S02.E15: The Car

[Clanstarling]

11 hours ago, Katy M said:

Weird Al.  Ha ha.  I am quite embarrassed to say I had one of his records when I was a kid. 

Don't be embarrassed - Weird Al is great. He still ranks #1 on my top concerts list.

11 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:

Only two things saved this episode from being treacly for me:  Dr. K (I think Gerald McRaney did a really fine scene) and Jack telling Kevin and Randall matter-of-fact-ly about his brother, then giving them the speech probably most parents have about "someday we'll be gone and you'll only have each other." 

That speech is the only time I've ever lost it on while watching this show. My parents and siblings are all gone and I am the keeper of the memories. Because of our nomadic lifestyle (military) and small families, there is literally no one in my life who knew me before my mid-20s. I don't think about it all the time, but it is a weird, un-tethered feeling.

 

10 hours ago, balmz said:

Randall really annoyed me with the watch, like who the hell does that? what is he going to pick through jacks stuff and steal the clothes he was wearing when he died as well?

Lots of people, actually. I have my mother's ring, and sweater. Wearing them help me feel close to her. My brother and his daughters took mementos from the house after the funeral. It's not stealing, it's cherishing.

10 hours ago, gonzosgirrl said:

She mentioned that she had no exams - so if that's the case, she wasn't really skipping, just not at the school. Maybe I shouldn't be proud of it, but my dad would've done the same for me.

Not being at the school, on a school day, if you're not ill, is kind of the definition of skipping. 

7 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

The ER doctor miraculously diagnosed a "widow maker" heart attack without an autopsy.  That's a significant blockage in the artery that provides blood to most of the heart.  It's likely that Jack was a ticking time bomb, and would have died soon regardless of the fire.  My dad died of this type of blockage when I was seventeen, and after the trauma of my mom being hit by a drunk driver.  My mom was okay but my dad died of a massive MI.  

On screen, the doctor only said "catastrophic" - and I wondered where she'd heard "widow maker" from.

1 hour ago, ShadowFacts said:

I am certainly not familiar with funeral customs nationwide, but it was odd to me that there was a service at the cemetery when Jack's ashes were not being interred there.  Then they left to a reception.  In my area, the urn that is not going to be interred is at a funeral home or church or other location for a memorial service, but not at a cemetery.   As has been mentioned, more annoying non-seasonal flora, and people not wearing winter attire in early February in Pennsylvania. 

Also, no full military honors, and he was a Vietnam veteran.  If that was his choice, and it must have been, they could have made that explicit in the scene in the car where he tells Rebecca not to put him in the ground.  I assume this will surface in some way in future episodes that deal with Vietnam. 

I was surprised at that too, I'm not sure why the cemetery would even schedule a service (outside) without an internment. As for the military honors, I can see Jack maybe not wanting them, since the war cost him his brother. My father was very clear about wanting military honors. Which was both strange and moving. Strange, because the honor guard outnumbered the attendees (my husband, myself, and my daughter) 3 to one. But surprisingly moving when I was given the flag with the rote speech they give.

[PRgal]

8 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

 

Not being at the school, on a school day, if you're not ill, is kind of the definition of skipping. 

 

If the school has a scheduled exam week, then no, Kate didn't necessarily have to be at school on days she doesn't have anything scheduled - if her school was anything like mine.  We did not need to be on campus on days we didn't have anything scheduled.  And we were free to go after we finished.  

[pianogirl73]

I meant to ask this question earlier; Is it normal to spread ashes by scooping them out with your hands? I would have been creeped out by that, especially at 17.

[Katy M]

1 minute ago, PRgal said:

If the school has a scheduled exam week, then no, Kate didn't necessarily have to be at school on days she doesn't have anything scheduled - if her school was anything like mine.  We did not need to be on campus on days we didn't have anything scheduled.  And we were free to go after we finished.  

So, you only have to go to school during finals week?  Is that what you're saying?  No.  I don't think that's how it works.  You can't cut school any day you want just because you don't happen to have any tests in your classes that day. If it were finals week and she didn't have any tests, then she simply would have asked permission to go to the record store and her parents would have said she could.  She was skipping.

[Trillium]

The car salesman probably lowered the price just to get Jack to shut the hell up. I like Jack but good grief that was a bit much, even for Jack. 

[TV Diva Queen]

1 hour ago, luna1122 said:

Screw them for giving up the dog, if they did/do. Your dad went back in for that dog...you better CHERISH that dog, Kate. Poor little guy. This family sucks when it comes to pets. They better find him a good home, tho it will probably never be mentioned again.

That speech at the end was eyerolling. The Pearsons are such special snowflakes that they get a deal on a car cuz Jack sermonizes. I'd have loved to see the impassive face of the car salesman as he had to listen to it, and then have him say 'Nice speech, bro. But here's the price'.

It was cheesy, but I did love seeing Dr. K again. Something about Gerald McRaney's voice is so soothing.

I do actually want to know more about Jack's brother.

Back then, new car prices were way more negotiable than they are now.  There truly was a real dealer's invoice price and not these fake $100 over invoice sales that you see now.  That scene was totally "buyable" for me.  

[Jillybean]

I was in high school a decade before the Big Three, and we didn't have a "Finals Week." "Finals" would have been at the end of the school year, anyway.  Tests were not administered on a stand-alone basis when I was in school -- they were given as part of the regular school day.  I have no idea whether that's changed since I'm child-free. I took Kate's comment about exams to mean she didn't have any tests that day, so she was only missing an "unimportant" school day.  But yeah, she was definitely skipping school.  It appeared Jack dropped her off at the record store and left her there, so I wondered how she was getting home or to school afterward.

Pittsburgh in Jan/Feb 1998 was quite lovely with all those trees in full bloom!

Love Dr. K. 

Poor Louie. How easily Kate can discard a dog she loved enough that Jack went after him in a blazing house.

Edited February 7, 2018 by Jillybean

[vixenbynight]

8 hours ago, NicoleMN6 said:

Kevin already had Jack's necklace. (We should have been reminded of that in this episode.) 

 

7 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

I think he had a little assist from Kate.  

Kevin's insecurities and jealously over Randall continued to grow throughout his life and I do not feel that Kate (along with Jack) never tried to stop him from feeling that way about his brother and himself. I just think that whatever Kevin did, he and he alone always viewed it as less than what Randall was able to do, while he also made fun/belittled those things that interested Randall.

All of Kevin's issues cannot totally be placed on Rebecca and Jack.

[Katy M]

2 minutes ago, Jillybean said:

I was in high school a decade before the Big Three, and we didn't have a "Finals Week." "Finals" would have been at the end of the school year, anyway.

I was also in high school a decade before the Big Three.  We had mid-term week in January and Finals in June.

 

3 minutes ago, Jillybean said:

took Kate's comment about exams to mean she didn't have any tests that day, so she was only missing an "unimportant" school day.  But yeah, she was definitely skipping school.  It appeared Jack dropped her off at the record store and left her there, so I wondered how she was getting home or to school

That's exactly how I took it.  Kate was going to take the bus to the record store, so she was going to take the bus back home. I wouldn't imagine she would go back to school, because then they would have known for a fact that she was cutting, whereas if she goes back the next day, she can just say she was sick.

[gonzosgirrl]

29 minutes ago, PRgal said:

If the school has a scheduled exam week, then no, Kate didn't necessarily have to be at school on days she doesn't have anything scheduled - if her school was anything like mine.  We did not need to be on campus on days we didn't have anything scheduled.  And we were free to go after we finished.  

I was in high school 78-82 and when we had exams week (she said exams, not a test). Same as you, when we were finished, we could leave, and if we didn't have an exam that day, we didn't have to be there.

[Shermie]

Quote

I am certainly not familiar with funeral customs nationwide, but it was odd to me that there was a service at the cemetery when Jack's ashes were not being interred there.  Then they left to a reception.  In my area, the urn that is not going to be interred is at a funeral home or church or other location for a memorial service, but not at a cemetery.   As has been mentioned, more annoying non-seasonal flora, and people not wearing winter attire in early February in Pennsylvania. 

Hollywood funerals are always outside on perfect sunny days because they're filmed in California. They don't give a crap where the shows are actually set. I've never been to an outdoor funeral, even if the weather is nice. Funerals are in churches or halls, and the family goes to the cemetery for a private interment service. (Note it's not "internment", unless the deceased got an entry level job in heaven. ?)

 

I do understand the urn being there, though, because Rebecca wanted it with her. Many cemeteries have columbariums for urns or even for plaques for people who don't have remains to bury. Having a plaque or headstone even without remains is nice for people to visit or bring flowers, and is useful for future genealogy research.

 

As for the car, haggling for a price is still a thing. That Wagoneer was one butt ugly car, though. 

[gonzosgirrl]

1 minute ago, Shermie said:

As for the car, haggling for a price is still a thing. That Wagoneer was one butt ugly car, though. 

Yup. And Jack straight up said he was going to use the kids as a bargaining chip, and that's what he did. Good on him if it worked.

[ZuluQueenOfDwarves]

I totally thought that Jack was gonna notice a picture of the salesman’s kids and offer something for them—a remodeled bedroom or a playhouse in the backyard, in lieu of $ for the difference between the Wagoneer’s cost and what he could afford. That would’ve been lovely, a sign of how fathers put their kids above all else. But no, the guy was persuaded by the power of shmaltz. 

I wish this show would realize that it’s completely unnecessary and detrimental to make Jack this OTT, mythical figure. Most (all) husbands, fathers, and best friends aren’t like that, but still engender mourning when they’re gone. The show’s strengths are the universality of its themes of love, loss, and legacy, not when it tries to make it seem like the Pearsons as a family know a love greater and purer than that which has been experienced by anyone before or since. 

[doodlebug]

1 hour ago, JudyObscure said:

One of the few times I've teared up (I never cry) at this show was when Louie was coming to Kate for affection and she rebuffed him.  Come on Kate!  Louie didn't ask for any of this.  My cat tripped me on the stairs and caused a fall that's left me walking with a cane forever.  I didn't see the fall every time I looked at him after that.  In fact he got diabetes a year later and my meticulous care kept him alive for three more years. Another reason the fall was so bad was I had my puppy in my hand and I wasn't about to drop her in order to put a hand out to catch myself.  If you love something you don't hold grudges and that "reminder" thing does not last if you don't let it.

I was waiting for Rebecca to tell Kate that the doctor said Jack had a clogged artery that was ready to blow and the attack would have come soon, if not through the stress of the fire, just getting out of bed suddenly a week or two could have done it.  True?  Who cares, it's only an exaggeration and could be true.  If it helps Kate it hurts no one.

I think, considering how Kate was so very close to her father, how extraordinarily sensitive (and self centered) she isand just because it didn't need to be said at that moment or ever; I would've never mentioned the smoke inhalation as the specific cause of Jack's death and instead stressed the obvious hidden heart disease as the culprit. Rebecca did a good job of telling Kate that it was Jack's choice to go back into the house, but I think it might've been better had the emphasis been placed on his underlying cardiac disease and not on the fire's aftereffects as the cause of his demise.  As it is, part of the reason I find adult Kate so very hard to tolerate is her "me, me, me, the world revolves around me" attitude and, in a weird way, blaming herself for Jack's death only helps her continue to put herself into the middle of the tragedy.

My nephew died at age 5 and was cremated (in part because he didn't like the dark and didn't like bugs; so my sister was emotionally unable to think of putting his body in the ground).  Her mother in law was opposed to cremation and very vocal in those feelings.  So, my sister and her husband purchased a cemetery plot, had a wake with him in the casket which went to the church and then the cemetery where we had a graveside prayer.  After everyone left, the funeral home took the casket and body to the crematorium,  Nobody at the cemetery even noticed that the casket was sitting on ground covered with a tarp and there was no hole underneath.  A couple weeks later, several of us went back to the cemetery where a portion of his ashes were buried.  My sister kept a small urn, which interestingly, she never told my parents about because the idea of dividing the ashes bothered them.  My sister's mother in law went to her own grave never knowing the casket wasn't in the grave and my parents never knew there was a second urn.  Sometimes, it's a kindness to keep the specifics private, IMO, which is why Rebecca should've been a little less forthcoming in discussing the cause of Jack's death with the kids.

[kilda]

28 minutes ago, TV Diva Queen said:

Back then, new car prices were way more negotiable than they are now.  There truly was a real dealer's invoice price and not these fake $100 over invoice sales that you see now.  That scene was totally "buyable" for me.  

I'm sure we were supposed to watch that scene and think, "aw, Jack was awesome!"  I was just thinking, wow he missed his calling.  He should have been selling cars. He was out-bullshitting a professional bullshitter.

[txhorns79]

Quote

The day that Dr K is off to meet up with Jack in heaven, I will be a MESS.

Is it wrong that I'm secretly hoping the show will go full soap opera with a flashback, flashforward and/or flash sideways that shows Dr. K at home with a crazy wall/shrine tracking the family through the years so he can conveniently show up at all the important life events? 

[Empress1]

13 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

Don't be embarrassed - Weird Al is great. He still ranks #1 on my top concerts list.

That speech is the only time I've ever lost it on while watching this show. My parents and siblings are all gone and I am the keeper of the memories. Because of our nomadic lifestyle (military) and small families, there is literally no one in my life who knew me before my mid-20s. I don't think about it all the time, but it is a weird, un-tethered feeling.

Lots of people, actually. I have my mother's ring, and sweater. Wearing them help me feel close to her. My brother and his daughters took mementos from the house after the funeral. It's not stealing, it's cherishing.

Not being at the school, on a school day, if you're not ill, is kind of the definition of skipping. 

On screen, the doctor only said "catastrophic" - and I wondered where she'd heard "widow maker" from.

I was surprised at that too, I'm not sure why the cemetery would even schedule a service (outside) without an internment. As for the military honors, I can see Jack maybe not wanting them, since the war cost him his brother. My father was very clear about wanting military honors. Which was both strange and moving. Strange, because the honor guard outnumbered the attendees (my husband, myself, and my daughter) 3 to one. But surprisingly moving when I was given the flag with the rote speech they give.

All four of my grandparents are gone and I have a lot of my late grandmothers' things. Not their clothing, as we were different sizes (my dad's mom was tall like I am but heavier, and my mom's mom was petite), but I have a lot of my dad's mom's jewelry and some of my mom's mom's knickknacks. The men in my family took my dad's dad's ties (he had SO MANY TIES), and a lot of the household items were divided among the family. I am fairly sure my father has my grandfather's watch. If he doesn't, then my uncle does.

I liked the scene with Dr. K. "Bullcrap!" And I laughed when he said he'd like to just stand up and walk off, but he's old and it would take at least six minutes.

Just now, kilda said:

I'm sure we were supposed to watch that scene and think, "aw, Jack was awesome!"  I was just thinking, wow he missed his calling.  He should have been selling cars. He was out-bullshitting a professional bullshitter.

I had the same thought - I hated the car speech. Negotiating is one thing but that's now how you do it. Jack was selling, not negotiating.

Kate is going to become a songwriter. Jack has deemed it.

[screenaddict]

1 hour ago, JudyObscure said:

One of the few times I've teared up (I never cry) at this show was when Louie was coming to Kate for affection and she rebuffed him.  Come on Kate!  Louie didn't ask for any of this. 

I text watched this with my friend, and we had the same reaction - Don't be mean to the dog! Poor Louie. 

[kassandra8286]

3 minutes ago, doodlebug said:

Sometimes, it's a kindness to keep the specifics private, IMO, which is why Rebecca should've been a little less forthcoming in discussing the cause of Jack's death with the kids.

I agree. In the scene where Kate asks Rebecca how Jack died, Rebecca was still in shock and grieving, but I thought her demeanor also revealed some subconscious anger (towards Jack) and resentment (towards Kate). She didn't deny it was Kate's fault when Kate kept pointing out that Jack going back in to get the dog was what killed him. She just kept repeating "I don't know". I felt so bad for Kate in that scene, I felt like she desperately wanted her mom to give her a reason to believe it couldn't have been "her fault" but she didn't.  Yes, later at the tree, Rebecca emphatically told Kate not to blame herself and that Jack was a grown man who made his own choice but by then Kate had already internalized that she "killed her dad"  and it was too late for reassurances otherwise.

[screenaddict]

Random thoughts:

You are all very young. I remember Gerald McRaney from "Simon and Simon."

I'm creeped out by the separating of the ashes. It's my issue - go ahead and dump my ashes, but dump them in one place. Plus, I was uncomfortable with how Rebecca brushed her hands off afterwards. That seemed out-of-character. I feel like she would have crouched down and lovingly picked off the dust and placed it on the ground.

The family's treatment of Kevin boggles me. I've raised my kids, and along the way I have met a lot of kids who excelled in sports. Those kids are the golden children of their families - especially the star quarterback or the top scorers of the soccer team or the pitcher with the lowest ERA. Even when those kids are poopheads, they are still their parent's reason for existing. Here, it's like, "We have Randall, our super genius. We have Kate, our sensitive singer. Oh, and there's Kevin. I think he plays football. Darn it Kevin, why can't you be nice like your siblings?"

I'm glad someone reminded me that we saw Dr. K's wife in an earlier episode, because I thought her aging makeup was off, and I wondered why they didn't just hire an order actress.

[Runningwild]

I really hate when people give up their dogs. It’s not the dog’s fault y’all left him in the house! Jack went back in to get him and you toss him aside? Horrible. 

[SueB]

8 hours ago, pennben said:

Also, I feel the crockpot needs a rebuttal episode if we are giving an episode to the car, it only seems fair. 

Poor abused Crockpot.  I hope their sales recover.

[blondiec0332]

Jerry's Records where Kate was going to see Alanis Morrisette is a real store in Pittsburgh.   I've been there.

[ShadowFacts]

7 minutes ago, screenaddict said:

The family's treatment of Kevin boggles me. I've raised my kids, and along the way I have met a lot of kids who excelled in sports. Those kids are the golden children of their families - especially the star quarterback or the top scorers of the soccer team or the pitcher with the lowest ERA. Even when those kids are poopheads, they are still their parent's reason for existing. Here, it's like, "We have Randall, our super genius. We have Kate, our sensitive singer. Oh, and there's Kevin. I think he plays football. Darn it Kevin, why can't you be nice like your siblings?"

Except we've seen much be made of Kevin and his football abilities, by both Rebecca and Jack.  In this episode teen Kevin is a punk to Randall from the back seat and then again at the reception, I can't work up too much empathy for the guy.  He's often tossing unprovoked barbs at Randall, his jealousy eats him up.  He was supposed to be the star of the family . . . I have a feeling no amount of attention would have been enough.

[Dejana]

45 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Yup. And Jack straight up said he was going to use the kids as a bargaining chip, and that's what he did. Good on him if it worked.

Now I'm remembering all those times my parents dragged us along to the car dealership and I was bored out of my mind and wished I could have stayed home--we were being used as bargaining chips! :)

Rewatched and definitely saw a person who seemed to be Teen Sophie with Kevin after the funeral. Has she ever had any lines?

[DoubleUTeeEff]

If I were Kate, I would love that dog MORE knowing my dad cared so much about me that he didn't want me to lose him. And then I would be devastated when the poor dog finally died. Am I weird? Kate says she blames herself but not wanting the dog is blaming the dog.

I think the Saint Jackhood level was turned up to 11 this episode. I mean, he can literally see the future! Kate is definitely going to become a songwriter.

I really don't think you can negotiate for a car that you just can't afford into a car you can afford. Especially just by talking at someone for 20 minutes. The Pearsons really make a lot of strangers listen to their drama. I wish they would run into someone cranky like me instead of all the incredibly patient people they usually deal with. Well, I guess Rebecca had to deal with the Onion Woman but Randall got the hardware store employee and Toby got the delivery person.

[chocolatine]

1 hour ago, gonzosgirrl said:

I was in high school 78-82 and when we had exams week (she said exams, not a test). Same as you, when we were finished, we could leave, and if we didn't have an exam that day, we didn't have to be there.

But if that had been the case with Kate, wouldn't she just have told her parents that she had a day off from school and would go to the Alanis signing? I doubt they'd have had a problem with that. But she definitely sneaked out, and when Jack found her she was surprised that he didn't take her back to school, so to me that was an indication that she was skipping classes.

Edited February 7, 2018 by chocolatine

[Ohiopirate02]

6 minutes ago, chocolatine said:

But if that was the case with Kate, wouldn't she just have told her parents that she had a day off from school and would go to the Alanis signing? I doubt they'd have had a problem with that. But she definitely sneaked out, and when Jack found her she was surprised that he didn't take her back to school, so to me that was an indication that she was skipping classes.

Kate probably was skipping school, but not missing anything.  I'm the same age as the triplets, and my high school would not allow you to leave early at all even during exams.  I know that I technically skipped school around exams whenever I did not have an exam.  Why sit in school doing nothing.  She was probably just skipping study hall or movie watching. 

[chitowngirl]

13 hours ago, balmz said:

the bridge scene was annoying and really random and unneeded

We needed the bridge scene because the last scene was Rebecca driving over the bridge without hesitation. 

We don’t even know that they gave Louie away! It’s been less than a week since Jack’s death. Emotions are high and it’s not a time to make decisions like that, especially when there are so many other decisions to be made-funeral, living arrangements, clothes, furnishings. No one is thinking straight. The show has always addressed the minutiae and I have no doubt they will with this.

Mandy really had the dead-eyed look of someone who has lost almost everything and has no idea how to carry on.

[Lion18]

13 hours ago, Amethyst said:

These casting directors deserve a raise.  I really thought I was hearing SKB's voice once or twice.  Especially when Randall was arguing with Kevin at the funeral.  

I was actually thinking maybe they are using SKB’s voice

[SueB]

It was a great episode, well crafted.  The Bridge part was especially poignant for me.  As little kids, Randall comes up with facts and Kevin gets them singing Weird Al.  And I like the idea that they are still a family even after Jack is gone.  Grabbing the kids, taking them to the tree and the show was a PERFECT choice - very Jack Pearson of Kate.  And I think Kate has that spontenaity.

But I think the "other shoe" is going to drop.  All along we've seen then scraping by on dollars.  Thank goodness Jack hadn't quit his job yet!  But does he have life insurance?  House insurance?  I'm pretty sure he has at least house insurance but I don't know about how much life insurance. So, I think the "other shoe" is going to drop when the money gets tight and Rebecca has to deal with ALL the years of Jack making financial decisions for the both of them.  

Kevin - Kevin's jealousy over the watch is both predictable and yet irrational.  I think he's "earned" the middle-child syndrome based on how Rebecca and Jack treated him.  OTOH, I think he consoled himself with his football persona and is now adrift.  The fact that he was in a self-pitying mode and had an argument with his dad right before the fire shows that the fallout of that great hospital conversation (when he was injured) did not take full root.  I'm not sure his relationship with his brother gets better until he's 36 to be honest.  I also think he took "on" as his sister's keeper post Jack's death. Finally, I think that when they go from the hotel back to an apartment or whever they live, Kevin won't fully setlle in.  

Kate - The young actress was so spot on.  I see her ignoring Mom's "bullshit" because Jack would never be stupid, so it must be the dog's (and thus Kate's) fault.

Randall - I think he takes on "dutiful child".  He takes his full ride scholarship and "make Dad proud" attitude and is the 'perfect child' post Jack's death.

Going to the Springsteen concert was perfect, but it's the weeks and months AFTER Jack's death that will really tell us how they got to where they wind up emotionally.  

[Katy M]

I think everyone is being too rough on Kate regarding the dog.  If she lvoes the dog, she's going to feel guilty loving the dog, because, in her mind, the dog caused her dad's death.  If she rebuffs the dog, she's going to feel guilty because she does love the dog.  I think Rebecca should have told her to take a couple of weeks to think about it before giving him away, but I don't think this is the unforgivable sin many are making it out to be.  It's not like she's just kicking him out.  She's going to find the dog a good home.  Even when she rebuffed him, she did end up going out to the kitchen and sitting with him. 

About the school skipping, she was skipping school.  I doubt she was just skipping homeroom or "movie watching."  It's easier to skip the whole day than to sneak in and out.  If that's the only time she skipped school, then again, not the biggest tragedy in the world.

5 minutes ago, Winston9-DT3 said:

Metz said "People are going to hate Kate", after she read how Jack dies.  I wonder if she knew we'd hate Kate because she blames herself stupidly, not because she caused the death?  Because if they were going for "audience blames Kate" they really missed the mark.  And if they were going for "audience hates Kate because she's ME-ME-ME", that's an odd choice.  

Well, seeing all the Kate hate regarding the dog, maybe that's what she meant.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

The actress playing teen Kate is so good. When she was in the car with Jack, she looked and sounded just like Chrissy Metz in every way - her facial expressions, the way she said things, just everything. I think because adult Kate is the least changed in many ways since Jack’s death, the actress playing teen Kate has the most imitating to do, and she does it so well. 

[pawsodoom]

13 hours ago, balmz said:

Randall really annoyed me with the watch, like who the hell does that? what is he going to pick through jacks stuff and steal the clothes he was wearing when he died as well?

When my dad passed, my mom gave away a lot of his clothes to other family members and the rest were donated. The one thing I wouldn't let her give away was my dad's Member's Only jacket (yes, I'm dating myself here). My dad died a couple of weeks before the start of my sophomore year of high school, and I wore the jacket every single day that year, no matter what the weather. It was comforting to me. I didn't care if any of my classmates thought it was weird. As I worked through my grief, I stopped wearing it. 

Everyone reacts and deals with grief differently. The fact that Randall was wearing the watch doesn't bother or surprise me at all. 

Edited February 7, 2018 by pawsodoom

[possibilities]

30 minutes ago, DoubleUTeeEff said:

I wish they would run into someone cranky like me instead of all the incredibly patient people they usually deal with. Well, I guess Rebecca had to deal with the Onion Woman but Randall got the hardware store employee and Toby got the delivery person.

Men who act out are charming. Women who act out are crazy bitches.

[Empress1]

5 minutes ago, pawsodoom said:

When my dad passed, my mom gave away a lot of his clothes to other family members and the rest were donated. The one thing I wouldn't let her give away was my dad's Member's Only jacket (yes, I'm dating myself here). My dad died a couple of weeks before the start of my sophomore year of high school, and I wore the jacket every single day that year, no matter what the weather. It was comforting to me. I didn't care if any of my classmates thought it was weird. As I worked through my grief, I stopped wearing it. 

Everyone reacts and deals with grief differently. The fact that Randall wanted the watch doesn't bother or surprise me at all. 

Yeah. I mean, either the personal items go to family and friends or they get donated or thrown out (often, it's a combination of those). And a watch is so personal, particularly for men since often that and a wedding ring are the only pieces of jewelry. I can't imagine getting rid of a father's watch. (I actually have a pocket watch that belonged to my grandfather. It needs to be fixed.) It would be stranger to me if Kevin or Randall DIDN'T keep it.

[Blakeston]

8 minutes ago, Katy M said:

I think everyone is being too rough on Kate regarding the dog.  If she lvoes the dog, she's going to feel guilty loving the dog, because, in her mind, the dog caused her dad's death.  If she rebuffs the dog, she's going to feel guilty because she does love the dog.  I think Rebecca should have told her to take a couple of weeks to think about it before giving him away, but I don't think this is the unforgivable sin many are making it out to be.  It's not like she's just kicking him out.  She's going to find the dog a good home.  Even when she rebuffed him, she did end up going out to the kitchen and sitting with him. 

About the school skipping, she was skipping school.  I doubt she was just skipping homeroom or "movie watching."  It's easier to skip the whole day than to sneak in and out.  If that's the only time she skipped school, then again, not the biggest tragedy in the world.

Well, seeing all the Kate hate regarding the dog, maybe that's what she meant.

I think the cast is under the impression that every single viewer loves Jack so much that any character who could possibly have anything to do with his death will be shunned.

As for the dog, I agree that a lot of fans are being too hard on Kate. No matter how much she tries to tell herself that the dog wasn't the cause of Jack's death, Louie is inevitably going to serve as a constant reminder of his death. The level of grief she's going through is unbearable - if she needs to give the dog away to get through the day, she needs to give the dog away. So long as she does it responsibly, I'm not going to judge.

[Runningwild]

21 minutes ago, pawsodoom said:

When my dad passed, my mom gave away a lot of his clothes to other family members and the rest were donated. The one thing I wouldn't let her give away was my dad's Member's Only jacket (yes, I'm dating myself here). My dad died a couple of weeks before the start of my sophomore year of high school, and I wore the jacket every single day that year, no matter what the weather. It was comforting to me. I didn't care if any of my classmates thought it was weird. As I worked through my grief, I stopped wearing it. 

Everyone reacts and deals with grief differently. The fact that Randall was wearing the watch doesn't bother or surprise me at all. 

 

The fact that Kevin was upset about it doesn’t bother me. I think Rebecca gave it away too quickly. Kevin is grieving too. He lost his father, his house, his future and now the only parent he’s got left is the one he knows prefers his brother over him. 

 

My mom gave away a lot of my dad’s stuff. I got a t-shirt. My brother got his cross, one nephew got his oboe, one nephew got his suits. I don’t know who ended up with his watch. And she gave all that away after the funeral. And his death was expected, not sudden like Jack’s. 

Edited February 7, 2018 by Runningwild

[TV Diva Queen]

18 minutes ago, pawsodoom said:

When my dad passed, my mom gave away a lot of his clothes to other family members and the rest were donated. The one thing I wouldn't let her give away was my dad's Member's Only jacket (yes, I'm dating myself here). My dad died a couple of weeks before the start of my sophomore year of high school, and I wore the jacket every single day that year, no matter what the weather. It was comforting to me. I didn't care if any of my classmates thought it was weird. As I worked through my grief, I stopped wearing it. 

Everyone reacts and deals with grief differently. The fact that Randall was wearing the watch doesn't bother or surprise me at all. 

Good for you <3

My dad passed away about 16 months ago, my son (14yo at the time and he were besties). When my dad is in town, he never missed my son's games (football, basketball and baseball).  At school, on game days, the athletes wear dress clothes.  My son has most of my dad's sweaters and wears them every week to school, with a dress shirt and tie.  Its his way of having his biggest fan ever  with him on Game day.  My mother gave my son one of my dad's watches to wear at the wake and funeral.  

[LADreamr]

14 hours ago, Veronica said:

 

Poor Louie! I need to know what happened to Louie.

 

I hope he met up with Clooney somewhere, and we get an episode through their eyes.

[chitowngirl]

I often wear a piece of jewelry of my mom’s or grandma’s so they get “to go” too. 

My take on the car sale-The salesman saw a young couple was was thinking, “Hey, I’m going to get a great commission today!”. Then Jack tells him about his kids, we see he’s a dad too, and he gives him a decent deal. Not one he’s going to lose his job over (a manager still would’ve had to approve that), but a reasonable price.

[Lady Calypso]

4 minutes ago, Winston9-DT3 said:

I don't think it's inevitable.  I don't think Louie or Kate in any way whatsoever caused Jack's death, so for Kate to view it that way is an odd choice.  Where does it end?   Why not blame Crockpot and the NFL and Rebecca for not cleaning up?  Why not go through life avoiding electrical appliances and open flames and dietary cholesterol?  Well, that latter might at least have had an actual hand in his death.  But it seems to be what she goes to for comfort, not shuns like she does dogs.  

Well, for Kate, Louie symbolizes her father going back into the house and inhaling more smoke that likely killed him. If Jack hadn't have gone back into the house to save her dog, he would be fine. That's teen Kate's thought process. She only just lost her dad less than a week prior. She's not thinking rationally, much like Rebecca wasn't thinking rationally when she agreed to get rid of Louie. And I think it's better that Kate decided to give Louie away rather than having built up guilt and repression toward the dog the longer she might have kept him. She could have completely neglected the dog, but she chose to give him to a better family who would love him and take care of him. 

It's not her fault, of course, but we know that she continues to blame herself for the next two decades. It's not Louie's fault either, but Kate had to give him away because she thought it would help ease the pain (obviously it doesn't). 

[Clanstarling]

1 hour ago, DoubleUTeeEff said:

 

I think the Saint Jackhood level was turned up to 11 this episode. I mean, he can literally see the future! Kate is definitely going to become a songwriter.

I know right? During the scene at the tree when Rebecca was talking about how terrible Jack was at movies, I was hoping she would describe some behavior that was annoying, but amused them. But no, he was so perfect he could predict every twist.

Those kind of affectionate stories were what helped us when my mother died.

Edited February 7, 2018 by Clanstarling

[luna1122]

42 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

The actress playing teen Kate is so good. When she was in the car with Jack, she looked and sounded just like Chrissy Metz in every way - her facial expressions, the way she said things, just everything. I think because adult Kate is the least changed in many ways since Jack’s death, the actress playing teen Kate has the most imitating to do, and she does it so well. 

I think she's a better actress than Chrissy, honestly, and yeah, the facial resemblance is startling. She's actually the only iteration of Kate that doesn't bug me, that I'm fond of, despite being the one who wants to give away Louie.

 

11 minutes ago, Winston9-DT3 said:

I don't think it's inevitable.  I don't think Louie or Kate in any way whatsoever caused Jack's death, so for Kate to view it that way is an odd choice.  Where does it end?   Why not blame Crockpot and the NFL and Rebecca for not cleaning up?  Why not go through life avoiding electrical appliances and open flames and dietary cholesterol?  Well, that latter might at least have had an actual hand in his death.  But it seems to be what she goes to for comfort, not shuns like she does dogs.  

Clearly, opinions are sharply divided here, and I guess we'd all react...however we react. For me, I'd think that pup would be even more precious to me now, and yeah, why not blame the slow cooker and battery-less smoke detector and your mom for not cleaning up the kitchen like a good wife should? Tho....it's Kate, she probably DOES blame those things too, and avoid them, and cry when she sees them, and scream at Toby when he brings home an Instant Pot as a surprise.

[ShadowFacts]

8 minutes ago, Winston9-DT3 said:

I don't think it's inevitable.  I don't think Louie or Kate in any way whatsoever caused Jack's death, so for Kate to view it that way is an odd choice.  Where does it end?   Why not blame Crockpot and the NFL and Rebecca for not cleaning up?  Why not go through life avoiding electrical appliances and open flames and dietary cholesterol?  Well, that latter might at least have had an actual hand in his death.  But it seems to be what she goes to for comfort, not shuns like she does dogs.  

I think what is inevitable is that a time will never come when she isn't reminded of Jack's death -- it's not something that can be forgotten.  To have a knee-jerk reaction that you don't want the dog anymore is understandable, but it is just that, an immediate feeling that could easily diminish over time.  When she said that he was going to pee all over the house and she didn't want to keep him, my thought was, oh this is a twist on adult Kate's dog problem, not that the dog caused Jack to go back in the fire, but that she made a wrong choice to get rid of Louie and regrets it all these years.  Then when Rebecca passively agreed, I could understand how that was not important in the moment, but I hold out hope that in a future episode she puts a stop to it and explains that pets aren't disposable.  And that Kate comes to treasure him as a direct connection to Jack and is inconsolable when the little guy finally dies. 

[ZeroDiscipline]

This show has me so paranoid. I totally thought that Rebecca was going to find that Jack was drinking again, what with the curious attention being paid to his coffee cup.

[Katy M]

34 minutes ago, LADreamr said:

I hope he met up with Clooney somewhere, and we get an episode through their eyes.

No matter what happened to Louie, I can guarantee he's dead by now.  

[Ohiopirate02]

40 minutes ago, Runningwild said:

The fact that Kevin was upset about it doesn’t bother me. I think Rebecca gave it away too quickly. Kevin is grieving too. He lost his father, his house, his future and now the only parent he’s got left is the one he knows prefers his brother over him. 

 

My mom gave away a lot of my dad’s stuff. I got a t-shirt. My brother got his cross, one nephew got his oboe, one nephew got his suits. I don’t know who ended up with his watch. And she gave all that away after the funeral. And his death was expected, not sudden like Jack’s. 

Exactly.  It does make sense that Randall got Jack's watch and Kevin got his dog tags, but I am  looking at this as an rational outsider.  In the midst of the grief and confusion of the Pearson family that week, I  can see how Kevin would react badly to seeing Randall wearing the watch.  He is a grieving 17 year old.  It probably never occurred to Rebecca to take time to explain this to Kevin.  With siblings, it is easy to forget what Mom and Dad already gave you when you see what they have given your brother (or sister). 

[Jillybean]

I thought Rebecca's pledge to spend the rest of her days making sure Kate didn't feel as though Jack's death was her fault was interesting. Clearly that didn't work out so well. 

It's hard for me to relate teen Kate to adult Kate, any physical resemblance notwithstanding. She seems pretty strong as a teen, and incredibly weak as an adult. And her speech about Toby "saving" her still bugs.  I would have preferred to see her on a journey to save herself.

Edited February 7, 2018 by Jillybean

[gonzosgirrl]

1 hour ago, Katy M said:

I think everyone is being too rough on Kate regarding the dog.  If she lvoes the dog, she's going to feel guilty loving the dog, because, in her mind, the dog caused her dad's death.  If she rebuffs the dog, she's going to feel guilty because she does love the dog.  I think Rebecca should have told her to take a couple of weeks to think about it before giving him away, but I don't think this is the unforgivable sin many are making it out to be.  It's not like she's just kicking him out.  She's going to find the dog a good home.  Even when she rebuffed him, she did end up going out to the kitchen and sitting with him. 

About the school skipping, she was skipping school.  I doubt she was just skipping homeroom or "movie watching."  It's easier to skip the whole day than to sneak in and out.  If that's the only time she skipped school, then again, not the biggest tragedy in the world.

Well, seeing all the Kate hate regarding the dog, maybe that's what she meant.

I agree with all of this, even the 'skipping school' part, despite my previous posts, because technically, yes she was skipping school, but not skipping classes, and yeah if she's a good student and this was not a regular 'thing' for her, then I have no problem with her dad going along with it. My dad would've, too.

Man, I love this show. Not because it makes me feel things, but because it lets me feel them. As the only daughter in a family of five, and a true 'daddy's girl' (and adopted to boot); as a woman who struggles with her weight; as a wife (once widowed, once divorced, now single). I can relate to so many of these stories that it is almost too much at times. I don't care as much about the details as I do the emotions of the stories, and they have those down cold.