S16.E07: Choosing Kids Over Kody

[Tabbygirl521]

On 1/4/2022 at 2:59 AM, Joan of Argh said:

Their lack of knowledge regarding monogamous marriages is hilarious! 😂

I have a couple close friends who have gone the separate rooms route and they couldn’t be happier… one was dealing with a husband who snores like a buzz saw…. every night was the same thing, him snoring and her giving him a shove every hour or two to wake him up, neither was getting a good nights sleep… they switched to separate rooms and love it!

another one of my friends is always cold and her husband is a furnace who kicks off all the blankets, they switched to separate rooms and wished they’d done it sooner.

The Browns seem to think that monogamous women are poor little puppets with no freedom who have to ask their husband for permission before doing anything, going anywhere or even reading a book!

they’ve also said how sorry they feel for monogamous women during childbirth because they don’t have anyone to help or support them like sister wives do 🙄

this is my favorite coffee mug and if I want to sit up reading a book or binge watch a series on Netflix I do it… no permission required!

 

But Janelle was once in a monogamous marriage. I think she was suggesting she liked being single. 

[Not Buyin It]

On 1/2/2022 at 11:35 PM, RedDelicious said:

I am reminded of the woman with whom I used to be friends who virtue signaled in many greeting cards throughout 2020. I blocked her and we no longer speak. 2022 and guess who’s never had Covid. Me. And I work in hospitals. Live and let live. Live and let die. I make my own choices. I am responsible for myself and my family only. I’d sooner die than tell someone else how to live their life. LFOD all day every day.

Christine and Janelle do what works for their family units. The writing is on the wall. Compliance with Kobyn’s “rules” is nothing more than exertion of control under the guise of covid avoidance. It 👏 is 👏 not 👏 about 👏 covid and it never was. 

AMEN!

[lilysmom]

1 hour ago, NoWhammies said:

I like to think that Robyn ran in the house with the box in her arms and an extra-wide mask firmly clamped across her extra-wide face, screamed, "You're on your own" to Kody and the nanny, and retired to her chamber for 14 days in an act of self-quarantine in order to abide by any and all rules she--oh excuse me, Kody--is imposing on the others. And in that 14 days of Robyn's self-sacrificing quarantine, Kody and the nanny fell in love, and the nanny is now taking Kody on as a brother-husband to her husband. Kody will be divorcing Robyn and asking Robyn to give up her parental rights so the nanny can adopt Robyn's children (all of them, including the adults) so they can stay with the famibly. 

There needs to be an emoji that can really express how hard I laughed at this. Thank you!!

[truebluesmoky]

If Kody wasn’t established as the kids’ legal father, what paperwork would he have had to sign for Ysabel’s surgery? I think that paperwork proves he IS on the birth certificates. 

[sharkerbaby]

Good point.  Or at least somewhere in some manner he has some legal and/or financial responsibility

Edited January 5, 2022 by sharkerbaby

[Adiba]

4 minutes ago, truebluesmoky said:

If Kody wasn’t established as the kids’ legal father, what paperwork would he have had to sign for Ysabel’s surgery? I think that paperwork proves he IS on the birth certificates. 

It could just have been an agreement to help pay for costs that weren't covered by insurance? However, I think you are right, that it was parental permission to perform the surgery.

Christine likely was going to be looking at a big chunk of change for costs that weren't covered. The surgery is said to cost between $150,000 and $175,000. So even with insurance,  she needed money to help pay for Ysabel's treatment.

[deirdra]

20 hours ago, GeorgiaRai said:

"change clothing after entering shops, other homes or businesses"

We've seen scenes where Kootie gets out of his truck, runs in the front door of Robyn's mansion and hugs Sol & Ari.  No shoe removal, no clothes changing, not even any hand sanitizing. 

[SDVegas]

2 hours ago, Ms.Lulu said:

Here in Oregon, pre-Covid arrangements also remained in place.

I believe either Christine or Kody could bring the other to court for child support or visitation, but I believe on Kody's part the comments were really more for show.

When Kody was doing yard work with Janelle and kids he barely acknowledged them.  And when he visits with Christine (may have been last episode) we see him arrive and leave and we don't see him ask for Truly or Isabel to come outside and chat.

I think it is all for show on this part.  Really, Kody seemed to be trying to control Janelle and Christine rather than gain access to his kids.

 

Speculation, based on the fact that all of the women have chatted about doing home births so that the authorities don't know about the polygamy.  And we know that Christine was on public assistance when the show started.  She wouldn't be eligible for that if she was married or living with the baby's father who had a job at that point.  Since they went public around the time of Truley's birth it is more likely he is on that birth certificate.

And if Kody decided to legally push the issue of visitation (with or without a name on the birth certificate) Christine could ask for child support.

Gosh, there is no evidence or reason to think that Kody is not on his kids’ birth certificates. He has obviously publicly acknowledged that they are all his. 
 

As far as custody - there would be no custody agreement or visitation because he is (or was) married (in their eyes) to the children’s mothers. Married people don’t need custody agreements or child support. 

[ginger90]

4 minutes ago, SDVegas said:

As far as custody - there would be no custody agreement or visitation because he is (or was) married (in their eyes) to the children’s mothers. Married people don’t need custody agreements or child support. 

I’m not exactly sure what you mean by this?

[Ms.Lulu]

31 minutes ago, Adiba said:

It could just have been an agreement to help pay for costs that weren't covered by insurance? However, I think you are right, that it was parental permission to perform the surgery.

Christine likely was going to be looking at a big chunk of change for costs that weren't covered. The surgery is said to cost between $150,000 and $175,000. So even with insurance,  she needed money to help pay for Ysabel's treatment.

I think that's right.  Christine said it was to take on legal responsibility for anything not covered by insurance.

[SDVegas]

5 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

I’m not exactly sure what you mean by this?

People are questioning what the custody agreements are between Kody and his wives. (As of this episode, they are all still spiritually married.)

My point is that custody agreements would not exist, as they are married, and married people don’t generally have custody agreements pertaining to their shared children. 🤷‍♀️ 

[Adiba]

7 minutes ago, SDVegas said:

Gosh, there is no evidence or reason to think that Kody is not on his kids’ birth certificates. He has obviously publicly acknowledged that they are all his. 
 

As far as custody - there would be no custody agreement or visitation because he is (or was) married (in their eyes) to the children’s mothers. Married people don’t need custody agreements or child support. 

Of course, because no one has filed legally for it--though they could.

However, the things are different in theory and in practice. Kody does not treat  Christine, Janelle, or Meri like his wives at present. Notwithstanding their agreement that they are spiritually married--I, as an observer, do not see anything "spiritual" about it. Just because one says it doesn't make it so, imo. He doesn't treat his children by them the same as he does his legal wife's. He treats all of the not-robins and children as if they are distant relatives.

[Ms.Lulu]

6 minutes ago, SDVegas said:

People are questioning what the custody agreements are between Kody and his wives. (As of this episode, they are all still spiritually married.)

My point is that custody agreements would not exist, as they are married, and married people don’t generally have custody agreements pertaining to their shared children. 🤷‍♀️ 

I'm the person.  I was just bringing it up around Truly & Ysabel as Christine and Kody are no longer together.  From the most recent episodes I'm not even sure they were together then.  In that instance Christine could ask for child support and Kody could ask for visitation.

1 minute ago, Ms.Lulu said:

 

 

Edited January 5, 2022 by Ms.Lulu

[Cetacean]

6 minutes ago, SDVegas said:

My point is that custody agreements would not exist, as they are married, and married people don’t generally have custody agreements pertaining to their shared children.

Except that spiritually married is not legally married.  Bigamy is still a crime in all states.  There can be only one legal wife.

[Not Buyin It]

On 1/3/2022 at 2:37 PM, spacefly said:

Here is a short excerpt from her blog on Sister Wive's Closet. It's easy to find just don't want  send her clicks:

"Little did I know that this would be the dichotomy that is Dayton his whole life.  When Dayton was in 2nd grade, the school counselor and psychologist brought me in and told me that he wanted to do some tests on Dayton.  I said yes and we started the long process.  This was when I was told that Dayton has Asperger Syndrome.  I was told it is a high functioning form of Autism.  Dayton had a lot of the behaviors.  It made sense to me because although he was amazing he also struggled with some things quite a bit.  He was artistic, intelligent, had an amazing memory and a sweet disposition, but he also really struggled in school, didn’t understand how to make friends, or how to deal with stress and didn’t have mind-body connection.  The more I learned and researched the more I started to understand what challenges were ahead for him and what I had to do as a mom to support him and advocate for him.  It was my job as his mother to help the world open their eyes to the amazing person before them, help fight for him to get the support he needed and help eliminate stress for him as much as I could.  You see, when someone with Autism or Asperger Syndrome is stressed out, the behaviors that make them stand out are more prevalent.  It has been a long journey but I have been determined to make sure he has every opportunity to be successful and happy.  I have been accused of being a helicopter parent but unless you have been in my shoes you don’t get it."

In other words, Robyn is one of those women who just HAS to make her kids "special", because that makes her a martyr and a MUCH better 'Mom' than those of us who have raised well-adjusted, normal offspring.

She hovers like a dang Chinook over all her kids to the point of making them all maladjusted and quirky.

[Mother of Odin]

On 1/4/2022 at 7:40 AM, Granny58 said:

enjoy perimenopause....because afterwards comes menopause and nothing.  

I like the other side much better. Perimenopause wad awful

[Mother of Odin]

On 1/4/2022 at 4:07 PM, kicotan said:

But I’m betting you didn’t involve yourself in a polygamy set-up where you and all the other wives pump out as many as you can with one man because heaven as if that’s supporting ANY child’s mental health, and then somehow manage to navigate the pandemic clinging to that principle for dear life, regardless of that man’s actual physical involvement with you and/or your kids.

Kody’s wives have impressed upon their children that “living the principle” is more important than the children are, collectively or individually.  The children have to suffer the consequences of their mother’s decision to go against what is considered in modern times socially and/or legally acceptable by choosing their religious beliefs over what is in the best interest of their child(ren). Their children are at risk for mental health issues from the git if for no other reason than the GLARING absence of a responsible, loving father.

I’m also betting that not ONE of those 18 children will choose to follow their parent’s chosen religion or lifestyle.  Lucky for them there are a lot who reject the religion they were exposed to as children so they will have some support in that department.

No, they really haven't. In fact, both Jenelle and Christine raised great kids who love and appreciate their mothers

[WhatAmIWatching]

2 hours ago, Cetacean said:

Except that spiritually married is not legally married.  Bigamy is still a crime in all states.  There can be only one legal wife.

Exactly!
I do sometimes wonder if Kody would try to drag his feet, or try to fight it if Christine pursued child support. 
 

I read your last sentence in Sean Connery's voice, from the movie Highlander. 

[sharkerbaby]

3 hours ago, Cetacean said:

Except that spiritually married is not legally married.  Bigamy is still a crime in all states.  There can be only one legal wife.

Regardless if they were legally married or not, custody and visitation agreements can still be drawn up and binding.  I think the point that was being made is that those agreements likely do not, or at least did not, exist because, as far as the Browns were concerned, they were operating under the assertion that they were married and therefore no agreements were necessary.

[Art Of Noiz]

3 hours ago, Adiba said:

Of course, because no one has filed legally for it--though they could.

However, the things are different in theory and in practice. Kody does not treat  Christine, Janelle, or Meri like his wives at present. Notwithstanding their agreement that they are spiritually married--I, as an observer, do not see anything "spiritual" about it. Just because one says it doesn't make it so, imo. He doesn't treat his children by them the same as he does his legal wife's. He treats all of the not-robins and children as if they are distant relatives.

But he is her father. Christine could sue him for 11 years arrearage.

[Elizzikra]

Quote

Gosh, there is no evidence or reason to think that Kody is not on his kids’ birth certificates. He has obviously publicly acknowledged that they are all his. 

Christine's having been on public assistance is evidence, to some degree, that Kody was not on her children's birth certificates. If he had been, his income would have been considered and they likely would not have qualified.

[Not Buyin It]

On 1/4/2022 at 7:40 AM, Granny58 said:

enjoy perimenopause....because afterwards comes menopause and nothing.  

You say that like it's a BAD thing.

 

[Absolom]

34 minutes ago, Elizzikra said:

Christine's having been on public assistance is evidence, to some degree, that Kody was not on her children's birth certificates. If he had been, his income would have been considered and they likely would not have qualified.

All his children would have been considered needing a share of his income.  Since Christine wasn't working and the other two wives were, she may very well have qualified for some assistance.  

[MsMalin]

 

Quote

Are we to believe that an uneducated, average looking, single mom of three with a ton of debt and no job, had men of means lining up to marry her, but because they wanted to live in monogamy, she declined? 

Yes, and they are all thanking their lucky stars now that she turned them down.

Edited January 6, 2022 by MsMalin

[SongbirdHollow]

On 1/3/2022 at 10:41 AM, Awfarmington said:

In my home state, being married is not a condition of adoption. And quick Google search looks like it’s also not required in Nevada, so unless Kody being married to another woman who is not the mother of the children was an issue, I don’t see why divorcing Meri was part of the process. I mean, I do see why, Robin is a terrible person and so Kody. Obviously her goal was to be legal wife. But in this particular case, if divorce wasn’t an actual requirement, wouldn’t Meri have been aware or made aware by the attorney? 

Maybe divorcing Meri and marrying Robyn was a condition imposed by Robyn’s ex in allowing the adoptions and name changes.  And he also insisted on visitation with the kids afterwards.  Just a guess. 

[Elizzikra]

Quote

 

In my home state, being married is not a condition of adoption.

 

Nevada state law on who may adopt, "Any adult person or any two persons married to each other may petition the court to adopt a child. A married person not lawfully separated from his or her spouse may not adopt a child without the consent of his or her spouse, if such spouse is capable of giving such consent."

This is a great resource for state laws related to many aspects of child welfare, including adoption: https://www.childwelfare.gov/topics/systemwide/laws-policies/state/?CWIGFunctionsaction=statestatutes:main.getResults

I think that in most, if not all, states, adoption by single persons is allowed. I don't think it's common for a state to allow two unmarried people to adopt, though some states may have had provisions for that before same sex couples were allowed to marry. 

Whether or not Kody adopted Robyn's kids, I don't know but I do believe that it would be a viable legal reason for him to have to divorce Meri and marry Robyn.

[nosedive]

On 1/4/2022 at 12:53 AM, Desert Rat said:

On 1/2/2022 at 1:39 PM, BamaGull said:

 I believe he’s mentally ill.

I hadn't considered this before but you might be on to something. He has always exhibited symptoms of bipolar disorder. He is now grandiose, paranoid, OCD and narcissistic. If this continues he will need inpatient treatment. 

An interesting theory.   Of course, we’re privy to only a glimpse of his life, but that won’t stop me from jumping in with my analysis 😉.  

Kody’s personality and behaviors to me seem to be less driven by a mental illness and more the result of having spent the past thirty-plus years operating in a patriarchal construct that endorses his role as absolute authority over his wives and children, a role reinforced by the acquiescence of the members of the family: a construct that demonstrates (in his mind) his hyper-masculinity.  But now the construct that has defined him as man-in-charge, potent-impregnator, super-stud, quasi-deity, and which has been indulged by his family for the past three decades, is crumbling, and all his blustering and hissy fits and stomping his foot can’t stop it.  

When his wives were compliant with all his wishes and whims, and his children were too young to exert agency over their own lives, they reflected his self-image back at him: god of his earthly kingdom to be worshipped and adored.  But who is reflecting that image back at him now?  Robyn and her spawn, maybe?  Certainly not his adult sons.  Certainly not Christine.  And while Janelle hasn’t yet jumped ship, she has the audacity to question his divine wisdom.  With their words and actions, they tell him he’s a failed leader, a paper tiger, an empty shirt.  The more they dare to challenge his authority and disobey his edicts, the more desperate he becomes to reestablish that image of himself.  

So he tightens his grip in an attempt to regain control, no matter what he has to do to accomplish it, including insults and threats and even banishing the recalcitrant sons from the kingdom.  The more his family turns away from him, the more blurred that image becomes and the more he lets loose his fury on them.  If he’s not the exalted lord over his earthly kingdom, who is he?  

Kody is not the leader he fancies himself to be because leaders inspire.  Leaders make personal sacrifices for the good of others.  Leaders bring out the best in the people they lead.  

Thirty-plus years ago, perhaps Kody was a decent fellow.  Perhaps he was insecure about his masculinity?  Perhaps he felt he needed to prove his worth to his father?  Perhaps he actually did believe in The Principle?  But today he is unkind and callous towards the people whom he has pledged to love and cherish for eternity.  What he’s doing is cruel and he knows it.  

I know and love several people with mental illnesses.  They have their challenges, but not one of them is deliberately cruel.  

[Pooky]

9 hours ago, xwordfanatik said:

Even if I hated cats (I don't, they're my favorite animal) I would also choose a cat over that blowhard idiot. 

I dont like cats 🤣😂🤣🤣

[Cetacean]

41 minutes ago, nosedive said:

Kody is not the leader he fancies himself to be because leaders inspire.  Leaders make personal sacrifices for the good of others.  Leaders bring out the best in the people they lead.  

And yet the harem has stuck with their cult leader for 20+.  Slow learners.

[deirdra]

7 hours ago, Cetacean said:

Except that spiritually married is not legally married.  Bigamy is still a crime in all states.  There can be only one legal wife.

But ex-mistresses and even one-night-stands can file for child support from their impregnators.  

Edited January 6, 2022 by deirdra

[Starlight22]

One thing I caught is that when Robyn talked about the other men who were proposing to her before she joined the Browns, she referred to a couple that proposed to her or wanted to date her or something. That struck me as odd, considering she was making the point that she was turning down monogamous relationships. Perhaps she was looking to be a third or fourth wife rather than a second…not sure what the benefits would be…she probably also saw the TLC gravy train coming as well though… 

 

[Cetacean]

8 hours ago, deirdra said:

But ex-mistresses and even one-night-stands can file for child support from their impregnators.  

Oh, absolutely. I was responding to the posting that these folks are all "married" so there would be no child custody arrangements needed.

[Julez]

Hello All😀

Long time lurker, first time posting.

Im across the pond so episodes are behind here, but just wanted to say I think you are fab, so funny & astute.

The screen shot of Douche upthread is a man maniacally unhinged that the curtain has fully been unveiled and he no longer has the control he once had by way of humiliation, blackmailing obedience with scraps of attention to be withdrawn if he is displeased

first started watching series 2 mainly out of curiosity for a life style I could not comprehend, live and let live for sure, but was intrigued especially how the wives coped with sharing a ‘man’ and how the unit and relationships worked, the jealousy, dynamics as well as the purported positives such as ‘sisters’, bonus mums etc.

There are possibly other families who this work for but this family in no way shape or form showed that, in fact confirmed all my pre judgements, shame for other plural families it may work for

The women do not even particularly like each other to the point they would not travel together, perhaps that is part of the torture and challenges they must endure to get to the better place?

They were/are single mothers with an occasional booty call

The hard slog of everyday work with the children was solely on the mothers, whilst Douche fleetingly graced with his presence to dictate & flap around from house to house saying he was exhausted & putting up stupid lights

Christine intrigued me the most

So immersed,cocooned & indoctrinated in that way of life to the extent she disowned her own mother, just staggering.

She tried to keep sweet as she had been indoctrinated to be for a few scraps as a reward with the threat of withdrawal of those scraps if she murmered  an independent thought or need. So sad, pathetic and undignified.

It has taken the health of her daughters to see the reality of the total insignificance she & her children are..

To have a ‘functional’ marriage under her nose, to see the grand home & the icing on the cake to be aware that non household and absolutely non essential dwellers could come and go at Douche Manor

Robin this lazy, manipulative,parasite of a woman should have a nanny just beggars belief, wtf does she do? She is something akin to the upstart in All About Eve..or the body snatchers😱

Meanwhile Christine looked after a dozen, she is lower rank than a nanny

I understand she home schooled and if that is correct she deserves credit, bc many of the children ( tho admittedly the boys)are intelligent, driven and succeeding tho I’m not sure how that would have panned out if they did not go to mainstream school and the exposure to peers ,of opportunites, possibilities & aspiration...as opposed to only having Douche as a role model...seems the sin side of LV they were concerned about has not come to fruition, quite the opposte...wonder if that was the real worry.

I was pleased to hear that Christine had left, can not be easy going against the indoctrination, loss of dignity, humiliation and self esteem, not all that are repeatedly beaten that way can get up.

As noted she seems to have the love and support of her children and non bio children & that must be an  enormous help

Douche ofc is incandescent as the boys especially show him up to be everything he is not & are protective of their mothers, it’s why he wants them gone.

 

All the mothers of the wives recanting their lives in past episodes and the great difficulties of polygamy was sad to hear but heartening that some broke free...to be disowned by some

In a way it’s refreshing & ofc more honest that the ridiculous facade has been dropped to some extent & the gloves are partially off.

The ‘modesty’ wardrobe abandoned, the no swearing line now see’s them dropping F bombs, the Truman show descending into the make believe rubbish we always knew is both fascinating and horrendous, the extent of mental abuse, utter disdain& contempt  K seems to have toward his family shows no bounds in his quest for dominance, he is livid, absolutely livid.

Anyway sorry to the mods if I have digressed somewhat but thanks again for the often laugh out loud and piercing observations on what is increasingly becoming quite a dark, malevolent car crash, the silver lining being the true realisation from some family members and the hope that they have a free and happy future.

Especially the children who had no say in this or the exposure

 

 

[TurtlePower]

4 minutes ago, Julez said:

Hello All😀

Long time lurker, first time posting.

Im across the pond so episodes are behind here, but just wanted to say I think you are fab, so funny & astute.

The screen shot of Douche upthread is a man maniacally unhinged that the curtain has fully been unveiled and he no longer has the control he once had by way of humiliation, blackmailing obedience with scraps of attention to be withdrawn if he is displeased

first started watching series 2 mainly out of curiosity for a life style I could not comprehend, live and let live for sure, but was intrigued especially how the wives coped with sharing a ‘man’ and how the unit and relationships worked, the jealousy, dynamics as well as the purported positives such as ‘sisters’, bonus mums etc.

There are possibly other families who this work for but this family in no way shape or form showed that, in fact confirmed all my pre judgements, shame for other plural families it may work for

The women do not even particularly like each other to the point they would not travel together, perhaps that is part of the torture and challenges they must endure to get to the better place?

They were/are single mothers with an occasional booty call

The hard slog of everyday work with the children was solely on the mothers, whilst Douche fleetingly graced with his presence to dictate & flap around from house to house saying he was exhausted & putting up stupid lights

Christine intrigued me the most

So immersed,cocooned & indoctrinated in that way of life to the extent she disowned her own mother, just staggering.

She tried to keep sweet as she had been indoctrinated to be for a few scraps as a reward with the threat of withdrawal of those scraps if she murmered  an independent thought or need. So sad, pathetic and undignified.

It has taken the health of her daughters to see the reality of the total insignificance she & her children are..

To have a ‘functional’ marriage under her nose, to see the grand home & the icing on the cake to be aware that non household and absolutely non essential dwellers could come and go at Douche Manor

Robin this lazy, manipulative,parasite of a woman should have a nanny just beggars belief, wtf does she do? She is something akin to the upstart in All About Eve..or the body snatchers😱

Meanwhile Christine looked after a dozen, she is lower rank than a nanny

I understand she home schooled and if that is correct she deserves credit, bc many of the children ( tho admittedly the boys)are intelligent, driven and succeeding tho I’m not sure how that would have panned out if they did not go to mainstream school and the exposure to peers ,of opportunites, possibilities & aspiration...as opposed to only having Douche as a role model...seems the sin side of LV they were concerned about has not come to fruition, quite the opposte...wonder if that was the real worry.

I was pleased to hear that Christine had left, can not be easy going against the indoctrination, loss of dignity, humiliation and self esteem, not all that are repeatedly beaten that way can get up.

As noted she seems to have the love and support of her children and non bio children & that must be an  enormous help

Douche ofc is incandescent as the boys especially show him up to be everything he is not & are protective of their mothers, it’s why he wants them gone.

 

All the mothers of the wives recanting their lives in past episodes and the great difficulties of polygamy was sad to hear but heartening that some broke free...to be disowned by some

In a way it’s refreshing & ofc more honest that the ridiculous facade has been dropped to some extent & the gloves are partially off.

The ‘modesty’ wardrobe abandoned, the no swearing line now see’s them dropping F bombs, the Truman show descending into the make believe rubbish we always knew is both fascinating and horrendous, the extent of mental abuse, utter disdain& contempt  K seems to have toward his family shows no bounds in his quest for dominance, he is livid, absolutely livid.

Anyway sorry to the mods if I have digressed somewhat but thanks again for the often laugh out loud and piercing observations on what is increasingly becoming quite a dark, malevolent car crash, the silver lining being the true realisation from some family members and the hope that they have a free and happy future.

Especially the children who had no say in this or the exposure

 

 

Welcome to the longest train wreck ever 🙂! I’ve been waiting for a full derailment for a long time now! 

[Julez]

5 minutes ago, TurtlePower said:

Welcome to the longest train wreck ever 🙂! I’ve been waiting for a full derailment for a long time now! 

 

6 minutes ago, TurtlePower said:

Welcome to the longest train wreck ever 🙂! I’ve been waiting for a full derailment for a long time now! 

Oops, sorry for double quoting...

Thank you!

Yes, indeed, I actually never thought we would see it, just the sanitised mirage....and its grimmer than I even imagined.

Its equal parts fascinating & horrendous, it’s my guilty secret and you guys are great, educational too, learning about laws in different States and the mine field regarding health insurance

Douche has a rebellion going on and has utterly lost the plot, quite chilling

 

 

[jacksgirl]

9 minutes ago, Julez said:

Its equal parts fascinating & horrendous, it’s my guilty secret and you guys are great.

 

 

 

Yes! None of my family/friends watch, so I have to come here to discuss. They have no idea what they are missing. 

 

[Shelbie]

12 hours ago, nosedive said:

An interesting theory.   Of course, we’re privy to only a glimpse of his life, but that won’t stop me from jumping in with my analysis 😉.  

Kody’s personality and behaviors to me seem to be less driven by a mental illness and more the result of having spent the past thirty-plus years operating in a patriarchal construct that endorses his role as absolute authority over his wives and children, a role reinforced by the acquiescence of the members of the family: a construct that demonstrates (in his mind) his hyper-masculinity.  But now the construct that has defined him as man-in-charge, potent-impregnator, super-stud, quasi-deity, and which has been indulged by his family for the past three decades, is crumbling, and all his blustering and hissy fits and stomping his foot can’t stop it.  

When his wives were compliant with all his wishes and whims, and his children were too young to exert agency over their own lives, they reflected his self-image back at him: god of his earthly kingdom to be worshipped and adored.  But who is reflecting that image back at him now?  Robyn and her spawn, maybe?  Certainly not his adult sons.  Certainly not Christine.  And while Janelle hasn’t yet jumped ship, she has the audacity to question his divine wisdom.  With their words and actions, they tell him he’s a failed leader, a paper tiger, an empty shirt.  The more they dare to challenge his authority and disobey his edicts, the more desperate he becomes to reestablish that image of himself.  

So he tightens his grip in an attempt to regain control, no matter what he has to do to accomplish it, including insults and threats and even banishing the recalcitrant sons from the kingdom.  The more his family turns away from him, the more blurred that image becomes and the more he lets loose his fury on them.  If he’s not the exalted lord over his earthly kingdom, who is he?  

Kody is not the leader he fancies himself to be because leaders inspire.  Leaders make personal sacrifices for the good of others.  Leaders bring out the best in the people they lead.  

Thirty-plus years ago, perhaps Kody was a decent fellow.  Perhaps he was insecure about his masculinity?  Perhaps he felt he needed to prove his worth to his father?  Perhaps he actually did believe in The Principle?  But today he is unkind and callous towards the people whom he has pledged to love and cherish for eternity.  What he’s doing is cruel and he knows it.  

I know and love several people with mental illnesses.  They have their challenges, but not one of them is deliberately cruel.  

This post is brilliant and I think you nailed Kody.

[monagatuna]

2 hours ago, Julez said:

Hello All😀

Long time lurker, first time posting.

Im across the pond so episodes are behind here, but just wanted to say I think you are fab, so funny & astute.

The screen shot of Douche upthread is a man maniacally unhinged that the curtain has fully been unveiled and he no longer has the control he once had by way of humiliation, blackmailing obedience with scraps of attention to be withdrawn if he is displeased

first started watching series 2 mainly out of curiosity for a life style I could not comprehend, live and let live for sure, but was intrigued especially how the wives coped with sharing a ‘man’ and how the unit and relationships worked, the jealousy, dynamics as well as the purported positives such as ‘sisters’, bonus mums etc.

There are possibly other families who this work for but this family in no way shape or form showed that, in fact confirmed all my pre judgements, shame for other plural families it may work for

The women do not even particularly like each other to the point they would not travel together, perhaps that is part of the torture and challenges they must endure to get to the better place?

They were/are single mothers with an occasional booty call

The hard slog of everyday work with the children was solely on the mothers, whilst Douche fleetingly graced with his presence to dictate & flap around from house to house saying he was exhausted & putting up stupid lights

Christine intrigued me the most

So immersed,cocooned & indoctrinated in that way of life to the extent she disowned her own mother, just staggering.

She tried to keep sweet as she had been indoctrinated to be for a few scraps as a reward with the threat of withdrawal of those scraps if she murmered  an independent thought or need. So sad, pathetic and undignified.

It has taken the health of her daughters to see the reality of the total insignificance she & her children are..

To have a ‘functional’ marriage under her nose, to see the grand home & the icing on the cake to be aware that non household and absolutely non essential dwellers could come and go at Douche Manor

Robin this lazy, manipulative,parasite of a woman should have a nanny just beggars belief, wtf does she do? She is something akin to the upstart in All About Eve..or the body snatchers😱

Meanwhile Christine looked after a dozen, she is lower rank than a nanny

I understand she home schooled and if that is correct she deserves credit, bc many of the children ( tho admittedly the boys)are intelligent, driven and succeeding tho I’m not sure how that would have panned out if they did not go to mainstream school and the exposure to peers ,of opportunites, possibilities & aspiration...as opposed to only having Douche as a role model...seems the sin side of LV they were concerned about has not come to fruition, quite the opposte...wonder if that was the real worry.

I was pleased to hear that Christine had left, can not be easy going against the indoctrination, loss of dignity, humiliation and self esteem, not all that are repeatedly beaten that way can get up.

As noted she seems to have the love and support of her children and non bio children & that must be an  enormous help

Douche ofc is incandescent as the boys especially show him up to be everything he is not & are protective of their mothers, it’s why he wants them gone.

 

All the mothers of the wives recanting their lives in past episodes and the great difficulties of polygamy was sad to hear but heartening that some broke free...to be disowned by some

In a way it’s refreshing & ofc more honest that the ridiculous facade has been dropped to some extent & the gloves are partially off.

The ‘modesty’ wardrobe abandoned, the no swearing line now see’s them dropping F bombs, the Truman show descending into the make believe rubbish we always knew is both fascinating and horrendous, the extent of mental abuse, utter disdain& contempt  K seems to have toward his family shows no bounds in his quest for dominance, he is livid, absolutely livid.

Anyway sorry to the mods if I have digressed somewhat but thanks again for the often laugh out loud and piercing observations on what is increasingly becoming quite a dark, malevolent car crash, the silver lining being the true realisation from some family members and the hope that they have a free and happy future.

Especially the children who had no say in this or the exposure

 

 

Well you sure saved up your wisdom during your lurking period! What a perfectly accurate description of this shitshow. Welcome!

[laurakaye]

1 hour ago, jacksgirl said:

Yes! None of my family/friends watch, so I have to come here to discuss. They have no idea what they are missing. 

No kidding - my husband will wander in while I'm watching and ask, "is this show seriously still on?"  I no longer hide my weird addiction, since he's caught me more than once watching gleefully with a notebook and pen at the ready, taking recap notes.  This is also my wine and popcorn show on the rare occasion that I decide to stay up past 9pm to watch in real time.  And then there's the two recap podcasts I listen to.....and sometimes I go back and rewatch old episodes........now that I see this typed out, I'm starting to question my life choices in a big way. 😳

[ginger90]

Nice post @Julez . Welcome!

[RedDelicious]

23 minutes ago, laurakaye said:

No kidding - my husband will wander in while I'm watching and ask, "is this show seriously still on?"  I no longer hide my weird addiction, since he's caught me more than once watching gleefully with a notebook and pen at the ready, taking recap notes.  This is also my wine and popcorn show on the rare occasion that I decide to stay up past 9pm to watch in real time.  And then there's the two recap podcasts I listen to.....and sometimes I go back and rewatch old episodes........now that I see this typed out, I'm starting to question my life choices in a big way. 😳

It's called doing the Lord's work and we appreciate it! 😆🍷🍿

[Julez]

2 hours ago, jacksgirl said:

Yes! None of my family/friends watch, so I have to come here to discuss. They have no idea what they are missing. 

 

Haha, a kindred spirit! over the years my children would wander in and ask what I was watching and I would probably go into too much detail as they glazed over... my son said it again the other day, ‘is that still on’

Yep 😩

so instead of shouting at the t.v because no one else is remotely interested I come here and my  thoughts are echoed with a huge dollop of humour, you guys are hilarious....and welcoming 😄

 

Edited January 6, 2022 by Julez
Reply ‘merged’?

[Julez]

32 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

Nice post @Julez . Welcome!

Thank you!

[Julez]

1 hour ago, monagatuna said:

Well you sure saved up your wisdom during your lurking period! What a perfectly accurate description of this shitshow. Welcome!

Hello & thank you

I feel like I just brought up a fur ball ! 

[LuvMyShows]

17 hours ago, Art Of Noiz said:

But he is her father. Christine could sue him for 11 years arrearage.

Well it wouldn't be arrearage, since that is what it is called when there is a child support order in place and the person hasn't paid.  I think you are talking about retroactive child support, and that would not be straightforward, since Kody could show that he had already been contributing to the expenses of Christine's children during that time period.  Also some states have limits on how far back retroactive child support can go. 

[Gramto6]

4 hours ago, Julez said:

Hello All😀

Long time lurker, first time posting.

Im across the pond so episodes are behind here, but just wanted to say I think you are fab, so funny & astute.

The screen shot of Douche upthread is a man maniacally unhinged that the curtain has fully been unveiled and he no longer has the control he once had by way of humiliation, blackmailing obedience with scraps of attention to be withdrawn if he is displeased

first started watching series 2 mainly out of curiosity for a life style I could not comprehend, live and let live for sure, but was intrigued especially how the wives coped with sharing a ‘man’ and how the unit and relationships worked, the jealousy, dynamics as well as the purported positives such as ‘sisters’, bonus mums etc.

There are possibly other families who this work for but this family in no way shape or form showed that, in fact confirmed all my pre judgements, shame for other plural families it may work for

The women do not even particularly like each other to the point they would not travel together, perhaps that is part of the torture and challenges they must endure to get to the better place?

They were/are single mothers with an occasional booty call

The hard slog of everyday work with the children was solely on the mothers, whilst Douche fleetingly graced with his presence to dictate & flap around from house to house saying he was exhausted & putting up stupid lights

Christine intrigued me the most

So immersed,cocooned & indoctrinated in that way of life to the extent she disowned her own mother, just staggering.

She tried to keep sweet as she had been indoctrinated to be for a few scraps as a reward with the threat of withdrawal of those scraps if she murmered  an independent thought or need. So sad, pathetic and undignified.

It has taken the health of her daughters to see the reality of the total insignificance she & her children are..

To have a ‘functional’ marriage under her nose, to see the grand home & the icing on the cake to be aware that non household and absolutely non essential dwellers could come and go at Douche Manor

Robin this lazy, manipulative,parasite of a woman should have a nanny just beggars belief, wtf does she do? She is something akin to the upstart in All About Eve..or the body snatchers😱

Meanwhile Christine looked after a dozen, she is lower rank than a nanny

I understand she home schooled and if that is correct she deserves credit, bc many of the children ( tho admittedly the boys)are intelligent, driven and succeeding tho I’m not sure how that would have panned out if they did not go to mainstream school and the exposure to peers ,of opportunites, possibilities & aspiration...as opposed to only having Douche as a role model...seems the sin side of LV they were concerned about has not come to fruition, quite the opposte...wonder if that was the real worry.

I was pleased to hear that Christine had left, can not be easy going against the indoctrination, loss of dignity, humiliation and self esteem, not all that are repeatedly beaten that way can get up.

As noted she seems to have the love and support of her children and non bio children & that must be an  enormous help

Douche ofc is incandescent as the boys especially show him up to be everything he is not & are protective of their mothers, it’s why he wants them gone.

 

All the mothers of the wives recanting their lives in past episodes and the great difficulties of polygamy was sad to hear but heartening that some broke free...to be disowned by some

In a way it’s refreshing & ofc more honest that the ridiculous facade has been dropped to some extent & the gloves are partially off.

The ‘modesty’ wardrobe abandoned, the no swearing line now see’s them dropping F bombs, the Truman show descending into the make believe rubbish we always knew is both fascinating and horrendous, the extent of mental abuse, utter disdain& contempt  K seems to have toward his family shows no bounds in his quest for dominance, he is livid, absolutely livid.

Anyway sorry to the mods if I have digressed somewhat but thanks again for the often laugh out loud and piercing observations on what is increasingly becoming quite a dark, malevolent car crash, the silver lining being the true realisation from some family members and the hope that they have a free and happy future.

Especially the children who had no say in this or the exposure

 

 

Welcome! Awesome post! Glad you decided to un-lurk!

[LilyD]

4 hours ago, Julez said:

To have a ‘functional’ marriage under her nose, to see the grand home & the icing on the cake to be aware that non household and absolutely non essential dwellers could come and go at Douche Manor

Hey Julez, welcome, to the club!

Douche Manor….that’s absolutely brilliant, I love it!😍 You’ll find that every now and then one of us comes up with a fantastic name or description that sticks with the other posters. I vote to include Douche Manor to the notorious list that includes stuff like Kodouche (bag), Kodester, the Dark Queen etc…..

 

[Adiba]

And I forget which poster said “Kodouchecanoe”, but bravo!

[Julez]

43 minutes ago, LilyD said:

Hey Julez, welcome, to the club!

Douche Manor….that’s absolutely brilliant, I love it!😍 You’ll find that every now and then one of us comes up with a fantastic name or description that sticks with the other posters. I vote to include Douche Manor to the notorious list that includes stuff like Kodouche (bag), Kodester, the Dark Queen etc…..

 

Thank you 👋🏼

Yes I have read many of them😀

’Dark Queen’, so apt.

I sometimes wonder if I should have a sneaky admiration for the woman who has clambered over & thru them all like an unstoppable weed to get the man🤮,palatial home and hired help, all while sobbing with the perma frown of concern, soo sincere...but then I think nah, she is conniving shrew.

She is the Dark Queen, you guys are Snow White, or a crucifix, or a garlic garland 😂. Her external appearance eaten up and looking more and more like her miserable core,she once had shiny eyes and a bit of a spring in her step...now she resembles a toad 

[Roslyn]

15 hours ago, nosedive said:

An interesting theory.   Of course, we’re privy to only a glimpse of his life, but that won’t stop me from jumping in with my analysis 😉.  

Kody’s personality and behaviors to me seem to be less driven by a mental illness and more the result of having spent the past thirty-plus years operating in a patriarchal construct that endorses his role as absolute authority over his wives and children, a role reinforced by the acquiescence of the members of the family: a construct that demonstrates (in his mind) his hyper-masculinity.  But now the construct that has defined him as man-in-charge, potent-impregnator, super-stud, quasi-deity, and which has been indulged by his family for the past three decades, is crumbling, and all his blustering and hissy fits and stomping his foot can’t stop it.  

When his wives were compliant with all his wishes and whims, and his children were too young to exert agency over their own lives, they reflected his self-image back at him: god of his earthly kingdom to be worshipped and adored.  But who is reflecting that image back at him now?  Robyn and her spawn, maybe?  Certainly not his adult sons.  Certainly not Christine.  And while Janelle hasn’t yet jumped ship, she has the audacity to question his divine wisdom.  With their words and actions, they tell him he’s a failed leader, a paper tiger, an empty shirt.  The more they dare to challenge his authority and disobey his edicts, the more desperate he becomes to reestablish that image of himself.  

So he tightens his grip in an attempt to regain control, no matter what he has to do to accomplish it, including insults and threats and even banishing the recalcitrant sons from the kingdom.  The more his family turns away from him, the more blurred that image becomes and the more he lets loose his fury on them.  If he’s not the exalted lord over his earthly kingdom, who is he?  

Kody is not the leader he fancies himself to be because leaders inspire.  Leaders make personal sacrifices for the good of others.  Leaders bring out the best in the people they lead.  

Thirty-plus years ago, perhaps Kody was a decent fellow.  Perhaps he was insecure about his masculinity?  Perhaps he felt he needed to prove his worth to his father?  Perhaps he actually did believe in The Principle?  But today he is unkind and callous towards the people whom he has pledged to love and cherish for eternity.  What he’s doing is cruel and he knows it.  

I know and love several people with mental illnesses.  They have their challenges, but not one of them is deliberately cruel.  

Kody seems to be going through a major identity "shelf break" to steal the term from the ex-mormon group. He was solid in his religion, he was solid in his identity of husband of 3 then 4 wives and his role as father to many. His needs were met. Hoping from house to house and always getting cheers from the mass of young children and a wife happy it was her night.

But...as anyone in any kind of long term relationship, it changes through time.  Kody didn't want that change. He wants the same as it has always been. But kids grow up and challenge their parents ways, they move on with their own adult lives, and if you don't nurture the growing and changing relationships...they fall by the wayside. I find it fascinating that the man that wanted every child to automatically stay as one big family is the same man now demanding "over 21's" need to get out...BuuBYE!!

He can now only see people as he saw them from the beginning. The wives aren't allowed to grow and change and his 18-22 year old sons can only be compared to him at that age. He just can't see anything from anyone's point of view. I would love to know more about his father, Janelle has pointed out some of Kody's personality is "just like Winn's"