Season 4 Talk

[AlleC17]

I have to agree with what a lot of people here are saying:  the constant put down of Bow and Junior is not funny, and they are my favorite characters.  I did like the bit with Charlie...so funny!  I love that Junior is learning to bite back.  Go Junior!

[Irlandesa]

16 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I don't understand how Dre can say he makes enough for Bow to stay home with a straight face. Wasn't it just last season that they had to see a financial planner about tightening up their budget because Dre was spending too much money on clothes and shoes? Now they have a new baby, a kid in college, another who is a year away from college, two kids in private school, and a baby. How can they afford all those expenses with one less income.

Yes! There was even a line in the episode when Dre said that he made enough now for her to stay home and she said "but you spend it all."  So it doesn't sound like they're saving much from his paycheck. 

5 hours ago, Madding crowd said:

And not all white teachers are morons. Most of us really care about all of our students and want them to do well.

I almost went on a rant about the teachers in this episode.  Sure, it was funny to see their manipulations backfire on them but when the substitute teacher came in claiming that, due to a fault in the education system, she couldn't be fired, I rolled my eyes.  Maybe it was intended as a teacher simply trying to intimidate the students but I couldn't help but think that a) she's a sub, of course she can be fired and b) this is a private school so of course she can be fired as it's unlikely they're part of the public school teachers union (and even that isn't as much of a protection as is rumored.)

[Sile]

9 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

 Bow is a surgeon, maybe she makes more money, and Dre should stay home?

Bow is an anaethesiologist, not a surgeon.  I recall her being turned down for promotions, so it's quite possible that Dre makes more money than she does, especially if she's still paying off student loans.  I'm also not sure that she's really that good at her job, it seems she's always screwing things up in some slapstick kind of way and acting like a complete idiot at work.  I think she's also commented before that she killed some guy once.  I can't remember the reason, but I'm pretty sure it was due to some failure on her part.

I realize that it's a sitcom, but Bow is generally shown to be some sort of incompetent ditz in the workplace.

[Frisson]

I generally like Charlie,  but the hand to the face demonstration of how to handle an “unruly bitch” was gross and uncomfortable. I found that just as problematic as Bow’s characterization in this episode.

[Dee]

So Charlie being a deadbeat dad, which the show constantly jokes about, wasn't a problem?

[Aileen]

7 hours ago, Frisson said:

I generally like Charlie,  but the hand to the face demonstration of how to handle an “unruly bitch” was gross and uncomfortable. I found that just as problematic as Bow’s characterization in this episode.

Yes, when he demonstrated how he physically handles a woman, I was a bit taken aback. 

[readster]

11 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

Yes! There was even a line in the episode when Dre said that he made enough now for her to stay home and she said "but you spend it all."  So it doesn't sound like they're saving much from his paycheck. 

I almost went on a rant about the teachers in this episode.  Sure, it was funny to see their manipulations backfire on them but when the substitute teacher came in claiming that, due to a fault in the education system, she couldn't be fired, I rolled my eyes.  Maybe it was intended as a teacher simply trying to intimidate the students but I couldn't help but think that a) she's a sub, of course she can be fired and b) this is a private school so of course she can be fired as it's unlikely they're part of the public school teachers union (and even that isn't as much of a protection as is rumored.)

As an educator myself, trust me, I was rolling my eyes with the teacher situation. Mrs. Readster is a SPed assistant. We get kids with problems all the time, but at the same time, you aren't as protected as much as you use to be. You could make one comment about a family member (especially in private school) and you are out. I had a former co-worker and month before the school year was over, he had made a comment about a relative of a student and was shown the door that following Friday. I also worked in previous schools where myself and others had a great track record, barely any issues or anything and then were shown the door do to budget cuts. They kept other teachers who were mid ground level and not even 2 months in the new school year, those teachers left by choice and we got emails saying: "Sorry, we should have kept you." Trust me, the Unions didn't do a damn thing, just took out money from our paychecks regularly and never said where the money went to. So, when shows like Black-ish, American Housewife or The Middle try to show the education system with these troupes. I just want to shut the TV off. I think its even worst that Bow brought up that Dre spends all their extra money on shoes and other crap. Yet, wants Bow to stay at home and then showing she is a ditz or the people she works with are such back stabbers. Doesn't make it a smart choice, just goes with Dre's company, how they all got into these positions of management means someone died or retired. 

[Arcadiasw]

Is it common for twins to be in the same classroom even if it's private school? I always assume twins were separated.  

[TigerLily20]

8 hours ago, Arcadiasw said:

Is it common for twins to be in the same classroom even if it's private school? I always assume twins were separated.  

Depends on the school set up.  If there is only one classroom of that grade then they would have to be together, they also tend to ask parents if they want them together or split. This is the first year my kids private school had 2 classes of first graders, and there is a set of twins and the mother decided on the back to school night that she wanted the girls separated for the first time this year.  Fun times that night lol...

[msrachelj]

On 1/2/2018 at 9:33 PM, mtlchick said:

Charlie's prolonged "biiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiitch" had me rewinding from crying...from laughing.  I do like Yara, but I'm tuning in for grown-ish more for Deon Cole. 

i did too but grown ish is terrible. i deleted it.

[readster]

18 hours ago, Arcadiasw said:

Is it common for twins to be in the same classroom even if it's private school? I always assume twins were separated.  

It really depends on the class schedule. If there is only one section of a class at certain time of the day for a grade level or during a semester. If there is a special request to have them separated by a parent or guardian, usually it's honored if possible. If say there is only a STEM class once a semester for several grade levels then when it's that grade level's rotation that semester, there isn't much choice. Hence twins will end up in the same class. It can vary in high school level depending on how many teachers teach a certain section. Say there are 5 social study teachers, but only one teaches government while two teach consumer education, then more than likely a set of twins will have the government teacher, but separate teacher when it comes to consumer education.

[ChromaKelly]

I was thinking the resolution to Bow's story was going to be that she works part-time. IDK how the Johnsons are going to be able to deal with the loss of her income, that's pretty significant. Did Dre get a (I'm just guessing here $150k+) raise? Anesthesiologists are in high demand. She could work on-call or something. I don't know why it had to be all-or-nothing.

I am highly in favor of a Ruby-Junior war. Bring it. 
 

[morakot]

Quote

Bow is an anaethesiologist, not a surgeon.  I recall her being turned down for promotions,

Wasn't it just the one while she was pregnant? Yes, that is also cause for discrimination, but AFAIR, it was only the one. Bow has always been proud of her job and enjoys it. I would say if someone had to stay home with the baby, it should be Dre. He spends most of his time at work talking about personal issues. 

[Personal anecdote: A boyfriend of mine broke up with me because he didn't want kids. A few years later, we reconnected and his current wife had him at home looking after 4 children under 6. I did laugh.]

[Happytobehere]

Dre’s role as a non-stop PoS is really making it hard to watch his scenes on the show.  The show better start dialing that mess back before they alienate viewers.

[Happytobehere]

On 1/4/2018 at 1:46 PM, Arcadiasw said:

Is it common for twins to be in the same classroom even if it's private school? I always assume twins were separated.  

In my neck of the woods, it is not school policy, it happens based on 1) Parental request — they want the twins to develop friends and identities outside of each other and 2) Academic ability — based 9n what we have seen, Diane would not in the same class as Jack.

[Frisson]

Quote

 

 

On 1/4/2018 at 3:26 AM, Dee said:

So Charlie being a deadbeat dad, which the show constantly jokes about, wasn't a problem?

That is another thing about him that’s pretty gross, but I was discussing what I saw in this episode that I didn’t like. I watch sporadically, and this particular conversation disturbed me. 

[BookThief]

20 hours ago, ChromaKelly said:

I was thinking the resolution to Bow's story was going to be that she works part-time. IDK how the Johnsons are going to be able to deal with the loss of her income, that's pretty significant. Did Dre get a (I'm just guessing here $150k+) raise? Anesthesiologists are in high demand. She could work on-call or something. I don't know why it had to be all-or-nothing.

I am highly in favor of a Ruby-Junior war. Bring it. 
 

Her income is likely in the $400,000 range or higher. Someone in my family is "just" a general practitioner and makes at least over $300,000. I imagine a specialist would be making more. But yeah, I don't know why she couldn't work only certain days or hours. But I guess she just wasn't ready and that's OK. But I don't know how she'll be able to do it. Will she just have to quit? She used up FMLA and I'm obviously no expert, but I don't think her circumstances of just wanting to stay home would allow her to use more, even if it was available. Her hospital will likely have some amazing program to allow for random leave for a few months.

[readster]

19 minutes ago, BookThief said:

Her income is likely in the $400,000 range or higher. Someone in my family is "just" a general practitioner and makes at least over $300,000. I imagine a specialist would be making more. But yeah, I don't know why she couldn't work only certain days or hours. But I guess she just wasn't ready and that's OK. But I don't know how she'll be able to do it. Will she just have to quit? She used up FMLA and I'm obviously no expert, but I don't think her circumstances of just wanting to stay home would allow her to use more, even if it was available. Her hospital will likely have some amazing program to allow for random leave for a few months.

Something that many shows like Black-ish seem to be out of touch with is how they think that being a stay at home parent is all rainbows and butterflies for one and expect the other will do it. The last show that did it in a realistic manner was Modern Family for a few years with Cam. Then having him go back to work felt organic. Here Dre wanting Bow to stay at home because: "It will be easier for everyone and I can show I'm the MAN of the house." Is such bullshit. Even the way her co-workers act at the hospital, they are down right hateful towards her and seriously, why? It was like about ten years ago on Grey's Anatomy where Bailey was constantly bullied by her ex husband and her father with: "You care more about your job than your family." You wanted to go: "Where is the money coming from to pay the bills then?" Then they had it where her ex-husband could take two years off since he was a lawyer and her father would front the money. That's where the line is crossed between reality and fiction because even back then going back to her your old job would be: "You've been gone for 2 years, we functioned fine without you, good luck and nice knowing you." 

   The way they also have Charlie with his deadbeatness goes way to far. Even a few years ago when he just walk out of the apartment and leave his son sitting alone in the dark wasn't funny. That is the example of taking a character's worst traits and pushing them to the extreme expecting people to find it funny, and it's not. It makes them look horrible and you can even tell the actors don't find it funny either because they can't sell it as funny. This is just a horrible direction the show has been taking the last year and sadly, they fell into the "add another kid to the show" because it will be rich with stories and then it turns into this. Which is utter crap and the show is on it's downfall. 

Edited January 6, 2018 by readster

[Joimiaroxeu]

Rainbow Johnson is the doctor who kills.

URBs represent!

Nice callback to Key & Peale's biiiiiiiiiitch sketch.

Cousin Denzel Washington. (But ugh with that "all Black people are related" thing, even as a joke.)

I'm liking this new Junior who's not afraid to step to Ruby. Should get real interesting.

Glad the show is back but it must be telling that now I don't bother to watch my recording until days after the episode has aired. Used to be a same-night watch for me.

[Quickbeam]

I loved: “find the nougat, black Jesus”. It just made me laugh, hard. 

[QQQQ]

Bow's black and white deconstructed sweater was pretty awful. My cats would've attacked her within minutes.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

On 1/3/2018 at 2:11 PM, attica said:

Charlie's hastily uttered "Bow should be my wife" made me snort.

Except he said "Bow should be my wife."  As opposed to someone else?  His emphasis was on the wrong word. It was a bad line reading, as though he didn't understand why he was saying it.

Edited January 8, 2018 by ItCouldBeWorse

[ItCouldBeWorse]

On 1/5/2018 at 1:30 PM, morakot said:

Bow has always been proud of her job and enjoys it. I would say if someone had to stay home with the baby, it should be Dre. He spends most of his time at work talking about personal issues.

But he wouldn't take great care of the baby. He would be bored and unlikely to interact as much as he should. Ruby sits there all day with little to do but lust after younger men, but we've seen that she would not be a good caretaker.  Pops is not equipped to do it either. Junior would honestly be the only family member beside Bow I would trust with the baby for an extended time. 

Edited January 8, 2018 by ItCouldBeWorse

[morakot]

ItCouldBeWorse, I totally agree Dre would be a terrible SAHD. The kids knew it which is why Junior stepped up. What IS Dre good at, beside spending money on shoes and hats?

[readster]

2 hours ago, morakot said:

ItCouldBeWorse, I totally agree Dre would be a terrible SAHD. The kids knew it which is why Junior stepped up. What IS Dre good at, beside spending money on shoes and hats?

Hiding high sugar foods in places like the garage and the toilet. 

[Court]

I was really excited to see an episode with Bow at work. I didn't like this at all. It was also unrealistic. Ugh. 

[OnceSane]

Quote

Dre is selected to run point on a campaign that focuses on “The Talk,” which refers to the conversations that Black parents have with their children through the decades to prepare them for the racial bias they may face in the world. Meanwhile, Bow finds an online group of women that she leans on for advice and support.

[jhlipton]

On ‎1‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 8:40 PM, Irlandesa said:

*ETA: professional working black woman.  While I don't think the stats in this one survey that I read broke it down to race, other surveys have looked at minorities and how they aren't proportionately represented either.

I'm sure (without having any stats, that it's worse for black women.

On ‎1‎/‎3‎/‎2018 at 9:37 AM, readster said:

It's like Ruby's constant put down of Bow . 

There's a great argument against Bow staying home!

 

On ‎1‎/‎3‎/‎2018 at 11:19 AM, tennisgurl said:

1) I hate that we dont get more stories about Bow as a doctor, there was lots of potential there.

2) Why do all of the Dres "this is how I made it" stuff have to be so selfish?

1) Scrubs-ish?

2) because Dre is a selfish manbaby!

[Tenarife60]

I must've missed some episodes because I thought Dre and Rhonda's mother always lived with Dre and Bow.  What was she doing with a duplex that she left Rhonda?

[Dee]

I howled at SantaMonica/Maria getting progressively wasted throughout the episode.

Rashida Jones has been a great addition to the cast.

Still waiting for Maya Rudolph to pop up as Rainbow's other sister though.

Edited January 10, 2018 by Dee

[mtlchick]

I need to find out more about the deal Ruby has with Ving Rhames.  

[charmed1]

Ruby and her pregnancy scares and her “agreement” with Ving Rhames LOL! And Ruby shooting Tupac should not have made me laugh so hard.  I keep forgetting that Raven is playing Dre’s sister. I wish they’d pull a Becky Connor on that one. I wonder if they’re going to rapidly advance DeVante’s age next year. I know he’s played by twins now (Peter Thomas’ grandsons), but Jack and Diane are getting to that age where sitcom writers think they need to be replaced by a younger, cuter addition. See: Raven-Symone as Olivia. Ugh.

I’d be so happy if Cree Summer was added to the cast as a family member. Hell, Cree Summer is Bow. Black mother, white father, raised on a reservation by new age, artsy parents with a brother named...of all things...Rainbow. Plus she’s worked with Jenifer before. Kenya, if you’re reading, bring on Cree. I miss seeing her on screen.

Edited January 10, 2018 by charmed1

[Sile]

The Tupac line seemed a little heartless given that Rashida Jones was on this episode, even if she and Ruby weren't in any scenes together.  It doesn't seem worth possibly causing someone pain just for a one-off throwaway joke.

Edited January 10, 2018 by Sile

[Dee]

Ruby and Santamonica shared a brief scene.

[Sile]

7 minutes ago, Dee said:

Ruby and Santamonica shared a brief scene.

Oh, you're right, in the kitchen.  I'd forgotten about that since I don't think they had any interaction.  She was probably on set during the scene with Dre, Rhonda and Ruby, then.  Or maybe even read it in the script.  Could be I'm being overly sensitive and she didn't think anything about it since it's been so long.

Meanwhile, Ruby not only owns a duplex while she sponges off of Dre and Bow, but then has the nerve sass him about it while she's relaxing in her bare feet on his sofa in his living room taking a nap?  While her new Mercedes (Lexus/BMW/whatever it was) he paid for is sitting in the garage?  No way in hell

Couldn't she have just explained that Rhonda really needed the money and hope that Dre would offer his half to her of his own accord?  Oh, I forgot, this is the Johnsons I'm talking about here.  I really do like the show, but I need way more Pops and way less Ruby.

[AnimeMania]

How did Rainbow become a worst mom by being a stay at home mother than she was when she was a working mother?

[paulvdb]

Seriously. How did she ever raise her other kids without Junior's help?

[Marley]

Rainbow continues to be the worst. Only reason I didn’t hate this episode was cause Rashida Jones. This show is so close to losing me.

The duplex should be left to both children like wtf.

[Racj82]

3 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

How did Rainbow become a worst mom by being a stay at home mother than she was when she was a working mother?

Part of it is adjusting. She never realized how much Junior did for her. Which the point of the episode plotline.

I liked how much acknowledgement to Junior from Bow with Dre being Dre most of the time.

[GHScorpiosRule]

7 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

How did Rainbow become a worst mom by being a stay at home mother than she was when she was a working mother?

THIS!

7 hours ago, paulvdb said:

Seriously. How did she ever raise her other kids without Junior's help?

AND THIS!

4 hours ago, Racj82 said:

Part of it is adjusting. She never realized how much Junior did for her. Which the point of the episode plotline.

 

But that doesn't address how Bow managed to raise Zoey, Junior, Diane and Jack just FINE. Junior wasn't there to help her. And neither was Dre.

I barely laughed. Where did my show go? It needs a HUGE dose of Pops.

[attica]

I do not doubt that Charlie's inherited treasure map will lead to something awesome.

11 hours ago, mtlchick said:

I need to find out more about the deal Ruby has with Ving Rhames.  

Well, we know he has the meats....

[joanne3482]

7 hours ago, Marley said:

The duplex should be left to both children like wtf.

I could see why Ruby was leaving it to the daughter. She seems to be struggling financially and Dre has all the monies. From a completely practical standpoint it makes sense, and that's how the daughter and Ruby were looking at it.  Dre was thinking about his memories associated with going with Ruby to pick up the rent. I think what bothered him was that she was going to inherit it and then immediately sell it since they were struggling financially.  As a mostly practical person I can see Ruby and the daughter's point.  

[readster]

1 hour ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

THIS!

AND THIS!

But that doesn't address how Bow managed to raise Zoey, Junior, Diane and Jack just FINE. Junior wasn't there to help her. And neither was Dre.

I barely laughed. Where did my show go? It needs a HUGE dose of Pops.

That's what really didn't make sense. It wasn't like Bow was there for the first 4 no problem. Granted having a baby after the first two are almost out of the house and so many years apart can be an adjustment. But this was too much. Also, with the entire Lucky Charms cereal with Diane and Jack. It was like they never had sugar before, considering their father hides super sugar items around the house because he didn't want his kids eating it before him when he needed it. Hence also why he got diabetes because of his poor diet and stress eating. Just mentioning that Dre still has it and Junior is bringing up Bow's pour shopping skills, that was too much. Especially with the glue stick. Ruby or Dre could have gotten a damn glue stick. Also, don't they have neighbors? Why would they be out of glue sticks to begin with? Nothing is making sense and don't get me started on the magical duplex that Ruby apparently owns yet sponges off Dre and Bow like they all owe her something. Rhonda is the normal one of that family? Really? Wow! Plus, just because Bow knows and even tells Dre that his co-workers make him do stupid crap doesn't mean it hasn't gotten old. Seriously, how did any of these men get into a white collar job like this and haven't been thrown in jail by now? It's becoming too much. Having them have Dante and throwing Zoey to college was not a smart move at all by the show. Because while Junior has really become such a better character, everyone else are complete idiots. Just the main 4 and having Zoey around was keeping the family sane. They I'm waiting for the house to burn down.

Edited January 10, 2018 by readster

[Traveller519]

I kinda felt like they needed to flush out the inheritance plot a bit more. It felt like it was dealt with very sporadically. Didn't we have an episode previously about Dre and Bow drafting up their wills and estates? Maybe what would have made sense was to see those being finalized (or amended with the addition of Davante) and it prompting Dre to look at his own parents estates.

Is Diane getting dumber. I seem to recall she was overly-precocious and quite smart early on in the series, but since they've decided to start playing up her "evil tendencies" they've played down her intellect. To the point where the past two episodes have had her unable to even do her own homework without someone's "assistance" (read: doing it for her). I get that the bookworm child is an overly done trope in family sitcoms, but reducing her to near-Jack levels is a bummer. Maybe the reason her older kids are so self sufficient and able to help out is because Rainbow wasn't facilitating helicopter parenting of them like she does with the younger ones, even if she's pawning that work off on someone else.

 

I did appreciate the conversation before bed. Especially the "Have you been talking to those people at work again?" It's nice to seem some bridging back to the office scenes from the family scenes. They often don't acknowledge it, which was supported by Dre's "You know I don't really talk to those people." And Bow, "putting it out in the universe" routine was pretty well done too!

[jmonique]

I was sitting here, wondering if I wasn't supposed to ask why Dre isn't raising his own damn kid and wondering if I'm supposed to think it's funny that they've turned Junior into a Duggar daughter.

Then I remembered "This Is Us" was back, and turned the station after 12 minutes. 

No regrets.

[Madding crowd]

I don't like the way Junior is forced to run the entire household. They could easily afford to hire a nanny, and Ruby doesn't seem like she does much, so why can't she help. Also don't buy Bow as being so clueless, she raised four other children.  Also annoyed that after briefly showing Diane as being a normal girl who is close to her twin, she now is evil again and clueless about making a simple poster.

I still like Charlie (as a character, not someone I would really like to meet), but they need to tone down the utter stupidity of Dre's co-workers. How would these morons be able to run a successful ad agency? As far as the inheritance: I actually thought that was well done. Every child wants to feel they are loved equally, even when they are grown up. I think Dre just wanted to know he was loved as much as his sister (or course he wants to be loved more than). I have been brutal on sitcoms this week, but there is funny and there is too out there to be funny.

[Dee]

Ruby (and Pops) do/does help, along with Vivian, so there was no reason for Rainbow to be portrayed as a terrible SAHM.

[TiffanyNichelle]

11 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

How did Rainbow become a worst mom by being a stay at home mother than she was when she was a working mother?

I'm mad that the purpose of this was to just have her sitting around, drinking wine while Junior does everything. I thought that was the opposite of why she wanted to stay home. I'd rather the storyline had been that she was too involved with the kids and trying to get them to do more activities in order to fill up her day.

[jhlipton]

11 hours ago, Racj82 said:

I liked how much acknowledgement to Junior from Bow with Dre being Dre most of the time.

We'll see how much of that acknowledgement sticks (Magic 8 Ball says: Not Much)

4 hours ago, Madding crowd said:

I don't like the way Junior is forced to run the entire household. They could easily afford to hire a nanny

They have one (Black Nanny) off and on as the script dictates.

Edited January 10, 2018 by jhlipton

[Racj82]

7 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

THIS!

AND THIS!

But that doesn't address how Bow managed to raise Zoey, Junior, Diane and Jack just FINE. Junior wasn't there to help her. And neither was Dre.

I barely laughed. Where did my show go? It needs a HUGE dose of Pops.

It does address it in the fact that as I said she's adjusting to a new way of doing things. It's not that she couldn't or can't take care of her children. There is a lot regarding the kids as they get older that she didn't have to stress as much as about. Routines are different. Likes and dislikes have changed. 

Really all this episode did was explore how much Junior being the third parent isn't just a joke. What he does is more than that. Bow didn't fully appreciate it until now. Now she has.