Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[Cherrio]

I think someone who was actually addicted to something would scare him shitless

Nah, he is one wild and crazy Fundie.   He wasn't skeered of the wild wicked women he was warned about all his life, so some meth and a beer chaser would be no big deal.

BAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA !          

[Julia]

When we have complete "freedom," we have no desires for ourselves and allow God to take control -- sobriety is a by-product, but not the goal.

 

or at least that's how Loki explained it in the first Avengers movie.

[babyhouseman]

50 shades of Josh. Who needs a rich, handsome billionaire when you can have this dumpy, balding hunk of a man?

[cheatincheetos]

I think that this is fundie-speak -- another example of taking a word an re-defining it to mean almost the exact opposite. As I understand it, in fundie-land, "freedom" means complete submission to the will of God. When we have complete "freedom," we have no desires for ourselves and allow God to take control -- sobriety is a by-product, but not the goal.

Freedom from the stress of having choices (oh, the horror!).

That's quite impressive weight loss.

[Fuzzysox]

I see Josh found the perfect outfit for when TFDW comes to pick him up and they go down to Boy's Town in Chicago, you know to minister to those sinners.

Edited August 29, 2015 by Fuzzysox

[CofCinci]

Where's GEML? If GEML watched the broadcast last night, he/she may have died of boredom.

[JayInChicago]

Josh would fit right in with that outfit in the backroom of Touché

[Marigny]

This bunch doesn't consider it a mental illness, it's a spiritual one.  And the cure is Jesus, He's like Penicillin for porn.  As far as any of us know, Josh has never received any counselling other than that provided by extreme conservative Christians like his family.  And the emphasis is on how the devil lead the sinner astray and prayer is the cure.  Nobody at the place where Josh is staying has any sort of certification in psychology, psychiatry, social work, addiction counselling or anything else.  They're all fundies, some of whom have been 'addicted' to porn or drugs or alcohol themselves, who are now spreading the Gospel of repentance and Jesus.  The website of the place he's at specifically says that the clients are forbidden to discuss their addictions with anyone there.  The schedule they provide on the website seems to indicate there is no actual counselling going on; it's all prayer sessions and manual labor.  It's sounds kinda like the way the Duggars expect all the children, especially the girls, to 'keep sweet' no matter what.  All this place seems to do is try to get the clients to bury their problems as deeply as possible under a heap of bullsh** with a little Jesus sprinkled on top.

 

Josh may have gotten some court ordered counselling as a kid when social services got involved when he molested his sisters, but his parents and the rest of the Gothardites don't believe in traditional psychiatric diagnoses or treatments.  It's all about Jesus.

 

 

I'm sure it will be less than 7 days before the lure of chick-fil-a and tiddays call Josh's name.

 

 

I'm so tempted to put these on tee shirts and sell them on Etsy. 

[3girlsforus]

 

I'm going to have nightmares!!!

[HumblePi]

Little did Josh know that the woman at the other end of his monitor with the name something like 'Hot Babe4U' was really this........

 

 

But then, the news about Josh and his account at Ashley Madison became known to Miss HotBabe4U and her reaction was...........

Edited August 30, 2015 by HumblePi

[Defrauder]

It's just different two different ways to talk about dealing with addiction. The aim with both is to stop consuming drugs/alcohol/excessive porn or whatever, but their way of looking at it is couched in terms of having freedom from the shackles of whatever compulsive behavior it is, that sent you to labor camp sermon rehab in the first place. Whereas with sobriety, there's more of a sense that a person is always an addict but does their best not to slip, going forward? And IDK, maybe that's too measured for this crowd.

Yes, in which case I purpose to advise them to change their slogan to Freedom AND Sobriety. 

I think that this is fundie-speak -- another example of taking a word an re-defining it to mean almost the exact opposite. As I understand it, in fundie-land, "freedom" means complete submission to the will of God. When we have complete "freedom," we have no desires for ourselves and allow God to take control -- sobriety is a by-product, but not the goal.

 

That's why in political terms, fundies yell so much about "freedom" while aggressively trying to deny freedom to others.

 

I'm not a fundie or ex-fundie, though, and I'm sure that there is someone else on the board who can explain it more effectively.

You are so right.  I've noticed that.  They use words that mean the opposite of what they claim they are trying to say.  Freedom is submission. It's righteous to be humble. There is a lot of double speak going on with them.

I think the motto is perfect. Freedom, not sobriety is Josh's goal. Lol

LOL!  Josh's new motto. Love it.

Edited August 30, 2015 by Defrauder

[Granny58]

Truth truth truth light light light darkness recover truth I am truth I am truth does that make sense truth light light darkness no light no light sin is no light darkness Jesus truth truth light light light

Ya know, I AM actually all into the truth, and light and overcoming darkness and Jesus and all that.....so even though it's not my kind of service, I get it.  However, one needs to WANT to get it and I just don't think that Josh really does.  I don't know...I could be wrong, but I just feel he's going through the motions.  And he will remain unsatisfied with his life if that's all he's getting from it.  Free Josh.

[farmgal4]

I can see your point. I just don't think josh was at the 'die in the gutter with a needle in his arm' zone yet. When the scandal went down he had a 6 figure job and TV money. There was definitely still some cash around. I was seeing it as akin to having an alcoholic always having a bottle under the sink, or a joint in the couch cushions kind of deal. *If* he's the type of guy to bang a porn star in secret, he might have five or ten grand stuck in a storage unit somewhere that no one else knows about. Hell, there may a blessing out there we don't know about.

 

I think it's worth remembering that addict does not necessarily equal down-n-out. Many, many rich and successful people are addicts, and are able to recover without losing it all. Rock bottom is subjective, though that RU meeting seems subterranian to me.

LMAO @ "...there may be a blessing out there..."! True, that!

[Jellybeans]

I think Josh wants to be free from the Duggar lifestyle.

[cheatincheetos]

I see Josh found the perfect outfit for when TFDW comes to pick him up and they go down to Boy's Town in Chicago, you know to minister to those sinners.

I'm so tempted to put these on tee shirts and sell them on Etsy. 

Was there ever a T shirt released for the ribald "Chow Down at Chikfila" song?

[Jynnan tonnix]

That article is fascinating. I am leaning more toward the theory that this is all a sham. The point is for the Duggars to be able to say that they got Josh therapy, they paid for it, they cared for Anna and the kids while he was gone, and then voila! He comes back and they can do a People magazine cover about how Jesus reformed him. And the Duggars are back to being the best parents in America!

 

Boring sermons are not going to scare Josh off, I'm sure he's heard them practically every day of his life. He's already been through work and prayer camps, so even that is nothing new. Maybe he believes, maybe he doesn't, but either way it doesn't matter. He's just expected to put up the facade, sit through it for six months or whatever, and keep from getting caught sinning after that. 

 

In the videos for RU they say that their graduates are expected to serve as kind of distance ministers for the place once they return home. So yes, Josh will probably be taking up a career in ministry. Probably not a bad choice for him -- he gets attention and social cache, and that's what motivates him. Sure he has to pretend to walk the straight and narrow, but nobody in the fundie world seems very surprised when their ministers fail to live up to what they preach. And Josh can funnel all the people with problems in his community to RU for therapy! What an amazing pyramid scam!

 

It's just lies all the way down. We're looking at it the wrong way because we're assuming that they want to be truthful and live up to their principles. But none of this is sincere at all.

Good post. Lots of truth here, I suspect. And if the pun had been just a little bit intended, I frankly think it would have even more impact :)

[leighroda]

Oh mylanta! I fell really far behind on this thread, I just graduated from nursing school on Thursday but have been studying hardcore for my exit exam, so this thread had to be put on the shelf for a bit, I made and appearance when the scandal broke, but for the most part had to keep my distance.

I can't with that church service thing. All I can say is that for all those who said justice hadn't been served for him, I think that is our karma for him. That should be the punishment for all sexua preditors. (I hope everyone knows I'm joking, I'm not trying to make light of sexual abuse... More just how bad that talk was)

As far as Anna is concerned... I would personally move in with her (or let her move in with me) and be her nanny if it meant she would leave that dillhole...unfortunately I just don't see it happening and I think it is so unfortunate. One thing that I think she said (I don't remember if it was a direct quote or paraphrase) was that anger is ungodly. That is the biggest load of BS I have ever heard. We have feelings! God made us that way, it's OK to be angry. It's not ok to act on that and murder someone, but anger is a completely normal and even healthy emotion. I know that is what their church teaches, but it just makes me furious (I know I know I'm going to hell for that emotion). Sometimes anger is the best motivator to positive change... Ugh I could go on and on.

[Featherhat]

Regarding Josh's marriage at 20, it's possible that he, like his parents, hoped it was the answer to his prayers. At last he could "righteously fulfil his desires" etc. He and Anna certainly had a lot of hand porn going on from the second they were allowed to touch. Of course that also meant the obligation to have as many babies as they could right away, which he was less enthused about, but he might have legitimately thought marriage (and subsequent partial independence was the way to go.)

I don't think Boob and Meshelle were going to let this "storyline" go without a fight either. Not only does it provide great fodder for the show in its early stages and set up years of "the next M Kid" it shows that courtship storylines are popular and also begins a new chapter for Josh after all the unpleasantness where he can have Gothard approved sex with his wife and everything will be lovely.

Also it's possible that Josh is mostly fine with being married, he's just one of those assholes who has a wife who does everything for him but he feels entitled to sex with other women, just because he can, because he's a man and they are sex workers. No intention of divorce, no intention of being faithful.

[3girlsforus]

Also it's possible that Josh is mostly fine with being married, he's just one of those assholes who has a wife who does everything for him but he feels entitled to sex with other women, just because he can, because he's a man and they are sex workers. No intention of divorce, no intention of being faithful.

 

See - this is what a real counselor should be working on with Josh. The focus of this "addiction center" is that you won't do these things if you are right with Jesus because Jesus doesn't want you to. The problem is there is so much more to it than that. If Josh can get around caring about what Jesus thinks and can hide it so he doesn't have to hear about what Mom and Dad think he'll keep doing it because he doesn't really see past that.  I really believe he cares about Anna and his kids. He wants to be married to her. What he doesn't really grasp is that viewing porn and paying for sex is more than just sexually immoral. It is destroying to Anna as a woman and a wife. And as he's destroying his marriage it will inevitably have an affect on his kids. He isn't just being a bad Josh. He's crushing the people he claims to care about. So Josh won't see that if he wants to keep up with this behavior it would be kinder of him to divorce Anna and financially support her than to stay married to her and sneak around. There is just no focus what he's doing to those around him with the possible exception of JB and Michelle berating him for derailing the family gravy train. It's all about Josh and Jesus. Sorry but Jesus doesn't want Josh treating his family like crap. 

[TheFinalRose]

I will add to everyone else's explanations that, once you watch that skit, from that point forward until the day you die, the only thing you will hear whenever "Don't Fear the Reaper" comes on the radio is cowbell.

 

 

 

But it's totally worth it.

 

 

 

Yes. Will Ferrell's exposed beer belly is my favorite part of that skit.   I even bought the "More Cowbell" t-shirt for Mr. Final Rose, which he wears proudly.

 

As for whether or not Josh is an addict, I vote no. The only reason he is in a "treatment" facility is that Josh and MEchelle remembered that people were mad when they found out his first round of therapy was only living with a construction worker, so this time they thought if they announced that Josh was in a treatment facility, everyone would back off. Of course, once again, they didn't figure on his whereabouts being exposed so quickly, via Gawker, etc., and everyone seeing that they were parking Josh with some old friends of theirs.

 

I bet Josh loves being out of the house and getting a good night's sleep away from all those kids and the newborn. Plus, there is a Chik Fil A only 1.7 miles down the road (approx. 5 min -- I looked it up), so you know he's kewl with it. The guy has a long life in front of him, what could they possibly do to him at RU that would make a bit of difference in his psyche?  He got caught, but that doesn't mean he has self-motivation to change his ways. Maybe Anna will decide she's okay with an open marriage!!!

[Joe Jitsu913]

Yes. Will Ferrell's exposed beer belly is my favorite part of that skit. I even bought the "More Cowbell" t-shirt for Mr. Final Rose, which he wears proudly.

As for whether or not Josh is an addict, I vote no. The only reason he is in a "treatment" facility is that Josh and MEchelle remembered that people were mad when they found out his first round of therapy was only living with a construction worker, so this time they thought if they announced that Josh was in a treatment facility, everyone would back off. Of course, once again, they didn't figure on his whereabouts being exposed so quickly, via Gawker, etc., and everyone seeing that they were parking Josh with some old friends of theirs.

I bet Josh loves being out of the house and getting a good night's sleep away from all those kids and the newborn. Plus, there is a Chik Fil A only 1.7 miles down the road (approx. 5 min -- I looked it up), so you know he's kewl with it. The guy has a long life in front of him, what could they possibly do to him at RU that would make a bit of difference in his psyche? He got caught, but that doesn't mean he has self-motivation to change his ways. Maybe Anna will decide she's okay with an open marriage!!!

Plus... 6 months away from Anna = no baby making which I'm sure Josh is cool with.

[3girlsforus]

Another thing that struck me about Anna and her constant baby fever. She's been taught that a woman's worth is in her fertility. Even assuming she didn't know Josh was cheating, it seems likely to me that she knew something wasn't right with the relationship. It probably affected the way he acted toward her and affected their intimacy (not just sex - but emotional intimacy as well). If she felt that Josh was losing interest I could see that fueling the baby fever. In her warped upbringing she was taught she is most desirable to men when she's fertile. So to her getting pregnant is probably the equivalent to meeting Josh at the door wrapped in saran wrap. She's being the best woman she can be trying to get her man's attention back. So very sad for a woman to feel that way. 

[Julia]

One thing that I think she said (I don't remember if it was a direct quote or paraphrase) was that anger is ungodly.

 

which is totally supported by the thing in the new testament where Jesus set up a series of seminars at the temple to address the moneylender issue.

 

If she felt that Josh was losing interest I could see that fueling the baby fever. In her warped upbringing she was taught she is most desirable to men when she's fertile.

 

Since someone posted the bizarre schedule for times that Gothard damsels can't have sex, I've wondered if these women aren't pregnant all the time because when they're pregnant is really the only time their husbands get sex on demand.

Edited August 30, 2015 by Julia

[MrsMommy]

Ya know what? Now I understand something! Remember when Anna found out baby #4 was cooking? She said "This is the longest I've been without being pregnant" well I think it's safe to say we all know what took so long. Idk why that amused me so much but it's been floating in my head all day.

[Sew Sumi]

To be honest, it was only the "longest" she'd gone by less than a month. Michael and Marcus came at exactly two year intervals; Meredith came at 25 months. Not exactly earth-shaking here. 

[Blondeone21]

I do not think Josh is an addict. I think he is either too lazy or brainwashed to think about what he really wants in life and how to get what he wants without the gravy train. I also think he never thought he would get caught.

[CofCinci]

Is Josh lazy? While I don't agree with FRC and I acknowledge that Josh was given the position only because of his celebrity, I do believe he worked hard in his role and enjoyed it.

Disobeying his father not only cuts off access to the family fortune, but Josh would also be exiled and wouldn't be allowed relationships with his siblings. Yeah, he molested a few but he did help raise the horde while his mother was completely checked out.

Josh isn't an addict. He was born into the wrong family. Like many men and women, Josh likes sex. No need to pathologize.

[Gemma Violet]

he did help raise the horde while his mother was completely checked out.

 

 

I doubt he did much in the way of raising his siblings.  That "woman's work" was for Jana, Jill, and Jessa.

[Wellfleet]

I'm genuinely curious, how many people here consider Josh to be an addict?

 

I believe Josh thinks he might be an addict, but after a thorough examination, I'm not at all sure a clinician would tag him as one. He certainly has any number of other problems, but I'm not sure about addiction. But he may have decided calling himself an addict will get him some leg-humper sympathy - and that it would remove some of the blame from him as well.

[cmr2014]

Is Josh lazy? While I don't agree with FRC and I acknowledge that Josh was given the position only because of his celebrity, I do believe he worked hard in his role and enjoyed it.

 

I think that Josh is very lazy, but I don't think he was lazy in DC. He was lazy about running the car lot, and he has been lazy about getting in shape, and he has been lazy about going back to school to get the degree he would have needed to get ahead in DC, but I don't think he was lazy about that job. I think that he really enjoyed that job, and that he believes that politics is his calling. I think that he was grateful to the patron who got him that job, and wanted to succeed at the FRC. I also think that he saw it as a stepping stone to bigger and better things in DC or Little Rock.

 

I think that Josh, like his parents, lacks empathy, and I wouldn't be surprised to learn that he was most upset about the loss of his job -- more so than the loss of the reality tv show, more than the loss of respect from his brothers-in-law, more that the damage that has been done to his marriage. YMMV.

[sleekandchic]

I've noticed that many kind-hearted, well-meaning, generous-of-spirit sister and brother posters have advanced the theory of IF ONLY -- that is, IF ONLY Josh could have attended law school, as he said he wished.

Josh barely has an 8th grade education, let alone an adequate high school education. College level? Hardly. I dont know what put law school on his wish list, but even if Jesus had somehow intervened and gave Josh a chance of admittance, how on earth could he have succeeded in any U.S. law school? It's ludicrously impossible and sad.

My opinion re whether Josh has an addiction: No, I think Josh has a sexual compulsion. He's been repressed and taught that sexual urges are ugly and sinful. So when his God-given, human sexuality stirs and excites, Josh thinks he is a sinner. I'm a little surprised at his chutzpah in seeking out the "dark side" of sexual experience. But there IS a level of bravery AND desperation (at the expense of his marriage) in seeking sex in strip clubs and from working girls. Anna is a victim of Josh's selfishness, for sure.

But this faux rehab Josh is imprisoned in can't have any long-ranging, positive effect. Pray-away is not real life. Prayer is a solace, an adjunct, a believer's support. But prayer is not hocus pocus. I feel very sorry for Josh Duggar, his wife and babes.

[Happyfatchick]

Blue Oyster Cult. The song is Don't Fear the Reaper. What is wrong with you people?

You guuuuuys have had me laughing for 2 days, and I sooooo needed that!!! Whoever said you can never hear that song without seeing the skit in your mind is exactly right! I also never hear "You Can Call Me Al" without seeing Chevy Chase, or "Don't Worry, Be Happy" without Billy Crystal. I neRly spewed water across the room when I saw where Aja had posted about CofCinci's "needs more cowbells". OMG, HILARIOUS!!!!!!

[LilyoftheValley]

I've noticed that many kind-hearted, well-meaning, generous-of-spirit sister and brother posters have advanced the theory of IF ONLY -- that is, IF ONLY Josh could have attended law school, as he said he wished.

Josh barely has an 8th grade education, let alone an adequate high school education. College level? Hardly. I dont know what put law school on his wish list, but even if Jesus had somehow intervened and gave Josh a chance of admittance, how on earth could he have succeeded in any U.S. law school? It's ludicrously impossible and sad.

My opinion re whether Josh has an addiction: No, I think Josh has a sexual compulsion. He's been repressed and taught that sexual urges are ugly and sinful. So when his God-given, human sexuality stirs and excites, Josh thinks he is a sinner. I'm a little surprised at his chutzpah in seeking out the "dark side" of sexual experience. But there IS a level of bravery AND desperation (at the expense of his marriage) in seeking sex in strip clubs and from working girls. Anna is a victim of Josh's selfishness, for sure.

But this faux rehab Josh is imprisoned in can't have any long-ranging, positive effect. Pray-away is not real life. Prayer is a solace, an adjunct, a believer's support. But prayer is not hocus pocus. I feel very sorry for Josh Duggar, his wife and babes.

Well, even average people think they are smart, and Josh had absolutely no one else to compare himself to while he was in "school".  I think that Josh thinks he is a genius who was just never give the chance.  The FRC job was clearly that chance to him, though I cannot imagine that if he were doing some amazing job there that the FRC would not have found a way to keep Josh's job even after the molestation scandal.  It was a make-work job, and some part of Josh must have known.  That is why it was so easy to fire him; his purpose was to make the organization look good, not to do any actual work.  

 

I have a law degree from a very respectable university and though I do not think anyone needs to be a genius to complete law school, having self-discipline and drive is an absolute must.  The biggest problem with homefooling is that the student is never asked to truly apply himself.  Did Josh ever have to do something really hard, like write a lengthy research paper?  Hell no.  Josh believes that he would have done great and college and law school because he has absolutely no notion of what it actually takes to truly learn something.  Josh has never spent one hour studying for a test, much less several days.  

 

At the end of the day, if Josh really wanted to achieve his dream, then he could have at any time in his teens applied for college and worked part time and gotten some grants or loans for tuition.  My own suspicion is that on a very basic level, Josh is terrified of going to school with other people and being compared to them.  I firmly believe that Josh's greatest fear is getting to college and seeing how totally ill-prepared he is for it, and that is why he never did it.  I bet that after all that time spent with educated people in Washington, Josh has an even clearer understanding as to just how uneducated he really is.  I highly doubt, for example, if Josh reads books for pleasure, or has ever read a classic.  That right there would make him look really, really out of place at law school.  

 

Come to think of it, do we ever see or hear of the Duggars reading a book besides the bible?  

[HundFan]

HOW JOSH'S ARRIVAL AT RU MIGHT HAVE GONE ....

Unseen hands pushed Josh into the chair. ​Man, his wrists hurt. He'd pictured being tied up, but not like this.

 

"Josh ..." The disembodied voice was scary. Like Daddy's got when Mama's biblical calendar said "Not tonight." "You can take the hood off now."

 

Josh pulled the pillow case loose and squinted at the light.  "Where am I?" 

 

The balding man spoke slowly, as if Josh might have trouble understanding. "You're at a recovery center."

 

"Like one of those community places with teen activities and salsa lessons?" 

 

"Don't be smart."

 

"I'm not. Honestly. Ask anyone. Who are you?"

 

"Well, I'm not a real counselor or a licensed therapist or anyone qualified to treat addiction. But for the next six months, you can call me 'Mama.'" The man leaned forward, pointing at Josh's cheeks. "What caused those injuries to your face?" 

 

"Cat," he lied. It had been Jessa's nails that etched his skin with bloody hashtags. And it took three howlers several minutes to pry her off him. Even Mama hadn't bothered to help. 

 

Mr. Mama frowned as his eyes wandered down to Josh's pants. "We respect Jesus here. Why are you wearing ripped jeans?"

 

"I got pushed out of a plane. Then a car." It had been a nightmare. A painful one.

 

"Do you know why you're here Josh?"

 

It was probably a trick question. Josh thought hard. "InTouch Magazine?" 

 

 "The information on your application is very troubling. It says you're attracted to the same sex."

 

Application? Daddy said it was just one of those fun magazine questionnaires! "No, no, I thought it said attracted to sex. Not same sex, Just sex!"

 

"I can see we're going to need a lot more money to save you, Josh."

 

Money? Had someone actually paid to send him to this horrible place? "I'm so hungry, Mr. Mama. Is there a Chick Fil A nearby?"

 

"You can eat our in-house gruel tomorrow. Set your alarm for 4:30."

 

That was 3 hours from now - he'd never gotten up that early in his life!   "Can I tell you about 'Duggar time?'"

 

"The devil never sleeps, Josh. And neither will you."

 

Josh had never felt so confused or alone. Not even when he had to ask for the "affair guarantee" refund from Ashley Madison because no one wanted to boink him. But there must be a way he could get out of this mess. And then the obvious solution came to mind. Josh squared his shoulders and cleared his throat. "Do you know who my Daddy is?"

 

The man smiled. "Yes, Josh, we do. He's the one who pushed you out of the moving car."

Edited August 30, 2015 by HundFan

[GeeGolly]

The Duggars are big on parables. Josh's story is that of the Prodigal Son, the only difference being he is the 1st born, not the 2nd.

 

Whatever we think of RU and the Duggar parents, I think that JB & M believe the treatment will be helpful. They are probably at their wits end both as parents and as "The Duggars". 

 

With that said, many people who act out with drugs, sex, or whatever, often have an undiagnosed mental health issue, or at the very least become pathologically depressed and/or anxious when faced with confronting their problems. And if that is the case with Josh, then he is shit out of luck, because unfortunately, while someone's faith can be helpful on their journey to wellness, no one has yet to pray mental illness away.

 

My hope is that this shit storm allows the entire family to take their blinders off, take Gothard out of the picture, and revisit their beliefs in a healthier way.

[cheatincheetos]

"You can eat tomorrow. Set your alarm for 4:30."

 

That was 3 hours from now!  He'd never in his life gotten up that early! "Whoaa there ... maybe I need to explain Duggar time."

 

"The devil never sleeps, Josh. And neither will you."

Welcome to Camp Scamafundie.

Edited August 30, 2015 by cheatincheetos

[Julia]

Well, even average people think they are smart, and Josh had absolutely no one else to compare himself to while he was in "school". I think that Josh thinks he is a genius who was just never give the chance. The FRC job was clearly that chance to him, though I cannot imagine that if he were doing some amazing job there that the FRC would not have found a way to keep Josh's job even after the molestation scandal. It was a make-work job, and some part of Josh must have known. That is why it was so easy to fire him; his purpose was to make the organization look good, not to do any actual work.

And besides, who's his role model? Josh was raised to believe that the strongest, smartest, hardest-working and most beloved of God human in his life was Jim Bob, and he had broken post-partum baby machine Michelle as a teacher. Say what you will about Josh, I don't doubt for a moment that he's more able than those two, and his siblings by birth order aren't allowed to be more able than he is.

I couldn't say how able he actually is, but his biggest barrier seems to be that he's a lazy, dishonest, self-indulgent, buffoonish bigot who wants contempt for women instutionalized because he's afraid of them (and with reason good - can you imagine what Jessa-Heather would have done to him if sticking up for him didn't make her Jim Bob and Michelle's best girl?). And he somehow has gotten the idea that he has a right to demand vagina access from women.

Which brings us neatly back to who's his role model?

Edited August 30, 2015 by Julia

[GeeGolly]

Can you imagine Josh's response if Anna was considering Madison as a name for M4?

[TaxNerd]

Can you imagine Josh's response if Anna was considering Madison as a name for M4?

They should do another Dugger family vote for the next M name. Might get quite a few votes?

[Chicklet]

Ok you guys are evil, now I still have a BOC earworm and I'm still laughing about "more cowbell", my husband thinks I'm crazy. 

Hundfan- please write that funny Viking book. Or a (funny) crazy sexy fundy book. 

Edited August 30, 2015 by Chicklet

[Cherrio]

I've noticed that many kind-hearted, well-meaning, generous-of-spirit sister and brother posters have advanced the theory of IF ONLY -- that is, IF ONLY Josh could have attended law school, as he said he wished.

Josh barely has an 8th grade education, let alone an adequate high school education. College level? Hardly. I dont know what put law school on his wish list, but even if Jesus had somehow intervened and gave Josh a chance of admittance, how on earth could he have succeeded in any U.S. law school? It's ludicrously impossible and sad.

My opinion re whether Josh has an addiction: No, I think Josh has a sexual compulsion. He's been repressed and taught that sexual urges are ugly and sinful. So when his God-given, human sexuality stirs and excites, Josh thinks he is a sinner. I'm a little surprised at his chutzpah in seeking out the "dark side" of sexual experience. But there IS a level of bravery AND desperation (at the expense of his marriage) in seeking sex in strip clubs and from working girls. Anna is a victim of Josh's selfishness, for sure.

But this faux rehab Josh is imprisoned in can't have any long-ranging, positive effect. Pray-away is not real life. Prayer is a solace, an adjunct, a believer's support. But prayer is not hocus pocus. I feel very sorry for Josh Duggar, his wife and babes.

Excellent post !     Wanted to re-post and add that he was never a politician. He was involved with an organization identified as a hate group. He got to shake some hands, big deal.   

[kokapetl]

I think he would've decided he wanted to be a lawyer after shadowing JimBob whe he was a state legislator, lots of the other legislators would've been lawyers.

[Cherrio]

Can you imagine Josh's response if Anna was considering Madison as a name for M4?

LOL       Madison Ashley

[NextIteration]

Excellent post !     Wanted to re-post and add that he was never a politician. He was involved with an organization identified as a hate group. He got to shake some hands, big deal.   

 

Which needs to be remembered whilst we're in the thick of things.  The FRC is named as a hate group by the esteemed Southern Poverty Law Center - it must never be forgotten.

[Granny58]

Another thing that struck me about Anna and her constant baby fever. She's been taught that a woman's worth is in her fertility. Even assuming she didn't know Josh was cheating, it seems likely to me that she knew something wasn't right with the relationship. It probably affected the way he acted toward her and affected their intimacy (not just sex - but emotional intimacy as well). If she felt that Josh was losing interest I could see that fueling the baby fever. In her warped upbringing she was taught she is most desirable to men when she's fertile. So to her getting pregnant is probably the equivalent to meeting Josh at the door wrapped in saran wrap. She's being the best woman she can be trying to get her man's attention back. So very sad for a woman to feel that way. 

some people who cheat then over compensate, extra attentive, extra nice.  She may have thought things were superb!

 

"he has been lazy about getting in shape,"   I wonder if it is indulgence or depression that has led to his weight issue.  

Edited August 30, 2015 by Granny58

[Oldernowiser]

Excellent post !     Wanted to re-post and add that he was never a politician. He was involved with an organization identified as a hate group. He got to shake some hands, big deal.

He got to be IMPORTANT. On his own, without JimBob or the rest of his family. He got to stand in front of people and they would listen while he told them who to hate and how much those people were going to hell and by definition, how much better he is.

It was the perfect storm for a repressed raging narcissist with ego and anger issues.

[Cherrio]

He got to be IMPORTANT. On his own, without JimBob or the rest of his family. He got to stand in front of people and they would listen while he told them who to hate and how much those people were going to hell and by definition, how much better he is.

It was the perfect storm for a repressed raging narcissist with ego and anger issues.

I also think he hates his father.     

[Aw my lahgs]

The Duggars are big on parables. Josh's story is that of the Prodigal Son, the only difference being he is the 1st born, not the 2nd.

Whatever we think of RU and the Duggar parents, I think that JB & M believe the treatment will be helpful. They are probably at their wits end both as parents and as "The Duggars".

With that said, many people who act out with drugs, sex, or whatever, often have an undiagnosed mental health issue, or at the very least become pathologically depressed and/or anxious when faced with confronting their problems. And if that is the case with Josh, then he is shit out of luck, because unfortunately, while someone's faith can be helpful on their journey to wellness, no one has yet to pray mental illness away.

My hope is that this shit storm allows the entire family to take their blinders off, take Gothard out of the picture, and revisit their beliefs in a healthier way.

I'm not sure if JB & M are convinced in their hearts of hearts that this place will cure Josh of his issues - I think that rather they purpose for it to clean up Josh's public image (he was horrible, but see, he went into rehab and came out a reformed man), as well as their image of great parents (look, they took action! They sent their son to rehab! They're great, responsible parents).

[kokapetl]

I think the livestream from the 28/08/2015 is now up. http://livestream.com/northlove/events/3868452

2:42 long.

Edited August 30, 2015 by Kokapetl

[kokapetl]

The Duggars are big on parables. Josh's story is that of the Prodigal Son, the only difference being he is the 1st born, not the 2nd.

Whatever we think of RU and the Duggar parents, I think that JB & M believe the treatment will be helpful. They are probably at their wits end both as parents and as "The Duggars".

With that said, many people who act out with drugs, sex, or whatever, often have an undiagnosed mental health issue, or at the very least become pathologically depressed and/or anxious when faced with confronting their problems. And if that is the case with Josh, then he is shit out of luck, because unfortunately, while someone's faith can be helpful on their journey to wellness, no one has yet to pray mental illness away.

My hope is that this shit storm allows the entire family to take their blinders off, take Gothard out of the picture, and revisit their beliefs in a healthier way.

Josh could reasonably be expected to be depressed from recent events in his life, but that can be overcome. My biggest concern is that 6 months of Josh doing busywork as a cure to a non existent addiction will make it "inappropriate" for Anna or Josh to discuss the real problems that will remain unaddressed.