S34.E05: Dirty Deed

[truthaboutluv]

7 minutes ago, Sugar said:

The most confusing thing, is that Hali was at the bottom of the tribe after the swap, and most likely would have been voted off if the red tribe went to tribal and there hadn't been a twist. So out of all of Debbie's ranting and raving, that's the part that really made me "WTF?!?!".

This exactly. When she was going on about Hali being so far up Brad's butt or his up hers or whatever and that whatever Hali wants, she gets, I was so confused because I kept thinking, "wait, wasn't this the Hali that was almost booted when it came down to her and Caleb and it was made clear to her she was completely at the bottom? And the only thing that saved her was the big twist last week?" Yeah, just more evidence that either editing is hiding a lot or Debbie is just completely batshit crazy.

[azshadowwalker]

6 minutes ago, truthaboutluv said:

Yeah, just more evidence that either editing is hiding a lot or Debbie is just completely batshit crazy.

It's likely that both are true. 

[peachmangosteen]

Youtube has the TC voting up and they edited Michaela's vote in the ep. She put #ByeBitch on it. I'm rolling!

[Ms Blue Jay]

Tell him Boy, Bye.... 

[dkb]

21 hours ago, ElleryAnne said:

And WHO does JT think he is, complaining about anyone else's ratio of sugar to coffee, anyway?  Glad he's gone.  Nice dig by Michaela at the end, telling him to let Malcolm know it was JT who got him eliminated.  

It has gone from funny watching Debbie to a bit uncomfortable, like laughing at someone who may actually have mental issues.  

I really didn't get why JT had such a problem with it. Its something for all of them to share, if Michaela wants to just eat the sugar straight up then she has every right. Why was Aubry agreeing with JT on this?

21 hours ago, Michichick said:

Debbie continues to be delusional about her skills. So tired of her and her stupidity.

J.T.'s tribe did an awesome job making him feel comfortable and conning him into thinking he was staying.

Varner's obvious delight at assorted shenanigans is a pleasure to watch. I crack up watching him crack up.

I couldn't believe how good Varner and Sandra were at Tribal, before tribal I thought JT was a goner, but then they way they talked at Tribal I was like Michaela is going home because Varner seems to be on JTs side. Sandra is cool under pressure and a good liar, I couldn't believe she pulled out the, "We're with HIM," while being completely against him.

 

21 hours ago, rustyspigot said:

At least Debbie wasn't involved in the sugar fight she would have claimed to own a sugar factory.

21 hours ago, jsm1125 said:

Or have invented sugar.

21 hours ago, LanceM said:

Debbie is certifiably insane and I love the editors did a flashback of her saying how "good" she was at balancing.  Did I miss the part where Hali was the princess of that tribe? lol  

JT is a dumbass. I mean how dumb and cocky can you be to think you didn't need to play that idol.

21 hours ago, enlightenedbum said:

4) HAHAHA.  Sandra being a manipulative stealing stuff jerk: kind of funny when it's aimed to destroy a guy who's acting like an asshole.  Michaela pulling out a mug at tribal council to celebrate JT's demise?  One of the funniest fucking things I've ever seen on this show.  The only way it could have been better would be if she had done a spit take on the third JT vote.

20 hours ago, enlightenedbum said:

Pretty sure Hali was first on the beam and second to finish (behind Ozzy, so no shame) and Debbie was first on the beam and never finished.

 

You guys are killing me, I'm laughing so hard. One of the best experiences of watching Survivor is reading all your guys thoughts!

 

17 hours ago, laprin said:

This show deserves a lifetime Emmy because 34 seasons in, I'm still entertained.

3 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

This episode was awesome. There were so many amazing moments. I truly believed this season would suck but it has been consistently amazing and entertaining. And men I hate keep getting booted! It's just glorious. I am waiting for the other shoe to drop though. I predict a boring and predictable post-merge game with a winner I hate lol.

The booting of JT made me wonder if Jeff has hyped this season at all. With all the big guys getting evicted one after the other, I'm gonna guess he hates this season. Although his boyfriend Brad is doing great, so maybe he loves it.

Totally agree, there's always something fun to talk about with each episode. Loving it.

 

11 hours ago, ferretrick said:

1)  She bragged about her balance skills and Brad was like "Great!" and assigned her the 2nd balance beam position, the ANCHOR position.  Yet she says Brad is a dictator who doesn't treat her with respect.

2)  Their tribe was in FIRST PLACE when Hali completed her segment.  They were.  Ozzy beat Hali across the first beam, but Hali made up time on the 2nd one, and Sierra's skill with the grappling hook had put them back in lead.  Yet Debbie believes that Hali cost them the challenge.

3) Debbie was incompetent at getting across that beam.  Yet she continues to brag about her gymnastics skills. 

I think Debbie is monstrously insecure inside, which is why she has these delusions and has to brag so much about all the jobs and accolades she supposedly holds.  The thing is, I think she actually makes herself believe that all that she says is true, and then when facts contradict it, she can't handle it.  Deep down, she sees the truth, but the truth cannot be allowed to pierce that fragile cloud of lies she has created because then that massive ego would have to face what a small, pathetic person she really is.  Thus she lashes out at anyone and anything and rewrites the facts in her head to protect her delusions.  I actually really pity her, but I don't have to live with her on a beach 24/7.  I don't know how Brad and Hali, especially, managed to restrain themselves from just straight out calling her on her shit. 

11 hours ago, Bryce Lynch said:

Yup, while Debbie floundered on the balance task, which she never completed, until after the challenge was over:

1) JT finished the 2nd obstacle of the FIRST round.

2) Varner grappled the handle.

3) Michaela dug up the 2nd bag.

4) Aubry completed the same task Debbie was doing, from start to finish.

5) Sandra did the slide puzzle.

Debbie is totally delusional.

All that aside, even if her alternate reality had been true, she asked for a balance task and was given one.  It appears that 2 different tribe members had to do the 2 rounds.  Brad wasn't being a "dictator".  He gave her exactly what she asked for.

So, she got her way and fouled up the challenge and single handedly blew it for her tribe.

Thanks for the recaps, I was with @JudyObscure in that I thought it must be editing because Debbie was insistent that she did much better. The flashbacks were good though. Reminds me of the Dan Foley situation; they don't want Debbie coming to them later, saying that they edited her badly. 

 

3 hours ago, Jobiska said:

I appreciate the play by play.  To continue just a second longer, in response to all those who said Debbie never finished:  We kept rewinding to hear something Sierra and Brad (I think?) said--"I'm getting sick of losing."  "Me too."was what it turned out to be--and so we watched Sandra's win about three times.  Almost exactly simultaneously with her solving the puzzle, Debbie finally did finish (didn't "count," of course) and Hali, waiting for the ball I guess, with all her attention on Debbie, said in a really sweet voice to Debbie something like "yay, you did it!"  This cemented for me my Hali-love.  It really seemed like true supportiveness, not bland cheering-on.  And I think she really was concerned about Debbie when she stalked off too and that is why she followed her.

I actually did a little "aww" when I heard Hali say that, it was really sweet. She was trying to make Debbie feel better. She must of been so confused when Debbie went off on her.

[After7Only]

11 hours ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I can't stand JT and love Michaela, but absent proof of sexism or racism I would just chalk it up to him being a stupid jerk.

 

The unfortunate thing about both racism and sexism, is there is rarely ironclad hardcore "proof".    Very few people walk around saying I hate women, or I hate (insert minority group).  It's the subtle things, the inferences of the words chosen is certain situations.  The differences in the way a person treats people from different groups.  I believe those are  the type of things people are picking up with JT.     Nothing concrete.  But enough to make you uncomfortable.  

9 hours ago, rasalas said:

Exactly. Why didn't Michaela go ballistic when she found out that Sandra essentially framed her for stealing the sugar -- and then took so much glee in doing so? And yet there's Michaela at TC laughing right along with the "queen." I'm also surprised that given the well-deserved viewer outrage over Southern boy JT belittling a strong black woman like Michaela as lazy and a baby that there isn't more adverse reactions about Sandra setting Michaela up as a thief.

Same as above.  Sandra hasn't shown other instances of racial/sexist insensitivity .  It was pretty clear that the "framing" was all about gameplay.  In fact I'm pretty sure she was counting on JT's biases in making the plan work.   She knew that JT would fall for the Michaela is untrustworthy and a thief story without question.  

Edited March 30, 2017 by After7Only

[piequinn35]

Your tea princess :)

[piequinn35]

Debbie 35 years ago. ;)

[Ms Blue Jay]

Debbie now

[Haleth]

The Great Sugar Caper made me think of Captain Queeg and his strawberries.

[Porkchop]

Do you think Sandra might have told Michaela earlier that she knew MIchaela did not steal the sugar? Might even have said, just let JT think you did it and we'll both benefit?

[piequinn35]

"Hey, I hate what happened, but we need you. For us to not go to Tribal every time, you've got to be here." - You fell for this JT :))

More on Michaela: (is she becoming Abi-Maria?)

http://www.tvguide.com/news/survivor-game-changers-jt-exit-interview/

[seacliffsal]

For whatever reason I thought Michaela showed a bit of temper at the reward challenge when she dug up the bag and just threw it down in front of her team and then had some attitude towards them.  So, there have been glimpses of attitude; however, JT's attitude also came out during this episode.  

Debbie's team is probably trying to placate her in order to have some peace and sense of safety at their camp.  As someone already mentioned-there is no rational discussion with crazy.  Therefore, they really didn't have an option of how to interact with her.  I think she is actually a grifter and uses her own lies to her advantage as much as possible.  I really hoped her tribe would lose so that they would vote her out.  Maybe next week...

[NutMeg]

6 hours ago, rasalas said:

This isn't true. Michaela found out about Sandra's stunt (framing Michaela for stealing the sugar) for the first time at the end of Tribal Council.

After JT departed:

Michaela: And I didn't steal the sugar, either. I don't know where it went.
[Sandra raises her hand and points to herself, smiling.]
Michaela: You took the sugar? [laughs]

So Sandra most certainly hid the act from Michaela until Sandra no longer needed the ruse to fool JT.

I'm sorry I wasn't clear, I was responding to this : 

Quote

Why didn't Michaela go ballistic when she found out that Sandra essentially framed her for stealing the sugar -- and then took so much glee in doing so?

and meant that Michaela knew Sandra (and Jeff) were going to pretend they were keeping JT, therefore voting her out. Or so I understand because of Sandra's "Do you trust me?" to her and her whole demeanour at tribal. She definitely knew what Sandra + Jeff were up to and had no problem with it. 

6 hours ago, MrsR said:

Varner did toss out the fish the night of his ouster. Tina outed him on the reunion show.

That's why Sandra pulled him into that move, she knew he would go with it.

Nice to learn another piece of Survivor trivia - so far I only knew Sandra was a fish tosser, had no idea she had not been the first or only one 

5 hours ago, laurakaye said:

I can't imagine a more bad-ass duo than Sandra and Courtney from HvV, but Sandra/Michaela sure would be fun to watch.

Not gonna lie, I'm very much liking all the people Sandra has build bonds with this season: Hali, Troy, Michaela, Varner. 

Apparently on another venue (could be Facebook; I haven't seen it but was told about it), someone said something that goes roughly like this: Sugar's game was thwarted by JT, JT's game was thwarted by sugar. I find it cute and rather clever :)

[azshadowwalker]

55 minutes ago, seacliffsal said:

For whatever reason I thought Michaela showed a bit of temper at the reward challenge when she dug up the bag and just threw it down in front of her team and then had some attitude towards them.

I had forgotten about that, being sidetracked by the beauty that is Sandra playing Survivor. However, now that you mention it, I was irritated by that at the time. It seemed like a petty thing to do and a time-waster, since the next person needed that bag. 

[MissEwa]

Debbie has crossed into that uncomfortable place for me where I feel like I shouldn't be watching her and I'm upset with her casting. That was some really weird, unpleasant stuff going on and assuming she's not just putting it on - and I don't think she is - it's kind of disturbing. Her tribe handled her well, I think, although Tai's 'I think she's upset' was typical Tai, really. 

How is Brad not awful this season? More accurately, how is Brad responsible for voting out my favourite player and *still* not awful? Was he just awful with Monica? I didn't notice his kids name tattoos but I did laugh at the word 'heart' on his chest, like he needed a reminder where it was. 

Bye JT. Numpty. They played it so well - Sandra sticking up for Michaela was a masterful touch. I feel like without that it would have been too obvious a telegraph and made most players paranoid. I haven't been loving Sandra this season but the Sandra-Michaela pair is up there with Sandra-Courtney for a Survivor Snark Dream Team. 

[LanceM]

2 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

This exactly. When she was going on about Hali being so far up Brad's butt or his up hers or whatever and that whatever Hali wants, she gets, I was so confused because I kept thinking, "wait, wasn't this the Hali that was almost booted when it came down to her and Caleb and it was made clear to her she was completely at the bottom? And the only thing that saved her was the big twist last week?" Yeah, just more evidence that either editing is hiding a lot or Debbie is just completely batshit crazy.

Well to be clear the exact quote from Debbie was "“He’s got his head so far up your ass his eyeballs are sticking out of your mouth.”, which nice visual there. She had also said when they first got back to the beach that after the four of them vote her out that "you  can just give Hali my clothes", which does anyone believe Hali actually wants her clothes?  And yes she said "whatever Princess Hali wants she gets".

So yeah I am confused too. lol

Edited March 31, 2017 by LanceM

[Adeejay]

19 hours ago, Vyk said:

As for J.T. himself, I'd always thought of him lucky enough to have Stephen with him in Tocantins and that he won on social game alone.  His gameplay and even basic personality both in Heroes vs. Villains and here in Game Changers have both given me validation and vindication in those thoughts and feelings.  He really is a terrible player. 

 I am starting to believe that perhaps the Tocantins jury awarded the million to the wrong guy. 

[SuburbanHangSuite]

2 hours ago, seacliffsal said:

For whatever reason I thought Michaela showed a bit of temper at the reward challenge when she dug up the bag and just threw it down in front of her team and then had some attitude towards them.

Yes!  This is why, for as much as I loved her last season, I'm not really feeling her this time around.  It's like she's just waiting to be slighted in some way and she's still carrying a HUGE grudge from her previous ousting.  For being a challenge beast, she really needs to up her social game.  

[cooksdelight]

39 minutes ago, absolutqt said:

Yes!  This is why, for as much as I loved her last season, I'm not really feeling her this time around.  It's like she's just waiting to be slighted in some way and she's still carrying a HUGE grudge from her previous ousting.  For being a challenge beast, she really needs to up her social game.  

You hit the nail, for me, as I couldn't quite figure out why I don't like her this time around.

[Ms Blue Jay]

She threw the bag. It was one thing.  The rest of the time I haven't seen anything weird.  Drinking the "tea" at Tribal was J.T.'s just desserts and it was hysterical.  That already goes down in history as an all-time best moment. 

Edited March 31, 2017 by Ms Blue Jay

[sadiegirl1999]

10 hours ago, NutMeg said:

And how sweet was it that Michaela managed to play the sacrificial goat well enough to fool him (meaning he didn't know her at all!)

Didn't she, in episode 1, go off b/c her name was being floated out as a decoy?

My how times have changed....

[Wandering Snark]

27 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

She threw the bag. It was one thing.  The rest of the time I haven't seen anything weird.  Drinking the "tea" at Tribal was J.T.'s just desserts and it was hysterical.  That already goes down in history as an all-time best moment. 

I'll call assery as it is and that was uncalled for at the challenge as much as Debbie's 'Did you see who was first over the wall??" to Brad.

And Michaela's "tea" was full on 100% assery. Period. Whether one finds it entertaining or not doesn't excuse it.

Edited March 31, 2017 by Wandering Snark

[kiddo82]

On March 29, 2017 at 10:39 PM, Gummo said:

ETA:

Normally I'd agree about too many gimmicks (idols, exile, returnees), BUT....

Since these are all previous players, including some multi-season players, ya gotta keep'em off balance. 

OR.....just put Debbie on a beam.  Hiyoooooooo!

 

I loved Sandra stealing the sugar.  Brilliant to stir the pot and brilliant to fess up about it, and get Michaela to giggle about it, almost immediately after it played out.  If not, it becomes "a thing."  Now it's entirely possible that Michaela shrugs it off.  

[blackwing]

Well, I'm disappointed about JT leaving.  He wasn't the brightest bulb, but I do think he was a tough competitor and he really gave it his all.  The numbers were against him and he didn't give up.

I can't believe I'm saying this, but I actually like Brad Culpepper this season.  I'd like him even more, but I'm so annoyed with Jeff and his obvious desire to sleep with Brad Culpepper that I can't get over that.  Congrats Debbie.  You made me like Brad Culpepper.  Debbie is crazy.  She insisted that she do the balance beam.  She said she has a good sense of balance.  Then she repeatedly fell off.  He didn't accuse her of sucking donkey balls.  She just went off on him because they lost and she blamed him for being controlling.  Then she went off and yelled at him. He just sat there calmly and he actually apologised to her, even though he had absolutely nothing to apologise for.  

Then he won them the immunity challenge, even though Debbie had such a poor attitude.  She took gymnastics for 10 years?  When?  From age 5 to 15? She looks like she's 60.  Hali is half her age.  Does she have the same sense of balance as a 60 year old hag as she did when she was 10?  She can leave anytime.  Her self-admitted eccentricity was funny the last time, but she is no longer entertaining.  I hope they never invite her back.

I'm over Michaela too, and I'm trying to figure out why I liked her last time.  She has a mouth and thinks she is way better in challenges than she actually is.  It's not "beastly" to dig in sand.  I would have been more impressed if she had done the slingshot or anything more physical.  I hope she too never comes back.  The only reason why she got invited is because of her mouth and because she took her top off.  Whatever.  Bye Felicia indeed.  She is dead to me.

Jeff Varner is 100% useless.  He is fat and out of shape so he is next to useless in challenges.  His social game is awful too, he is just a follower.  How sad that he's in his 50s and still doesn't play his own game.  

[SlackerInc]

On 3/29/2017 at 9:25 PM, Queena said:

JT is not familiar with Facebook, the coffee cup? The way that she was sipping her 'tea' classic Kermit!

I've read these two sentences at least ten times and I still can't parse them.  I know all the words, of course.  I'm familiar with Facebook and use it every day...but "coffee cup"?  Huh?  And I fondly remember Kermit the Frog from the Muppet Show.  But...what now?

23 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

Not amazing: the editors.  There was never a doubt in my mind JT was going home the entire episode.  He really blew it all around (didn't even bring his idol??), but they gave him such an edit I couldn't imagine any other outcome.  That was like a Project Runway bootee edit, amateur hour.

I'm a longtime PR watcher and I don't recall such strong telegraphing there.  But it was sure here, in force.  It sucked all of what could have been some intense suspense of the "sudden death" final moments of the IC.  And then I just fast-forwarded to right after they finished voting, as I felt the only drama at that point was whether J.T. would play his idol.  (However, after so much discussion here that got me curious, I did go back and watch the stuff I previously skipped.  Ouch, Aubry: you've really dug yourself a hole!)

17 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

I'll never believe Sandra is brilliant while she's playing against someone that stupid.  Stealing something while setting someone else up to take the blame is grade school stuff.  If J.T. hadn't been arrogant as well as stupid he would have played his idol and Mikaela would have gone home based on Sandra's frame up.  I just can't enjoy that kind of play.  It may be within the rules but it's not sportsmanlike.

I had been reading along and buying into the "brilliant Sandra" hype.  But I think you make a strong anti-CW point here that can't be easily dismissed.  It was incredibly dumb for J.T. to not use his idol, so what Sandra actually did was reminiscent of the late stages of season 1 of Fargo, when Lester

Spoiler

sent his wife in to get their passports, making sure to have her wear his coat with the hood on, so if the killer was lying in wait for him, she'd serve as the canary in the coal mine and shield him.  

The only difference here was that

Spoiler

the "canary" lived,

due only to J.T.'s terrible play. 

15 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

Sandra got in trouble for burning Russell's hat, I believe she had to replace it and apologized for it. [snip]

The destruction of the fish was probably the worst thing that she did because she deprived the tribe of food. She was pissed that they voted off her friend and is very spiteful. That has always been clear. You piss Sandra off and she targets you with a laser. She has played that way since day one.

Sandra is not a saint. She is willing to spy on folks, she was shown doing that her first season. She is willing to screw with objects around camp to cause friction but her "sabotage" never raises to the level of destruction.

I'm ambivalent about Sandra, but I just have to point out that in this comment, you noted that Sandra burned another player's hat, and was guilty of "destruction" of fish...but then in the very next paragraph, you asserted that "her 'sabotage' never raises to the level of destruction."  Huh?

14 hours ago, Hpmec said:

I kept hoping Probst would call in the medical team, including a mental health professional, for an on the spot evaluation of Debbie. We've watched numerous contestants being removed from the show for health related reasons, and Debbie's issues are no less serious. True she makes for good tv, but she is clearly unstable and in need of professional help. 

Yeah, agreed.  How is this different from Brandon?

12 hours ago, Hanahope said:

Debbie sure is a piece of work.  Who's crazier, Debbie or Abi?

Debbie, AINEC.  And that's really saying something!

6 hours ago, After7Only said:

The unfortunate thing about both racism and sexism, is there is rarely ironclad hardcore "proof".    Very few people walk around saying I hate women, or I hate (insert minority group).  It's the subtle things, the inferences of the words chosen is certain situations.  The differences in the way a person treats people from different groups.  I believe those are  the type of things people are picking up with JT.     Nothing concrete.  But enough to make you uncomfortable.

I agree.  I would frame it like this: if you are a white guy with a thick accent from the Deep South, you should just know better than to go on national TV and call a black woman "lazy" etc.  That doesn't mean you have to ally with her or that you can't vote her out.  But don't say that shit, not even if she is objectively lazy (whatever that would mean).  Just don't do it.  If you do, you're an idiot, a racist, a racist idiot, or you're at least racially insensitive enough to not care how bad that looks.

And I say this as someone who has harshly criticized Michaela both this time and in her first season.  I bristled when people implied dislike of Michaela was automatically racist.  But I'm not from the Deep South, and I didn't call her "lazy".  (I complained that she is abrasive, that she needlessly burns bridges with others, which makes her social game really bad.)

4 hours ago, LanceM said:

She had also said when they first got back to the beach that after the four of them vote her out that "you  can just give Hali my clothes", which does anyone believe Hali actually wants her clothes?

I'm not sure that is what she said.  I had trouble making it out, so I rewound it a couple times.  When I still couldn't understand it, I turned on closed captions--and apparently they couldn't parse it either, because it was just left un-transcribed.

[cooksdelight]

4 hours ago, SlackerInc said:

I've read these two sentences at least ten times and I still can't parse them.  I know all the words, of course.  I'm familiar with Facebook and use it every day...but "coffee cup"?  Huh?  And I fondly remember Kermit the Frog from the Muppet Show.  But...what now?

[SuburbanHangSuite]

AHAHAHAHAHA!  Ok, so now it becomes clear.  I'm usually quite satisfied being social media-free but sometimes stuff goes right over my head.  Thanks for asking, SlackerInc.  And thanks to cooksdelight for the illumination and laugh!

[SVNBob]

9 hours ago, seacliffsal said:

For whatever reason I thought Michaela showed a bit of temper at the reward challenge when she dug up the bag and just threw it down in front of her team and then had some attitude towards them.

That was the second bag, right?  I don't think her attitude at that time was aimed at them, but at Jeff.  Remember, it took a while for Varner to grapple the bow before she could dig up the first bag, then she blazed through that digging faster than Cirie or Tai.  Then when she went out to dig up the second bag, Jeff commented on whether or not she'd be able to do it that quickly again.  She responded that she could, then she went and did it.  So I think that Jeff's dig at her ability (pun intended) brought out that particular bit of her competitive temper.

 

9 hours ago, LanceM said:

She had also said when they first got back to the beach that after the four of them vote her out that "you  can just give Hali my clothes",

Actually, I think she said that they could "give her her clothes".  The ones she was leaving behind as she "moved out" of camp, with the implication being that they could give them back at TC when they voted her out.

To some, Debbie might look like a tempting goat after that meltdown, but she's not.  You can't keep the unstable and uncontrollable element around.  Otherwise it'll bite you in the ass when the tribe decides they can't live with the unstable one anymore.  After that one gets voted out, the next question will be, "Who thought it was a good idea to keep them around in the first place?"  And that puts you on the chopping block next.

Control is the key word.  Special Agent Pink Panties was controllable.  BRob demonstrated it, and Andrea proved it.  Littler Hantz was uncontrollable, as he well proved.  And given the choice between those two in FvF2, the favorites unanimously decided to keep SAPP around, deciding not to even compete in an IC to rid themselves of their uncontrollable element.  Or just look back to the premiere of this season.  Tony demonstrated to Sandra that he was uncontrollable, so she gathered the entire tribe (minus Aubry as a backup plan) to vote him out, instead of keeping the "winner's alliance" intact.

So the question is not "do Brad, Tai, and Sierra think Debbie is a good goat?".  The question is "do Brad, Tai, and Sierra think that Debbie is controllable?"  If they think she is, then they'll keep her around over Hali.  If not, then the prophesy fills itself.

[JudyObscure]

Yes, thanks!, I'm not on Facebook either.  It would seem that, "But that's none of my business," is a new version of the southern, "Bless her heart."

[alexa]

I was relieved that something interesting actually happened this episode...for me it has been fairly boring up until now.  After the last 2 seasons of regular twist and turns, the returning players just aren't bringing it the same.   So to see Sandra stir things up a bit, and for it to work out so well made me happy.

[Ms Blue Jay]

And "tea" is also slang for gossip, like "Spill the tea... tell me all the tea" ;)

[FormerMod-a1]

I'm just glad they clarified it was the "'tea' classic Kermit!" meme in their post, because given my love of true crime genre this is the Kermit meme I see most.

 

[Lamb18]

Just a few more thoughts:

I don't think J.T. was upset because Michael wanted coffee and sugar, too, but she asked him to make it for her. "Sugar and seven drips of coffee!" (or whatever it was). That's where "lazy" came from. Then, from what I recall, Sandra made Michaela feel secure that they were going to vote J.T., so Michaela wasn't that worried going into tribal council. I don't recall any pre-tribal discussion about Michaela being a decoy.  Then with Sandra's confession about the sugar, I think Michaela was so relieved she wasn't voted out after all, she didn't care about Sandra stealing sugar and just laughed.

The Kermit picture about F in gym class made me think of Debbie.

[ProfCrash]

6 hours ago, SlackerInc said:

I'm ambivalent about Sandra, but I just have to point out that in this comment, you noted that Sandra burned another player's hat, and was guilty of "destruction" of fish...but then in the very next paragraph, you asserted that "her 'sabotage' never raises to the level of destruction."  Huh?

Good catch, I left off a word. "camp destruction." The fish she let go caused people to go hungry but they had all the tools they needed to go and get more food. Rupert did all the food gathering for that tribe, Sandra was looking to punish them for voting out Rupert by making them do their own work. Russell's hat was burned before the final tribal. Sandra realized that Russell loved the hat and knew that it's destruction would throw Russell off for a bit. He couldn't wear the hat for a few days but it was a targeted, localized effect.

Thai and the Bullies actively worked to harm the entire camp and cause problems that could have seriously harmed people. Sandra's plots were far smaller, more prankish, and had a specific reason and desired result. They were prankish (the sugar) but were not going to cause people long term harm. They damaged property, the hat, but it wasn't douse the fire so that a new fire pit needs to be dug and hid all of the tools needed to gather wood and food.

[laurakaye]

14 hours ago, Sugar said:

Whoever said that Debbie and Philip could be soulmates - I've never read a fanfic, but would 100% pay money for this.

Former Federal Agent (?) Phillip Shepard arrives on the boat.  He is unclothed, save for a pair of charred, faded fuchsia briefs and a headband sporting the discarded feathers of various exotic birds.  Debbie, fresh from another loss involving a balance challenge (despite having nearly won the gymnastics bronze medal in the 2004 summer Olympics), has been voted to spend the night with Phillip on Redexile Island.  She vigorously flips off her team with both hands and simultaneously does eight backflips before joining Phillip on the boat.  The other Survivors wave with barely restrained glee as the boat jets off into the sunset.  Debbie can be heard screaming "I'M PISSSSSSSsssssed!!" long after the boat has faded from view.

Thirty minutes later, the tribe is relaxing around the campfire, enjoying a wonderful Debbie-free evening.  Suddenly, an explosion is heard in the distance.  The tribe gathers on the beach and looks out towards Redexile Island, which is now on fire.  As they watch, the entire island falls into the ocean.  The tribe exhales, knowing that neither Debbie nor Phillip will ever grace their shores again.

Or will they?

 

10 hours ago, absolutqt said:

Yes!  This is why, for as much as I loved her last season, I'm not really feeling her this time around.  It's like she's just waiting to be slighted in some way and she's still carrying a HUGE grudge from her previous ousting.  For being a challenge beast, she really needs to up her social game.  

Is it too much of a stretch to say that Michaela is the female form of (my beloved) Ozzy?  Challenge beasts who think just a bit too highly of themselves, and are stumped when they realize that not everyone playing the game is working hard to make sure they not only stick around, but win?

 

1 hour ago, SVNBob said:

To some, Debbie might look like a tempting goat after that meltdown, but she's not.  You can't keep the unstable and uncontrollable element around.  Otherwise it'll bite you in the ass when the tribe decides they can't live with the unstable one anymore.  After that one gets voted out, the next question will be, "Who thought it was a good idea to keep them around in the first place?"  And that puts you on the chopping block next.

Control is the key word.  Special Agent Pink Panties was controllable.  BRob demonstrated it, and Andrea proved it.  Littler Hantz was uncontrollable, as he well proved.  And given the choice between those two in FvF2, the favorites unanimously decided to keep SAPP around, deciding not to even compete in an IC to rid themselves of their uncontrollable element.  Or just look back to the premiere of this season.  Tony demonstrated to Sandra that he was uncontrollable, so she gathered the entire tribe (minus Aubry as a backup plan) to vote him out, instead of keeping the "winner's alliance" intact.

So the question is not "do Brad, Tai, and Sierra think Debbie is a good goat?".  The question is "do Brad, Tai, and Sierra think that Debbie is controllable?"  If they think she is, then they'll keep her around over Hali.  If not, then the prophesy fills itself.

Oh, I love this post.  Perfect explanation of why Debbie would be a very, very high-risk goat.  Given that much of her anger stems from events that only she can see, it would be like carrying a can of gasoline through a forest fire.

 

1 hour ago, JudyObscure said:

Yes, thanks!, I'm not on Facebook either.  It would seem that, "But that's none of my business," is a new version of the southern, "Bless her heart."

I'm from Michigan, and I so want "bless her/his heart" to migrate north so I can start using this phrase on a daily basis.

Edited March 31, 2017 by laurakaye

[Special K]

14 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Debbie now

OMG.  Dying here.

[Special K]

57 minutes ago, laurakaye said:

Former Federal Agent (?) Phillip Shepard arrives on the boat.  He is unclothed, save for a pair of charred, faded fuchsia briefs and a headband sporting the discarded feathers of various exotic birds.  Debbie, fresh from another loss involving a balance challenge (despite having nearly won the gymnastics bronze medal in the 2004 summer Olympics), has been voted to spend the night with Phillip on Redexile Island.  She vigorously flips off her team with both hands and simultaneously does eight backflips before joining Phillip on the boat.  The other Survivors wave with barely restrained glee as the boat jets off into the sunset.  Debbie can be heard screaming "I'M PISSSSSSSsssssed!!" long after the boat has faded from view.

Thirty minutes later, the tribe is relaxing around the campfire, enjoying a wonderful Debbie-free evening.  Suddenly, an explosion is heard in the distance.  The tribe gathers on the beach and looks out towards Redexile Island, which is now on fire.  As they watch, the entire island falls into the ocean.  The tribe exhales, knowing that neither Debbie nor Phillip will ever grace their shores again.

Or will they?

@laurakaye wins the internet today.  Bless her heart.  :)

[needschocolate]

14 hours ago, seacliffsal said:

For whatever reason I thought Michaela showed a bit of temper at the reward challenge when she dug up the bag and just threw it down in front of her team and then had some attitude towards them.  So, there have been glimpses of attitude; however, JT's attitude also came out during this episode.  

I didn't think there was any temper shown.  I saw it more like a football player slamming the ball after making a touchdown.  Still, it was a dumb thing to do in the beginning of a challenge, don't make your tribemates take extra time to pick up the bag.  

I agree with others that Michaela isn't as fun to watch this time.  I think enjoyed her the first time because of two things that seem to be lacking this time around - (1) she gave funny talking heads, (2) she was amazing at challenges.  She is probably still amazing, but she hasn't had as much chance of showing it.  Also, the first time around, I didn't realize she had a quick temper until a little way into the game, but now I know about it, so it clouds my interpretation of her comments.  

2 hours ago, SVNBob said:

That was the second bag, right?  I don't think her attitude at that time was aimed at them, but at Jeff.  Remember, it took a while for Varner to grapple the bow before she could dig up the first bag, then she blazed through that digging faster than Cirie or Tai.  Then when she went out to dig up the second bag, Jeff commented on whether or not she'd be able to do it that quickly again.  She responded that she could, then she went and did it.  So I think that Jeff's dig at her ability (pun intended) brought out that particular bit of her competitive temper.

I am pretty sure that it was the first bag, because I remember watching to see if she would to it again the second time, and she didn't.

[azshadowwalker]

14 hours ago, piequinn35 said:

"Hey, I hate what happened, but we need you. For us to not go to Tribal every time, you've got to be here." - You fell for this JT :))

More on Michaela: (is she becoming Abi-Maria?)

http://www.tvguide.com/news/survivor-game-changers-jt-exit-interview/

Looks like JT thinks Sandra was getting revenge specifically for Malcolm as a player. He still doesn't get that she was avenging him undercutting their tribe with his big mouth, which just happened to cost Malcolm. Dude is still clueless. 

I think Michaela is a bit overly intense and petulant, but I will take what JT says with a grain of salt. 

ETA: It was the first bag, because we were shown literally no reason for it. I also watched to see if she would do it again, and she didn't. 

Edited March 31, 2017 by azshadowwalker

[Special K]

To me, Michaela throwing down the bag was like giving the finger to JP and her tribe.  Like, "take that, you mo-fos, see what I can do!  Don't underestimate me!" In a previous episode(s) didn't she express frustration about not getting to show her strength in challenges?  And remember how imperious she was with Hannah last season during challenges.  She's definitely a challenge monster and quite an athlete, but sportsmanship may not be her strong suit.  

It was petulant and bratty, and cost her tribe several seconds, but in the context of this week's Debbie-splosion, it was pretty small potatoes.

[Bouffe]

3 hours ago, needschocolate said:

I didn't think there was any temper shown.  I saw it more like a football player slamming the ball after making a touchdown.  Still, it was a dumb thing to do in the beginning of a challenge, don't make your tribemates take extra time to pick up the bag.  

I agree with others that Michaela isn't as fun to watch this time.  I think enjoyed her the first time because of two things that seem to be lacking this time around - (1) she gave funny talking heads, (2) she was amazing at challenges.  She is probably still amazing, but she hasn't had as much chance of showing it.  Also, the first time around, I didn't realize she had a quick temper until a little way into the game, but now I know about it, so it clouds my interpretation of her comments.  

I am pretty sure that it was the first bag, because I remember watching to see if she would to it again the second time, and she didn't.

Yes, it was the first bag.

I took her throwing the bag as intensity. It was stupid to do it because it made whoever had to pick up the bag to untie it lose precious seconds. If I remember correctly, the others who retrieved the bags from the sand started untying them as they walked/ran back to the mat. Mikaela is intense during challenges, and she doesn't seem to be able to tone it down or control it. At least that was my take on it.

She did crack me up when Probst was wondering out loud if she could dig the bag out as fast as the first one; "F*** yeah I can Jeff" LOL

Edited March 31, 2017 by Bouffe
spelling mistake

[peachmangosteen]

3 hours ago, laurakaye said:

Is it too much of a stretch to say that Michaela is the female form of (my beloved) Ozzy?  Challenge beasts who think just a bit too highly of themselves, and are stumped when they realize that not everyone playing the game is working hard to make sure they not only stick around, but win?

I don't see Michaela as someone who thinks everyone should be playing the game for her to win at all. Ozzy, for sure. Although I hope at this point he's let go of that.

I'm going to rewatch the IC because I remember it a bit differently than it's being described here.

[Eolivet]

14 hours ago, absolutqt said:

It's like she's just waiting to be slighted in some way and she's still carrying a HUGE grudge from her previous ousting.

Which again -- I don't get at all. She wasn't voted out for being obnoxious or lazy or anything this season's players have accused her of. She was (ostensibly) voted out for being a threat. She was voted out for showing her brain (I remember the word "intelligent" being used, like 17 times, to the point where it started to feel like doth protesting too much -- we get it, you're not racists, mmkay?). If they just decided she was a jerk and got rid of her, I could see how she'd be on pins and needles this year, but I feel like Michaela needs to watch her own season.

[pamplemousse]

20 hours ago, Rowan said:

I go back and forth between love and dislike with Sandra. That being said, the woman knows this game. She ate that sugar knowing the only two people that would care would go at it. She doesn't piss off Varner or Aubrey cause they don't care about the sugar. She knew JT would lose his shit and target Michaela. So, then she admits what she did when the vote is over because she knows that Michaela will be less inclined to be pissed cause JT made such an ass of himself.

JT pretty much set up all the pins for his own ousting and practically begged someone like Sandra to knock them all down. How fucking stupid do you have to be to come back from a TC on the outs with your tribe who suspect you, quite rightly, to have sold them out to Brad Culpepper resulting in your tribe's strongest player being voted off, and then instead of chilling out and lying low for the next few days you proceed to get petty and ridiculous over some sugar for your coffee and egregiously hating on another player because she eats too much of it? Screw off, JT, and never come back to this game. It was an insult to my intelligence every moment I had to watch you.

[Bryce Lynch]

18 hours ago, seacliffsal said:

For whatever reason I thought Michaela showed a bit of temper at the reward challenge when she dug up the bag and just threw it down in front of her team and then had some attitude towards them.  So, there have been glimpses of attitude; however, JT's attitude also came out during this episode.  

Debbie's team is probably trying to placate her in order to have some peace and sense of safety at their camp.  As someone already mentioned-there is no rational discussion with crazy.  Therefore, they really didn't have an option of how to interact with her.  I think she is actually a grifter and uses her own lies to her advantage as much as possible.  I really hoped her tribe would lose so that they would vote her out.  Maybe next week...

I am not sure why she slammed the first bag down.  I could have been sort of like spiking a football in celebration.  She was extremely fired up and it helped her digging.  I think she must be part terrier.  

The other possibility is that she wanted to do something she thought was more important (probably the balance beams) and slammed the bag down as if to say, "See, I'm a challenge beast, why did you waste me on the digging!"  

When they were strategizing, she said something like, "OK, I'll do the (bleeping) bags".  

[brilliantbreakfast]

19 hours ago, piequinn35 said:

Your tea princess :)

That is the greatest "Bye Felicia" of all time.  I bow down before our new overgoddess.

[ghoulina]

21 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

And yet some of them said that they would be hard pressed to not give Sandra the million if she made it to the end. 

The way she's playing right now, I'D give it to her. And I don't even like Sandra. 

[piequinn35]

11 minutes ago, brilliantbreakfast said:

That is the greatest "Bye Felicia" of all time.  I bow down before our new overgoddess.

With matching nice earrings ;)

[ghoulina]

19 hours ago, dkb said:

I really didn't get why JT had such a problem with it. Its something for all of them to share, if Michaela wants to just eat the sugar straight up then she has every right. Why was Aubry agreeing with JT on this?

I'm with you. I didn't get it. Some people like coffee, but not sugar. Some people may like sugar, but not coffee. If the team wins a food item, then anyone on the team has the right to eat any of those said food items. What if they brought back jars of PB and J? And someone just wanted the PB? Or just the jelly? Simma down, dude. 

 

7 hours ago, SVNBob said:

hen when she went out to dig up the second bag, Jeff commented on whether or not she'd be able to do it that quickly again.  She responded that she could, then she went and did it.

Right. I think her throwing the bag was like, "Boom! Take that, Jeff". Michaela has mouthed off to Jeff several times during challenges. Not everyone takes his commentary nicely.