S39.E14: Island of the Idols Reunion

[Ellee]

I don’t know.  I felt like the winner this year was one of multiple people on the jury.  Yeah, you get that feeling every year but it’s because who you are rooting for got voted out. This year there were more on the jury that I wanted to win than the 3 up for it. 

Think the Sia awards were only announced for the 3 but I feel like there was more that received money but not announced.  Besides that feeling, who are we to spend Sia’s money?

Dean came on strong in the end.  I wonder if he has stayed up nights wondering if he should have made a big push a little earlier.

 

 

[JudyObscure]

4 hours ago, GaT said:

 

I wonder how Sia determines how much money to give? I realize it's her own money & she can give it or not how she wants, but she gave the black man $15,000 & the 2 white women $100,000. I can't imagine that that isn't going to become a thing on social media, especially right after a discussion about race.

 

[sarcasm]Oh My Gosh, she didn't give any money at all to Aaron, Missy, or Lauren so clearly  she's the Grand Wizard of the KKK.[/sarcasm]

I was really surprised that Noura didn't get a single vote.  She was all over the place, lied, betrayed  and talked too much, but she was working and playing hard the whole time.  I also thought she looked great at the reunion.  She was getting a certain cave-woman look there toward the end so it was nice to see the recovery. I could finally believe she really had all that dating experience.

[Bryce Lynch]

4 hours ago, 30 Helens said:

 As this was airing, the conversation at my house...

My husband: “How come the black guy only got 15,000?”

Me: “‘Cause Sia’s racist.”

I was joking, but, yeah. It’s gonna be a thing.

I think better question is why Jamal got anything.  He stirred up racial strife over absolutely nothing and called grown women girls. 

He made a solid, but kind of obvious, comment, about Aaron being wrong for assuming he would know if sexual harassment was going on, but that was it.  

[Drogo]

43 minutes ago, Ellee said:

Dean came on strong in the end.  I wonder if he has stayed up nights wondering if he should have made a big push a little earlier.

I felt he had the non-Lauren jury 100% with him until he perjured himself over the F2 deals and caved during the related questioning. 

I don't feel slighted for Jamal because he was just given $15K he didn't have before.  

UO: I found Kellee to be annoying.  She speaks now as if she wasn't believed when she spoke up, and doesn't acknowledge the steps that were taken and the unique challenges of the producers,  ie removing a player against the wishes of the sole complainant.  Glad that's over.  Now let it be written in the pre-show contracts that no one should touch anyone without the touchee's express verbal consent regardless of touch location or intention and if anyone violates it, bye.

[Bryce Lynch]

16 minutes ago, Drogo said:

I felt he had the non-Lauren jury 100% with him until he perjured himself over the F2 deals and caved during the related questioning. 

I don't feel slighted for Jamal because he was just given $15K he didn't have before.  

UO: I found Kellee to be annoying.  She speaks now as if she wasn't believed when she spoke up, and doesn't acknowledge the steps that were taken and the unique challenges of the producers,  ie removing a player against the wishes of the sole complainant.  Glad that's over.  Now let it be written in the pre-show contracts that no one should touch anyone without the touchee's express verbal consent regardless of touch location or intention and if anyone violates it, bye.

I didn't see Kellee last night, but based on her prior comments, I agree.

In fact, from what was shown, I don't think she was a true complaintent.  She was asked if she wanted production to step in, and she said no.  What she did was more like venting than filing a formal complaint.

Plus, until she thought the whole tribe had turned on Dan, she was ready to continue to work with him as an ally.  You can't expect TPTB to take unwanted touching of you more seriously than you take it.

Dan should have gone home earlier, but it should have followed a formal complaint by Kellee.

[sigmaforce86]

I'll give Noura this, for someone who can babble on and on at camp she has laser focus at any challenge that requires concentration like the final balance blocks or any of the endurance challenges.  It's a little like two sides of a coin with no middle ground, either she's bouncing around talking, talking, talking or she is so completely in the zone she's zeroed in on what she's doing like there is nothing around her.  That said she managed to keep it reasonable at the reunion and not actually give extended rambling answers sucking up a lot of time.

Speaking of time it seems like they didn't cut anything out of the show or reunion but did keep the live portion short to make up for the time lost breaking in to talk about the impeachment vote so they'd still end the show on time to air the 10pm news on the East Coast.  In a way that worked out, it did mean some people who should have gotten to talk a bit didn't but a pared down, no filler show was sort of nice.

As far as the winner goes, didn't hate it, didn't love it; I'd say this season just "was" and that's all.  It's sort of a "well that happened, next" season and not much more.  As always it's interesting to see how everyone looks cleaned up but out of all of them I love that Elaine still had her hat and stayed true to her style and herself.

[Ellee]

I have to admit I avoided the Kellee topic.  The whole thing is complicated to say the least. 

Kellee’s initial reaction, how she handled it, what she verbalized and what she didn’t, I believe was handled excellently. I’m proud of her.  With all that has gone on, she must be feeling an incredible amount of pressure and no matter what she says/does she can’t make anyone ‘happy’ (again probably the wrong word but I’ll count on someone to post the proper word).  Hopefully she stays true to herself.  It’s a long life and Survivor was just an episode in it. 

I’m in trouble for this one too. Dan.  This one is very difficult for me to express.  While wrong in continuing to do what he was told not to do by Kellee,  he was also in somewhat of a position that he could do no right. (Ugh)  If the women had all told him ‘no more’, one would hope he’d stop. Can’t prove that as it didn’t happen.   Now, when he can talk, he can’t talk.  We can’t hear what he would say and can only pick apart was he is ‘allowed’ to say.  

There’s more but, ugh, I hate how I post and will leave it to better posters. 

[Eolivet]

I'm not sure what to make of the reunion. At first, I was livid at the show for Probst doing the usual "We're live, it's fun, happy Survivor!" intro, then I was annoyed that there was Sia money to begin with (though happy she didn't show up and support this nonsense). I thought the interview with Kellee was as well-done as it could've been, and I'm of the opinion she received a settlement from CBS, which is why she was willing to sit on the Stools of Seriousness (tm Glee), and be the designated spokesperson to receive the "we didn't mean it, we're sooooooo sorrryyyyyyy" Jeff Probst apology.

I'm still sort of shocked that Probst apologized to Kellee (another reason I think they settled with her), but I did not like how he tried to slip in a defense of himself (boo hoo to your 15-hour time difference, and I noticed that "men and women working diligently" reference, when I'm pretty sure most of production is men). I was pleasantly surprised Kellee was allowed to subtly call out production for not removing Dan sooner -- another reason I think she's settled with them.

And I sort of believe them when they say this won't happen again. But that doesn't exonerate them from this ever happening in the first place. It's like they want credit for changing and saying "we're all better now, we'll do better," when I continue the question the ... humanity of a production team that could've looked at a woman in tears, with all the harassment on tape, against multiple women, and gone "nah, we're good" in the first place.

I guess I do believe Survivor when they say they've learned from this, and I do actually trust them (because they're an aging show who can't afford -- literally afford -- to alienate the audience like this) when they say they've improved their procedures going forward. But they're asking me to dismiss a horribly uncomfortable, disturbing season where we had to witness multiple women being harassed (assaulted, in legal terms) with "mistakes were made." And yeah ... no.

I will try to forgive, Survivor, but I will not forget how you took my favorite show, my fun escape for the week, my beloved psychological rollercoaster of a mind trip that I used to adore, and turned it into something unrecognizable. Something that turned my stomach.

And I will not forget how you failed to protect the contestants.

Edited December 19, 2019 by Eolivet

[marys1000]

Noura's speech about being yourself was good and I believe what she said.  
And yet......she might have at least gotten some votes if she had said to herself 
"you know, I believe in being who you are but in this competition maybe I should
try to tone it down some because its a competition"
I mean, what does she think about the fact that she got no votes?  That everyone on social media is talking about how lucky she was to just get there and how crazy they think she is?  

I really wish the would either release all the 39 days/24 hours of footage so we can see for ourselve what the Dan situation is.  Or have an objective view by detectives or something.  I'm not going to judge a man based on heavily edited footage and CBS producers who probably have the ethics of pond scum.  I know he should have stopped touching Kellee when she asked.  I know that.  But I'm not sure he deserves to have his life ruined.  
And I too find Kellee annoying somehow.  Aware of that I'm trying not to let it color my opinions. 

While noone should have to, she did have some other options.  She could have confronted Dan a second time, in front of the tribe and had it out publically.  I would rather she handled it that way.  

People I know were surprised by the Tommy win, they thought Dean would win.  And I had a tough time trying to voice why.  Just a weak boring season.  Would love to have seen Janet in the final 3, or even final 4.  

Jamal was great and the 15k was awkward.  I wonder what SIA is going to hear about it.  

Looking forward to season 40 even though there are a few players I never wanted to see again.  I hope they come up with new game stratgies somehow.  I think part of the problem is all so game set match now, alliances, numbers, jury management

Edited December 19, 2019 by marys1000

[TaraS1]

I was so thrilled for Janet and especially Elaine to get that much Sia money!  A well deserved gift for those two.  

And I was so excited to see Nick back for Season 40!  He's from my area (and Elaine's) so I'll definitely be rooting for him to win again.  And I can't help it, I love twinnie Natalie, so I'm happy to see her and Jeremy returning too.  I'm less happy about Rob and Amber, neither of whom I've ever liked, but the real dud for me is Ben.  What new challenge will they come up with at the end to give him the win this time?  *bitter*

[Haleth]

9 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

Noura kept trying to signal her home planet that her mission was over and she was ready to come home.

That cracked me up.

The thing that bothered me about the Kellee/Jeff interview was that Jeff never said the words I was waiting to hear-- we should never have put you in the position to have to decide.  Period.  Kellee was going to be blamed whatever her decision was.  Making her decide was going to affect other players either for the better or worse.  Production should have been swift in removing him and firm in pointing out the rule, leaving Kellee's hands clean in the matter.  (No pun intended.)

The next season sounds promising.  (Yul, sighhhh)  I couldn't stand Tony but he was entertaining as hell.  (Spy shack?)  The rest are more or less good/interesting people.  I may be the only person on the planet that likes Ben.  These were all memorable winners.  Tommy will be forgotten soon and this season will only be remembered because of Dan.

But whyyyyy are they reusing the Edge of Extinction concept?  That was terrible and left us with a winner who was voted out early.  Wouldn't an original recipe, no gimmicks Survivor be better for a bunch of winners?  Let's see who can win without a crutch.

[mythoughtis]

I don’t have a problem with the Sia money difference.  Anyone think Neville should have gotten the same number of house points as Harry,Hermione and Ron in the Sorcerers’  Stone? 
Elaine got the large amount because Sia liked her. Janet got it because she risked her entire game to speak up for young women.   Jamal got honorable mention because he told Aaron he might not know what was going on.  He didn’t risk what Janet did. He wasn’t as likeable  as Elaine. 

[RescueMom]

34 minutes ago, Haleth said:

 

But whyyyyy are they reusing the Edge of Extinction concept?  That was terrible and left us with a winner who was voted out early.  Wouldn't an original recipe, no gimmicks Survivor be better for a bunch of winners?  Let's see who can win without a crutch.

Dalton Ross at EW has an interview up with Jeff that addresses this - sounds like a lot of the winners would only come back if they could be guaranteed a legitimate chance of winning, so they decided to do a second chance season.  I don't like EoE either, but if we have to have it I would rather it be during a season with returning (mostly) popular players,  because I want to see as much as possible of some of my favorites like Denise and Yul. 

[peachmangosteen]

10 hours ago, TVFan1 said:

Can't wait to see Michele play again. Would love to see her win again.

+1. Can you imagine Jeff's reaction lol? Fucking hell that'd be so much fun!

I wanna rid myself of this shit show but man I am really excited about Winners at War. I mean, ew at them bringing EoE back and honestly I feel that's it's especially shitty for a season of winners (they've won before, make them work for it!), but also there are so many people I'm so excited to see again. Just ugh I'm giddy with excitement. Now watch it be an abysmal season lol.

[Special K]

Noura really is the ultimate goat, especially if you can't win immunities.  She's too annoying and chaotic to win, but dominated the individual challenge portion of the game.  All you have to do is attach yourself to her, flatter her enough to exact her loyalty (and it really didn't take much, as Dean learned), and then let her protect you by winning Individual Immunities in the final stages.

Oh, yeah, and learn to make fire. 🙂

IMO, they're using EoE in the Winners season so they can get as much mileage out of these people as possible in terms of footage and audience engagement.

[AZChristian]

Here's my view of the sexual touching situation. The stricter rules and protection should have happened the day that Richard Hatch rubbed his naked genitals against Sue in full view of the cameras in the middle of a challenge. He should have been walked off the set right then and there. Survivor could have been a good example of how to stop unacceptable behavior instead of now trying to impress people all these years later.

 

[Wouldofshouldof]

2 hours ago, Eolivet said:

I guess I do believe Survivor when they say they've learned from this, and I do actually trust them (because they're an aging show who can't afford -- literally afford -- to alienate the audience like this) when they say they've improved their procedures going forward.

Don't get me wrong, they absolutely need to have a policy in place, but they're going to have to be sure to back up a contestant's complaints with proof, either in the form of witnesses or footage.  Otherwise they run the risk of having a contestant decide to make something up just to get a player out.

[Special K]

19 minutes ago, AZChristian said:

Here's my view of the sexual touching situation. The stricter rules and protection should have happened the day that Richard Hatch rubbed his naked genitals against Sue in full view of the cameras in the middle of a challenge. He should have been walked off the set right then and there. Survivor could have been a good example of how to stop unacceptable behavior instead of now trying to impress people all these years later.

 

Also, it would help if they provided them with adequate clothes/coverings so they don't have to huddle together at night just to not get hypothermia, which can result in not only misunderstanding of actions/intentions but also a cover (no pun intended) for unwanted touching. 

I am not a prude, but I still find it appalling that an older married man was spooning so intimately with and stroking the bodies of young attractive women he had only known a couple days/weeks, let alone touching them after they tell him to stop. If he really doesn't see that that is wrong, there really is no hope for him.

 

Edited December 19, 2019 by Special K

[SuburbanHangSuite]

11 hours ago, mojoween said:

!!!!!!!!!

Did I see Yul in the preview?  Please tell me I saw Yul.

I straight squealed like an 11 year old girl when I saw Yul.  I don't know if my heart can take Yul, Jeremy, Ethan and Boston Rob in one season.  February can't get here soon enough.

[Rachel RSL]

4 hours ago, Ellee said:

Think the Sia awards were only announced for the 3 but I feel like there was more that received money but not announced.  

I wonder if Jack screwed himself out of $15 000 by not showing up? Him and Jamal had a very sweet moment.

3 hours ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I think better question is why Jamal got anything.  He stirred up racial strife over absolutely nothing and called grown women girls. 

He made a solid, but kind of obvious, comment, about Aaron being wrong for assuming he would know if sexual harassment was going on, but that was it.  

It wasn't racial strife over nothing.  Even Jack, the other person involved, agreed immediately that it was something.  As for his comment about Aaron being wrong, you may say it was "obvious" yet Jamal was the only one who spoke up and said it.  The only one.  

3 hours ago, Drogo said:

UO: I found Kellee to be annoying.  She speaks now as if she wasn't believed when she spoke up

She wasn't.  Don't you remember Aaron and his "If anything had actually happened, I would know about it" moment?

[JudyObscure]

The Sia award never sets well with me.  She  watches the show just like we do, wishing her favorites would win, just like we do, but because she happens to be rich (no longer just like we are) and because the show gives her the platform, she gets to pick her own winners.   She could just send her favorites some money, but it has become this big public thing and now people are "playing for the Sia award" and that's often contrary to the way you play to win the game. 

It's become the "who is the nicest person award," and we really don't know that and it leads to awkward things like Jamal being compared as somehow less-nice than the other two winners, and really who knows what any of them are like on an ordinary day.  I can see it becoming a separate contest of who is best at virtue signalling.

[Fallacy]

There is no way that Kelli and the show didn’t come to a settlement out of court.  Jeff admitted on camera that the producers made a mistake and he admitted on camera that Kelli was right. There is no way that Jeff acknowledges how wrong the show was if they didn’t already have an agreement with Kelli not to take further civil action. There is also no way Sia doesn’t give Kelli at least 100 thousand dollars if Sia doesn’t know about the settlement.

I think Jeff and the show made a very smart move when he started that interview by acknowledging the Kelli was right. That acknowledgment is what every victim wants to hear. And I believe that the acknowledgment was part of the settlement.  I would bet Kelli got $1 million because she could argue she was robbed of her chance of winning because of the producer’s actions. And a million bucks is nothing for CBS to spend to get back the goodwill of its audience when Kelli “forgives” them, which is basically what she did on the show tonight. 

Edited December 19, 2019 by Fallacy
Added

[laurakaye]

12 hours ago, jsm1125 said:

I don't know if we saw him, but we definitely heard him in a voiceover. 

Also, and I have read the cast list elsewhere, if it's any consolation, Mike (the winner of Worlds Apart who sounded like Patty/Selma from the Simpsons) isn't on this season. 

Regarding Yul - his swoony face popped up right at the end.  Believe me, I was looking for him.  My favorite winner, hands-down.

And to me, Mike sounded like Patrick Starfish from Spongebob Squarepants but yeah, Selma totally fits too.

12 hours ago, TVFan1 said:

Can't wait to see Michele play again. Would love to see her win again.

Not sure if sarcasm, LOL.  But I am totally on the Michele bandwagon.  I just finished re-watching Kaoh Rong and I thought she played a great, low-key, strategic, social game.  And she wasn't willing to sit back and let Nick insult her intelligence at the FTC.  I'd take her as a winner again, for sure.

10 hours ago, BK1978 said:

I am not sure.  It is weird, I can remember early boots from years ago but I cannot remember people from a season I just watched.  

++++1.  I am now re-watching Amazon.  I remembered that it was Daniel who fell off the balance beam during the first challenge, and that Shawna always had dirt on her face.  But I struggle to remember the winners from the past 4-5 seasons.  I honestly blame it on the fact that the title sequence with the player's names has been removed.  It drives me nuts.

3 hours ago, Eolivet said:

I will try to forgive, Survivor, but I will not forget how you took my favorite show, my fun escape for the week, my beloved psychological rollercoaster of a mind trip that I used to adore, and turned it into something unrecognizable. Something that turned my stomach.

And I will not forget how you failed to protect the contestants.

****BRAVO.******  All of this, every single word.

Edited December 19, 2019 by laurakaye

[TVFan1]

18 minutes ago, laurakaye said:

Regarding Yul - his swoony face popped up right at the end.  Believe me, I was looking for him.  My favorite winner, hands-down.

And to me, Mike sounded like Patrick Starfish from Spongebob Squarepants but yeah, Selma totally fits too.

Not sure if sarcasm, LOL.  But I am on the Michele bandwagon.  I just finished re-watching Kaog Rong and I thought she played a great, low-key but strategic social game.  And she wasn't willing to sit back and let Nick insult her intellegence at the FTC.  I'd take her as a winner again, for sure.

++++1.  I am now re-watching Amazon.  I remembered that it was Daniel who fell off the balance beam during the first challenge, and that Shawna always had dirt on her face.  But I struggle to remember the winners from the past 4-5 seasons.  I honestly blame it on the fact that the title sequence with the player's names has been removed.  It drives me nuts.

****BRAVO.******  All of this, every single word.

No sarcasm at all. I loved Michele's win. She was one of my favorite players from Kaoh Rong, and I was rooting for her to win all through that season.

[Otherkate]

Honestly, the Dan situation was handled much better on this reunion than I anticipated it being handled. I wish they had acknowledged that Kellee should not have been put in a position to make a decision, especially one that could cost her the game, but I am happy to take what we got. This season started out so well and devolved into one of my least favorite ever and I'm mostly just happy it's over.

Is there anyone more slimy than Dean? Every time he gloated after winning or finding an idol, I got a chill down my spine. Frankly, I think final 5 is way too late for an idol nullifier to be in play. 

There was actually a good argument to be made for a Noura win, but of course she was incapable of making it. Shine on, you crazy diamond.

I like the Sia thing.

I am so excited for next season, I literally cheered aloud at the end of the preview. I am happy to have Rob and Sandra on as often as they would like to be on. They were the only things that saved this season for me.

 

[sara416]

4 hours ago, Eolivet said:

 

I'm still sort of shocked that Probst apologized to Kellee (another reason I think they settled with her), but I did not like how he tried to slip in a defense of himself (boo hoo to your 15-hour time difference, and I noticed that "men and women working diligently" reference, when I'm pretty sure most of production is men). I was pleasantly surprised Kellee was allowed to subtly call out production for not removing Dan sooner -- another reason I think she's settled with them.

 

 

This is what bothered me the most. Jeff seemed to be very forthcoming at first when he said to go ahead and say what she wanted to say, even if it included railing on him. But then he got defensive, not just of himself, but of the other players. Kellee didn't get to really be heard when this all went down, let her be heard now! I understand she was nervous and part of his job as host is to move things along, but he could have done it a different way. I also noticed the "men and women working diligently" but what I also noticed was that I believe he said "WOMEN and men..." noting women first. It was almost too obvious of a mention just so he could claim he gets women and understands that there are women out there too. Please. I just didn't buy his sincerity. 

[iMonrey]

I never hated Tommy. He's not my favorite but compared to some past players I find him pretty inoffensive so I was much relieved that he won, because I spent two hours thinking Dean was going to take it. Phew!

I also find it amusing that the person who won never went to the stupid Island of the Idols. At the end of the day Sandra and Rob contributed fuck all to the game. 

I wonder how far in advance Kellee knew she would have a one-on-one with Jeff. She seemed really unprepared. I get that she was nervous but she just didn't seem to know what to say. Jeff had to do most of the talking because she just kept trailing off.

I doubt I will be back next season, I usually boycott seasons with returning players and I recognize maybe half of the returning winners because of that. And for the love of Pete, enough of Boston Rob. Just give him his own damn show so his fans can go watch that and the rest of us can live in peace.

[Ms Blue Jay]

1 hour ago, SuburbanHangSuite said:

I straight squealed like an 11 year old girl when I saw Yul.  I don't know if my heart can take Yul, Jeremy, Ethan and Boston Rob in one season.  February can't get here soon enough.

I still have the biggest crush on Wendell too.  Oooooh boy.

6 minutes ago, sara416 said:

This is what bothered me the most. Jeff seemed to be very forthcoming at first when he said to go ahead and say what she wanted to say, even if it included railing on him. But then he got defensive, not just of himself, but of the other players. Kellee didn't get to really be heard when this all went down, let her be heard now! I understand she was nervous and part of his job as host is to move things along, but he could have done it a different way. I also noticed the "men and women working diligently" but what I also noticed was that I believe he said "WOMEN and men..." noting women first. It was almost too obvious of a mention just so he could claim he gets women and understands that there are women out there too. Please. I just didn't buy his sincerity. 

He kept saying this is the time for Kellee to speak and let her voice be heard but every time she paused Jeff interjected.  LOL.  Even though IT WASN'T LIVE and it could be edited down worst case scenario.

[Bryce Lynch]

1 hour ago, JudyObscure said:

The Sia award never sets well with me.  She  watches the show just like we do, wishing her favorites would win, just like we do, but because she happens to be rich (no longer just like we are) and because the show gives her the platform, she gets to pick her own winners.   She could just send her favorites some money, but it has become this big public thing and now people are "playing for the Sia award" and that's often contrary to the way you play to win the game. 

It's become the "who is the nicest person award," and we really don't know that and it leads to awkward things like Jamal being compared as somehow less-nice than the other two winners, and really who knows what any of them are like on an ordinary day.  I can see it becoming a separate contest of who is best at virtue signalling.

I don't really have a problem with the Sia money.  But, I agree that it could turn into a virtue signalling contest.  I believe Jamal got his for virtue signalling.  Janet got hers for actually taking a stand to defend other women.  Elaine seemed to get her by being a funny, charming hick with some strong  sob stories.  

 

[Bryce Lynch]

27 minutes ago, Otherkate said:

Honestly, the Dan situation was handled much better on this reunion than I anticipated it being handled. I wish they had acknowledged that Kellee should not have been put in a position to make a decision, especially one that could cost her the game, but I am happy to take what we got. This season started out so well and devolved into one of my least favorite ever and I'm mostly just happy it's over.

Is there anyone more slimy than Dean? Every time he gloated after winning or finding an idol, I got a chill down my spine. Frankly, I think final 5 is way too late for an idol nullifier to be in play. 

There was actually a good argument to be made for a Noura win, but of course she was incapable of making it. Shine on, you crazy diamond.

I like the Sia thing.

I am so excited for next season, I literally cheered aloud at the end of the preview. I am happy to have Rob and Sandra on as often as they would like to be on. They were the only things that saved this season for me.

 

She was put in that position by Dan.  Unfortunately, any time a person is being touched in an unwanted way, or otherwise mistreated, that person has decisions to make.  Both in Survivor and in the real world, angels generally don't descend from the sky to fix people's problems. 

Someone in Kellee's situation has to decide what her priorities are and what actions she thinks are best for her.  

Imagine if TPTB removed Dan based upon Kellee's "venting" for lack of a better word, about Dan's touching, when she expressly declined to make a formal complaint, and that removal caused her alliance to lose the numbers and she was voted out next, possibly costing her $1 million.   

Dan put Kellee in a terrible position, but IMO, TPTB gave Kellee agency to decide how to handle the situation in they way she thought was best for her.   

I didn't really find Dean slimy, more like silly and embarrassing himself.  That said, he kind of needed to go for it at FTC. 

I actually enjoyed him finding that last idol after Tommy foolishly and arrogantly asked for him to used his color sighted eyes to help him.  

 Tommy had such a sense of entitlement that he couldn't imagine that Dean would do the smart thing and keep the idol for himself.   Of course, I partly blame Lauren, Janet, Noura and some of the others for feeding that sense of entitlement by fighting over who would go to FTC to lose to Tommy instead of voting his ass out.   Lauren getting more mad at Noura "betraying" her than her best bud stabbing her in the back by teaching Dean how to beat her at fire building was pathetic. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 19, 2019 by Bryce Lynch

[Josh371982]

13 hours ago, mojoween said:

Wonder why Jack couldn’t make it?  But how cute he and Jamal are roomies now.  And Jamal in specs - ROWR.

I did see Aaron, but were Missy and Elizabeth there?

I need to go on Survivor and make sure you all love me so I can get some of that sweet Sia cash.

Jack couldnt make it cause hes probably supporting his horrid GF Elizabeth 

[Cornhusker12]

4 hours ago, Haleth said:

The thing that bothered me about the Kellee/Jeff interview was that Jeff never said the words I was waiting to hear-- we should never have put you in the position to have to decide.  Period.  Kellee was going to be blamed whatever her decision was.  Making her decide was going to affect other players either for the better or worse.  Production should have been swift in removing him and firm in pointing out the rule, leaving Kellee's hands clean in the matter. 

I think this is exactly right, and exactly what they didn't quite get to during the finale. New processes and procedures, great. Wish we would've handled it better, great. You were right, great. But they should have gotten more specific about what they were talking about, which is that they prioritized being hands-off and protected the "sanctity of the game" over everything else. They got so wrapped up in the idea that Survivor is its own society/ecosystem that they forgot it's just 39 days within the actual world as it is in real life.

They should have been able to make the call themselves in a situation like that, rather than back away and have a contestant in a game decide what's appropriate punishment, when she's trying to compete while being the subject of a tv show. Yes, Survivor plays by different rules than the outside world, but they still obviously have certain rules that absolutely can't be broken.

You don't ask a basketball player to decide whether to call a flagrant foul on someone, a referee decides whether something is clearly outside the realm of the larger game and makes the call to eject. And if someone in Survivor does something that is outside the realm of the larger game, or is a larger/weirder issue than just gameplay that is deserving of getting voted out at the next Tribal, they too should be ejected by the people in charge, not the players. Hopefully the new rules and procedures lay that out more clearly.

Edited December 19, 2019 by huskerj12

[Josh371982]

13 hours ago, princelina said:

Well they were on the stumps and he was bribing them off with peanut butter.  They were the ones who said "I'd strip naked for that" and then did it before jumping off - the peanut butter was on offer for anyone who stump-jumped.  They chose to do the stripping.  Trying to make a name for themselves in the early days of reality tv 😄 

Sez BRob.  Hee.  I didn't hate them from their season, but I remember it was the first All-Stars, and I am still asking anyone who will listen - how on earth was Amber ever an All Star?  IMO she never should have been cast on the All Stars to begin with.

I'm super-excited for season 40!  I already knew what it was from reading here so I'm surprised that so many of you are surprised by it!  😄 

If I remember correctly Amber wasnt a first choice. Some others like Elizabeth From the same season were asked first and turned it down

[himela]

Some comments:

Was I right or was I right about saying Tommy was getting the winner's edit since episode 1? 😄

If Tommy and Lauren were together in the final tribal council, Lauren would win so I think the sexism comments (if a man and a woman make the same moves the man will win) are irrelevant and tiring to be honest. Sometimes we the viewrs make Survivor more complicated than needed (two black people won immunity, strong women, people of color voted out first etc). I would like to enjoy the strategy without the real life implications.

I have a hard time deciding whether I will watch season 40. There are many people I dislike / hate from there (Rob, Tyson, Ben to name a few) but the one I can't honestly stomach is Parvati. She represents everyting I hate in the female gender and she is the example of the woman I would fear my daughter (if I had one) would become. I am absolutely disgusted by her. I think I will just read your comments here. And with the Edge of Extinction coming back we know there is no chance we get rid of them sooner or later. They will all be there till the end.

[MrsR]

12 hours ago, princelina said:

I am still asking anyone who will listen - how on earth was Amber ever an All Star? 

Amber was a last minute replacement for Sandra who turned out to have parasites from the previous season.

[Bryce Lynch]

25 minutes ago, huskerj12 said:

I think this is exactly right, and exactly what they didn't quite get to during the finale. New processes and procedures, great. Wish we would've handled it better, great. You were right, great. But they should have gotten more specific about what they were talking about, which is that they prioritized being hands-off and protected the "sanctity of the game" over everything else. They got so wrapped up in the idea that Survivor is its own society/ecosystem that they forgot it's just 39 days within the actual world as it is in real life.

They should have been able to make the call themselves in a situation like that, rather than back away and have a contestant in a game decide what's appropriate punishment, when she's trying to compete while being the subject of a tv show. Yes, Survivor plays by different rules than the outside world, but they still obviously have certain rules that absolutely can't be broken.

You don't ask a basketball player to decide whether to call a flagrant foul on someone, a referee decides whether something is clearly outside the realm of the larger game and makes the call to eject. And if someone in Survivor does something that is outside the realm of the larger game, or is a larger/weirder issue than just gameplay that is deserving of getting voted out at the next Tribal, they too should be ejected by the people in charge, not the players. Hopefully the new rules and procedures lay that out more clearly.

Flagrant fouls, while sometimes questionable, don't require the same sort of context as sexual harassment by unwanted touching claims.   In addition, it is NEVER in the interests of the player who was fouled to not get the free throws and the ball out of bounds, and the opponent ejected.   In Survivor, losing an ally to an ejection for touching you could cost you $1 million.   Whenever a flagrant foul is called, the play is viewed over and over from different angles, in slow motion.   

Besides, that, if it ever happened that Player A fouled Player B hard and Player B went to the ref and said "It wasn't flagrant, just a hard foul." the ref would likely rule it a common foul.  

Also, I'm not sure anything Dan did to Kellee (anything we were shown anyway) was so obviously egregious that anyone would get pulled for it, without a complaint.   I think Kellee can decide whether Dan brushing back her hair from her face (after she asked him not to touch her much earlier in the game) is worth losing a number in her alliance.  If she said, "Kick his ass to the curb!", I'd be 100% for that.   But, I don't think it was at the level that TPTB should have done that without her input.  

 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

He kept saying this is the time for Kellee to speak and let her voice be heard but every time she paused Jeff interjected.  LOL.  Even though IT WASN'T LIVE and it could be edited down worst case scenario.

I saw that more as Jeff picking up the conversation when Kellee began to trail off, rather than interrupting her as soon as she paused. She was nervous (by her own admission) and not sure of what to say, so after a bit of her grasping for words, Jeff stepped in. I thought it was kind of nice, actually, like he was trying to make it easier for her.

[Zuleikha]

Dan put Kellee in a terrible position, but IMO, TPTB gave Kellee agency to decide how to handle the situation in they way she thought was best for her.

Yes, that's my apparently unpopular position as well. There was no choice that TPTB could make that wouldn't potentially affect Kellee's position in the game, so IMHO, there was no path forward that was clearly correct. 

I also just don't agree with Kellee that she shouldn't have been put in a position to make a choice. To me, that's a really paternalistic argument, and I wonder if she would feel the same way had her choice worked out better for her.

[Dbolt]

Everyone is arguing if it was racist that Jamaal got less Sia money, but no one pointing out that it could be sexist instead. Not sure what that means, but I find it interesting. 

[Josh371982]

14 minutes ago, MrsR said:

Amber was a last minute replacement for Sandra who turned out to have parasites from the previous season.

So she replaced Sandra? I thought she replaced Elizabeth lol.

[HurricaneVal]

Tommy is the blandest winner ever.  Thank gawd for Noura, or that would have been the most boring final three in the history of the game.  Out of that group, I guess I'm OK with a Tommy win.  Just OK, not happy, not mad, just OK.  That's how bland that was.

I'm all in for next season.  I can't wait.  I'm also glad there will be an EoE.  I think a season of all-star winners like this is the only time that concept works.  EoE just might be more interesting than the regular camp, kind of like Ponderosa. I hope they give equal time between the regular game and the meta-game.  Oh yes.  EoE, now with 100% less Reem....

I love me some Yul.  But if they're smart, they'll vote him and Boston Rob off first thing.

[Lady Calypso]

Just now, tracyscott76 said:

I saw that more as Jeff picking up the conversation when Kellee began to trail off, rather than interrupting her as soon as she paused. She was nervous (by her own admission) and not sure of what to say, so after a bit of her grasping for words, Jeff stepped in. I thought it was kind of nice, actually, like he was trying to make it easier for her.

It also depends if they actually had Kellee/Jeff speak in front of the entire audience or if they pre-taped THAT before the pre-taping. They never actually showed the audience throughout that segment, and it's not like we would have known if those were just edited in shots of the audience, but it seems like Kellee was nervous because she was in front of hundreds of people. So, if she was actually speaking about this in front of the audience, then that's a mistake on Survivor's end. 

I think what Jeff did was fairly good. Kellee makes a point; she kind of became the Survivor spokesperson for the sexual harassment and that can be nervewracking. Even though she's not the only one to speak up, she's the only one who's being heard and now is in the forefront of all of this. That does add a lot of pressure to how Kellee responds, because it feels like she has to speak for all the women that have been sexually harassed on this show and how she was the person to make the difference, finally. 

I think Jeff handled the segment well. He listened where he needed to, and when Kellee seemed to be at a loss for words, he interjected so that it could give Kellee a bit to compose her thoughts.

1 minute ago, Dbolt said:

Everyone is arguing if it was racist that Jamaal got less Sia money, but no one pointing out that it could be sexist instead. Not sure what that means, but I find it interesting. 

Personally, I don't think it's either. Sia probably just liked Elaine and Janet better (they were the fan favourites of the season anyway), and Jamal was only really memorable for his do-rag segment with Jack, and speaking up against Aaron during the Me Too Tribal Council. Plus, yeah, I think there may be some merit to the rumour that Kellee probably settled with CBS/Survivor so she already got some money from this season so Sia gave her money to the next memorable (and mostly likeable) contestant instead, who really was Jamal. But Jamal still didn't make as much of an impression as Janet or Elaine...so he got less money. Though, yeah, 15k is really small. Even 25k would have been a bit better. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

36 minutes ago, tracyscott76 said:

I saw that more as Jeff picking up the conversation when Kellee began to trail off, rather than interrupting her as soon as she paused. She was nervous (by her own admission) and not sure of what to say, so after a bit of her grasping for words, Jeff stepped in. I thought it was kind of nice, actually, like he was trying to make it easier for her.

Not in my opinion.  It is extremely difficult to find words to speak about an issue like this , and no matter what Kellee says there will be people out there who criticize her or call her annoying for it.  She needed time to think, and the interruptions were unhelpful and unnecessary.

I still can't believe Sia's THAT rich.  There is a Twitter account whose main purpose is to tweet out every day that Jeff Bezos could end world hunger but chooses not to.  I can't believe Sia chooses to give her money to Survivor contestants numerous times a year.  It's so funny.  I think it's fun and interesting to discuss who Sia gave her money to and why because it's FASCINATING.  Somebody said Sia gave the money to Elaine because Elaine is "likeable".  LOL.  That's very interesting!  That some people think some people deserve money for likeability.  It just shows you how differently everyone thinks.

Edited December 19, 2019 by Ms Blue Jay

[Guest]

13 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Not in my opinion.  It is extremely difficult to find words to speak about an issue like this , and no matter what Kellee says there will be people out there who criticize her or call her annoying for it.  She needed time to think, and the interruptions were unhelpful and unnecessary.

To be clear, I'm very much on Kellee's side in this whole thing, and am not among those criticizing her or calling her annoying. I just feel that Jeff was being supportive and helpful in this specific situation. He gave her time to think, and stepped in when she understandably faltered. I found it to be a nice gesture in this season of unpleasantness. But I understand those who view it differently.

[Bryce Lynch]

1 hour ago, Dbolt said:

Everyone is arguing if it was racist that Jamaal got less Sia money, but no one pointing out that it could be sexist instead. Not sure what that means, but I find it interesting. 

I can't believe anyone could call Sia racist, sexist or anything for giving free money, from her own pocket, to people who were not entitled to a dime from her.  I would just call her "generous".  

[simplyme]

1 hour ago, Bryce Lynch said:

Flagrant fouls, while sometimes questionable, don't require the same sort of context as sexual harassment by unwanted touching claims.   In addition, it is NEVER in the interests of the player who was fouled to not get the free throws and the ball out of bounds, and the opponent ejected.   In Survivor, losing an ally to an ejection for touching you could cost you $1 million.

And this perfectly sums up why sexual harassment is generally a no-win situation for the victim, both in Survivor and usually the world in general.

The victim either has to continue to be sexually harassed or he/she suffers other negative consequences in terms of loss of power, money, job, etc. They are also likely to be doubted and face social backlash for speaking up.

 

[Annamz]

12 hours ago, GaT said:

I didn't want any of the final 3 to win, so this was a disappointment to me, but watching Noura's face as she realized that nobody voted for her was priceless.

I wonder how Sia determines how much money to give? I realize it's her own money & she can give it or not how she wants, but she gave the black man $15,000 & the 2 white women $100,000. I can't imagine that that isn't going to become a thing on social media, especially right after a discussion about race.

The whole discussion with Kellee was awkward. I'm glad they talked about it though & admitted they didn't handle it right.

I thought the same thing about Sia's award! It's great that she gave him the 15,000 but why not just give them all the same? It's her money and she's free to do what she wants with it... but it's Sia... and she's not hurting for money. She could've even divided 200,000 into 3. It just seems weird how she did it. But again, it is nice that she did it at all. I guess I'm just being petty.

[princelina]

2 hours ago, Josh371982 said:

If I remember correctly Amber wasnt a first choice. Some others like Elizabeth From the same season were asked first and turned it down

 

2 hours ago, MrsR said:

Amber was a last minute replacement for Sandra who turned out to have parasites from the previous season.

Thanks guys!  I know it - I just think she should have been way way way WAY lower on the list to be picked for All Stars.  And then she did nothing for a second time and won!  Then I watched them on the Amazing Race and she was just as useless there.  Oh well - I'm sure she's a good wife and mother 😄 

[simplyme]

2 hours ago, MrsR said:

Amber was a last minute replacement for Sandra who turned out to have parasites from the previous season.

Fairplay went home with her? That's terrible! 

[iMonrey]

Quote

Everyone is arguing if it was racist that Jamaal got less Sia money, but no one pointing out that it could be sexist instead. Not sure what that means, but I find it interesting. 

Either way the optics on this are bad. It's not as if Survivor doesn't have enough PR problems this season. I don't understand why they continue to showcase "these are the players a random celebrity liked best this year" but if they're determined to keep doing it, the "Sia Award" needs better rules. 

I honestly don't understand why I'm supposed to give a shit who Sia liked best every season or why that's award-worthy. I'd never even heard of her before she showed up in that weird hat a few seasons ago to throw money at Tai.