Talking Dead: Where Chris Hardwick Got His Groove Back

[Macbeth]

Oh Lennie I will miss you.  You are such a fantastic actor.  But I will not be traveling with you to FTWD or whatever they call it.  I can never get back the hours I spent on the first season.  I feel your pain.

With Lennie going, Danai Gurira working on major movies, Xander Berkeley (the actor playing Gregory) has been revealed to be a pervert, I agree with Kevin Smith - Carol (and her new group for me)  is keeping me watching the show.  

And then the show kills off a good portion of the Kingdom.  FU show.

Oh but when Jerry smiles - he has the greatest smile ever.

[ghoulina]

I quit watching FTWD sometime in the second season, so I could care less who they bring in - although, I do think Lennie is too good for that horrible show. Using him certainly won't get me to start watching again. 

[Anela]

I have no interest in watching it, either. I'm barely watching the main show, right now. The other one lost me quickly. 

[RedheadZombie]

On ‎11‎/‎27‎/‎2017 at 2:49 PM, SimoneS said:

I was in the library and there was the season 7 DVD set with Negan on it. Blech. I almost threw up in my mouth. I bet the sales are slow as hell compared to previous seasons.

Well, Frank Dillane is also black (not sure how he self-identifies though) so the show has already hit that mark.

I did not know Frank's mom was Biracial so I googled her.  Frank looks exactly like his mother.  It's amazing. http://articlebio.com/naomi-wirthner

[SnarkyTart]

3 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

I did not know Frank's mom was Biracial so I googled her.  Frank looks exactly like his mother.  It's amazing. http://articlebio.com/naomi-wirthner

Holy smokes, it's uncanny!

Edited November 29, 2017 by SnarkyTart

[peach]

3 hours ago, SnarkyTart said:

Holy smokes, it's uncanny!

But that's him.  lol  For some reason, that pic comes up in the images when you google his mom.

[Iguessnot]

6 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

I did not know Frank's mom was Biracial so I googled her.  Frank looks exactly like his mother.  It's amazing. http://articlebio.com/naomi-wirthner

Yeah I don't know why his picture is on her bio. With a google image search, you'll she her picture.

[SnarkyTart]

16 minutes ago, peach said:

But that's him.  lol  For some reason, that pic comes up in the images when you google his mom.

LOL!  And here I was coming back to add a comment that it looks like they share the same hair stylist and wardrobe of old man sweaters.

[Iguessnot]

24 minutes ago, SnarkyTart said:

LOL!  And here I was coming back to add a comment that it looks like they share the same hair stylist and wardrobe of old man sweaters.

Ripped old man sweaters at that.

[SimoneS]

7 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

I did not know Frank's mom was Biracial so I googled her.  Frank looks exactly like his mother.  It's amazing. http://articlebio.com/naomi-wirthner

He looks like her, but not exactly. This is his mom here: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1528731/

[RedheadZombie]

33 minutes ago, SimoneS said:

He looks like her, but not exactly. This is his mom here: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1528731/

WTF?  Is the one I posted Frank with lipstick?

[nachomama]

I thought his (Frank/Nick) hair on FTWD was because, hey, it's the apocalypse, he's a drug addict. Now I have no explanation why he is just opposed to combing his hair. Was he abused by a comb as a child? Fear the Walking Comb?  Or he knows he'll one day be bald like his dad so he feels his hair should roam free now.

[ljenkins782]

2 hours ago, nachomama said:

I thought his (Frank/Nick) hair on FTWD was because, hey, it's the apocalypse, he's a drug addict. Now I have no explanation why he is just opposed to combing his hair. Was he abused by a comb as a child? Fear the Walking Comb?  Or he knows he'll one day be bald like his dad so he feels his hair should roam free now.

His hairline is already running for the hills, so I'd assume it's the latter. ;) 

Quote

WTF?  Is the one I posted Frank with lipstick?

He does appear to have some sort of lipstick and the pic has a rather feminine vibe to it, it wasn't until I saw this version of the same day that I knew it was him for sure:

 

[BasilSeal]

On 27 November 2017 at 11:23 PM, SimoneS said:

AMC will probably do a FTWD marathon from the beginning to set up Morgan's arrival. If you do watch, just don't expect much, okay anything, that way you will just be disappointed rather than crushed. 

fTWD is actually a better show that the original, from a technical point of view anyway. It doesn't really tell us anything we don't already know about the start of the ZA, which many dislike, but  the problem there is the walkers are really just a big old lumbering metaphor, there is no possible rational or pseudo scientific explanation for them other than: "A Wizard did it. then ran away" because they defy the laws of physics. They only exist as a form of existential danger to the characters, you have to just accept they are there and ignore the fact their existence is a physical impossibility. they can never look too closely at the origins of the walkers because if they did it would highlight their literal impossibility.

The show has a very different look to it because it's shot in the very sharp bright light of the desert as opposed to the dingy gloom that's used to signify the decaying world of TWD.

The characters are not that sympathetic which makes it harder to empathise with them, but this is largely to facilitate the key theme that those who survive do so at the expense of others, and in order for you and yours to get through it, it's necessary to either leave others to their fate or even be instrumental in bringing said fate about. the theme of moral equivalence crops up in TWD as well, but it's dealt with in the spin off with far more subtlety, characters choose between morality and survival but their choices are consistent, and some characters like Daniel had already made this choice in the old world.

I think the characters in fTWD are also more human, due to the comic book source material of the original the characters in TWD tend to be more cartoonish caricatures, this is a particular problem with the villains and fTWD has succeeded where the original has failed on several occasions now by actually having a major villain in Proctor John whose motivations and actions actually make sense, where as Negan and the governor are Dick Dastardly type cartoon villains who do bad things simply because they are the baddies and it's what's expected of them. the writers also mostly, though not entirely, avoid the common trope used in TWD of having the characters suddenly become really really stupid just to move the plot forward or create tension / danger. As one review put it, TWD is about super heroes, fTWD is about people.

In short it's a very different show to the original, it's almost like it takes place in a different universe, and it will be interesting to see how they fit morgan in, both from the perspective of disparate time lines, and from the differences of tone between the two shows.

[peach]

4 hours ago, ljenkins782 said:

His hairline is already running for the hills, so I'd assume it's the latter. ;) 

He does appear to have some sort of lipstick and the pic has a rather feminine vibe to it, it wasn't until I saw this version of the same day that I knew it was him for sure:

 

Ah, yes, this is our raggedy Nick we all know.

[peach]

2 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

I think the characters in fTWD are also more human, due to the comic book source material of the original the characters in TWD tend to be more cartoonish caricatures, this is a particular problem with the villains and fTWD has succeeded where the original has failed on several occasions now by actually having a major villain in Proctor John whose motivations and actions actually make sense, where as Negan and the governor are Dick Dastardly type cartoon villains who do bad things simply because they are the baddies and it's what's expected of them.

Apt summary of why TWD gets progressively worse.   I thought even the Governor was a pretty good character, esp because of David Morrissey's performance.  And Danai was able to make Michonne seem like a real person and not too outlandish.   But once Abraham & Co showed up, it started screaming "comic book" from their very first appearance.  And now here we are years later with ninja pacifist Jesus, and Negan, and CGI tigers, and bad wigs, and Mad Max naked garbage morons.  <Sigh>

You almost convince me to watch fTWD again.  Almost.

[BasilSeal]

11 hours ago, peach said:

You almost convince me to watch fTWD again.  Almost.

fTWD is still flawed, but overall it's a more rounded and accomplished production than the original show, particularly the current 8th series which is just a mess. It hits far more of it's chosen targets and achieves more of what the writers set out to do, it may not be telling the story that some people want it to tell, but that doesn't mean it's a bad show.

the hate directed towards it on here isn't really justified, particularly when the original show it's base on is frequently given a free pass for far worse failings. I think one reason people cut TWD so much slack is because they like many of the key characters, fTWD doesn't have these iconic characters and as such even though it's characters are more real and act much more consitently, people just don't have the attachment to them, particularly when many of them aren't particularly sympathetic.

Morrissey  did his best with The Governor, but the problem with that character is why he does what he does, why get so worked up about the prison? they pose no threat to his community or his position, he could just leave them to it and get on with playing post apocalyptic bond villain in peace. the only apparent reason for his relentless and self destructive fight with the prison dwellers appears to be that he's stark raving mad, which is a bit of a shit reason, in all fairness. There's no depth or motivation to his character.

The, as you say, we get a host of new characters who are stylised and hyper real, no one looks like Abraham or Ezekiel in real life, unless they're on their way to a cos play convention.

[SimoneS]

16 hours ago, peach said:

You almost convince me to watch fTWD again.  Almost.

Eh, FTWD is still rubbish with bad writing and mostly bad acting. I occasionally watch in hope, but it never improves. However, I will be watching for Lennie. Hopefully, finally having a talented lead might make a difference. 

[ghoulina]

4 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

the hate directed towards it on here isn't really justified, particularly when the original show it's base on is frequently given a free pass for far worse failings. I think one reason people cut TWD so much slack is because they like many of the key characters, fTWD doesn't have these iconic characters and as such even though it's characters are more real and act much more consitently, people just don't have the attachment to them, particularly when many of them aren't particularly sympathetic.

But with a character driven show, isn't that important? Characters you can relate to or root for? That's EXACTLY why I still keep watching TWD. When I first started watching, I was instantly drawn to Rick. I loved Carl and Daryl right away. T-dog made me laugh. Merle was horrible, but supremely entertaining. The mothership has some amazing actors. FTWD? I tried. I really did. But I didn't care about ANY of the characters. They were all boring and unrelatable and much of the acting was flat out awful. I've enjoyed Kim Dickens in other things, but she is the WORST in FTWD. Her face perpetually looks like she's smelling a bad fart. 

It's been awhile since I quit watching, so my memory is bad, but I remember the storyline of FTWD often being just as nonsensical as TWD. But yea, I'm connected to the characters on the original, so I'll keep watching and hope for the occasional good episode. There is no reason for me to watch Fear again. Ever. 

[Ocean Chick]

I, too, enjoy some of the characters on Original Flavor, which is why I keep watching.  I gave FTWD 2 years, but Strand and Daniel were the only ones I really liked, and they just weren't enough to win over the stench of the other characters.  Especially when odd groups of people keep thinking a junkie or a teen aged girl would make awesome leaders for groups filled with much more experienced people.

[BasilSeal]

5 hours ago, ghoulina said:

But with a character driven show, isn't that important? Characters you can relate to or root for? That's EXACTLY why I still keep watching TWD. When I first started watching, I was instantly drawn to Rick. I loved Carl and Daryl right away. T-dog made me laugh. Merle was horrible, but supremely entertaining. The mothership has some amazing actors. FTWD? I tried. I really did. But I didn't care about ANY of the characters. They were all boring and unrelatable and much of the acting was flat out awful. I've enjoyed Kim Dickens in other things, but she is the WORST in FTWD. Her face perpetually looks like she's smelling a bad fart. 

The characters on TWD , particularly in earlier seasons, were very poorly drawn, I also don't see how anyone can call Kim Dickinson's character annoying when they've watched a  series with Lori Grimes in it, who was without exception the single most awful person in the entire world. Here's a review from the time that pretty much sums up my feelings on the first two TWD seasons:

https://mostlyfilm.com/2012/04/11/planks-vs-zombies/#more-4737

 

Sure, you can pick holes in fTWD, just as you can with any series, but any fault you can find in Fear, TWD original has in spades.

[ghoulina]

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. I am one of the few Lori-fans, but I empathized with her. The plots and relationships were interesting, unlike FTWD. Lori may have been annoying (to some, not all), but I think SWC was capable of more than one expression, which is more than I can say for the unfortunate Dickens fart face. 

[BasilSeal]

55 minutes ago, ghoulina said:

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. I am one of the few Lori-fans, but I empathized with her. The plots and relationships were interesting, unlike FTWD. Lori may have been annoying (to some, not all), but I think SWC was capable of more than one expression, which is more than I can say for the unfortunate Dickens fart face. 

We'll definitely have to agree to disagree on those points. Plot and characterisation were the two weakest parts of early period TWD, the characters were just broadly drawn cyphers whose personalities expanded and contracted to suit the needs of the plot. At least in Fear the characters are consistent, they make reasoned logical choices that don't contradict stuff they've said or done a couple of episodes earlier.

[nodorothyparker]

We've all veered increasingly far off topic, which is what's discussed on The Talking Dead.  If we want to continue comparing the shows, there is a thread for that in the FTWD forum or we can start one in this forum now that the shows will be more closely linked.  Please limit further posts on this thread to TTD.

[SimoneS]

David Mazouz is on TD. Such a talented young actor. 

[SoSueMe]

Josh is pretty funny.

[Ohwell]

Dwight looks like a 70s rocker.  I like his look.

[raven]

14 minutes ago, SoSueMe said:

Josh is pretty funny.

He's always good in interviews.  I used to like when they would have him and Michael Cudlitz together.

[shanndee]

Hardwick "There's a minor on the couch!"

Time lapse.

David Mazouz "There's a minor on the couch!"  Ha! Young man has a sense of humour. :) 

[gutbuster]

I hope not, but I tend to agree that the shocking moment is going to be at least one non-Savior death and we'll find out what, or who, Rick was weepy about in the time shift scene from the season premiere. So tired of the show killing off characters as their crutch for creating 'drama'. Please, Show, do something else. Other things can happen to shock us and make the show interesting.

Sneak peek of next weeks episode, Michonne says "they got out?!". Uh, of course they got out. This was Daryl and Tara's big plan? Does Daryl not remember how his group of, what, 10 people or so, were able to clear an entire prison of walkers with less than what Negan has at the Sanctuary? And so next week is basically reset to season 7 premiere and Negan doing more of the same at Alexandria. I'm bored already. 

I enjoyed the guests this week. I always like Josh, and Austin seemed more relaxed than I remember him being last time.  David was normal and adorable. Excited for the guests next week! Except for Gimple (a thorn between two roses).

[peach]

1 hour ago, gutbuster said:

Sneak peek of next weeks episode, Michonne says "they got out?!". Uh, of course they got out. This was Daryl and Tara's big plan? Does Daryl not remember how his group of, what, 10 people or so, were able to clear an entire prison of walkers with less than what Negan has at the Sanctuary? And so next week is basically reset to season 7 premiere and Negan doing more of the same at Alexandria. I'm bored already.

This is why it was so dumb of Rosita and Michonne to take off when they knew what Daryl was going to do.   If you thought this was going to be a mistake and cause problems, WHY would you just leave and have no idea what the outcome was?  Instead of being all "I don't want to be a part of this, so I can later be shocked they are coming for us instead of being there to take them out before they could."  And WHY did Daryl and Tara run away and not wait to see what happened either?  Weren't they supposed to meet Rick there?  THIS SHOW IS DUMB.

[DEL901]

5 hours ago, peach said:

This is why it was so dumb of Rosita and Michonne to take off when they knew what Daryl was going to do.   If you thought this was going to be a mistake and cause problems, WHY would you just leave and have no idea what the outcome was?  Instead of being all "I don't want to be a part of this, so I can later be shocked they are coming for us instead of being there to take them out before they could."  And WHY did Daryl and Tara run away and not wait to see what happened either?  Weren't they supposed to meet Rick there?  THIS SHOW IS DUMB.

Why would they leave and make a bad outcome more likely? 

[Mu Shu]

17 hours ago, Ohwell said:

Dwight looks like a 70s rocker.  I like his look.

I think he looks like a mash up of Tom Petty and Eric Erlandson.  He is a striking guy.

[raven]

That was a pretty good episode.  I like to watch next day and I can FF thru the fan stuff and commercials.

David Mazouz's idea of putting the Joker and Negan in a cell in Arkham together - and the Joker has the bat - seemed to be something he'd been thinking of, I liked him.  Plus "there's a minor on the couch!" when Josh leaned over to "bite" Austin's package. 

Josh is always good "why does Dwight wear Daryl's jacket" "it's in the script" hee.  I like the way Josh is always "that's the way the show wants it/it's written", etc.   Still, both he and Austin Amelio give thought to their characters,

[MichaelaRae]

Oh, shut the hell up, Gimple. You'd blow your own dick if you could reach it.

[shanndee]

Simple HAS to know that this show is in a death spiral. Who does he think he's kidding?

[mightysparrow]

So Gimple, YNB and Khary are sitting around talking about Carl.  Chandler is going to be on the half-season opener.  None of the people who have worked with Chandler for YEARS is on the show.   THEY"RE STILL DICKING WITH THE AUDIENCE!!

Edited December 11, 2017 by mightysparrow
Forgot something.

[ottoDbusdriver]

Just now, mightysparrow said:

So Gimple, YNB and Khary are sitting around talking about Carl.  Chandler is going to be on the half-season opener.  THEY"RE STILL DICKING WITH THE AUDIENCE!!

Plus, there's always flashbacks that Carl could appear in.  Or Carl could appear as a ghost and haunt Rick, kind of like Laurie did in the prison.

So, did Chandler get a better gig somewhere else ?

[catrox14]

2 minutes ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

Plus, there's always flashbacks that Carl could appear in.  Or Carl could appear as a ghost and haunt Rick, kind of like Laurie did in the prison.

So, did Chandler get a better gig somewhere else ?

Spoiler TV article with Chandler says he was written out. He didn't leave of his own accord. Or maybe I misread but he didn't expect Carl to be killed I think. Spoiler barring this just in case.

Spoiler

Revealing that he had been bitten on the ribs a few episodes prior, Carl Grimes — Rick's teenage son, who has been played by Chandler Riggs since the show's pilot — is on death's door. "Yes, Carl is going to die," Riggs tells The Hollywood Reporter in an exclusive interview. "There's no way he can get back from that. His story is definitely coming to an end."

When did you find out?

I was planning on going to college until I found out. I found out when I was doing rehearsals for episode six back in June. It was quite the shocker for me, Andy and everyone because I don't think anyone saw it coming. It's definitely not a bad thing because it has been awesome being on the show but now I get to go and do a lot of other stuff that I haven't gotten to do before. Scott wanted to meet in person because it was such a big deal. We had just finished rehearsing for a scene in episode six and he wanted to meet with me and my mom and dad and talk about what's going to happen.

Edited December 11, 2017 by catrox14

[CletusMusashi]

They could have Carl as a ghost without even having to pay Chandler. All it would take is a hat on a string.

[shanndee]

Oh. Khary...I think I heart you! 

[chick binewski]

Daryl stop mumbling the end of your lines!

 

Mona was quite handsy.

[ParadoxLost]

The most interesting thing about this episode of TD is that YNB is no longer coming across like a super fan of the show. 

Edited December 11, 2017 by ParadoxLost

[peach]

42 minutes ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

So, did Chandler get a better gig somewhere else ?

He's filming a movie about opiate dealers in the Appalachians.  And he released some music on Soundcloud today. 

[callmebetty]

The answered none of the questions I had. 

What is going to happen with Oceanside?

Is Jerry still alive?

What's up with Morgan?

And fuck you Gimple. Why the fuck does it have to be a secret when Carl got bit? What the fuck mystery could it be. It's just a stupid thing to hide.

Good luck to Chandler Riggs. You're lucky to he out. 

[mightysparrow]

6 minutes ago, ParadoxLost said:

The most interesting thing about this episode of TD is that YNB is no longer coming across like a super fan of the show. 

When the biggest 'superfan' can't be bothered to pull out her pom-poms, things are in rough shape.

[ParadoxLost]

Just now, mightysparrow said:

When the biggest 'superfan' can't be bothered to pull out her pom-poms, things are in rough shape.

Yes.  But what was most curious was the under reaction. I can't even imagine YNB being that unmoved by this development in her earlier appearances.  Even Hardwick seemed a little off compared to earlier deaths.

[MrsRafaelBarba]

16 minutes ago, peach said:

He's filming a movie about opiate dealers in the Appalachians.  And he released some music on Soundcloud today. 

 

According to a recent interview, this was Gimple's idea.

[peach]

7 minutes ago, ParadoxLost said:

Yes.  But what was most curious was the under reaction. I can't even imagine YNB being that unmoved by this development in her earlier appearances.  Even Hardwick seemed a little off compared to earlier deaths.

I feel for them, because what is there to say?  It's not just the loss of Carl, it's the unnecessary loss of Carl.  And Rick not killing Negan AGAIN.  It's just...crap. 

Just now, MrsRafaelBarba said:

 

According to a recent interview, this was Gimple's idea.

I just meant that's what he's doing now.  I'm sure he'd rather still be on TWD.

[ottoDbusdriver]

<deleted>

Edited December 11, 2017 by ottoDbusdriver