S04.E01: Strangers

[Forsaken]

1 hour ago, ShadowFacts said:

I don't think anyone has touched on Rebecca's father's little warning speech to Jack which was as overdone as Jack's speech at the table.  He was the only one who could calm crying baby Rebecca blah blah she is his whole world!  Despite having a wife and another daughter.  They just don't do subtlety on this show.

No they don't do subtle at all. The fathers speech was your basic cliche father thing to say. I am surprised there was no mention of how he loves to hunt deer and has a closet full of shot guns!

The problem is the writers aren't consistent. If she means that much to him why did he let her go off with a strange man? Not really the way an over protective father behaves. And in that era parents still had a lot of control.

[drafan]

So here we go.....

Deja is going to start dating Malik. Malik's dad is going to have an aortic aneurysm and die ....we've already seen the shoulder pain. Malik is going to attempt a drug deal to support his daughter and get shot and/or killed. Grandma will be too old and stressed to deal with any of it......soooooooo....Randall will take the baby.  Tie that one up with a big red bow of obvious.

Futurama Jack will become the biggest thing ever...for no reason other that he's a Pearson.

Flashback Jack will deliver a long boring self-praising monologue every week. Rebecca will stick out her lower lip while gazing at St Jack in adorement.

All the previews will come with instructions that we will need tissues. Maybe they will start releasing cry level ratings each week.

[ams1001]

4 minutes ago, drafan said:

Flashback Jack will deliver a long boring self-praising monologue every week. Rebecca will stick out her lower lip while gazing at St Jack in adorement.

Jumpin' Jack Flashback

[doodlebug]

On 9/26/2019 at 8:16 PM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Or, as Gloria Steinem said, "If men could get pregnant, abortion would be a sacrament."

[JudyObscure]

1 hour ago, doodlebug said:

Or, as Gloria Steinem said, "If men could get pregnant, abortion would be a sacrament."

All true and hilarious, but I also think if men had a form of birth control that only required one visit for an implant, and then they were good to go for the next three years, and could get as drunk as they wanted and have as much unsheathed sex as they wanted with no fear of anyone getting pregnant -- they would be lined up twice around the block for it.   Even if  it meant taking a bus across town and spending as much as they would on a new outfit.

[observer]

Pretty sure I'm done with this show.  I don't want to work this hard to follow characters and storylines.  Too fragmented for my pea brain, too little reward for the effort, moved too slowly.  All IMO, of course.

Edited September 29, 2019 by observer

[bybrandy]

On 9/27/2019 at 8:12 PM, BaggythePanther said:

Assuming Kevin is still famous in the future (and I think there were some acting awards shown in the flash forwards) I wouldn’t be surprised if Jack II was using the Pearson name (going by Jack Pearson Damon) to get in the door, at least at first. So I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s one of those artists that goes by three names (which everyone eventually just shortens to their initials).

Anything is possible but the only time we heard him addressed by his full name was when he was introduced as Jack Damon not Jack Pearson Damon.    So while he may have dropped the Pearson after getting famous there is nothing we've seen that indicates that's the case.   

 

[MsJamieDornan]

9 hours ago, observer said:

Pretty sure I'm done with this show.  I don't want to work this hard to follow characters and storylines.  Too fragmented for my pea brain, to little reward for the effort, moved too slowly.  All IMO, of course.

I agree.

[marceline]

Is keeping frosted, decorated cakes uncovered in the fridge a real thing? Or just a Pearson thing?

Since now we know that it's so far in the future, I'm going to assume that the convo where Lucy tells Jack 2 she's pregnant is happening in a hovercar.

[Lady Calypso]

Hey everyone! Let's get back on track to things that have happened in the episode. There are other threads that you can take the off topic discussions. Thanks! 

[bybrandy]

46 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

I wouldn't think so.   I would assume that the fat in the frosting would attract refrigerator odors.   That said, that was a pretty pathetic looking cake.

I assumed they bought/made/decorated it that day and it was just waiting for everybody to get home so while I don't keep frosted decorated cakes uncovered in the fridge I doubt there was time for it to pick up too much funk.

[Crs97]

1 hour ago, icemiser69 said:

Rebecca apparently doesn't know her father very well.  I thought he was supposed to be the nice one, not that her mother is any bed of roses.

Scary thing is that he is the nice one.  Amazing Rebecca turned out as nice as she is.

[gonzosgirrl]

3 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

Jack is just too stubborn.   He should have moved on from Rebecca.  

Rebecca apparently doesn't know her father very well.  I thought he was supposed to be the nice one, not that her mother is any bed of roses.

Maybe she never finds out that he spoke to Jack that way. 

[Beezella]

On 9/25/2019 at 1:16 PM, saber5055 said:

Thanks, show, for telling more people how to wear clothes and then return them so they can be sold to unsuspecting people who actually PAY for them.

I was on the receiving end of some pants that had been worn and returned. Inside the pocket was a Starbucks receipt and $14 change. I considered that a pretty lucky day.

[Booklady1017]

On 9/25/2019 at 4:28 PM, OhSarah69 said:

I totally thought bare-butt boy was Kevin Jr.....it never occurred to me that he was GrownUpBabyJack.  Seriously, until the scene with SmallBabyJack in Kate's arms at the doctor's office, it did not sink in. 

I found it a bit much that (Grandpa)Jack would tell his life story at the dinner table at the country club.  I figured he'd come back from the restroom and say something about the war...but that was not the place for a soliloquy on your little brother, your abusive parents, etc.  How would that make a good impression on your girlfriend's family?  Not that it excuses their snobby behavior.  It's just like, know your audience, man.

I think I really missed my Tuesday night emotional roller-coaster fix over the summer, so now that the show is back, I found that all through the hour, with all these new unfamiliar characters milling about, I was willing to just go with it (i.e. lay on the couch like a lump and let it wash over me, LOL).  I wasn't that fussed that one entire episode was used to jam these folks in...just hoping they're skillfully weaved in on future episodes without taking them over.  My feeling is, how do you keep expanding the characters without drawing in new experiences?  One way is by building onto existing characters or plot threads and that means bringing in new people sometimes.  Yes, I know sometimes it feels like they're cramming them down our throats.

Malik, the young teen father....I swear I thought he was 12 in his first scene.  How old is he supposed to be, maybe 14 or so (how old is Deja?).  When his mom made a comment about the baby waking up through the night, I totally thought the baby was Malik's little sister...totally bowled over that he was her daddy.  Please God, let Malik not get involved in drug running and inadvertently drag Deja in with him....I hope that's not where they are going with this.  Instead I hope she is a good influence on him and they have a relatively uncomplicated teen romance (but not a super-cheesy one).  Did we see Deja as a grown up in the Season 3 finale?  I wonder what happens to her...I loved her grinning face as she went home after the BBQ and loved Randall's and Beth's bemused faces as she strolled by them.

I thought Jack Jr. was Kevin Jr. too because of the great resemblance between Jack Jr. and Kevin.

[Booklady1017]

On 9/25/2019 at 10:19 PM, ams1001 said:

He's 17, apparently.

Thanks for sharing. I guess he’s one of those people who look really young for their age. I was like that.

[ams1001]

8 minutes ago, Booklady1017 said:

Thanks for sharing. I guess he’s one of those people who look really young for their age. I was like that.

Me too. I've worked for years with a woman who I'm still not sure believes I'm two years older than her.

[Snickerdoodle]

On 9/26/2019 at 9:37 AM, PRgal said:

Randall probably lives in the jurisdiction he represents.  And that area might be mixed income.  It's a change for the girls (at least for Tess and Annie), but it might be something that Deja is used to.  As for Malik's family, I wonder if the baby's mom is from a troubled home (and in foster care).  Since Malik's family is stable, she was placed under her grandparents' care.  I also think they purposely cast a very young looking teen so we would be even MORE surprised when we find out he's the dad and not the older brother.  Because I, too, thought he was like 13.

I wonder if there'll be a storyline involving the babymama wanting the baby back and Randall getting involved with it somehow. 

Maybe Randall will send the girls to a private school in Philly like Penn Charter (aka William Penn Academy from The Goldbergs.)

[Snickerdoodle]

On 9/27/2019 at 11:20 PM, DebbieM4 said:

I am so over Jack & Rebecca's early years too.   And yes, there was Jack going into a whole monologue at the dinner table.   Predictable and overdone, and it doesn't endear him to me at all.

I would have been okay with it if it hadn't gone on so damn long!   People on other sites posted that they thought they were watching the wrong show, had accidentally changed the channel, or whatever.   I understand trying to pique our curiosity, but I was really bored because it seemed as though I was endlessly watching people I didn't know and didn't care about.   All of that went on much, much too long.

I agree.  After waiting all this time, we wanted to see the family we've come to know!  Instead we were subjected to these random people for the majority of the episode.  I'm with you - I'm not at all interested in any of the new characters either.  They were shoved in my face too much, and I kept wanting them to go away.  It was overkill.  This episode needed a much better balance.

I DVRed the show and honestly I fast forwarded through most of it.  I really came to see the characters I was familiar with, not random people.  It kind of reminded me of when Nikki and Paolo were introduced on Lost.  It was made to seem we were supposed to care about those 2 characters, and they didn't seem to have ties to anyone else on the show.  Turned out fans hated them so they killed them off the show.  That's how I felt being introduced to these new characters without knowing their Pearson connections.

[Blakeston]

It just hit me that Jack Damon was introduced to us bare-assed as a nod to Jack Pearson being introduced that way in the pilot.

[CrystalBlue]

1 hour ago, Snickerdoodle said:

I DVRed the show and honestly I fast forwarded through most of it.  I really came to see the characters I was familiar with, not random people.  It kind of reminded me of when Nikki and Paolo were introduced on Lost.  It was made to seem we were supposed to care about those 2 characters, and they didn't seem to have ties to anyone else on the show.  Turned out fans hated them so they killed them off the show.  That's how I felt being introduced to these new characters without knowing their Pearson connections.

I watched it live and was irritated by the extended episode bullshit because at 10:00pm sharp I wanted to (and did) turn to another show on another channel (hello any Mayans MC watchers here!).  I was confused as everyone else, convinced that some supernatural power overtook my remote control and switched channels.  I rewatched on Hulu so actually sat through most of the show a second time.

Can we take bets on who kills off Cassidy, and Malik & Family?

What with the constant flashbacks, flash forwards and too many characters we're supposed to care about, and knowing there's two more seasons after this, I don't know if I'll hang in.

Not looking forward to the babies having babies storyline with Deja in the mix either.  What happened to Tess and Annie?  Boo.

[CrystalBlue]

25 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

It just hit me that Jack Damon was introduced to us bare-assed as a nod to Jack Pearson being introduced that way in the pilot.

True, but he's not Jack Junior, he's Kate and Toby's kid, so not "like father like son" but more of how many bare asses can we show on network TV (a la NYPD Blue).

[methodwriter85]

On 9/29/2019 at 4:54 PM, Snickerdoodle said:

Maybe Randall will send the girls to a private school in Philly like Penn Charter (aka William Penn Academy from The Goldbergs.)

In real Philadelphia, these girls would be sent to private school or charter. But knowing this show, they'll send them to traditional public school so that Randall will find out how bad Philly public schools are and realize that it's up to him to save it. We will then see a season-long plot that "homages" Lean on Me with Randall in the Mr. Clark role.

*BTW, not to get off topic, but charter schools are not private schools. They are public schools, just run independently of any school district. I attended a magnet school, which is similar to a charter in that they're public, but they're actually a part of the school district, just not set as a feeder pattern school. You have to apply to get into a magnet.

Edited October 2, 2019 by methodwriter85

[ElectricBoogaloo]

3 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

charter schools are not private schools. They are public schools, just run independently of any school district. I attended a magnet school, which is similar to a charter in that they're public, but they're actually a part of the school district, just not set as a feeder pattern school. You have to apply to get into a magnet.

Thanks for the reminder. I remember during Parenthood, there was a lot of confusion about this (due in no small part to the Bravermans’ involvement).

Edited September 30, 2019 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Clanstarling]

2 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Thanks for the reminder. I remember during Parenthood, there was a lot of confusion about this (due in no small part to the Bravermans involvement).

Not to mention their magical abilities to get it done - and less than magical incompetence once they did it. 

[Blakeston]

12 hours ago, CrystalBlue said:

True, but he's not Jack Junior, he's Kate and Toby's kid, so not "like father like son" but more of how many bare asses can we show on network TV (a la NYPD Blue).

Jack Pearson is still Jack Damon's namesake, and his direct descendant. I really don't think it's a coincidence that they were both introduced with rear nudity.

I'm sure the network was glad to have a hot naked guy onscreen, too, but that doesn't mean they weren't going for a parallel.

[ljenkins782]

On 9/24/2019 at 10:36 PM, Rohirrim said:

I spent the first 60+ minutes wondering why I continue to watch this show, only to be sucked in by the final waning seconds.  Not cool, guys...and yes I will tune in next week, dammit. 😉

Yeah, I was completely confused for the entirety of the episode (except the Jack/Rebecca parts since I at least knew who they were) and the ending kinda brought me back around, but I still don't think that was a great season opener. 

If your audience has to keep checking the channel to make sure that they're still watching the show they tuned into, it's not a great thing. I especially think the war storyline was a major WTF distraction, that was a hell of a lot of backstory simply to arrive at Nicky (who I don't really care that much about) freaking out at a meeting. 

[Scarlett45]

On 9/28/2019 at 9:16 AM, Forsaken said:

The problem is the writers aren't consistent. If she means that much to him why did he let her go off with a strange man? Not really the way an over protective father behaves. And in that era parents still had a lot of control.

Well Rebecca is a full blown adult (over 21 at this point) and she lived in her own apartment and was supporting herself. They couldn’t have stopped her. It was the late 1970s not 1870s- they didn’t have control over her life they just thought she was stupid. 

[PRgal]

20 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

Well Rebecca is a full blown adult (over 21 at this point) and she lived in her own apartment and was supporting herself. They couldn’t have stopped her. It was the late 1970s not 1870s- they didn’t have control over her life they just thought she was stupid. 

I think I may have forgotten, but does Rebecca have any siblings?  Or if she does, is she the youngest?  That could be a reason.

NOTE:  My mom is more or less Rebecca's age and let's just say my grandmother tagged along with her when she went to school even in university (this isn't typical in Hong Kong and YES, she was embarrassed.  My grandmother was helicopter long before that existed).

[ShadowFacts]

6 minutes ago, PRgal said:

I think I may have forgotten, but does Rebecca have any siblings?  Or if she does, is she the youngest?  That could be a reason.

NOTE:  My mom is more or less Rebecca's age and let's just say my grandmother tagged along with her when she went to school even in university (this isn't typical in Hong Kong and YES, she was embarrassed.  My grandmother was helicopter long before that existed).

Yes, it was mentioned in this episode and I think previously that she has an older sister.  I am also thinking that country club mommy and daddy probably weren't super excited about their daughter singing in dive bars, if she was straight with them about her sources of income . 

[Clanstarling]

10 minutes ago, PRgal said:

I think I may have forgotten, but does Rebecca have any siblings?  Or if she does, is she the youngest?  That could be a reason.

NOTE:  My mom is more or less Rebecca's age and let's just say my grandmother tagged along with her when she went to school even in university (this isn't typical in Hong Kong and YES, she was embarrassed.  My grandmother was helicopter long before that existed).

They've mentioned a sister.

Your mom and I have some things in common. My father went to college when I did, even took classes with me. It didn't seem abnormal to me and took many years for me to figure out why my profs thought it was so weird. Once I figured it out, I started distancing myself. Moving didn't help - they just moved right along with me. I just had to work at setting boundaries, which was a challenge.

Edited September 30, 2019 by Clanstarling

[PRgal]

5 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

They've mentioned a sister.

Your mom and I have some things in common. My father went to college when I did, even took classes with me. It didn't seem abnormal to me and took many years for me to figure out why my profs thought it was so weird. Once I figured it out, I started distancing myself. Moving didn't help - they just moved right along with me. I just had to work at setting boundaries, which was a challenge.

At least my grandmother didn't go into my mom's classes!!!  She just took the bus with her.  I think my mom said something about her running errands.  I mean, who wants to tell their friends the REAL reason?  

[ErinV]

I fear that you all who are saying Jack Jr looks like Kevin are actually the blind ones 😆

[CrystalBlue]

10 hours ago, ljenkins782 said:

Yeah, I was completely confused for the entirety of the episode (except the Jack/Rebecca parts since I at least knew who they were) and the ending kinda brought me back around, but I still don't think that was a great season opener. 

If your audience has to keep checking the channel to make sure that they're still watching the show they tuned into, it's not a great thing. I especially think the war storyline was a major WTF distraction, that was a hell of a lot of backstory simply to arrive at Nicky (who I don't really care that much about) freaking out at a meeting. 

I care about Nicky, as he is Pearson family.  (Also, I'm a Griffin Dunne fan).  The WTF new Middle East war PTSD storyline and character is not needed to see Nicky connecting with his newly-found family.  Unless Cassie is related, as some have speculated.  But she's another character that takes up a lot of space.

[debraran]

6 hours ago, CrystalBlue said:

I care about Nicky, as he is Pearson family.  (Also, I'm a Griffin Dunne fan).  The WTF new Middle East war PTSD storyline and character is not needed to see Nicky connecting with his newly-found family.  Unless Cassie is related, as some have speculated.  But she's another character that takes up a lot of space.

Do you think she might be related, Nicky's daughter? I wondered because Fogleman said she will have a different, complicated relationship with Kevin. That could go anywhere but she seemed to know Nicky and I'm sure he wasn't a complete monk all these years. Time will tell.

[meep.meep]

On 9/29/2019 at 3:01 AM, marceline said:

Is keeping frosted, decorated cakes uncovered in the fridge a real thing? Or just a Pearson thing?

It's Faux Reality - a thing that happens on TV but not in real life.  In real life we have our decorated cakes in a box.  On TV they have to be uncovered so we know it's someone's birthday.

[CrystalBlue]

12 hours ago, debraran said:

Do you think she might be related, Nicky's daughter? I wondered because Fogleman said she will have a different, complicated relationship with Kevin. That could go anywhere but she seemed to know Nicky and I'm sure he wasn't a complete monk all these years. Time will tell.

Yes, time will tell.  I sure hope they're not spending all this time on some rando, but Nicky having a lost-long daughter?  Tragedy pile-on.  If Cassie is Nicky's blood, the she can't connect with Kevin in a way that would make her his baby momma, right?  Do we really need an inspiration for PTSD storyline?  Anyway, does anyone think that Nicky was drunk and crazy when he hurled the chair, not "just" PTSD-induced angry?

[debraran]

2 hours ago, CrystalBlue said:

Yes, time will tell.  I sure hope they're not spending all this time on some rando, but Nicky having a lost-long daughter?  Tragedy pile-on.  If Cassie is Nicky's blood, the she can't connect with Kevin in a way that would make her his baby momma, right?  Do we really need an inspiration for PTSD storyline?  Anyway, does anyone think that Nicky was drunk and crazy when he hurled the chair, not "just" PTSD-induced angry?

Did he have a bottle in his hand?  Maybe a little of both. I thought daughter because she has a son and it would be more complications. Some time has to pass before he gets rich and Rebecca gets old and his son seemed 7-8, hard to remember, but I assume it wont be his wife.  We will see...; )

Just now, debraran said:

Did he have a bottle in his hand?  Maybe a little of both. I thought daughter because she has a son and it would be more complications. Some time has to pass before he gets rich and Rebecca gets old and his son seemed 7-8, hard to remember, but I assume it wont be his wife.  We will see...; )  You also are discouraged to hook up with other recovering addicts but many do. To have Cassie going through her recovery and Kevin and Nicky seems a bit much. 

[Chewy101]

14 hours ago, meep.meep said:

On 9/29/2019 at 5:01 AM, marceline said:

Is keeping frosted, decorated cakes uncovered in the fridge a real thing? Or just a Pearson thing?

It's Faux Reality - a thing that happens on TV but not in real life.  In real life we have our decorated cakes in a box.  On TV they have to be uncovered so we know it's someone's birthday.

In my world, only people who could purchase a personalized cake had cake boxes. The rest of us made them ourselves, so yes, they stood in the fridge or on the counter not boxed up. And if we made a cake for someone else, we carried it in a cake dish, not a box.  

[Chewy101]

I'm intrigued by these theories about Cassidy. This shows throws endless loops, so who knows, but I really just thought Nicky and Jack's experiences would be something she would relate to in future AA episodes and she was only there to be Kevin's next girl.

As for Nicky holding a bottle..... I think his issues with the VA and refusal to take their help, and his struggles with alcohol, and it was an AA meeting, I saw a drunken lash out. What I didn't see was that it may possibly be personally directed at Cassidy. I thought it was just directed at the VA.

[debraran]

3 hours ago, Chewy101 said:

I'm intrigued by these theories about Cassidy. This shows throws endless loops, so who knows, but I really just thought Nicky and Jack's experiences would be something she would relate to in future AA episodes and she was only there to be Kevin's next girl.

As for Nicky holding a bottle..... I think his issues with the VA and refusal to take their help, and his struggles with alcohol, and it was an AA meeting, I saw a drunken lash out. What I didn't see was that it may possibly be personally directed at Cassidy. I thought it was just directed at the VA.

I don't mind it unwinding and not knowing. This show rarely does anything for no reason and she does give him a "look" it seems when she is getting chair. Nicky also mentioned once having a home, maybe he got worse over the years and sadly left some people behind. As long as it's done well, it can go many places.

[cali1981]

I finally watched the season opener last night and sat through a lot of it thinking "who are all these people?". The show can sometimes get a little too cute with its alternating time lines and this episode was even beyond that. Sure, the last few minutes did tie some of it together but there had to be a better way to introduce these folks.

[NYCFree]

On 9/26/2019 at 3:17 PM, JudyObscure said:

I'm continually amazed that schools, and shopping areas everywhere, don't have clinics where anyone could get free birth control anytime.   It would save the government so much money in the long run, plus the need for abortions might go so low as to almost quit being an issue.

When I was a teacher, my school had a program that distributed free condoms. They had to have one female teacher and one male teacher available each period to hand them out. I volunteered, but my principal looked at me doubtfully and told me to say “condom.”  I complied and she shook her head and told me I blushed too much to have that position.

[Brookside]

On 9/27/2019 at 10:28 AM, S.Batts said:

They used the same baby for both scenes.  Not sure anyone else caught on but it was the same baby.   Good on them for saving some money on hiring one baby to play both roles.  You don't notice so much in the doctor's office when Kate is holding baby Jack but you do notice when she gets home and Rebecca is holding the baby in the air and you can see the back of his head.   The flat head is a dead giveaway to it being the same baby.

Curious as to how you know it's the same baby?  And why it would save money?  (It's not uncommon for babies to have flat heads from sleeping on their backs when the skull is soft.  They usually round out later.)

[Driad]

For a while I wondered if teenage Malik was yet another young Randall, in an alternate universe in which he was adopted by a black family (and given a different name).  Hoping they never do alternate universes in TIU.

[Samwise979]

So how's this for dumb. As soon as the blind character was introduced I imdb'd him because I thought he was cute, saw that he was playing Jack Damon (and also noticed the woman was playing Lucy Damon) and I thought... Huh, must be Toby's parents. 😂😂😂😂🤦🤦🤦🤦 Not until the very end when the doctor told Kate and Toby Jack would not be regaining his sight was I like, ooooohhhhhhhh right, their kid's name is Jack. 

[MdMaxx]

On 9/24/2019 at 10:05 PM, Blakeston said:

Please, Deja, run from a single father in his mid-teens who thinks the responsible thing to do for his daughter is to sell drugs. I'm not looking forward to that storyline one bit.

I'm actually really insulted by this story-line. Of course they introduce a poor Black family with a teen son who's a father and he also happens to know a drug dealer. I really really REALLY hope they aren't setting Deja up for some struggle love bullshit. 

[CrystalBlue]

4 hours ago, MdMaxx said:

I'm actually really insulted by this story-line. Of course they introduce a poor Black family with a teen son who's a father and he also happens to know a drug dealer. I really really REALLY hope they aren't setting Deja up for some struggle love bullshit. 

You know they are.

Yes, it's a stereotype.  And they cast a kid who looks 12 years old to play him.

[ShadowFacts]

9 hours ago, MdMaxx said:

I'm actually really insulted by this story-line. Of course they introduce a poor Black family with a teen son who's a father and he also happens to know a drug dealer. I really really REALLY hope they aren't setting Deja up for some struggle love bullshit. 

Just for a reference point, remember that Jack Pearson, fresh from Vietnam and around age 30, thought it was a bright idea to play poker with shady back-alley types, then try to steal money back from them in a bar.  And met his true love at a bar that night and his life course changed.  So they are probably going in that direction here with Deja and maybe a less rosy ending.  One difference is that Jack came from a very dysfunctional family and Malik's doesn't look that way at all.  The parents/grandparents get along very well, both are employed, are supportive of their son.  I am not crazy about the kid wanting to make more money the wrong way, but there is precedent in the show with old Jack P. 

[sunshine23]

Now I'm sad I deleted this one. Guess I have to go back and watch it.