S02.E13: That'll Be the Day

[BoogieBurns]

1 minute ago, Lovecat said:

They’re 37; the show started on their 36th birthday, and I believe there was reference to their 37th. When Randall said he was 40, he was exaggerating.

Yes, let it be stated here. They were born in 1980. It's very easy to keep with the time line that way. They were 8 in 1988, they were 17 in 97 (when Titanic was being watched and re-watched by the youth of America). They are August babies, so they graduated high school at 17, which is why they were talking about college acceptance letters this episode. 

Titanic was in theaters for so long, that the new theater (not the discount cinema that plays older releases) was playing the movie even after it came out on VHS. I remember thinking that was the longest time a movie was in theaters in my lifetime. 

Broke my heart to see the wall where they measured their height just bubble up into flames. I remember crying when we moved from my childhood home and my dad painted over our height wall without even letting us see it one more time. Also, I think Jack's entertainment center may have kept the videos from burning up. Sometimes all it takes is a closed door for things to not get burned up. They intentionally showed him close that high quality wood with Kate's tape in it.

[DebbieM4]

1 minute ago, Lady Calypso said:

Maybe the producer meant that nobody guessed that Jack died in a fire that is started by a slow cooker? 

I still think he didn't die directly in the house, but at the hospital later on. And I would not be surprised, though a little pissed, if they went the route of him dying suddenly after seeming to be fine. 

I mean, the issue is that Rebecca had Jack's work journal with the rest of his things in the season premiere flashback, when she drove to see the burnt down house for the first time. That question of how that ended with the rest of his belongings still need to be answered. 

Yes, who would have come up with a slow cooker as the cause!  Honestly, though, it doesn't matter, other than apparently dying in a fire because he ran back in to get the dog.  I've read that theory more than any other, so it will be disappointing if that's what it turns out to be.  Whether he dies in the house, in the hospital later, or whatever.  If Kate's guilt was caused by her father going back in to get her dog, then lots of people guessed that awhile ago.  Better for the producer to sit back and let people share their theories rather than say that no one had guessed the truth when in fact it's been all over the internet for awhile.

Of course my angst over this could be premature.  The dog may have little or nothing to do with it, Kate's guilt could come from something else entirely, and unanswered questions (such as the one you mentioned) could be answered by a scenario that had not occurred to viewers.  Here's hoping!!  :-)

[HighHopes]

Maybe Jack doesn't run back in to get the dog, but to get Kate's audition/application tape? They made a point to show him putting it in the cabinet when he was cleaning up. The dog has to play into it somehow, but maybe it's not The Reason for his death? 

Edited January 24, 2018 by HighHopes

[MelGoLightly]

11 minutes ago, jmonique said:

It's not just the teens mimicking the Big Big Three that blew me away, but when 17-year-old Kevin got snotty about "Kevin's the worst again" or whatever it is he said, I immediately flashed to 8-year-old Kevin going off on his dad at the pool.

Am I the only one who was welling up during the previews for the next episode? Oy. If Jack fought through the fire to save Randall and Kate, honestly, he earned the God-like status he holds with that family.

I'm finding it extremely palpable how similar the mannerisms of the teens and adults are. There has to have been a concerted effort on the part of the director to have the teen versions study the adults. But for it to be so seamless across three different teen actors and three different and corresponding adult actors - that can't be a coincidence. Must say, this show continues to impress me in the depth of the story and characters. I'm impressed. 

[ChromaKelly]

Gonna nitpick the crockpot. The crockpot was still on when Jack was cleaning up the kitchen and he switches it off. So, Rebecca left the crockpot of chili on that whole time? No one scooped out the chili, put it away, and washed the crockpot out? 
I might need to go hide in Unpopular Opinions because that ending did nothing for me, I was just like finally, we know. I was starting to wonder if they bought the old people's house and then he died in a fire working on it and it's been a fakeout that it was their house somehow.

[MelGoLightly]

13 minutes ago, BoogieBurns said:

Yes, let it be stated here. They were born in 1980. It's very easy to keep with the time line that way. They were 8 in 1988, they were 17 in 97 (when Titanic was being watched and re-watched by the youth of America). They are August babies, so they graduated high school at 17, which is why they were talking about college acceptance letters this episode. 

Titanic was in theaters for so long, that the new theater (not the discount cinema that plays older releases) was playing the movie even after it came out on VHS. I remember thinking that was the longest time a movie was in theaters in my lifetime. 

Broke my heart to see the wall where they measured their height just bubble up into flames. I remember crying when we moved from my childhood home and my dad painted over our height wall without even letting us see it one more time. Also, I think Jack's entertainment center may have kept the videos from burning up. Sometimes all it takes is a closed door for things to not get burned up. They intentionally showed him close that high quality wood with Kate's tape in it.

I was an August 1980 baby (which makes this show even more interesting, given we are the exact same age) and there are countless (and real) parallels in these kids and my teenage hood. I went to Titanic like 6 times with my boyfriend in 1997. And wore so much flannel. (but I got back around to that again in my 30s...) And was so angsty. It all rings so true to me. They have done a pretty great job of depicting teens of this exact age at that exact time. 

[tennisgurl]

17 minutes ago, jmonique said:

Am I the only one who was welling up during the previews for the next episode? Oy. If Jack fought through the fire to save Randall and Kate, honestly, he earned the God-like status he holds with that family.

*raises hand* I was tearing up the second we saw Jack opening the doors to the flames. I have never simultaneously dreaded and looked forward to an episode of television. At least, not in quite awhile. 

[MelGoLightly]

6 minutes ago, ChromaKelly said:

Gonna nitpick the crockpot. The crockpot was still on when Jack was cleaning up the kitchen and he switches it off. So, Rebecca left the crockpot of chili on that whole time? No one scooped out the chili, put it away, and washed the crockpot out? 
I might need to go hide in Unpopular Opinions because that ending did nothing for me, I was just like finally, we know. I was starting to wonder if they bought the old people's house and then he died in a fire working on it and it's been a fakeout that it was their house somehow.

May I direct you to the "Nitipicks" thread? It's a deluge of over thinking and nitpickery. Join us. Salvation awaits! 

This Is Our Minutiae Thread: For Those Pesky Job/Housing/Money/Geography Details

Edited January 24, 2018 by MelGoLightly

[DebbieM4]

3 minutes ago, ChromaKelly said:

I might need to go hide in Unpopular Opinions because that ending did nothing for me, I was just like finally, we know. 

We can hide there together.  My reaction was more, "Finally!" rather than any sadness, tears, or dread.  I'm very interested in seeing how they all move forward, and I'm more than ready for that.

[Miss Dee]

Okay, show, I need Kevin to find out what was on that note. I don't care how you do it. I don't care if it's through a medium. I don't care if Jack comes back as an actual angel and talks to him. I don't care if Clarence the Angel comes back and talks to him. I don't care if you repeat the exact same plot you did with Randall at the cabin. I will completely swallow whatever half-baked storyline you write, without complaint, but I need Kevin to know what his dad wanted to say to him before he died. It absolutely guts me that we know exactly what last words Jack wanted to say to his son, and Kevin never will. 

Kevin and Randall might have looked good doing that carpentry work - and they did - but it was Toby whom I thought was absolutely adorable in this episode. Not as adorable as Audio, mind, but still.

Edited January 24, 2018 by Miss Dee

[MelGoLightly]

1 minute ago, DebbieM4 said:

We can hide there together.  My reaction was more, "Finally!" rather than any sadness, tears, or dread.  I'm very interested in seeing how they all move forward, and I'm more than ready for that.

See, I don't think this is an unpopular opinion at all. We've all known and have had time to come to terms with Jack being dead from the start. We even saw him have a moment with William before he died. The jig is up. We also know that death does not mean absence in this show. I think that the majority of viewers are looking forward to getting past the how's and what's and moving into what the rest of the series might bring b/c they have clearly lined us up for a wealth of stuff in the future. It's kind of turning drama on its head - come out with the big "reveal" in season 2 and move deep into character development and stories afterward. 

[Cardie]

The crockpot's broken switch shorted out, thus sparking the fire. Curse you, crockpot of doom, and George's foreboding jukebox playing "That'll be the day, when I die." Now we know why viewing the SuperBowl with Jack's ashes is so sacred to Kate. Jack may save everyone from the fire and then die of a heart attack or get hit by a car chasing the dog, I suppose, but if he doesn't go back in for the dog then it's another misdirect for misdirection's sake, which they should give a rest for the central tragedy of the show.

Hasn't Jack been going to AA for weeks or months? I'm sure he made his amends to the kids well before the fire (and we'll see that scene in a flashback some day.)

Randall and Beth partnering to rehab a building reinstates Rebecca and Jack's never to be realized house remodeling and flipping partnership. Perhaps Kevin will sign on full time and Big Three Builders will become a reality at last.

I host a SuperBowl party every year and it's going to take all my restraint not to shoo all the guests out the minute TIU begins. Fortunately I'm retired and a night owl, so if I have to stay up till 3 a.m. to watch, I can.

Edited January 24, 2018 by Cardie

[elle]

52 minutes ago, Pop Tart said:

I am getting extremely tired of the emotional manipulation and the endless, drawn out story of Jack’s death. 

Just selecting one of the many comments about this.  We all know there is no reason for the show to be aired after the Super Bowl.  It could wait until the usual time on Tuesday.  Just more emotional manipulation.

Quote

I host a SuperBowl party every year and it's going to take all my restraint not to shoo all the guests out the minute TIU begins. Fortunately I'm retired and a night owl, so if I have to stay up till 3 a.m. to watch, I can.

Hey, Cardie, you could always continue the party as a one for TIU.

Quote

Charlotte!  I may have been harder on you than anyone here, but all is forgiven.  Classy note; classy gesture.  For those among us who cling to such things: thanks for sending the necklace back.

Agreed, Voiceover, thanks for calling that out.  Charlotte could have been vindictive and kept it as a memento of that night.  I wonder when she found it.

Edited January 24, 2018 by elle

[maggiemae]

OTOH for those upset it is after the SB - you get it to see it one day earlier (Mon) if you record it.

[Artsda]

I started crying already at the end when Jack went downstairs to clean the kitchen & talk to Randall. the build up this show weaves through it's story is so well done.

You see where Kevin's issues stem from, his guilt he feels over Jack with how he left things. I teared up at him getting his necklace back and how the entire plot ties into the Superbowl upcoming is just perfect. 

[DebbieM4]

20 minutes ago, MelGoLightly said:

See, I don't think this is an unpopular opinion at all. We've all known and have had time to come to terms with Jack being dead from the start. We even saw him have a moment with William before he died. The jig is up. We also know that death does not mean absence in this show. I think that the majority of viewers are looking forward to getting past the how's and what's and moving into what the rest of the series might bring b/c they have clearly lined us up for a wealth of stuff in the future. It's kind of turning drama on its head - come out with the big "reveal" in season 2 and move deep into character development and stories afterward. 

I understand that.  My point, really, was that the thought of Jack dying doesn't leave me in a puddle of tears.   And I'm not dreading that episode at all.

I've never understood why he's viewed as Saint Jack.   He and Rebecca are the least compelling parts of this show for me.  I'm far more interested in the other characters, and quite honestly Jack and Rebecca could both disappear entirely (no flashbacks, nothing), and it would be fine with me.  I realize that most viewers don't feel that way.  Hence, my "unpopular opinion".   :-)

[methodwriter85]

1 hour ago, MelGoLightly said:

I was an August 1980 baby (which makes this show even more interesting, given we are the exact same age) and there are countless (and real) parallels in these kids and my teenage hood. I went to Titanic like 6 times with my boyfriend in 1997. And wore so much flannel. (but I got back around to that again in my 30s...) And was so angsty. It all rings so true to me. They have done a pretty great job of depicting teens of this exact age at that exact time. 

I have a sister who is just a few months younger (January 1981 and class of '99) and there is so much they get right. Kevin's flannel hoddies are so dead on.

Betty Crocker has to be pisssssseeeeed. I won't be surprised if they yank any sponsorship or further product placement on the show.

Edited January 24, 2018 by methodwriter85

[Snapdragon]

My guess for Jack's death is that the dog is a complete red herring.  Upon waking up and realizing the house is on fire (and knowing that Kevin is gone for the night), Jack and Rebecca split up to get the kids out of the house, each taking their favorite child (and as we all know, Kevin is no one's favorite so it's double lucky that he wasn't in that house that night since between his basement bedroom and non-favorite status, Kevin would have been totes dead.  Totes).  Rebecca gets Randall out but Jack and Kate get trapped.  In an attempt to save them, Jack makes a rope out of bedsheets or something, sending Kate down first.  She gets down, but accidentally breaks whatever they're using as a ladder, trapping Jack in the fiery house, which is why she blames herself for his death (or by the time she gets out, the fire has reached Jack and he can't make it down).  All the emotions around the dog are probably because after Jack's death, the dog is who Kate clings to and after the dog dies, it's hard for her to get another pet.  

Also Titanic was released in theaters in December of 1997 but stayed in theaters almost a year, so Randall seeing it on Super Bowl Sunday 1998 is realistic.  

And while I'm glad that Kevin got his necklace back, my stomach is turning over the fact that he had to write an apology letter to rapey Charlotte to do it.  I mean, what did the letter say, "Sorry I ran out on you after you used me (while I was obviously drunk and emotionally unstable) to fulfill your pathetic high school fantasies?"  Ugh!

[Rowan]

I'm too easy for this show. I started getting teary-eyed the moment the piano notes started plinking. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

That Was Us:

[MoonMountain]

2 hours ago, HighHopes said:

Maybe Jack doesn't run back in to get the dog, but to get Kate's audition/application tape? They made a point to show him putting it in the cabinet when he was cleaning up. The dog has to play into it somehow, but maybe it's not The Reason for his death? 

I was thinking it has something to do with the tape too! Ugh. But if that were the case, then present day Kate would probably have even more issues around singing and performing and not be able to do it, so I'm not sure.

Kevin talking to Sophie outside of her house was heartbreaking. That's where the tears started for me. Just shows Sophie sees what the viewers see...no real chemistry anymore, and their relationship is a thing of the past. Probably best for everyone to move on. Still, so sad though. 

I am not looking forward to next week. 

I think my parents still have a working crockpot from my childhood. That thing has to be 30+ years old. 

Random side note...a neighbor moved out several years ago and offered me an older working crockpot. I declined because my kitchen is small and I couldn't see myself really using it. A couple years later, I was thinking I should have just taken it because it was in good vintage condition and I got into cooking a bit more and wished I'd had a crockpot (not enough to buy one though! Haha). Now I'm glad I didn't! Never accept crock pots from neighbors!! 

[project90]

4 hours ago, MizStaken said:

Oh my. That was something. I can’t read well without my glasses, what did the note say that Jack taped to the wall. I don’t know how I’ll watch the next episode. 

Kevin

If I don't see you before work tomorrow I love you you owe us an apology Love dad

3 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

Also, something that stood out to me. When Randall and Kevin are talking in the apartment, Randall mentions something about Jack's list of people to make amends to. I don't think we've ever seen that scene happen, so perhaps it's a hint toward Jack surviving long enough to see his kids? 

Though it better not be some stupid fakeout where the doctors say Jack will be fine, only to have him dying later that day.

 

could be a different flash back see Jack list. Read someone still see Jack in flashbacks

 

3 hours ago, debraran said:

I still don't get the airplanes being thrown out and not burned or ashy and how the dog seemed less for the wear in Kate's arms, how she had videos, pictures,  etc. Would they keep so much in another home? This was way before computers and clouds.

and how Rebeca has bag of Jacks things beside her in the car  in flash back she drives back to the burnt house

Edited January 24, 2018 by project90

[methodwriter85]

18 minutes ago, Snapdragon said:

Also Titanic was released in theaters in December of 1997 but stayed in theaters almost a year, so Randall seeing it on Super Bowl Sunday 1998 is realistic.  

And while I'm glad that Kevin got his necklace back, my stomach is turning over the fact that he had to write an apology letter to rapey Charlotte to do it.  I mean, what did the letter say, "Sorry I ran out on you after you used me (while I was obviously drunk and emotionally unstable) to fulfill your pathetic high school fantasies?"  Ugh!

Titanic came out when I was in 5th grade and I remember that was around for a LOOOOOOOOONNNNNGGGGG time. I remember it was considered newsworthy when the 1998 Lost In Space remake unseated Titanic from Number 1, and that movie came out in April.

The show really doesn't seem to be framing what Charlotte did as a bad thing, which is pretty problematic.

[Kilcanon]

2 hours ago, Miss Dee said:

Okay, show, I need Kevin to find out what was on that note. I don't care how you do it. I don't care if it's through a medium. I don't care if Jack comes back as an actual angel and talks to him. I don't care if Clarence the Angel comes back and talks to him. I don't care if you repeat the exact same plot you did with Randall at the cabin. I will completely swallow whatever half-baked storyline you write, without complaint, but I need Kevin to know what his dad wanted to say to him before he died. It absolutely guts me that we know exactly what last words Jack wanted to say to his son, and Kevin never will. 

This is so true. I love how this show, no matter how inevitable, no matter how unpalatable, we knew Jack's death was going to be, I still wanted it to be different. The tragedy happened in the past, yet I want TPTB to change their script and agenda and save Jack.

I'm with you Toby. I surf the web constantly for dogs on petifnder.com that I cannot house now.

I'm extremely glad that he basically got to say goodbye and that neither he nor the kids went to bed angry...

(I still wish that Jack could be saved...)

[Dowel Jones]

I wonder how many crockpots will be listed on EBay by tomorrow morning?

Teenage Kevin dug his personality hook under my skin once again this week, with that snotty tirade toward his parents.  It's always about you, kid.

I loved Beth's snarkery about how Randall could have maybe asked someone who had a history of housing development and who might that be?  Pro tip, Randall:  If a wall has been added to a room, by definition it's not a load bearing wall (unless it replaced one).  Otherwise, what was bearing the load before?

Audio should get an honorary Emmy for Best Supporting Actor simply for those scenes in the shelter.

[BarbieDoll]

So... there's no episode next Tuesday the 30th?  (They're having us wait a week and a half?)...

And in addition to it airing after the Superbowl due to increasing viewership (obviously), anyone finding it poignant that the fire in the show is Superbowl Sunday too...?

Edited January 24, 2018 by BarbieDoll

[project90]

2 minutes ago, BarbieDoll said:

So... there's no episode next Tuesday the 30th?  (They're having us wait a week and a half?)...

And in addition to it airing after the Superbowl due to increasing viewership (obviously), anyone finding it poignant that the fire in the show is Superbowl Sunday too...?

no episode on the 30th

 

episode on the 4th and episode on the 6th

[Spencer Hastings]

I’ve always had an irrational fear of crockpots and this episode proves that maybe I’m not insane for not trusting them. 

I also ordered new smoke detectors for my house, so big props to Jack for that. 

So many moments got me this episode.  Kate watching the video and noticing the way Jack looks at her, Kevin deciding to talk to his dad “in the morning” (we know there will be no such thing), the Big 3 collectively skipping their dad’s last Super Bowl.  Some might find it heavy handed but I ate it all up.

[Manda317]

4 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Wait, so Randall ditched the SuperBowl to see Titanic...a movie where the main characters name is Jack..."I`ll never let go Jack..."

SOBBING FOREVER.

I dislike you now. I will never be able to get that out of my head.

[memememe76]

Maybe we will see Kevin throw Jack's necklace in the ocean. Or maybe that is how Rebecca will removes hers.

Loved it so much. And was that an actress from A Different World? Also, I kinda loved the woman at the dog shelter. 

[catrox14]

Well fuck a duck. That's fucking sad.

I'm so upset. 

[InsertWordHere]

1 hour ago, methodwriter85 said:

Betty Crocker has to be pisssssseeeeed. I won't be surprised if they yank any sponsorship or further product placement on the show.

Just wait till the future episode when a distraught Kate tells a Bed Bath and Beyond employee all about why she has to return the crock pot from her wedding registry because a crock pot killed her father. BB&B employee will be an expert on crock pots and explain all the new safety features modern slow cookers have over the ones from 40+ years ago. Kate will return home trusting in slow cookers again and lose weight through meal prep. Maybe she’ll name her next pet Betty. 

This way Kate can join Rebecca, Randall, and Toby in their habit of pouring their hearts out to random people just trying to get through a day at the job or a trip to the store. 

ETA: And Kevin with the hotel housekeeper. See, everyone really does forget about Kevin. I trust Beth will be the only main character not doing this, because Beth slows her roll when needed. 

Edited January 24, 2018 by InsertWordHere

[Manda317]

3 hours ago, HighHopes said:

Maybe Jack doesn't run back in to get the dog, but to get Kate's audition/application tape? They made a point to show him putting it in the cabinet when he was cleaning up. The dog has to play into it somehow, but maybe it's not The Reason for his death? 

I'm questioning if Kate is looking for her dog and something happens while Jack trying to get her out. Something could fall and hit him as they are running out so he doesn't make it. He doesn't die saving the dog, he dies saving Kate who is looking for the dog. 

[Anela]

4 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

So, I totally teared up at Kevin getting Jack's necklace back. At least that was one good thing to happen to him, even though he can't complete his list of amends. I'm not sure whether this is the end of Sophie, but it sure felt final. I wonder if the actress is stepping aside from her role. Either way, I think it had to happen. 

 

The actress just had another baby, just before Christmas. I think it's about six months until they start filming the next season, so maybe they just wanted to give her an "out" if she didn't want to come back. 

I haven't watched most of this season, but started again a couple of weeks ago, when the family was in therapy. I was stuck away from home, and came into it halfway through. I sobbed through this entire episode, because Jack reminds me of my dad in ways. He's still here, but my mother isn't. I can't believe I cried through this whole hour, and that they left the part I wanted to get over with, until the freaking Super Bowl!! 

[cuppasun]

3 hours ago, jmonique said:

Am I the only one who was welling up during the previews for the next episode? Oy. If Jack fought through the fire to save Randall and Kate, honestly, he earned the God-like status he holds with that family.

Nope, you're not the only one. (*sniffle*)

3 hours ago, BoogieBurns said:

Yes, let it be stated here. They were born in 1980. It's very easy to keep with the time line that way. They were 8 in 1988, they were 17 in 97 (when Titanic was being watched and re-watched by the youth of America). They are August babies, so they graduated high school at 17, which is why they were talking about college acceptance letters this episode. 

Yes. My son, eldest of my three, was born in 1980, and it's so easy to do the math in my aging head, heh. (Also, yes, not a math person, so whatever...). I've used that to track how old the kids on the show are ("oh yeah, same age as A! Wow, how'd I get a kid that old already...")

[SueB]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned that Jack may go after Kevin because he doesn't know Kevin isn't home.  Of course that would put much much more blame on Rebecca for not telling him so maybe that's not it. 

The dog DOES seem more likely but those flames are MASSIVE.  Would Jack really go back for a dog with the house as an inferno?  Perhaps. 

But if Jack gets physically out of the fire but has massive smoke inhalation, or worse, he could have lung and throat damage which swells after the fact and then they die.  It's a HORRIBLE way to go.  In fact, after an ER episode about 20 years ago had a kid die like that, it's haunted me ever since.  If may have to DVR and check the next day to see if they go that route. I literally could not watch that again. It DOES seem like Jack is getting everyone out and most likely to be most damaged.  It hurts my heart to even think about it.  I'm just going to close my eyes, put my hands over my ears and "la la la la la" really loud for the next week and a half.  Yeesh.

On the positive front:

- NOW it makes sense why Garrett Morris is on the show. I couldn't imagine that little guest spot was all he had.  I suspect the apartment will be a big deal.
- I LOVED LOVED the ladies just setting up chairs to watch a tank top Manny do construction work.  They will be remembering that for a looooooong time.
- Audio and Toby are a love that will last forever.  I'm so glad Kate went back for the dog.  So VERY glad.  
- I'm also glad Kevin got the necklace back. 
- I have to say, I thought Justin did excellent work in both the necklace scene and telling Sophie she wasn't just a name on the list.  I think he doesn't get recognized because of the "pretty" factor but Justin deserves award noms.  I'm also okay with him NOT getting Sophie back.  There's just too much history and they both need to move on.  Kevin is no where near ready to pursue a relationship right now.  And I don't know if Sophie could ever let her heart be open enough again.  Plus, there should be consequences for this event and Kevin already feels like he skated by in the past.  It would make little sense for the big grand speech to work again.  It wouldn't feel right.  He would then start to focus on Sophie and not his own recover as well.  ETA: Who is Zeke and what did Kevin need to apologize for?  He was on Kevin's list. 
- Kate taking on a dog again was a BIG step.  I'm so glad she took it.  
 

Finally, I'll go ahead and dive right into the shallow pool -- Justin and Sterling should consider doing a construction business show -- like those TV brothers -- I'd watch that.  Milo could join as well.  

[Anela]

3 hours ago, MelGoLightly said:

I was an August 1980 baby (which makes this show even more interesting, given we are the exact same age) and there are countless (and real) parallels in these kids and my teenage hood. I went to Titanic like 6 times with my boyfriend in 1997. And wore so much flannel. (but I got back around to that again in my 30s...) And was so angsty. It all rings so true to me. They have done a pretty great job of depicting teens of this exact age at that exact time. 

I was just a little bit older, and I loved Kate's flannel jacket that she was wearing. I miss the 90's. :) And being so young. 

I hate Titanic, though. The movie. I was annoyed by it, and only teared up at the end, as it was sinking, and we saw what happened to people - the poor who were locked in, and not allowed to escape on life boats. Ugh. I didn't care about Jack and Kate. I hate love triangles, so the main part of it being taken up like that... anyway, we watched it on video tape, because mum wanted to watch it, and the VCR kept messing up, popping it out every two minutes, so we had to keep pushing it back in. 

[RachelKM]

Well, Fuck.  I can't hate Toby now.  I can't hate anyone who 1) gets that excited about a dog, any dog, coming into his home and 2) falls down Petfinder rabbit holes.  It's a real thing, y'all.

I'm basically over Jack's death with how long we've been set up for it (though I'm sure I'll cry on the day), but the thing that absolutely got me was when I thought Kate was leaving Audio.  I was crushed.  And then when she came home and started giving her speech and I realized she adopted him, I was right there with Toby. "Woman, DO NOT PLAY WITH ME RIGHT NOW!" Audio is presently my favorite Pearson (I fully expect, nay demand, Toby take their name... as of tonight. I may relent.)

Hell yes to the Pearson brothers slo-mo, sleeveless  walk.  I may have to write to the show runners to put in a vote for a PersonBroSloMo per episode quota. 

As for the Titanic discussion, it was definitely in the theaters through most of 1998.  It opened Christmas 1997, but I avoided seeing it until convinced by my then boyfriend (now ex husband) who really liked it in April ish 1998 (it was Palm Sunday weekend, whenever that was).  I was right; it was dumb. 

Edited January 24, 2018 by RachelKM

[Spencer Hastings]

25 minutes ago, SueB said:

ETA: Who is Zeke and what did Kevin need to apologize for?  He was on Kevin's list. 
 

Was Zeke the unattractive roommate with the heart gold? The one who invited him to the party and Kevin screwed him over by trying to steal his role? 

[SueB]

2 minutes ago, Spencer Hastings said:

Was Zeke the unattractive roommate with the heart gold? The one who invited him to the party and Kevin screwed him over by trying to steal his role? 

Wow.  That's a really long tme ago.  I'll be surprised if Kevin can make amends there.

[izabella]

3 hours ago, Miss Dee said:

Okay, show, I need Kevin to find out what was on that note. I don't care how you do it. I don't care if it's through a medium. I don't care if Jack comes back as an actual angel and talks to him. I don't care if Clarence the Angel comes back and talks to him. I don't care if you repeat the exact same plot you did with Randall at the cabin. I will completely swallow whatever half-baked storyline you write, without complaint, but I need Kevin to know what his dad wanted to say to him before he died. It absolutely guts me that we know exactly what last words Jack wanted to say to his son, and Kevin never will.

I don't remember when Jack put the note on Kevin's door.  Was it before he talked to Randall and cleaned the kitchen or after?  Because if he did it before, there's a chance that Randall may have seen the note and could tell Kevin what it said.  But he'd have to have gone to the basement, which he wouldn't have had a reason to do, so, probably not, I guess.  Unless the note was on the door leading to the basement, which could have been on the way to Randall's room...

Loved Toby, Kate and the dog. 

Edited January 24, 2018 by izabella

[SadieT]

Thanks for the crockpot of death, George. 

Going to unplug all my appliances now before I go to bed. 

Never thought I'd have something in common with Toby but I too have lost myself on Petfinder a time or two. 

Would have never forgiven Kate if she didn't go back and get that dog. 

You could see bits of Jack in both Kevin and Randall tonight so in a way, he lives on. 

Nervous about next episode. And now I'm going to have rush home from a super bowl party to watch a beloved fictional character die on TV but I guess that's what this show wants. 

[Amethyst]

Few things upon rewatch that aren't fire related:

Randall mentioned how worried he was to start a new career late in life.  Iirc, he quit his job as a weather commodities trader because he was disrespected by his boss, plus Randall's breakdown due to William dying.  Still, didn't he like what he did?  He went to Tess' Career Day and (badly) rapped about how he loved his career.  After William died, I thought Randall would break out and work solo, or start his own firm.  Not leave the industry entirely for something that came up at the last minute. 

Yeah, Randall is impulsive but I can see why Beth is frustrated.  Their life can't just be about William or Randall's personal issues.  They have a mortgage and two daughters to look after.  And the money situation is pushing it.  I'm wondering if he got a severance from the firm.

 

Sophie admitted that she should have realized something was going on with Kevin, since she was a nurse.  I wonder if the writers were reading the boards, because that was a big complaint, hehe.

 

Is Rebecca done trying to sing professionally?  Sounds like she gave it up after that argument she had with Jack last season.

Edited January 24, 2018 by Amethyst

[project90]

42 minutes ago, Spencer Hastings said:

Was Zeke the unattractive roommate with the heart gold? The one who invited him to the party and Kevin screwed him over by trying to steal his role? 

yup that Zeke

Edited January 24, 2018 by project90

[debraran]

I thought it was really said to see "Dad" at bottom of Kevin's list. ; (  He must have so much guilt being so nasty but he didn't know he wasn't going to see him.

I know he felt terrible about losing his scholarship and probably wanted his Mom to be a little more, "Yeah it sucks" rather than a cheerleader for community college, which is fine but not where he wanted to go. It also emphasizes his grades weren't very good (as he has to bring them up) and made it seem like the scholarship was just talent based as some are, which might have made Kevin feel even worse.

I wonder too about the conversations with all of them that Jack had, Randall made reference too. If it was earlier and a flashback, would Kevin and Kate still be so angry with him, impatient? I hope not, but a deathbed scene might be a little over the top too. I guess we'll see how they get to Miguel's (no cell phones seem so ancient) who calls the fire dept, and how he gets them all out unscathed to Miguel's and the red haired girl hears about it and shows up at Miguel's too before Kevin even knows?

 

On 1/23/2018 at 9:59 PM, MelGoLightly said:

Did anyone else, when the old guy arrived so happy to deliver the crock pot that would bring on the fate of this family before the children were even born/adopted, think OMFG GET YOUR DEVIL CROCK POT AWAY! YOU HAVE CURSED THIS FAMILY!" 

Asking for a friend. 

I just thought, you picked out a crock pot that has a knob that needs to be shaken and give it to a neighbor? I think I'd rather have just seen the crock pot malfunction on it's own, why show neighbors? Or have them buy it at a tag sale being low on funds. But Chrissy said fans will blame her so I guess she felt her part was worse than her parents using an old crock pot past it's prime. That one really should never have been used. This show goes back and forth so often, I get dizzy sometimes!

And only one smoke detector is a bad thing in 2 story, one battery not working is fine, the second would have caught and it and why didn't the dog bark (or it did and they didn't show it yet) I hate fire, always feared it  so this will be hard to watch.

 

On 1/24/2018 at 12:53 AM, project90 said:

 

 

and how Rebeca has bag of Jacks things beside her in the car  in flash back she drives back to the burnt house

Except for the steno book he used for AA and maybe work, keys and rings, etc wouldn't burn and the book might have been left in the car. That said, why was the book in the bag, he was in bed, why would it be on him going to hospital? That one thing, made me think he was in rehab or lived after fire.

It might have been a product placement not given much thought, but grabbing that leaving a burning house is odd and having it bagged later is odd too.

Edited January 24, 2018 by debraran

[Blakeston]

6 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

Maybe the producer meant that nobody guessed that Jack died in a fire that is started by a slow cooker? 

I still think he didn't die directly in the house, but at the hospital later on. And I would not be surprised, though a little pissed, if they went the route of him dying suddenly after seeming to be fine. 

I mean, the issue is that Rebecca had Jack's work journal with the rest of his things in the season premiere flashback, when she drove to see the burnt down house for the first time. That question of how that ended with the rest of his belongings still need to be answered. 

I have to wonder if Jack ends up jumping from the top floor. I don't see the writers letting him die without communicating some extra-poignant last words to his family. Maybe he goes back into the burning house to find the dog (who isn't actually inside), and winds up on the second story, and calls out his final goodbyes to his family members on the ground before he has to jump. And then he dies either from the fall, or from smoke exhalation.

3 hours ago, Snapdragon said:

And while I'm glad that Kevin got his necklace back, my stomach is turning over the fact that he had to write an apology letter to rapey Charlotte to do it.  I mean, what did the letter say, "Sorry I ran out on you after you used me (while I was obviously drunk and emotionally unstable) to fulfill your pathetic high school fantasies?"  Ugh!

I agree. Her name being checked off suggests that she only decided to give the necklace back once he made his amends to her. (Unless she just happened to find it around the time that he made his amends, which seems unlikely.)

She knew fully well that the necklace was his only memento of his dead father. You don't withhold something like that, no matter how hurt you were that the person ditched you.

[Arcadiasw]

Now I don’t feel bad when people want to give me their old stuff and I politely decline (more than once) but they keep insisting I take it and I do only to throw it away or give it away to Goodwill.

Jack and Rebecca were lucky for 18 years that fire hadn’t happen already. Giving someone something that’s defective, is an accident waiting to happen if that defect isn’t fixed.

I love my slow cooker and I use it a lot but I’m always home when I use it and when I’m done, I always unplug it.

 

Beth was right to read Randall the way she did but she shouldn’t have gone in business with him in renovating that building. Randall jumps into things without thinking it through and doesn’t listen well. Those tenants were rude. I understand them being disgruntled over their living conditions and their previous landlords but Beth and Randall were their new landlords and the least they could do is be civil and let them speak and tell them what they are going to do before voicing their concerns. Beth and Randall’s first mistake was letting those tenants take over that meeting. Those tenants are gonna run over Randall.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I'm glad that Kevin is in therapy and trying to work through his issues but if ever there was someone who needs therapy, it's Kate. This is someone who couldn't even entertain the thought of getting a dog for over twenty years because the only other dog she had as a teenager was somehow involved in Jack dying. That's like saying you can't talk to or be friends with or have relationships with all [insert any group of people] because one was tangentially involved in something crappy that happened to you over two decades ago. I mean, it was to the point that Toby said he knew that dogs were "a sensitive issue" for Kate and he told her to forget that he was looking at pictures of dogs. It's not like he was looking at grisly crime scene photos. She would barely even look at him when he was talking about how he'd fallen down a puppy rabbit hole.

Wow, Rebecca is a pretty lenient parent if she was totally fine with Kevin spending the night at his girlfriend's house when they're still in high school. I'm trying to imagine my parents' reaction if I had told them, "I'm just going to spend the night at my boyfriend's house," when I was in high school.

Hahahaha, how many people are going to start unplugging their Instant Pots due to this episode? I have been super paranoid about fires since I was a little kid. When I got old enough not to sleep with my stuffed animals anymore, I put my two favorite ones in my little kiddie plastic shopping cart by my bedroom door so that in case of a fire, I could grab them on my way out. Yup, serious paranoia. Where I live now, we have an electric stove (which Mr. EB hates). I won't leave dish towels or anything on top of the burners. I always make sure there's nothing on them before bed. I know the chances of the burner turning itself on and setting a towel on fire are slim to none, but like I said, I AM PARANOID ABOUT FIRE.

Shallow notes: thank you for letting us see Randall's biceps in that slow motion walk down the hallway. Loved the women in the building coming in to watch the Manny at work. And Audio was adorable!

I'm really glad that Kevin got Jack's necklace back. I can only imagine how much more guilt he had about now that we've seen the last interaction he had with Jack.

I am also glad that Sophie said that the best thing Kevin could do was leave her alone and just let her have her memories of him from when they were younger. Just because you love someone (and I have no doubt that Kevin loves Sophie) doesn't mean that you are good together. And just because you loved someone a long time ago doesn't mean that you should be together now. Having a past together isn't always enough to build a future.

 

57 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

Her name being checked off suggests that she only decided to give the necklace back once he made his amends to her. (Unless she just happened to find it around the time that he made his amends, which seems unlikely.)

She knew fully well that the necklace was his only memento of his dead father. You don't withhold something like that, no matter how hurt you were that the person ditched you.

I'm not going to make excuses for Charlotte's actions earlier in the night, but I blamed her not looking for Kevin's necklace after she kicked him out on a combination of her anger in the moment and her drunkenness. I think that most people would see in the cold sober light of the next day that it's shitty to keep someone else's stuff.

But I think the main reason she didn't return his necklace before he made amends to her was because she didn't know where he lived. The Pearson house burned down and none of the Pearson siblings live in their hometown anymore. I know that many of my high school classmates' parents eventually sold their bigger houses and downsized into smaller places, so if I had to go on a quest to track down someone from my high school who had become famous and their parents had moved in the 20 years since graduation, I probably wouldn't be able to find them either. When Kevin sent his apology letter, he must have included a return address which is what allowed her to send his necklace to him.

Edited January 24, 2018 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Anela]

10 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

 

Hahahaha, how many people are going to start unplugging their Instant Pots due to this episode? I have been super paranoid about fires since I was a little kid. When I got old enough not to sleep with my stuffed animals anymore, I put my two favorite ones in my little kiddie plastic shopping cart by my bedroom door so that in case of a fire, I could grab them on my way out. Yup, serious paranoia. Where I live now, we have an electric stove (which Mr. EB hates). I won't leave dish towels or anything on top of the burners. I always make sure there's nothing on them before bed. I know the chances of the burner turning itself on and setting a towel on fire are slim to none, but like I said, I AM PARANOID ABOUT FIRE.

 

I'm the same way, although I leave my IP plugged in a lot. I've left it cooking a few times when we've left the house, but once I panicked over it.

I'm always moving things off the burners, and I used to want try to make sure that I knew where the animals were, preferring that they were in my room, so that I could try to get them through the window, in case of emergency. I have Worst Case Scenario brain. We have had a very small fire, and a bed on fire before, which I put out (it wasn't mine). I couldn't watch the house go up in flames, in this episode. I was crying too hard, and walked away. 

[Mrs. DuRona]

My theory?  Kate is the one who goes back into the house for the dog.  Jack goes in to save her, resulting in his death.  It explains why she feels such deep guilt about it and has a hard time with getting a dog.  

When Kate was saying she couldn't take Audio, I was actually yelling at my TV "Get the dog!  Take him home!"  I'm definitely more of a cat person, but that dog was the absolute cutest thing.  

My place of employment has a phone number that is very similar to the crock pot help line, we get calls for them almost daily.  I'm curious to see if there's an uptick in calls today...