S04.E10: 13 Hours In Islamabad

[attica]

First of all, kudos to Sarah for her nickname of Haqqani's crew as The Haq-tones. They need never be called anything else.

 

We tend to view suicide as a coward's way out of punishment, but that view wasn't always the case, especially among the aristocracy. Back when the officer class was made up entirely of aristos, it was considered The Gentlemanly Thing to Do to off yourself if you were caught in a crime, or some other 'failing the mission' misbehavior. Even as relatively recently as WW2, this sentiment was not unheard of. So I was digging Boyd's reaching back into history (sort of), until he proved he was neither an Officer nor a Gentleman.

[Kerrey92]

The scene with Boyd and Martha was the best for me.  She obviously hates him with a fiery passion, but there's still the marital bond that's existed for numerous years that can't just be erased because he's a treasonous traitor who treasons.  She softened toward him for a minute and then brought it back to herself and ultimately made a decision that I didn't want her to make.  Death is not a way out for stupid Boyd.  I really thought he was playing her the whole time to see if she still had any part of her that still loved him. I don't think he ever meant to kill himself, but wanted to manipulate and humiliate her one more time on the way out.  He's such a huge piece of shit. 

 

The head of the CIA caved to terrorists and handed over intel? What? Was he not taught "We don't negotiate with terrorists”?

 

I was yelling this at my TV!  It's a line I use regularly with my kids so it was fresh in my head.  Stupid Lipless handing over the list.  What a dumbass. 

 

I agree with other posters that this was the best episode of this series.  It had me on the edge of my seat and my heart was pounding.  Good job!

[BigBlueMastiff]

 

We tend to view suicide as a coward's way out of punishment, but that view wasn't always the case, especially among the aristocracy. Back when the officer class was made up entirely of aristos, it was considered The Gentlemanly Thing to Do to off yourself if you were caught in a crime, or some other 'failing the mission' misbehavior. Even as relatively recently as WW2, this sentiment was not unheard of. So I was digging Boyd's reaching back into history (sort of), until he proved he was neither an Officer nor a Gentleman.

I agree with you, attica, but tended to be more of the ambassador's initial point of view that he was doing it to take the easy way out, and not take full responsibility for the consequences of his actions. Though his story about doing it for his familyand her career swayed the ambassador in the end, I didn't buy it, still just a ploy.

[henripootel]

I kept thinking  "where's Jack Bauer when you need him?"  And then Quinn took charge and I felt a little better.

Not that much better.  As preposterous as 24 could get, Jack Bauer + a clear line of sight = Haqqani's brains flying every which-a-way.  Things are looking up now that Quinn is on the hunt, which is good given all things we were asked to swallow this episode.  Handing over the knock-list, letting the Ambassador anywhere near her husband, alone (with her not under 'close supervision' at all times, for that matter), Saul again forgetting all the tradecraft he must have learned, the embassy guards crouching out in the open when the position was clearly untenable ...  

 

And did they really have to send out all the embassy guards?  Has no one heard of a diversionary attack before?  I mean you might expect Col. Klink to fall for this and send everyone rushing out but I'da thought there'd be procedures in place to prevent this very thing.  And Haqqani's plan seemed pretty strongly hinged on them doing this - Quinn and one marine very nearly sank the whole thing.

 

I made it through 8 seasons and a movie of 24 so I know this wasn't gonna happen, but I was hoping for a scene of Haqqani back with his men, opening the List Box to reveal ... a device with the traditional red numbers counting down '4 ... 3 ... 2 ... 1' as it registers on Haqqani what he's holding.  It'd cut short Quinn's hero quest but it'd at least make me think more of Lockhart.  

 

ETA:

there's still the marital bond that's existed for numerous years that can't just be erased because he's a treasonous traitor who treasons.

No way they'd ever let her anywhere near him, not the least of reasons being the great probability that she's dirty too.  More likely she'd be under guard herself, and he under suicide watch until they got him back and questioned him very, very closely about the extent of his betrayal.  If Duck had hung himself, even Sgt. Shutlz (continuing my Hogan's Heroes theme) would swiftly conclude that somebody gave him the belt, that it was his wife, and that she obviously had something to hide herself. No way she 'gets off' and goes on with her career if Duck dies now.

Edited December 8, 2014 by henripootel

[bunnywithanaxe]

I can't help wondering if that little snake is up to something with getting her to pass him a belt. Not one single authentic word has passed from his lips in three episodes, except for blurting out the business about the tunnel-- and even then his hide was at stake.

Someone had to have found that belt on the floor. I bet it comes up later.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Quinn was BAMF, of course. And I'm impressed by Carrie's decision to stay in Pakistan for him... I just hope she won't make it worse somehow.

It's pretty much guaranteed that she will. I just hope he doesn't end up sleeping with her.

 

I was surprised she did it because she's smart enough to know that some people will wonder if he really killed himself and, even if he did, whether he did it to cover-up for her.

Yeah, I think no matter what he does now, her career in the diplomatic service is over. I echo comments above and wonder what she ever saw in him. I guess his being so weak made it easier for her to park him in a corner while she forged ahead with her own climb up the ladder?

Edited December 8, 2014 by Joimiaroxeu

[mjt626]

I suspect that the ambassador and her husband were both rising stars when they got married. Some episodes ago, she mentioned that he had gotten caught plagiarizing his academic work. She kept rising and he fell into a sniveling loser.

[shelley1234]

I felt like way too much happened too quickly in this episode.  I expected the takeover of the Embassy and the battle to last more than half an episode.  

 

I did get a giggle of joy when Quinn took out the 3 guards and then stole their walkie talkie....I really thought Homeland was going to go with the whole John McClain Die Hard angle and was so looking forward to it.  Unfortunately, it only lasted for about 5 minutes before Quinn was at the vault door and then chasing the bag guys only to be thwarted by their bomb trickery.  Pfft!  I wanted Yippee Kay Yay!  

 

While I thought it was all kinds of idiotic for Lockhart to open the door, it was an interesting piece of character development.  Lockhart has been openly critical (often with good cause) of Carrie and her inability to follow order/chain of command and to just all around make the right choice when she is out in the field.  Since Lockhart is someone who spends his days sitting behind a desk, I think he got a rude awakening that actually walking the walk is much harder than just talking the talk.  I also liked seeing Lockhart so affected by the idea of losing someone he considered a colleague and maybe even a friend.  It really made him so much more human....much more stupid, but also human.  

 

Max.  Awe....poor buddy.  He broke my heart this episode with his clear love for Fara.  I was also entertained and maybe even amused by his conversation chastising Carrie after Fara's death.  While it is true that Carrie could have been nicer, kinder and gentler with her....Carrie's job is to protect her assets and the country (which yes, she tends to do a pretty piss poor job of, but none the less)....not be Fara's BFF.  I also rewatched the interaction and while Carrie clearly hears Max and shares his sadness and guilt....when he continues with the "why couldn't you be nicer"....there is a brief moment that Carrie totally side eyes and rolls her eyes at him before sucking it up, saying she wished she had and then the gently touching of Max on his shoulder.  That scene to me was Claire Danes at her finest.  

 

The Ambassador and her husband....wow...those suckers deserve each other.  

 

Oh Saul.  Mandy Patankin is nothing short of spectacular.  He really brought it and while I would like him to be able to decompress and help with what Quinn was doing, it's also just showing how much trauma and war can leave devastating marks.  Saul came out of that experience a different and broken man....and while he would love nothing more than to just will himself beyond it, he cannot.  Sighs.  

 

And now it seems like the season will wind down with Quinn and Carrie all alone battling against a terrorist regime.  I am sure in classic 24 style, it'll end in a blaze of glory, but good lord....in the real world, they are both dead already.  

 

Still.  I'm in.  I'm riveted.  Bring me more.  

[bobbyjoe]

You know what I hope Carrie never does again?  When she goes " ......   FUCK! "  It's annoying.

 

It's Carrie's version of Jack Bauer's "dammit." 

 

If they ever do a crossover, they can put them in a high stress situation together. "Dammit!" says Jack.  "Fuck!" says Carrie.  "Dammit!" Jack repeats.  "Fuck!" echoes Carrie.  Suddenly their eyes lock, they move closer to one another...wait, how did I end up suddenly writing fanfic?

[slowpoked]

So I guess this bloodbath is what the Homeland cast and crew was filming a funeral scene for a couple of weeks ago.

 

Now that the whole season is coming to a close - So Sandy's "asset" was Tasneem, and Sandy was trading state secrets with her in exchange for people on the kill list, which I assume her and Haqqani were more than willing to give up in exchange for this big plan of embassy invasion. Tasneem "gives up" Haqqani so the CIA wouldn't go searching for a dead man while he makes his big plans. However, Saul put a little monkey wrench in the plans, but it turned out to be even better since Haqqani got some of his men back.

 

So in light of all that happened, shouldn't Lockhart be culpable for the embassy invasion as well because he knew fully well that Sandy was in bed with the enemy trading state secrets? Something that Carrie outed him earlier in the season? But that fact seems to be forgotten after all that happened, and it's looking like Dennis will be the sole fall guy for all of this. 

 

BTW, where in the world is General Bunny in all of this? I had the impression that he is Tasneem and Khan's boss. Why didn't anyone made a phone call straight to him and bypass the ranks? Carrie already knows there's a mole within the ISI, so why trust anyone who is not the possibly highest ranking official. And the fact that Khan is a very high-ranking official, but he gives in to Tasneem's wiles???

 

Great hour of action, and I did a little gasp when Fara got killed the same way I gasped when Aayan was killed. But lots and lots of question still. A little digging deep and a lot doesn't make sense....

Edited December 10, 2014 by Cranberry
Added spoiler tag just in case.

[shapeshifter]

...Saul has steadily seen his skill set diminishing in order to serve the plot, this week we added that he couldn't fire a rifle or remember basic counter intelligence measures. Contrivance....

I'm about his age and could totally relate. We just don't bounce back like we used to.

 

Given how short the episode was, and given how much time Dennis's "To be or not to be" scene took, it felt a bit like filler.

Yeah. I felt like it went on way too long.

[Helena Dax]

I'm glad Dennis didn't kill  himself because he needs to pay for the rest of his life. The Ambassador's face when she saw him alive, inside that car, was amazing, I've never seen  so much contempt together.

 

Poor Fara... She was dead anyway, Lockhart shouldn't have opened that door. 

 

Quinn was amazing! Can't wait to see what happens now with Carrie and him. There's no protocol to follow, no rules, which makes them more dangerous than ever. And that guy, Khan? I'm sure he's going to help them. He wasn't happy at all when Tasneem told him to wait. 

Edited December 10, 2014 by Helena Dax

[ElectricBoogaloo]

The look on Martha's face when she looked at her husband in the car said, "I didn't think it was possible for me to think any less of you, so congratulations on lowering my expectations to a subterranean level."

[Blakeston]

The scene with Boyd and Martha was the best for me.  She obviously hates him with a fiery passion, but there's still the marital bond that's existed for numerous years that can't just be erased because he's a treasonous traitor who treasons.  She softened toward him for a minute and then brought it back to herself and ultimately made a decision that I didn't want her to make.  Death is not a way out for stupid Boyd.  I really thought he was playing her the whole time to see if she still had any part of her that still loved him. I don't think he ever meant to kill himself, but wanted to manipulate and humiliate her one more time on the way out.  He's such a huge piece of shit. 

 

I didn't get that impression at all. Over and over again, we've seen that he's a huge coward. I think he really meant what he said about wanting to kill himself - but then just didn't have the stomach for it.

 

The look on his face in the car at the end wasn't, "Gotcha one last time." It was, "I know I'm pathetic, and I can't even look at you."

[Mama No Life]

Exactly.

 

He didn't even have the balls to take the coward's way out.

[Kristen]

RIP, Fred from Roseanne. And Fara, too. She was all right.

 

Has anyone else noticed that Lipless has a whole Dick Cheney smirk thing going on?

Edited December 9, 2014 by Kristen

[bunnywithanaxe]

RIP, Fred from Roseanne. And Fara, too. She was all right.

 

Has anyone else noticed that Lipless has a whole Dick Cheney smirk thing going on?

Totally! In fact, I wondered if the casting call said "Dick Cheney type."

Edited December 9, 2014 by bunnywithanaxe

[mjc570]

 

I'd rather the show focus on Quinn from now on, even if it meant Homeland was turning into 24.  And have him team up with Khan for shallow reasons.

Oh, yes, PLEASE.

[shapeshifter]

If this was a Choose Your Own Adventure ending episode, I would have had poor Max die in Fara's place (as the hero) so Fara could meet Khan. They are mirror images of each other in terms of disappointment with the people they find themselves working with.

[myname2use4now]

RIP, Fred from Roseanne. And Fara, too. She was all right.

 

Has anyone else noticed that Lipless has a whole Dick Cheney smirk thing going on?

I kept thinking the same thing about watching Dick Cheney on screen! Lol!

[ElectricBoogaloo]

What annoyed me is that he was okay with the first two guys getting their brains blown out but suddenly he decided to give up the case because he didn't want Fara killed? Tough luck for those other guys!

 

When the vault door started counting down, I was really hoping that there was an Elias style bomb that would go off like on Person of Interest. I mean, sure, it would suck for the ambassador and everyone else in the vault but I would have been happy with it taking out Lockhart and Haqqani. I still can't believe that Lockhart was dumb enough to think that if he just opened the door and handed over the case, Haqqani was going to let Fara and everyone else live. IDIOT.

[Mozelle]

Yeah, Lockhart et. al. should have accounted for the fact that Haqqani would have killed Fara anyway precisely because she is Muslim. Fara's brand of belief was so far and away on the opposite end of Haqqani's murderous beliefs that there was no way that he was ever going to let her live. Given what the Taliban did to Malala two years ago, Fara was never going to make it. Haqqani, and other Taliban, consider her a corrupted Muslim.

It's why I'm also afraid for Khan. Tasneem buys into what Haqqani's selling, while Khan doesn't. It doesn't bode well for him.

Edited December 9, 2014 by Mozelle

[Former Nun]

IDIOT.

 

 

Complete. From Day One (I hope you read ElectricBoogaloo's comment above.

And that guy, Khan? I'm sure he's going to help them.

 

 

I continue to think Carrie will end up having another baby...and this time one with dark brown eyes and black hair.

[bunnywithanaxe]

I am so pathetic. I just read the "Particles" feature and I fuckin' sniffled over Fara and Max's La Pieta jpeg. Also, Carrie calling Fara's dad.

 

Fara! :(

[Cosmocrush]

With all the many comparisons of this show to 24, I'm really glad I never saw 24 because I am loving this show.
 

I am not surprised that Lockhart couldn't let Fara die. He knew her from last season. Knew her loyalty. He is a politician not a soldier.

 

I'm not sure it was intentional but I did appreciate Lockhart's behavior and what it implied (at least to me). It's a lot easier to run a war/authorize bombings etc., when you are sitting behind a desk in Washington. I would normally assume that the head of the CIA has some active military training but maybe not. If Lockheart had any it would seem to be a long time ago or to have consisted of running things behind a desk like now. Saul, on the other hand, has actual time in the field.

Maybe I'm projecting but I like to think it was intentional to make that exact point.   He seemed stunned by the Haqqani actually killing Americans and I loved Martha telling him, "This is a war." in a  way that told me that this was probably the first time he really understood what happens to people during war.

 

I love Martha. She would have let all those people in the lobby die. Steely. She looked so deeply offended when Lockhart shoved her aside. The belt moment surprised me. I didn't really believe she would be THAT career minded. I think was was a major mis-step on the show and I am glad Dennis failed. Mark Moses makes the best weak man.

Unlike Lockart, I think Martha has long understood what it's like to be in the field, fighting the good fight.     I've always thought that people who work in the state department are all in.  It's more than just a career.  I don't think she gave him the belt to save her career but maybe saw this as a good way to really be rid of him.  And who knows, it might have helped her save something of her career/legacy -  as Dennis reminded her about the CIA, "these are the people that can rewrite yesterday's weather."  And they do it all the time.  

 

I agree that the actor makes a really good week man.  Duck and then Dennis. Mark Moses is due for a hero role. 

[LotusFlower]

Great time to choose to ditch all naivete, by the way, because the look she gave Max was kind, but also contained the "Oh Max, I've been dead from the second he laid eyes on me, I'm sorry".  

Shades of Hank on Breaking Bad (your imagined quote). Poor Fara. She never got her redemption arc. At least Hank went out a bad ass. But I like how they always keep everyone in character. Fara - idealistic, naive, Quinn - cool as a cucumber, total bad ass, Duck - coward, Martha - smart, brave, but also politically savvy (thinking of her career), and Lockhart - a politician, and not cut out for field work! The only one a bit out of character was Saul, but he was so severely traumatized and hurting, so I thought it was pretty realistic.

[DrLar]

Wouldn't that list on that case had a failsafe, say if you don't open it with a key or code ink/acid/fire would destroy the contents inside? IDK 

[LGGirl]

Lockhart should be fired for handing over file. If Quinn hadn't open fire, everyone including Lockhart and those in the bunker would have been killed.

I, too, kept wondering: Why isn't there a phony file?

Saul. Saul. Considering your training, you should be able to give Quinn some useful information.

Quinn was awesome. Keep him and get rid of the others, including Carrie.

Edited December 9, 2014 by LGGirl

[CozyKat]

What annoyed me is that he was okay with the first two guys getting their brains blown out but suddenly he decided to give up the case because he didn't want Fara killed? Tough luck for those other guys!

 

Even aside from the fact that Fara was a pretty woman, which unfortunately was probably part of it, the way Haqqani dragged her right up to the camera and appeared ready to perform a sloppy beheading with that knife made her different from the first two shockingly fast executions, in which he proved beyond a doubt that he wasn't messing around. It was a definite escalation, and I could see why that would be the breaking point for any old guy with a desk job. I was so afraid Haqqani was going to take out all the occupants of the safe room after that door swung wide that Fara's particular death still shocked me, though, even though I knew intellectually why she was the last one Haqqani would spare.

 

I still have last-scene whiplash from going "Quinn, how could you be so stupid to let yourself be tailed with no backup and -- oh right, TV boyfriend, how could I have doubted you?" And yes, of course he would pre-imburse the street merchant.

[Notwisconsin]

It's Carrie's version of Jack Bauer's "dammit." 

I seem to remember in an early season DVD, Jack says "fuck." I also believe Carrie said "dammit" on occasion.

[polyhymnia]

I really do wish that there either were phony files in that case or a tracking device. That would make it a little better. OR that the rest of the bunker's occupants would have jumped Lipless and kept him from opening the door. Why would any of them want to die? I knew the second Haqqani spoke to Fara that she was dead unless Quinn could do the impossible.

I think Khan had no way of getting out of that situation with Tasneen. I don't think he's endorsing it. It will be interesting if there is a substantial schism in opinion in the Pakistani government between these two camps. I am assuming Bunny is aligned with Tasneen, but being aligned with the US helps protect their interests regarding India so I imagine there would be many who are not cosigning on to the Tasmeen/Haqqani/Taliban plan.

[Pallas]

I am assuming Bunny is aligned with Tasneen, but being aligned with the US helps protect their interests regarding India so I imagine there would be many who are not cosigning on to the Tasmeen/Haqqani/Taliban plan.

 

Interesting: why do you say that?  He's not her superior; she is ISI and he is an upper-level minister, I believe. And it was Bunny who introduced Saul to Khan.  None of that means he can't be quietly supporting or even promoting Tasneem's work; I'm just wondering why you think so.  

[Bcharmer]

Just a small nitpick.

 

Haqqani: "Give me the list, or I will kill her, right here, right now."

 

Perhaps it's just me, but for some reason, Haqqani using that (overused) phrase just seemed out of place.  Didn't bother me until the second viewing, when I wasn't as caught up in the drama and knew what was coming, but it made me wish the writers had him say something a little more terrorist-y.

[Constantinople]

At the end of the previous episode, didn't Dennis/Duck tell Martha that he told Tasneem about the US embassy's secret tunnel?

 

On reflection, I'm surprised that wasn't mentioned during the episode after the attack was over.

 

Did Martha not tell anyone, or is the US holding back on confronting the Pakistani government?  I would have at least thought that Carrie and Lockhart would have discussed this

[Milburn Stone]

Some televiewing has the ability to warp the experience of time itself. Case in point, this episode. So much happened that I felt put through the wringer, and was convinced I had just spent about forty-five minutes on the couch. I needed to pause the show for some reason and at that point discovered that only twenty minutes had elapsed. I was dumbfounded to discover this.

 

Sometimes you catch a look at the time and can't believe that only [X] minutes have elapsed because a show has been so boring. Other times a show is so engaging that it flies by and you can't believe a whole hour has passed. Both of those situations are kind of intuitive. What's not intuitive is a show apparently slowing down time because it's so fantastic.

[alexvillage]

Thrilling and exciting

And bad writing too.

Did not like the nuances, even if I was sliding down the couch, holding my breath during some scenes.

I will not try to analyze the episode because if I do I will hate it too much 

[Bcharmer]

Okay, one more nitpick. When they were getting ready to evacuate the embassy, I found it a bit questionable when Martha said she hadn't seen her husband "all morning." I understand her intention... "It's time to go, but I haven't seen Dennis yet. What could be keeping him? Maybe someone should go check his cell, and make sure he hasn't overslept (wink wink)." And that Carrie had to tell her he was already in the lead car, and would be traveling in custody?  Had he really hung himself, Martha would have been notified of that waaay before then. Was she thinking that the guard outside his door, or anyone, would not have checked in with him after her visit, or later that night, or even earlier in the morning, to at least bring him food? Surely, someone would have discovered his body hanging by a belt (and where would he have hung himself from, I wonder?) long before it was time for them to depart, and Martha would have been told immediately.  To pretend that he was just late, was a little unrealistic. She should have known by then that he didn't go through with it.  Of course, we were all waiting to find out if he was dead, or not, but if Martha was unaware by that point, it should have been fairly obvious that he wasn't.

[VLove]

Someone, somewhere (here? twitter?) said that Brody dying was the best thing that happened to this show. Amen.

Look, I spent the entire "vault" scene screaming at the tv, "JUST TURN OFF THE FUCKING MONITOR!!!" Watching the staff outside the door fall one by one would have been horrible but in the words of the incomparable Super Chicken, "You knew the job was dangerous when you took it." As much as I adored Fara, it was her time. Life sucks. Under NO circumstances should the Director have opened that door. I might be a 5'3 bundle of nothing (and guaranteed to lose my job) but Director Lipless would have had to physically fight (not just push) me to get out. I was aghast that the staff inside just watched as he thumbed his nose at protocol.

I was disappointed when Martha gave Dennis the belt - to me there were only two acceptable conclusions to Dennis: Martha killing him, herself or him facing treason charges in a court of law. My boyfriend wisely told me that he was too much of a coward to kill himself while I was screaming at the tv, "YOU'RE TRYING TO SPARE YOUR FAMILY? YOU WEREN'T THINKING ABOUT YOUR FAMILY WHEN YOU WERE COMMITTING TREASON!"

Also, I pretty much hate Carrie for falling in love with a terrorist then having his baby THEN abandoning the baby, then having sex with a baby asset but I was all ready to ship her with Khan when he folded to Tasneem. He hurt me deep, man.

All this to say, Go Quinn, and (clearly) I was the worst person to watch the show with this week because I was yelling (read: screaming) at the tv the ENTIRE time.

Edited December 11, 2014 by VLove

[Pallas]

Saul. Saul. Considering your training, you should be able to give Quinn some useful information.

 

Saul had a bad week -- a bad year, he'd thought, until the bad week.  And he'd just learned that his capture and release had been part of an action that ended in the deaths of many Americans within their own Embassy.  Including the analyst (not case worker) Fara, who he had brought onto his team, mentored, promoted and visited in her home.  

 

Saul wasn't really there with Quinn in the bunker.  He was really and truly alone with his fervent desire that he and Haqqani had been blown up by the drone that his people didn't send; or that he and Haqqani's cadre had been blown up by the other drone his people -- led by his trusted, crazy, better half -- didn't send;  or that he, the boy, and everyone on either side within range had been blown up by the vest his people refused to provoke Haqqani's cadre into detonating.  And since none of those things happened, and this thing happened instead, right then and there Saul couldn't really come to grips with why anyone should ever do anything, ever again. 

[Lemons]

RIP, Fred from Roseanne. And Fara, too. She was all right.

 

Has anyone else noticed that Lipless has a whole Dick Cheney smirk thing going on?

The actor even does that talking out of one side of the mouth like dick Cheney. Cheney's smug face pops into my head every time Lockhart is on screen. Ew.

[Constantinople]

I'm wondering what Tasneem's plan is for her end game.

 

Haqqani's use for Tasneem has ended, or it will end once everyone on the list is killed.  She also knows a lot of information about him that is less than flattering (arranging for the drone strike on the wedding party).  Plus, Sandy told Carrie that his source for the wedding party intel had been right before; if Sandy was telling the truth that it was the same source, ultimately what Tasneem knows doesn't look too good for Haqqani.

 

The Taliban sympathizers in the ISI/Pakistani government need to think about covering their tracks.

 

Those in the ISI/Pakistani government who don't sympathize probably don't want to air that dirty laundry either, and almost certainly don't want the Americans to get her.  Once they know what she knows, there's no reason to keep her around.  If they had to choose between finding everything out and making sure she didn't fall into the hands of the Americans, they might very well choose the latter option.

 

It seems the Americans have the strongest reason to keep Tasneem alive.

[shapeshifter]

...Saul. Saul. Considering your training, you should be able to give Quinn some useful information....

Saul had a bad week -- a bad year, he'd thought, until the bad week.  And he'd just learned that his capture and release had been part of an action that ended in the deaths of many Americans within their own Embassy.  Including the analyst (not case worker) Fara, who he had brought onto his team, mentored, promoted and visited in her home....

Perhaps Saul didn't pay attention to anything after he had resolved in his mind that he was going to die rather than be traded for the release of Haqqani's men. During his escape attempt, he might have been paying attention, but (possibly before and) after that, why bother?

[polyhymnia]

Interesting: why do you say that?  He's not her superior; she is ISI and he is an upper-level minister, I believe. And it was Bunny who introduced Saul to Khan.  None of that means he can't be quietly supporting or even promoting Tasneem's work; I'm just wondering why you think so.  

I thought they (Bunny and Tasneem) were exchanging a lot of significant glances at the table talks as well as his very close contact involvement with the prisoner exchange.

[Kel Varnsen]

Wouldn't that list on that case had a failsafe, say if you don't open it with a key or code ink/acid/fire would destroy the contents inside? IDK 

I once read a non-fiction book about the CIA and how officers are sometimes given special briefcases for files. They are designed so that if you turn the key the right way they open. But if you turn the key the opposite way the case gets filled with kerosene and the case burns. 

 

I'm wondering what Tasneem's plan is for her end game.

 

I was confused about that scene with her and Khan in the car. Does she out rank him or something. Obviously he does not side with the Taliban, so why was he ok with a crazy shootout happening in the middle of his capital city?

[izabella]

I was confused about that scene with her and Khan in the car. Does she out rank him or something. Obviously he does not side with the Taliban, so why was he ok with a crazy shootout happening in the middle of his capital city?

 

Khan wasn't ok with it, and he doesn't side with the Taliban.  I think he felt he had to do what Tasneem said, though I don't know why.

 

I'm not entirely sure what Tasneem's role is as related to the Taliban.  I thought she was ISI, which is Pakistan's Intelligence service, so like our CIA.  She must rank higher than Khan, who is Pakistani military.  And it would appear the ISI might be in league with the Taliban, more than Khan knew or expected.

[John Potts]

Well, that was certainly tense. Quinn was suitably Badass (while watching I started to wonder what it would be like if he & Jack Bauer ever teamed up - the US would be unstoppable!) and I loved his admission that he wasn't sure they'd back down if attacked, Fara was calm in the face of death (I would have loved her to throw back at Haqqani "So do you!" when accused of killing her own kind, but she still knew she was probably doomed and didn't flinch) and the Ambassador was pretty calm when trapped in the bunker. The only one who was a real disappointment was Lockhart, who for all his hardline credentials, folded like a pack of cards once the pressure was on (OK, I know I've never faced the possibility of having somebody executed in front of me, but still, he should be tougher than me - he could copy what Benton Fraser did in a similar situation and just turn off the comms). As for why they didn't hand over a fake dossier - I'm guessing they didn't have time (and didn't think of it in advance). Still, I have faith in Carrie and Quinn's ability to save at least some people on the list.

 

Not sure what's going to happen with the Pakistani government, or indeed what side "Bunny" is on.

 

DiegoBurger I was really disappointed that Martha caved and threw the idiot traitor husband the belt. I would have preferred she dangle it in front of him and then throw it out of his reach.

 

We may hate him, but presumably she still has some residual feelings for him.

[tvfanatic13]

I haven't seen the last 2 episodes yet, but TO DATE (no spoliers please) do we know what Tasneem was holding over Duck's head to get him to commit treason? I don't recall learning this yet.

[Kel Varnsen]

I haven't seen the last 2 episodes yet, but TO DATE (no spoliers please) do we know what Tasneem was holding over Duck's head to get him to commit treason? I don't recall learning this yet.

I won't give you any spoilers but based on episode 10 I have no idea how the whole Sandy/Duck/Tasneem/Haquinni relationship worked. I mean Sandy gave her secrets in exchange for terrorist targets. She got those targets from Haquinni I guess. So he was getting his own people killed? And Sandy was getting the secrets from Duck? Because the Ambassador's Husband knew better secrets than a CIA station chief? And then the attack was made on the wedding. I get that it was to discredit the US and make it look like Haquinni was dead, but then what? The embassy invasion only really happened because of the Saul exchange, so what was their plan once he was assumed dead? And why did Sandy have to be killed?

I have seen the rest of the season and they never really explained how it worked. 

[halgia]

(Continuing with no spoilers.) It's not all totally clear, but I think it more or less makes sense:

I mean Sandy gave her secrets in exchange for terrorist targets. She got those targets from Haquinni I guess. So he was getting his own people killed?

Probably people he was willing to spare to lead up to his big plan, yeah.

And Sandy was getting the secrets from Duck? Because the Ambassador's Husband knew better secrets than a CIA station chief?

Probably both. He stole stuff from his wife that Sandy didn't have, plus whatever Sandy was willing to give up. Maybe the ambassador had more political secrets that Sandy felt less bad giving up than the operational details that he'd have.

And then the attack was made on the wedding. I get that it was to discredit the US and make it look like Haquinni was dead, but then what? The embassy invasion only really happened because of the Saul exchange, so what was their plan once he was assumed dead?

I think whatever plan they had to get in didn't happen because they took advantage of the Saul thing instead. Yeah, I don't think we saw what the alternative would have been.

And why did Sandy have to be killed?

They didn't need his info anymore (and he probably would have been more reticent with it after the major fuckup), and didn't want people to find out about the deal, probably?

[Jordan27]

I wished Fara would have answered,  "Yes, I kill Muslims, bad ones."