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S11.E02: Licked Up and Down

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As the ladies try to show Teresa the error of her ways, Jackie struggles with tension in her marriage. On the other hand, Jennifer's relationship with her mother worsens and Frank tries to repair the rift between Dolores and David.

Airdate: 02.24.2021

Please limit discussion to the events of this episode; current events are spoilers.

Nice to see the klassy titles continue for these klassy ladies.

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Nice to see the klassy titles continue for these klassy ladies.

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they'd have an easier time climbing Mt. Everest barefoot. 

While climbing backwards and juggling flaming swords.

Edited by Hiyo
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Ah, Jennifer’s storyline...marriage counselor to her parents. 
 

That’s boring. I’m also over the Tre needing to hate, manufacture drama (lies) and get bent out of control too. What happened to watching people have fun. Especially when we can’t with having to isolate.  

Edited by Mindthinkr
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Dolores is gorgeous without makeup!  She looks nothing like her sisters or brother in that picture they showed.

Jennifer is trying really REALLY hard to look like Kim Kardashian.

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I oddly enjoyed the conversation between Frank and David. I thought it was kind of cute.

I appreciated what Gia said to her mom on the phone. She had common sense.

Otherwise, kind of boring episode lol. 

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You know it’s a boring episode when Frank and David were the best part.

 I still think it’s weird that a doctor likes guns, though.

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Ok, that didn’t take long for Jackie to begin her spin tour by telling Margaret that she told Teresa vis a vis Gia, “I don’t know if it’s true, but...”. FICTION.  Or, as the Red Menace used to say, “LIE!”

If I had a dollar for every time the word “analogy” got tossed around on this episode, good God.  It’s reverberating now to Melissa and Marge Sr.  For the people who think the analogy was implied by virtue of Jackie’s tone—which I could see—wouldn’t it be so much more honest of Jackie to say just that?  Because Jackie is making it sound like an unambiguous analogy, and that part simply isn’t true.  I’m a reasonably intelligent person, and I struggle with it.  If Jackie wanted to be even more honest and go another step to show us that she how evolved she is (as opposed to Teresa), she could go the extra mile and say that she was trying to set Teresa off with the “analogy,” rather than trying to get Teresa to see the light, because that part is clear to me.  To err is human, to pretend you don’t understand what you did is bovine.  

Jackie is never going to look at Teresa again or spend any more time with her?  Sure.  Is this like on RHBH when they went to Amsterdam, Kim said “let’s not talk about the husband,” Lisa Rinna broke a glass at the table and went for Kim’s throat and later told Kyle that she would never spend time with Kim again, only for Rinna to literally have a sit-down with Kim in Kim’s hotel room in the same episode?  Is there a different space-time continuum on Real Housewives?  The only way Jackie will not be amongst Teresa again is if she quits the show.  Hmm.

Teresa is lying or at least being hypocritical when she says that Jackie isn’t strong if she can’t take the rumor about her husband cheating.  Has Teresa met herself and the 90 seasons she spent trying to put a lie—with violence—to the cheating rumors about Joe?  All the glasses that Teresa has broken over the seasons stood up and voiced their objection to that one.  

Good job, Margaret, season nine, casting aspersions on Jennifer’s brother’s “mail-order bride” now that he is married and has two beautiful children.  Maybe Margaret should worry more about her own family.  

Dolores is being passive-aggressive with David, I think, as he is being with her.  She came on the show with a broken engagement to a guy who also couldn’t commit.  Frank has said in the past that he’s not with Dolores because he’s not 100% sure he can be faithful.  What is going on with her?  Is her picker off?  So Dolores’s and Jennifer’s parents are separated?  Jackie’s parents live separately.  Marge Sr dates married men.  And Melissa’s dad used to “go out for milk” for days at a time, leaving her with a potential half-sister.  What is going on with these parents and do they deserve their own franchise?

OMG, Teresa has unhung oil paintings of herself in her bedroom!!!  She is like Suzy on Curb Your Enthusiasm.  

“Wow, Melissa, maybe if I was a mirror, you would greet me.”  -Jen.  She is gold.  Who else would have ever had the balls to say that, other than maybe season 6 Dina?  

Margaret is an interesting one to tell Teresa directly to her face what Jackie said and didn’t say to Teresa when Margaret wasn’t even in the room.  Last season when Margaret said that Jennifer’s husband sleeps in his girlfriend’s bed, it took her about 2.4 seconds to realize it was time to apologize because that was out of line.  Margaret is free to tell Teresa that she thinks Teresa owes Jackie an apology, but it’s not for Margaret to say that it was an analogy when she didn’t hear firsthand and Teresa did.  

Oh, we have to do that Housewives thing where they have to pretend there is a reason they’re going on a trip other than for the show?  Yawn.  

Ok, Teresa has a crush on Evan.  This is clearly schadenfreude.  Teresa’s excuses for saying Evan was cheating were so lame.  He is a swa-vay guy and Jackie doesn’t give him blowjobs?  Not the best evidence.  Doesn’t convince me he’s cheating.  What does convince that he’s cheating is Jackie’s reaction.  I don’t know whether I’m happy she skipped the trip or if it would have been great fun if she’d been there.  

Frank looked scary in that picture with his injuries.  He looked sad and droopy in the face like a post-deportation Joe Giu.  If there has to be a guy scene on a show about housewives, I’m at least grateful it doesn’t involve either of the Joes (Joe B or Joe G, can’t stand either one).  Catania has really good manners in restaurants (I’m a former server, and I pick up on those little things), and I like that about him.  

Party of one, maybe, but I don’t enjoy drunk Melissa aka Melissa Motherfucking Gorga.  She is just a sloppy drunk.  If she has something to say to Teresa’s bullshit, she would have looked like so much less of a wuss if she’d done it sober.  She’s afraid of Teresa too, she’s just not first in line.  

Teresa is blaming tequila?  Again?  That’s what prompted her to urge Danielle to pull Margaret’s ponytail last season.  Maybe it’s time to put the bottle down for a beat.  Teresa’s last, best hope is to say her gossip about Evan is revenge for Jackie’s talk of Teresa’s cheating last season, and even that excuse is flawed.  But nothing else can be said that is remotely defensible, and Teresa should just stick to that one line of dialogue.  

Jackie cutting hair in the driveway with her shitty posture and nervous tics?  Ok, Teresa pissed her off, but what did we do as viewers to be subjected to this?  It makes Jackie’s underwhelming birthday party for her kids last year look like Marie Antoinette at Versailles.  Can we go back to Frank and David please?  Nothing is more important to Jackie than her family?  Is that why she didn’t talk to her sister for 15 years?  And you don’t have to be friends with anybody you don’t want to be friends with?  Then why was she so flabbergasted last season when Jennifer announced that Dolores doesn’t consider her a friend?  Get your shit together FL Jackie (that’s Fordham Law Jackie to us peons).  Jackie’s complaining that she didn’t “get to” go on vacation with her friends?  Who stopped her?  Did she need permission to leave the state, the way Teresa did a few seasons ago?  Vag up, Miss Lady, and go to Lake George if you’re such a boss.  Why let Teresa stop you?  

Lexi...just no.  I don’t think she’s going to last, the way Barbara K didn’t last on RHNYC.  We’ll all always look back on this as the season that Margaret’s weird worker friend Lexi was on.  Hopefully.  

Teresa’s white dress with the black bow was working for me in Lake George.  Everyone else looked kind of slouchy.  Just to be fair, Jackie looked good in her pink dress last episode.  It was tailored well to her body.  

I don’t believe Melissa that she doesn’t use a vibrator.  This is part of her season three “be a lady in the parlor and a whore in the bedroom” shtick.  She’s not putting out on a regular basis.  Anyone who bought her book should get their money back.  

Teresa clearly wanted Jackie to be there so that she could mind-fuck her.  She should have something else going on.  Despite this, solid episode.  It went so fast.  I really enjoy Melissa vs Jennifer when Jackie is out of the equation as Melissa’s wingman.  Melissa knows she can’t hold her own against Jennifer, so she looks like she’s caught in the deep end of the swimming pool with a quickly deflating floaty swan.  Someone asked on last week’s thread if anyone wants to talk about anything besides Jackie and Teresa.  Yes, I do!  I want to talk about the quiet feud between Melissa and Jen.  This has the potential to be very interesting.  Jennifer will get a bitch together with her mouth faster and more thoroughly than Teresa can hurl a glass.  

Edited by LibertarianSlut
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Jackie says she was okay with missing the trip and wanted to spend quality time with her kids then we hear her telling her daughter that even though her bags were packed, they are mean girls, don't associate with mean girls, etc...why do these HW's talk to their pre teen kids about things that go one with the other HW's such as fights, they go in to details that the kids don't need to hear about, why not just say she wanted to stay home with her family?  

Tre can't shut up about Jackie and the other women are trying to not dwell on the situation by feeding in to Tre's constant comments about Jackie not being there but yet every conversation circles back to the Jackie story.

Joe is selling vibrators?  He always struck me as the type that would get his nose out of joint if a woman whipped one out to add to their bedroom fun, like it would be an insult and it would hurt his ego.

Margaret likes a bold wallpaper, doesn't she?  Honestly, I would love to see the finished product, she has very tall ceilings, could be a very cool look once the furniture is in.

Frank seems like a nice guy.

David most likely will not put a ring on it.

 

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After a summer of Covid 19 and being in lockdown with all her kids, Jackie tries to convince us that she’s so happy to be home with her family and not on the trip. Try again.

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Hasn’t Margaret ever watched RHOA?  What’s with all the food?  Doesn’t she know there’s supposed to be just one crab cake just for her?

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1 hour ago, LibertarianSlut said:

Jackie cutting hair in the driveway with her shitty posture and nervous tics?  Ok, Teresa pissed her off, but what did we do as viewers to be subjected to this?  It makes Jackie’s underwhelming birthday party for her kids last year look like Marie Antoinette at Versailles.  Can we go back to Frank and David please?  Nothing is more important to Jackie than her family?  Is that why she didn’t talk to her sister for 15 years?  And you don’t have to be friends with anybody you don’t want to be friends with?  Then why was she so flabbergasted last season when Jennifer announced that Dolores doesn’t consider her a friend?  Get your shit together FL Jackie (that’s Fordham Law Jackie to us peons).  Jackie’s complaining that she didn’t “get to” go on vacation with her friends?  Who stopped her?  Did she need permission to leave the state, the way Teresa did a few seasons ago?  Vag up, Miss Lady, and go to Lake George if you’re such a boss.  Why let Teresa stop you?  

Are you glad I stayed home?  Are you happy I stayed home?  I really hate that kind of begging for affirmation. Does she need it for herself or is it for the benefit of the viewers?  Either way it is off-putting.  Glad she wasn't along for the Lake George trip despite having to pay for it by having to hear about her and watch her with what I believe she called them last week, the four most adorable children.  To me this woman is the human embodiment of nails on a chalkboard.  

Edited by ichbin · Reason: clarification
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Nice to know that Jackie immediately said it was a analogy. I was wondering if her doing press and saying that now was revisionist history. So really Jackie didn’t put anything out there about Gia, Bravo is to blame for leaving a rumor hanging out there for a week before actually showing her true intentions. 

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Jackie might have a law degree but smart... I don't know anymore.

If you "WIN," if you're so sure your husband has nothing to hide, if you're SO SURE your analogy was clear and perfectly stated, then why are you hiding at home. If she's so secure in her marriage and her retaliation, she should have no problem going on that trip with sycophants like Mel and Marge and icing Tre out or having another go at her. In fact, she could have taken valuable camera time to explain the analogy to Tre and make her look dumb. 

But Jackie is a coward. If you won, honey, you wouldn't be retreating into your enclave and letting others state your case for you. Lawyers don't do that. It's not like Denise on BH who had no allies and crazy shit being thrown at her every dinner - Mel and Marge are right there like loyal soldiers for her. But see, Jackie knows that while she INTENDED to make an analogy about Gia, what came out was a statement. She was mad, and she misspoke. It could be forgivable, but not when you are constantly touting your intelligence and your superior position. 

So now she's home, without camera time, stewing and figuring out how to spin what she intended but failed to execute. 

I didn't miss her one bit. Tre is so dumb - SHUT UP ABOUT HER SHE ISN'T EVEN THERE!

I loved Tre's black and gold top.

Once again, Gia is the voice of reason. This is why Gia (and not Tre) is worth defending. Gia and Tre are two separate entities. You can know Jackie was injured and that Gia was injured while recognizing that Tre started all this chaos by running her mouth. 

Overall this bored me to tears. 

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Welp. The shooting range. 

Dr. David whoring out his buddy's ammo place w/his t shirt advertising. The tshirt had that hard look that it's never been washed before and it's not a t shirt that he wears a lot because I do not think that size is his comfort zone. He is a pretty fit guy and it gave him an unattractive bloated belly. It wasn't natural. Felt contrived and not like two sportsmen out at the range. Felt like two tough guys putting on for the camera. The supervising staff were creepy in the background.  That is just how I felt YMMV, I am aware this is a potentially triggering  (no pun intended) topic that's just how I felt personally. I feel like this is a place I can express that. 

 Frank with his super fly high top no socks wrestling shoes. He is a dummy but yes, he entertains me at the end of the day, I am expecting roid rage and he is funny and vulnerable. I think Delores and Frank and David works! 'Ceptin when they're being tough guys at the range. That wasn't for me. 

 

Edited by Alonzo Mosely FBI
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petty department:  I would rather NOT drink a cup of coffee than use that powdered Carnation stuff that tre was dumping in her coffee.  Maybe its a diet thing - I don't know, but my coffee w half and half is non negotiable.  

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Jackie didn't make it that clear as she said it was to Marge with the "that's like me saying" I find it odd Jackie didn't say online it was edited because they way she said it, it wasn't that clear until she was all "I don't know where I heard it but I did." I don't have the original ep on my DVR anymore but my DVR recorded that behind the show of last week and "That's like me saying" wasn't there, I checked. Was it in the original ep? Jackie still let comments under her tweet saying it was an analogy go unchecked of people saying "oh we know she does coke."  Jackie's comment of "Teresa's there with my friends" was lame. They're your co-stars, You and Jen are shaky, maybe Marge is friendly with you but it won't last beyond the show, Melissa will ditch her like she did Kathy and she's Teresa's SIL, and Delores and Teresa have an actual friendship since before the show with Dina. That said, Melissa and Marge would have defended her, she didn't go because she is a coward. Cutting the kids hair was lame and did not feel like she'd been "doing it all lockdown."

 

I still say Jackie isn't a good HW and not nearly as smart as she claims. Teresa was making herself look stupid by denying she didn't spread a rumor when she clearly did. Gia handled it well at the time but I'm sure Jackie not giving much of a damn about the online stuff said about her is the change of tune. If Gia is to blame for not turning off comments as I've heard some say, then isn't Jackie responsible for not deleting comments under her tweet about Gia or not replying to them saying it wasn't true back off? Gia did not involve herself in it. Gia doesn't go on trips like the Manzo kids did. I don't even know if Gia has been around Jackie? She's only ever gotten involved in the Gorga/Giudice stuff. Jackie was laughing on Twitter that Teresa said she'll demolish her with her tongue but also ran out of the room. 

 

Jen's comment about Melissa greeting her if she were a mirror was funny. However, I don't like the Gorga/Giudice kids involved in the adult stuff, and I was uncomfortable seeing Jen's daughter (Olivia?) in the kitchen as the grandmother was crying about the grandfather. She's too young to have to comfort her grandma over her the marriage and now grandpa lives with  them, is Olivia going to feel uncomfortable over making grandma cry? Referring to the grandson by another name is passive aggressive and not fair to Jen's brother/wife/the baby if she keeps it up when the baby is old enough to understand Grandma doesn't use his name. That's good the brother was able to Turkey instead of having to wait it out in America (I know someone who met/married someone in another country in their grandparents town, and couldn't stay there until the spouse could come so their first year or so of marriage was largely apart.)

 

Delores/David/Frank is odd but yet one of the less toxic aspects of the show. 

Edited by Gigi43
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“Tre is truly a box of rocks.”

Oh come on now. I’m sure a box of rocks could easily out-think her.

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23 minutes ago, Gigi43 said:

"That's like me saying" wasn't there, I checked. Was it in the original ep? Jackie still let comments under her tweet saying it was an analogy go unchecked of people saying "oh we know she does coke."  Jackie's comment of "Teresa's there with my friends" was lame. They're your co-stars, You and Jen are shaky, maybe Marge is friendly with you but it won't last beyond the show, Melissa will ditch her like she did Kathy and she's Teresa's SIL, and Delores and Teresa have an actual friendship since before the show with Dina. That said, Melissa and Marge would have defended her, she didn't go because she is a coward.

Thank you, it wasn't. Now, did Bravo cut it? We will never know. But that's why Jackie can't claim the moral high ground over Tre - she's very smart, you see. She's just so super-duper intelligent with her analogy. She's smart enough to know the crap Tre spread about her hubby will be taken as fact, and that's not fair, and that's Tre's fault.

Ergo, even if preface a statement with, "What if I said" or "How would you feel if I said" you should know that Bravo could cut that part for drama and ONLY present the drug accusation. Which of course they would do for drama! So Jackie really just needs to own that she got angry (justifiably) and got down in the muck with Tre, and in the process went for a really low blow that hurt a person who did nothing to her (Gia). 

But she won't own that, and that's why I can't stand her. She thinks she's above this show and everyone in it. Honey, you're a bookend in the credits and farthest from Andy on reunion couches. Wake up and realize where you are on the chess board. 

Now, quite stupidly, she's given Tre carte blanche to never apologize - and to hold that comment about Gia against her forever. But she should send Tre a fruit basket for the storyline cuz she's never had one this good before!

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16 hours ago, Axie said:

You know it’s a boring episode when Frank and David were the best part.

 I still think it’s weird that a doctor likes guns, though.

Right??? Jersey.

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53 minutes ago, BrownBear2012 said:

Right??? Jersey.

That gun place (with the oh-so-jaunty z at the end of its name) is right near me. Not that I would be there, but it made me wonder how the hell I have never run into any of these people “in the wild”? My friends have, but not me!

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5 hours ago, Alonzo Mosely FBI said:

I think it's good that the discussion place about older couples and the struggle with a marriage and the emotions, it was sad. But important. 

Out of this entire episode, my heart hurt for Jen's father.  That poor man looked like he was just used to cowering in the wake of her mother's mean, toxic energy.  And who doesn't her mother have an issue with?  Her husband, her gay son, the son with the new baby.  Whew.  She is....a lot.

Delores/David/Frank (and Frank Jr.!) are fascinating.  I like them all.  They need their own show where they can be weird and funny without any Teresa distraction.

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52 minutes ago, SuburbanHangSuite said:

Out of this entire episode, my heart hurt for Jen's father.  That poor man looked like he was just used to cowering in the wake of her mother's mean, toxic energy.  And who doesn't her mother have an issue with?  Her husband, her gay son, the son with the new baby.  Whew.  She is....a lot.

Delores/David/Frank (and Frank Jr.!) are fascinating.  I like them all.  They need their own show where they can be weird and funny without any Teresa distraction.

I had the opposite reaction watching Jen’s mother. She looks quite a bit younger than the father. Jen herself said she did not remember seeing much love between them and that her parents had an arranged marriage. I am thinking that mother has had to wait on this guy for a long time and has finally had enough. Father can now hang out at Jen’s house where someone else will wait on him.

I really enjoyed the segment with Delores and her mother. Even though Delores is in her 50’s her mom was still mothering her.

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Ok, not to change the subject but when can we have an intervention with the Marge about her clothing choices? I mean, I was sweating out of every crevice watching her try not to have a nip slip in that nightgown/sweater combo. 

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Teresa keeps bringing up Jackie on the trip because somewhere in that dinosaur brain she knows what’s up.  Looking for affirmation.

Edited by 12momine
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Jens mom seems like the type of woman to berate her husband until he finally snaps and says something nasty back, then cries that he called her a bitch and is so mean to her (completely ignoring the fact that she provoked him for hours before he retaliated). 

Jacks, what you won was a spot on the top of tre's shit list. Then you proved you can't handle being there by bailing on the trip. Your a mouse in a standoff with a cobra.

Juicy Joe is selling sex toys. He always struck me as a bend her over, bang it out in 5 min, don't care if she gets off as long as I do, kinda lay.

So David is a pussy maestro and a good guy. If he wasn't a commitmentphoebe he'd be a catch. 

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On 2/24/2021 at 7:15 PM, escape said:

Jackie lost control of the fight.  Teresa did not come in guns blazing.  I think she knew she was wrong.  But then Jackie escalated it by saying she's not stupid, she's a lawyer and that she wins.  And now she's having to defend herself with what she said about Gia.

We all know Teresa holds grudges.  Not only will she not apologize now, she will never forgive Jackie.

Why does anyone care if Teresa forgives her? I will never understand why everyone caters to her. She just may be the dumbest HW in the franchise, which is quite an accomplishment, and us constantly mad at something.

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6 minutes ago, chlban said:

Why does anyone care if Teresa forgives her? I will never understand why everyone caters to her. She just may be the dumbest HW in the franchise, which is quite an accomplishment, and us constantly mad at something.

Yeah, Tre's not happy unless she has an adversary. She really tried to stir that pot several times during the episode.

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7 hours ago, Real Housewife LI said:

Is there anyone who didn’t understand that she was making a comparison/analogy? I totally got what she was doing....and talking about a rumor you heard (Teresa) is spreading a rumor..and even if she is too stupid to u derstand what Jackie was doing....saying it at a party with tons of people multiple times is very different than saying something in a private conversation with the one person the “rumor” effects. 

Jackie isn't exactly good at wordsmithing... what she should have said is "Teresa...if you were having a birthday party for one of your children and someone was walking around telling people that one of your children was using drugs in the bathroom, how would you feel?" Even Teresa would be able to see that as a "what if" situation that is similar to what she did. There's always the possibility however, that Teresa would still explode and refuse to see or admit that she was wrong...she's just not capable of being an adult and having a moral compass. I do love how the Bravo producers do a mash up of all her outbursts at other people when they accused Juicy Joe, purveyor of sex toys, of cheating on her...brilliant!

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On 2/24/2021 at 10:02 PM, Legalbeagle421 said:

I oddly enjoyed the conversation between Frank and David. I thought it was kind of cute.

I appreciated what Gia said to her mom on the phone. She had common sense.

Otherwise, kind of boring episode lol. 

David isn't in love with Delores...and he obviously has commitment issues. The more she nags him about it the further away he pulls from her. Maybe it just isn't meant to be...and honestly, I just don't understand her obsession with all the cosmetic work. She looks beautiful and her body is perfect...let it be.

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It makes me chuckle that the drink Marg always offers guests is a cold brew coffee. I love me some iced coffee and would he thrilled with the offer but what a specific and somewhat unusual thing to offer. She did it in the last episode too. I’ll admit that I have mostly checked out of RHOJ for the past few seasons so I kept wondering if she maybe has her own cold brew brand that she is trying to market via the show - does she? 🤷🏻‍♀️

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