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The Duggalos: Jinger and the Holy Goalie

frenchtoast

By frenchtoast
in Counting On

cm-soupsipper
Message added by cm-soupsipper,

Closure Notice: This Thread is now closed due to the name (and much of the posting within it). Please be mindful going forward by naming topics in a way that invites a healthy community conversation. If you name something for a cheap laugh, this thread may be closed later because it encourages discrimination and harm. 

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BitterApple

BitterApple

I think how you address your in-laws largely depends on your comfort level. I was raised very formally, so even after ten years with my husband, I still call my MIL "Mrs. Bitter Apple." However his brother's wife calls her "Mom" which would feel very awkward to me. Since Jill did more hands-on childcare than Jinger, she likely raised the Littles to address adults as "Miss So-and-So" and it's just what comes naturally to her.

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Spencer Hastings
Spencer Hastings

Tough crowd!  She's wearing modern shoes with closed toes, pants, and a shirt that literally calls back to her family's ridiculous rules and there are still 35 things wrong with what she's doing. 

Churchhoney
Churchhoney

That's okay. He's forgotten it a few times himself. 

GeeGolly
GeeGolly

My push presents after having my kids were my kids. 

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Lunera

Lunera

23 minutes ago, bigskygirl said:

Jessa and Jill are probably envious. The verdict is still out on Jana being envious. 

Of course Jana is envious. If Jessa would have told Jeremy, "I have a 26 year old sister named Jana who has a heart for the Lord" I believe he would have pursued Jana instead. Jana would be in Jinger's position and Jinger would have been married off to another local yokel.

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bigskygirl

bigskygirl

Hmmm.. I do not think Jana is that envious to the point she would have tried to get together with Jeremy if Jessa introduced her to Jeremy first. Some of us may think Jinger has the great life and marriage, but some of us thought the same thing about Jill and Derick at first. My verdict is still out until we see what happens when the baby comes. A handsome husband, four bedroom house, and better clothes may be all fine and dandy, but it does not make the marriage last or builds a strong relationship in the long run.

Marshmallow Mollie

Marshmallow Mollie

2 hours ago, Portia said:

Here are my thoughts on "Southern good manners" vis-à-vis forms of personal address. Others can feel free to chime in if they disagree.   :-D

Once a child is grown and no longer being coached by a parent ("Junior, say hello to Ms. Portia!"), the onus is on the older adult to tell the younger adult what to call them.  Personally, I think that the younger adult should defer to the wishes of the older adult. My kids' friends called me "Ms. Portia" when they were kids, but when they became young adults, there came a time when I began telling each of them, "Please call me Portia" because I was acknowledging that they were fellow adults and someone I considered to be a friend, not just the friend of my child. Personally, I'd feel a little insulted if one of my kids-in-law insisted on calling me "Ms. Portia" because that's much too formal for the close relationship I have with them.  But if they had called me Ms. Portia since meeting me, and there had never come a day when I asked them to call me only by my first name, I would not be surprised if they continued to append the "Ms." to my name. 

The added complication is that some Southerners were taught to NEVER address any adult older than themselves by first name only. Full stop.  But I think it depends entirely on the relationship and the wishes of the older party. If I meet a 70-something lady at a church social, I'm going to start out calling her "Ms. Lucille." But if she says, "Oh, honey, call me Lucille!", to me that translates to this: "I consider you a peer."  Some people just don't seem to be able to shake the polite form of address, though.  The senior pastor of my church is 20 years my junior, and he insists on calling me "Mrs. Lastname." I have asked him repeatedly to just call me by my first name, pointing out that we are all adults and that he and my husband are peers (serving on the same church staff). I have even gone so far as to say, "It makes me feel old when you call me that." But he just can't (or won't) shake the habit; it's just how he was raised, I suppose.  It's like nails on the chalkboard, and frankly I think it would be a lot more polite of him to observe my request, but I try not to let it bother me too much since he does it with everyone. 

So I guess my question is this: Do we know what the married Duggar girls' MILs have asked to be called? Do we have any evidence that Cathy said "Call me Cathy" but Jill just kept on adding the "Ms."?

I was going to say the same thing, but not even half as well as you did. 

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Arwen Evenstar

Arwen Evenstar

1 hour ago, Temperance said:

But Cathy is southern and Diana is Northern. They may call mom-in-law what she wants. 

It’s also cultural as well. My husband is Puerto Rican, and in their culture, sons or daughters in law refer to spouse’s parents  as usted instead of ti or tu.  He told me the more formal is almost always used without exception to show respect, regardless of how loving the relationship.  We adored one another.

He just calls my mom, Mom. She’s OK with it, since she’s the only surviving parent either of us has.

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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

Don't judge me but I made it 30+ years, until my MIL passed away without ever addressing her by name (except for in cards and such). She lived many miles from us but we visited with each other about 4 times a year and spoke on the phone often. It was actually quite easy for the most part, but every once in a while there would be an awkward moment when I would have to get up and walk in front of her to get her attention. I'm not sure she every noticed because she never said a thing to me or my husband. Cards, letters and gifts were always addresses to Mom, however I always signed my husbands name first. I found it era appropriate, but mildly insulting, when cards mailed to me from her were addressed to Mrs Huband's name Last name. Like Mrs Jeremy Vuolo.

I continue to call my parents friends Mrs or Mr if that's how I addressed them when I first met them. My children's friends have always called me Mrs Mom and still do. If I run into former teachers of mine I address them as Mr or Mrs still.

I'm guessing Jinger is the closest to her MIL because I think Mrs Vuolo is probably the most embracing of the MILs and Jinger isn't shy like Jessa or as clueless as Jill. If I remember correctly Anna was still calling Michelle Mrs Duggar even when Michael was born and then I believe she switched to Mama Duggar. I'm not sure why Michelle would care though, her usual answer to a kid saying mom is, "Go find your buddy".

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Westiepeach

Westiepeach

I've been married for 30 years and I have never, ever called my in-law's anything. Father-in-Law is the only living parent left, and I have never, ever called him "Dad." I just don't call him anything. I'm with @GeeGolly with the card thing - when I send cards I address it to "Dad," but sign Husband's name first.

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MonicaM

MonicaM

1 hour ago, BitterApple said:

I think how you address your in-laws largely depends on your comfort level. I was raised very formally, so even after ten years with my husband, I still call my MIL "Mrs. Bitter Apple." However his brother's wife calls her "Mom" which would feel very awkward to me. Since Jill did more hands-on childcare than Jinger, she likely raised the Littles to address adults as "Miss So-and-So" and it's just what comes naturally to her.

I was not at all close to my MIL.  She didn't seem to particularly like her son, my husband, and she wasn't crazy about me either.  However, she always signed cards and referred to herself as Mom M(lastname), so that's what I called her. 

A friend of mine met her husband in high school and initially knew her in-laws as Mr. and Mrs. Smith.  That's what she called them, even after she and her husband had been married for years.  It was partly out of habit, partly because it had become a mutual source of amusement in the family.  

How different people refer to the in-laws is an interesting topic.

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BitterApple

BitterApple

1 hour ago, bigskygirl said:

Hmmm.. I do not think Jana is that envious to the point she would have tried to get together with Jeremy if Jessa introduced her to Jeremy first. 

I tend to agree. Jeremy is the antithesis of what Jana said she's looking for, so if she's jealous it's probably because Jinger's a thousand miles from the TTH, not because she has Jeremy for a husband.

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bigskygirl

bigskygirl

Jana may be happy not to be married and expecting to be popping out grandchildren right or left. She may not care for her brothers-in-law and pretends to like them. In otherwords, looking at her brothers-in-law may make her more happy she is not tied down to someone like them *cough* Derick *cough* or someone like Josh.

SnarkyShark

SnarkyShark

4 hours ago, Portia said:

Here are my thoughts on "Southern good manners" vis-à-vis forms of personal address. Others can feel free to chime in if they disagree.   :-D

Once a child is grown and no longer being coached by a parent ("Junior, say hello to Ms. Portia!"), the onus is on the older adult to tell the younger adult what to call them.  Personally, I think that the younger adult should defer to the wishes of the older adult. My kids' friends called me "Ms. Portia" when they were kids, but when they became young adults, there came a time when I began telling each of them, "Please call me Portia" because I was acknowledging that they were fellow adults and someone I considered to be a friend, not just the friend of my child. Personally, I'd feel a little insulted if one of my kids-in-law insisted on calling me "Ms. Portia" because that's much too formal for the close relationship I have with them.  But if they had called me Ms. Portia since meeting me, and there had never come a day when I asked them to call me only by my first name, I would not be surprised if they continued to append the "Ms." to my name. 

The added complication is that some Southerners were taught to NEVER address any adult older than themselves by first name only. Full stop.  But I think it depends entirely on the relationship and the wishes of the older party. If I meet a 70-something lady at a church social, I'm going to start out calling her "Ms. Lucille." But if she says, "Oh, honey, call me Lucille!", to me that translates to this: "I consider you a peer."  Some people just don't seem to be able to shake the polite form of address, though.  The senior pastor of my church is 20 years my junior, and he insists on calling me "Mrs. Lastname." I have asked him repeatedly to just call me by my first name, pointing out that we are all adults and that he and my husband are peers (serving on the same church staff). I have even gone so far as to say, "It makes me feel old when you call me that." But he just can't (or won't) shake the habit; it's just how he was raised, I suppose.  It's like nails on the chalkboard, and frankly I think it would be a lot more polite of him to observe my request, but I try not to let it bother me too much since he does it with everyone. 

I find this so interesting! My mom raised us with the mindset that Mr./Mrs./Ms. <Lastname> is always the default because it is polite and respectful, unless the adult specifically tells you otherwise. So if you were to say, "Please, call me Portia," then I would follow suit.

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Christina87

Christina87

(edited)
3 hours ago, bigskygirl said:

Jessa and Jill are probably envious. The verdict is still out on Jana being envious. I am waiting to see what happens when the baby comes because it will be a whole new ball game. Jeremy enjoys being the center of Jinger's attention, and a baby takes a lot of time, love and attention.

I agree with you that Jana might not be jealous. Unlike all her married sisters, she still has HOPE that the same thing could happen to her, too! Jessa, Jill, and joy have zero chance of living such a fashionable life, but it still could happen for Jana! Plus, I think she reads people better than most of them, and can see right through Jeremy. I think Jana wants someone genuine who treats her like an equal. I think Jana likes being fashionable, and would like an attractive spouse, but she would probably choose a cute guy who's going somewhere over a hot blowhard. 

Edited by Christina87
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Magoo

Magoo

22 hours ago, madpsych78 said:

26685873_2313323712028545_36866718993892

 

Looks like this was posted yesterday. Jinger looks great, but I detest Jeremy's bow color with the rest of his suit.

More pictures here at Swan 4 Kids.

There's a photo in this link - Jinger and Jeremy are onstage, heads bowed and praying, where she is the spitting image of Jessa.  I've never thought Jinger looked much like her siblings at all, but wow, that photo caught me off guard.  Agree also that someone has taken her under their style wing - her clothes, her hair, her makeup (especially here) - all look fantastic.  It's so great that she's been open to suggestions and coaching rather than hanging on to her old life by refusing to change her look (ahem...Michelle).  I wonder what the Duggar clan thinks when they see her - surely they must realize she outclasses them in every possible way.  Jessa must be fuming.

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queenanne

queenanne

3 hours ago, Adeejay said:

Based on her confident demeanor, if I didn't know better, I'd think Jinger has been in this circle all of her life.  She is arguably a jet setter, has a handsome "Preacher" for a husband, a four bedroom home and a stylish wardrobe.  That is the lifestyle I envisioned for Jessa, the "hot" Duggar girl; while  poor Jin Jin would be relegated to the mold house with an average husband and kids. I can't help but believe her sisters are envious. 

Well, that's what happens when you jump at the first mildly hot teenager who shows any interest in you, Jessa.  

However, I'm not sure Jessa is envious because if she were realio, trulio so inclined, you'd think she wouldn't have bothered talking Jinger up to Jeremy, or vice versa, in the first place.

35 minutes ago, SnarkyShark said:

I find this so interesting! My mom raised us with the mindset that Mr./Mrs./Ms. <Lastname> is always the default because it is polite and respectful, unless the adult specifically tells you otherwise. So if you were to say, "Please, call me Portia," then I would follow suit.

Agreed; in fact I always call strangers, whose age I do not know (like work emails to clients), "Mr./Ms. So-and-So" the first time.  I don't feel right saying "Mary" or "Mitch", without Mary and Mitch sign their replies to me as such.  Once they do, I will use the name.  

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EmeraldGirl

EmeraldGirl

Wow, she’s gorgeous. She did pick a beautiful wedding gown, hair, and makeup. So I think that slightly more sophisticated thing was already in Jinger. 

Oh how I’d love to see her and the baby in mommy and me classes and the library. Time will tell, but she’s for sure got an edge over Jessa who seems to go back to the main house so her kids can play with cousins - like all the time. 

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MamaMax

MamaMax

On 1/12/2018 at 2:13 PM, Lunera said:

Screenshot_20180112-104517.thumb.jpg.8bd4c953e62cf421d65e3037f628a8cc.jpg

 

Jeremy posted this under his Andrea Bocelli song post. I think the person asked him if he was Italian, but no one asked if he was Catholic.

I don't know why, but this bugs me SO MUCH. It's like he needed to get out in front of the "dirty secret" that he has Catholic roots. That since people know he is Italian, he needs to put it out there that he's not one of those awful Catholics. And then to call Catholicism a "self-righteous" religion WHILE YOU ACT SELF RIGHTEOUS ABOUT YOUR OWN FAITH just really frosts my cookies!

I am practicing Catholic and I tried to listen to a little of the "testimony" but had to stop because I was getting furious. It's so easy to mock and belittle other people's faith. It is certainly NOT the Christian thing to do!

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lascuba

lascuba

12 hours ago, floridamom said:

 

You know, I have to wonder what Jinger is thinking of all these professional women here who are out in the work force attending this dinner and speaking PROFESSIONALLY. They aren't home having babies one after the other and prohibited from an education and a job. It has to make her THINK a little about how she was brought up, doesn't it?

Maybe that explains the arm-clutching (Jinger did not look confident to me at all)....she knew she was way out of her league in that environment and had nothing to contribute on that stage. I'm cringing imagining the insipid platitudes that came out of her mouth.  

7 hours ago, Lunera said:

I can't believe how sofisticated she looks. Duggar Academy gave Jinger the equivalent of a middle school education, she must definitely feel out of her element among educated women and young ladies who are more accomplished than her. 

I'm gonna sound like an asshole but I don't know why Jeremy chose Jinger. He's a somewhat handsome, educated guy and could have had his pick of an equally attractive and educated woman but he settled for a stunted girl and the Duggar family as baggage. He managed to polish her looks up but I'm disappointed that he didn't do more for her before he knocked her up. 

 

I'm right there with you. Him choosing her speaks badly of him. He sought out a hugely unbalanced relationship so he could be in charge. 

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Mollie

Mollie

1 hour ago, MamaMax said:

I don't know why, but this bugs me SO MUCH. It's like he needed to get out in front of the "dirty secret" that he has Catholic roots. That since people know he is Italian, he needs to put it out there that he's not one of those awful Catholics. And then to call Catholicism a "self-righteous" religion WHILE YOU ACT SELF RIGHTEOUS ABOUT YOUR OWN FAITH just really frosts my cookies!

I am practicing Catholic and I tried to listen to a little of the "testimony" but had to stop because I was getting furious. It's so easy to mock and belittle other people's faith. It is certainly NOT the Christian thing to do!

Outside of his immediate family, all of Jeremy's relatives are still Catholic and all of his ancestors are buried in Catholic cemeteries. 

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bigskygirl

bigskygirl

1 hour ago, lascuba said:

Maybe that explains the arm-clutching (Jinger did not look confident to me at all)....she knew she was way out of her league in that environment and had nothing to contribute on that stage. I'm cringing imagining the insipid platitudes that came out of her mouth.  

I'm right there with you. Him choosing her speaks badly of him. He sought out a hugely unbalanced relationship so he could be in charge. 

Jeremy is probably enjoying the fact Jinger is clinging to him during the event. It boasts his ego to have his scared because she is not use to this type of event wife glued to his side.

awaken

awaken

6 hours ago, Westiepeach said:

I've been married for 30 years and I have never, ever called my in-law's anything. Father-in-Law is the only living parent left, and I have never, ever called him "Dad." I just don't call him anything. I'm with @GeeGolly with the card thing - when I send cards I address it to "Dad," but sign Husband's name first.

Ha. Same here!  

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awaken

awaken

42 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

Last sentence of the bio gives us the closest thing we're probably ever going to get w/r/t a due date. 

https://www.gcclaredo.com/leadership

I notice what’s lacking in his bio is any mention of education or experience in ministry!  Just says transitioned from soccer to church work.  Very duggarish. He watched his dad doing it, has read (or maybe just hugged) some books, so assumes he is qualified. 

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questionfear

questionfear

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I do give some side eye to Jeremy marrying Jinger, but considering how she's become more confident, stylish, and healthy looking, I also wonder if this isn't a case of him simply falling for who she was, and they figured out how to work around the baggage of her being a Duggar. She seems to be fairly intelligent and mature, and while she might be behind the curve in terms of education, she's had a year of no kids and no job to read, talk with her in-laws, and try to better herself. Within the circle that is their fundie-ism, she seems to be doing just that. It wouldn't shock me in the least if Jeremy first hung around hoping to become a "friend of the Duggars" for fame/networking reasons, and then found that he really genuinely enjoyed Jinger's company. 

I wouldn't want to be married to him, and I wouldn't want to marry into the Duggar clan...but it does seem like this marriage has improved Jinger's life immensely, so more power to her. 

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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

2 hours ago, BitterApple said:

It doesn't look like a good turnout for the conference thus far. There's only a sprinkling of people in the background and outside the venue is a ghost town. 

Yay for people not going. There's a lot of lies and hate in the group assembled for that conference, in my opinion. That Anzen guy, for example, Mr. "Iron Sharpens Iron," has, among other things, pushed the book "The Pink Swastika," which I'd call a lying fundie's attempt to argue that Nazi Germany wasn't anti-gay because large hordes of actual Nazis were gay. .... They really are a fearful bunch of paranoids who want to stomp out anybody they perceive as different. Different ones have different obsessions and different levels of distrust and hatefulness, but terror and distrust of "the other" seethes somewhere in the makeup of them all, I think. Go find somebody else to talk to, Jer and Jingle. (and Der and Jill and Bin and Jessa, too, for that matter.)

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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

20 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

What did Jeremy do yesterday that Jinger had to spend the day with that young lady?

Well, it said he was going to lead a breakout session. And I suppose that was virtually all men. There was only one woman on the speaker roster, so I'm guessing women were little wanted when it came to the really high-level discussions. You'd need a failed pro soccer player to truly comprehend the deep stuff, right? ............Jingle's TeeVee fame was good for getting him on the program and on the radio, though, I expect. So there's that. 

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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

2 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

Well, it said he was going to lead a breakout session. And I suppose that was virtually all men. There was only one woman on the speaker roster, so I'm guessing women were little wanted when it came to the really high-level discussions. You'd need a failed pro soccer player to truly comprehend the deep stuff, right? ............Jingle's TeeVee fame was good for getting him on the program and on the radio, though, I expect. So there's that. 

Jeremy's breakout session is today. Jinger said that she spent the day yesterday with that other young lady. I wonder how Jinger killed her time whilst Jeremy pontificated to a group of men.

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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

7 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

Jeremy's breakout session is today. Jinger said that she spent the day yesterday with that other young lady. I wonder how Jinger killed her time whilst Jeremy pontificated to a group of men.

Ah ... so I assume he attended sessions yesterday. .... I would think that if the minister's wife attended the conference she'd go to sessions as well. But I suppose I have to doubt that she did, since this seems to be a very male-centric affair. ... Wives without school-age-and-younger children probably attended, though, so maybe there were several of the youngest and the oldest pontificators' wives to hang out with? 

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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

(edited)
44 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

Is Voddie still based out of Africa? I haven't kept up with him for a while.

Dunno.

As far as I know, he still lists it as his main institutional affiliation on his own website. 

But I've kept an occasional eye on the website of the "university" itself, because I'm curious. And as far as I know they don't list any staff on the site, so you can't tell whether he is or isn't there.

They do list their (huge) board of directors, but he's not a member of it. However, he gave at least one speech there in 2017. ...

. It's also hard to tell how much of a program they have at this point. They list one study program, which seems to be a one-year program maybe? And it turned out a class -- its first? second? -- last year.... They list fees for that (of course. ha) and some courses it apparently entails. But it's all pretty vague. The sense I get is that the 'institution" as a whole just barely exists at this point. And while he said his family moved there, I've never seen anything about what he's doing. 

But of course very very vague "careers" and "jobs" that people seem to spend very very little time at seem to be the rule, not the exception, with this whole crew.  (And not just the Duggs and Dugg adjacents. No wonder this seems normal to them, because it looks pervasive in their set, really.)

I wonder what Calvin would think about that? 

Edited by Churchhoney
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FakeJoshDuggar

FakeJoshDuggar

14 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

Seriously.  A few inches and we've been in a state of emergency since Monday night.

I’m surprised there were as many people there as we saw. I was just able to get out of my driveway yesterday and then it was sketchy at best. Metro Atlanta doesn’t play and shuts down when a flake falls from the sky. Was it 2013 where everyone was stuck on the interstate?

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Christina87

Christina87

21 hours ago, lascuba said:

Maybe that explains the arm-clutching (Jinger did not look confident to me at all)....she knew she was way out of her league in that environment and had nothing to contribute on that stage. I'm cringing imagining the insipid platitudes that came out of her mouth.  

I'm right there with you. Him choosing her speaks badly of him. He sought out a hugely unbalanced relationship so he could be in charge. 

I feel that speaks badly to him, too. I wonder what his previous relationships with girls he's presumably met in college have been like. Maybe there has been a controlling pattern that those girls didn't like. 

I'm still holding out hope that Jana will meet an educated guy, a veterinarian who lives on a farm and loves working with his hands. However, i feel like the fantasy guy sees something in Jana beyond the uneducated woman she is. In my fantasy, he realizes she has intelligence and curiosity, and is in awe of all she is already doing (raising children, gardening, etc). Jeremy has explicitly stated that he wanted a meek wife, and clearly enjoys teaching her amazing things like how to make a cup of coffee. Jana's fantasy guy sees her as an equal, or at least potential equal. 

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cm-soupsipper
Message added by cm-soupsipper,

Closure Notice: This Thread is now closed due to the name (and much of the posting within it). Please be mindful going forward by naming topics in a way that invites a healthy community conversation. If you name something for a cheap laugh, this thread may be closed later because it encourages discrimination and harm. 

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