The Duggalos: Jinger and the Holy Goalie

[Churchhoney]

I went to the wrong schools. In what kind of a graduate program does the first two weeks of a semester leave a married student with a child enough free time to seek out mentors to teach him food-photography to spice up his instagram, attend a professional sports contest and take up golf?  (all before the second weekend)

Also -- I wonder if he ever hangs out at all with his fellow seminarians. They're certainly not in evidence on his social media. Does he ever talk to them or is he too busy shopping for matching jackets with staff members? 

As @Lunera said, if WASC wanted more proof that MacArthur's top staff continues to play favorites with students, they need look no further than the social-media accounts. 

I expect that lying, papering over and conservative Christian political pressure will eventually let the Master's Seminary keep its accreditation. But the hijinks surrounding Jer seem to make clear that they have no intention at all of changing their ways. 

Edited August 17, 2019 by Churchhoney

[Minivanessa]

10 hours ago, Lunera said:

So, is it normal for the Dean to ditch school on Friday and accept a golf invitation from a student? If I was a  current student I'd be side eyeing Masters and the church. 

Wasn't favoritism one of the reasons Masters was in danger of losing their accreditation?

9 hours ago, Oldernowiser said:

RFP should watch his back. All the guys who are actually paying money to be there AND taking it seriously may just figure out a way to take him down. He’s certainly giving them ammunition.

17 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

I went to the wrong schools. In what kind of a graduate program does the first two weeks of a semester leave a married student with a child enough free time to seek out mentors to teach him food-photography to spice up his instagram, attend a professional sports contest and take up golf?  

Also -- I wonder if he ever hangs out at all with his fellow seminarians. They're certainly not in evidence on his social media. Does he ever talk to them or is he too busy shopping for matching jackets with staff members? 

Well, aren't they all Calvinists, and all aspiring to be rich, famous, and powerful expositional preachers? It's obviously all about power and influence with that crowd. It's possible Jeremy may be envied by his classmates, but I'm sure they also (even if they don't admit it) admire his skilz at zipping right to the top of the heap and hanging with the dean and other big shots. 

I saw this on Facebook the other day. From all I have heard and read of the Master's Seminary and MacArthur's church, this is NOT a reflection of their values. For them, I think "sitting with the great" is what it's all about, and "walking with the broken" is something just  for a photo opp, to tick that "love mercy" box on the Christian checklist:

ETA: The quote wasn't attributed on FB and after posting I looked it up. It's attributed to Bill Bennot, the author of a book about "Apostolic Leadership," whatever that is. But I don't think it's about playing golf with the seminary dean. 

Edited August 17, 2019 by Jeeves

[fonfereksglen]

12 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

Apparently there are no classes on Fridays. And Jer picks up yet another expensive hobby.

What a horrible swing!  Such a phony.

[Churchhoney]

25 minutes ago, Jeeves said:

Well, aren't they all Calvinists, and all aspiring to be rich, famous, and powerful expositional preachers? It's obviously all about power and influence with that crowd. It's possible Jeremy may be envied by his classmates, but I'm sure they also (even if they don't admit it) admire his skilz at zipping right to the top of the heap and hanging with the dean and other big shots. 

I saw this on Facebook the other day. From all I have heard and read of the Master's Seminary and MacArthur's church, this is NOT a reflection of their values. For them, I think "sitting with the great" is what it's all about, and "walking with the broken" is something just  for a photo opp, to tick that "love mercy" box on the Christian checklist:

Well, I don't  know about them not fighting back -- at least when it comes to the staff and the institution.

I doubt there's anything they could or would do about Jer himself. But WASC hasn't re-accredited the seminary yet but instead have extended the time allotted for the seminary to mend its ways for about a year, I think. 

 And the reason the accreditors have continued their scrutiny seems to be that they've gotten a high volume of complaints from students, former students and staff about nepotism and numerous forms of favoritism.

In MacArthur's fall 2018 speech on the matter he pointedly told everyone to shut up about their complaints because they were assisting Satan by complaining. However, I'm pretty sure the March 2019 WASC report said the complaints were continuing. So at least some people didn't go by the "shut up, you're satanic" thing.

Additional alumni have published their critiques online this year, for example, mentioning theology. The favoritism stuff has gone on and on and, in the eyes of pretty many people connected to the group, it does contradict the supposed theology.

Just because people attend or work at or graduated from a seminary that's developed a bad habit of ignoring theology doesn't mean that all those students and staff are willing to ignore it, too, especially when they feel like the "small" who are being spat upon! 

I still doubt the accreditation will be pulled. Seems to me too likely that political pressure behind the scenes will let them skate. But the griping and the attempts to get them to change don't seem to be subsiding either. 

18 minutes ago, fonfereksglen said:

What a horrible swing!  Such a phony.

Well, that probably means he'll need to schedule some additional golf dates with the Deans so he can improve his skills, right?

Edited August 17, 2019 by Churchhoney

[Minivanessa]

10 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

Well, I don't  know about them not fighting back -- at least when it comes to the staff and the institution.. . .

 And the reason the accreditors have continued their scrutiny seems to be that they've gotten a high volume of complaints from students, former students and staff about nepotism and numerous forms of favoritism.. . .

The favoritism stuff has gone on and on and, in the eyes of pretty many people connected to the group, it does contradict the supposed theology.

Just because people attend or work at or graduated from a seminary that's developed a bad habit of ignoring theology doesn't mean that all those students and staff are willing to ignore it, too, especially when they feel like the "small" who are being spat upon! 

Thanks for this, @Churchhoney. It's turned my cynicism down a notch this morning. 

As I said, I saw that quote on FB and it kept resonating with me as I was browsing this forum. It's so exquisitely dissonant with seminary student Jeremee's carefully curated SM presence. 

[TeeMo]

Anyone who watched their season of Idol must be scratching their heads like I do every day when I think about Cade’s idea of a woman’s place and his engagement to Gabby. Girlfriend was one of the most overtly ambitious in a borderline unpleasant to others way during her season. One of the moments that made me LOL was a week when she was one of the last names announced to advance and Cade was still in limbo. Her name was announced, she jumped up in glee, clapped her hands and ran all the way over to the chairs where the “safe” contestants were seated without even a backwards glance at Cade whom she was already dating. I am all for celebrating your own successes but the contestants on that show all generally try to pretend to be both excited for others’ success and compassionate about others’ failures. Nearly every other contestant sent to the next round had given a hug or pat on the back to the contestants left waiting to hear their fate but not Little Mama. 😂 Truthfully she and Jeremy would probably make a great pair because they are both pretty obvious about their naked ambition to just be famous.

I just can’t imagine Gabby giving up her career to be a wife and mother and truthfully I don't think she should. By all accounts she has been working a long time towards a successful music career. She should keep fighting for what we wants and not be shy about her ambitions. In any other situation these two would get married and even start a family while both working on their music careers but I just don’t see Cade finding that acceptable and I wonder how it will all shake out.

[Churchhoney]

2 hours ago, Jeeves said:

Thanks for this, @Churchhoney. It's turned my cynicism down a notch this morning. 

As I said, I saw that quote on FB and it kept resonating with me as I was browsing this forum. It's so exquisitely dissonant with seminary student Jeremee's carefully curated SM presence. 

Glad I could slightly lighten the mood! I share your feelings and qualms about this. And Jer's stuff is not helping the bad image. I find that fact quite interesting. 

On the bright side, a lot of people have spoken up, either publicly or confidentially to WASC, saying that the favoritism, nepotism, meanness and MacArthur's use of money to get his way go very much against their beliefs and that the WASC criticisms are just. And that includes quite a lot of people who hold what to me are really antediluvian theological and other beliefs.

Like this guy, a very high-profile and influential seminary alum -- 

"RALPH DROLLINGER / JANUARY 7, 2019 AT 7:23 AMREPLY

"HI John Matthew Fox; I agree with your overview completely.

"As a graduate of TMS, I later experienced the same kinds of things you did at the college as I led Capitol Ministries: Harsh heavy-handedness has been MacArthur’s way of dealing with things over the years; he clearly violates 1 Peter 5:3. With most everyone on his boards being on his payrolls (some place or another) our Lord’s patience with him has now seemingly run out; my take on this is that God has now raised up objective leadership — the Accreditation folks, folks he must submit to — to bring to light MacArthur’s patently unbiblical way of dealing with people. He has hurt so many.

"Similar to ORU and the Hobby Lobby rescue of that Christian College from its failed leadership, the TMS/TMU board needs to resign and fresh leadership be appointed. Another realistic solution is to merge TMU with another Christian College, since Christian student enrollment in Christian Colleges is way down across the nation and there are more schools than are necessary (unfortunately).

"I appreciate your courage in stating what you have dear brother. Ralph Drollinger, President and Founder, Capitol Ministries"

"I should add to my above post, and I say this with a sad heart as a graduate of TMS, whose seminary faculty prepared me well for the ministry I have today in Washington D.C., that existing students should transfer and that incoming freshmen should go somewhere else – if they desire to earn an accredited degree."

"The fact that an outside governmental agency objectively documented and determined that MacArthur’s leadership does not even meet the moral and ethical standards of the world, deems him unqualified to remain at the helm. MacArthur measures up neither to WASC’s nor his own standards....

"Most important here is the cause of Christ, the Great Commission, the glory of God, and the sustainability and endurance of the University and Seminary (I am a graduate of the Seminary)—not MacArthur and his sycophant board members who are now trying to save face. [Editorial comment: via Jeremy Vuolo's social-media accounts! 😈] They have feathered their own bed; it is time for them to fly away."

https://thejohnfox.com/an-open-letter-to-john-macarthur-and-the-masters-university/

It'll be interesting how this all plays out.

I'm kind of baffled that Jer would cement himself so firmly to these people in a time when their future seems dicey. And I wonder what Chuck thinks, since this is his world as well.

Part of me figures that Jer's embrace of it means Chuck may know a man who knows a man who's told them that the fix is in and that ultimately MacArthur will escape unscathed and keep his accreditation without changing a thing. But maybe I'm just being too pessimistic in that. 

1 Peter 5:3   Note the KJV[ersion]. This verse all by itself explains why the Duggars and a lot of other SOTDRT grads don't understand much about their faith. Name one Duggar who would have a snowflake's chance in hell of correctly interpreting those words. lol

1 Peter 5:3 Parallel Verses [⇓ See commentary ⇓]

1 Peter 5:3, NIV: "not lording it over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock."

1 Peter 5:3, ESV: "not domineering over those in your charge, but being examples to the flock."

1 Peter 5:3, KJV: "Neither as being lords over God's heritage, but being ensamples to the flock."

1 Peter 5:3, NASB: "nor yet as lording it over those allotted to your charge, but proving to be examples to the flock."

1 Peter 5:3, NLT: "Don't lord it over the people assigned to your care, but lead them by your own good example."

1 Peter 5:3, CSB: "not lording it over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock."

Edited August 17, 2019 by Churchhoney

[awaken]

Thanks, as always, @Churchhoney for your insight!

[Churchhoney]

Just now, awaken said:

Thanks, as always, @Churchhoney for your insight!

Thanks!

We should always remember, though, that there's a fine line between insight and ill-informed idle speculation! 

[galaxychaser]

How old are Jinger and Jeremy?

[Churchhoney]

14 minutes ago, galaxychaser said:

How old are Jinger and Jeremy?

jinger's 25 and Jeremy's 31, I think. 

[cmr2014]

18 hours ago, Oldernowiser said:

This is the essence of Cade. Bless his condescending misogynistic little heart.

There are red flags all over this guy's post. I hope that this girl runs far far away before any wedding. All that "support" for her career is going to dry up 20 seconds after "I do."

I could be completely wrong, I don't know these people at all -- I didn't even see them on American Idol. Still, if I had a daughter and she showed this to me and told me how Cade "worshipped" his girlfriend, I'd point her immediately to the endless narrative accounts of women whose boyfriends were so over-the-top "in love" with them before they were married and turned abusive before the ink was dry on the marriage license.

[awaken]

They just posted part 2 of their Q&A. I can’t bring myself to watch. 

He really does seem to have a lot of free time for someone starting a graduate program. 

[Oldernowiser]

10 minutes ago, awaken said:

They just posted part 2 of their Q&A. I can’t bring myself to watch. 

He really does seem to have a lot of free time for someone starting a graduate program. 

My guess is he’s going to graduate with honors and never attend a class. The fix seems to be in.

[Spencer Hastings]

Question: What was your favorite movie growing up and have you showed it to Jinger?

Jeremy: Hmmmm...oooh....hmmm... *hemhaws for a minute and a half and still doesn’t answer the question.*

I’m assuming it’s Showgirls or something equally sinful. 

[Lunera]

[Lunera]

Didn't really watch it. Skipped to the part about Jake. They left him with a family in the neighborhood and they are sooo sad 🙄. They didn't look like they gave a flying fuck.

Just waiting on someone to take one for the team and amd summarize it.

[jcbrown]

21 hours ago, Oldernowiser said:

This is the essence of Cade. Bless his condescending misogynistic little heart.

Good grief. He is this cemented in his misogynist beliefs at the ripe old age of 23?

20 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

It's still surprising to me that somebody so young and with pretty much exposure to a variety of people wouldn't feel a little more inhibited about expressing those views. 

I suppose I should be glad that he just comes right out with it. But it makes me think he must mostly be sheltered in a large crowd that all believe the same thing. Yeeesh. 

Perhaps there is a hope that he will encounter some real world experiences to shake him out of this but it doesn't seem likely yet. I cannot imagine wanting to be with someone whose baseline was thinking I was inferior due to my biological sex. I know that's a core tenet of the Duggars, too, but they seem a bit better about sugar-coating it than Clueless Cade.

[BigBingerBro]

I did another synopsis of the Part 2 Q&A:

Jin - What was your favorite movie growing up and have you shared it with Jinger?
He says that he's shared a lot of the movies he's enjoyed with her, but "that's a 
tough one"  Batman is one....but it's not his favorite.  It's near impossible to answer!!
They watched "Back to the Future" the other day. They decide to come back to that one later...

Jer - Did you workout before you were married and what sports are you doing now and are 
you still playing some tennis?
She says that she did workout before she got married, but it was more like weights here and there.
She enjoyed being in nature, exercising, running and the only organised sport she played which she loved 
was broomball in their community. She says her family used to play it twice a week.
She sats her family played sports all the time, like basketball.
She picked up a little tennis when they lived in Lardeo and she wants to get back into it.
Jeremy says she works out everyday. She says she loved getting a workout in every morning.

Jin - What is your religion?
Christianity.  He then gives a basic, boring speech about what that means.

Jer - Why did you move to LA, how has it been for your family?  Is it drawing you closer or is it hard?
She say they moved primarily because Jeremy is going to start seminary.
She says they both felt "pressed" to move to LA.
He has just started and has had his first week of classes.
He says it's a lot of reading. She says lots of learning Greek coming up.
She says it's been really smooth adjusting to living in LA.
The hardest part was packing up and "selling" everything in Laredo. (???)
Jer says he didn't think they could get any closer. The move has been a bonding experience.
 

[louannems]

I've never had a problem with the sound on my tablet.  But the Q & A, both part 1 and 2 have been SO soft.  I have to put the speaker to my ear just to barely hear it.

Someone did ask if they ever have disagreements and Jinger said lots of times, but never on the big things.  They just talk through it and she said Jeremy is a really good listener.  

[BetyBee]

Did they throw the questions on the floor like they did in part 1?  I found that annoying.

[ginger90]

3 minutes ago, BetyBee said:

Did they throw the questions on the floor like they did in part 1?  I found that annoying.

Yes they did. 

[Sew Sumi]

3 minutes ago, BetyBee said:

Did they throw the questions on the floor like they did in part 1?  I found that annoying.

That would be affirmative.

[Churchhoney]

14 minutes ago, BetyBee said:

Did they throw the questions on the floor like they did in part 1?  I found that annoying.

I know that, in truth, that means nothing.

But if you're a person who's asked one of those questions, or someone a little insecure or shy who admires them and might think of asking a question, that's very likely to feel slightly disrespectful and offputting, even if unconsciously. If you're really serious about projecting a great image to the public, you quickly learn that little things mean a lot and you don't do stuff like that. 

Especially true for an aspiring spiritual leader. You gotta up your appearance-of-empathy game, Jer. 

And I assume they're doing this at least partly to practice public presentations. That's the kind of thing that needs work. 

Edited August 17, 2019 by Churchhoney

[Westiepeach]

Totally over them. They think they are all that. They are not. 

[BitterApple]

11 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

I know that, in truth, that means nothing.

But if you're a person who's asked one of those questions, or someone a little insecure or shy who admires them and might think of asking a question, that's very likely to feel slightly disrespectful and offputting, even if unconsciously. If you're really serious about projecting a great image to the public, you quickly learn that little things mean a lot and you don't do stuff like that. 

Especially true for an aspiring spiritual leader. You gotta up your appearance-of-empathy game, Jer. 

And I assume they're doing this at least partly to practice public presentations. That's the kind of thing that needs work. 

I agree. Imagine Oprah or Ellen interviewing someone and casually flicking their note cards to the ground after each question. It's a dismissive gesture and doesn't come off well to the audience. For someone who aspires to life as a public figure, Jeremy is completely tone deaf.

Edited August 17, 2019 by BitterApple

[fonfereksglen]

20 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

I agree. Imagine Oprah or Ellen interviewing someone and casually flicking their note cards to the ground after each question. It's a dismissive gesture and doesn't come off well to the audience. For someone who aspires to life as a public figure, Jeremy is completely tone deaf.

Much like Kate Gosselin on her show when she answered questions from fans.  Dismissive in the extreme.

[xwordfanatik]

Even Sister Wives Kootie and the Gang weren't that disrespectful on their Q & A episodes.

JereMe must be exhausting to cope with.  Jin is already showing forced smiles and slightly crazy eyes a la Michelle, IMO.  

[Zella]

Oh my God if Jeremy is going to be learning Greek for seminary, I think we all need to brace ourselves for the avalanche of pretension that will surely follow! 

[farmgal4]

2 hours ago, louannems said:

I've never had a problem with the sound on my tablet.  But the Q & A, both part 1 and 2 have been SO soft.  I have to put the speaker to my ear just to barely hear it.

Someone did ask if they ever have disagreements and Jinger said lots of times, but never on the big things.  They just talk through it and she said Jeremy is a really good listener.  

I’m glad he’s a good listener, because he’s certainly not a good talker.  The last thing he needs is a career doing anything that requires him to talk/speak, because he sucks at it IMO.

Edited August 18, 2019 by farmgal4
Reworded a sentence.

[Sew Sumi]

Ironically, he thinks he's all that and loves the sound of his own voice. He's delusional.

Edited August 18, 2019 by Sew Sumi

[BigBingerBro]

After thinking about it a while, these Q&A videos are rather strange.  I know they are trying to come off as unrehearsed, but we all know the questions were deliberately selected in advance.  I'd like to know if the "What is your religion?" question was for real or just a lame attempt at inserting a statement of faith into this.  If it was for real, these fans are pretty stupid.  I really thought that Jer's inability to name a favorite movie he's shared with Jinger pretty telling.  I could just imagine his brain cells swirling trying to come up with something that would be respectable yet popular, but he couldn't.  

[galaxychaser]

2 hours ago, Westiepeach said:

Totally over them. They think they are all that. They are not. 

But...but...Jesus loves them the most because they are special... $85 pocket square says so

[Ohiopirate02]

1 hour ago, BigBingerBro said:

After thinking about it a while, these Q&A videos are rather strange.  I know they are trying to come off as unrehearsed, but we all know the questions were deliberately selected in advance.  I'd like to know if the "What is your religion?" question was for real or just a lame attempt at inserting a statement of faith into this.  If it was for real, these fans are pretty stupid.  I really thought that Jer's inability to name a favorite movie he's shared with Jinger pretty telling.  I could just imagine his brain cells swirling trying to come up with something that would be respectable yet popular, but he couldn't.  

I think Jeremy's inability to answer that question is not all that deep.  He doesn't want to admit to their fans that his favorite movie is something very secular.  Whatever his favorite movie is he doesn't want to let them know he loves something that could be controversial.   He knows it should be something Christian in nature,  but its probably Scarface or a raunchy comedy.   Dude needs to think about this question and have another option for these types of situations.   I don't admit my love of Blazing Saddles to everyone, I answer My Fair Lady when the need arises. 

[Zella]

5 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

 I don't admit my love of Blazing Saddles to everyone, I answer My Fair Lady when the need arises. 

LOL I sidestep this quandary by asking matter-of-factly what genre of favorite movie they want to know about. 

I think Mr. Smooth needs to learn some better stalling tactics and canned answers. You'd think after being a pastor for a few years that he already had a safe answer for a favorite movie question memorized. 😄

Edited August 18, 2019 by Zella

[latetotheparty]

2 hours ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

I think Jeremy's inability to answer that question is not all that deep.  He doesn't want to admit to their fans that his favorite movie is something very secular.  Whatever his favorite movie is he doesn't want to let them know he loves something that could be controversial.   He knows it should be something Christian in nature,  but its probably Scarface or a raunchy comedy.   Dude needs to think about this question and have another option for these types of situations.   I don't admit my love of Blazing Saddles to everyone, I answer My Fair Lady when the need arises. 

I love love love the music in My Fair Lady but I can’t deal with sexism/classism of the story anymore. Dammit. I do love Blazing Sadles; it’s so ridiculous. Rear Window is my favorite movie.  

[GeeGolly]

I'm guessing a follower is not going to be bothered by a question, that was either retyped, written out or printed out, that was tossed on the ground. If they really cared at all, I think they'd be pleased their question was answered. I'm guessing they might not even have strong feelings about their question being answered.

With SM it's easy to be a 'fan' of anyone these days. It's not like in the past where you'd have to hand write a letter, address a envelope, put a stamp on it and mail it. 

Jinger may have a million or so followers, but we know they're not all fans. I'm thinking very few really give Jinger and Jeremy much thought, throughout their daily lives.

Edited August 18, 2019 by GeeGolly

[floridamom]

I watched Part 2 of the Q & A. I noticed Jeremy was disrespectful and snickered at Jinger's pre-marriage "organized sports' experience with broomball. I think he really doesn't like the Duggars and their sub-standard NW Arkansas lifestyle at all. Responding that they are "Christian" - didn't answer the question, I believe the person inquired about what denomination they are; everyone on the planet knows they are 'Christian'. Didn't answer that one either, really. Neither of them responded to the camera; they looked at each other when answering. Not good body language. Jinger says first that they 'packed up everything', then she goes on to say they 'sold everything'. Which is it? She is wearing a sleeveless summer dress with no stockings; Jeremy is wearing long pants with a long sleeved polo shirt. Do they live in the same place? He's dressed for autumn, she's dressed for summer. 7 minutes wasted.

[Churchhoney]

6 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

I'm guessing a follower is not going to be bothered by a question, that was either retyped, written out or printed out, that was tossed on the ground. If they really cared at all, I think they'd be pleased their question was answered. I'm guessing they might not even have strong feelings about their question being answered.

With SM it's easy to be a 'fan' of anyone these days. It's not like in the past where you'd have to hand write a letter, address a envelope, put a stamp on it and mail it. 

Jinger may have a million or so followers, but we know they're not all fans. I'm thinking very few really give Jinger and Jeremy much thought, throughout their daily lives.

You're absolutely right about this, of course.....But I don't think either Jer and Jingle, or MacArthur, are fully aware of it...or of its ramifications. Jer and MacArthur, at least, seem to have some notion that these high numbers are their ticket to ride. Maybe I'm crazy, but I think Jer sees himself on the road to real fame and influence. He does think he's all that -- and some of that feeling comes from these numbers.

It's clear from interviews he gave during his soccer years that he aspired to major fame as a top-flight athlete who was also an influential conservative Christian. And his current demeanor says to me that he now has some idea his dream of fame is coming true. So, uh, rude awakening potentially coming up. 

My feeling about the tossing stuff on the ground and such is this: If these are your gestures when you're on camera like this, you're almost certainly going to do perhaps subtler but similarly dismissive things when you're in front of people in real life. Because these gestures come naturally to you and it doesn't occur to you to question them. And we know exactly what he intends to do for a living -- speak and be the spiritual leader of a group, a large one. He plans to be revered and looked up to for his great wisdom and public presence. And there it is going to matter.

Since I'm pretty sure these little sessions are at least partly intended to be practice for his future career out in front of the crowd, if he had any idea that details of his demeanor need scrutiny and perhaps revision to do well there, we ought to see him making some thoughtful choices about that in the videos.

He's over 30 years old and he's in academia preparing for this career.....Nobody can tell me that some guys in similar situations aren't carefully perfecting their personas, presentation styles and all the details relevant to being top speakers at this very moment.

But we don't see him doing that. He's clearly clueless about how his demeanor may come off to people. He's acting like a careless child about the whole "preparation to be a lifelong public speaker" thing, seems to me. I think he could be in for a rude awakening there, too, down the line. 

Edited August 18, 2019 by Churchhoney

[Portia]

1 hour ago, floridamom said:

I watched Part 2 of the Q & A. I noticed Jeremy was disrespectful and snickered at Jinger's pre-marriage "organized sports' experience with broomball. I think he really doesn't like the Duggars and their sub-standard NW Arkansas lifestyle at all. Responding that they are "Christian" - didn't answer the question, I believe the person inquired about what denomination they are; everyone on the planet knows they are 'Christian'. Didn't answer that one either, really.

......

She is wearing a sleeveless summer dress with no stockings; Jeremy is wearing long pants with a long sleeved polo shirt. Do they live in the same place? He's dressed for autumn, she's dressed for summer.

i agree that the fan was likely wanting to know the Vuolos' denomination but used the wrong terminology. Jin and Jer probably thought they were being awfully clever sidestepping that question, and interpreting the question literally afforded them a perfect opportunity to "share the gospel."

As for the weight of their outfits, I can't bring myself to nitpick at that level. I wear long pants/leggings and sweaters (indoors) in the oppressive Alabama summer heat because I'm cold-natured and there's AC everywhere. My husband's like a human space heater. It'd be stupid to match our outfits by "season."  I expect the Vuolos didn't give it a second thought. 

Edited August 18, 2019 by Portia

[zenme]

4 minutes ago, Portia said:

As for the weight of their outfits, I can't bring myself to nitpick at that level. I wear long pants/leggings and sweaters (indoors) in the oppressive Alabama summer heat because I'm cold-natured and there's AC everywhere. My husband's like a human space heater. It'd be stupid to match our outfits by "season."  I expect the Vuolos didn't give it a second thought. 

When I lived in Southern California, I recall the weather being such that one could wear shorts or a sweater in all seasons and be perfectly comfortable. I love California weather!

[DangerousMinds]

5 hours ago, floridamom said:

I watched Part 2 of the Q & A. I noticed Jeremy was disrespectful and snickered at Jinger's pre-marriage "organized sports' experience with broomball. I think he really doesn't like the Duggars and their sub-standard NW Arkansas lifestyle at all. Responding that they are "Christian" - didn't answer the question, I believe the person inquired about what denomination they are; everyone on the planet knows they are 'Christian'. Didn't answer that one either, really. Neither of them responded to the camera; they looked at each other when answering. Not good body language. Jinger says first that they 'packed up everything', then she goes on to say they 'sold everything'. Which is it? She is wearing a sleeveless summer dress with no stockings; Jeremy is wearing long pants with a long sleeved polo shirt. Do they live in the same place? He's dressed for autumn, she's dressed for summer. 7 minutes wasted.

WHY can they not answer the question about their denomination? That’s just ridiculous.

[Temperance]

44 minutes ago, DangerousMinds said:

WHY can they not answer the question about their denomination? That’s just ridiculous.

IIRC, Michelle and JB have always cagey about their denomination on television, press interviews, etc. Not sure why. 

[jcbrown]

17 minutes ago, Temperance said:

IIRC, Michelle and JB have always cagey about their denomination on television, press interviews, etc. Not sure why. 

Because admitting on camera that they belong to a patriarchal cult is a bad look? Just another facet of their hypocrisy. If you're so proud of your super specialness and so much better than the rest of the heathens, why not own it?

[farmgal4]

3 hours ago, DangerousMinds said:

WHY can they not answer the question about their denomination? That’s just ridiculous.

Maybe because their church is non-denominational, or because they don’t want to admit being one religion (Baptist) and risk losing the fans from a different religion (Church of Christ).  I used Baptist/Church of Christ as examples only.

[Oldernowiser]

5 minutes ago, farmgal4 said:

Maybe because their church is non-denominational, or because they don’t want to admit being one religion (Baptist) and risk losing the fans from a different religion (Church of Christ).  I used Baptist/Church of Christ as examples only.

And thanks to Google, it’s a very short path to Gothard and his ministry of weirdness and perversion and Duggars are too gutless and hypocritical to stand up for that.

[Churchhoney]

1 hour ago, Oldernowiser said:

And thanks to Google, it’s a very short path to Gothard and his ministry of weirdness and perversion and Duggars are too gutless and hypocritical to stand up for that.

The Ministry of Weirdness and Perversion. 😀🤣😈

Is that somewhere near Diagon Alley? 

Edited August 18, 2019 by Churchhoney

[Christina87]

On 8/17/2019 at 4:00 PM, cmr2014 said:

There are red flags all over this guy's post. I hope that this girl runs far far away before any wedding. All that "support" for her career is going to dry up 20 seconds after "I do."

I could be completely wrong, I don't know these people at all -- I didn't even see them on American Idol. Still, if I had a daughter and she showed this to me and told me how Cade "worshipped" his girlfriend, I'd point her immediately to the endless narrative accounts of women whose boyfriends were so over-the-top "in love" with them before they were married and turned abusive before the ink was dry on the marriage license.

Late to the party, but yes, the red flags are everywhere!!! Singing is a career that you can have and balance with a family well! It's not like she'd have to be at the office from 9-5, dumping her kids off at the Little Tykes Daycare down the street (nothing wrong with that, but they think there is). I see no reason why she couldn't write and practice songs at home with her kids, and the help of a nanny, since they could afford that. There would be long hours in the studio, but that would hardly be every day, and tours / appearances. When the kids are young, she could likely take the kids and nanny along for a lot of it, and it would be a fun time for all!

i just have zero idea why someone who went on American idol and finally got her dream would give that up! She would be smart to strike while the iron's hot. If she were a school music teacher, she could take a break and then come back, but no one is going to be interested in her recording an album in 20 years. I really, really hope this dipshit doesn't hold her back. She deserves to spend as much time on her career as she wants! She could easily remain childless for ten years and enjoy her career, before retiring to raise kids. However, she absolutely does not need to quit to become a young mom and stay home! She'll regret that forever. 

[galaxygirl76]

So he's playing golf now, that's so unexpected  /sarcasm

[Lisa418722]

I'll give Jer a break on his "Christian" comment.   I go to a non-denominational Christian church and on a first date one time a guy asked about my religion.  I did say that I was a Chrisitan and he got huffy with me "we're ALL Christians."  Then I added that the church I go to is a non-denominational Christian church and he just rolled his eyes at me.  That was the first and last date.   

But the Duggars and Jeremy probably don't want to say they are Baptist (an example only since we don't know for sure) because there are different "sects" of the Baptist Church.  I grew up Southern Baptist, but I know a church I used to go to wanted to leave the Southern Baptist Convention because of the SBC's policies.  I think at the time it was boycotting Disney for some reason - I don't remember.  This church was full of families and they didn't want to tell their members not to take their families to Disney.