Party of One: Unpopular TV Opinions

[paulvdb]

On the subject of giving shows a chance, for me there are four categories of shows based on premise (most important element for me) and people involved. How much of a chance I give a show depends on the category.

1. Shows I'm not interested in at all based on what I've read about them. I don't bother watching a single minute of these shows. Reality tv and most procedurals and animated shows fall in this category.

2. Shows that I expect not to like, but want to check out because I like someone involved in it. With those shows I often realize after 5 or 10 minutes that I'm not going to like them and quit immediately.

3. Shows that I'm on the fence about. I usually give those at least a whole episode before I decide to watch the next episode. I may decide on an episode-by-episode bases for several episodes before I fully commit to the show and have often quit them after a few episodes. It's rare for me to not give these shows at least one complete episode.

4. Shows that I expect to love. I will give those shows more time as long as there are at least some elements that I like.

When I am committed to a show I usually watch it all the way to the end, but there have been exceptions where a show declined in quality or I didn't care for a specific storyline. In those cases I have quit shows after watching multiple seasons. But usually I continue until the end as long as there are at least some elements that I still like.

As far as animated shows are concerned, as a kid I used to like shows like Tom & Jerry, Bugs Bunny and Road Runner. More recently the only animated shows I even bothered to watch are two Star Wars shows: Clone Wars and Rebels. And that's only because they are Star Wars. The fact that I liked them both does not mean that I'd like other animated shows like the Simpsons or South Park. So I never watched those.

[DoctorAtomic]

I'm more inclined to stick with a show that's on here so I can talk about it with people. On the weekends, I usually find things here and there on my streaming channels that are just one offs; movie on Saturday night, maybe a documentary on Hulu on Sunday, etc. 

[janie jones]

The Picture Picture about making crayons is some of the best television in the history of television, as far as I'm concerned.

On 3/5/2021 at 10:53 PM, Irlandesa said:

This discussion of "it gets good later" brings up a possibly unpopular opinion in this day and age---It's okay to NOT start at the beginning of a series. 

People used to start a show mid-run all the time.  They'd catch an episode or two one night or they'd see it in syndication and start watching.

This is actually (sort of ) how I got started watching Schitt's Creek. A couple people said that I'd like it, but it never really piqued my interest. Then I heard that it takes a few episodes to get into it, -- which, if that's something that works for some people, that's fine by me, but if a show can go multiple episodes without being good, that's not something I want to invest time in. I don't think of a series overall like a book, whose first couple chapters (episodes) might be a bit boring before the plot really starts up. I think of each episode like a book. Each one (more or less) has to entertain me if I'm going to go out of my way to watch it.

So anyway, I didn't really want to check Schitt's Creek out, but then I was flipping through channels late at night and caught part of an episode, and it seemed okay, so I ended up streaming the first episode. I liked the first episode, and don't really get the "it takes three or four episodes to get good." (I don't think I saw enough of that later episode to fall in love with the characters or plot. It basically just functioned like a movie trailer for me.)

On 3/6/2021 at 6:23 AM, Shannon L. said:

I think the reason Schitt's Creek works for me is that while the family can be very stuck up  because of the wealthy lifestyle they were raised in, as the series goes on, they grow, they learn and you realize that under all of what seems to be shallowness are people who are kind and actually do care. 

I agree. And even in the first episode, after Johnny yells at Roland to get out of their room, he apologizes for the outburst. They're used to nicer things, but they aren't bad people, and they don't think they're better than the townspeople.

Edited March 8, 2021 by janie jones

[JimmyJabloon]

I really wanted to like bojack horseman. But I couldn't watch more than 4 episodes.

[DearEvette]

On 3/6/2021 at 1:53 AM, Irlandesa said:

This discussion of "it gets good later" brings up a possibly unpopular opinion in this day and age---It's okay to NOT start at the beginning of a series. 

...

On a personal level, I find this to be especially true with sitcoms. If a show comes together in Season 2--great--but before I try to power through a season that might not be working for me, I'd rather be told which two or three episodes are their funniest/best constructed episodes.  In a sitcom, it shouldn't matter how well I know the characters, I should be able to watch those randomly selected episodes and flat out enjoy them for what they are.  And if I do enjoy the episodes, I'm far more likely to power through a first season of a show trying to figure itself out than I am if I'm unsure if my disinterest is because a show is figuring itself out or if it's just not my cup of tea.  99% of the time, watching the "best" episode will give me that answer.

This is me 100%.   This has worked for me where I found shows I liked and and knew which ones would not work no matter how wonderful everyone else thinks it is.  I know that a lot of shows don't hit their stride until later in their first season or sometimes not even until the second season.

I am one of the people who just could not get into Parks and Recreation or Schitt's Creek after following this formula.  I can acknowledge that people love those shows but I am not gonna be one of them so I didn't want to keep trying.

Meanwhile, I show that if you had asked me I would have told you was completely something I would never watch, I found myself enjoying quite by accident is The Unicorn.  I am not a fan of the typical CBS comedy formula.  And yet, this cycled on automatically on ...Netflix?  after something else and I kept it on as background noise and by the third episode I was kinda into it.  Now i like it.

[kiddo82]

Question for those of you who do series rewatches:  do you skip episodes or no?  For me it depends.  If I made a conscientious decision to do a full on, soup to nuts rewatch then I do every epsiode.  Clunkers and all.  (I even make myself watch Epsiode I during a Star Wars rewatch.)  I consider it part of the experience.  Now, if I'm just doing the greatest hits of a certain season or era, which is usually done more on a whim, then I'll skip whatever doesn't interest me.  Obviously that's just me.

Edited March 8, 2021 by kiddo82

[andromeda331]

12 minutes ago, kiddo82 said:

Question for those of you who do series rewatches:  do you skip episodes or no?  For me it depends.  If I made a conscientious decision to do a full on, soup to nuts rewatch then I do every epsiode.  Clunkers and all.  (I even make myself watch Epsiode I during a Star Wars rewatch.)  I consider it part of the experience.  Now, if I'm just doing the greatest hits of a certain season or era, which is usually done more on a whim, then I'll skip whatever doesn't interest me.  Obviously that's just me.

For me it depends on the series. There are some that I love every episode or enough of every episode that I'll watch every single one. Others I skip and just watch the ones I like. 

[Annber03]

Depends for me, too. There may be specific times when I want to watch an entire season straight through, or need to do so for some reason or other (discussion purposes or fic ideas or whatnot). And if I come across a marathon of a series I like on TV, especially if it's at a time when there's nothing else on and whatnot, yeah, I'll just watch it straight through, all the episodes that air, 'cause hey, good way to kill a few hours :). And sometimes I like to rewatch entire seasons and episodes, even the ones I don't care for, because maybe sometimes I will find that oh, this episode or season is better than I thought it was. 

And then yeah, there's days when I' just want to watch some of my particular favorite episodes, and so I'll pull out the DVDs and watch those and call it good :). 

[DoctorAtomic]

With all the original content year-round, there's still new shows I still haven't got to. I haven't rewatched since before DVRs. 

[Bastet]

Occasionally during a re-watch I will decide to give the clunkers another try, but I usually skip them.  And I always skip episodes I can't stand or have zero interest in.  Life is too short to watch something I know I'm not going to like.

[Irlandesa]

I don't really "do" rewatches in general.  I'll watch reruns but that's more of a "take them as they come" type of situation because it's based on what's on TV when I'm watching. 

The only time I rewatch a show from start to finish is if I was a sporadic viewer to begin with so I know there are a lot of episodes I missed.  Or if it has been so long (I'm talking decades) since I first saw it that I don't really remember enough about most episodes to know that I need to skip it because it's a dud. 

I mean, I keep meaning to do rewatches of certain shows but there's always something else I want to try. I think, fundamentally, I don't really get them. I get that it can be casual comfort viewing but making an effort always seems to go against my idea of comfort. 

But if there's a marathon?  I can get sucked in for a day. 

Edited March 9, 2021 by Irlandesa

[ABay]

Rewatches are more relistens for me, usually, since I want something on while I'm engaged in another activity like cross stitching or doing a puzzle. I'll look up when a favorite scene comes on but mostly I'm listening and just let the episodes play one after another.

[DoctorAtomic]

When SciFi was actually a channel, they showed Babylon 5 M-T at 5 or 6. I watched it through twice and then got my roommate into it. They did the same with Farscape. So you just come home and put the tv on. 

[Bastet]

I got into re-watching favorite movies and episodes of TV shows early on; we got our first VCR in 1978.  If there was nothing good on, or I was home sick, pop in that recording of 9 to 5 and enjoy  It's why I know so many early '80s movies verbatim.

So by the time entire series were being released on DVD, and I could have the whole show with me whenever and wherever I wanted (and take up a lot less space than all those tapes)?  It was right up my alley, and I still get my favorite shows on DVD/Blu-Ray once they're done.

[topanga]

On 3/6/2021 at 10:09 AM, BlackberryJam said:

I don’t like sitcoms. Not dragging you specifically here, because the responses that follow do the exact same thing. I don’t like sitcoms, so why should I bother trying them? People do this same thing when I say I don’t like cats. Cats make my skin crawl. Cats make me hyperventilate. I feel about cats the way many people feel about spiders. People always say to me, “You’d like my cat, it’s not like a cat at all.” But it IS. All cats are exactly like cats.

I am not going to waste 1, 2, 3 hours of my l life on something I have a track record of not liking

Don't worry--I don't feel drug (specifically). I suppose I don't consider Schitt's Creek a traditional sit com. IMO, those are shows that primarily take place on an indoor set and usually have a live audience or a laugh track, a.l.a. Three's Company, The Fresh Prince of Bel Air, The Golden Girls, or Living Single. Schitt's Creek is a comedy, sure, but I've never considered it a sit-com. If you do, I understand why you wouldn't bother to try it. 

And the other genres I listed, the hour-long comedy-dramas or comedy-mysteries--you didn't mention if you liked those or not. I'm going to guess no.  But I'm really curious--what ARE some of your favorite shows? 

[BlackberryJam]

6 hours ago, topanga said:

Don't worry--I don't feel drug (specifically). I suppose I don't consider Schitt's Creek a traditional sit com. IMO, those are shows that primarily take place on an indoor set and usually have a live audience or a laugh track, a.l.a. Three's Company, The Fresh Prince of Bel Air, The Golden Girls, or Living Single. Schitt's Creek is a comedy, sure, but I've never considered it a sit-com. If you do, I understand why you wouldn't bother to try it. 

And the other genres I listed, the hour-long comedy-dramas or comedy-mysteries--you didn't mention if you liked those or not. I'm going to guess no.  But I'm really curious--what ARE some of your favorite shows? 

These aren’t necessarily unpopular opinions, but I love Succession, I enjoyed some season of GoT, the first season of Westworld. Unbelievable was fantastic. Big fan of The Expanse, Battlestar Galactica, Babylon 5. I enjoyed Bridgerton. I love British mystery series, and some of the Aussie ones too. Big fan of Tennis and NFL football. I like the occasional reality show, but they need to be focused on people succeeding, like Project Runway or Top Chef and absolutely not about people being humiliated. I find absolutely no joy in watching people get insulted, embarrassed, humiliated, mocked...and that tends to be a lot of so-called comedy. 

I can’t even stand slapstick comedy because it’s all about injuring another person for laughs. And that is not funny. 

[paulvdb]

When rewatching I have some shows where I can still watch every single episode from the beginning to the end. But with many shows I skip episodes I don't like or fast forward through characters or storylines I don't care about. Or I watch only a few favorite seasons. And there are shows that I have no interest in rewatching except for a small number of favorite episodes. For example, the Mirror Universe two-parter is all I've ever rewatched of Star Trek Enterprise. And I quit my Vampire Diaries rewatches after season 3. One time I made it through season 4 but after that I don't care enough to continue.

[proserpina65]

On ‎03‎/‎03‎/‎2021 at 4:28 PM, AimingforYoko said:

I personally was upset because she deliberately targeted civilians, which she never did before. If they had shown her slaughtering Lannister troops after they laid down their arms, that's villainy that would have been seen coming. Showing her tearing ass for the Red Keep after the surrender, absolutely. But to instead purposely raze the city and all the people in it? Nah. Every other person or people she killed, she had a beef with. She had no argument with the commoners.

She threatened to kill civilians, though, both in Season 2 at the gates of Qarth, and at the end of Season 6 when she declared that she would destroy Astapor, Yunkai and Volantis before Tyrion talked her out of it.  So not entirely out of character.

On ‎03‎/‎04‎/‎2021 at 5:19 PM, Mabinogia said:

My biggest issue with how GOT ended was a feeling of "really, that's it?" As someone said, it's like they just wanted to get it over with. I think, because in the beginning they had the books as a road map, detailed with every little bump, the first few seasons were amazingly detailed and rich. But then there were no more books and though they may have gotten a quick synopsis of how GRR planned on ending it, they didn't have that rich detail to pull from. So they just kind of went "ah, fuck it, Dany's evil, Arya kills the Big Bad and Bran is somehow now king. Deal with it." Had it been their story from the beginning it might not have seemed so jarring or had they had the completed book series to pull from it might not have seemed so jarring but the first few seasons were basically written by a different author, the books author while the last season was written by the show runners making it basically a different story.

My unpopular opinion is that I didn't feel this way at all.

[Shannon L.]

On 3/6/2021 at 6:09 PM, kathyk24 said:

I think fans can get really possessive of their favorite shows and god help you if you disagree with them. I liked Criminal Minds but I thought Reid was a boring character and I liked the hated JJ. I got my head handed to me for expressing these opinions.

We're in the middle of season 7 of Criminal Minds right now, so maybe this will change, but for now, I can't for the life of me understand why JJ is hated.  I haven't seen anything with her yet that has us not liking her.  In fact, my husband and I both really like all of the characters on CM.  Personally, I'm already dreading the seasons when we start losing some of the actors that started from the first season. 

Actually, I take that back--there was one character that I didn't like and it was the female agent who left before Prentiss stepped in.  She was ok at first but, while I was sorry for what she went through, I don't like the way it was handled and it made me glad she was gone.  But so far, she's the only one. 

[proserpina65]

On ‎03‎/‎08‎/‎2021 at 6:23 PM, kiddo82 said:

Question for those of you who do series rewatches:  do you skip episodes or no?  For me it depends.  If I made a conscientious decision to do a full on, soup to nuts rewatch then I do every epsiode.  Clunkers and all.  (I even make myself watch Epsiode I during a Star Wars rewatch.)  I consider it part of the experience.  Now, if I'm just doing the greatest hits of a certain season or era, which is usually done more on a whim, then I'll skip whatever doesn't interest me.  Obviously that's just me.

It depends for me, as well.  If it's just a bit clunky, I'd probably watch every episode.  If I hated it, then I'd skip it.  (And if it's Season 3 of 800 Words, then it ends at Jeff & Tracy's wedding.  Other than watching with my bff who hadn't seen the show, I will never again watch George choose the wrong woman.)

On ‎03‎/‎08‎/‎2021 at 6:43 PM, DoctorAtomic said:

With all the original content year-round, there's still new shows I still haven't got to. I haven't rewatched since before DVRs. 

There might be a lot of original content out there, but most of it doesn't interest me.

 

I just can't with Bridgerton.  I don't generally mind taking some liberties in a historically based show, but it's from fantasyland.  (This was a big problem for me with The Tudors, which I only watched for Jeremy Northam.)  And I don't get all the frenzy over the main guy.  He's attractive but nothing particularly special, imo.  (FTR, none of this means I don't think it should be on tv, or that its fans shouldn't enjoy it as much as they do.  It just means that it's not for me.)

Edited March 10, 2021 by proserpina65

[Annber03]

1 hour ago, Shannon L. said:

We're in the middle of season 7 of Criminal Minds right now, so maybe this will change, but for now, I can't for the life of me understand why JJ is hated.  I haven't seen anything with her yet that has us not liking her.  In fact, my husband and I both really like all of the characters on CM.  Personally, I'm already dreading the seasons when we start losing some of the actors that started from the first season. 

Actually, I take that back--there was one character that I didn't like and it was the female agent who left before Prentiss stepped in.  She was ok at first but, while I was sorry for what she went through, I don't like the way it was handled and it made me glad she was gone.  But so far, she's the only one. 

I'm the same way in liking all the characters :). And I've never gotten the JJ hate, either. 

I liked Elle, myself, but yes, I can see where one would take issue with how the storyline that led to her exit was handled. 

I hope you continue to enjoy the show! 

Edited March 10, 2021 by Annber03

[Katy M]

6 hours ago, Shannon L. said:

We're in the middle of season 7 of Criminal Minds right now, so maybe this will change, but for now, I can't for the life of me understand why JJ is hated.  I haven't seen anything with her yet that has us not liking her.  In fact, my husband and I both really like all of the characters on CM.  Personally, I'm already dreading the seasons when we start losing some of the actors that started from the first season. 

I had no idea she was hated.  I have actually only seen a handful of episodes.  For the most part the show is just too dark for my taste.  But, I remember really liking JJ in the epis I have seen.  And Spenser.

[callie lee 29]

On 3/10/2021 at 9:50 PM, Katy M said:

I had no idea she was hated.  I have actually only seen a handful of episodes.  For the most part the show is just too dark for my taste.  But, I remember really liking JJ in the epis I have seen.  And Spenser.

She definitely hated on certain online fandoms, but the average viewer? I don't think so. 

I liked Elle on first viewing, when I was watching it once a week, but I think binging with show after show doesn't benefit the character. I think the writers kind of built up this cool girl trope with her that when you watch her episodes back to back, makes her become irritating.  

Personally, my UO (possibly mentioned before) is that I DESPISE Gideon. Utterly and completely. It is 100% because I cannot stand the actor. 

[Kel Varnsen]

On 3/7/2021 at 9:12 AM, Annber03 said:

On 3/7/2021 at 1:09 PM, Mabinogia said:

 

Spoiler

 

Spoiler

 

Yeah, I've seen some of the intense fandom around him. He was not the draw for me when I got into "Community"-I'd never heard of him before that show, and I've not followed any of his work outside of that show. I got into "Community" 'cause it had Joel McHale and John Oliver in it, and I liked them, so naturally I wanted to see what a show with them would be like :). 

My double unpopular opinion is that one of the best things they ever did on Community was when Abed would talk about how Cougar Town was the funniest show on tv, because it totally was.

On 3/7/2021 at 10:43 AM, Shannon L. said:

The thing about Arrested Development is that it had a lot of things in the background or in newspapers they were reading that were really clever if you caught them.  You had to be really observant or invested in pausing the show or backing it up ( ex. "what was that clown doing?").  If you caught it, you were really committed and/or observant.  If you didn't, it doesn't make you "not smart enough to get it".  Thankfully, imo, there was enough going on in the foreground and with the story that I don't feel like I missed out by not catching those

The weird thing about people saying that others didn't like Arrested Development because it was too smart, was that AD had a narrator who would explain and re-explain most of the storylines and running gags on a given episode. So I don't think that people didn't watch it because it was too smart or too hard to follow.

On 3/7/2021 at 1:09 PM, Mabinogia said:

I'm like that. It drives people nuts because they'll be all "oh, you liked Buffy, you'll love Firefly". I loved Buffy. I hated and loathed Firefly. Just because the same dude made them doesn't mean I'm gonna like em both. 

I was the same way. Super big Buffy fan, but I think I could only make it through half a Firefly episode because I found the concept really dumb.

On 3/7/2021 at 1:09 PM, Mabinogia said:

Based on our mutual likes a friend thought I'd love Schitt's Creek. Can't stand it. Couldn't get through a single ep I was so annoyed with how hard it was trying. 

I am not sure I could get into Schitts Creek because every time I see Dan Levy I am reminded that he was one of the many annoying hosts when MTV Canada was launched.

[Ubiquit0us]

On 3/8/2021 at 2:18 PM, JimmyJabloon said:

I really wanted to like bojack horseman. But I couldn't watch more than 4 episodes.

At least you have the option of watching more than four eps! I have never seen more than one ep of Bojack Horseman at a time. 😡

[Zella]

8 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

The weird thing about people saying that others didn't like Arrested Development because it was too smart, was that AD had a narrator who would explain and re-explain most of the storylines and running gags on a given episode. So I don't think that people didn't watch it because it was too smart or too hard to follow.

Arrested Development was also unabashedly pretty goofy--and that's what I really loved about the show was the way it blended some more high-concept comedy with some pretty stupid shit. I enjoyed the little layers that they added to the show and it does make it very rewarding to rewatch, but the stuff that made me laugh the hardest tended to be the silliest.

So, it always makes me do a double-take when people act like you needed to be "smart" to get the humor. It's a very specific form of humor that's not for everyone, but I don't think viewer intelligence really plays into that so much as personal taste. 

[magicdog]

On 3/7/2021 at 12:29 PM, Katy M said:

I couldn't udnerstand why he was always changing his shoes and sweater.

It was reflecting the difference between play time and work time.  I'm from that generation that had a "nice wardrobe" (dresses, jumpers, mary jane shoes) for church, school, and holidays, while "playtime" was wearing more casual clothes (jeans, t-shirts, sneakers).

[Wiendish Fitch]

I HATE Catra from She-Ra and the Princesses of Power. If she'd just stayed a villain, I could at least enjoy hating her, maybe even consider a magnificent bitch, and call it a day.

But noooooooooooooo.

They had to woobie-fy her, sweep her actions (which include attempted murder, mass slaughter, and nearly causing the apocalypse) under the rug, ply us with villain apologia (as Mermista would say, "UGGGGHHHHH!"), and even worse? The writers frame Adora as somehow in the wrong and responsible for Catra being the way she is.

Um, the hell?

Adora is not without her faults, but I refuse to believe she is in any way responsible for Catra's toxic codependency and evil behavior. Adora gave Catra dozens of opportunities to leave the Horde and join the rebellion, but Catra always refused. I loved the moment in season 3 where Adora finally came to her senses, basically said "Fuck you and this whole mess!" and gave up on Catra. The fact that the final season basically erased all that, had them get together and treated it like the greatest love story ever, and why? 'Cause Catra was a bit blue over her actions from season 4, and kind of helped our heroes out a bit (y'know, after being a complete ingrate after Adora saved her).

Catra's whole arc basically amounted to this:

Edited March 14, 2021 by Wiendish Fitch

[Ms Blue Jay]

I love Parks and Recreation Season 1.   I like most of the show, but I feel like the majority opinion is that Season 1 is bad.  In fact, I loved it.  I loved the show immediately from the pilot.  

I loved Will Ferrell on The Office.  I loved Idris Elba on The Office too.  

Arrested Development is unwatchable for me after Season 1.  Season 1 is one of the best things I've ever seen, but after that, I can't take it.  It doesn't help that Portia De Rossi completely changed her face.

Edited March 14, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[Ms Blue Jay]

On 12/24/2020 at 9:56 AM, JimmyJabloon said:

Friends- I don't hate Ross. 

I love Ross, and I love Ted on "How I Met Your Mother", as well.

Most narration annoys me, and I don't need it, so for me, Kristen Bell's narration on Gossip Girl is one major drawback from that show.  When I heard that they were going to keep this for the reboot, I was very sad.  I also heard that KB "begged" to narrate the original show, and they weren't even going to have a narrator.  The whole thing annoys me top to bottom.  

Edited March 14, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[DoctorAtomic]

I liked the narrator on AD because it was basically another viewer watching the show with me. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

I think liking Ron Howard on AD is a very popular opinion.  I don't mind the narration on AD as much because at least it was clever and funny and added jokes to the narrative.

 

[Zella]

Ron Howard's Narrator Voice basically lives rent-free in my head, silently retorting to people all day long. 

[Spartan Girl]

On Angel I had zero problems with Angel stepping aside and letting Darla and Dru massacre the evil lawyers from Wolfram and Hart. They were the ones that got Dru to turn Darla back into a vampire and we’re more than happy to have them murder innocent people. Them showing up to their house wine party was the perfect act of karma. Plus, the Powers pretty much intended for it to happen since they tried to distract Angel with Cordy’s visions of another person in trouble, so it’s not like he was supposed to save them. 

Yeah, it wasn’t exactly a good thing to do, but hardly the worst thing Angel ever did. So Cordy and Wesley can miss me with that righteous horror. Bad guys got what they deserved. The end.

[Ambrosefolly]

17 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

On Angel I had zero problems with Angel stepping aside and letting Darla and Dru massacre the evil lawyers from Wolfram and Hart. They were the ones that got Dru to turn Darla back into a vampire and we’re more than happy to have them murder innocent people. Them showing up to their house wine party was the perfect act of karma. Plus, the Powers pretty much intended for it to happen since they tried to distract Angel with Cordy’s visions of another person in trouble, so it’s not like he was supposed to save them. 

Yeah, it wasn’t exactly a good thing to do, but hardly the worst thing Angel ever did. So Cordy and Wesley can miss me with that righteous horror. Bad guys got what they deserved. The end.

I will argue until my dying day that I had no problem with Arya offing House Fray, the only thing I worried they would have an arc where it turned her evil so I was glad it didn't. They murdered her mother, brother, sister-in-law and unborn nephew along with her country man by breaking a long held sacred custom after feigning forgiveness for Rob Stark's mistake, but she can't wipe out the people who did that because she is a "good guy?" Well fuck that.

[Mabinogia]

On 3/14/2021 at 4:27 PM, Ms Blue Jay said:

I love Parks and Recreation Season 1.   I like most of the show, but I feel like the majority opinion is that Season 1 is bad.  In fact, I loved it.  I loved the show immediately from the pilot.  

Season 1 was a whole lot better than the last couple seasons. As much as I loved the show, I think it went on too long.

I know the biggest gripe about Season 1 seems to be the Mark Brandanowitz character. He certainly wasn't my favorite but I didn't mind him. I wasn't sad to see him go but I would have been fine with him staying as well. He was just sort of there. 

I did grow to hate both April and Tom though. They were just mean for the sake of being mean. And the way Gerry was treated got old really, really fast. 

[kiddo82]

52 minutes ago, Mabinogia said:

I did grow to hate both April and Tom though. They were just mean for the sake of being mean. And the way Gerry was treated got old really, really fast. 

I don't mind in principle when sitcom characters act mean to each other.  Sitcom life is usually heightened and as long as the joke is funny I can forgive a sitcom character more easily than I would a person who is supposed to be more real.  Having said that, the Gerry jokes just seemed really mean spirited and not that funny.  I know the point was that Gerry's life was actually hella awesome, which should have given him the last laugh, but we never seen the rest of characters have a reckoning with that.  They just go right back to making fun of him.  

[Danny Franks]

12 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

On Angel I had zero problems with Angel stepping aside and letting Darla and Dru massacre the evil lawyers from Wolfram and Hart. They were the ones that got Dru to turn Darla back into a vampire and we’re more than happy to have them murder innocent people. Them showing up to their house wine party was the perfect act of karma. Plus, the Powers pretty much intended for it to happen since they tried to distract Angel with Cordy’s visions of another person in trouble, so it’s not like he was supposed to save them. 

Yeah, it wasn’t exactly a good thing to do, but hardly the worst thing Angel ever did. So Cordy and Wesley can miss me with that righteous horror. Bad guys got what they deserved. The end.

That's one of the best moments in the entire series - Angel's slow walk down the stairs, Darla, Dru and the lawyers realising he's there, then he stands inscrutably at the door while Darla mocks him and Holland begs. His repetition of Holland's earlier line, "somehow, I can't seem to care" [about people dying] is perfect.

Yes, it was Angel stepping over the line so I get why Cordy, Wes and Gunn were upset, but I don't blame him one bit. The mistake he made was firing his team and alienating them instead of letting them work through their shock and anger. That's the thing he has to make up for later, when he has his epiphany.

Another unpopular Angel opinion is that I actually liked the prospects of an Angel/Cordelia romance. I thought Cordy's snarky affection and Angel's goofiness as genuine friends was lovely, and could easily see it building into more as they spent about ninety percent of their waking lives together.

We already knew that Cordy thought Angel was hot from the early days of Buffy, and that was before she knew what a noble, tortured soul he was. Angel himself had seen all of Cordy's growth as a person, from that superficial cheerleader to having a noble, tortured soul of her own. Then they start raising Connor together, and get to see new sides of one another as doting parent and quasi-parent, and it just made sense.

Also, it's not like Angel's relationship with Buffy was worth putting on some pedestal that could never be scaled.

Unfortunately, because it's Whedon it all had to be angsty and painful and impossible to ever work.

Edited March 18, 2021 by Danny Franks

[Spartan Girl]

Completely agree @Danny Franks! The Cordy/Angel romance had so much better potential than it actually got. Too bad Whedon had to ruin it because he got all buttsore over Charisma’s pregnancy. 

I also thought it would have been better if the show hadn’t gone down the “Connor getting kidnapped and coming back as a bitter, hateful, emo teen” route. I would have loved to see Angel actually getting to experience more parenthood.

[Hiyo]

What is it with TV shows saddling us with a main character's long-lost kid and/or rapidly aged kid? It rarely ever works, and can be quite a turn-off.

[Kel Varnsen]

3 hours ago, Danny Franks said:

Also, it's not like Angel's relationship with Buffy was worth putting on some pedestal that could never be scaled.

Even back in the day I always thought that relationship was kind of stupid. I mean even beyond the creep factor, I am in my 40's and I can't imagine how annoying it would be to interact socially with a bunch of 16 year olds. After being alive for a few centuries it would have to be impossible.

Then on top of that there is the creep factor, with her being in high school and him being a very old adult. Especially in that flashback from season 2 that revealed he started watching her when she was 15. So gross.

[Blergh]

1 hour ago, Hiyo said:

What is it with TV shows saddling us with a main character's long-lost kid and/or rapidly aged kid? It rarely ever works, and can be quite a turn-off.

I agree! It was a lame idea for Xena. Yes, I know that she and Gabrielle were in some kind of suspended animation during the former's daughter entire childhood and early adulthood but the two of them still had to deal with the title character's daughter when they got revived and it was a completely awkward- and, frankly, unbelievable story arc (and that's totally ignoring the bogus chain of events that led to the girl's conception ).

[Wiendish Fitch]

1 hour ago, Hiyo said:

What is it with TV shows saddling us with a main character's long-lost kid and/or rapidly aged kid? It rarely ever works, and can be quite a turn-off.

There was a Star Trek: DS9 episode that dealt with this, in which poor little Molly O'Brien got sucked into a time vortex-thingy, and re-emerged as a teenaged cave girl minutes later (years have gone by from her dimension). Thankfully, the episode ends with Cave!Molly being sent back into the time vortex thingy, running into her 5-year-old self, sending her back, and this causes Cave!Molly to blip out of existence.

Some viewers gripe about this ending, but I am absolutely fine with it. Not only because I don't like "rapid aging" storylines to begin with, but doesn't Miles O'Brien get enough crap dumped on him as is???

[Blergh]

I rarely ever saw The Talk but when I tuned in, I thought that Sara Gilbert was one of the more likable folks on it.

 

Even so, it seemed  to me that ,despite her lengthy performing career, Miss Gilbert  has been a painfully shy individual who seems rather uncomfortable discussing her off-camera life to the point that it  appeared as though she'd have rather been anywhere but on that set. It was almost like watching a turtle  constantly withdrawing into her shell/sweater thinking that   hawks would nab her at any moment. Yes, I know she created this enterprise but it's puzzling to me why she didn't just produce it via backstage  from Day One onward (which she wound up doing the last seasons)  if she  truly didn't want to let it all hang out on camera. 

Edited March 18, 2021 by Blergh

[Zella]

1 hour ago, Blergh said:

I rarely ever saw The Talk but when I tuned in, I thought that Sara Gilbert was one of the more likable folks on it.

 

Even so, it seemed  to me that ,despite her lengthy performing career, Miss Gilbert  has been a painfully shy individual who seems rather uncomfortable discussing her off-camera life to the point that it  appeared as though she'd have rather been anywhere but on that set. It was almost like watching a turtle  constantly withdrawing into her shell/sweater thinking that   hawks would nab her at any moment. Yes, I know she created this enterprise but it's puzzling to me why she didn't just produce it via backstage  from Day One onward (which wound up doing the last seasons)  if she  truly didn't want to let it all hang out on camera. 

I watched a fair amount of The Talk back in the day, and that was my read on her too. I liked hearing her perspective quite a bit more than some of the more outspoken people (here's looking at you, Sharon), but she was so visibly uncomfortable that it made for awkward viewing. 

I've been reading a lot of the behind the scenes stuff about The Talk, and it seems like a) it was a very toxic place, which I always wondered about, and b) Sara Gilbert didn't really have as much control as you'd expect from an executive producer. It wouldn't surprise me if it's true that she really didn't want to be there. 

 

[kathyk24]

20 hours ago, Ambrosefolly said:

I will argue until my dying day that I had no problem with Arya offing House Fray, the only thing I worried they would have an arc where it turned her evil so I was glad it didn't. They murdered her mother, brother, sister-in-law and unborn nephew along with her country man by breaking a long held sacred custom after feigning forgiveness for Rob Stark's mistake, but she can't wipe out the people who did that because she is a "good guy?" Well fuck that.

I feel the same way about Tyrion killing his father. Tywin treated his son like dirt from the time he was born and allowed him to be bullied by Cersei. Tywin deserved his fate.

[proserpina65]

21 hours ago, Ambrosefolly said:

I will argue until my dying day that I had no problem with Arya offing House Fray, the only thing I worried they would have an arc where it turned her evil so I was glad it didn't. They murdered her mother, brother, sister-in-law and unborn nephew along with her country man by breaking a long held sacred custom after feigning forgiveness for Rob Stark's mistake, but she can't wipe out the people who did that because she is a "good guy?" Well fuck that.

I found her actions disturbing, but justified within the framework of the story.  I'm glad she didn't any farther down that very dark path, though.

 

6 hours ago, Blergh said:

I agree! It was a lame idea for Xena. Yes, I know that she and Gabrielle were in some kind of suspended animation during the former's daughter entire childhood and early adulthood but the two of them still had to deal with the title character's daughter when they got revived and it was a completely awkward- and, frankly, unbelievable story arc (and that's totally ignoring the bogus chain of events that led to the girl's conception ).

That was terrible enough that just reading episode descriptions made me glad I had long since stopped watching.

[GaT]

12 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

I also thought it would have been better if the show hadn’t gone down the “Connor getting kidnapped and coming back as a bitter, hateful, emo teen” route. I would have loved to see Angel actually getting to experience more parenthood.

The Connor storyline led to the Cordy getting pregnant storyline, & both pretty much ruined the show. Then Whedon decided to hammer the nail in the coffin & came up with the Illyria storyline & that was that.

[kieyra]

12 hours ago, Hiyo said:

What is it with TV shows saddling us with a main character's long-lost kid and/or rapidly aged kid? It rarely ever works, and can be quite a turn-off.

Because kids on TV are boring unless they’re written with unlikely 30-year-old dialogue coming out of their mouths. 🙂

[DoctorAtomic]

Setting aside the context, the kids on the Cosby show actually acted liked kids (until they obviously grew up). I think that was a main reason the show was popular.