S41.E02: Juggling Chainsaws

[Whimsy]

Quote

Immunity challenges get interesting when a new idol is introduced that has a special twist

Original airdate 9/29/21

[mojoween]

Throat lozenges, Peachy.  Stock up.

Very very cool that Deshawn and Voce are doctors, but it’s a smidge unsettling for physicians to say how not smart they are.

Tiffany is delusional if she thinks her performance was only a *little* bit of the problem.

Yase is going to get Pagonged right out of existence.

New advantages are cool but how many trees gave up their lives for the dissertation of rules that were written on the parchment?

[Guest]

Props to Liana for being the only one to spell Voce's name correctly.

Jeff needs a lozenge.

If people keep bringing up butterflies at every challenge, everyone's going to know something's up.

[Haleth]

What’s with Probst’s voice?  He sounds like he’s 90 years old. He looks odd too.

Last week I could not stand Voce but this week I think the yellow tribe are idiots for booting him instead of useless Tiffany. I mean, who takes a nap in the middle of a challenge?

[LadyChatts]

Too bad Tiffany, Brad, and Evvie weren't on the same tribe together.  Between the first two being overly paranoid for no reason, and the third one over playing, this could be Tribe Chaos of Fun.  

I have no problem with Tiffany, but I think Evvie and Liana made a mistake keeping her over Voce.  And Evvie is really taking a gamble-how does she know a tribe swap isn't coming tomorrow, and the only person she winds up with from her former tribe is Xander?  That could totally screw her over.  In addition, she's proved to Xander her can't trust her, and I don't know why she thought spilling all to Deshawn was a good idea.

I like the twist on the advantage, but I hope something happens to keep Xander in it, because I don't have faith yellow tribe will be going on a winning streak.  I do think it's funny that Tiffany is complaining about how no energy and being exhausted, but then saying she isn't just the problem in challenges and why they are losing.

Edited September 30, 2021 by LadyChatts

[Lamb18]

Evvie was stupid to disclose the idol secrets to DeShawn. It's to her and her allies' advantage that the other two idols remain hidden as long as possible.

[truthaboutluv]

Quote

This is what happens when you are playing the game to prove a point rather than play the game for your own good.  She lost Xander's trust and has no idea when his idol might get activated or if Tiffany will stay loyal, if there will be a swap/merge anytime soon, or what.  She's way overplaying.

ITA. Look, I am completely here for an all-girls alliance and rejecting the sexist notion of woman = weak, so let's side with the big, tough guys and get rid of all the women. That said, the argument holds more weight when one of said women isn't very obviously a weak link and repeatedly underperforms in challenges. And she's also paranoid and unpredictable as well. 

They already got rid of Abraham last tribal, ostensibly for this same reason and apparently I guess he was also bossy and annoying people. But when you lose another challenge and the person who was on the chopping block last time is the one that largely loses it for you, yeah may be time to cut your losses. 

I agreed with Xander in pointing out how different the game is this season and so making decisions because one is just assuming a swap will come, is stupid. It's not like the show hasn't let a tribe damn near die away before swapping - Stephanie of the Tribe of 1 and Malcolm and Denise stayed on their tribe of doom until it was just the two of them. Now granted Denise still won that season and Stephanie made Final 3 but the point is, Evvie's making those decisions assuming what will or won't happen may come back and bite her in the ass. 

That said, Xander's season so far is starting to remind me of Spencer's original season. Spencer too ended up on a tribe where the women stuck together and they kept losing. And despite J'Tia being the weak link that largely caused them to keep losing, Kass and Tasha debated hard on keeping him over her when they went to tribal council again. And I have a strong feeling that may very well be Xander's predicament when they inevitably lose the immunity challenge again. 

Edited September 30, 2021 by truthaboutluv

[Lamima]

Dumb move. Either get out weakest link or the guy with all the power. Not some random. 

I wonder if Survivor is going to have a successful girls alliance this season...like BB had the cookout so Survivor will do girls alliance for the W. But they already had that, no? With the Black Widows (season 16?). 

[Straycat80]

Xander needs to stop being so trusting maybe? He’s has a lot of power now but it won’t matter. His team will probably continue losing challenges because they are keeping weak players like Tiffany and committed to an all women alliance. 

[LadyChatts]

14 minutes ago, truthaboutluv said:

ITA. Look, I am completely here for an all-girls alliance and rejecting the sexist notion of woman = weak, so let's side with the big, tough guys and get rid of all the women. That said, the argument holds more weight when one of said women isn't very obviously a weak link and repeatedly underperforms in challenges. And she's also paranoid and unpredictable as well. 

They already got rid of Abraham last tribal, ostensibly for this same reason and apparently I guess he was also bossy and annoying people. But when he lose another challenge and the person who was on the chopping block last time is the one that largely loses it for you, yeah may be time to cut your losses. 

I agreed with Xander in pointing out how different the game is this season and so making decisions because one is just assuming a swap will come, is stupid. It's not like the show hasn't let a tribe damn dear die away before swapping - Stephanie of the Tribe of 1 and Malcolm and Denise stayed on their tribe of doom until it was just the two of them. 

I'll also say that I'm all for an all girls alliance that is successful, but also smart.  And I have also been annoyed more times than I count in the past when a tribe loses, and it's automatically the woman's fault (usually the older woman).  Or the younger woman is too manipulative to keep around and might woo the young guys into her pocket, so she needs to go.  But I'm not sure what Evvie is doing is smart for her game.  Same with Liana.  What I really don't get is that they haven't even swapped or merged yet.  How does Evvie expect the all girl thing to go when that happens?  Is she content just proving her point while she's on her original tribe and acting like she did something big?  Does she think all the others girls in the game will abandon their male allies just to do an all girl thing, even if it's no benefit to their game?  I mean Tiffany is a fairly big factor as to why they are losing.  She's openly said she has no energy.  So...does Evvie not want to win challenges then?  I agree with your point about what Xander said, and that made me wonder if Evvie would change her mind.  And S10 didn't have a tribe swap despite how horrible Ulong was, and didn't even officially merge.  Stephenie just joined Koror by default.  

Evvie just seems to be playing for the approval of social media at this point.  I like her, but I wouldn't be surprised her game play tonight doesn't come back to bite her.  I would actually find it funny if Tiffany leads to her getting voted off.

Edited September 30, 2021 by LadyChatts

[ProfCrash]

What a stupid decision. Ignoring the fact that Tiffany sucks at challenges, she is paranoid. Evvie told Tiffany that she had read the note and that he didn’t have an idol but Tiffany wouldn’t trust Evvie. So they vote off Voce, who had no advantages an not opportunity to gain an advantage, keep Xander, who has an extra vote and could get immunity, and kept Tiffany who wouldn’t trust Evvie. 

Stupid, stupid, stupid. 

How the hell does Evvie explain this to Xander? At least if they voted out Xander Evvie could argue that Xander was too well set up in the game and she couldn’t risk drawing rocks to protect Xander. But what is the logic for voting out Voce?

I don’t have a problem with what Evvie told Deshawn. It could help her at a swap. I am not sure it is that damaging. 

Brad has a reason to be paranoid. He got a surprise vote at Tribal and Ricard tossed his name out and had to make Brad nervous with his comments. Brad is an idiot though because he trusted that Shan wouldn’t tell Ricard what Brad did. The going to listen in and getting back to look like he never left was brilliant. Doing it in front of Shan and telling Shan was stupid. Brad is not the savviest of players. And now Shan will make sure she never talks to anyone at the water well. 

Some really awful game play tonight. Seriously awful. 

[KaveDweller]

That seemed like a really dumb move, but Xander also didn't seem that shocked?

I like Evvie, I hope she didn't hurt herself by giving so much info to the guy on the other team. Especially since she told him she was considering voting out her ally, but didn't go through with it. 

I hope no one else finds idols this year and we just have Xander keep saying how butterflies are his dead relatives or whatever at every single challenge. 

[tvfanatic13]

Can someone please explain to me like I am 5 years old the rationale for voting out Voce? Even if I can accept keeping Tiffany (which, not really) I still can’t understand this vote. 

[KaveDweller]

3 minutes ago, tvfanatic13 said:

Can someone please explain to me like I am 5 years old the rationale for voting out Voce? Even if I can accept keeping Tiffany (which, not really) I still can’t understand this vote. 

In case Xander had an idol. One he could use, on top of the in-active 1/3 of an idol Evvie saw the note for.

It is terrible logic.

[neece26]

Quote

Can someone please explain to me like I am 5 years old the rationale for voting out Voce? Even if I can accept keeping Tiffany (which, not really) I still can’t understand this vote. 

Tiffany was paranoid and believed that Zander had an idol so she convinced the other two women to vote Voce with her to be sure that she would not go home if an idol was played.  

Quote

I hope no one else finds idols this year and we just have Xander keep saying how butterflies are his dead relatives or whatever at every single challenge. 

It would be really odd if he said that again at another challenge.  I would think that now that he has said his butterfly phrase, he will just wait for the other two phrases to be said.  

[KaveDweller]

1 minute ago, neece26 said:

It would be really odd if he said that again at another challenge.  I would think that now that he has said his butterfly phrase, he will just wait for the other two phrases to be said.  

That was my original assumption, but Dalton Ross wrote in his recap that he confirmed with producers it has to be said every time.

[PaperTree]

18 minutes ago, tvfanatic13 said:

Can someone please explain to me like I am 5 years old the rationale for voting out Voce? Even if I can accept keeping Tiffany (which, not really) I still can’t understand this vote. 

Tiffany firmly believed Xander had a real old-fashioned idol too, would use it and she would go and convinced the others and also her clairvoyant powers knew Voce had nothing.

11 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

That was my original assumption, but Dalton Ross wrote in his recap that he confirmed with producers it has to be said every time.

So this can end as badly as a Big Brother "twist".

[Pepper the Cat]

At some point in the challenge, the camera showed a poster with a word puzzle. Did anyone else see this?

it was like W - something & something. 
sorry I don’t know more, I was watching Survior and the Blue Jays using PIP.

but I am sure it is some type of clue?

anyways, yellow team is really stupid to keep the person that lost them them the challenge!

 

 

 

+

 

[LanceM]

Um Jeff, I think your average seventh grader could tell you that one in six chance equals 16.666666%. I mean seriously, it wasn't that impressive that Voce knew that.

As far as the vote itself i will reserve judgment as to whether it was dumb or not based on the fact that I am not convinced that Xander was at all shocked by it and secondly whether or not they swap next week.

 

 

[Cotypubby]

-Liana to Evvie and Tiffany, “Guys, he found it.”

-“Voce to Evvie and Xander, “Hey guys.”

-Jeff to everyone, “So how are you guys feeling on day 50-I mean 5?”

-Jeff at Tribal Council, “I just want to commend you guys.”

-Tiffany to the rest of her tribe at Tribal “Thank you guys.”

 

So uh, remind me again why Jeff/CBS had to create a fake controversy around the word “guys” and pander to a certain crowd when clearly no one is actually bothered by it? 🙄 

Edited September 30, 2021 by Cotypubby

[CraftyHazel]

36 minutes ago, Pepper the Cat said:

At some point in the challenge, the camera showed a poster with a word puzzle. Did anyone else see this?

it was like W - something & something. 
sorry I don’t know more, I was watching Survior and the Blue Jays using PIP.

but I am sure it is some type of clue?

anyways, yellow team is really stupid to keep the person that lost them them the challenge!

 

 

 

+

 

W+earth/plate-t/ring-r/I forget…but it works out to Worth Playing For

[dbell1]

So, Tiffany was basically hanging out and going backwards on the beam.  Then blows the plan to boot Xander and his advantages. BUT Voce goes? K. 

Edited September 30, 2021 by dbell1

[candall]

Crazy.   

Is Tiffany really that delusional about where their game was lost?  Maybe she passed out for a while on the beam.

Or maybe she knows that you can say the opposite of what happened, and even if people watched the event with their own eyes, you can brazen it out and people will believe you.

In any event, Tiffany cost them the game and then, instead of thanking her lucky stars she has two stalwart partners to keep her safe, she insists they need to switch their target from the dangerous man to the non-dangerous man. 

And they do it!

Evvie, grrrl, I wanted to hitch my wagon to your rainbow butt star, but this is all very disappointing.

.

[PaperTree]

22 minutes ago, Cotypubby said:

So uh, remind me again why Jeff/CBS had to create a fake controversy around the word “guys” and pander to a certain crowd when clearly no one is actually bothered by it? 🙄 

Ricard said he was (smh)

[bunnyface]

A girls' alliance is okay, if it gets you ahead.  Keeping Tiffany won't get them ahead.  She was all but useless in the challenge.  I don't remember her being all that brilliant last week either.  They deserve to lose.

What happens if Xander gets voted out before the other idols are used, so all three phrases can't be said?  The others are waiting for the butterflies trigger but it's never said so they have to sit on their broccoli revelations?  Or is it hidden again and they have to wait until it is discovered again.  This seems like a lot of going around waiting for something to happen.

 

[KaveDweller]

2 minutes ago, bunnyface said:

A girls' alliance is okay, if it gets you ahead.  Keeping Tiffany won't get them ahead.  She was all but useless in the challenge.  I don't remember her being all that brilliant last week either.  They deserve to lose.

Evvie's argument seemed to be that if a woman goes to the end with men, they will likely get the credit/votes. History shows this is true. So it makes sense to want to go to the end with all women. However, you have to get to the end. I don't think Tiffany is going to help with that, but I've been surprised by contestants before.

[knitorpurl]

I'm sorry but everything Tiffany did tonight should have been enough to shut down the women's alliance. At this point Evvie and Liana are just caving to Tiffany against their own logic. 

I saw a blonde woman on the blue team that I'm sure I didn't see on the first episode. Maybe we'll get to see that tribe sometime. But not until the yellow team's implosion is.complete, I guess.

[TVFan1]

There shouldn't be a swap this season. Would love to see the Yase tribe get obliterated. Keeping Tiffany is a big mistake if there is no swap. Lose again.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed Jeff's hoarse voice. I was wondering if something was wrong with my audio.

[Leeds]

Is it a requirement that competitors on Survivor have chiclet teeth? 

[BK1978]

2 hours ago, mojoween said:

Throat lozenges, Peachy.  Stock up.

Very very cool that Deshawn and Voce are doctors, but it’s a smidge unsettling for physicians to say how not smart they are.

 

Yeah what was up with his voice?  He sounded like the late Johnny Most (He was the voice of the Boston Celtics for decades and he had a very raspy voice from years of smoking).

I thought the same thing about them saying they were not smart.  I am not sure I would want either of them operating on me...but hey I am not smart either.

2 hours ago, Lamima said:

Dumb move. Either get out weakest link or the guy with all the power. Not some random.

I hate to say I co-sign but yeah, I co-sign.  As I say below, getting rid of Xander is perfectly logical and Evvie would have perfect cover for why she made such a move.  However, getting rid of Voce...well who knows how they will spin that one.  It will be interesting.

2 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

What a stupid decision. Ignoring the fact that Tiffany sucks at challenges, she is paranoid. Evvie told Tiffany that she had read the note and that he didn’t have an idol but Tiffany wouldn’t trust Evvie. So they vote off Voce, who had no advantages an not opportunity to gain an advantage, keep Xander, who has an extra vote and could get immunity, and kept Tiffany who wouldn’t trust Evvie. 

This, I mean I would not have had a problem with them voting out Xander because the logic was there for such a vote.  But to vote out Voce?  What the blue hell?  I mean I guess there was some sort of logic but it is like listening to a crazy person and following their instructions.  Sure it makes sense to them because they are out of their mind, but any sane person probably should not follow that logic.  Yet they did.

1 hour ago, Pepper the Cat said:

At some point in the challenge, the camera showed a poster with a word puzzle. Did anyone else see this?

it was like W - something & something. 
sorry I don’t know more, I was watching Survior and the Blue Jays using PIP.

but I am sure it is some type of clue?

anyways, yellow team is really stupid to keep the person that lost them them the challenge!

 

 

 

+

 

That is only for the viewers at home and more specifically aimed at the younger viewers.  It is all part of the "break the fourth wall" theme of the season.

I do like the little mini-videos they are doing with the contestants this season so we can get a little backstory about them.  They do something similar on Australian Survivor, though on there the videos are much longer, and to me it really helps me to invest in the contestants more.  It has been a bit since I watched the earlier seasons but I thought they did something like that back then.  If that is the case I wonder why they decided to bring it back.  What would also be nice is if they brought back the opening credits.  That is another thing that Aussie Survivor does and it really does help me remember people faster. 

I mean thus far out of this cast I only remember who Liana, Xander, Naseer, Tiffany, Evvie, JD, Ricard, and Brad are just based off seeing them.  I don't really know any of the others by name or visually.  That is probably more a me problem, but still having opening credits would help me out greatly.  I understand why they were cut but still.

[Lantern7]

Idols that can only be activated in unison via secret phrases? Oy. I thought The Challenge had a lock on the "secret agent bullshit" thing. I mean, it's funny to make people say weird-ass stuff out loud and deny them their votes if they don't succeed, and the "open at your peril" bit was nice . . . but it feels like overthinking things.

Damn, Brad is a gangly motherfucker, isn't he? With that said . . . if you and a friend go off to just "get water," it would probably pay to give the area a quick sweep before talking strategy. If you're a guy with a guy alliance partner? Just whip 'em out and whiz all around. Even if you don't hit someone, the shock would give away any hidden parties.

Naseer brings up growing up in Sri Lanka, I immediately think of Natalie & Nadiya. I wonder if he's a fan of either or both of them.

I'm hoping Tiffany got oxygen after the challenge. And yeah, she should have been sent out. Who is Voce?

Was Probst hoarse last episode? Or does shoving one's head up one's own ass lead to laryngitis?

I'm giving The Challenge priority now and DVRing Survivor. Once Legends of Tomorrow returns, I might relegate Survivor to Thursday viewing. I don't see anything changing my mine right now. Maybe if I went out on the street and said that out loud, Probst would be compelled to make improvements.

[LadyChatts]

38 minutes ago, knitorpurl said:

I'm sorry but everything Tiffany did tonight should have been enough to shut down the women's alliance. At this point Evvie and Liana are just caving to Tiffany against their own logic. 

I saw a blonde woman on the blue team that I'm sure I didn't see on the first episode. Maybe we'll get to see that tribe sometime. But not until the yellow team's implosion is.complete, I guess.

I didn't notice her, either, so I was shocked when she was chosen to sat out for the challenge.  It's not like there's a lot of blonde contestants this season, so you think she'd stand out.

43 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

Evvie's argument seemed to be that if a woman goes to the end with men, they will likely get the credit/votes. History shows this is true. So it makes sense to want to go to the end with all women. However, you have to get to the end. I don't think Tiffany is going to help with that, but I've been surprised by contestants before.

I don't disagree with Evvie's logic, but it's super early in the game to be thinking that far ahead.  All she did tonight was keep someone weak in her tribe, betray someone who may have a lot of power very soon that thought she was an ally, and reveal all to a guy that isn't even on her tribe.  What she said about a woman's game compared to a man's game made sense, but what she actually did tonight made no sense.

[millennium]

If "Voce" is pronounced "Vo-chay," shouldn't Jeff have said, "Time to count the vo-tays?"

[millennium]

Xander thinks he's a lock for the win (see what I did there?)

I wondered how many of his "I just found the hidden idol" expressions Xander practiced before his bathroom mirror before leaving for the island.

I don't like Xander.

[millennium]

29 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

I'm giving The Challenge priority now and DVRing Survivor.

Watching Survivor has been rough in the past but since I became a Challenge junkie during the pandemic, Survivor is nearly insufferable.

[Chicago Redshirt]

3 hours ago, Lamb18 said:

Evvie was stupid to disclose the idol secrets to DeShawn. It's to her and her allies' advantage that the other two idols remain hidden as long as possible.

I think it depends.

Evvie had been trying to juggle two alliances: the all-girls one and the Voce/Xander/her one. She could have the option of skipping the all-girls alliance due to Tiffany's horrible performance, even saying to Liana that it's time to bail on Tiffany because she did so poorly and they can only expect to be back at Tribal in a couple days. 

Telling Deshawn what's up is positive for Evvie if she makes the Voce/Xander alliance her true one, as the sooner Xander gets his vote back, the better it is for Evvie/Voce/Xander. 

Telling Deshawn what's up is positive for Evvie if there is a mini-tribe merge/swap soon, which there almost has to be soon if the current tribe she's on keeps on sucking. Or even if the merge happens further down the road. Because, as she said, it possibly means that Evvie has a potential friend in Deshawn when it's one tribe.

Telling Deshawn what's up is positive for Evvie in the short term because she can tell Xander that she's working for his benefit to get his vote restored as soon as possible. (I guess she could have just lied and said she told Deshawn, but Evvie doesn't strike me so far as a particularly good liar.)

[Chicago Redshirt]

46 minutes ago, LadyChatts said:

I don't disagree with Evvie's logic, but it's super early in the game to be thinking that far ahead.  All she did tonight was keep someone weak in her tribe, betray someone who may have a lot of power very soon that thought she was an ally, and reveal all to a guy that isn't even on her tribe.  What she said about a woman's game compared to a man's game made sense, but what she actually did tonight made no sense.

I don't know if it's ever too early in the game to be thinking very far ahead. 

And I think Evvie deserves some more credit. She has basically guaranteed that she's surviving next tribal assuming no merge. Even if Xander does get his vote back, it's three against one. I think Liana could safely be considered a low-risk to backstab her at this point, and Tiffany is unlikely to go after Evvie right now too. If anything, Tiffany is an easy vote off for next time, because her sucking at challenges is not redeemable.

Evvie can probably get back in Xander's good graces by explaining something semi-true: Tiffany was the ringleader who wanted Voce gone, and the only reason Xander isn't gone instead was because she thought he might have an idol. Evvie was afraid that it was going to be two votes for Voce and two votes for Tiffany which could force drawing for rocks, so the only way to make sure Evvie was safe was to vote for Voce. Heck, she can even spice it up with some lies: Tiffany wanted Xander gone, but Evvie took the target of his back and suggested Voce because Evvie wants to be Xander's ride-or-die. 

[dbro]

WTF!! So while the all girl alliance is strategizing silently at the water hole, I'm trying to follow the conversation by reading the subtitles. Then suddenly I get a little pop-up Skechers ad on screen that covers part of the subtitle!! After rewinding several times to try and hear what is said I give up and turn on my closed captions. Closed captions couldn't understand it either, it just left the sentence hanging with a -!??

Edited September 30, 2021 by dbro

[Maverick]

 WTF with all these Rube Goldberg rules this season?  You need a damn indexed, footnoted and cross-referenced users manual as thick as a Yellow Pages phonebook (google it, kids) to follow along.   Was Peachy on some recreational edibles when he came up with these rules (along with other "genius" ideas like whispering to the camera and officially confirming he doesn't give a shit what viewers think)?  I'm mean really, "code phrases"?  If I got one of those notes, I'd respond along the lines of Wade in Goldeneye when Bond delivers a code line:  "I mean, for crying out loud... another stiff-ass Brit, with your secret codes and your passwords. One of these days you guys are gonna learn just to drop it." 

 

[mertensia]

Xander's lock of hair he so artfully has cascading down his right side of his face makes me unreasonably stabby.

[Primetimer]

Just posted: Primetimer's Joe Reid weighs in how Season 41's best players seem to be those most steeped in Survivor fandom.

Quote

Two episodes into its 41st season, Survivor is coming in hot with new advantages, tons of strategy, and a pool of contestants who are clearly students of the game. For a show that's been on TV for over two decades, this shouldn't be surprising. But as players become ever more aware of not only the game mechanics (how idols work; when things like tribe swaps tend to happen) but also the meta narrative of how the game tends to be played, Survivor in this self-professed new era has become a show as much about itself as it is the game being played.

This showed up in a big way in episode 2, evidenced by the two types of Survivor super-fans who are playing the game. First, there are the people who are students of Survivor strategy, who know the language of the game and (perhaps more importantly) its nonverbal cues. Sometimes this can lead to overzealous play, as we saw tonight when Brad overreacted to the sight of J.D. and Ricard going to the water well and ran off to spy on them. But at their best, these students of the game have been playing out game scenarios in their heads for years, waiting for the moment when they can put their expert plans into motion. But we'll get back to Evvie shortly.

Also, on the topic of those "Rube Goldberg rules":

Quote

My secret theory that Jeff Probst got left stranded in Fiji for the duration of the production shutdown and dreamed up Season 41 as he was slowly going mad grows stronger.

Read his complete take on episode 2 here:
https://www.primetimer.com/features/survivor-finds-itself-deep-in-its-know-it-all-era

[candall]

2 hours ago, mertensia said:

Xander's lock of hair he so artfully has cascading down his right side of his face makes me unreasonably stabby.

Same.  That cunning little cluster of shiny bouncy curls on the outside of his bandana is a ridiculous affectation.

[Lamb18]

Need to correct something I said in the Live Chat thread. I said Xander reminded me of Devon from Millennials vs Gen X. I got him mixed up with Ken. Devon was from Heroes, Healers and Hustlers with Chrissy and Ben.

[violet and green]

The only player I really liked this episode was the sea. Beautiful colours!

The tribe with Naseer and Deshawn on it seems nice, but so long as they're not losing challenges we don't get enough of them, or Genie. I still like Brad, but he is clueless. I like that he's so keen. Can't stand the pastor, JD, or Ricard.

I hate those yellow tribe women being micromanaged badly by smug Evvie. Tiffany makes me murderous. I like Xander but I want to scream every time I see his curly lock dangling over his face like that. Dude! And blabbing to his 'alliance' about his (dis)advantage was so dumb.

And I really hope this is the only season, ever, that has Jeff telling us stuff, breaking the fourth wall breathlessly, and all these convoluted extra things, wasting time with people walking up that long trek to spin a wheel to the right of left, and that butterfly-broccoli-whatever idol. Argh!

At least we got a brief look at their hideous 'shelters'.

 

[Haleth]

5 hours ago, Maverick said:

 WTF with all these Rube Goldberg rules this season?  You need a damn indexed, footnoted and cross-referenced users manual as thick as a Yellow Pages phonebook (google it, kids) to follow along.   Was Peachy on some recreational edibles when he came up with these rules (along with other "genius" ideas like whispering to the camera and officially confirming he doesn't give a shit what viewers think)?  I'm mean really, "code phrases"?

Yeah, I'm still confused about the "risk your vote" thing too.  I've given up trying to figure out what they are doing and will just go with it.  

[ProfCrash]

I like the idea of a hidden immunity idol that requires others to find theirs. You take a risk in opening it and there are consequences. I think that is fine. I would prefer it just be that the idol doesn’t work until the other two are found but the outside note did give a warning. But the key phrases are far too stupid and glaringly obvious that something is up. They should have made them something related to the game that could have sounded normal. The way it is going to play out everyone is going to be like “Purple butterflies, broccoli, and whatever stupid catch phrase must mean someone has a super power, let’s vote them out.” 

If you are going to do something like this that is that different, then try and make it subtle instead of glaringly obvious. It is like they are putting up a flashing “He has an idol” sign over each contestants head which defeats the purpose of a hidden immunity idol. 

[Chicago Redshirt]

1 hour ago, Haleth said:

Yeah, I'm still confused about the "risk your vote" thing too.  I've given up trying to figure out what they are doing and will just go with it.  

I think the Risk Your Vote is straightforward enough. It's a prisoner's dilemma situation: 

If all people choose "protect," they retain their votes as normal.

If all people choose "risk," each will lose their votes at the next tribal they are at.

If at least one person chooses "risk" and at least one person chooses "protect," then the riskers get rewarded with an extra vote that can be used up till some point (I think someone said F6, but I don't remember).

So it takes trying to put yourself in the mind of the other people who are there. Do they seem like they would take the conservative approach, in which case it might make more sense to risk? Are they unpredictable, in which case it's probably better to protect?

This minigame is of course different when players can anticipate it coming. Evvie was able to straight up tell Deshawn she was gong to protect her vote, so his choice to risk his vote was really no risk at all. (I mean, it would have been pretty crazy and stupid for her to say she's going to protect and then go PSYCH!) Which I guess is another way I think Evvie was smart and built trust with Deshawn -- she showed him she was truthful and conveyed on him an advantage. Presumably, at some point he might reciprocate.

It also will potentially make vote counting much more complicated. It will presumably be hard for the players to know who risked and got rewarded, versus who protected. I imagine there will be people bluffing and saying they got extra votes when they didn't, or saying they chose protect when they have extra votes. And there will always be the issue of when do you think you need to use that extra vote.

Add to the mix the notion that the shared HII might mean up to two players are voteless until all three are discovered, and it seems like a fun mixup.

Edited September 30, 2021 by Chicago Redshirt

[Lady Calypso]

19 minutes ago, ProfCrash said:

I like the idea of a hidden immunity idol that requires others to find theirs. You take a risk in opening it and there are consequences. I think that is fine. I would prefer it just be that the idol doesn’t work until the other two are found but the outside note did give a warning. But the key phrases are far too stupid and glaringly obvious that something is up. They should have made them something related to the game that could have sounded normal. The way it is going to play out everyone is going to be like “Purple butterflies, broccoli, and whatever stupid catch phrase must mean someone has a super power, let’s vote them out.” 

If you are going to do something like this that is that different, then try and make it subtle instead of glaringly obvious. It is like they are putting up a flashing “He has an idol” sign over each contestants head which defeats the purpose of a hidden immunity idol. 

I think that the idea of this new Beware Advantage has a lot of potential, BUT I think it needs some tweaks. First off, I do think perhaps, some sort of additional warning before the player opens it is necessary. I know the warning was basically "beware if you open this blahblahblah" but having them open it ONLY to find out that they now have lost their vote until the other two tribes find their notes, AND you have to utter a stupid secret phrase constantly until you hear the other two phrases? That's a lot. I know it's a season of more risks and all that, but my goodness, I think having an additional warning before the person opens it is a good idea, since nobody would think that it would be as big as LOSING YOUR VOTE right off the bat, and especially in small tribes where your vote DOES matter. 

I like the Beware Advantage, I do, but they need to make the phrases less odd. I get that it's supposed to be a risk and having an out there phrase to utter is a risk you're taking to get the idol, but now Xander has to work that phrase in AGAIN, and it's just going to be obvious that something is up when he says it again. There's taking a risk, and there's being so obvious that it could ruin their game before they even get the idol. 

I do think Evvie really tried to get everything they wanted (keeping Xander, a close ally and a shield ahead of them, and keeping Tiffany for their girls alliance) but I think it might be something that backfires on them down the line. Tiffany has shown to be more paranoid and untrustworthy than Xander or Voce. Tiffany not believing Evvie when they said upfront that they saw the note, saw what Xander had to do to get that idol, and therefore DIDN'T HAVE THE IDOL 100%, means that Tiffany doesn't trust Evvie in the slightest. Which means Tiffany's chances of flipping OR ruining Evvie's game are much higher than the two men who did trust them. Having Liana isn't going to be enough for Evvie in the long run.

Which, I guess is why they approached Deshawn and told them certain things to get trust when a swap or merge happens. It's a risk as well, because Deshawn may not even want to work with them down the line, but I do appreciate Evvie's form of thinking. I love their strategy and explaining their thought process. It makes it easier to see that they're NOT stupid and not making bad choices just for the hell of it. More that they're taking a risk that may or may not pay off. 

I can see why Evvie kept Xander over Voce, but they need to be careful. It's good, because Xander has no vote and as long as he has no vote, he has not idol. And if they go to Tribal again next week, they can vote him out, easy peasy. But they're also risking keeping Tiffany, who has proven to be unreliable and unpredictable AND she sucks at challenges, to boot. I mean, taking probably about three minutes to cross the beam, even failing to shimmy across it at one point? And then sitting in her confessional, saying that she's totally not getting voted out because her girls will keep her, no matter what? There's confident, and then there's delusion. 

Not much happened on the other tribes, besides Brad failing to be like Tony, and Naseer showing how useful he is to his tribe, which means he might be the safest one if their tribe loses. Which is a step up from Danny/Deshawn/Sydney wanting him out last week. 

[JudyObscure]

Xander's tuft of curls over one eye, Liana's twin braids falling directly over her pupils, and Tiffany's carefully placed facial ringlets all make my scissors fingers itch.  People who deliberately impair their own vision irritate and bewilder me, but when, like Tiffany, you're old enough to know better you really, really deserve to get voted out.   Maybe she was thinking about her hair while she was day dreaming on the balance beam.

[violet and green]

Mussing with their stupid hair instead of building a proper shelter!