The Duggalos: Jinger and the Holy Goalie

[Madtown]

I know many of us can't stand Jeremy and pretty much think he's douche, but at least Jinger isn't sitting at home 24/7 with a million kids. Considering he's a "pastor", she's not at home doing nothing but reading the bible and watching church sermons. She's far from the TT house and seems to be expereincing a little more to life. I'd take her life over most of the Duggar girls, any day of the week.

[BitterApple]

2 hours ago, Madtown said:

I know many of us can't stand Jeremy and pretty much think he's douche, but at least Jinger isn't sitting at home 24/7 with a million kids. Considering he's a "pastor", she's not at home doing nothing but reading the bible and watching church sermons. She's far from the TT house and seems to be expereincing a little more to life. I'd take her life over most of the Duggar girls, any day of the week.

True, but notice how everything is centered around Jeremy's interests. Soccer games, men's clothing stores, shmoozing with the higher-ups at GCC. It doesn't seem like they do many Jinger-related activities or at least their social media isn't reflecting it. 

[Jeeves]

1 minute ago, BitterApple said:

True, but notice how everything is centered around Jeremy's interests. Soccer games, men's clothing stores, shmoozing with the higher-ups at GCC. It doesn't seem like they do many Jinger-related activities or at least their social media isn't reflecting it. 

Well, he's the headship, so . . .

[Dirndl]

2 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

True, but notice how everything is centered around Jeremy's interests. Soccer games, men's clothing stores, shmoozing with the higher-ups at GCC. It doesn't seem like they do many Jinger-related activities or at least their social media isn't reflecting it. 

But what would Jinger want to do? The way she grew up, I don't think she has a favorite sport activity or interest in art, nature whatever. Jeremy, however, has different interests and hobbies, so I don't think that it's strange that they do these things. Personally, I don't believe Jeremy would say no if Jinger wanted to go to a museum, arts show, the zoo, etc. Maybe it takes a little bit more time, meeting more and different people for Jinger to develop her own interests. And as a female soccer fan myself I think she very much enjoyed visiting the soccer games or watching her husband play.

[Madtown]

1 minute ago, Dirndl said:

But what would Jinger want to do? The way she grew up, I don't think she has a favorite sport activity or interest in art, nature whatever. Jeremy, however, has different interests and hobbies, so I don't think that it's strange that they do these things. Personally, I don't believe Jeremy would say no if Jinger wanted to go to a museum, arts show, the zoo, etc. Maybe it takes a little bit more time, meeting more and different people for Jinger to develop her own interests. And as a female soccer fan myself I think she very much enjoyed visiting the soccer games or watching her husband play.

YES! I was just typing something similar in response. I was going to say that maybe now that they are in LA, there will be more things Jinger will take interest in that are more suited for HER. We saw a lot of changes in her before Felicity was born with her clothing. I remember a lot of us freaking out at the first picture of Jinger in jeans.

I can honestly say that I have taken in A LOT  more of Mr.Madtown's interests in our 29 years together. We do have a lot of similar interests where I think most women would think I just ran with his to be more connected with him and that's the farthest from the truth.

[heckkitty]

47 minutes ago, Dirndl said:

But what would Jinger want to do? The way she grew up, I don't think she has a favorite sport activity or interest in art, nature whatever. Jeremy, however, has different interests and hobbies, so I don't think that it's strange that they do these things. Personally, I don't believe Jeremy would say no if Jinger wanted to go to a museum, arts show, the zoo, etc. Maybe it takes a little bit more time, meeting more and different people for Jinger to develop her own interests. And as a female soccer fan myself I think she very much enjoyed visiting the soccer games or watching her husband play.

Well, she’s interested in photography. & he’s interested in having his picture taken so they’re perfect for each other. 

[PradaKitty]

She likes thrift store shopping. Maybe she can hit some consignment stores with Jeremy. (FANCY consignment stores). 

[lookeyloo]

Maybe for now, everything is new to Jinger so she is enjoying all the experiences.  When we travel and are asked what we want to see, we say, it is all new to us, so anything is good.  Then later we can decide on specifics.  She said she wanted to live in a city, and just being there might be enough for her, for now.  She also has her photography which she seems to enjoy, whether taking pictures of Jeremy and Felicity is going to be enough for her, time will tell.  

[fonfereksglen]

1 minute ago, lookeyloo said:

Maybe for now, everything is new to Jinger so she is enjoying all the experiences.  When we travel and are asked what we want to see, we say, it is all new to us, so anything is good.  Then later we can decide on specifics.  She said she wanted to live in a city, and just being there might be enough for her, for now.  She also has her photography which she seems to enjoy, whether taking pictures of Jeremy and Felicity is going to be enough for her, time will tell.  

I'm pretty sure it was posted here when JerJer announced the big move so he could attend the seminary, that Jing would be required to attend classes or meetings or training of some sort to learn how to be a proper pastor's wife.  Something she didn't have a clue about in Laredo.  

[lookeyloo]

Just now, fonfereksglen said:

I'm pretty sure it was posted here when JerJer announced the big move so he could attend the seminary, that Jing would be required to attend classes or meetings or training of some sort to learn how to be a proper pastor's wife.  Something she didn't have a clue about in Laredo.  

I guess time will tell - she might enjoy it.  Or not.  

[leighdear]

8 hours ago, Dirndl said:

But what would Jinger want to do? The way she grew up, I don't think she has a favorite sport activity or interest in art, nature whatever. Jeremy, however, has different interests and hobbies, so I don't think that it's strange that they do these things. Personally, I don't believe Jeremy would say no if Jinger wanted to go to a museum, arts show, the zoo, etc. Maybe it takes a little bit more time, meeting more and different people for Jinger to develop her own interests. And as a female soccer fan myself I think she very much enjoyed visiting the soccer games or watching her husband play.

They actually DO go to museums, the ballet, musical concerts, etc.  Things Jinger has always expressed an interest in.  But many of those venues don't allow "action" photos to be taken in the theaters or halls the way photos can be taken in sports stadiums, etc. 

Plus, with Felicity, there is more of a focus on things that can be entertaining for an almost-toddler.  Most symphony orchestra recitals frown on attendance by the under-2 set.  

Edited July 8, 2019 by leighdear

[Lunera]

A leghumper on Instagram paid for a personalized message from Jinger. She didn't post the video just screenshots.

3 pictures 

Edited July 8, 2019 by Lunera

[Zella]

45 minutes ago, leighdear said:

They actually DO go to museums, the ballet, musical concerts, etc.  Things Jinger has always expressed an interest in.  But many of those venues don't allow "action" photos to be taken in the theaters or halls the way photos can be taken in sports stadiums, etc. 

Plus, with Felicity, there is more of a focus on things that can be entertaining for an almost-toddler.  Most symphony orchestra recitals frown on attendance by the under-2 set.  

How do you know they go to things like museums, ballet, concerts, etc? Not trying to be argumentative--if they do, that's great. Just curious how you know. 

[Sew Sumi]

They went to a concert in Philly once, pre-baby.

[Zella]

5 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

They went to a concert in Philly once, pre-baby.

I can definitely see/believe them doing those things once, but I have a hard time believing it is something they do regularly without it being documented.

Especially as pretentious and preening as Jeremy is. Can totally see him dolled up in one of his fancy suits and pocket squares, backed up against his busts and books, taking a selfie with the mrs, captioned "Headed out for a night at the ballet!" 

Though, truth be told, the fundies I know are quite offended by how much male anatomy you see in ballet. LOL Like I mentioned liking ballet once and was informed by numerous fundies that the ballet made them quite uncomfortable for that reason. 

Edited July 8, 2019 by Zella

[DangerousMinds]

1 hour ago, Zella said:

How do you know they go to things like museums, ballet, concerts, etc? Not trying to be argumentative--if they do, that's great. Just curious how you know. 

I don’t recall Jinger ever expressly mentioning interest in these things either.

[Zella]

1 minute ago, DangerousMinds said:

I don’t recall Jinger ever expressly mentioning interest in these things either.

Yeah the only hobby I really associate Jinger expressing an interest in is photography. 

Edited July 8, 2019 by Zella

[OpieTaylor]

She posted some pics from the Getty Center museum. It was on one of their LA visits before they moved there. And I think maybe they’ve shown a museum visit in San Antonio?

Edited July 8, 2019 by OpieTaylor

[Churchhoney]

10 hours ago, Lunera said:

A leghumper on Instagram paid for a personalized message from Jinger. She didn't post the video just screenshots.

3 pictures 

Okay, I'm depressed as hell that she's dragging Felicity into this. (no surprise there, probably... lol)

To me, this is right up there with making kids hug and kiss people they don't want to hug and kiss. In a way it could even be worse -- leading a toddler to believe it's a good idea to sell her (fake) "friendship," for money, to online strangers, about whom you know absolutely nothing except that those strangers profess to love you.

And, yes, I do think Jingle's a caring mom and a person of good will who has absolutely no bad intent in doing this. However, in my view she's now following completely -- though unwittingly, I'm sure -- in the steps of her crap parents, who sold their children's personal lives for fame, influence for their cult, and, mostly,  money. 

Hideous. 

And all of Mark Zuckerberg's wildest dreams and ambitions have now been accomplished, apparently. Very unfortunate for us all, in my opinion 

Edited July 8, 2019 by Churchhoney

[latetotheparty]

57 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

Okay, I'm depressed as hell that she's dragging Felicity into this. (no surprise there, probably... lol)

To me, this is right up there with making kids hug and kiss people they don't want to hug and kiss. In a way it could even be worse -- leading a toddler to believe it's a good idea to sell her (fake) "friendship," for money, to online strangers, about whom you know absolutely nothing except that those strangers profess to love you.

And, yes, I do think Jingle's a caring mom and a person of good will who has absolutely no bad intent in doing this. However, in my view she's now following completely -- though unwittingly, I'm sure -- in the steps of her crap parents, who sold their children's personal lives for fame, influence for their cult, and, mostly,  money. 

Hideous. 

And all of Mark Zuckerberg's wildest dreams and ambitions have now been accomplished, apparently. Very unfortunate for us all, in my opinion 

Co-signed. And Felicity looks so over it. 

[heckkitty]

1 hour ago, Churchhoney said:

Okay, I'm depressed as hell that she's dragging Felicity into this. (no surprise there, probably... lol)

To me, this is right up there with making kids hug and kiss people they don't want to hug and kiss. In a way it could even be worse -- leading a toddler to believe it's a good idea to sell her (fake) "friendship," for money, to online strangers, about whom you know absolutely nothing except that those strangers profess to love you.

And, yes, I do think Jingle's a caring mom and a person of good will who has absolutely no bad intent in doing this. However, in my view she's now following completely -- though unwittingly, I'm sure -- in the steps of her crap parents, who sold their children's personal lives for fame, influence for their cult, and, mostly,  money. 

Hideous. 

And all of Mark Zuckerberg's wildest dreams and ambitions have now been accomplished, apparently. Very unfortunate for us all, in my opinion 

I can’t figure out if I’m more depressed over all of this, or that people think it’s just dandy to throw away 60 bucks for having complete stranger & her kid send a video of the kid miserably waving to them. 

[Churchhoney]

11 minutes ago, heckkitty said:

I can’t figure out if I’m more depressed over all of this, or that people think it’s just dandy to throw away 60 bucks for having complete stranger & her kid send a video of the kid miserably waving to them. 

Yep. 

I guess you could see it as a bargain? Cause I notice it's $550 for Charlie Sheen to send you a message. 

[Jeeves]

I suppose I'm the outlier here. But I can't get my knickers in a twist about Jinger's making money with that Cameo thing or having Felicity on camera with her. It's better, and with a more direct payday, than shilling cheap clothing at inflated prices. 

Of course it's possible that someone will prank her, or try to. I think Jeremy's savvy enough to head off anything like that, and I can't see her agreeing to make any shout-outs without checking with him first. 

I also don't think that many leghumpers have sixty bucks to spare for a Jinger shout-out.

The kid isn't old enough to have a clue about this, except Mommy's holding her and they are talking to the camera. 

[xwordfanatik]

I can't fathom sending any "celebrity" money for a message that means essentially nothing.  What a world.

Jin using Felicity in this manner is just how she and her siblings were paraded around like show ponies by their shitty parents.  I agree that Jin seems to be a caring mother, but this just strikes me as all kinds of wrong.  Strange days, indeed.  

[BitterApple]

I agree with all the above. If Jinger wants to dance like a circus bear for easy cash, fine whatever, but leave the kid out of it. 

[Churchhoney]

15 minutes ago, Jeeves said:

I suppose I'm the outlier here. But I can't get my knickers in a twist about Jinger's making money with that Cameo thing or having Felicity on camera with her. It's better, and with a more direct payday, than shilling cheap clothing at inflated prices. 

Of course it's possible that someone will prank her, or try to. I think Jeremy's savvy enough to head off anything like that, and I can't see her agreeing to make any shout-outs without checking with him first. 

I also don't think that many leghumpers have sixty bucks to spare for a Jinger shout-out.

The kid isn't old enough to have a clue about this, except Mommy's holding her and they are talking to the camera. 

Well, as everybody knows by now, I'm the Internet-privacy nut around here. So I expect I'm more of the outlier, in fact! 

I'm also a nut when it comes to this thing I feel I've learned (again and again) both from my family life and my professional life:      Kids from birth through young-adulthood sometimes take huge lessons and arrive at huge conclusions from tiny things their parents (and even their teachers and other adult caregivers like grandparents and coaches) do and say. Things that you, as the adult, didn't even notice you said or did, didn't give a second thought to if you did register it, and never in a million years thought the kid would notice, remember or -- least of all -- conclude anything from or act upon.

So obviously this incident, like some others, hits a couple of my very big buttons.

As is often true, it'll be nice if I'm wrong! 

Edited July 8, 2019 by Churchhoney

[Jeeves]

@Churchhoney, you're not a nut! I respect your position and even share many of your concerns about privacy and exploitation of kids. 

As to Jinger's foray into the shout-out thing? IMO if Jeremy gets an inkling it would be bad for his future as MacArthur's golden child, he'll shut it down in a hot minute. 

[Churchhoney]

4 minutes ago, Jeeves said:

@Churchhoney, you're not a nut! I respect your position and even share many of your concerns about privacy and exploitation of kids. 

As to Jinger's foray into the shout-out thing? IMO if Jeremy gets an inkling it would be bad for his future as MacArthur's golden child, he'll shut it down in a hot minute. 

Very good point!

[louannems]

On 7/6/2019 at 10:10 PM, Lunera said:

Little Felicity is developing the prominent Duggar girl chin.  She is so cute.

[lascuba]

I just...can't imagine being a fan of anyone so much that I would pay for something like this. Seriously, what can possibly be so thrilling about a "shout-out" THAT YOU HAD TO PAY FOR?! Explain it to me like I'm 5.

I don't even have a problem with Jinger doing this...get your money girl (just don't ever bitch about lack of privacy or weird fans, because with the reality tv gig and now this, it's what you deserve). It's the fact that the market exists for this that bugs the shit out of me.

[Zella]

3 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

Cause I notice it's $550 for Charlie Sheen to send you a message. 

I just can't get over this! I mean, I actually used to like Charlie Sheen before he took the fast train to Crazy Town, but that's just insane.

Also an interesting insight into the hierarchy of Z-level celebrities. I wonder who sets these prices. Because obviously Jingle isn't valued as highly as Private Chris Taylor. 😂

[Oldernowiser]

I would pay Charlie Sheen to NOT send me a message.

[PradaKitty]

Ginger looks really cute in those screenshots, though. 

[Zella]

7 minutes ago, Oldernowiser said:

I would pay Charlie Sheen to NOT send me a message.

😂😂😂

[Lunera]

So far she has done 7 " shout outs" in about a week. At 60 bucks a piece that's a good chunk of change, enough to pay their rent in LA each month. Of course, the novelty of it will wear off eventually.

You can watch the videos here. 

https://www.cameo.com/jingervuolo

I just had a thought that Jinger would make tons of money being a web cam girl but instead of doing the usual kinky stuff she could just sit in front of the camera and read the bible. Tons of leghumpers and weirdos would pay to see that.

[Natalie68]

1 hour ago, lascuba said:

I just...can't imagine being a fan of anyone so much that I would pay for something like this. Seriously, what can possibly be so thrilling about a "shout-out" THAT YOU HAD TO PAY FOR?! Explain it to me like I'm 5.

I don't even have a problem with Jinger doing this...get your money girl (just don't ever bitch about lack of privacy or weird fans, because with the reality tv gig and now this, it's what you deserve). It's the fact that the market exists for this that bugs the shit out of me.

I would pay $60 if I could tell Josh exactly what I think of him.  

[doodlebug]

1 hour ago, Zella said:

I just can't get over this! I mean, I actually used to like Charlie Sheen before he took the fast train to Crazy Town, but that's just insane.

Also an interesting insight into the hierarchy of Z-level celebrities. I wonder who sets these prices. Because obviously Jingle isn't valued as highly as Private Chris Taylor. 😂

I'm from Cleveland, so I wouldn't mind a shout out from Ricky 'Wild Thing' Vaughn.  Not for $550 though.

[Churchhoney]

2 hours ago, lascuba said:

I just...can't imagine being a fan of anyone so much that I would pay for something like this. Seriously, what can possibly be so thrilling about a "shout-out" THAT YOU HAD TO PAY FOR?! Explain it to me like I'm 5.

I don't even have a problem with Jinger doing this...get your money girl (just don't ever bitch about lack of privacy or weird fans, because with the reality tv gig and now this, it's what you deserve). It's the fact that the market exists for this that bugs the shit out of me.

Well, in my opinion it shows the sick "relationship" way too many people are getting with "celebrities" online and with the online world in general.

In many cases, they may idiotically idolize people they don't know from a hole in the ground and who quite often are simply famous for being famous and not worth idolizing in the least.

And in this particular farcical program, buyers certainly imagine some kind of emotional connection with these people (unless they're sending one to somebody as a joke, which I can imagine as kinda making sense -- although I doubt that makes up very much of their business)......Because clearly the point is to give the recipient (whether it's you or somebody else) a little special thrill. 

The depressing thing about that, to me, is that people must be paying for some kind of real emotional thrill (because, otherwise, WHY would you pay?). But what they're getting is clearly just pro forma crap from somebody who couldn't pick you out of a lineup and is doing it for money. 

I'd call it paying an emotional prostitute. Shows the deep social isolation a lot of people are apparently feeling in the internet age, seems to me. 

Why else would you do it except for an emotional charge? And if someone pays someone else for a minute of canned speech to give them an emotional charge because that person is famous (or vaguely famous) and you've seen their face in two dimensions on a screen, I find that transaction deeply depressing. 

Edited July 8, 2019 by Churchhoney

[Churchhoney]

1 hour ago, Lunera said:

I just had a thought that Jinger would make tons of money being a web cam girl but instead of doing the usual kinky stuff she could just sit in front of the camera and read the bible. Tons of leghumpers and weirdos would pay to see that.

I'd much rather she did this than what she's doing now. At least she wouldn't be passing out birthday wishes and such, which are phony, fake, and meaningless because she doesn't know these people and she's doing it for money. 

If she read the bible, at least nobody would be imagining in their sad lonely heads that Jingle actually knows them and is speaking to them. 

Edited July 8, 2019 by Churchhoney

[Suzn]

8 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

Well, in my opinion it shows the sick "relationship" way too many people are getting with "celebrities" online and with the online world in general.

In many cases, they may idiotically idolize people they don't know from a hole in the ground and who quite often are simply famous for being famous and not worth idolizing in the least.

And in this particular farcical program, buyers certainly imagine some kind of emotional connection with these people (unless they're sending one to somebody as a joke, I suppose) -- because clearly the point is to give the recipient (whether it's you or somebody else) a little special thrill. 

And the depressing thing about that, to me, is that people must be paying for some kind of real emotional thrill (because, otherwise, WHY would you pay?) when what they're getting is clearly just pro forma crap from somebody who couldn't pick you out of a lineup and is doing it for money. 

I'd call it paying an emotional prostitute. Shows the deep social isolation a lot of people are apparently feeling in the internet age, seems to me. 

Why else would you do it except for an emotional charge? And if someone pays someone else for a minute of canned speech to give them an emotional charge because that person is famous (or vaguely famous) and you've seen their face in two dimensions on a screen, I find that transaction deeply depressing. 

Brilliant!  I think you have identified something that is going deeply wrong.  People are increasingly living at a remove through social media and the celebrities they encounter there feel as "real" to them as people they have actually met.  For those who feel that they aren't experiencing anything unless in is on social media, the famous-for-being-famous are woven in like any other "experience".

[FizzyPuff]

2 hours ago, Lunera said:

So far she has done 7 " shout outs" in about a week. At 60 bucks a piece that's a good chunk of change, enough to pay their rent in LA each month. Of course, the novelty of it will wear off eventually.

You can watch the videos here. 

https://www.cameo.com/jingervuolo

I just had a thought that Jinger would make tons of money being a web cam girl but instead of doing the usual kinky stuff she could just sit in front of the camera and read the bible. Tons of leghumpers and weirdos would pay to see that.

I just watched one of the videos, felicity was screaming and making noise the whole time if I paid $60 for that I’d be pissed. 

[Barb23]

 How sad that the leghumpers who are shelling out $60 to get a Jinger Shoutout  probably cannot afford it.   I see it as throwing away $60. At least if they paid $60 for a dress from Citrus & Beans they would have something to show for it. 

ETA,  I just saw @Jeeves mentioned this already.

[fonfereksglen]

2 hours ago, Lunera said:

So far she has done 7 " shout outs" in about a week. At 60 bucks a piece that's a good chunk of change, enough to pay their rent in LA each month. Of course, the novelty of it will wear off eventually.

You can watch the videos here. 

https://www.cameo.com/jingervuolo

I just had a thought that Jinger would make tons of money being a web cam girl but instead of doing the usual kinky stuff she could just sit in front of the camera and read the bible. Tons of leghumpers and weirdos would pay to see that.

1.  I doubt they get the full 60.

2.  They better have a great accountant to properly deal with all the crazy 1099s from all these various ventures that will show up come tax time!   

[Churchhoney]

26 minutes ago, Barb23 said:

 How sad that the leghumpers who are shelling out $60 to get a Jinger Shoutout  probably cannot afford it.   I see it as throwing away $60. At least if they paid $60 for a dress from Citrus & Beans they would have something to show for it. 

ETA,  I just saw @Jeeves mentioned this already.

Well, I'm hoping that at least most of the buyers are people with enough money who see this as a way to throw a little cash toward Jingle and her family, whom they like and figure could use the cash. I don't feel very confident of that. But my Pollyanna side does think that's possible .... 

ETA: On the sad front, in the one video I watched all the way through, the recipient is a Californian who hopes that she and the Vuolos can become best friends. Jingle tries to both acknowledge this and gloss it over ... "Who knows? Maybe one day we'll run into you when we're out and about." 

Edited July 8, 2019 by Churchhoney

[Oldernowiser]

I would guess she’s getting maybe half of that $60...$180 doesn’t keep RFP in shoes.

I am kind of happy to hear Felicity actually screams on occasion.

[leighdear]

6 hours ago, louannems said:

Little Felicity is developing the prominent Duggar girl chin.  She is so cute.

That is probably one of the cutest photos ever, of anybody's baby.  

[Oldernowiser]

47 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

ETA: On the sad front, in the one video I watched all the way through, the recipient is a Californian who hopes that she and the Vuolos can become best friends. Jingle tries to both acknowledge this and gloss it over ... "Who knows? Maybe one day we'll run into you when we're out and about." 

Yikes. Both sad and creepy...

[gonecrackers]

3 hours ago, Lunera said:

You can watch the videos here. 

https://www.cameo.com/jingervuolo

Someone has to pay for all those ties.

Maybe it's just me but she always sounds like she's talking to preschoolers.  I couldn't take much more than a few seconds of a few before her voice was like nails on a chalkboard.

[Dimi1]

4 hours ago, lascuba said:

I just...can't imagine being a fan of anyone so much that I would pay for something like this. Seriously, what can possibly be so thrilling about a "shout-out" THAT YOU HAD TO PAY FOR?! Explain it to me like I'm 5.

I don't even have a problem with Jinger doing this...get your money girl (just don't ever bitch about lack of privacy or weird fans, because with the reality tv gig and now this, it's what you deserve). It's the fact that the market exists for this that bugs the shit out of me.

if sam hueghen charged 55$..I would have him ring me once a week ...as long as he did his Jaime Fraser voice!

[JoanArc]

4 hours ago, Lunera said:

I just had a thought that Jinger would make tons of money being a web cam girl but instead of doing the usual kinky stuff she could just sit in front of the camera and read the bible. Tons of leghumpers and weirdos would pay to see that.

Jinger Vuolo, modestly dressed prostitute.