S35.E05: The Past Will Eat You Alive

[blackwing]

Ryan is a weak physical player but I do admit that he must have a social game, because that saved both him and Chrissy.  Ryan's ineptitude at the reward challenge was costly.  The blue tribe not only got to fill their bellies with pastries, which gave them a good sugar boost, but also got supplies for making coffee and tea going forward.  That's huge.  If they were smart they would have saved some of the pastries to ration for a few days.  The red tribe got a bottle of iced coffee which they probably all drank right away, but they still got an energy boost.

So then we get to the immunity challenge, which for Yellow was all on the arms and back of JP.  I'm still trying to figure out when they fell so far behind, because I thought they were the first ones to get their first rice bag through the hole?  I could have sworn Jeff said they made quick work of it, while some other tribe was struggling.  Wasn't JP the first one on the balance beam?   All of a sudden, they were then in dead last.  He must have gotten tired.  I'm sure he would have appreciated a cup of coffee consumed just before the challenge to give him some extra pep.

Chrissy's stubbornness and passive aggressiveness lost them the immunity challenge.  She blamed the balance beam, but I didn't see any other person falling off.  She just sucked at maneuvering the ropes and was pulling too much which got her off balance.  I don't understand why all the teams kept rotating people.  After one person got the hang of it, as Jeff said there is a learning curve, why not have that person keep going?  Instead Dame Chrissy seems to have deemed that it was "her" role and that Ali only was temporarily taking over and then was expected to relinquish it back to the queen.  As soon as she fell off the second time and couldn't blame her shoes, she should have stepped away.  She asked if anyone else wanted to try but she never put the handles down, she should have said "someone else needs to try" and not "oh I'll keep going if no one else wants to, as long as you all remember that I offered and no one wanted to".  I can't stand passive aggressive behaviour, and she is a prime example.

I don't understand why Ryan is so loyal to Chrissy.  He doesn't need her.  He seems to be smart enough to make the strategic decisions.  Why would he want to partner up with someone who is also strategic?  What he needs are loyal henchmen.  He had a good relationship with Ali, and he could have reached out to JP.  JP is much more likely to survive individual immunity challenges than either Ryan or Chrissy.  

I agree that the montage of Cole licking his fingers was unsightly, but again... passive aggressive behaviour from all of the others.  If they are so appalled by him, why didn't anyone say anything to him?  Lauren seems like a stereotypical passive aggressive grumpy old lady.  First she hated Patrick, now he's gone and she has turned her hate on to Cole.  She seems really intolerant of others.  Maybe the problem is her?  Maybe she dislikes the young good looking men because of her own history? She is the kind of person who is always grouchy and sullen and complains about everything and everyone.  Why even apply to Survivor is she is that intolerant of others?

This episode made me dislike Mike even more.  He referred to himself in the third person as "Dr. Mike".  Ugh.  I know Jeff calls him that, and I actually think he's doing it purposely in a patronising way.  There have been other doctors on the show before... Candice and John Cody, Peter Bilbobaggins, etc and I don't recall them getting called "Dr. John" or anything.  So now Mike thinks of himself as a character.  And I still dislike him for calling himself a "sex doctor" just to get a rise out of everyone.  

[ProfCrash]

3 minutes ago, Catronia said:

Yes! And remember when rewards used to be like a case of Mountain Dew and a couple of bags of Doritos? Or when, in Season 2, they lost their rice in a flood and that was quite literally all they had to eat? It's gotten comparatively much more luxurious these days. Survivors who made it near the end used to lose 30-40 pounds, now, often, it's less than 10. Now they're gorging themselves on pastries, and they aren't even to the merge yet. I don't necessarily want to see people starve, but they should have to work for it. It's taken a whole strategic layer out of the game -- playing the "provider" role. Now the show provides.

Plenty of people are losing a lot more then 10 pounds. The Ponderosa videos for the jury typically show people losing 20-40 pounds. There are very few people who lose 10 pounds by jury and those are normally very small women or men. I suspect that the extra food is because it would be really boring to watch people do nothing when all they have is limited rice or beans nad rice.

[NutMeg]

My theory on why Ryan chose to vote with Chrissy rather than Ali is tied to his social game, or more specifically to his stated objective to use his social game. Ali seems to be a pretty social person and had quickly built a connection to the new comer - that must have been a red flag for Ryan, who, if he had followed Ali's choice, would have kept in the game someone he had zero connection to.

I also think the fact that Chrissy was so bad in the IC helped in making him want to keep her. Just in case the merge doesn't happen soon, after he screwed up in the RC, in case tribe mates decide to go all "keep the tribe strong", she is a shield, i.e. one who can be voted off before him.  

As to why not telling Ali beforehand... WE know she was ok with Patrick being voted off, but nobody on her tribe seemed to know how close they were. So now that she seems close to Roark and is rooting for her to stay, I can see how Ryan could have thought that she would have warned her if she had known beforehand, and when a target is warned, you can easily have a situation where the fecal matter hits the moving device, which is never something you want if your aim is to minimise unknowns.  

[Ms Blue Jay]

2 hours ago, mishap said:

The hero, healers, and hustler thing really falls flat for me, in general.  Even before the mixed them, it was hard to figure why a lot of them were on their tribes. 

Every pre-Survivor season when the 'themes' are announced the fans always moan and groan because they're corny or whatever, but I always enjoy the themes and see and understand the need for them.  For me it's just marketing, something to get the fans excited, and honestly, it works on me.

However, this theme falls flat to me too. I have no idea what tribe people started on.  There's nothing about how they look that gives way to their designation.  At least with "Brains, Beauty, Brawn", one of my all time favourite seasons, you can look at most of those contestants and understand that they're supposed to be (STEREOTYPICALLY) beautiful or brawny or if neither (LOL) then brainy.  That theme was so fun and hilarious because the Brain tribe was so awful and the Brawn tribe ended up working really well together and dominating, and so on.

I have no idea who is what on this season and I don't care and the talk of loyalties upthread is super interesting but I have no idea who is on what original tribe and who is supposed to be loyal to who.  It's too bad.

[SuburbanHangSuite]

39 minutes ago, Catronia said:

Yes! And remember when rewards used to be like a case of Mountain Dew and a couple of bags of Doritos? Or when, in Season 2, they lost their rice in a flood and that was quite literally all they had to eat? It's gotten comparatively much more luxurious these days.

So luxurious that they use big-ass bags of RICE as weights in the ocean for the Immunity Challenge?!  Who thought that would be a good idea??

 "Hey, let's have the hungry (well, relatively hungry) survivors use huge, unwieldy bags of food for the challenge but it all goes to waste at the end!"  Asshole, sadistic producers.

ETA:

I didn't realize that @Lamb18 pointed that out back on page 1:

Quote

Immunity challenge: I wonder if they get to keep the rice. Maybe they'll stuff their pockets while digging through the bags. Well, I guess it's ruined after being dragged through the salt water. What a waste of food. Couldn't they use packing peanuts or something? 

Packing peanuts??  Pshaw!  Much too light, my little Lamb!   But the tremendous waste of food is unforgivable.

Edited October 26, 2017 by SuburbanHangSuite
adding stuff

[survivinmt]

I would like to think that Ryan's decision to boot Roark had a lot to do with her being a Healer. If they merge soon and are still as tight as everyone else thought they were, that is a tough group to challenge. I would have loved to have Chrissy's smug face voted off in a landslide, but no.

I also liked the explanation at TC that Alli gave about real loyalties being tested by voting. She's right - otherwise its just lip service.

I think Lauren has a decent social skills. She was completely an adult about the Ben situation. "I am coming to check on you but if you want to be left alone, I will go away." And then did! Think how many people fowl this up - Deb (water lady/gymnast/psycho) for sure would have failed on this. "Let me talk at you about my experience with people trying to kill me. They were waaaaay more serious than anything you've been through."

[Tryangle]

I don't know who I find more attractive between Desi or Ali. Dilemma.

Seriously, Joe truly is trying to be Tony 2.0. Just needs a Spy Shack and he's good to go.

The problem with Ryan is he's trying to play both sides and instead torched one of his allies. Either cut one adrift, or come clean to the ally you disagree with. That 'social game' he's all about could blow up in his face.

[iMonrey]

So there was someone named Roark? Does her father run Fantasy Island? De plane, de plane!

I feel like if they're going to use corny labels like Heroes and Healers and Hustlers they ought to stick to them and not switch them around before a merge, because I can't keep track of who's where once they do. I also can't tell the difference between JP and Cole. I'm sure I could if they were sitting side by side but at this point they're both a couple of generic himbos.

I just can't with Ryan either. I know it's shallow but he's just so weird looking, it's like somebody cut his face off just below his mouth.

Quote

I would have been disappointed either way that vote went. Two smart women going against each other, while Ryan gets to decide who goes. That sucks. 

Yeah - neither were favorites of mine but the women always seem to take each other out rather than band together. I mean - there were three of them vs. two men and unless they just landed on this planet they have to know a merge is coming up. Why not take out one of the alpha males when you have the numbers and the opportunity? Big picture, people.

[candall]

14 minutes ago, Catronia said:

Yes! And remember when rewards used to be like a case of Mountain Dew and a couple of bags of Doritos? Or when, in Season 2, they lost their rice in a flood and that was quite literally all they had to eat? It's gotten comparatively much more luxurious these days. Survivors who made it near the end used to lose 30-40 pounds, now, often, it's less than 10. Now they're gorging themselves on pastries, and they aren't even to the merge yet. I don't necessarily want to see people starve, but they should have to work for it.  It's taken a whole strategic layer out of the game -- playing the "provider" role. Now the show provides.

 

9 minutes ago, ProfCrash said:

Plenty of people are losing a lot more then 10 pounds. The Ponderosa videos for the jury typically show people losing 20-40 pounds. There are very few people who lose 10 pounds by jury and those are normally very small women or men. I suspect that the extra food is because it would be really boring to watch people do nothing when all they have is limited rice or beans nad rice.

It wasn't boring back then.  Maybe there's a benefit to the show that players are perkier for being fed, but that means they've lost a number of other elements.  As Catronia mentioned, "providing" was a valuable skill and warranted consideration.  Who cares if Ozzy can scamper up a coconut palm when there are leftover muffins available?  With rewards, people would have to plan ahead and think about who was going to be full of food and operating at full strength for challenges vs. who was going to be hungry and enervated.  You could really screw your tribe if you tampered with the rice supply.

I liked it when the rice was precious and the promise of a spoonful of peanut butter was enough incentive to make you drop out of a challenge.  To me, it was a better show when "surviving" referred to more than making strong alliances and avoiding betrayal.

I understand that Big Brother also once had a strong "Have Not" element of deprivation, which is barely mentioned anymore.  Interesting.  So talk, talk, talk, and then the scheming is interrupted by crazy challenges, either in a locked house or on an island.  But I must be in the minority, because I guess they're giving the viewers what they want, right?

I still watch.  : )

[ProfCrash]

16 minutes ago, candall said:

It wasn't boring back then.  Maybe there's a benefit to the show that players are perkier for being fed, but that means they've lost a number of other elements.  As Catronia mentioned, "providing" was a valuable skill and warranted consideration.  Who cares if Ozzy can scamper up a coconut palm when there are leftover muffins available?  With rewards, people would have to plan ahead and think about who was going to be full of food and operating at full strength for challenges vs. who was going to be hungry and enervated.  You could really screw your tribe if you tampered with the rice supply.

Ozzy was voted out even when he was the provider because no one wanted to deal with him going on a competition streak. Honestly, I don't know of too many people who have gone far in the game as the "provider" because most people are willing to go hungry for a few days in order to win the game. So vote out the dude who is winning points by bringing in food. People drop out of Survivor for food still. There is always one comp were they ask people to eat or play and a good number o people eat. The reward challenges are still fought over because the people want the food.

I don't think that they have too much food. They all lose weight, they are all hungry. They might not be as hungry as they were in the day but they are still plenty hungry. Africa was a boring ass season because they couldn't go any where due to the threat of an animal attack and they were so hungry. Watching the tribe suffer in Australia was not fun. They traded in Colby's giant flag for the rice.  They eat better now but the amount of food that they are getting is still far less then we get on a regular basis. Now there is a bit more activity at camp to follow and the challenges move a bit better and people are still very, very hungry.

The food element on Big Brother was great, I have no idea why they went away from it. They had competitions to win food for the week. The Have Not thing is kind of done because it is mainly boring and people flat out volunteer for it or end up as Have Nots because they are in the opposing alliance. I suspect that the competitions cost is the reason why they get rid of the food comps because CBS is cheap and they want to save money when they can.

To each their own, I prefer them to not look like skeletons at the end of the season, I think it looks gross and makes me worry.

[Rachel RSL]

1 hour ago, Nashville said:

If you're looking for any kind of natural setting where there aren't bugs, then I'm afraid you're on the wrong planet.  :D

Which is why I said it was reason #849567372 I could never go on Survivor :)

But, seriously though, I understand there are bugs out there but that doesn't mean you have to purposely let them crawl around on your face or in your hair.

[mishap]

Regarding the sand, I couldn't believe how it was all around some of their eyes, and they didn't seem to notice.  Sand in the eyes is a bad deal, but maybe they are so used to feeling grubby it doesn't bother them.  Had it been me, i would have found the nearest body of water and rinsed it all off. 

[Special K]

9 minutes ago, mishap said:

Regarding the sand, I couldn't believe how it was all around some of their eyes, and they didn't seem to notice.  Sand in the eyes is a bad deal, but maybe they are so used to feeling grubby it doesn't bother them.  Had it been me, i would have found the nearest body of water and rinsed it all off. 

Didn't someone once get med-evaced for a sand injury to the eye?  Shamir, was it?

[Rachel RSL]

Yep, Shamar in Fans vs Favourites

[BarneySays]

8 hours ago, himela said:

Chrissy's teeth are annoyingly white. Other than that, do arrogant people realize they are arrogant? How can she not see how unlikeable she is saying that Roark is not smart and that she is outsmarting the smarty pants? I mean, come on, you are 45 years old, grow up! Mean girl detected!

Chrissy is only 45?  Wow.  She must have had a hard paper route.  I thought she was at least 10 years older.  She looks and acts it. 

I found Roark fascinating to look at and to try to figure out.  My interest was piqued, but I also knew she was going home (who didn't?).

Why do the weasel-looking guys always act weaselly?

I found this a dull, predictable episode in a season of dull, predictable episodes.  I watch mostly out of boredom, but I'm losing the battle.

Edited October 26, 2017 by BarneySays

[ghoulina]

1 hour ago, survivinmt said:

I would like to think that Ryan's decision to boot Roark had a lot to do with her being a Healer. If they merge soon and are still as tight as everyone else thought they were, that is a tough group to challenge. I would have loved to have Chrissy's smug face voted off in a landslide, but no.

That's a good point. They still had 6 going into this swap. Given how well they were doing at challenges, one might think they were a pretty cohesive unit too. I just wish we could have seen more of Ryan's thought process going into TC. 

 

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

Yeah - neither were favorites of mine but the women always seem to take each other out rather than band together. I mean - there were three of them vs. two men and unless they just landed on this planet they have to know a merge is coming up. Why not take out one of the alpha males when you have the numbers and the opportunity? Big picture, people.

I just really really wanted to see Ali and Roark work together. But there was no way Chrissy was going to be a part of that. I'm probably being totally judgmental here, but she strikes me as the type who likes to be the only girl in a group. 

[BarneySays]

1 hour ago, candall said:

I liked it when the rice was precious and the promise of a spoonful of peanut butter was enough incentive to make you drop out of a challenge.  To me, it was a better show when "surviving" referred to more than making strong alliances and avoiding betrayal.

Agreed.  There's very little "surviving" these days.  It's just people yacking in an exotic setting- and the same one repeatedly at this point. 

[piequinn35]

Jessica knew that the HII was found near the well (Cole told her) and she told that to Mike which was a bad decision, she could have found the HII for herself. (Hustler's beach)

Joe's HII was found in the Healer's beach, would the show put it back in the Healer's beach? Why Joe did not look for another HII in the Heroes' beach? Maybe next ep?

[piequinn35]

Quote

Reality TV World: Was there any talk of hidden Immunity Idols or did anyone go off looking for one? I'm wondering if there was any suspicion an idol might be played heading into Tribal Council. 

Roark Luskin: Oh yeah, that's a good question! So when we showed up for the Reward Challenge, Jeff asked [Ashley Nolan] how Tribal had gone, and she said, "It was a really long night. It was a really crazy night. Some things happened that we didn't anticipate, and it got crazy." 

And so I'm like, "Alright, [Joe Mena] played that idol, definitely." It had been very obvious from what was said that the idol had been played, and I knew it was the "Soko" idol. 

And so, being a fan, I had to assume that it had been re-set on "Soko" beach. When you're with five people and those other people can deduce that an idol is in play, no one is alone, ever. No one had time to go look for that idol. I did not have time, Ryan did not have time, Ali did not have time, and Chrissy did not have time. JP looked for coconuts... 

Seriously they didn't have time? lol and JP looked for coconuts :D

[Jobiska]

I thought Cole was using his fingers to wipe out the last of a jelly jar, not peanut butter.  Which:  even grosser.  Jelly makes more sense as part of one of those sadistic goes-right-through-you rewards.

I don't care if they get fed more; I never want to see a contestant's hair fall out from malnutrition (Elisabeth Filarski) or learn that after the show they caught themselves secretly wanting to hoard food in their apartment (Yul) again.  I kind of look forward to seeing them put the fancy china to mundane uses like scoops or suchlike.

I don't mind Mike, and good for him for persisting and finding the idol.  I still like Ryan and assume his choice was to cut down the original Healer numbers, and that he feels he can talk Ali around, and I hope he can.  

I'm sure Ben knows people have PTSD for all sorts of reasons but he was speaking of a subset, triggered by things that remind one of combat.  I'm sure he wouldn't deny the experience of others if asked.  He seems reasonable.

I think they did the seawater rice at least once before as a challenge.  

More cute flying foxes, yay!  I was sure the mantis whose shots were intermingled with those of a cute bug waving its antennae was going to eat said bug.  Thankfully not.

[Silver Raven]

Ryan is a bellhop.  Why is he unable to lift heavy things?

[piequinn35]

3 minutes ago, Silver Raven said:

Ryan is a bellhop.  Why is he unable to lift heavy things?

He uses hotel trolleys :D

[fishcakes]

I don't understand why Chrissy seemed to have so much animosity toward Roark. As far as I can tell, Chrissy thought Roark was a threat to her (and lol at, "she's the most strategic player in the game. After me." God forbid Chrissy say anything complimentary about someone without mentioning that they're still not as great as she is herself) and set up that little talk about the women's alliance just so she could rat Roark out to JP and Ryan. But in Chrissy's confessionals afterward, she seemed pretty offended by Roark's mere existence, saying she didn't like her and couldn't wait to vote her out. Did we see anything to indicate that Roark was condescending or bossy or anything unpleasant with Chrissy? It looked to me like she was going along with what Chrissy was saying (or at least pretending to go along and not being super obvious about it) and yet Chrissy's reaction was so full of vitriol, first with saying she was dying to tell Roark, "you're not the smartest person on the island" and then the "I outsmarted Miss Smartypants" comment in the voting booth. Unless Roark got a completely false positive edit (and I don't think she did, based on what a good sport she was in her final words), Chrissy's venom toward her makes no sense.

I neither like nor dislike Ryan, but I did feel for him during the challenge where the ball kept rolling away from him. That's the kind of goober performance I would put in if I were on the show.

[UGAmp]

6 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

Unfortunately, I think Ali is going to have really no choice but to just stick with Ryan. She has no other allies. I mean maybe Lauren, but even that I'm not sure about. I don't really see how Ali is anything but screwed now since obviously Ryan doesn't give a fuck about her as an alliance mate and would cut her in a second but she really has no other options. But I'm still sorta with @UGAmp that Ali might be getting a winner's edit. I have thought that since ep 1. I don't know though I really don't see how that can happen now.

Ali was my episode one pick too. I’ve only gotten Adam right in all my Survivor seasons (maybe Ethan but that’s just because my teenage self loved him). She is definitely in trouble. That’s why if she finds a HII next week, she’s for sure going to the FTC. ;)

4 hours ago, NutMeg said:

My theory on why Ryan chose to vote with Chrissy rather than Ali is tied to his social game, or more specifically to his stated objective to use his social game. Ali seems to be a pretty social person and had quickly built a connection to the new comer - that must have been a red flag for Ryan, who, if he had followed Ali's choice, would have kept in the game someone he had zero connection to.  

I was thinking something along similar lines. I think Ryan knows Ali is a social threat. I think he’s thinking several steps ahead (possibly too soon) and knows he doesn’t want to work with her forever because she’ll be a threat to winning the whole game. Chrissy isn’t a threat. She doesn’t seem well-liked and did herself no favors at TC. She’s weak physically so easy to vote her out instead of Ryan who has done better in challenges that I thought he would but did pretty bad in this episode’s RC. She might be the perfect person to take to the end in his mind.

I’ll stop talking about the winners edit after this post, I promise, but I don’t think Ryan is quite there yet. He’s very much like Cochran and Spencer in my opinion. Gives good sound bytes in his talking heads. Underdog. He’s a fan/student of the game. I think he’ll definitely be asked back for more seasons unless he completely crashes and burns sometime during this season. I don’t think he’s winning. I just think the producers and Jeff love him. 

[LadyChatts]

31 minutes ago, fishcakes said:

I don't understand why Chrissy seemed to have so much animosity toward Roark. As far as I can tell, Chrissy thought Roark was a threat to her (and lol at, "she's the most strategic player in the game. After me." God forbid Chrissy say anything complimentary about someone without mentioning that they're still not as great as she is herself) and set up that little talk about the women's alliance just so she could rat Roark out to JP and Ryan. But in Chrissy's confessionals afterward, she seemed pretty offended by Roark's mere existence, saying she didn't like her and couldn't wait to vote her out. Did we see anything to indicate that Roark was condescending or bossy or anything unpleasant with Chrissy? It looked to me like she was going along with what Chrissy was saying (or at least pretending to go along and not being super obvious about it) and yet Chrissy's reaction was so full of vitriol, first with saying she was dying to tell Roark, "you're not the smartest person on the island" and then the "I outsmarted Miss Smartypants" comment in the voting booth. Unless Roark got a completely false positive edit (and I don't think she did, based on what a good sport she was in her final words), Chrissy's venom toward her makes no sense.

I neither like nor dislike Ryan, but I did feel for him during the challenge where the ball kept rolling away from him. That's the kind of goober performance I would put in if I were on the show.

I think she just hates women, or at least hates working with them.  Maybe she wants to steam roll over the men this season and not have any woman get in her way or steal some glory away from it (like Kim, which she is not).  I don't get why she thinks so highly of herself or her game.  Katrina was an easy first boot, and from some interview posted here I don't think there was much question Katrina was going over Chrissy.  Then the Heroes (which I also don't think she is) went on a winning streak.  It's not like they lost consecutive immunities and she had to claw back from beyond to save herself.  And last night, she goes for Roark, the girl whose the lone Healer on her new tribe, lies to ensure she'll be the target, and somehow thinks that makes her such a great strategic player?  Lauren Rimmer is more of a strategic player than Chrissy is at this point, imo.

[CloudySky]

While I respect Chrissy's succesful scrambling because I hate it when players just accept their fate without even trying...I dislike her because of her attitude about it. Rather than approach it from an it's me or you sorry not sorry attitude...she got so  vicious about it for no reason whatsoever.

I can understand why Ryan chose to keep Chrissy but he made a big mistake by not telling Ali. Ali is reasonable and if he were smart, he would have convinced her (or at least told her) with the argument that they can't keep THAT many healers around even if his true reason is keeping someone who is close to him (Chrissy) rather than to Ali (Roark). I hope this comes back to bite him...But Ali is in trouble if they lose especially if she makes a big fuss about it and alienates herself even more. With the merge in mind, Ryan and Chrissy could also decide to go for JP. He could be dangerous if he teams back up with Lifeguard girl in a merge situation. Chrissy knows his loyalty wouldn't be to her.

JP and Ben are the same to me...nice enough but boring muscle who are not strategic.

I'm rooting for Desi, Ali and Lauren (I find her grumpiness pretty funny). Joe is my favorite guy surprisingly. I'm looking forward to having a female challenge beast post merge with Desi hopefully.

I'm quite enjoying this season because there is nobody truly unlikeable. Even the assholes are redeemably villanous and there are several people I'd like to see win.

[millennium]

4 hours ago, Catronia said:

Yes! And remember when rewards used to be like a case of Mountain Dew and a couple of bags of Doritos? Or when, in Season 2, they lost their rice in a flood and that was quite literally all they had to eat? It's gotten comparatively much more luxurious these days. Survivors who made it near the end used to lose 30-40 pounds, now, often, it's less than 10. Now they're gorging themselves on pastries, and they aren't even to the merge yet. I don't necessarily want to see people starve, but they should have to work for it. It's taken a whole strategic layer out of the game -- playing the "provider" role. Now the show provides.

It occurred to me last night that it has also been many, many seasons since contestants had to weather bone-chilling, 24-hour rainstorms or other inclement conditions.   

[ratgirlagogo]

17 hours ago, millennium said:

Separated at birth?

I think he looks much more like an insect than a reptile.  That whole sequence with the beetle followed by the preying mantis, then Ryan!  Too funny.  

[iMonrey]

Unless I missed something, Chrissy was right about asking the others if they wanted to take over in the immunity challenge. I saw her turn around and ask if anyone else wanted to try at least once, if not twice. Nobody else stepped up. So it's kind of hard to lay that all on her if nobody else was willing to step in.

[RedheadZombie]

4 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

Ozzy was voted out even when he was the provider because no one wanted to deal with him going on a competition streak. Honestly, I don't know of too many people who have gone far in the game as the "provider" because most people are willing to go hungry for a few days in order to win the game. So vote out the dude who is winning points by bringing in food. People drop out of Survivor for food still. There is always one comp were they ask people to eat or play and a good number o people eat. The reward challenges are still fought over because the people want the food.

I don't think that they have too much food. They all lose weight, they are all hungry. They might not be as hungry as they were in the day but they are still plenty hungry. Africa was a boring ass season because they couldn't go any where due to the threat of an animal attack and they were so hungry. Watching the tribe suffer in Australia was not fun. They traded in Colby's giant flag for the rice.  They eat better now but the amount of food that they are getting is still far less then we get on a regular basis. Now there is a bit more activity at camp to follow and the challenges move a bit better and people are still very, very hungry.

The food element on Big Brother was great, I have no idea why they went away from it. They had competitions to win food for the week. The Have Not thing is kind of done because it is mainly boring and people flat out volunteer for it or end up as Have Nots because they are in the opposing alliance. I suspect that the competitions cost is the reason why they get rid of the food comps because CBS is cheap and they want to save money when they can.

To each their own, I prefer them to not look like skeletons at the end of the season, I think it looks gross and makes me worry.

I agree.  As much as people like the provider, they often become resentful of the provider.  In my memory, I don't really recall the provider being saved.  And I'm not talking about the people who strut around pounding their chest as they present food.

I like the rewards where people are tempted by food.  It shows which people are feeling safe or cocky, and can often reveal the pecking order.

I agree they do not get too much food.  I vividly remember season two, and I've only seen it once.  I don't need to watch women's hair falling out in clumps.  The lethargy of Mike's cast mates when he fell in the fire.  I still remember a very emaciated Nick talking to the camera.  He sounded like a zombie.  I especially hate it because Colby very quickly dominated every immunity challenge because he won every reward challenge.  It was a cycle no one could break because he was the only remotely nourished person there.  

Personally, I was very affected by Caleb's emergency (as well as the non-Hantz Russell).  I'm a nurse, and I really believe he was close to death.  And he was down and unnoticed for a short period of time, because there were two others down at the same time.  The simple truth is too much was going on for one medical crew.  I am not here to watch people fight for their literal life.  I do not want to watch people who have to go into stages of renal failure, as well as other issues that take months to recover after the show.   After Caleb's crisis, I decided they should have a cooling tent, ice water, and a basic snack prior to the challenges.  A wedge of cheese, or milk and graham crackers - basic.  All off camera, therefore not taking away anything from the audience.  Give them four ounces of juice on the way out - again off camera.  We will still see people who are very hungry and motivated for food, but they will be more mentally alert, and perhaps better at strategizing.  And they can probably fight off infection better, so we don't watch an entire season of festering wounds.

7 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Unless I missed something, Chrissy was right about asking the others if they wanted to take over in the immunity challenge. I saw her turn around and ask if anyone else wanted to try at least once, if not twice. Nobody else stepped up. So it's kind of hard to lay that all on her if nobody else was willing to step in.

There was at least one instance of Roark asking to switch out, and Chrissy brushing her off.  

[cooksdelight]

I teared up during Ben’s segment, I have more than a handful of friends and family who would have reacted the same way. God bless him, I would be happy if he won.

Ryan is lousy at challenges, has a great social game....which people should be scared to death of. You suck at challenges so people keep you around until it’s an individual game, and they don’t realize that they keep you around because you’re also entertaining. Dangerous, dangerous thinking.

I wanted Chrissy gone. She’s smug, she’s arrogant, and I’d vote her off in a heartbeat.

The sex doctor (I’m bad with names) should have stuck that thing in his pocket and said, “Well, I can’t find anything...” He’s an idiot. Anyone who “shares” an idol with someone is an idiot.

[blackwing]

20 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Unless I missed something, Chrissy was right about asking the others if they wanted to take over in the immunity challenge. I saw her turn around and ask if anyone else wanted to try at least once, if not twice. Nobody else stepped up. So it's kind of hard to lay that all on her if nobody else was willing to step in.

It was a hollow gesture.  She said it but immediately turned back to the game and never let go of the handles or stepped off the beam.  I thought Roark volunteered but the Smartest Person in the Room acted like she didn't hear her.  She could have said "my balance is bad, someone else needs to try".   

[RedheadZombie]

20 hours ago, RandomWatcher said:

I can barely name a handful of people who have been on Survivor. How people can remember people and how they played is amazing.

I'm the same but Denise and Dawn are especially memorable.  Denise was an extremely physically fit woman in her 40s, went to every tribal council, yet won.  Dawn was Cochran's sidekick, became increasing unstable throughout the season, went to final and lost to Cochran.  

[RedheadZombie]

25 minutes ago, cooksdelight said:

I teared up during Ben’s segment, I have more than a handful of friends and family who would have reacted the same way. God bless him, I would be happy if he won.

Ryan is lousy at challenges, has a great social game....which people should be scared to death of. You suck at challenges so people keep you around until it’s an individual game, and they don’t realize that they keep you around because you’re also entertaining. Dangerous, dangerous thinking.

I wanted Chrissy gone. She’s smug, she’s arrogant, and I’d vote her off in a heartbeat.

The sex doctor (I’m bad with names) should have stuck that thing in his pocket and said, “Well, I can’t find anything...” He’s an idiot. Anyone who “shares” an idol with someone is an idiot.

But is he?  I don't remember him being a detriment to the team until this past episode.  He's shown in previous challenges that he's pretty aerobically fit and can keep up.  Roark also sucked at that sand inchworm part, but I don't remember her being a detriment in any previous challenge, either.  

I'm pretty claustrophobic, and I just don't think I could have done that part.  Being restrained and frequently slamming my face into the sand?  I would feel like I was suffocating.  I actually thought the whole PTSD episode with Ben was a set-up for him to freak out.  That challenge required a lot of core strength, and the ability to potentially sacrifice your corneas.  If they do it again, they should require goggles.

[ByaNose]

I just watched a secret scene of JP (and, Ben) and, a confessional. Wow! How did he make it through casting? He can barely form a sentence. I can only think he sat with his shirt off during the whole casting process. Now, I know that we’ve been joking about him but to hear him speak it’s just amazing he made it during the long casting process that I hear Survivor has. At least, he has his looks.

[Machiabelly]

I think the important thing we are missing is that Jeff called out a female as a challenge beast.

[RedheadZombie]

Just now, Machiabelly said:

I think the important thing we are missing is that Jeff called out a female as a challenge beast.

Desi, right?  She went in with both guns blazing, don't care if I mess up this beautiful face or destroy my eyes, badassery.  Personally, I would have been extremely intimidated watching her as I awaited my turn.  She had barely registered for me prior to this challenge.  Now she's in the small group of people I'm rooting for.

[jay741982]

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

Unless I missed something, Chrissy was right about asking the others if they wanted to take over in the immunity challenge. I saw her turn around and ask if anyone else wanted to try at least once, if not twice. Nobody else stepped up. So it's kind of hard to lay that all on her if nobody else was willing to step in.

Roark asked if she could help and Chrissy denied her .

[Wandering Snark]

7 hours ago, blackwing said:

This episode made me dislike Mike even more.  He referred to himself in the third person as "Dr. Mike".  Ugh.

Yeah anyone who speaks of themselves in third person automatically send up flags to me, even moreso if they refer to themselves as 'Dr. Mike', I mean Probst loves to do that kind of thing but you don't do it yourself. It's kind of akin to giving yourself a nickname.

6 hours ago, candall said:

Who cares if Ozzy can scamper up a coconut palm when there are leftover muffins available? 

Hah... I love this statement. I think that the pre/post challenge snacks are an interesting idea but I wouldn't mind seeing more of the whole 'surviving' angle. Yes it got a little out of hand early on what with Tina turning into a cavewoman and Elizabeth pulling her hair out in clumps... but daily food rewards and them always having something more than just their rice annoys me. Respect the rice. Fear the loss of your rice. There shouldn't be a constant gravy train imho.

[MissEwa]

21 hours ago, Brookside said:

I'm not sure if this is the right place for this question, but -

Does anyone know how it's decided what they can bring with them?  Specifically their underwear.  The women all look as if they were sent a small selection of bras to choose from.  Except for Roark who had the kind of grubby looking, ill-fitting things I hide at the back of my drawer.  And why the hell can't they wear sports bras/bikinis?  And all the men seem to be wearing one style of underwear.  I just don't get it, unless the producers pretty much insist on a ce3rtain style for sex appeal.  Those bras are totally ill-suited for a lot of the challenges, particularly when they're snaking through the sand.

I know it's shallow and insignificant but the fit of Roark's bra bothered me so very much. The style didn't bother me (although it seems a deliberate decision to give the more stereotypical hotties nice push-up bras and the quirky girl something less flattering) but it did not fit her at all - it looked like it might look on Day 35 if she'd lost a bunch of weight. I cannot see all that ill-fitting wire being comfortable. 

10 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

Devon reminds me so much of someone but I can't figure out who. It's been driving me crazy!

Chrissy is the worst. I would love to be able to root for her because she's an older woman and also because she is playing the game hard as hell, but she is heinous and I just can't bring myself to like or root for people who have such odious personalities. I fucking hate that her and Ryan, my two most loathed players, are obviously going very deep. I feel like that alone will ruin this entire season for me.

Speaking of Ryan, I see where he's coming from with voting out Roark over Chrissy, but by not telling Ali he made it one of the dumbest moves I've ever seen. Just it makes literally no sense. If he wasn't going to tell Ali, which essentially means he picked Chrissy over her, then he should have just voted her out, as @KimberStormer said.

Unfortunately, I think Ali is going to have really no choice but to just stick with Ryan. She has no other allies. I mean maybe Lauren, but even that I'm not sure about. I don't really see how Ali is anything but screwed now since obviously Ryan doesn't give a fuck about her as an alliance mate and would cut her in a second but she really has no other options. But I'm still sorta with @UGAmp that Ali might be getting a winner's edit. I have thought that since ep 1. I don't know though I really don't see how that can happen now.

 

Yeah Roark didn't appeal to me but I was really bummed about this move because a) I don't like Chrissy and b) it leaves Ali isolated, and she's been my pick to win until now. I'm holding out hope she can work some angles, make it to the merge and then figures something out. I don't know if the stats bear this out but I feel like in three-tribe seasons players without huge alliances actually do better at the merge, so I'm holding out hope. 

3 hours ago, millennium said:

It occurred to me last night that it has also been many, many seasons since contestants had to weather bone-chilling, 24-hour rainstorms or other inclement conditions.   

They had to evacuate the contestants due to a cyclone the season before last, and we've had a run of heat-related medical situations in the past couple of years. I feel like maybe they are trying to be more mindful of it though, which I appreciate. I'd rather see them play then get close-ups of the skin peeling off their feet or whatever, or get to worry that someone's going to die, but YMMV. 

I'm tentatively on board with this season, but it still feels really early, in that everything is kind of nebulous and ill-defined, which is weird because it's over 1/3 of the way through. I enjoy the individual episodes but I don't yet feel like I have strong opinions on anything yet. 

[ByaNose]

13 minutes ago, MissEwa said:

I know it's shallow and insignificant but the fit of Roark's bra bothered me so very much. The style didn't bother me (although it seems a deliberate decision to give the more stereotypical hotties nice push-up bras and the quirky girl something less flattering) but it did not fit her at all - it looked like it might look on Day 35 if she'd lost a bunch of weight. I cannot see all that ill-fitting wire being comfortable. 

Yeah Roark didn't appeal to me but I was really bummed about this move because a) I don't like Chrissy and b) it leaves Ali isolated, and she's been my pick to win until now. I'm holding out hope she can work some angles, make it to the merge and then figures something out. I don't know if the stats bear this out but I feel like in three-tribe seasons players without huge alliances actually do better at the merge, so I'm holding out hope. 

They had to evacuate the contestants due to a cyclone the season before last, and we've had a run of heat-related medical situations in the past couple of years. I feel like maybe they are trying to be more mindful of it though, which I appreciate. I'd rather see them play then get close-ups of the skin peeling off their feet or whatever, or get to worry that someone's going to die, but YMMV. 

I'm tentatively on board with this season, but it still feels really early, in that everything is kind of nebulous and ill-defined, which is weird because it's over 1/3 of the way through. I enjoy the individual episodes but I don't yet feel like I have strong opinions on anything yet. 

In Roark’s exit interview with Rob she said the weather was great when she was there. She said they had a half hour of rain and that was it. I think the weather issues won’t be a issue for the foreseeable future while their in Fiji. It sounds kind of boring. I want people dying of heat and miserable during long periods of rain. LOL!!!!!!

[Rachel RSL]

I agree. It can't be that difficult to find a happy medium, can it? I don't want people to be in actual physical danger but, on a show called Survivor, I'm ok with a little suffering. And, seriously, "Fear the loss of your rice!" should be this show's tagline.

[simplyme]

8 hours ago, blackwing said:

I don't understand why all the teams kept rotating people.  After one person got the hang of it, as Jeff said there is a learning curve, why not have that person keep going?  Instead Dame Chrissy seems to have deemed that it was "her" role and that Ali only was temporarily taking over and then was expected to relinquish it back to the queen.  

Although it wasn't specified, every time Survivor has done a very similar challenge I've noticed that every tribe switches players between balls and no one does more than one ball. So I'm going to guess that each ball had to be maneuvered into place by a different tribe member. If you were struggling, you could give up and switch out with someone who hadn't yet placed a ball in one of the top holes, but once someone did place a ball, they were done. The other two balls had to be placed by two of the other three tribe members.

So Chrissy struggled and gave up to take her shoes off. Meanwhile, Ali stepped in and did her one ball, so then either Chrissy, Roark, or JP had to do the next.

The whole "Chrissy wouldn't let anyone help/ No one would when Chrissy asked" thing that came next is ambiguous. Chrissy did turn and ask if anyone else wanted to try. Roark responded with something like, "I mean, I can if you want me to." I didn't notice JP say anything (or it was edited out.) Chrissy turned back around and kept trying.

Roark's rather tentative response can be interpreted in two (or more) ways. One is that she's willing to step in and is phrasing it that way because societally women are often taught to phrase things as suggestions and seek approval to avoid offending others. The other way it can be interpreted is that Roark really is not interested in taking over, but feels she has to respond, so she lobs the decision back to Chrissy.

Chrissy appears to go with interpretation #2, either because that suits her purposes or she really thinks Roark doesn't genuinely want to step in or she'd be firmer.

So to me, there's a possibility that both believed what they said (Chrissy that she asked if anyone wanted to step in and no one did, and Roark that people offered and Chrissy just ignored them) because they don't know each other that well and they communicate a little differently. Or either one could have deliberately responded the way she wanted having felt she covered her butt by asking/offering in the way she did.

[MissEwa]

1 hour ago, Rachel RSL said:

I agree. It can't be that difficult to find a happy medium, can it? I don't want people to be in actual physical danger but, on a show called Survivor, I'm ok with a little suffering. And, seriously, "Fear the loss of your rice!" should be this show's tagline.

Yeah I don't want it to be summer camp, but I don't think it's accurate to say it's been years and years since we've seen them properly suffering. I do, personally, find constant rain kind of boring, because it limits what the castaways can do at camp, and that limits what we get to see them doing. The food thing... I feel like they're still hungry? They get more for rewards but it's not like everyone get them. (I feel like second place in this episode would be more of a punishment - none of the food and all of the dehydrating, jittery fun of coffee!)

[KimberStormer]

2 hours ago, Sugar said:

Why are some people skeeved out by Dr. Mike...? Am I missing something? He seems like a fairly nice, easygoing dude - did he do something to turn people off?

Admittedly some of it is just that subtle chemistry of affinity.  But I started to dislike him reading his pre-game interviews.  Forget what he looks like and read this:

Quote

"In my video, I talked about how Survivor is ruining the American dream, because people think they can just go on a game show and win a million dollars. I'm here to show them they have to work their butts off for everything in life. . .  I've succeeded at everything I've ever done," he says. "I'm not gloating, it's just a fact. I was valedictorian of my high school class. I was accepted to Brown for their college and med school program at the same time. I was the first person in Brown's history to have three concentrations and graduate in four years. I then did a master's while in medical school with a focus on epidimeology, because I had time on my hands."

These are the words of a douchebag in shlub's clothing.  Then the way he came at Jessica last episode, "If you're screwing me I'm going to fucking kill you."  I honestly don't know how this went by without making everyone else mad, but it sure made me mad.  Like, isn't that a total Hantz move?  This episode he got a chance to pat himself on the back some more and also was again weirdly aggro at Jessica in one of the challenges, though the fog of time has obscured my memory of how it went down. 

[Superpole2000]

On 10/25/2017 at 9:36 PM, Maverick said:

 I'm in the minority.   I didn't care for Roark at all.  She just instantly rubbed me wrong when she joined the show last week and my dislike of her was confirmed when she started going after Chrissy with that admonishing corporate speak.   I'm no fan of Chrissy, but I'll live with her another week to be rid of Roark  

From what I saw, Roark was a terrible player. That entire interaction with Chrissy was so poorly managed by Roark. She just could not remove her ego from the situation and instead had to turn it into a battle against Chrissy. "Why didn't you come to me before you needed me?" Roark, who cares? She needs you now, and more importantly, you need her. Don't throw that away for pride/ego/spite. Good players can work with anyone and evolve to suit the game situation. Bad players are stubborn and unable to create positive interactions at critical moments.

The challenges this season have been excellent. I know Chrissy failed on that beam, but she was right to call out her tribe for not stepping up to the plate at that critical moment. They were really hesitant to put themselves on the line (very half-hearted offers to help), and it is all too easy to criticize failure after the fact when you weren't the one taking the shot.

[Star Aristille]

18 hours ago, Superpole2000 said:

From what I saw, Roark was a terrible player. That entire interaction with Chrissy was so poorly managed by Roark. She just could not remove her ego from the situation and instead had to turn it into a battle against Chrissy. "Why didn't you come to me before you needed me?" Roark, who cares? She needs you now, and more importantly, you need her. Don't throw that away for pride/ego/spite. Good players can work with anyone and evolve to suit the game situation. Bad players are stubborn and unable to create positive interactions at critical moments.

I certainly agree that Roark handled things badly with Chrissy, but in what way was that ego or arrogance?  I found that to be more like suspicion.  If Chrissy really hadn't approached her till just before she's in trouble, I can see why Roark would be suspicious of her motives.  I definitely didn't get any arrogance or spitefulness in her tones.

Edited October 27, 2017 by Star Aristille

[peachmangosteen]

11 hours ago, simplyme said:

The whole "Chrissy wouldn't let anyone help/ No one would when Chrissy asked" thing that came next is ambiguous. Chrissy did turn and ask if anyone else wanted to try. Roark responded with something like, "I mean, I can if you want me to." I didn't notice JP say anything (or it was edited out.) Chrissy turned back around and kept trying.

I rewatched this scene because I thought I had remembered Roark's response differently than you describe here. You are right though, Roark does kind of tentatively ask Chrissy if Chrissy wants her to try. She does say "If you want me to." She also asks Chrissy if she wants Ali to try, which I found interesting. First of all, Ali had already done it, so I don't know if that means a person could do more than one ball or if Roark just hadn't thought about Ali having already done it. Or perhaps that part was shown out of order and actually happened before Ali went. Although I will say, even though Roark was kinda tentative in her words, her body language was different imo. She was walking towards the beam/Chrissy as she was talking. Also, Chrissy, as she was asking, never let go of the ropes, which makes it seem to me like she didn't really have any intention of relinquishing control.

[Jel]

This epi had me scratching my head a little. From my viewing station and snack center, I saw Chrissy, failing, ask if anyone wanted to take over. Since this is a race and time is of the essence, I would have expected the person who wanted to take over to physically step up and towards her, and not give some weak sauce "yes" while still standing in the non-playing area. It was essentially a relay race at that point, so get your ass up there if you want to sub in.  The truth as I see it, is that the team at that point was way behind and no one else wanted to take over for fear of being the cause of the loss.

Then, at tribal, Jeff's reaction to Chrissy saying she'd asked if anyone wanted to take over. Jeff was all, "Wowwww", which really made me think of that Seinfeld episode where men made cat fight noises when Elaine would say something.  It was bizarre to me because I thought Chrissy was just being direct, defending herself against an untrue accusation.  I wish he'd made cat fight noises -- it would have been more honest. 

[peachmangosteen]

1 minute ago, Jel said:

I would have expected the person who wanted to take over to physically step up and towards her, and not give some weak sauce "yes" while still standing in the non-playing area. . . The truth as I see it, is that the team at that point was way behind and no one else wanted to take over for fear of being the cause of the loss.

I just rewatched the scene and Roark did indeed start walking towards Chrissy/out of the non-playing area. But I do agree with you that no one really wanted to step up because they didn't want to be blamed for the loss. Roark was the only one who stepped up and she still did it rather tentatively.