S08.E03: The Long Night

[Neurochick]

5 minutes ago, Ottis said:

There are many similar comments today in reviews around the internet. Might not find as many among fans here. I was glad to see many others shared my take. Lots of comments about how difficult it was to follow, and how the show lost its nerve and left so many alive. Caused minimal emotional impact. 

I read some negative reviews too.  Sometimes I think people write negative reviews just to get noticed.  Some folks don't like reading positive things no matter what.  In earlier seasons, some complained that the bad guys were always winning.  And now that the episode wasn't the bloodbath people expected, folks are pissed too.  

But there are 3 episode left and who knows what will happen.  I also feel some were upset because of all the predictions as to who would die and many of those predictions didn't come true.  

My only complaint with the episode was that it should have only been one hour, but other than that I was satisfied.  

Quote

The score got bizarrely jazzy and jaunty at the very end. The upbeat piano stuff going on while the NK strode towards Bran sounded so bizarre and out of place for what was supposed to be a world-ending moment. 

Yes, what WAS that score at the end?  It did sound out of place.  Not very "Game of Thrones-y"

Edited April 29, 2019 by Neurochick

[Bannon]

I really would like it if The Iron Bank played a role in finish. I can hear the Bank's representative now...."Your Grace, your Maester is a skilled scientist and engineer, but he's a lousy lawyer. If you'll note on page 4, paragraph 6 of your Golden Company Lease Contract, we reserve the right to refund your lease payment, and pull back the Company to Essos. The Bank has decided that it is imprudent to see half the Company burned by a Dragon, for the price you are paying. In addition, one of the Bank's most valued partners is called The House of Black and White, and their managing partner has just named a certain Arya Stark as The House's Employee of the Month! It would be counter to the Bank's culture to be aligned against it's valued partners, so we are also invoking another clause  in the lease agreement that Maester Qyburn apparently overlooked, wherein your new husband Euron's fleet was pledged as collateral, in event of any violation of the agreement by you. You promised to never publicly disparage The Bank under any circumstances, and we have sworn afadavits that you, while intoxicated, called The Bank, and I quote "A bunch of parasitic bloodsuckers". If you'll look out the window, you'll see your fleet is being re-poed. Feel free to apply with us again in 12 months, after your FICO score improves!"

[millennium]

37 minutes ago, Macbeth said:

The quiet piano theme during the part of the battle when all appeared lost threw me off. It was beautiful, but it sounded like it was something I would hear on Westworld. I know they share the same composer. 

I haven't watched Westworld yet, so I am happy I was able to enjoy it for its own beauty and not had my impression colored by another show.   It was reminiscent of the sequence when Cersei blew up the Great Sept.

[Humbugged]

15 hours ago, rollacoaster said:

Ok...did Grey Worm survive?

Cleanup is gonna be a f*cking bear.

Too soon dude as House Mormont was ended

[Holmbo]

6 minutes ago, Ottis said:

There are many similar comments today in reviews around the internet. Might not find as many among fans here. I was glad to see many others shared my take. Lots of comments about how difficult it was to follow, and how the show lost its nerve and left so many alive. Caused minimal emotional impact. 

I'm glad that people here liked it. But honestly a bit surprised not to see more complaints. I watched it with a friend and as we discussed the episode after we just kept coming up with new things we didn't like. And we're not picky people overall.

[Constantinople]

13 minutes ago, DarkRaichu said:

Qyburn has the ability to make wildfire so supply is not the issue

As always, it depends how detailed the writers want to be.

We don't know how long it take to make wildfire, nor what supplies are necessary. It's possible it will take too long, or it's possible they don't have enough the necessary ingredients

Or it's possible the writers will just hand wave all of that away and we'll have Insta-wildfire, just add water, heat for 60 seconds and stir

[millennium]

12 hours ago, Kanner said:

It’s that she considers herself the best leader and then does this. 

We all like to believe we'll be heroes when the hour of wolves is upon us,  but it is not in everyone's nature.   It doesn't make you less of a person, just human.

[Traveller519]

Really enjoyed watching it in the moment. The tension was palpable. As the "fog of war" lifts on both our heros and us in the moments of watching the show some picky-ness has emerged.

There were some great moments in the show (Arya kills the Night King, obviously; Theon’s redemption; Lighting the Dothraki Swords, Lady Mormont stabbing the giant), but only one truly great scene in my opinion. And that was Arya in the Library into the great hall. That was tense, well shot, gave us a good sense of where everything was, and transitioned into a good character moment.

I’ll give an honorable mention to the Unsullied covering the retreat too. That was a good scene, given the very light dialogue of the episode.

There were several smaller elements I liked too. I liked that the Dragon Class on the defensive hedgehogs worked and we got to see that payoff. Melisandre, on the whole, was VERY good. I liked Tyrion’s anxiousness in the crypts and the moments between him and Sansa (not to mention Missandei dropping some tea). The fact that the dead were raised in the crypts, but that they were really just bone and incomplete skeletons, mitigated what could have been a very lazy premise.

Some things that I think could have helped, though:

• More engagement with the actual White Walkers. If this is truly the last we encounter them, they were really only in one scene walking into the Castle. I would have liked to see them “commanding” battalions of wights and getting the reminder that if you kill a White Walker those that it has turned go down too. It would have been a nice little moment of reprieve in the battle too.
• Some more importance placed on the value of the Valeryian Steel blades throughout the battle. Maybe have Dany pick up Jorah’s and hold her own defense.
• Something to reinforce the motivation of the Night King before he met his demise. Maybe engaging with Bran in Three-Eyed Raven vision. Something to reinforce the looming disaster.

Edited April 29, 2019 by Traveller519

[ulkis]

12 minutes ago, kieyra said:

Something I forgot till just now:

The score got bizarrely jazzy and jaunty at the very end. The upbeat piano stuff going on while the NK strode towards Bran sounded so bizarre and out of place for what was supposed to be a world-ending moment. 

It was nice music and I actually think it did fit, but it was also jaunty, like you said, so between that and not being tense anymore I was shimmying my shoulders.

Edited April 29, 2019 by ulkis

[Giselle]

52 minutes ago, WatchrTina said:

HBO has posted a behind-the-scenes video for this episode and it is AWESOME.  It's much much in-depth than the usual Inside-the-episode video (that is also available -- it comes on automatically if you want the episode on-demand.)

Enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3M0Xt97aFI

Thank you for posting this.

It was amazing and interesting to watch.

Thanks again!

[Dobian]

19 minutes ago, Ottis said:

There are many similar comments today in reviews around the internet. Might not find as many among fans here. I was glad to see many others shared my take. Lots of comments about how difficult it was to follow, and how the show lost its nerve and left so many alive. Caused minimal emotional impact. 

I really thought Brienne was going to die, given how they featured her last week.  I think if she had died rhe episode would have achieved its major character death quota.

Edited April 29, 2019 by Dobian

[DarkRaichu]

35 minutes ago, Dobian said:

I would like some explanation, even in a mini flashback next week, for how Arya got past a zombie mob in the castle and then past the NK's guards to attack him.  Her ability to use faces would be the obvious explanation and the ultimate culmination of her assassin training.

I highly doubt there will be any explanation.  But here is how I fanwank it: Arya dressed up as 1 of the wights that were attacking Theon.  Once she was shot by Theon, she used her assassin skill to lay motionless on the snow until NK arrived.  As she jumped up from the ground to attack, we saw the swooshing of Walker's hair.

[eelpout]

36 minutes ago, Dobian said:

I would like some explanation, even in a mini flashback next week, for how Arya got past a zombie mob in the castle and then past the NK's guards to attack him.  Her ability to use faces would be the obvious explanation and the ultimate culmination of her assassin training.

1 hour ago, chrisvee said:

I am more interested in the interpersonal dynamics rather than another huge battle although we’re likely getting one.

yep.

as others said they telegraphed that Arya was going to be the one to take down NK via Melisandre's 30 second stare down near the beginning and their exchange over eye color in the room with The Hound. But how Arya managed to get out of the castle and by the entire horde without any explanation, I too was expecting some use of faces, they apparently thew up their hands about and hope we didn't care because... Arya!!! And sorry, stealth doesn't explain it. Disappointing.

And no real interaction between Bran and NK after all this? What the heck?

I fear GoT has succumbed to ye old chestnut of CGI over story in this last season. 🙄 Go back and watch some of their early seasons before the computer imagery was so prevalent to see what I mean.

[WatchrTina]

11 minutes ago, Traveller519 said:

There were some great moments in the show (Arya kills the Night King, obviously; Theon’s redemption; Lighting the Dothraki Swords

I'm calling it now.  Someone is going to do a mash-up of this episode inter-cut with scenes from Lord the the Rings, in which the lighting of the Dothraki swords is going to lead directly to the lighting of the beacons of Minas Tirith.  What will follow will be a mashup between this battle and battle for Helms Deep.  Seriously, this NEEDS to happen.

Edited April 29, 2019 by WatchrTina

[OldButHappy]

1 hour ago, Bali said:

Dany's true grief, and Drogon comforting her. (Like my sheltie was comforting me at that point.)

Ha!  My dog made himself scarce...I'm generally non-emotive when the television is on, so on the rare occasions that I shout and jump up from my chair (every super bowl and last night's GOT), he's quite sure that I am losing my mind.

[Clawdette]

I had looked so forward to this episode that I set myself up for a small letdown. It was fine but didn’t have the impact for me that The Battle of the Bastards had. I couldn’t stop thinking about Stark v. Bolton and watched that set-to multiple times. I’m sure I will rewatch last night’s episode but I’m not in a hurry to do so  

[Giselle]

2 minutes ago, DarkRaichu said:

I highly doubt there will be any explanation.  But here is how I fanwank it: Arya dressed up as 1 of the wights that were attacking Theon.  Once she was shot by Theon, she used her assassin skill to lay motionless on the snow until NK arrived.  As she jumped up from the ground to attack, we saw the swooshing of Walker's hair.

Maybe they will do a flash back and show how Aria did it next episode. Everybody has found out individually what a badass she is. People are gonna talk.

[DarkRaichu]

4 minutes ago, eelpout said:

And no real interaction between Bran and NK after all this? What the heck?

This.  All the build up and at the end there was 0 interaction between the 2 of them ?? C'mon!!!

[tennisgurl]

So, now that Winter Has Come, can the new house words for the Starks be "stick em with the pointy end"? 

[Constantinople]

Things I learned from Game of Thrones

• Keep a spare dragon glass arrow with you for when the Night King shows up
• Don't scream as you jump at the Night King from behind

[DarkRaichu]

3 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

So, now that Winter Has Come, can the new house words for the Starks be "stick em with the pointy end"? 

Didn't Arya say that to Gendry too ?? 

Good night folks !!!!

😄

😄 

[eelpout]

9 minutes ago, DarkRaichu said:

14 minutes ago, eelpout said:

And no real interaction between Bran and NK after all this? What the heck?

This.  All the build up and at the end there was 0 interaction between the 2 of them ?? C'mon!!!

upon further thought, I fear they left this out because they are planning that prequel about the origins of NK.

Edited April 29, 2019 by eelpout

[Macbeth]

40 minutes ago, kieyra said:

Something I forgot till just now:

The score got bizarrely jazzy and jaunty at the very end. The upbeat piano stuff going on while the NK strode towards Bran sounded so bizarre and out of place for what was supposed to be a world-ending moment. 

Yeah. I thought so as well. I commented earlier that it sounded like it belonged in Westworld. GOT shares the same composer. 

Generally the score is so good so for me it is a minor nitpick. 

[BitterApple]

I'm with others who have a hard time believing Bran is so integral to the world, his death would be the ultimate trophy for the Night King. For starters, nobody knew what the Three Eyed Raven even was before Bran dropped his new job title. Second, Bran's visions haven't done jack shit to help win battles or save lives. Thus far, all he's done is out the fact that his brother cousin is boning his aunt. Lastly, what's his endgame? To write history books? There's already an entire Citadel and team of Maesters to do that. Act as a sort of living history? His purpose just isn't fleshed out enough for viewers to buy it as motivation to protect him at all costs.

[MadameKillerB]

35 minutes ago, WatchrTina said:

I'm calling it now.  Someone is going to do a mash-up of this episode inter-cut with scenes from Lord the the Rings, in which the lighting of the Dothraki swords is going to lead directly to the lighting of the beacons of Minas Tirith.  What will follow will be a mashup between this battle and battle for Helms Deep.  Seriously, this NEEDS to happen.

hehehe. When the trench was lit, I yelled, "The beacons are lit!" and my son yelled, "Gondor calls for aid!"

[terrymct]

1 hour ago, ulkis said:

Well, if anyone wants to watch a big battle where the protagonists

  Hide contents

don't win and a bunch of main characters die

, PBS is on episode 3 of a no-singing Les Miserables mini-series tonight at 9 pm EST, heh.

I understand Javert's motivation only slightly better than the Night King's.

[proserpina65]

I really wish I had wifi so I could've expressed my immediate reaction without having to leave the safety of my bedroom.  (Have I mentioned that zombies freak me the hell out?)  But here's the message that my best friend's answering machine got, because I had to say it to someone:  HOLY FREAKING SHIT!!!!!

Now, hours later, I can say thought that was awesome and intense, and I was so amped up afterwards that I couldn't sleep for hours.  Some of it was expected, some of it wasn't, and some of it was sad as hell, even if I did anticipate it.  (Nooooooo, not my Dolorous Edd!!!!)

I will say I was surprised that neither Jon, nor Tormund, nor Edd, all of whom has seen what the Night King did at Hardhome, considered what might happen in the crypt where generations of Starks had been entombed.  Maybe they, like some of us on the internet, thought the tombs would contain the dead, or that they'd been dead too long to be raised.  Obviously Jon Snow still knows nothing, sometimes.

And after all the talk of Azor Ahai and the prince who was promised, it was Arya Freaking Stark who destroyed the Night King.  Amen.

Honestly, if that had been the series finale, ending with Melisandre's death just as the first rays of dawn showed over the mountains, I would have been satisfied.  The next 3 episodes are going to be very anticlimatic for me.

So my basic character outcome list is as follows:

Survived - Jon, Dany, Bran, Arya, Sansa, Tyrion, Varys, Missandei, Davos, Jaime, Brienne, and I think that was Pod with them.  And Drogon, of course.

Died - Edd<sob>, Jorah, Theon, Lyanna Mormont, Melisandra, and Viserion for good.

MIA - Tormund, Grey Worm, Sam Gendry, Gilly, Baby Sam, The Hound, Rhaegal, and Ghost

[RedHawk]

When Jorah returned from the first foray, his expression in closeup and the way the horse moved made me question if he was some sort of "ghost", that maybe he would turn into a wight just as he got back to Winterfell. It was chilling! 

I loved the tension of the scene where Arya evaded the wights in the library. I kept thinking the one we saw dragging a sword would be Uncle Benjen. I have been waiting for him to reappear as a wight or a White Walker since S1 Ep 1. He turned up once as a WW and somehow helped Jon when he was north of the Wall, right? Have we seen him since? I guess if not he is definitely finished now.

I enjoyed Sansa and Tyrion making up while hiding behind a crypt. Kept waiting for one of the very most ancient dead Starks to bust through right above Sansa's head though! 

Sam did his share of fighting and then I think he was exhausted, terrified, and certain there was no hope. Yes, maybe he was cowardly to give up and keep needing to be saved, but the Hound gave up for a while there as well. I ascribe to the theory that Sam will be revealed as the author of the "Songs of Ice and Fire". I like him and was happy he survived. He has been brave -- he was the first man to kill a White Walker and he also killed one (1) Thenn!

It does bug me that characters are shown (sometimes more than once) surrounded by wights and yet they survive. I'm glad they survived, but it still bugs.

The scenes of the dragons above the clouds were beautiful.

Edited April 29, 2019 by RedHawk
Added more about why I like Sam!

[Taget]

1 hour ago, Wendy said:

That would be amazing. I want her death to be as painful as possible. I can picture Arya saying: 

One stab, "This is for my father" 

Another stab, "this is for Sansa" 

Another stab, "This is for my mother, Robb and his wife" 

And then I wouldn't mind if she tells her " The last thing you're ever going to see is a Stark, smiling down at you, as you die." 

Please D&D make it happen. 

Nah.  Cersei needs a death equal to the suffering she gave others.

Remember the poison she gave to Ellaria Sand and her daughter so that mother could watch her daughter die painfully before she did the same?

Or making sure that the woman who served The High Sparrow was sentenced to be raped by the Mountain for months on end before she was executed?

I guarantee you if Cersei got hold of Arya she would not be content to stab her a few times and wait for blood loss to make her go woozy and die in an hour.

[The Companion]

2 minutes ago, Taget said:

Nah.  Cersei needs a death equal to the suffering she gave others.

Remember the poison she gave to Ellaria Sand and her daughter so that mother could watch her daughter die painfully before she did the same?

Or making sure that the woman who served The High Sparrow was sentenced to be raped by the Mountain for months on end before she was executed?

I guarantee you if Cersei got hold of Arya she would not be content to stab her a few times and wait for blood loss to make her go woozy and die in an hour.

I still vote for: falls down the stairs after being tripped by Ser Pounce, who she thought she had killed but who survived.

[Efzee]

17 hours ago, Conan Troutman said:

He went MIA once he crashed, so I assume he's dead, but he could be just badly injured.

I couldn't tell which dragon was which because everything was so dark (and it was still light out here) and assumed Drogon was the one who ripped off half of Viseryon's neck and then nothing for a while... I was worried Rhaegal had been killed too and for a moment thought it was him/her with the blue dragonfire (with Jon in the courtyard or wherever) until I realized the fire was also coming out of its neck, where V had been injured. My thinking was that if Rhaegal had been killed, we'd have seen two "ice" dragons because the NK raised all the dead and we didn't, so he/she must still be alive.

16 hours ago, bluvelvet said:

Just read this on Twitter and didn’t even think of it. The Lord of Light brought Beric back all those times to fulfill his role to protect Arya. Hence why Mel said he fulfilled his purpose. Mel also fulfilled her mission and let herself die. 

16 hours ago, Growsonwalls said:

I;m glad they also gave Melisandre a hero's death because I'll admit, I almost stopped watching GoT after Shireen was sacrificed. That sweet wonderful girl dying like that was so hard for me to watch that I really almost stopped watching. And I'll never forgive Melisandre for her role in Shireen's death. But at least she redeemed herself.

I would have absolutely loved it if instead of taking off the necklace, Melissandre would have been standing there, realizing what had happened ("they" had won!) and that dawn was coming... her necklace falls off, she looks over her shoulder at Davos, gives him a small nod and walks off to die. Small difference, mostly the necklace falling off instead of her removing it, but the distinction would not be her "giving up" or whatever for fulfilling her destiny, but with her actions (firing up the arakhs and the trench) she burned up all her magic and did it knowingly.

16 hours ago, BitterApple said:

When the AOTD was climbing the walls, I was screaming, "WHERE THE HELL ARE THE DRAGONS?!!!!!!." Dany and Jon could've knocked the mob out in one shot, but were off playing tag with the Night King. 

Regarding Bran, can he just be useful for a frigging change? What's the point of having all these visions when they can't do jack shit to help the cause? 

Same, on both accounts.

16 hours ago, LadyChaos said:

Any sympathy I had for Sansa I lost.  She literally had a weapon and hid to save herself while people died.  Even if she didn't know how to use it, she could have tried to save the people.  

Same.

16 hours ago, maydaymayday said:

Am I the only one who thought Theon would rise up and kill the night King?

For a moment I was kinda hoping, especially when the NK was staring down at him. Then I was like, 'ah, I get it! Bran's sitting there so calmly because he's gonna warg into Theon (whose mind is still weak from his Reek period and thus easier to overtake than a regular person, similar to Hodor) and then kill the NK!', but that didn't happen either. 

Not that I don't love Arya's kill 🙂 

16 hours ago, 30 Helens said:

Another question: Where were all the identifiable dead Starks among the crypt rising dead? Seems like a wasted opportunity not to see Lyanna, Catelyn, and especially headless Ned.

Who knows, maybe those iron swords in the laps of the dead lords really do work 😉 

8 hours ago, merrick715 said:

I agree Sansa would have looked better if she was shown keeping morale up, beforehand.  However, I don't know what a true leader would do with the Westerosi equivalent of a shank, especially, if said leader, had no weapons training.

And whose fault is that? We've seen her watching her little sister fight, we've seen pretty much every northerner training with weapons, Jon and the northern lords/ladies agreed everyone, including the women, had to fight... yet Sansa couldn't be bothered to pick up a weapon and get some training. She could have even asked Brienne for some private tutoring indoors if she felt embarrassed about it or whatever. I just don't get the total lack of survival instinct from her.

8 hours ago, merrick715 said:

Thank you. Someone should have taken a few swords or spears down in the crypts with them, The only reason Sansa had that shank was that Arya gave it to her, and then sent her to the crypts.  It seemed like it wasn't the plan for Sansa to go to the crypts.  She is standing on the battlements with Arya, and it isn't until the Dothraki get slaughtered, that Arya sends her away.

I'm guessing Sansa was being her cocky self until she saw what the NK, WW and the army of the dead were capable of and realized that, yeah, maybe she should be in the crypts with all the helpless women, children, dwarf and eunuch.

[DarkRaichu]

6 minutes ago, RedHawk said:

I ascribe to the theory that Sam will be revealed as the author of the "Songs of Ice and Fire". I like him and was happy he survived. 

An older & fatter Sam with a pair of spectacles plus white hair and beard..  Oh and a hat, don't forget the hat.... 

I can see that, I definitely can see that 😉

[Lady S.]

6 hours ago, Wendy said:

I do wish that someone would let Yara know about Theon, how brave he was, how honorable his death was, how much his presence protecting Bran helped. 

I want Yara to be so proud of her baby brother, I want her to know that her brother killed as many bastards as he did. I want her to know that her brother made house Greyjoy proud. 

My only problem is that the only one that saw was Bran and he is not the best communicator, maybe by then Arya was already around and saw everything, she could tell everyone what a hero Theon was. 

His death hit me hard, not sure where that came from, it surely was unexpected but still the feels were all there 😞 

That single tear going down his cheek as Bran tells him he's a good man and thanks him, and then the doomed heroic charge at the Night King, how could anyone not get all the feels?

Watching 8.01 I was fine with that being Yara's exit as she had so few men and was clearly not in for the bigger fight, but yeah, now I really need to have her know Theon went out like a badass as the last ironman standing. I also need to see her kill Euron because it bugs me that he outlived Theon.

(Funny how no one calls Sandor a coward or a bitch for having another PTSD attack. Is it really just that Beric/Arya snapped him out of it?)

[RedHawk]

7 hours ago, Drogo said:

I agree with this.  I don't agree with how she spent her time in the crypt as the only possessor of a known effective weapon. 

If she couldn't use it herself, she should have given it to the 6 year old who volunteered to defend the crypt. 

Speaking of volunteering to defend the crypt, as Tyrion pointed out, he did fight and survive of the Battle of the Blackwater. So why wasn't he given (or obtain for himself) a dragonglass weapon so he could at least attempt to defend himself and the others down there? Gotta protect that clever brain from being eaten by wights!

Edited April 29, 2019 by RedHawk

[Constantinople]

21 minutes ago, Efzee said:

And whose fault is that? We've seen her watching her little sister fight, we've seen pretty much every northerner training with weapons, Jon and the northern lords/ladies agreed everyone, including the women, had to fight... yet Sansa couldn't be bothered to pick up a weapon and get some training. She could have even asked Brienne for some private tutoring indoors if she felt embarrassed about it or whatever. I just don't get the total lack of survival instinct from her.

What would be a better use of Sansa's time? Getting Winterfell organized, or weapons training so she could perhaps go from terrible to really, really bad?

Should Gendry spent his time improving his weapons skills, or was his time more useful as a smith forging weapons for others?

Neither Sam nor Davos did anything to improve their subpar skills with weaponry

Edited April 29, 2019 by Constantinople

[proserpina65]

1 hour ago, millennium said:

We all like to believe we'll be heroes when the hour of wolves is upon us,  but it is not in everyone's nature.   It doesn't make you less of a person, just human.

Plus Sansa is not a fighter, never has been.  Not all leaders are fighters.

[hnygrl]

OMG. Cerci and Jamie. Jamie is a changed man. Cerci is the same evil queen she always been.

I'm officially making a prediction.

JAMIE will kill Cerci. Up close and personal.

[sistermagpie]

13 hours ago, ShellsandCheese said:

Plot point: Jon already bent the knee; nobody is asking the North to give up rule out of gratitude. The person who was named KITN already did that prior to battle. In real life, the sovereignty of countries fighting for the allies was only going to be threatened if they lost. In other words, can we stick to show and not try to compare it to real life historical events (other than the ones that GRRM took inspiration from) because the comparisons don’t really work. 

And if the North had smart and capable leaders (I’m not including Jon, because he bent the knee and doesn’t want to rule or lead anyway) they’d have already approached Dany with an alternative agreement that would have been beneficial to both. Although, I’m guessing most of the Northern lords are dead at this point though. Or Sansa could have had a useful conversation in the crypts with Tyrion or even Messendei, to learn more about Dany and she if she could find a common thread or leverage that could be used to bargain for Northern independence but that didn’t happen either. 

But I don't see how that changes the analogy. Dany wanted to rule the North and asked for Jon to bend the knee for her help. That's how they became subjects rather than allies. Even if we consider Jon a sucky leader for doing it, it's still the North giving up independence for Dany's help beforehand and being happy about it out of gratitude afterward. With Dany not considering giving them independence out of gratitude or preferring an alliance. 

6 hours ago, Wendy said:

I do wish that someone would let Yara know about Theon, how brave he was, how honorable his death was, how much his presence protecting Bran helped. 

I want Yara to be so proud of her baby brother, I want her to know that her brother killed as many bastards as he did. I want her to know that her brother made house Greyjoy proud. 

My only problem is that the only one that saw was Bran and he is not the best communicator, maybe by then Arya was already around and saw everything, she could tell everyone what a hero Theon was. 

Since Bran knew to tell Theon he was a good man before he died, I think he'll know what's important to communicate to Yara on this one.

53 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

I'm with others who have a hard time believing Bran is so integral to the world, his death would be the ultimate trophy for the Night King. For starters, nobody knew what the Three Eyed Raven even was before Bran dropped his new job title. Second, Bran's visions haven't done jack shit to help win battles or save lives. Thus far, all he's done is out the fact that his brother cousin is boning his aunt. Lastly, what's his endgame? To write history books? There's already an entire Citadel and team of Maesters to do that. Act as a sort of living history? His purpose just isn't fleshed out enough for viewers to buy it as motivation to protect him at all costs.

I think it's more mystical. It means something to be remembered by someone, even if you're not part of general knowledge. Killing Bran means the NK doesn't just wipe out mankind, he wipes out any memory that it existed.

[proserpina65]

1 hour ago, Macbeth said:

1 hour ago, kieyra said:

Something I forgot till just now:

The score got bizarrely jazzy and jaunty at the very end. The upbeat piano stuff going on while the NK strode towards Bran sounded so bizarre and out of place for what was supposed to be a world-ending moment. 

I didn't even notice.

1 hour ago, BitterApple said:

Second, Bran's visions haven't done jack shit to help win battles or save lives.

He did give Arya the valerian steel knife.

[Constantinople]

And Arya joins a long list of those who attacked from the back while their enemy was distracted. It may not be honorable, but it gets the job done

[proserpina65]

21 minutes ago, Efzee said:

16 hours ago, 30 Helens said:

Another question: Where were all the identifiable dead Starks among the crypt rising dead? Seems like a wasted opportunity not to see Lyanna, Catelyn, and especially headless Ned.

I don't think any of their bodies made it back to Winterfell.

[MissLucas]

20 minutes ago, Constantinople said:

And Arya joins a long list of those who attacked from the back while their enemy was distracted. It may not be honorable, but it gets the job done

Well, she's an assassin - no points awarded for honor just for efficiency.

45 minutes ago, Taget said:

Nah.  Cersei needs a death equal to the suffering she gave others.

Remember the poison she gave to Ellaria Sand and her daughter so that mother could watch her daughter die painfully before she did the same?

Ellaria Sand used the same poison on Myrcella and the young sandsnake was also a cold-blooded murderer. On a list of crimes Cersei committed that one ranks somewhere towards the bottom of the (last) page.

Edited April 29, 2019 by MissLucas

[RedHawk]

5 hours ago, Bryce Lynch said:

Exactly.  The only numbers that count are:

Dany: 2 dragons, 1 Arya

Cersei : 0 dragons, 0 Aryas, 0 elephants  

I don't even see the need for troops and a huge battle. Just send Arya. This is Cersei's War, no one else in the South really wants it to happen, do they? They're all worn down and sick of war and suffering. It's like the Night King -- take out Cersei and the whole thing falls apart. The Golden Company goes home and everyone else sits down to figure out how to bring the peace and prosperity of Summer back to Westerns.

Well, I guess there's Euron who also wants the Iron Throne, but Yara and a quick sea battle could put an end to his arrogant ass.

[RedHawk]

1 hour ago, WatchrTina said:

I'm calling it now.  Someone is going to do a mash-up of this episode inter-cut with scenes from Lord the the Rings, in which the lighting of the Dothraki swords is going to lead directly to the lighting of the beacons of Minas Tirith.  What will follow will be a mashup between this battle and battle for Helms Deep.  Seriously, this NEEDS to happen.

The wights climbing over themselves up the walls also reminded me of similar scenes in one of the "Pirates of the Caribbean" films.

[VCRTracking]

[Humbugged]

All the talk about the Lord of Light and the prophecy as it might relate to Arya misses the point .The prophecy came from those that follow the Light ,and even though the LoL and the Many Faced God are usually opposed they were not in this case,and  Arya serves the MFG and the Night King had subverted death by re-animating them , Arya just gave 100,000 people the gift at a stroke and let them rest .

[SourK]

18 hours ago, Grumpymonkey said:

Bran telling Theon he was a good man, was a good finish for Theon, I did appreciate that.  I think I'll try to re-watch.

I think Theon is an interesting character, and I feel pity for him because of the way he was tortured -- no one deserves that no matter what they've done. But he also murdered two innocent children just to save face and there's nothing that's going to tip the scales back in the other direction for me and make him a good man.

He's a bad man who suffered a lot, and that makes him complicated... but not good. At least not for me.

17 hours ago, ulkis said:

Technically Cersei is the weaker villain but I think that is where most viewers' emotional investment is in.

I've never cared about the zombie story and I'm slightly worried that this is going to turn out to be a fake-out and the zombie story will dominate again at the end, but I'd be totally happy to spend the rest of this season wrapping up the political, interpersonal stories, because that's what I like about this show.

16 hours ago, Black Knight said:

Sansa has been my guess to end up ruling (along with Tyrion) and I was disappointed with her in this episode. I expected her to take and apply some lessons from the similar situation in Battle of the Blackwater, but despite being Lady of Winterfell she did nothing at all in the crypts to help keep up people's spirits or whatever.

I don't have a problem with Sansa disliking Dany, but I agree that there's a sharp contrast between that early battle and this one. On the one hand, we had a situation where Cersei was getting drunk and ignoring everyone (and making fun of Sansa for being such a goody-goody) while Sansa tried to comfort the servants and get everyone to pray together. I expected her to do something like that this time, especially since she's the lady of Winterfell, but instead she literally said nothing and turned away from everyone.

Full disclosure: Sansa is my favourite character who's not dead and I'm hoping she gets a good ending, but this stuff makes me worry for her. Especially because there have been other comparisons between her and Cersei. So, to see a throwback to that early scene that originally demonstrated how she was kinder than Cersei and have it harshly reversed like that... yeah, I'm worried.

15 hours ago, Keely said:

That wasn't the plan though. The grand, idiotic and ridiculous plan was for the 2 of them to sit up there with the dragons until the NK showed. Then they would engage him together with the dragons. The sparse dialogue alluded to it and the show discussion after confirmed it.

Straight-up: part of my less-than-optimal enjoyment of this episode is that I didn't understand the plan and therefore couldn't tell if it was going well or not at any given time.

One thing I'll say for the dragon plan, though: from Danny's POV, the last two times she took her dragons into battle, they got hit with missiles. One of them was injured and one of them died. So I'm not sure it would be awesome to just fly up to an army they can't see and see what happens.

However, since it appeared that the Night King was in no special hurry to go get Bran, it was also not awesome to sit the dragons out indefinitely while they waited for the Night King to reveal himself. I realize they have a better chance of winning a dragon battle 2-1, but maybe one of them could have been looking for the Night King and one of them could have been helping the army.

15 hours ago, lucindabelle said:

does this make Arya azor azhai then? And what about the bit about the Kings blood? I mean we saw Arya bleeding but she’s not the daughter of a king.

I'm confused about this, too, and it makes me wonder if maybe the prophecy is about doing something else? I don't know.

[Bryndza]

Not that I’ll really miss the character of Beric, but I loved his voice! I could listen to him all day.

I agree with above poster, I think Jaime will be the one to off Cersei.

Edited April 29, 2019 by Bryndza
Spelling matters

[Growsonwalls]

On social media the actors of GoT are paying tribute to Jorah, Theon, and Arya. It sounds like shooting this episode was hell for all involved but it's nice to see the various cast members pay tribute to these three characters from last night.

As for Sansa, yeah, last night she sucked. And I say this as a fan. But oddly that might have bonded her more to Tyrion, who also kind of cowered and ducked as well. I saw them holding hands and exchanging glances while hiding terrified as an acknowledgement that "yeah, we both suck."

[ElectricBoogaloo]

3 hours ago, WatchrTina said:

HBO has posted a behind-the-scenes video for this episode and it is AWESOME.  It's much more in-depth than the usual Inside-the-episode video. (That is also available -- it comes on automatically if you watch the episode on-demand.)

Enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3M0Xt97aFI

FYI - there are now two behind the scenes videos for each episode (Inside the Episode and Game Revealed), both of which are posted in the Inside the Episode thread every week. Game Revealed is a newer thing that began with S6 but it originally began as a six part thing (not one for each episode). During S6 and S7, the Game Revealed videos weren’t released until after the season was over. This year they are releasing them the same week that the episode airs (along with Inside the Episode).