Figure Skating

[Darknight]

I'm Sorry Ashley looks bitter. She had two chances to medal and didnt do it. She wouldn'thave saved the team

32 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

I think I'm letting my imagination run away with me a bit when it comes to that coach. I don't know her so it's not really fair but she looks damn scary. Plus I saw this 1 minute video of the two girls practicing and when they were being interviewed they were teary. They looked so poorly and little. I think part of why I wanted them to do so well (ie win!) was because I keep imagining bad things happening to them if they don't! 

It's sad because even if they do well we will never see them again. I want to see more of them not less.

[specialj67]

7 hours ago, fan94 said:

LOL https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/columnist/brennan/2018/02/23/wrong-russian-won-gold-medal-womens-figure-skating-2018-winter-olympics/366111002/

She made great points about Zagitova’s questionably high PCS and the short shelf life of top-tier Russian female figure skaters, but yeah, not an exact repeat of Tara vs. Michelle.

[BelleBrit]

Ashley came in 7th, but she skated pretty well, Samson and Delilah was one of my favorite programs of hers.  But I'm not sure what the difference between 7th-10th is in the public's eyes, and whether it's better or worse to skate well and come in 7th and skate not so well and come in 10th.  One thing I will say about Ashley and Gracie though, they held down those three ladies spots for more than a few years, and they also had to deal with the media spotlight and people like Christine Brennan and Phil Hersh bitching to them about why they were coming in 4th or 5th instead of in 1st-3rd.  Ashley and Gracie (and Mirai, for that matter. She just ended up peaking physically and mentally for the team event.  There was also a lot of backlash from the ice dance fan community leading up to the team event when there was talk about the Shibs doing  both events and subbing in Mirai, with people saying that Mirai would underrotate and underwhelm, and basically walk away with a freebie medal on the backs of ice dance and Nathan.  I don't blame her for thinking that she did her duty to them tbh) owe the USFS nothing at this point, as far as I'm concerned, their real problem and thing to figure out is the lack of talent and depth coming up.  

edit: Here's the new People Magazine Mirai apology exclusive, which I knew would be coming. Sigh. 

http://people.com/sports/winter-olympics-2018-mirai-nagasu-explains-dwts-interview-triple-axel/

Edited February 24, 2018 by BelleBrit

[displayname]

28 minutes ago, specialj67 said:

She made great points about Zagitova’s questionably high PCS and the short shelf life of top-tier Russian female figure skaters, but yeah, not an exact repeat of Tara vs. Michelle.

That PCS is questionable only when you don't consider that Medvedeva had a similar rise in PCS in her first year as senior.

 

Medvedeva, too, would have had the exact same article written about her had she debuted on the Olympic year and beaten the favourite. It's the exact same thing. It's why it's annoying when these journalists start spewing garbage about Medvedeva's "artistry" of miming deserved more PCS, and that Zagitova somehow stole away the medal because of backloading and "undeserved" PCS, because that's been the story of ALL Russian ladies, starting with Lipnitskaya and Sotnikova in 2014.

[BlackberryJam]

On rewatch, Medvedeva really lumbers into her jumps. In comparison to Zagitova, Medvedeva's jumps are not smooth, clean or artistic. So I struggle with "Oh Medvedeva is so artistic" when she just looks so heavy (and I don't mean her weight) going into and landing her jumps. Every single jump requires so much effort while Zagitova incorporates her jumps beautifully and seamlessly into the choreography.

Artistry is not exaggerated facial expression.

 

Edit: So I rewatched both again so this edit is like an hour later. Zagitova has magnificent carriage. Her back and shoulders are naturally like a ballroom dancer, the arch, the lift through her shoulders. Medvedeva looks like she's working hard not to slump, as that's her natural posture. Zagitova also looks like she has much more upper body strength than Medvedeva. I'm betting Zagitova puts in more aggressive gym time.

This might be my anti-Anna Karenina bias, but that music just isn't beautiful. It didn't lend itself to a program that flowed.  

I am not terribly impressed with Zagitova sticking herself in the ballerina box with her programs. It's worked for this season, but if she's going to continue, I'd like to see her being a little more free, less constrained. 

Those two have really set themselves apart from the other skaters.

Edited February 24, 2018 by BlackberryJam

[Chaser]

I have no problem saying Zag was/is the better skater, I just felt more for Med. 

[BitterApple]

I have no issue with the results even though I preferred Med to Zag, however from my understanding Zag backloading her SP was what won her the medal. I understand Alina was playing within the rules, but if you're going to go that route then your PCS needs to take a nosedive. It's not an artistic, balanced program when you spend the first half of it treading water. For it to come down to that leaves me feeling sort of deflated about the whole thing. 

[PattyG]

They never did penalize the PCS of skaters who front load so what would be the justification of penalizing the ones who backload?  

To be fair, Med backloads her programs as well.  All her jumps are in the back half for the short, almost (but not quite) all in the FS, so it's just the degree of backloading, so very small difference for the FS, which they tied anyway. The real deciding factor was the difference in the base values of 3Lz3L vs 3F3T in the short. 

I do feel bad for Med because I like her a lot, but I thought Zag was superior both artistically and technically and definitively deserved the win.  I don't agree with higher GOE for Med considering how much higher, more fully rotated and more effortless Zag's jumps were. They were both overscored on PCS but I thought Med was more overscored.  Neither as overscored as Costner who should have finished behind Sakamoto and Choi.  And should at least have finished behind Sotskova in the FS.

[HartofDixie]

Skaters music for tonight’s gala:

[PattyG]

Does anyone know why Misha Ge is in the gala?  I like him, but he's neither Korean or a top finisher, which all the others seem to be.  

OK, I just looked him up, it seems that he's "a little bit Korean."  Source.

[Eyes High]

13 minutes ago, HartofDixie said:

Skaters music for tonight’s gala:

Kaetlyn Osmond's skating to a Hallelujah cover. Groundbreaking.

Heh, Marchei and Hotarek are skating to Barbie Girl. 

Yay for Virtue/Moir skating to the Tragically Hip. Nice tribute to Gord Downie.

[anniebird]

14 hours ago, BitterApple said:

I remember when dirt started coming out about the Karolyis, and Kim Zmeskal said Marta only allowed the girls to eat fruit in the weeks preceding the Olympics. I don't know how one of them didn't drop dead from the strain that must've put on their bodies.

I'm surprised they didn't all get rickets.

[mledawn]

I literally sighed when I read that Kaetlyn Osmond was skating to Hallelujah. Come on. Certain songs should be retired.

I am completely prepared to cry during the Virtue/Moir skate. I can hardly listen to the song now without losing it, it's so heavy with memories and of course, Gord.

[MaKaM]

3 minutes ago, mledawn said:

I literally sighed when I read that Kaetlyn Osmond was skating to Hallelujah. Come on. Certain songs should be retired.

I am completely prepared to cry during the Virtue/Moir skate. I can hardly listen to the song now without losing it, it's so heavy with memories and of course, Gord.

Especially when at least one of your teammates has already used it. If we can't get worldwide agreement on 1 top level skater or pair per song, at least we should be able to get country limits. Only 1 Canadian per Moulin Rouge, Hallelujah, Swan Lake, etc.

[Darian]

Is Hallelujah cover by KD Lang? Lang's Canadian and her cover of Hallelujah is from her Canadian songwriters tribute album (which I love), but geez, that song is still done too much. Blah.  

[Omeletsmom]

18 hours ago, HartofDixie said:

Their newest video is trending on you tube! I can’t wait to see their Olympics vlog!

I am Ded of the Cute!

[mledawn]

2 minutes ago, Darian said:

Is Hallelujah cover by KD Lang? Lang's Canadian and her cover of Hallelujah is from her Canadian songwriters tribute album (which I love), but geez, that song is still done too much. Blah.  

Sadly no, the cover is by Tori Kelly, which I am not familiar with. However, there's only so much that can be done with that song at this point.

[BitterApple]

39 minutes ago, Eyes High said:

Kaetlyn Osmond's skating to a Hallelujah cover. Groundbreaking.

 

 

[SeanC]

49 minutes ago, Eyes High said:

Kaetlyn Osmond's skating to a Hallelujah cover. Groundbreaking.

Her regular exhibition routine this season has been “I Love It” by Icona Pop, so I guess she must have decided to change it out.

[Guest]

Ashley Wagner needs to get over herself. She’s not half as good as she thinks she is. 

I finally watched the ladies’ competition and feel Alina deserved the win. I do think they need to change the 10% bonus structure though. 

Did the Bielman get rated highly in the new scoring system? I feel like it used to be a rare spin and now it is the new layback.

[stealinghome]

3 hours ago, BitterApple said:

I have no issue with the results even though I preferred Med to Zag, however from my understanding Zag backloading her SP was what won her the medal. I understand Alina was playing within the rules, but if you're going to go that route then your PCS needs to take a nosedive. It's not an artistic, balanced program when you spend the first half of it treading water. For it to come down to that leaves me feeling sort of deflated about the whole thing. 

ITA. I also think there needs to be a cap on the bonus for backloading because putting all the jumps in the back half defeats the rationale for having the bonus to begin with (rewarding jumping on tired legs towards the end of a program). Not that one is fresh as a daisy after skating around and doing the other requirements in the first half, but if all jumps are in the back half, a skater’s legs seem like they would be less tired at the halfway mark than someone whose program is balanced and has done some jumps in the first half.

[NUguy514]

6 hours ago, specialj67 said:

She made great points about Zagitova’s questionably high PCS and the short shelf life of top-tier Russian female figure skaters, but yeah, not an exact repeat of Tara vs. Michelle.

Yet she completely ignored Med's awful technique yielding ridiculously high TES (and PCS, for that matter), but facts get in the way of 20-year-old axes that need grinding.

9 hours ago, fan94 said:

LOL that moment when you discover that Med beat Zag on PCS and GOEs in the FS (and was pretty much dead even on GOEs in SP).

 

So she's neither the better technician nor the better artist according to the judges. Just a backloader.

 

Ladies' FS is bogus.

Seriously, the scores are laughable.  Med outscored Zag on the GOE of the lutz (Zag's first one, not in combination), even though Med very obviously flutzed it (Zag's landing was a little wonky because she didn't do the loop, but come on).  She outscored Zag on the GOE of the double axels each did at the end of their programs...I mean, what?  Zag's double axel isn't phenomenal by any means, but Med's is just awful.  She outscored Zag on every single program component, including transitions and skating skills, which almost makes my blood run cold because Zag has SUCH better skating skills. @BlackberryJam nailed it with Zag's excellent carriage and strength and Med's poor posture and laborious jumping technique (and Med's artistry being comprised of facial expressions), and that wasn't (and historically hasn't) been reflected in Med's inflated scores.

I'd also disagree that Zag should be docked for backloading.  I want the ISU to fix that loophole because it's kind of annoying, but Zag was playing within the rules and shouldn't be punished for that; moreover, the choreography of her program and the placement of all the jumps in the second half made sense with that musical selection.

NBC showed the top four ladies' free skates again on its afternoon broadcast yesterday; after watching again, my top three would be Zag, Osmond, and Miyahara, in that order.  I just can't get over Med's technique and find her PCS ridiculously over-scored compared to fundamentally better skaters like Osmond and Miyahara (even with her lack of height, Miyahara's jumps are just so much cleaner), and I actually think Osmond should've received the highest PCS.  I just...really don't care for Med's overwrought style or poor technique, even though she seems like a sweet young woman.

[scarynikki12]

19 hours ago, HartofDixie said:

Their newest video is trending on you tube! I can’t wait to see their Olympics vlog!

 

Fatal cuteness.

[Guest]

Brennan’s article really irritates me because I can’t think of another sport where an athlete would be so criticized for utilizing a strategy under the existing rules. But because ladies’ figure skating is supposed to be dainty little feminine girls, using the rules to gain a competitive edge is wrong to Brennan.

[doodlebug]

3 minutes ago, deaja said:

Brennan’s article really irritates me because I can’t think of another sport where an athlete would be so criticized for utilizing a strategy under the existing rules. But because ladies’ figure skating is supposed to be dainty little feminine girls, using the rules to gain a competitive edge is wrong to Brennan.

Brennan used to be a pretty decent skating writer, however, she's  now got a passel o'biases that color her opinions on all parts of the sport.  I, too, feel sad that so much of the artistry and beauty in figure skating has gone by the wayside in favor of doing the big jumps; but its not the fault of the skaters.  Zag not only played by the rules, she used them to help her win.  Not her fault, nothing wrong with that strategy.  And comparing Med's 'artistry' in any way to Michelle Kwan's is just ridiculous.

[MostlyC]

I’m giving virtually everyone a pass on whatever they’re saying right now.  Especially the women, who skated last out of all the figure skating competitions. They’ve been in a super intense period of training, competition and global media madness; I think they are all punch drunk (and/or, in some cases, probably drunk) from the stress and craziness that is the olympics.  

Co-workers/friends were elite athletes, and what they described sounded pretty nuts.  And in all of that, they are supposed to compete at their very very best.

[Omeletsmom]

Quote

Evgenia Medvedeva, the 18-year-old two-time defending world champion, is her sport’s best example of a complete skater, a masterful jumper and expressive artist whose programs are built to honor skating as it was meant to be: with all the requisite physical muscle of the toughest triple jumps, but the subtle, well-placed, connective balance of a true performance.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/columnist/brennan/2018/02/23/wrong-russian-won-gold-medal-womens-figure-skating-2018-winter-olympics/366111002/

Hahahahahahaha!  Did she not see Medvedeva muscling through those jumps?  Or the Flutz so obvious that even I, who can barely tell one jump from another, could see it without the slow mo?

Edited February 24, 2018 by Omeletsmom
Extraneous words.

[displayname]

42 minutes ago, Omeletsmom said:

a masterful jumper and expressive artist whose programs are built to honor skating as it was meant to be:

Skating as it was meant to be: crammed with transitions to get the TR mark, crammed with "expression" to get the PE mark, crammed with arm movements to get the IN mark, crammed with unnecessarily long step sequences and useless changes of direction which have nothing to do with the music to get that SS mark. Too bad it's ugly for the CO mark though. But she gets that anyway.

Edited February 24, 2018 by fan94

[MaKaM]

It is odd, you watch older programs and they seem so empty, there is not constant movement in all directions, arms and body going in opposite directions from the feet, etc. But they also had time to hold a position and actually interpret music. An Ina Bauer that crossed the entirety of the ice, a change of edge spiral that flowed with the music, a sequence of split jumps, etc. Yeah, the programs were emptier but they were, well, faster. And more joyful. It would be nice to see if a middle ground could ever be reached.

Edited February 24, 2018 by MaKaM

[Crs97]

3 minutes ago, MaKaM said:

 

It is odd, you watch older programs and they seem so empty, there is not constant movement in all directions, arms and body going in opposite directions from the feet, etc. But they also had time to hold a position.

 

I have the opposite  opinion, at least as it relates to the men’s figure skating. If you watch Boitano and Orser, they have all sorts of interesting moves into jumps - spins, spread eagles, death drops, leaps, even single axels that are interesting.  Now it’s just skate to the next quad with arms flailing. 

[elle]

NBC is airing an "in between" piece about the '88 Calgary Olympics battles: Battle of the Brians and Battle of the Carmens.  Not sure if I want to watch Debi Thomas' heartbreaking performance again but I do want to hear what she has been up to over the years.

I do like Rob Lowe as a narrator.

[dankesean]

2 minutes ago, elle said:

NBC is airing an "in between" piece about the '88 Calgary Olympics battles: Battle of the Brians and Battle of the Carmens.

Oh, good, I haven't heard Carmen in ages.

[ChicksDigScars]

23 hours ago, LadyKenobi said:

 Everything prior to March 21, 2006, the day Twitter debuted, if you want to play dueling strawmen.

Since the rise of social media, sports has exponentially become a gladiatorial arena of personal branding, particularly within "every four year" events like figure skating. It's reductive, counter-productive, and detrimental to the sport in service of self-gratification and the race for Instagram likes. Some resist this, and good for them. 

 

7 Significant Political Events in Olympic History (and only one of them occurs since the advent of social media)

[twoods]

Yay! I’ve been waiting for some skating to K-pop. Would have loved to hear some BTS but will take what I can get. 

[HartofDixie]

Sasha Cohen article

Mirai apology

[Thumper]

When is the skating gala being televised?  I thought someone said today, but I can't find it in the cable lineup.  .Thanks.

[Moxie Cat]

4 hours ago, PattyG said:

Does anyone know why Misha Ge is in the gala?  I like him, but he's neither Korean or a top finisher, which all the others seem to be. 

I also questioned why there are some 5's and 6's in the gala, but not all. C/L finished 6th and are in it, but Nathan Chen (5th) is not. Is it for people who are retiring?

9 minutes ago, Thumper said:

 

When is the skating gala being televised?  I thought someone said today, but I can't find it in the cable lineup.  .Thanks.

 

NBCSN has it for me from 4-6 am (EST). Early Sunday morning. There is also an empty hour of "Olympics" slotted after that so I'm guessing that is for the overrun and will set that too. At 7 they have soccer so it will end by then, probably.

[MostlyC]

Nathan Chen has the flu.

[absnow54]

1 minute ago, Moxie Cat said:

I also questioned why there are some 5's and 6's in the gala, but not all. C/L finished 6th and are in it, but Nathan Chen (5th) is not. Is it for people who are retiring?

I think someone mentioned a few pages back that Nathan Chen was scheduled to perform, but backed out due to illness. 

[redpencil]

Yeah, apparently Nathan Chen was originally slated to be in the gala. Here's his exhibition skate from Nationals:

[Enero]

9 minutes ago, HartofDixie said:

Sasha Cohen article

Great and interesting piece by Sasha. I can only imagine how difficult it is for athletes to transition from a life of strictly defined schedules and goals. It’s likely even harder for those who have meteoric careers. I guess that’s why we see so many who have held on to skating for so long even when it was clearly time to move on ala Caroline Kostner, Mao Asada, Plushenko, even Patrick Chan etc. 

I’d love to see the documentary she’s working on about that transition. It sounds interesting. 

[Mindthinkr]

According to my announced line up, NBC will be featuring the Bobsled and Figure Skating Exhibitions tonight at 8 pm EST. (That usually means they’ll start with the Bobsled and put the skaters in later). Hope that everyone can find it in their areas. 

[peachmangosteen]

26 minutes ago, Thumper said:

When is the skating gala being televised?  I thought someone said today, but I can't find it in the cable lineup.  .Thanks.

It's listed in the description for tonight's prime time coverage on NBC, but they'll likely only show a couple of the performances. Or possibly none at all if they find things they feel more important to show. Someone earlier in this thread also linked to a live stream of it.

ETA: Found the link to the live stream. It starts at 7:30 et. This article also has UK links.

Edited February 24, 2018 by peachmangosteen

[COESpiral]

9 hours ago, BelleBrit said:

 

edit: Here's the new People Magazine Mirai apology exclusive, which I knew would be coming. Sigh. 

http://people.com/sports/winter-olympics-2018-mirai-nagasu-explains-dwts-interview-triple-axel/

Anymore, I think of Mirai in the same way I think of Gabby Douglas:  she's damned if she does and damned if she doesn't.  Both ladies seem to have an absolute talent for saying wrong thing at the wrong time and while you know full well they don't mean to come across as not thinking or crass or irresponsible, that's how it's translated.  And then they have to go back and say, no, that's not what I meant and it came out wrong the first time.  

I don't for a second believe Mirai thinks she's the "savior" of the team event or that she is flip about her performances.  Girl just has her mouth working at a different speed than her brain and when her brain catches up it's like, oh shit.  It's the kind of thing the media absolutely loves and I hate that.  

She's apologized, she's exhausted physically and mentally, and she just wants to go home and snoodle with her dogs.  I'm giving her a break.

[anniebird]

4 hours ago, deaja said:

Ashley Wagner needs to get over herself. She’s not half as good as she thinks she is. 

I finally watched the ladies’ competition and feel Alina deserved the win. I do think they need to change the 10% bonus structure though. 

Did the Bielman get rated highly in the new scoring system? I feel like it used to be a rare spin and now it is the new layback.

Except the layback is prettier.

[ChicksDigScars]

Another version of Hallelujah? Yeah, there are evidently 25 versions of it, sung by 25 different people, but STAAAAAAAAAAAPPPPPPPPP. PLEEESE.

 

We couldn't even get a break during the Exhibition Gala? Why don't y'all just say "fuck it" and haul out Carmen and Moulin Rouge, too?  We need another night of the Figure Skating Drinking Game. Evidently, our livers aren't pickled enough after 17 days. 

[PradaKitty]

My vote for the most overused word of these Olympics—- REDEMPTION!  Please people, buy a thesaurus... 

[Darknight]

Can I just say I hate reporters and their dumb questions. Stop asking about failures and how does it feel to lose or shit about the past

[HartofDixie]

5 hours ago, anniebird said:

I'm surprised they didn't all get rickets.

The skeletons are coming out of the closet for the Karolyi’s.

https://www.apnews.com/0c67e962d7524c87a865d3c468bdd521

5 hours ago, PattyG said:

Does anyone know why Misha Ge is in the gala?  I like him, but he's neither Korean or a top finisher, which all the others seem to be.  

OK, I just looked him up, it seems that he's "a little bit Korean."  Source.

Hes a performer like Jason Brown and has already started his career as a choreographer. Check out the videos on his Instagram where they were trying out curling and speed skating:

https://www.instagram.com/mishage8

[Quof]

If a skater wants to use "Hallelujah", it should be only the original.