S01.E06: One World, One People

[formerlyfreedom]

Quote

As The Flag Smashers escalate their efforts, Sam and Bucky take action.

Season finale drops Friday, April 23, 2021.

[Chicago Redshirt]

Kinda mixed about the episode. Basically, was not in love with all the action stuff or Sharon=Power Broker because that is a twist for twist's sake. It really seems hard to square her being the Power Broker with her leading people to Nagel, for starters. Don't so much love the rehabilitation of Walker. The action scenes were choppy and hard to follow. 

On the other hand the things I loved I loved, in no particular order:

1. Redwing 2.0

2. Sam taking the mantle up 

3. The Isaiah/Sam scene and Isaiah finally getting his due. 

4. Changing the title card to Captain America and the Winter Soldier.

5. The scene of the Wilson family business seemingly thriving.

 

[Female83]

It was a decent episode.

Spoiler

The Sharon as Power Broker  fan theory ended up being true

. 

[bmoore4026]

I almost fell out of my chair when I heard John call Julia Louis-Dreyfus' character

Spoiler

Val.

Do you know how many X-Men nerds are going to freak out about that name drop?

Also, how handsome was Anthony Mackie in his Captain America outfit.  And Wyatt Russell in his US Agent costume.  Seriously, the costuming department needs awards for the work they've done.

And the bit at the end with Isaiah at the Captain America exhibit warmed my heart.  And that same heart broke when Bucky told that old man what he did do his son.

Spoiler

And I like this Sharon Carter as a bad guy because it doesn't involve brainwashing or being subliminally controlled to shoot a handcuffed Steve Rogers multiple times in the stomach.  I have not forgotten the comic Civil War storyline and I will never forgive.

Is it wrong that I was more broken up about Batroc's death than little orphan Karli's?

 

[Emma]

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. 

Not sure I’ll ever get over what they’ve done to Sharon. I wanted her to return but not like this.

Edited April 23, 2021 by Emma

[steelyis]

Dammit, Sharon!

I was actually pretty jazzed to see Walker finally don the U.S.Agent suit. I also liked when he literally dropped trying to be Captain America and saved those hostages from falling to their deaths. Not as jazzed he works for Val, but shit, a job is hard to come by these days.

Zemo, you scamp!

Seriously though, Sam being Captain America was pure fan service. Damn near everything he did as Cap was cool as hell! Up to and including setting up Isaiah Bradley's monument in the Captain America Museum.

[Vanderboom]

Yay, insomnia! FYI mid credit scene @ 45:00. Also one of the production assistants is named Secret Harris, which is an incredibly cool name.

Wow. So much to process! I loved that Walker showed up just when I said "Where's Walker?" Thought it was interesting when Karli talked about "lives that mattered" to an enraged John. I know this isn't filmed in real the time, but still . . . They telegraphed the Power Broker pretty clearly so the reveal was a bit of a letdown. Excellent timing, though. Zemo is more of a grey area, but he helped, too.

Bucky didn't have as much screen time, but Sebastian Stan made his moments count the way that only he can. Bucky took Sam's advice to heart, and there was a lightness to him at the end that we've never really seen before. Also: how cute is he with Sam's nephews?

The best part was Sam remaining un-Supered. Even with the gear, his rescues were imperfect, he needed help, and he had trouble fighting people off completely. His humanity remains his best power. I love the thought of Captain America (LOL @ reporter asking ”is it Captain Falcon now?") with a background in counseling and a sincere desire to Do the Right Thing. His speech was Everything and I've already rewatched it several times. Isaiah Bradley's reaction brought tears to my eyes; they came again at the exhibit. Sam's going to need to have someone to talk to who can see things Bradley's way.

[vb68]

33 minutes ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

Kinda mixed about the episode.

Same. I agree the action scenes were very choppy.  I'm still marinating on it, but I liked it more than loved it. 

For one thing , I find it a little incredulous that Sam felt he had to call Sharon for backup (not that she wasn't going to show up anyway for whatever her agenda truly is) over Rhodey, maybe Bruce, and whoever else just might happen to be in NY?

Sam's speechifying at the end was...a little much. but I get it. The government cronies needed a lecture. I just never developed a soft spot for Karli or her not so merry band.

Zemo's butler taking care of business was more fun. And I'm interested to see where Walker and Countess Selena Meyer go from here. and whatever the "weird" is that's coming.

The kids holding on to Bucky at the end was probably my favorite part.

Edited April 23, 2021 by vb68

[TiffanyNichelle]

So there was a lot of stuff in this one episode and I don't think everything got a chance to breathe. I'm sure I'll have to rewatch it because there was so much. 

I didn't like that Sharon turned out to not just be the Power Broker but also really evil about it? I'm not a fan of this direction they went with her.

I also didn't like that Walker basically didn't learn any real lessons by the end of the episode and was back to being his usual self. Yes, I liked that he said Lemar's life mattered after Karli said he wasn't important enough to kill. But I think both Sam and Bucky were too cool with him considering how things last ended with him.

Sam did an amazing job as the new Cap. The costume looked amazing. He had so many great moments as Cap and as people were seeing him do it. However as good as his speech to the GRC was after a while it started to drag for me. The scenes with Isaiah were the best. Him getting Isaiah into the exhibition touched my heart. 

I did love the title card changing to Captain America and the Winter Soldier.

[Zonk]

I'm still annoyed that they are treating ordinary humans as super soldiers.

No ordinary human could throw the shield like that. I know it is (part) vibranium, but either it's light like a plastic frisby or it can do massive damage. It can't be both.

Same goes for Sam holding an armored truck in the air. He has powerfull jets on his back... great... but his bones are just ordinary human bones. He should have been crushed, his armes snapped like twigs, his ribs and spine shattered.

[Lebanna]

I knew they were going to make me cry. I didn’t expect it to be quite so many times. 

The damage of the past is something that both the guys can put back together piece by piece, but they aren’t going to write it off or wipe it out. That history all happened and it was all wrong. What if, like Bucky, you were a part of atrocities? How do you learn, if you tell yourself it never happened and if it did, who cares? These two do care.

Sam put Isaiah in the Smithsonian and made his story unforgettable. It doesn’t undo anything, but it does something new.

That moment when Sam wraps his new Wakandan wings around the cop on the bridge was something significant and magnificent. He looks like an Avenging angel and it’s gorgeous. The speech to the officials might have been a bit preachy, but the world needed someone to preach it. It was so obvious, it is always so obvious, and no one ever seems to just say it.

Batroc, you say you’re not, but you are just so Canadian. And so is your pronunciation of ‘vraiment’.

Little Redwing is back! I love that little guy.

Sharon, we all knew it was coming, but what are you doing? Peggy would kick your arse six ways for this.

It was nice to see Bucky immediately turn around somewhat on Walker once he did something good for humanity and lost the shield. It seemed right that he in particular would try to give Walker a fresh chance. But USAgent doing a little dance of happiness while his proud wife looks on had the potential to be quite heartbreaking at some future point. Do they think he’s working for the government? Who have they decided Val is? Because she certainly hasn’t told them. If he wanted to find his place among the heroes, Sam and Bucky would have done him right, but instead... His arc still looks like it’s going Greek, and not in the fun way. 

Good to see Steve’s notebook left behind. It did its job, for both of them. Steve and Bucky both found a place and a family, in the end.

Loved that scene of Sam taking selfies and Bucky delivering cake and silliness. The guys on the dock, amongst family and friends, brothers.

Edited April 23, 2021 by Lebanna

[vb68]

15 minutes ago, TiffanyNichelle said:

I didn't like that Sharon turned out to not just be the Power Broker but also really evil about it?

And it all worked out so conveniently with Sam and Bucky having no clue. Was she always going to shoot Karli before she said anything? I guess so, but Sharon still got really, really lucky.

Bucky still has that old school Banner sad music as he watched the old guy and bartender through the window. 

Edited April 23, 2021 by vb68

[TiffanyNichelle]

17 minutes ago, vb68 said:

For one thing , I find it a little incredulous that Sam felt he had to call Sharon for backup (not that she wasn't going to show up anyway for whatever her agenda truly is) over Rhodey, maybe Bruce, and whoever else just might happen to be in NY

I was confused by this because even when Sarah showed up I kept wondering who the help was that he called in. I didn't think it was her. I actually think it was his way of telling Bucky he repaired Redwing. Actually I was hoping it was Torres with the old Falcon wings. 

20 minutes ago, vb68 said:

Sam's speechifying at the end was...a little much. but I get it. The government cronies needed a lecture. I just never developed a soft spot for Karli or her not so merry band.

Yeah, while I understood Karli and The Flagsmashers more by the end, I never really cared about them or their cause. In fact when she was giving her speech about how they were all willing to kill the hostages and die for the cause I really wanted the hot guy to be like, you know what, I like living more.

Considering Sam was one of the returned who had to deal with how life wasn't that great for him either, I really wish they'd pressed that angle more in his dealings with her. They kind of dropped that after the bank scene when he couldn't get a loan after being away for 5 years. They needed more time to explore how things weren't great for the ones who stayed or the ones who returned. 

[AnimeMania]

Batroc: You cost me a lot of money, I wonder how much I can get for your new bird costume. 
Sam: Maybe a baguette and a few french fries.
In my version Sam would have said: Maybe a "Royale with Cheese" and a few french fries.

When Bucky does his Endo (Stoppie - front wheelie) I would of had him land fist first into the face of the Flag-Smasher, with one super "Baddie" out cold.

They really crippled the fighting skills of Craptaint America and juiced up the fighting skills of Karli, there is no way she should have been able to whoop on him like that, he was a great fighter and he had the super serum and a shield. I would have preferred that he was the one to have killed Karli, sometime after she gave the Lemar's life didn't matter speech. Craptaint America could have said that a single person can inspire people to do the right thing. Craptaint America was past the point of being useless the entire episode, except for the time that he pulled back that armored car.

I would have preferred that Sharon end up with a pardon and the remaining Super Soldiers, doing a switcheroo, where the remaining Flag-Smashers end up in a different transport on their way to Madripoor. Sharon would then declines the U.S. Government position and resumes her secret Power Broker identity. Baron Zemo would continue to think he succeeded in blowing up the Super Soldiers. 

My favorite character was the little plane on Falcon's back and now he has two.

[Gin and Tonic]

There was a lot to recommend this episode, but overall I’m still a little unsure how I feel about it. I think the season suffered from a lot of pacing issues and this episode did as well. 

The scene with Yori felt too short, especially because that particular memory/storyline was supposed to represent Bucky moving through his trauma. I would’ve liked more catharsis if that is meant to be Bucky’s closure to that part of his history. I’m not actually sure I even like that being the end or him giving up the notebook. I don’t want “trauma manpain Bucky” in every iteration we see of this character, but his trauma does feel like something he would continue to carry with him. To the extent the notebook is symbolic of his history and attempts to make amends, it would make more sense to me to keep the notebook but put it away. The healing doesn’t come from divesting yourself from the past, but integrating it into your present in a healthy way. 

Sam is a joy. I love to get to see him being a big damn hero. Him making sure to honor Isaiah was so fantastic. As is his taking up the cap mantle on his own terms despite knowing the racist backlash that will ensue. 

In keeping in with my feelings toward her in her previous 2 movies, I still do not care at all about Sharon Carter. 

Finally, if there is another season I would like it to center completely around BBQs with the Sam and Bucky while they hang on the docks being super attractive and cute with the kids. I will also accept vacations in New York where Uncle Bucky (step-dad Bucky?) takes them all to a ballgame and spends the whole time bitching about the Dodgers moving to L.A. of all places.  

Edited April 23, 2021 by Gin and Tonic

[arc]

45 minutes ago, Zonk said:

Same goes for Sam holding an armored truck in the air. He has powerfull jets on his back... great... but his bones are just ordinary human bones. He should have been crushed, his armes snapped like twigs, his ribs and spine shattered.

I totally agree. This gets back to what I said in an earlier thread about the MCU cheating on what non-enhanced humans can do.

59 minutes ago, vb68 said:

and whoever else just might happen to be in NY?

The way Sam rescued the police truck was very reminiscent of Iron Man saving the Staten Island ferry in Far From Home. I know, Iron Man is dead now, but calling back to that scene from a Spider-Man movie only emphasizes that Marvel's most famous New York based superhero wasn't in this. (I suppose we could headcanon that this was happening while Peter was in Europe for his trip.)

44 minutes ago, Zonk said:

but either it's light like a plastic frisby or it can do massive damage. It can't be both.

Back in The First Avenger, Howard Stark said the shield is a third the weight of steel. Aside from that, we just have to accept that in the MCU, getting hit with the flat of the shield somehow hurts as much as WWE wrestlers getting hit by the championship belt.

10 minutes ago, AnimeMania said:

They really crippled the fighting skills of Craptaint America and juiced up the fighting skills of Karli, there is no way she should have been able to whoop on him like that, he was a great fighter and he had the super serum and a shield.

That knockoff shield doesn't have the physics-defying nature of the real shield. And, not that the show was super blatant about it, but I think Karli maneuvered the fight into the scaffolding* to put it in a more confined space where his shield-swinging would be a bit of a disadvantage.

* this is one of the rare times I've seen Manhattan on screen with scaffolding!

BTW, again, just cause Walker got kicked out of the military doesn't particularly seem like enough punishment for literal murder. Cops might get away with this, but the US military is a little more strict about proportional response. And aside from that, the whole world watched him haul a truck up by sheer strength. The government should be bleeding him for serum remnants. Or at least he should have to sign the Sokovia accords... ? maybe.

Overall, I think the plotting was a little too loose in a lot of areas but the emotion and tone were perfect. Sam's preachy monologue at the end was clunky but OTOH I mostly agreed with it.

[arc]

from the ep 5 thread but I think misplaced:

1 hour ago, bmoore4026 said:

I almost fell out of my chair when I heard John call Julia Louis-Dreyfus' character Val.

Do you know how many X-Men nerds are going to freak out about that name drop?

I'm not an X-nerd, nor a deep Captain America/SHIELD/etc nerd but Val is the short form of her actual name, as she said in ep 5, and she's not really an X-related character. 

[swanpride]

Count me in as considering Sharon being the weakest part of the episode, hell, the whole show. Because nothing regarding her made sense. Her leading Zemo to Nagel doesn't make any sense if she was the power broker, Sam calling her to come to the other side of the world makes no sense when even Torres is closer than here, not to mention Rhodey, Spider-man or pretty much ANYONE else. And am I really supposed to beliefe that Superspy Sharon wouldn't have been able to find Karly at the funeral?????

Also, the new costume really Disappointed me. Honestly. I really liked the idea of the Wakandan design being married to the while, red and blue, and then they did the cheesiest and ugliest costume possible instead. Big let down. 

And I was right, the scene with Bucky talking to the old man would have fit better last episode. Also, I would have liked to see more of his reaction. 

At least Zemo stayed a bastard till the end. 

[magdalene]

As someone that never saw John Walker as the  one note villain a lot of the Internet did and chafed against the intense dislike Wyatt Russell got from that quarter - it was sweet to see what the show did with him in this final episode.

And since I had totally disliked Karli throughout and never saw her as any kind of hero - good bye and good riddance.

I just have such a hard time believing Sharon Carter as the Power Broker. I am grasping at straws, could she be a Skrull?

[paigow]

How many leaks are in the police / army that 2 different groups had infiltrated prisoner transport? The Flag Smashers replaced the crew and somehow "Sokovian Alfred" knew which truck would be used and was able to rig a giant bomb without anybody noticing.

[Spartan Girl]

If it hadn’t been for them turning Sharon Carter — one of Marvel’s best comic heroines—into a villain, I would have loved this ending. I mean, seriously after all the crap Emily VanCamp got from the Stucky stans on the internet and the Russos just cowing to them, the MCU brought her back for this?! This?!? It’s Game of Thrones all over again!!!!!

At least I’m pretty sure Bartoc was a setup and she had no intention of letting him kill Sam—or she knew Sam would kick his ass easily. 

I wasn’t expecting Walker to redeem himself like that. Not sure how I feel since they did such a good job setting up a tragic villain story.  THAT was better done than Sharon being the villain.

I at least loved Sam finally being the new Cap, Bucky telling the truth to his friend (at the cost of losing him) and his parting gift to the shrink, Isaiah getting his dues at the museum, and the party at the end with the final title CAPTAIN AMERICA and the Winter Soldier—ha! 

Edited April 23, 2021 by Spartan Girl

[ItCouldBeWorse]

2 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

The scene of the Wilson family business seemingly thriving.

How can Sam possibly protect his family from all the evil-doers who will want to get back at him?  Or even the extreme racists he spoke about?  This would be a major issue.

2 hours ago, Zonk said:

Same goes for Sam holding an armored truck in the air. He has powerfull jets on his back... great... but his bones are just ordinary human bones. He should have been crushed, his armes snapped like twigs, his ribs and spine shattered.

I did not get that either.

1 hour ago, TiffanyNichelle said:

I was confused by this because even when Sarah showed up I kept wondering who the help was that he called in. I didn't think it was her. I actually think it was his way of telling Bucky he repaired Redwing. Actually I was hoping it was Torres with the old Falcon wings.

Yes, Sam sounded surprised when he heard her voice.

Did Sharon care if Batroc killed Sam?  Because he might have gotten lucky.

1 hour ago, TiffanyNichelle said:

Considering Sam was one of the returned who had to deal with how life wasn't that great for him either, I really wish they'd pressed that angle more in his dealings with her. They kind of dropped that after the bank scene when he couldn't get a loan after being away for 5 years. They needed more time to explore how things weren't great for the ones who stayed or the ones who returned. 

Exactly.  I wonder if we will ever find out the solution to the resettlement issue.

[paigow]

8 minutes ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Exactly.  I wonder if we will ever find out the solution to the resettlement issue.

Lots of space in Louisiana... until global warming floods the Gulf Coast... 

[cambridgeguy]

The single most unbelievable thing in the entire MCU is the idea that a US senator would back down and change course like that.  He'd dig in and double down on Sam being a well meaning but naive idiot who has no idea what the five years were like.

I guess we're supposed to believe the new Cap suit is kind of like the Iron Man suit and completely shields the normal human inside?  God bless vibranium. 

[swanpride]

Honestly, the "resettlement issue" seems to be vastly overstated to me. I mean, how likely is it, that a full family vanished with nobody being left? Might have happened, but in most cases there would have been someone left, a heir or something like this, to take care of whatever was left. And while it is true that there was most likely a need for workers created in a lot of places, that doesn't necessarily translate into refugees from all over the world being suddenly welcome in mass, because the inherent "fear" of a different culture wouldn't just vanish too. The anti-refugee sentiments has little to do with economy and everything with racism, and you can't just snap racism away. And finally, people coming back might lead to a shortage of living space in areas in which a lot of people moved during those five years, but this is certainly nothing you can't solve within your national borders. 

[Bill1978]

Definitely a lot to process but Sharon being bad going forward into Phase 4 has left a very sour taste in my mouth.

[swanpride]

Sharon better be a Skrull, because only then her actions make kind of sense (playing the long game of getting back into Fury's inner circle is naturally better than having some super soldiers). 

Otherwise, I think I now know what bothered me so much about the show: It seemed to be hard hitting in the beginning, but in the end, it did pull its punches considerably. The whole story was set-up as a fight over America's soul, except that they conveniently shifted most of the story to Europe, hence there was no need to actually point out how the US treats refugees, oh no, that is a problem all over in Europe. And in the end of the day, they didn't really get into what it would mean to be a black Captain America. It was just accepted, they showed NONE of the backlash which would have happened, there was nobody even doubting that Sam had the right to the title, and hey, even Isiah got his wing in the museum with no problem at all. All this run completely false to me, sorry, this is not the America I know. They basically spend five episodes side-stepping the conflict set up in the beginning and then just solved it with a snap, and that was deeply dissatisfying. And for the same reason I kinf of hate Walker's so called redemption, because he did nothing to redeem himself. Yeah, he pulled that bus back (or at least tried to), but that doesn't make him any less a murderer or a superpowered wild card who feels entitled to heroism. 

[bmoore4026]

2 hours ago, arc said:

from the ep 5 thread but I think misplaced:

I'm not an X-nerd, nor a deep Captain America/SHIELD/etc nerd but Val is the short form of her actual name, as she said in ep 5, and she's not really an X-related character. 

My mistake.  I thought Val referred to Valarie Cooper.

[Hana Chan]

Ho boy... lots to unpack here. I'll agree with the general consensus that the episode was a bit rushed - with all the moving parts and storylines to wrap up, a two hour finale would have been more than justified and would have given a chance for the storylines to breathe. But other than that... I'm more than satisficed. They didn't totally stick the landing - there was a bit of a hop to the side (using my gymnastics fetish here).

Sam's storyline played out well and he's not only accepted his new role as Captain America but showed why Captain America is so important. It's not being a superhero or being pumped full of super steroids. It's not being the ideal of what an American or soldier should be (or is thought to be). It's to inspire and lead by example. To show what the country and people can aspire to, The quality that he shared with Steve is that he wants the world to be better, and he's willing to put himself on the line to help make it better. Yes, he'll be dependent on having the costume and weapons in a way that Steve wasn't when it comes to fighting, but he's got the strength of will to go beyond that. He knows what being a symbol means, and that having a black man not only accepting the mantle but openly claiming the title of Captain America (with all of the complicated history wrapped up in that) is a demand for respect for the role that his people have played in America's history. There weren't any real surprises with his story and it came to a satisfying conclusion. There is something really beautiful about a black man carrying Captain America's shield while flying on Wakandan wings.

Giving Isaiah back his identity and making sure that he gets the recognition that he deserves and that his sacrifices (however unwilling) were honored. It doesn't make up for everything that had been done to him, but he'll be remembered as a hero who served his country beyond what anyone could have excepted. That closing scene with him and Sam at the Smithsonian had me sniffling.

Bucky's story was always going to be more complicated and even though he isn't walking away with the shield, I found his journey really fascinating. Bucky is a man who is chained to a very difficult and painful past that he is never going to escape from. No matter what, being the Winter Soldier, however unwilling, is always going to be a part of him. Like his arm, he can chose how he uses that past and he's finally reached the point where he can take all that he'd been through and what he'd been given (good and bad) and forge his own future. That being the Winter Soldier doesn't mean that he's permanently tied to what Hydra did to him. Yes, he's a product of that but he's more a product of the man he was before he was captured. He's a soldier, who wants to protect and try to make the world a better place. And using his arm to its fullest capability shows that acceptance.

Confessing to Yori what happened to his son was one of the scenes that I wished had more time to play out because that was a very important moment in Bucky's healing. He accepted that giving Yori the closure that he needed would cost Bucky their friendship, but he understood that a friendship founded in deception wasn't a real one anyway. Sam was right in that giving Yori the closure that he needed would help Bucky put his past further in his rear view mirror. And he is finally able to let the past go, including Steve, so he could move forward.

I'm glad that Walker had a semi-redemption because while I thought he was more than a bit of an entitled dick, he did genuinely want to help people and choosing to save people over revenge shows that while he made a lot of mistakes (and some very, very big ones), he isn't a black and white figure and shows that someone can have the best of intentions and end up in a bad place. Am curious to see where his journey as US Agent takes him.

Karli was always an interesting character and while I can certainly sympathize with her cause she reached a point that while her cause was justifiable, her actions weren't. She was a classic example of how someone can start out as an idealist and end up a fanatic. She was unable to see anything from another perspective and came to have a lack of caring towards those that weren't in the group she felt that she was protecting. The people who returned were, in her eyes, taking away opportunities and prosperity that she felt that the ones who remained had rightly earned while refusing to see the difficulties faced by those who'd had their lives effectively erased for five years and then dumped into a world that changed dramatically while they were gone. Like the government, she took a very complicated issue with no good or easy answers and made it into a black and white case where there was only one side (and one set of people) that mattered. She had moved well past the point of being redeemed long ago but cemented it when she told Walker that while she might have recreated killing Lamar, he didn't matter to her as a person because he wasn't a member of her protected class. When she made the decision repeatedly that killing hostages was a more than justifiable means to her goals, there was no option except to take her down.

Sam's speech to the senator at the end, recognizing that there were no good answers to the very complicated problems facing the world but not accepting the equally black and white solutions that the world governments were setting out to enforce. Reminding them that there were deep human costs to these decisions and that both sides needed to be at the table hopefully will make things a bit better.

Ah Zemo... you naughty boy! I can't stay mad you. You have to give serious props to a man who can be in the most secure prison in the world and not only know what's going on but able to engineer his ultimate goals.  And Sharon... yeah, we all called that she would be the Power Broker and it's going to be interesting to see a darker side of the Carter legacy. Peggy did tend to be idealized in a lot of ways and I'm curious to see where they take her character.

I'm sure that I'll find more to babble about because this series was jam packed and there's a lot to absorb. It wasn't a perfect finale, but it was a satisfying one for me.

[tv echo]

Live thoughts while watching...

The Flag Smashers are one of the least interesting adversaries in the MCU.

Sgt. Barnes? He's got his rank back?

Yay!  It's Sam in his new Falconesque Captain America suit! And he's accepted the Captain America name!

Why is Karli calling Bucky and not Sam? Oh, she was distracting him.

The GRC is one of the least interesting global organizations in the MCU.

Batroc is distracting Sam from the real fight.

A flying Captain America is pretty great. And Redwing's back.

Karli's losing it. I really hope she's a one-and-done character.

Vibranium wings as cover shield. So cool.

Ugh. Walker's back in his fake Captain America suit and carrying his fake Captain America shield.

Right here's the difference between Bucky and Walker.  Bucky immediately went to save the hostages in the burning truck, while Walker immediately focused on killing Karli and the Flag Smashers (sounds like the name of a band).

Finally, Walker tries to save hostages. Redemption for him? And Sam saves the day.

Did Batroc just save the Flag Smashers from capture? And Sharon's there with him

Bucky, don't trust Sharon!

Wait, what? Sharon was Karli's mentor?  Are they really going to make Sharon the Power Broker? (eyeroll) 

Sharon is one of the least convincing villains in the MCU - with one of the least convincing origin stories.  So in the relatively short period of time between getting unSnapped and the start of this series, she rose to power in Madripoor and developed a worldwide criminal network? Or if she wasn't Snapped, then she hid from the Avengers, her family and the world for five years, and instead of coming out to help during the Snap period, she focused selfishly on acquiring money and power for herself? She blames others for her situation, but did she ever reach out to Nick Fury or Sam or anyone for help? The Avengers facility was not hard to find. Certainly a lot easier to find than Sharon somewhere in the world - as proved by the fact that she was listed among the Snapped in the Avengers HQ database.

If they want me to feel sympathy for Karli, it's not working.

Sam's speech is a little too preachy, but he makes good points. The MCU writers wrote better speeches for Steve.

Sharon's still alive. And no one knows she's the Power Broker. Ugh.

Wait, who's the old guy in the car? He just blew up the captured Flag Smashers in the car. Oh, he's someone working for Zemo.

So Val gave Walker a new suit. Aaand he's now U.S. Agent. So I guess we'll see him again. Meh.

We'll probably see Contessa Valentina Allegra de Fontaine again, too.

Poor Bucky. As expected, he confesses to killing his friend's son. I guess that's the end of that friendship, as well as the end of his Wednesday lunch dates and his dating the barista.

Sam got Isaiah his own exhibition at the Smithsonian. Yay!

Mid-credits scene: Sharon gets a full pardon and her old job back. But wait, who is she calling? Maybe she isn't the Power Broker, but just working for the real Power Broker while posing as the Power Broker at his order ("Sir")?  It would be more believable that the real Power Broker helped Sharon when she was on the run and thereby earned her loyalty. It would even be more believable if it turns out that Sharon is working deep undercover for the new SHIELD or SWORD (or whatever) in order to take down the real Power Broker. So I'm holding out hope for that to be a future twist.

ETA: I misheard what Sharon said on the phone in the mid-credits scene ("Start" not "Sir"). It does sound like she's the Power Broker - which still makes no sense to me.

Edited April 24, 2021 by tv echo

[Craphole Island]

Damn I love Sharon and Emily VanCamp but I realllly don’t think it makes sense for her to be the Power Broker? I feel like there’s gotta be more going on. Like maybe she’s a Skrull or something? Lol I’m grasping at straws but I just don’t want her to be fully evil.

On the other hand I loved the Sam/Isaiah scenes and I’m excited to see more of John Walker. Wyatt Russell was great. And I need more JLD!!

[Cobalt Stargazer]

3 hours ago, TiffanyNichelle said:

I also didn't like that Walker basically didn't learn any real lessons by the end of the episode and was back to being his usual self. Yes, I liked that he said Lemar's life mattered after Karli said he wasn't important enough to kill. But I think both Sam and Bucky were too cool with him considering how things last ended with him.

Same. He didn't even apologize to Bucky or Sam, and he's been such a colossal tool from Minute One that his sudden humility or whatever you want to call it doesn't work for me. I did notice that he seemed a little twitchy at the end there, since once he had his new uniform on he did one of those head shake things, like he had a fly buzzing around him. Only there was no fly, so they're not done with him yet, and maybe there's something to what Zemo said about the serum corrupting people or making them crazy. I guess Zemo's butler didn't know that John got the last of it, since he didn't blow him up. I'm not sure how to feel about that, either.

I don't care, I'm mad that Karli got killed, and all so she'd take the info about Sharon being the Power Broker with her when she died. In the end, she was just a kid, pulled into something so big that it altered her, and I don't just mean the serum. She apologized, even if it was just at the last.

Isaiah, though. Man. I admit it, there were tears when Sam took him to see the exhibit, and that hug just intensified it. No matter how justifiable his anger is, all he wanted was for someone to notice and give a damn, and now it's happened.

"What do you want, Black Falcon?" "Hey, you need to learn some manners." Hee.

Sharon, Sharon, Sharon. I can sort of see how this would happen, her being the Power Broker, at least depending on when she turned. She did stick her neck out to help Steve and the others, and it blew up in her face without her having the resources or the help to recover once everything was over. That the government has welcomed her back only for her to turn the place into an open house for the highest bidder is them inviting disaster, but where does it go from here? I did like the way she smiled when she was walking away from the podium, how you could see all that surface sweetness curdle into something less charming. Kind of like John, since who knows what's going on in his head now that he's been given the Contessa's backing.

More to unpack, so I'm sure I'll have a ton more to say later.

[Oreo2234]

Quote

If it hadn’t been for them turning Sharon Carter — one of Marvel’s best comic heroines—into a villain, I would have loved this ending. I mean, seriously after all the crap Emily VanCamp got from the Stucky stans on the internet and the Russos just cowing to them, the MCU brought her back for this?! This?!? It’s Game of Thrones all over again!!!!!

I hope she is eventually redeemed. 

Sam's new Captain America suit is awesome. 

Though I enjoyed the episode it did feel a bit rushed. Some of the action scenes had too many cuts. I still think the best action scene was the opening scene of the first episode.

[revbfc]

Does Cap’s (meaning Sam) new suit have some kind of exoskeleton that helps him catch & hold a whole armored car in free fall?

I really feel we’re owed an answer to this.

Edited April 23, 2021 by revbfc

[Abra]

Incoherent live viewing reactions:

"I'm Captain America" - "I thought he was on the moon?" heh

Karli asking a man who fought in World War II if he'd ever fought for something bigger than himself, the nerve of this child good grief

Redwing is back!

Did Bucky just do a Superhero Landing?

Oh, Walker tried to save the people! (As someone who feels for him more than can't stand him, this is a yay for me.)

Ooh, the shot of the shield as Sam lifts the truck up to save the people.

SHARON WHAT ARE YOU UP TO?

Sam just left Sharon there all shot up to carry Karli outside? Did he figure out she's the Power Broker?

Wait, so are we supposed to believe that Walker is mentally stable now? He did the right thing, but he still needs help, not just a new uniform.

What book was Bucky talking about in is note to Dr. Raynor?

The show could not have shoved it in our faces more this episode, but I still can't believe Sharon is the Power Broker. That's evil, and she's not evil. WTF? I'm going to hope she's a Skrull just like Endgame Steve, aren't I? OOH, maybe she'll be in Secret Invasion? Or she's deep deep undercover and trying to root out corruption...somewhere? I'm going to refuse to take this at face value, otherwise that's yet another character assassination with no real evidence to back up the behavior.

Edited April 23, 2021 by Abra
Accidentally submitted way too early again

[paigow]

Sharon is the fake Power Broker calling the fake Mandarin...

[AimingforYoko]

37 minutes ago, revbfc said:

Does Cap’s (meaning Sam) new suit have some kind of exoskeleton that helps him catch & hold a whole armored car in free fall?

I really feel we’re owed an answer to this.

Whenever you have a question like that, it's wizardsvibranium.

Sam's speech to the GRC was cheesy as hell, but completely in character for MCU Sam. And damn if they didn't get me with the Isaiah Bradley exhibit. 

Sharon as Power Broker? They left a lot of questions on that one. Was she one of the disappeared or not? Why did she purposely wreck her Super Soldier program? What is her end game here?

[paigow]

5 minutes ago, AimingforYoko said:

Sam's speech to the GRC was cheesy as hell, but completely in character for MCU Sam. And damn if they didn't get me with the Isaiah Bradley exhibit. 

Sam can get pardons for people, instantly get an exhibit built with a life size bronze statue... but is unable to get a bank loan...

[Ohiopirate02]

5 minutes ago, paigow said:

Sam can get pardons for people, instantly get an exhibit built with a life size bronze statue... but is unable to get a bank loan...

I assume, given how the episode ends, that the Wilson family got the money to keep their business afloat.  Most likely a gift from someone like Pepper or the US government greased the wheels for Sarah to get a secure loan that cannot be exploited.  Now that Sam is Captain America, it behooves TPTB to make sure him and his family are comfortable and secure.  

[Llywela]

20 minutes ago, Abra said:

Sam just left Sharon there all shot up to carry Karli outside? Did he figure out she's the Power Broker?

Wait, so are we supposed to believe that Walker is mentally stable now? He did the right thing, but he still needs help, not just a new uniform.

What book was Bucky talking about in is note to Dr. Raynor?

Sharon was a fugitive in hiding, so Sam couldn't just take her out to an ambulance, he'd blow her cover. Although it bothered me, too, that he just left her there with a gut wound!

I don't think we are supposed to believe that Walker is mentally stable now, no. As for who he is now working for...that has been left purposely vague. But I'd put money on him (and his instability) potentially being exploited.

The book Bucky said in his note that he'd finished was the little notebook Raynor had just looked at, with all the names crossed off. He has finished 'making amends' - put the Winter Soldier's crimes to bed, so to speak, as best he can, and started moving forward unfettered by his past. Giving her the notebook instead of keeping it was also symbolic of him letting go of the past in another way, since it came from Steve. 

7 minutes ago, paigow said:

Sam can get pardons for people, instantly get an exhibit built with a life size bronze statue... but is unable to get a bank loan...

The bank loan was then. I suspect he'd probably be given it now.

[FnkyChkn34]

1 hour ago, tv echo said:

Mid-credits scene: Sharon gets a full pardon and her old job back. But wait, who is she calling? Maybe she isn't the Power Broker, but just working for the real Power Broker while posing as the Power Broker at his order ("Sir")?  It would be more believable that the real Power Broker helped Sharon when she was on the run and thereby earned her loyalty. It would even be more believable if it turns out that Sharon is working deep undercover for the new SHIELD or SWORD (or whatever) in order to take down the real Power Broker. So I'm holding out hope for that to be a future twist.

This is kind of what I thought, but I've been known to be wrong...

I'm not sure I even followed this whole episode.  I'm going to need to binge watch all six episodes in a row to pick up on everything that I missed.

[Lebanna]

Of course I don’t believe he’d ever use it to get the loan, but Sam has publicly shown that he has a bunch of Vibranium assets in his possession now worth many millions.
 

The bank would consider him potentially rich.

[cambridgeguy]

1 hour ago, Oreo2234 said:

If it hadn’t been for them turning Sharon Carter — one of Marvel’s best comic heroines—into a villain, I would have loved this ending. I mean, seriously after all the crap Emily VanCamp got from the Stucky stans on the internet and the Russos just cowing to them, the MCU brought her back for this?! This?!? It’s Game of Thrones all over again!!!!!

On the other hand, some of the MCU's favorites are villains who are more the magnificent bastard/manipulator types (Loki, Zemo) or have been wronged (Killmonger) and have shades of grey.  After all, the official government (Ross, the senator in this series, etc.) have generally been portrayed as complete dicks, so it's not so bad if there's someone who wants to stick it to them.

[Racj82]

5 hours ago, Zonk said:

I'm still annoyed that they are treating ordinary humans as super soldiers.

No ordinary human could throw the shield like that. I know it is (part) vibranium, but either it's light like a plastic frisby or it can do massive damage. It can't be both.

Same goes for Sam holding an armored truck in the air. He has powerfull jets on his back... great... but his bones are just ordinary human bones. He should have been crushed, his armes snapped like twigs, his ribs and spine shattered.

Welcome to comic book properties. You must be new here.

On a side note, there is nothing disappointing to me about Sharon being the powerbroker. It's only disappointing if you let yourself get all worked up about who it could be. It was logically her from the jump...so it just makes sense.

I get that others are just upset that Sharon has seemingly gone bad but the changes in the mcu world are not going to lead to positive changes for everyone. 

I shed a tear for Isaiah. 

Sam is now my Captain America and I'm proud of that. 

[Hana Chan]

2 hours ago, tv echo said:

Sgt. Barnes? He's got his rank back?

Maybe not his rank, but his identity. That someone is identifying him first as himself (or at least the person he was before HYDRA got their hands on him) and not the Winter Soldier. This was the first time since Steve found him again that someone saw him as a person to be respected and not an international assassin (reformed or otherwise).

Have to admit that I loved seeing Bucky at the cookout with Sam and his community, and seeing Bucky completely accepted. He had people hugging him, kids climbing all over him, women clearly interested in him.... and the smile on his face. He's finally found a sense of peace and happiness that he's been denied for far too long.

He's not Steve's Bucky or HYDRA's attack dog or even Wakanda's White Wolf. He's himself.

 

Edited April 23, 2021 by Hana Chan

[VCRTracking]

Me during Sam's speech:

I loved "Evil Alfred" and Julia Louis Dreyfus' "or did I?" bit.

Sharon being the Power Broker isn't a shock. I personally love they they leaned in on the "Emily Thorne" of EVC. People need to remember the thing that kept Sharon in the comics from going full rogue was Steve, but in the MCU he's no longer around so....

Edited April 23, 2021 by VCRTracking

[festivus]

1 hour ago, Abra said:

Karli asking a man who fought in World War II if he'd ever fought for something bigger than himself, the nerve of this child good grief

I loved his answer: Yes, and I fell twice. 

[ursula]

29 minutes ago, Racj82 said:

On a side note, there is nothing disappointing to me about Sharon being the powerbroker. It's only disappointing if you let yourself get all worked up about who it could be. It was logically her from the jump...so it just makes sense.

 

12 minutes ago, VCRTracking said:

Sharon being the Power Broker isn't a shock. I personally love they they leaned in on the "Emily Thorne" of EVC. People need to remember the thing that kept Sharon in the comics from going full rogue was Steve, but in the MCU he's no longer around so....

Yep, I also had Emily Thorne (Amanda Clarke? Legit can't remember who she really was?) flashes in that scene and I thought it was kinda neat. Plus I like the bait-and-switch of making it seem that Walker was the heroic character that will break bad... only for it to be Sharon who already did before the show even started.

[Hana Chan]

1 hour ago, Abra said:

Karli asking a man who fought in World War II if he'd ever fought for something bigger than himself, the nerve of this child good grief

This is another moment where Karli's blindness to the suffering and sacrifice or anyone outside of her own little circle of followers really hamstrings her. To ask a man who fought the Nazis and HYDRA (pretty much the same thing), fought his way back to sanity after decades of being tortured and having his brain fried on a regular basis, taking up arms against a delusional alien with a massive army not once but twice to save the world and he's got this self-entitled child demanding to know if he's ever fought for a larger goal. 

This is why I couldn't support Karli. She refused to see anyone but her people suffering, and no cause as worthy other than her own. Yes, she had a lot of good points but she was completely blind to anything other than her cause and refused to see that rather than helping her cause, her actions did nothing to help it in the end except cost herself and her followers their lives.

[Minneapple]

4 hours ago, cambridgeguy said:

The single most unbelievable thing in the entire MCU is the idea that a US senator would back down and change course like that.  He'd dig in and double down on Sam being a well meaning but naive idiot who has no idea what the five years were like.

Yeah, I didn't buy anybody listening to Sam's speech. World leaders hear impassioned speeches every day and go about their business like nothing happened.