird youngest sister comes out with the doll hands and does something bizarre.

 

Nearly spit tea all over the keyboard of my new laptop!  Guess I am truly evil but it is so true!  How sad. Josie needs intervention.  Three years ago.  Poor kid, she doesn't stand a chance.  And, some poor J'slave will be forced to care for her for the rest of her life. That's tragic in itself.

Edited June 4, 2014 by 3 is enough

[Sew Sumi]

I also wondered why Josh and Anna were siting on the sofa in this episode. It looked like they live around the corner and popped in, instead of fifteen hours away. Seriously, has Smuggar ever worked an entire week? He's only been working there a year, and you don't (or the rest of us) don't get weeks and weeks of vacation time at first.

It was a Sunday and there was some big fundie protest that weekend (forget the issue, but there's only a couple that drive the Duggars). I guess Smuggles did a two-fer, knowing TLC's filming schedule. I imagine he wrote the trip off. Lazy fuck.

[Absolom]

And the ratings went up again! 3.034 M viewers and a 1.0 rating. I think that's the best ever for a Duggar episode.

[FairyDusted]

Best part of the episode for me was Jill running and real hugging her man. Bells and lights and all. AWESOME! It soooo looked liked He kissed her head a few times. And she sure wanted to kiss him. Go Jill!

 

The Bad...Hand sex is back.*shudder*

[Mrsjumbo]

Yes! We all move at different paces, but I liked that Jessa was like, no ring = no dress show.

Josie ain't right. I don't know if she is delayed/ challenged, feral/howlette or just weird. That talking head with her sisters talking, then her swatting fake flies, staring at her hands, then gulping them, was not normal.

God help me but she reminds me of those SNL skits with the Fake Lawrence Welk Sisters who are all beautiful and sing, then the weird youngest sister comes out with the doll hands and does something bizarre.

This made me LOL & I have a special needs kid!

I agree there is something wrong with Josie & I can't believe she is not getting services. I live in NW Arkansas too, & my DS has been getting therapies since age 2.

About Walmart- funny they can't mention it since the proposal on the square was right in front of the striped awning of the Walmart Museum, LOL!

One question- it was mentioned earlier about them finding kittens. Can you tell me about this? We adopted a baby orange tabby a yr ago & at the shelter they told us a Duggar dropped him off.

[jb0495]

Where are you all seeing the girls Pinterest accounts? Are they listed under different names?

[Sew Sumi]

Pinterest has locked down its search feature, but I found Jill's beforehand:

 

http://www.pinterest.com/ipreferatext/

 

She's obviously looking at mint green/seafoam for her bridesmaids.

 

I haven't seen a Pinterest from either Jessa or "the girls," but a couple of the Bates girls have them (but should be posted on the right thread).

Edited June 4, 2014 by Sew Sumi

[drafan]

I wondered if Walmart didn't want their name listed, or, more likely, TLC wasn't name dropping Walmart for free. 

 

The (scripted) conversation could've gone something like this (without mentioning Walmart) :

 

JB: So, Derick, you graduated from college a couple of years ago.... now that you're back from Nepal, do you have any job prospects?

Derick: Well, yes, I have a bachelor of science in accounting and I've recently been offered a job in my field.

 

Of course, JB's ego is too big for this. And then he'd have to make a joke that Derick won't be a bachelor anymore. And of course, the word 'science' scares him. And then maybe he'd say, "Yes, all we Duggar men work hard out in the field." Hardy, har, har. (Green-toothed laugh)  So, no.

 

Loved that JoyAnna was wearing spandex capris under her skirt. I think she is adorable. Hope they don't send her off to Weight Watchers because she's not stick-thin. Also noticed that the little girls were wearing some form of stretch pajama pants in the hotel scene. And speaking of that...the howler girls are so wild that they  have to wear bike pants under their dresses....so it's basically pants but with a longer top. Another rule stretched. LOL

 

I got the impression that the NYC bridal salon was beneath Jessa.....she already knows what she wants and it ain't at that place. And she probably fears that Mullett will force her into a Princess Diana dress. 

Edited June 4, 2014 by drafan

[Sew Sumi]

The kitten house was purchased in 2012, so not the same babies. I'm sure there are plenty of cats on the property. Obviously, there are dogs; three or four bowls were lined up next to the front door in the shot when Derick showed up to ask for Jill's hand. They have the money; they should pony up and get some of these animals fixed, especially if their only care is some food and water, but not shelter or any real human contact.

[BitterApple]

When Jessa and Jill were having a friendly squabble over who would try on the dress, I clearly heard Jessa say "YOU'RE the one getting married first so YOU do it!" So either the timeline was wonky or Jill knew about the proposal way in advance and everything on the episode was staged nonsense.

I also hope they don't make Joy go to WW. She has a beautiful curvy figure, she doesn't need to lose any weight.

Does anyone know if Anna is a bridesmaid? It doesn't seem like she's all that close to the J'Slaves, but I can see Jill including her out of obligation.

[DangerousMinds]

What bugged me about the 3 month thing is that I believe, they were saying Jill/Derrick had been courting for 3 months.  But they've been talking every day via phone/skype much longer than that.  Granted, still quick by today's standards.  But none of these girls are going to have three year courtships followed by year long engagements. 

 

I love how the two of them looked like they were barely able to keep themselves from kissing/hugging during the song.  So sweet.  But goodness you two, get a room with that hand holding! I don't know what it is about the Duggars and the hand holding, but I felt this way about Josh/Anna too.  It seems so intimate.  Like I feel like I'm violating their privacy watching them hold hands. 

I'm also pretty sure that of the 3 months of "courtship," that 2 of those months (60 days!) took place while he was still in Nepal. So only 1 month of actual, in-person dating (accompanied at all times by chaperones).

[surgeprotector]

Relieved I'm not the only one who feels pervy watching their fervent handclutching.

Greater transgression...holding hands as Jill drives off in Nepal or frontal hug at ARK airport?

No matter, Derick put a ring on it...yes, I went there.

[parisprincess]

I had a different reaction to Michelle's "I see hand holding!" announcement when Jill and Derrick got back to the compound. I thought she was still experiencing PTSD from the full frontal hug at the airport and had a mini heart attack when she thought they might be breaking yet another courtship rule on camera.

 

Jill called and basically told the family to gather because they were coming home with big news, so I'm sure Michelle was expecting an engagement announcement.  There was no reason for her to open her big mouth but, as usual, Michelle didn't care about anyone but herself.

[RazzleberryPie]

This made me LOL & I have a special needs kid!

I agree there is something wrong with Josie & I can't believe she is not getting services. I live in NW Arkansas too, & my DS has been getting therapies since age 2.

About Walmart- funny they can't mention it since the proposal on the square was right in front of the striped awning of the Walmart Museum, LOL!

One question- it was mentioned earlier about them finding kittens. Can you tell me about this? We adopted a baby orange tabby a yr ago & at the shelter they told us a Duggar dropped him off.

I wish they would realize there is no shame in a child having special or extra needs. There is shame, however, in ignoring needs AND shame in creating behavioral issues AKA Howler Manners. Plus the pretend fly gulping was just bizarre in the middle of a conversation.

[bigskygirl]

Mullet does not want to accept her daughter or any of her children have special needs. She is the bestest mother out there, and she can takes wonderful care of them in Duggar land.

[BitterApple]

I agree there's nothing to be ashamed of when it comes to special needs. I have a cousin who had a severe speech impediment as a child. His parents sought early intervention and now at 20 you would never guess he had a prior issue.

If they don't want to advertise Josie's delays, fine, but at least get the poor kid help.

[Chicklet]

Oh god I'm so glad someone else saw the Lawrence Welk in Josie. I just was waiting for the bubbles.

And what was wrong with her hair in the end segment, it looked like it hadn't been brushed in weeks. 

So will Josie and Jana be the only ones left in that house after Jblob and Mullet die? Poor Jana.

[mythoughtis]

The proposal was nice (sweet, there I said it).  Jill was expecting it, because they had probably been discussing the possibility just like normal couples do.  Very few  men are going to propose unless they have an inkling the woman will be saying yes.   I have to sound off like everyone else that Michelle couldn't just BE QUIET and let Derick and Jill make their announcement.  I gagged when Derick and Jill commented that they 'had gotten permission' to hold hands now.... aren't they the ones making their courtship rules?  But, of course, we know they aren't. 

The wedding dress staged event was sad, neither Jill nor Jessa wanted to try on the dresses (who doesn't want to try on wedding dresses?  Jessa was superstitious (kind of odd for a fundy ... wouldn't that be blasphemy of a sort?).  I think it was an attempt to include the audience in seeing Jill in a wedding dress, and that the actual wedding dress purchase will not be televised. 

Loved, loved seeing Derick and his Mom.  Such natural closeness, she wore pants, and acted like a MOM who knew her son and wanted to make him less nervous.  I saw no advice like that for Josh when he was going to ask Anna to marry him.

There is (IMO) something wrong with Josie, maybe on the autism scale.  What was all that fake fly routine, and  then eating same?   She's old enough now to know better than that in a TH segment.  Of course, Jana must not have been present.

Jim Bob is such a bad actor.  He knew very well that Derick had a job offer, and was taking it.  That would have already been one of the group texts/phone calls. 

Edited June 5, 2014 by mythoughtis

[Mrsjumbo]

Mullet does not want to accept her daughter or any of her children have special needs. She is the bestest mother out there, and she can takes wonderful care of them in Duggar land.  

 

Kind of reminds me of John Travolta & Kelly Preston & their son who died at 16, & they never acknowledged his autism publicly until he was gone.

Edited June 5, 2014 by Rhondinella
combined two posts

[Howyougetthegirl91]

On a side note , I love the new hair style Jessa had in this episode. I thought it looked really beautiful on her.

[Ripley68]

Who pays for the chaperones meals and other things on these chaperoned dates?

[RazzleberryPie]

Who pays for the chaperones meals and other things on these chaperoned dates?

I never thought of it, but it would be really expensive to pay for meals for you, your date and two others everytime you wanted to eat.

[ghoulina]

I have to say, I'm very grateful for the timing of these relationships. I'd much rather have courtship-based episodes than watch the Duggars book tour ad nauseam. Can you imagine??? And if this tour was for the older girls' book, why did the entire family need to come along anyway? Especially Josh and his clan. Sheesh. 

 

I thought it was adorable that Derick was doing his hair the way he knew Jill liked it. But at the same time it creeped me out a bit, with her encouragement of hairspray. I instantly have Boob flashbacks and fear for the ozone layer. 

 

It makes me really mad that Jill needs a chaperone for her freaking proposal! Good grief. But the way he did it - that song - gah, I started crying. What a softie I am! I just love seeing how much thought he put into it, to make it special for her. I love seeing Jill so happy. These poor girls have been slaves since they could see over the kitchen counter, so it's nice seeing something be about them and not their parents or younger siblings. 

 

It does annoy me, though, how they always say - "we thought about it and discussed it and decided hand holding was okay for this stage". Oh please. If this was something that was really up for discussion, we might see just ONE kid veering from the norm. But we don't. Well, except for that impromptu full-frontal hug. More of those, please! That proposal would have been a lot better with more body contact. Oh, and anyone notice that Michelle immediately picked up on them holding hands when they came in the door. She really is the defrauding police, aint she? 

Edited June 5, 2014 by ghoulina

[bigskygirl]

Did Derick really put the proposal together by himself or did TLC and JimBoob have a hand in it? At least, it was better than what Anna got.

[Fostersmom]

I don't remember Josh/Anna's proposal, but I remember him asking Anna to court in that cheesy restaurant (or was that the proposal?) and I'm going to actually defend Josh here. While Jill's proposal was nice, and fairly low key in what I've seen on fundy blogs, what Josh planned was much more realistic and normal here in the non-fundy world, taste in restaurants notwithstanding. From the looks of some of these courtship requests and then proposals, it's ridiculous and over the top (I'm looking at you, Bates girls) and sets up a weird competitive thing. Every request has to be bigger and grander than the last and honestly, it kind of weirds me out, the intense importance they put on the courtship requests and proposals. God forbid it's not some huge orchestrated event. 

 

I'm sure TLC had a hand in this, and Jill obviously dressed for the event. Too bad she defrauded everyone with her see thru skirt! LOL! 

[gunderda]

I think Josh surprising Anna in the restaurant was for the courtship.  But now I'm doubting my memory.

[Fostersmom]

I think it was for the courtship, but I have no memory of his proposal, so maybe we didn't see the proposal? 

[BitterApple]

Fostersmom, it was the proposal that took place in that oh-so-klassy swamp restaurant with the ceramic alligators and plastic menus.

The Bateses' proposals were ridiculously over the top. Broadway musicals have less bells and whistles. I totally agree these girls are super competitive. "Oh, he took you for a carriage ride? Well MY guy rented out a theme park, brought in a twenty piece orchestra, ten elephants and juggling midgets! Sucks to be you."

Jill's proposal was sweet, if not a tad awkward. The real, epic snarkfest will take place when Bin proposes to Jessa.

[PinkSprinkles]

No, he surprised her on her birthday with a proposal. 

 

She said she didn't want to get engaged until she was 20 years old so Josh flew down on her birthday and proposed to her at that tacky Gator Landing restaurant. Anna's parents walked away when Josh came out carrying balloons and wishing her happy birthday, which freaked Anna out. Josh then told her to he wanted to ask her something and then proposed while Anna said yes in a less than convincing manner. After she said yes the film crew came out which freaked her out more. Then we were treated to a snarky waitress saying that while it was sweet, people were trying to eat! 

 

I also think this is the episode where people really started calling Josh by the 'smuggar' moniker because he came as off as a know-it-all about relationships and kept stressing how pure he wanted to be and how great their relationship was. Everyone at the time knew he was a phony because everyone found out he had a prior courtship that failed (someone on TWOP asked Amy and Amy confirmed it). Not to mention that their every move was monitored and they gave us some of the most uncomfortable scenes in television history. I swear, the handsex needs to be blurred if they re-air those episodes. 

[ginger90]

I seem to recall Josh had other plans for the proposal. I think the weather wasn't cooperating.

[PinkSprinkles]

When my husband proposed to me he did it in a secluded area in a  park we went on walks in. He knew I didn't want a huge orchestration and wanted it to be a private moment between just the two of us. I don't understand why these things have to be so detailed and ornate. You would think these girls would take the private moment alone with NO CHAPERONES over the huge blow-outs with every family member and a film crew present. 

 

Then again, my parents had the utmost trust and faith in myself and my now spouse that we knew what to do concerning our relationship. We didn't have to answer to a chaperone or overbearing parents and were able to have private conversations and develop a sound trust in one another that we couldn't have done with eyes watching. That's why I can't believe they allow this courtship model to go on. It protects you from nothing. If anything, it allows for deception. 

I seem to recall Josh had other plans for the proposal. I think the weather wasn't cooperating.

Yes, he planned on proposing on the outside deck area of the restaurant. Then it started to rain so they moved it inside.