S12.E18: The Real Vikings Of Orange County

[gundysgirl]

I cannot imagine Peggy coming back. Not just because she is the most boring HW I have ever seen and lacks even the most basic ability to communicate, but because she hasn't really formed any real bonds with anyone else on the show. Vicki likes her OK, but she isn't really all that into her. Lydia will listen to her, but I don't think she cares much about her one way or the other. I think you have to have formed one actual bond on these shows to continue on for another season. They all realize she is a loon and simply does not fit in. She reminds me of Eden on the BH show. She might get some sympathy here or there from someone, but no one really cares if she is around or not. 

[Mu Shu]

OC is 0-2 in Peggys.  They should retire the name like a hurricane,  a really dull and forgettable one. 

time for Andy and co to go crawling on their bellies to the Dubrow’s impossibly aspirational port-cochere.   

[Jextella]

So, last season's reunion was around this time.  Heather's departure was announced in late December or early January if I'm not mistaken.  I imagine we'll know what happens with the cast in a month or two.  

[walnutqueen]

18 hours ago, ShawnaLanne said:

Yes.  She should not have do e the show. Hundred percent agree,  can't stand Puggy, but let's not start with trying to quantify another person's pain. 

Some ho'wives are quite adept at quantifying that themselves - e.g. 100% pain for 5, 7 or 9 days.  ;-D

[lunastartron]

5 hours ago, AttackTurtle said:

I feel for your aunt, but that is not typical.  As you indicated she had a horrible reaction.  There has been no indication that Peggy has had a horrible reaction and given the drastic measures she took after they discovered pre-cancerous cells (not a tumor), I'm sure we would've heard about any bad reaction Peggy was having.  FWIW - my expanders ended up being a bust & I ended up having to have tram flap surgery...now that was a whole other nightmare for me.  But I hope your aunt is doing well now.

I don't get this. Wouldn't  the indication of pain and a horrible reaction in this situation be, well, the pain itself? We did and are hearing about how much pain she was in. 

She had a growth of precancerous cells, 3mm of which had turned into cancer and was actively expanding. 

7 hours ago, Mu Shu said:

When that person is on a reality show acting like an asshole and using pain as an excuse, I will indeed question her pain.   It’s the same scam that Vicki tried to pull- no one would dare question a cancer patient.

Except for the distinction that Peggy had major surgery and Brooks/Vicki fabricated every element of their respective supposed ordeal. 

All of the women (from my subjective perspective) use/invoke their personal pain and extenuating circumstances to minimize and/or excuse their bad behavior. 

Meghan is usually reasonable and this doesn't have to contextualize any emotionalism but she was teary a lot this season because, hormones. 

Shannon was erratic and belligerent because Tamra and Heather gossiped about her marriage; then because she'd discovered David's infidelity; and, now, because of her marital expiration and, yes, hormones.

Tamra launched attempted sexual assaults on her costars because, Simon. And hit/pushed Kelly because, Sydney. 

Edited November 10, 2017 by lunastartron

[zoeysmom]

I have always wondered if perhaps Peggy had some regrets about opting for the double mastectomy.  I know she entered into her decision shortly after her father's death so I am wondering if perhaps she pulled the trigger before giving a lot of thought.  She sure didn't seem thrilled when Meghan mentioned her mother had the same procedure 10 years earlier.  Almost as if someone was stealing her thunder.  Since filming her claims of "being in denial" about having cancer fall fairly flat.  For someone who claims she came on the show for support it was certainly a one way street until Iceland and she wanted to crawl into bed with Vicki to comfort her.  I find it difficult to lend support when I don't know what the person is experiencing.  People have different thresholds for pain and the impression I got was Peggy was one of those who does not tolerate discomfort or pain well.  

As far as Peggy's arrival on the show I do believe it was Lydia driven.  Lydia desperately  wanted back on to promote her new magazine and Peggy and Diko were in their I believe first or second edition.  There should have better vetting because as far as I can see Peggy doesn't get reality shows involve coherent conversations.  It seems "talkies" have not arrived in Armenia.  Peggy also had so much anger towards David in a conversation she never heard, and her husband has apologized to both Shannon and David for his interpretation of said conversation.  Lydia doesn't help matters when she claimed Doug said David intruded on he and Diko's conversation.  For me Peggy's appearance was essentially a brag-a-thon about how much she and Diko have amassed.  

I believe for Peggy all she managed to find out about herself is how incredibly dependent she is on Diko.  I can understand the other women being a little put off by her continual Diko references.  They don't know the guy and in the case of Shannon all she really got from him was an accusation, and an unfounded one at that.  I don't see a future for either she or Lydia next year.  A little Judy goes a long ways and I just felt like Lydia went way overboard in trying to be Queen Bee and foist her friendship whispering way too hard.  As a Christian woman she should have understood that Tamra and Vicki being friends didn't have to involve isolating Shannon or blaming her for every single thing she could think up.

What the season has proven to me more than anything else-they don't need Vicki.  She added nothing this year and very little last year.  Don't care about her, her daughter or anyone else in her life.

Edited November 10, 2017 by zoeysmom

[WireWrap]

19 minutes ago, lunastartron said:

I don't get this. Wouldn't  the indication of pain and a horrible reaction in this situation be, well, the pain itself? We did and are hearing about how much pain she was in. 

She had a growth of precancerous cells, 3mm of which had turned into cancer and was actively expanding. 

Except for the distinction that Peggy had major surgery and Brooks/Vicki fabricated every element of their respective supposed ordeal. 

All of the women (from my subjective perspective) use/invoke their personal pain and extenuating circumstances to minimize and/or excuse their bad behavior. 

Meghan is usually reasonable and this doesn't have to contextualize any emotionalism but she was teary a lot this season because, hormones. 

Shannon was erratic and belligerent because Tamra and Heather gossiped about her marriage; then because she'd discovered David's infidelity; and, now, because of her marital expiration and, yes, hormones.

Tamra launched attempted sexual assaults on her costars because, Simon. And hit/pushed Kelly because, Sydney. 

I would have more sympathy with Peggy had she been open/honest with the others about her pain but she didn't want to talk about it. She wanted to tell various versions about what was going on to different HWs then expected the women to never ask her any questions, which led to even more confusion. Diko added to that confusion as well, his stories weren't clear either, which tells me that they did this on purpose and that makes me dislike them even more because they used these differing/changing BC stories to cause confusion in order to set up the other HWs. 

[Carolina Girl]

18 hours ago, WireWrap said:

o, it really is them trying to save Vicki's Orange in order to secure their own for next season. LOL

I can tell you, I will not watch next season if either Lydiot or Pugly are on.  Or maybe I'll watch but I'll fast forward through any of their "domestic" scenes.  I can't think why Bravo considers Icki worth saving for the series.  

[Mu Shu]

When people who have major surgery decide to go on a reality show less than two months later, I will assume that they have poor judgement, are selling shit, and will use their surgery as an excuse when they get called out for being an asshole.

Hell, the Dodd was up and running practically minutes after her boob thing.  yes, yes, I know Peggy’s was more complex than that.  But she should have stayed home.  She didn’t.  Screw her and the Armenian horse she ride in on.  I felt the same about Briana driving cross country in “extreme pain”, and I like her.

[AttackTurtle]

6 hours ago, lunastartron said:

I don't get this. Wouldn't  the indication of pain and a horrible reaction in this situation be, well, the pain itself? We did and are hearing about how much pain she was in. 

She had a growth of precancerous cells, 3mm of which had turned into cancer and was actively expanding. 

Except for the distinction that Peggy had major surgery and Brooks/Vicki fabricated every element of their respective supposed ordeal. 

All of the women (from my subjective perspective) use/invoke their personal pain and extenuating circumstances to minimize and/or excuse their bad behavior. 

Meghan is usually reasonable and this doesn't have to contextualize any emotionalism but she was teary a lot this season because, hormones. 

Shannon was erratic and belligerent because Tamra and Heather gossiped about her marriage; then because she'd discovered David's infidelity; and, now, because of her marital expiration and, yes, hormones.

Tamra launched attempted sexual assaults on her costars because, Simon. And hit/pushed Kelly because, Sydney. 

Okay, how shall I put this.  I've had a mastectomy and you are literally left with no feeling where your new  breast is being formed.  When my expanders were filled, they were filled with the largest needle I've ever seen, but as I have no nerves remaining where my left breast once existed, I felt nothing.  There could've been issue with the placement of the expanders in your aunt's case.  I have no idea, I'm not her physician.  What I do know is that in preparing for my mastectomy (I was 38), I knew what to expect as far as pain was concerned and while expanders are not comfortable, they are not generally painful and the process of having them filled should not be painful.  

 

As far as Peggy taking drastic measures, I've mentioned on here before that I don't fault her for having a double mastectomy; however she tested negative for BRCA.  She had ducal carcinoma in situ.   It literally is defined "is a very early non-invasive cancer that is treatable.  Cancer cells are contained in the milk ducts and have not spread to the surrounding breast tissue or distant sites.  It is estimated that 20-30% of DCIS patients go on to develop invasive breast cancer." Given her situation, I personally find it hard to believe that her surgeon recommended a double mastectomy.  I had stage 2 breast cancer with a 3cm. tumor.  I wanted a double mastectomy, but my surgeon was completely opposed to removing my other breast because you shouldn't cut off healthy tissue. I don't fault Peggy for having a double mastectomy, but I do fault her for her using her breast (pre) cancer to deflect her own crappy behavior.  I do fault her for acting like "chemotherapy" was an issue for her as chemo simply isn't treatment for what she had.  

 

i apologize if you were offended by my comments regarding Peggy; however they do represent my opinion based on my experience.  I honestly had not read your comment about your aunt prior to posting my comment.  But to help clarify for you, life post - mastectomy hasn't exactly been a "cake-walk".   I had to undergo six weeks of radiation...thats six weeks, seven days a week.  I nearly bled to death following my reconstruction surgery.   I will be on tamoxifen for at least ten years (probably longer given recent studies on recurrences of breast cancer) I receive lupron injections every three months and my joints feel like those of a 90 year old woman.  Every six months i go in for a mammogram and try not to bite off all my nails during the 24 hours i wait on results.  It's fortunate that I like my son, because I cannot have the long planned second child due to the "miracle drugs" I take.  

I stand by my comments because I know first-hand what the experience is like and also because I did a heck of a lot of research about what to expect following my mastectomy.  And I'm just going to put it out there, I think Peggy could've provided a great service by clearly explaining what the nature of her diagnosis was and why she chose to take the actions that she did, but she didn't.  She came on the show expecting a pity party from total strangers and when she didn't get it she exaggerated the details of her diagnosis.  

And again, I hope nothing but the best for your aunt.  I truly do feel for her that she had a difficult time with her recovery following her mastectomy.  Given how stressful just having BC is, that does truly suck.    Breast cancer is truly a shit-show.  Us lucky ones who were able to cut  the cancer out, still live with the knowledge that the same damn cancer could come back twenty years later.   

Edited November 11, 2017 by AttackTurtle

[ITALIA]

10 hours ago, gundysgirl said:

I cannot imagine Peggy coming back. Not just because she is the most boring HW I have ever seen and lacks even the most basic ability to communicate, but because she hasn't really formed any real bonds with anyone else on the show. Vicki likes her OK, but she isn't really all that into her. Lydia will listen to her, but I don't think she cares much about her one way or the other. I think you have to have formed one actual bond on these shows to continue on for another season. They all realize she is a loon and simply does not fit in. She reminds me of Eden on the BH show. She might get some sympathy here or there from someone, but no one really cares if she is around or not. 

Peggy - clueless, boring, homely, and entitled needs to go, along with small DICK-O. She's pathetic.

[AntAnn]

3 hours ago, AttackTurtle said:

And I'm just going to put it out there, I think Peggy could've provided a great service by clearly explaining what the nature of her diagnosis was and why she chose to take the actions that she did, but she didn't.  

^^^^THIS^^^^

Thank you ATTACKTURTLE. 

[lunastartron]

7 hours ago, AttackTurtle said:

Okay, how shall I put this.  I've had a mastectomy and you are literally left with no feeling where your new  breast is being formed.  When my expanders were filled, they were filled with the largest needle I've ever seen, but as I have no nerves remaining where my left breast once existed, I felt nothing.  There could've been issue with the placement of the expanders in your aunt's case.  I have no idea, I'm not her physician.  What I do know is that in preparing for my mastectomy (I was 38), I knew what to expect as far as pain was concerned and while expanders are not comfortable, they are not generally painful and the process of having them filled should not be painful.  

 

As far as Peggy taking drastic measures, I've mentioned on here before that I don't fault her for having a double mastectomy; however she tested negative for BRCA.  She had ducal carcinoma in situ.   It literally is defined "is a very early non-invasive cancer that is treatable.  Cancer cells are contained in the milk ducts and have not spread to the surrounding breast tissue or distant sites.  It is estimated that 20-30% of DCIS patients go on to develop invasive breast cancer." Given her situation, I personally find it hard to believe that her surgeon recommended a double mastectomy.  I had stage 2 breast cancer with a 3cm. tumor.  I wanted a double mastectomy, but my surgeon was completely opposed to removing my other breast because you shouldn't cut off healthy tissue. I don't fault Peggy for having a double mastectomy, but I do fault her for her using her breast (pre) cancer to deflect her own crappy behavior.  I do fault her for acting like "chemotherapy" was an issue for her as chemo simply isn't treatment for what she had.  

 

i apologize if you were offended by my comments regarding Peggy; however they do represent my opinion based on my experience.  I honestly had not read your comment about your aunt prior to posting my comment.  But to help clarify for you, life post - mastectomy hasn't exactly been a "cake-walk".   I had to undergo six weeks of radiation...thats six weeks, seven days a week.  I nearly bled to death following my reconstruction surgery.   I will be on tamoxifen for at least ten years (probably longer given recent studies on recurrences of breast cancer) I receive lupron injections every three months and my joints feel like those of a 90 year old woman.  Every six months i go in for a mammogram and try not to bite off all my nails during the 24 hours i wait on results.  It's fortunate that I like my son, because I cannot have the long planned second child due to the "miracle drugs" I take.  

I stand by my comments because I know first-hand what the experience is like and also because I did a heck of a lot of research about what to expect following my mastectomy.  And I'm just going to put it out there, I think Peggy could've provided a great service by clearly explaining what the nature of her diagnosis was and why she chose to take the actions that she did, but she didn't.  She came on the show expecting a pity party from total strangers and when she didn't get it she exaggerated the details of her diagnosis.  

And again, I hope nothing but the best for your aunt.  I truly do feel for her that she had a difficult time with her recovery following her mastectomy.  Given how stressful just having BC is, that does truly suck.    Breast cancer is truly a shit-show.  Us lucky ones who were able to cut  the cancer out, still live with the knowledge that the same damn cancer could come back twenty years later.   

Thank you for the very thorough context - I have learned a not insignificant amount about a subject on which I would otherwise not have encountered much data and I very much appreciate when that happens thanks to the forum, this franchise, and posters such as yourself who construct such thoughtful replies. It was not me but rather, I believe, @ShawnaLanne whose aunt had the unfortunate experience with expanders. In any case, many thanks to you both for sharing - that direct knowledge is what makes these forums and the discourse about the narratives on these shows so enriching. 

In terms of Peggy, I will say I am confused since in this article she specifically claims her "options were limited to three choices": chemo, radiation, or removal of her affected breast.

http://people.com/tv/real-housewives-of-orange-county-peggy-sulahian-double-mastectomy/

Edited November 11, 2017 by lunastartron

[WireWrap]

29 minutes ago, lunastartron said:

Thank you for the very thorough context - I have learned a not insignificant amount about a subject on which I would otherwise not have encountered much data and I very much appreciate when that happens thanks to the forum, this franchise, and posters such as yourself who construct such thoughtful replies. It was not me but rather, I believe, @ShawnaLanne whose aunt had the unfortunate experience with expanders. In any case, many thanks to you both for sharing - that direct knowledge is what makes these forums and the discourse about the narratives on these shows so enriching. 

In terms of Peggy, I will say I am confused since in this article she specifically claims her "options were limited to three choices": chemo, radiation, or removal of her affected breast.

http://people.com/tv/real-housewives-of-orange-county-peggy-sulahian-double-mastectomy/

Here is an excellent explanation of DCIS (the cancer Peggy had) and the treatments for it. http://www.breastcancer.org/symptoms/types/dcis   

I suspect that given Peggy's mother's death, she and her Dr. may have felt that a Mastectomy was her safest option as there is a chance of it coming back. Most BC is treated with radiation or chemo or removing the affected breast or a combo of all three, it depends on how advanced it is, the type of cancer and/or family history. Chemo isn't used for DCIS but I'm not sure that Peggy knew/knows that, she isn't the sharpest tool in the shed or she may have said it for effect (shock value/sympathy, at this stage, I suspect it is the latter).

[Hockey Addict]

The housewives are becoming like a wad of gum that's been chewed for hours in end. What was once tasty and flavorful is now hard, bland, and old. Time to get a new stick from the pack Bravo.

[AttackTurtle]

3 hours ago, lunastartron said:

Thank you for the very thorough context - I have learned a not insignificant amount about a subject on which I would otherwise not have encountered much data and I very much appreciate when that happens thanks to the forum, this franchise, and posters such as yourself who construct such thoughtful replies. It was not me but rather, I believe, @ShawnaLanne whose aunt had the unfortunate experience with expanders. In any case, many thanks to you both for sharing - that direct knowledge is what makes these forums and the discourse about the narratives on these shows so enriching. 

In terms of Peggy, I will say I am confused since in this article she specifically claims her "options were limited to three choices": chemo, radiation, or removal of her affected breast.

http://people.com/tv/real-housewives-of-orange-county-peggy-sulahian-double-mastectomy/

Lord I did confuse you two.   My apologies for my long post.   I think I was still smarting from the "cake" comment.  But thank you for hitting the nail on the head about the confusion regarding her treatment.  She brought up chemo on the show and in articles and it simply doesn't make sense.   I honestly would not have commented on her choices, but for the fact that she gave another interview where she discussed her diagnosis and I simply could not understand her suggestion that chemo was an option.  

 

I really wish that we had been shown scenes with her mastectomy surgeon as opposed to the plastic surgeon.   I truly believe we would have heard that hormonal therapies had been suggested first, but she may not have gotten lots of jewelry for taking some pills (okay...now I'm really being petty, but the fact that they celebrated her double mastectomy with expensive materialistic gifts is just beyond gauche to me).

[AttackTurtle]

3 hours ago, WireWrap said:

Here is an excellent explanation of DCIS (the cancer Peggy had) and the treatments for it. http://www.breastcancer.org/symptoms/types/dcis   

I suspect that given Peggy's mother's death, she and her Dr. may have felt that a Mastectomy was her safest option as there is a chance of it coming back. Most BC is treated with radiation or chemo or removing the affected breast or a combo of all three, it depends on how advanced it is, the type of cancer and/or family history. Chemo isn't used for DCIS but I'm not sure that Peggy knew/knows that, she isn't the sharpest tool in the shed or she may have said it for effect (shock value/sympathy, at this stage, I suspect it is the latter).

Thanks for the additional article.  I totally agree that the fact that her mother died of BC rprobably was a factor in Peggy's mind, but I'm not so sure about her doctor.  She tested negative for BRCA, so this wasn't genetic.  And further her mother died when she was 18.  There have been huge advancements in BC treatment options and declines in BC deaths since that time.   Angelina Jolie & Christina Applegate are perfect examples of when a dbl mastectomy is completely on target.  Both tested positive for BRCA and both of their mother's either had BC or ovarian cancer.  

Hopefully if Peggy does come back she can put some time & energy into cancer charities.  I've learned to appreciate how lucky I was to have the resources, support and amazing doctors at my fingertips whereas others are not so fortunate and have suffered tragically as a result.  

Edited November 11, 2017 by AttackTurtle

[nexxie]

On 11/9/2017 at 10:30 AM, gundysgirl said:

The thing that was so interesting to me about this was when Kelly defended Peggy and said something like "no she wouldn't have said anything about Meghan being a bad mom". But wasn't Kelly the one who earlier in the season seemed to indicate that Meghan was a bad mom for being out and about on the town while her tiny one was home? Honestly, what Peggy said was horrible, but no more so (IMO) than what Kelly had said. 

I noticed that mismatch too - Kelly’s insincere words and her own earlier judgment of Meghan. Kelly seems completely situational (like Vicki) - whatever gets her what she wants/needs in the moment.

[Audpaud]

The only cast member that I always think needs to go is Tamra. I'm just not a big fan of any Housewives that think they are smarter than the viewers. She's grated on me for several seasons with the fake story lines and bad acting so yes, I'd even rather see Peggy Part Duh than Christian-body-builder-exploited-estranged-daughter BS. 

[English Teacher]

I call BS on Vicki.  What a surprise.  Her hypocrisy infuriates me. She demands loyalty from her friends. They better have her back in a fight or pile on. But the minute those friends are under attic, she runs.  “It’s not my fight”.  I think Peggy is crazy, but she has been loyal to Vicki and V let her down.  Again, no surprise.  

[Chicklet]

Vicki's problem is that she really does think she's "royalty" or whatever she thinks the OG of the OC even means. Which is nothing to normal people.

She wants people to do what she says, not what she does. Therefore she's a "human being of the fecal variety" (from a friend who won't cuss no matter what happens).

[Anne Thrax]

Sorry - haven't caught up until today and I haven't read all the wonderful posts yet, so my comments might duplicate those of others.

I have a lot of questions about this episode.  Like, what is up with the weird phenomenon of Peggy's hair?  It never fails to look like a rat's nest.  The woman is seriously in need of a moisturizing treatment on that frizzy, spiky mop.  Somebody needs to clue girlfriend in that the exaggerated "bump it" look she frequently favors is out of fashion.

Another Vicki Sausage Couture (TM --oh shoot, I forget who wrote it first) again on this episode.  That green monstrosity she was wearing to dinner needed about 2 more yards of fabric if it was going to cover that huge ass and thunder thighs.  That, and she's too unwieldy to walk normally in 4 inch heels -- especially in the snow and ice.  Vicki in 4 inch heels reminds me of the hippo ballet in "Fantasia".  Except the hippos were more graceful.

Question 1:  Why doesn't Vicki know yet that skimpy body-con dresses and super high heels haven't been her friends in quite some time?

Question 2:  Why did Lydia tell Peggy that the women WEREN'T laughing at her -- they absolutely were.  What Peggy said at the time was truly laughable, and so they laughed.  And laughed.  Self-important Peggy's ego just couldn't handle it.  I guess in Armenia there's no such thing as a sense of humor -- except if they're joking about wife beating.  And I KNEW this was coming because Peggy is SUCH a downer and hunts for insults in everyone's comments.  When Kelly said "my daddy can beat up your daddy" I just knew Peggy would glom onto that and twist it into some sort of pointed insult to her late father.  She's so predictable.

Question 3: Does Peggy really believe that a husband can "put sense into" (Armenian euphemism for threatening to beat) his wife?  I mean, if Michael could somehow "put sense into" Kelly, don't you think he'd have done so long before now?  She overuses the word "disgusted" throughout the episode, and in her conversation with Dickwad, totally glosses over her role in creating the shit show.

Question 4:  Why does Peggy need near constant reassurance from Dickwad that she's completely right to do everything she did, and everyone else is wrong to do whatever she disapproves of.  Honestly, I cannot stand that dumbass bitch. 

Question 5:  Who brings a backless, shoulderless gown to Iceland?  (Is it me, or does that schmatta look like she purchased it in a bargain basement somewhere?)  Everyone else is dressed in something more appropriate for the cold weather (well, there IS Tamra and her ever-present shoulder cut-outs).

LOVED Kelly's Mexican yell after Shannon "led" the choir performance.  If you blinked you missed it.  And let's get it straight -- it was Kelly who decided to take the Anger Management Classes (the court's order had nothing to do with it, apparently).

LOVED how Briana refused to buy into her mother's hypochondria.  Owen wasn't loving Nana's hugs, either, so Owen is learning early about Nana's love being all about what Nana wants from you.

HALELUJAH!!  Shannon is finally getting the news we all knew she needed to hear:  You need to get on hormone replacement therapy, woman!

Next week looks interesting.

[SweetieDarling]

I'm not sure which I laughed at harder; Vicki bragging to Brianna that the other women brought her a casserole, or Brianna's reaction (something to the effect of) "You finally got the casserole you've been wanting for so long" 

[Anne Thrax]

On 11/8/2017 at 10:32 AM, Snarky McSnarky said:

Armenia meets Iceland.

OMG, Peggy must have done her own dye job.  Watching this episode, I noticed how uneven her hair color was, but not until I saw this photo did I notice she has dye stains all along her hairline.  You'd think with HER lousy hair and all the conspicuous spending, Peggy would spend a few of those bucks on color and highlights from a decent salon that knows enough to clean the hair dye off your face before you leave.

[Anne Thrax]

On 11/9/2017 at 11:47 AM, Natalie68 said:

Being happy is a state of mind and it sounds like she has difficulty being happy anywhere!  If she identifies with her Midwest roots why isn't she moving to the Midwest?  Perhaps she needs to look a little deeper to find out if her unhappiness is related to her location or her life.  If she hated OC why buy a house there and leave her husband in OK while depriving her sons day in and day out access to their dad?  I certainly wouldn't have bought a house in my hometown JUST to make my mom happy.  Briana, your problems WILL follow you anywhere.  

I seem to recall that Brianna decided she disliked where they lived in OK, and then continued to have health problems which was part of the "official" reason she was moving back to OC -- to get treatment from the doctors she had here.  I remember it being mentioned that she felt lonely "in the middle of nowhere", and that all her friends are in OC. 

As we know, her mother had her own agenda for bringing Brianna back, and the dangling of acquiring a house there for Brianna and the boys to move into (Brooks was still in the picture then) was the tipping point for Brianna to agree.  

Plus, now that they're being a little more open about Ryan's need for psychological treatment, I suspect that at the time, Brianna was needing to put some distance between her husband's problems and herself/the kids.  I think she always knew the scenario of Ryan as her mother's employee was unworkable because Ryan would never be able to hack being Vicki's underling all day long on top of his mental issues.

Perhaps now that Ryan will be closer to his own family and away from The Narcissist's interference, it'll be the buffer needed to keep Brianna and Ryan on an even keel.

Edited November 12, 2017 by Anne Thrax

[Mu Shu]

I think Bravo dangled a fat carrot to get Briana back to support Vicki.  It didn’t work.  I think that house they bought and rehabbed was for the show, and that they bought in a good market.  

Now they finally get to leave with a profit from the house, and probably a better than usual payout for Briana.  

N.C. Is nice.  Plus you can drive a few hours and be in different states, so it’s centrally located and the climate is mild.  With Brianna’s good income, Ryan can afford to find something entry level to get started.  Does he have some sort of income from the military?  

[ghoulina]

On 11/11/2017 at 11:26 AM, SweetieDarling said:

I'm not sure which I laughed at harder; Vicki bragging to Brianna that the other women brought her a casserole, or Brianna's reaction (something to the effect of) "You finally got the casserole you've been wanting for so long" 

Vicki actually told her that the women MADE her a casserole. As if they took over the kitchen at that lodge and sweated and labored to make poor Miss Vicki her long deserved casserole themselves. 

As if the gift of the casserole wasn't meant to be mocking. 

She's clueless. 

[chenoa333]

Brianna is a typical OC spoiled, entitled brat. She will not last in N.C. Once she realizes she is living in reality with her husband's family (not hers), no reality tv paycheck, no mommy to run to for money, etc. Maybe nurses get paid more in N.C. and Ryan's parents can take care of the boys so Brianna can work those long shifts as an e.r. nurse.

I just find it very odd that she is making this drastic move. Something is not making sense. But the truth always comes out. 

[lunastartron]

Briana has established an odd pattern of haplessness/dissatisfaction and major relocations, 180s, and reversals since she got offloaded by her boyfriend Cody back in season four of five, immediately after which she leapt into that strangely belligerent and quickly aborted effort to join the Army as battlefield medic. She has seemed perennially disgruntled ever since.

I can't imagine her finding contentment in North Carolina based upon the reflexive curl of her lip at Oklahoma. She seems determined to be put upon/exhausted. 

I still remember that gross attempt she made to portray herself as the second coming of Cinderella scrubbing stains off of Vicki's sofa after the season eight finale party in order to justify Ryan's bizarre outburst at Lydia's mom. 

[ShawnaLanne]

On 11/9/2017 at 10:30 AM, gundysgirl said:

The thing that was so interesting to me about this was when Kelly defended Peggy and said something like "no she wouldn't have said anything about Meghan being a bad mom". But wasn't Kelly the one who earlier in the season seemed to indicate that Meghan was a bad mom for being out and about on the town while her tiny one was home? Honestly, what Peggy said was horrible, but no more so (IMO) than what Kelly had said. 

Oh for sure. With Kelly though,  and not excusing because she is batshit,  Kelly always seems to go for the lowest blow she can think of in any argument, whether she believes it or not.  Also,  Kelly really seems to hate Puggy, so she's always going to jump in for a swing. 

Puggy on the other hand really comes across as that judgemental. 

Just now, ShawnaLanne said:

Read it wrong. 

[zoeysmom]

43 minutes ago, lunastartron said:

Briana has established an odd pattern of haplessness/dissatisfaction and major relocations, 180s, and reversals since she got offloaded by her boyfriend Cody back in season four of five, immediately after which she leapt into that strangely belligerent and quickly aborted effort to join the Army as battlefield medic. She has seemed perennially disgruntled ever since.

I can't imagine her finding contentment in North Carolina based upon the reflexive curl of her lip at Oklahoma. She seems determined to be put upon/exhausted. 

I still remember that gross attempt she made to portray herself as the second coming of Cinderella scrubbing stains off of Vicki's sofa after the season eight finale party in order to justify Ryan's bizarre outburst at Lydia's mom. 

I distinctly remember  Briana on her exit to OKC saying she and Ryan would never return to California as it was expensive.  Instead she bailed on Ryan with 18 months to go and fled back to OC.  IIRC correctly Vicki said something about Ryan leaving the military and becoming a house flipper.  They even went do far as to have Jeff Lewis make an appearance in her "forever" home in OC.  Oops I was wrong she left him in OKC for 20 months.

http://www.bravotv.com/the-daily-dish/vicki-gunvalson-welcomes-jeff-lewis-to-briana-culbersons-new-oc-pad

[Ki-in]

5 hours ago, Mu Shu said:

 

N.C. Is nice.  Plus you can drive a few hours and be in different states, so it’s centrally located and the climate is mild. 

You have mountains and the ocean too,  best of both worlds, it's very nice there.

[ShawnaLanne]

1 minute ago, ShawnaLanne said:

Oh for sure. With Kelly though,  and not excusing because she is batshit,  Kelly always seems to go for the lowest blow she can think of in any argument, whether she believes it or not.  Also,  Kelly really seems to hate Puggy, so she's always going to jump in for a swing. 

Puggy on the other hand really comes across as that judgemental. 

 

 

5 hours ago, Mu Shu said:

I think Bravo dangled a fat carrot to get Briana back to support Vicki.  It didn’t work.  I think that house they bought and rehabbed was for the show, and that they bought in a good market.  

Now they finally get to leave with a profit from the house, and probably a better than usual payout for Briana.  

N.C. Is nice.  Plus you can drive a few hours and be in different states, so it’s centrally located and the climate is mild.  With Brianna’s good income, Ryan can afford to find something entry level to get started.  Does he have some sort of income from the military?  

I'm pretty sure he is on disability, not sure what his rank was or have any real idea at what percentage his disability would be at,  but I'm betting it's pretty high,  so somewhere around 2k a month at the low end,   most likely. He was on a long time and he's likely at least an E6.

[ivygirl]

Maybe we'll be blessed with a version of Southern Charm featuring Brianna!

[Ubiquitous]

Did something happen between Kelly telling Peggy she goes nuclear and Peggy leaving the room? I got the feeling Kelly said something that made Peggy leave.

[Gam2]

Just watched a rerun of the Iceland trip-Vicki comes back from the hospital, Peggy sulks in her room all day, the girls go to the Iceland dinner the night before they fly home. I cannot believe how much these women drink, stay up until 4:00 or 5:00 am and then get up at 6:45 and go shopping. Then they get drunk the night before they fly back? I’m queasy enough when I fly but I would die a slow death if I flew with a hangover. Peggy is just ridiculous on every level. As is little Dick. Please send them back to Armenia. Vicki’s dress was horrendous and for a Christian woman, Lydia’s dress was awfully low in the front and up to her ass in the back. Don’t these women own mirrors? Or someone who loves them and will be honest with them?

[chenoa333]

2 hours ago, Ki-in said:

You have mountains and the ocean too,  best of both worlds, it's very nice there.

I have no doubts that N. Carolina is beautiful but I have doubts that Brianna will enjoy and embrace it's beauty (or anything else in life that most of us folks are grateful for having.)

[Jextella]

I have such a different take on Briana than many others.  I think she is an awesome daughter, mother, and sister, and overall human being.  She's an exceptionally hard worker and smart.  She went to college in a very challenging field, graduated early, has single-parented quite a bit thus far, dealt with the challenges that come with a spouse in the military, and is dealing with personal health issues severe enough that require multiple surgeries.    I also think she and her mom have a good relationship. If nothing else, it seems they can be open and honest with one another which is HUGE.

I also believe Briana is very grateful for what she has in life. Given the challenges she's experienced, she knows what's really important.  And, she's not a moocher out for a free ride.   Vicki may give her kids things from time to time, but she's also been very adament that they get an education and be able to stand on their own two feet - which is precisely what Brianna has done.  Brianna is no slouch. She works very, very hard for what she has.

I also don't doubt her desire to move from OC.   She never struck me as one who craved a fast-paced lifestyle with lots of bells and whistles.  OC - or at least what we see on TV - seems more this way, and I can see Brianna thinking its not her cup of tea.  Raleigh sounds like it will be a good fit for her.

Briana has yet to do or say a single thing that offends me.  I think she's pretty amazing, actually.   

Edited November 13, 2017 by Jextella

[oakville]

7 hours ago, chenoa333 said:

Brianna is a typical OC spoiled, entitled brat. She will not last in N.C. Once she realizes she is living in reality with her husband's family (not hers), no reality tv paycheck, no mommy to run to for money, etc. Maybe nurses get paid more in N.C. and Ryan's parents can take care of the boys so Brianna can work those long shifts as an e.r. nurse.

I just find it very odd that she is making this drastic move. Something is not making sense. But the truth always comes out. 

Wouldn't salaries for an emergency room nurse be higher in the OC than NC?

I do think it will help their marriage if Ryan is happy in NC.

Dealing with Vicki would be very stressful on/off camera.

[Cheetosandchoc]

2 hours ago, oakville said:

Wouldn't salaries for an emergency room nurse be higher in the OC than NC?

I do think it will help their marriage if Ryan is happy in NC.

Dealing with Vicki would be very stressful on/off camera.

     I think the more distance between Vicki and Brianna the happier she will be. No joke. I have real life experience with this. I have a million pound weight lifted I never knew was there.

   I think Oeggy is on the show because Dicko is a thirsty little man who wants to sell lots and lots of tires. Her cancer storyline could of been a great one since breast cancer affects so many people’s lives and I don’t think she needs to justify her choice to remove her breasts, but I do think it is very interesting and worth discussing, and it could encourage others who are faced with the same decision.

      I just don’t like Peggy. I also think she is actually very aggressive. She kept grabbing the doctor’s arm demanding he help Vicky, she PINCHED Meghan’s lips together th first time she met her, she physically restrained Shannon at I think Kelly’s house that one time. She also kept shushing Kelly and sort of placed a hand on her arm when doing so. Fuck her.

Edited November 13, 2017 by Cheetosandchoc

[VedaPierce]

On November 9, 2017 at 7:26 PM, Hockey Addict said:

i wonder what Peggy/Dicko's motives were for doing the show. Publicity for the business? I think that there's a good chance Peggy never wanted to so the show at all but Dicko did just a theory.

What's Tamra's motives for doing the show? Or Vickie or Kelly's?? They all have the same motives. 

Easy money, shill some shit, fame-whoredom. 

Edited November 13, 2017 by VedaPierce

[ShawnaLanne]

15 hours ago, oakville said:

Wouldn't salaries for an emergency room nurse be higher in the OC than NC?

I do think it will help their marriage if Ryan is happy in NC.

Dealing with Vicki would be very stressful on/off camera.

Yes,  but cost of living would eat that up and more. 

[Mu Shu]

1 hour ago, VedaPierce said:

What's Tamra's motives for doing the show? Or Vickie or Kelly's?? They all have the same motives. 

Easy money, shill some shit, fame-whoredom. 

Tamra is in it for the money.  Vicki likes the money, but the “fame” is the driver for her, IMO.  Kelly needs an income, so money.

Peggy an Shannon are wealthy.   Shannon seems to enjoy the “fame”, and is not recovering from surgery.  Peggy seems to hate being on the show and is recovering from medical issues.  

Why make yourself miserable if you don’t have to? 

I have no clue why Lydia does the show.  Probably just to be an asshole.

[PhilMarlowe2]

23 hours ago, lunastartron said:

Briana has established an odd pattern of haplessness/dissatisfaction and major relocations, 180s, and reversals since she got offloaded by her boyfriend Cody back in season four of five, immediately after which she leapt into that strangely belligerent and quickly aborted effort to join the Army as battlefield medic. She has seemed perennially disgruntled ever since.

I can't imagine her finding contentment in North Carolina based upon the reflexive curl of her lip at Oklahoma. She seems determined to be put upon/exhausted. 

I still remember that gross attempt she made to portray herself as the second coming of Cinderella scrubbing stains off of Vicki's sofa after the season eight finale party in order to justify Ryan's bizarre outburst at Lydia's mom. 

I think his name was Colby. And, yes, I agree that Colby's leaving her broke something deep in Briana's heart and seemed to put her in even more of an emotional tailspin.

To me, Briana is 100 percent a person whose physical maladies have at least some roots in deep emotional pain. I think she has so much unexpressed rage that she is bottling up. I really wonder what would happen with her illnesses if she got real help and let some of her emotions actually move through her body.

All that said, as a tried-and-true Californian, I do have to say there is a big difference between North Carolina and Oklahoma. I personally could see myself being happy in North Carolina - whereas Oklohoma would be a lot more difficult. I won't say more because I am sure this is already offensive to Oklohomans.

[Snarky McSnarky]

1 hour ago, Mu Shu said:

Tamra is in it for the money.  Vicki likes the money, but the “fame” is the driver for her, IMO.  Kelly needs an income, so money.

Peggy an Shannon are wealthy.   Shannon seems to enjoy the “fame”, and is not recovering from surgery.  Peggy seems to hate being on the show and is recovering from medical issues.  

Why make yourself miserable if you don’t have to? 

I have no clue why Lydia does the show.  Probably just to be an asshole.

Nobleman?  The last time she was on, they kept promoting their other lame magazine.

Somebody named Andrew Smith wrote the article on Iceland, by the way.  Lydia could have stayed home (and probably should have).

http://noblemanmagazine.com/iceland/

Edited November 13, 2017 by Snarky McSnarky

[eclectcmoi]

On 11/10/2017 at 4:43 PM, AttackTurtle said:

Okay, how shall I put this.  I've had a mastectomy and you are literally left with no feeling where your new  breast is being formed.  When my expanders were filled, they were filled with the largest needle I've ever seen, but as I have no nerves remaining where my left breast once existed, I felt nothing.  There could've been issue with the placement of the expanders in your aunt's case.  I have no idea, I'm not her physician.  What I do know is that in preparing for my mastectomy (I was 38), I knew what to expect as far as pain was concerned and while expanders are not comfortable, they are not generally painful and the process of having them filled should not be painful.  

 

As far as Peggy taking drastic measures, I've mentioned on here before that I don't fault her for having a double mastectomy; however she tested negative for BRCA.  She had ducal carcinoma in situ.   It literally is defined "is a very early non-invasive cancer that is treatable.  Cancer cells are contained in the milk ducts and have not spread to the surrounding breast tissue or distant sites.  It is estimated that 20-30% of DCIS patients go on to develop invasive breast cancer." Given her situation, I personally find it hard to believe that her surgeon recommended a double mastectomy.  I had stage 2 breast cancer with a 3cm. tumor.  I wanted a double mastectomy, but my surgeon was completely opposed to removing my other breast because you shouldn't cut off healthy tissue. I don't fault Peggy for having a double mastectomy, but I do fault her for her using her breast (pre) cancer to deflect her own crappy behavior.  I do fault her for acting like "chemotherapy" was an issue for her as chemo simply isn't treatment for what she had.  

 

i apologize if you were offended by my comments regarding Peggy; however they do represent my opinion based on my experience.  I honestly had not read your comment about your aunt prior to posting my comment.  But to help clarify for you, life post - mastectomy hasn't exactly been a "cake-walk".   I had to undergo six weeks of radiation...thats six weeks, seven days a week.  I nearly bled to death following my reconstruction surgery.   I will be on tamoxifen for at least ten years (probably longer given recent studies on recurrences of breast cancer) I receive lupron injections every three months and my joints feel like those of a 90 year old woman.  Every six months i go in for a mammogram and try not to bite off all my nails during the 24 hours i wait on results.  It's fortunate that I like my son, because I cannot have the long planned second child due to the "miracle drugs" I take.  

I stand by my comments because I know first-hand what the experience is like and also because I did a heck of a lot of research about what to expect following my mastectomy.  And I'm just going to put it out there, I think Peggy could've provided a great service by clearly explaining what the nature of her diagnosis was and why she chose to take the actions that she did, but she didn't.  She came on the show expecting a pity party from total strangers and when she didn't get it she exaggerated the details of her diagnosis.  

And again, I hope nothing but the best for your aunt.  I truly do feel for her that she had a difficult time with her recovery following her mastectomy.  Given how stressful just having BC is, that does truly suck.    Breast cancer is truly a shit-show.  Us lucky ones who were able to cut  the cancer out, still live with the knowledge that the same damn cancer could come back twenty years later.   

Thank you for this post AttackTurtle.  Your explanation was very clear unlike the shell game Peggy and Diko used.  You also have my utmost respect for your strength and courage.  

[Mu Shu]

On 11/11/2017 at 10:36 AM, Chicklet said:

Vicki's problem is that she really does think she's "royalty" or whatever she thinks the OG of the OC even means. Which is nothing to normal people.

She wants people to do what she says, not what she does. Therefore she's a "human being of the fecal variety" (from a friend who won't cuss no matter what happens).

Hot shit on a silver platter, when in reality she’s a cold turd on a paper plate. 

[KLovestoShop]

3 hours ago, Mu Shu said:

Hot shit on a silver platter, when in reality she’s a cold turd on a paper plate. 

We’ve had a similar saying about Vicki.  She thinks she’s hot shit in a champagne glass, but she’s really warm diarrhea in a Dixie Cup.  But regardless, she’s always trying to shove 10 lbs of flour into a 2 lb bag when she dresses.  Truly a busted ass. 

[goofygirl]

And as my beloved old father-in-law used to say: "Ass big as the Dallas/Fort Worth metroplex".

[KungFuBunny]

29 minutes ago, KLovestoShop said:

We’ve had a similar saying about Vicki.  She thinks she’s hot shit in a champagne glass, but she’s really warm diarrhea in a Dixie Cup.  But regardless, she’s always trying to shove 10 lbs of flour into a 2 lb bag when she dresses.  Truly a busted ass. 

Awww....don't make fun of the exploding tube o toothpaste!