Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[Jeeves]

7 minutes ago, iwantcookies said:

https://people.com/tv/duggar-family-not-as-close-as-they-once-were-amid-josh-legal-drama-source/

I assume the "family source" is Famy.

[IndianPaintbrush]

That cover has gotta be Boob's worst nightmare. Don't they have a longstanding relationship with People Magazine?

[iwantcookies]

1 minute ago, IndianPaintbrush said:

That cover has gotta be Boob's worst nightmare. Don't they have a longstanding relationship with People Magazine?

Yes. People magazine used to pay for baby exclusives all the time.

[BigBingerBro]

Wow, the tables certainly have turned!!

[Absolom]

Quote

 TLC cut all ties with the Duggars and pulled the plug on Counting On — fracturing the unity of the once tight-knit family and leaving their future uncertain.

That's giving TLC a lot of credit.  I would have thought Josh's actions would have been more fracturing.  If losing the show is what it took for most of the Duggars to see the light, that's fine, too, though.  

[Rootbeer]

33 minutes ago, BigBingerBro said:

Wow, the tables certainly have turned!!

Josh is probably already calling his siblings, wanting their thanks and congratulations for getting them a People cover just like the old days.

Interesting that People, which always played up the folksy, close-knit family BS the Duggars were serving while ignoring multiple huge red flags in their lifestyle, has now come full circle.

Of course, People also refers to both of the Duggars' reality series as 'wildly successful' and claims that Josh is confident he won't be charged, even though he's already been charged and the trial is coming up.  Not exactly the most accurate reporting ever.

The 'quotes' from the family source are definitely Amy-type quotes.  I don't think Derick would be interested in discussing anything but his own unhappiness as it pertains to the family.

Edited September 1, 2021 by Rootbeer

[beckie]

4 minutes ago, Absolom said:

That's giving TLC a lot of credit.  I would have thought Josh's actions would have been more fracturing.  If losing the show is what it took for most of the Duggars to see the light, that's fine, too, though.  

If that's all it took to "fracture" them, then they've probably been faking for years just for the tv show.

[Tikichick]

17 hours ago, Absolom said:

It will be Josh's decision, but if JB cuts off the money, Josh might end up going to trial with a different legal team or changing his mind.

Given the complexity of these types of cases a significant amount of money was likely paid upfront with contractual agreement in place.   Courts are sticky about attorney withdrawals as cases are coming down to the wire for good reason -- left to their own whims defendants will use this as a stalling tactic.   Attorneys are also generally careful about putting measures in place to secure their revenue stream.    

It's very likely JB has already bid a sad farewell to a significant amount of money for lawyers, investigators and experts.   All of these professionals are aware they're dealing with people who stand accused as criminal defendants.   They may be given the protection in court of being seen as innocent until proven guilty, but that doesn't extend to forcing the defense team to do their job and simply hope they'll get paid.

[BitterApple]

Are there any guesstimates as to how much Boob has dished out so far for Josh's defense?

 

[Tikichick]

17 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

I feel I know so little about Josh that I have absolutely no idea whether he is now or has ever been a person who would do that or whether he's a person who's delusional, basing his decisions on some stupid image that's inside his own head. 

 

I don't know Josh, but I do know that predators tend to develop keen instincts over time in service of satisfying their drive while protecting their own hides at all costs   It seems his lead attorney is well-versed in these types of cases, so would no doubt be very familiar in dealing with these types of personalities.   I would guess he's spoken very plainly to Josh and broken things down for him and talked to him on a level Josh has never experienced before.  I can't see how Josh could avoid the realization he's swum out far beyond the home church, homeschool and JB Duggar, Inc boundaries and probably flailing desperately for any glimmer of self preservation.

[Absolom]

4 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

It seems his lead attorney is well-versed in these types of cases, so would no doubt be very familiar in dealing with these types of personalities.   I would guess he's spoken very plainly to Josh and broken things down for him and talked to him on a level Josh has never experienced before.

I expect so.  It would have been wonderful to have seen Josh's reaction to real world straight talk about what he's done and the likely consequences.  

[GeeGolly]

So People is doing click-bait bullshit articles now? I'm guessing the sources are this site and Reddit. And Jill has seen her parents during the last 2 years - at weddings, and other occasions she has spent time with her mom.

[MargeGunderson]

I do think it’s interesting that no one in the family has made any public announcement that Josh is innocent. That could be on advice of a public relations advisor, but I think if they really wanted to say something, they would. 

[Zella]

34 minutes ago, Rootbeer said:

claims that Josh is confident he won't be charged, even though he's already been charged and the trial is coming up.  Not exactly the most accurate reporting ever.

I was coming here to comment on that. Even if that's an error the original source made, which I could see because none of these people are the sharpest knives in the drawer, the writer/editors should've been clued in enough to do an editorial note, ala Arrested Development Ron Howard. 

[Rootbeer]

29 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

Are there any guesstimates as to how much Boob has dished out so far for Josh's defense?

 

Not a lawyer, but, the defense firm representing Josh is one of the top firms in their region.  Lawyers who defend major criminal cases in the federal courts do not come cheap.  As some of the legal specialists were telling us when the case was first filed; Josh is going to need defense experts for trial who are experts in electronic media, cell phone data, etc who are going to spend hours and hours poring over the electronic trail that lead to the charges.  They are going to bill for that and, then, if it goes to trial, they are going to bill to testify.  Each expert is going to charge minimum several hundred bucks an hour for their time and, if they are retained to witness at trial; they will have a contract that will guarantee a substantial percentage of their usual fee even if the case doesn't go to trial  or they are not called upon to testify.  These are people with very unusual skills whose time is very much in demand.  You want them available for your trial, you are going to have to guarantee they'll be paid or they won't clear their schedule.

I think its a safe bet that over 6 figures in fees have already been amassed and paid and, depending on what happens in court, whether Josh is convicted and, if so, if there is an appeal; the sky is really the limit here.

Edited September 1, 2021 by Rootbeer

[Rabbittron]

I want to see Smuggars face when he goes from court straight to jail. 

[JoanArc]

1 hour ago, IndianPaintbrush said:

That cover has gotta be Boob's worst nightmare. Don't they have a longstanding relationship with People Magazine?

They went with 7 year old pictures, as well

[BetyBee]

Most of the Duggars are probably more upset about the loss of revenue than anything else.

[Fosca]

I hope Amy got paid well for that article; it might be how she can afford to move her "business".

[Zella]

10 minutes ago, Fosca said:

I hope Amy got paid well for that article; it might be how she can afford to move her "business".

I actually doubt she got paid for it, though I could be wrong. I think she gets some sort of weird satisfaction/affirmation as being treated as more important than she really is to the family by media whenever she leaks stuff. 

[BigBingerBro]

Is her NDA still in effect?

[Rootbeer]

31 minutes ago, BigBingerBro said:

Is her NDA still in effect?

I don't think anyone here knows for sure.  She has been pretty obtuse about it; not sure if it was even clear if it was only for things pertaining to the show or everything about JB and his brood.  I would think she'd be more careful about spilling the beans to People if she was really worried about violating the NDA though.  The article itself didn't contain anything that wasn't available all over the web, so, even if she did talk, she didn't give anything new and most of what was posted was pure speculation anyway with multiple points that were provably false.

[MsJamieDornan]

3 hours ago, iwantcookies said:

the source is Amy or Dereck?

The source is probably JBoob. He wants it out there so they can get another show or more publicity by saying some have distanced themselves.

[MsJamieDornan]

2 hours ago, BitterApple said:

Are there any guesstimates as to how much Boob has dished out so far for Josh's defense?

I'm fairly sure the retainer JBoob had to pay to the lawyers is $150,000 or more.

 

[scriggle]

2 hours ago, BitterApple said:

Are there any guesstimates as to how much Boob has dished out so far for Josh's defense?

 

A whole helluva lot.

I recently had some standard legal documents (will, power of attorney, etc.) drawn up. It cost over $1000, billed at $275/hr. And that's just a local lawyer in my town in MA.

I imagine the firm they hired is charging at least twice that as an hourly rate.

[jennblevins]

2 hours ago, MargeGunderson said:

I do think it’s interesting that no one in the family has made any public announcement that Josh is innocent. That could be on advice of a public relations advisor, but I think if they really wanted to say something, they would. 

Honestly, I doubt any of them really care whether he’s legally innocent — even if his fingers clicked the button (or typed the text) that downloaded the CSA, the devil made him do it, so his soul is innocent regardless. (Excuse me while I go throw up.)

[Tikichick]

2 hours ago, MargeGunderson said:

I do think it’s interesting that no one in the family has made any public announcement that Josh is innocent. That could be on advice of a public relations advisor, but I think if they really wanted to say something, they would. 

No doubt the legal team put out instructions that any comments about the case will be issued solely by them.  That's common in many cases that get any kind of media coverage, let alone one with guaranteed media coverage by virtue of a prior public profile.

If it comes down to it post conviction or post conviction via plea, any potential of a future TV deal might require public acknowledgement of Josh's guilt by the family members involved in the project.   That's easier to do if you haven't opened your mouth and asserted belief in his innocence previously.   That information may have been given to the family through network connections, production company sources, legal connections, PR sources, etc.

[Absolom]

2 hours ago, scriggle said:

I recently had some standard legal documents (will, power of attorney, etc.) drawn up. It cost over $1000, billed at $275/hr. And that's just a local lawyer in my town in MA.

My daughter is billed at $650 an hour if that helps at all.  The most expensive case she has worked the legal fees were over $2M.  She doesn't normally do criminal defense, but I wouldn't be surprised at $200,000 or even more for Josh's case.  That's a pure gut guess.  I have zero experience with his kind of case.  

[sue450]

On 8/1/2021 at 10:05 AM, zenme said:

Omg. I don’t realize they made the girls stand before the congregation as well. Way to victim-blame. That’s completely traumatizing. Those poor kids. Wait! What in the heck did 5 year old Joy do to entice him??

    they are taught that  the man has NO CONTROL and if something happens it is the females fault no matter how young the age is

 

not only that but josh finally gave in and  admitted he did it and begged forgiveness only after they threatened to shave a girl/womans head  instead of his head (  women in that cult  it is gothards rule women must have long hair for their husbands it is their crowning glory..if they had shaved a womans head it would have been very traumatic for her  and  every where she would go people would see it 

On 8/5/2021 at 2:14 PM, Scarlett45 said:

I remember that. I thought he was a little shit for a long while, (including when he had Anna carry their luggage ON THE HONEYMOON) but that took the cake. She was in labor with their FIRST child and his lazy ass was sleeping. 

he made anna carry the bags into the place they stayed for the honeymoon....and at 1 point she was on  trip VERY PREGNANT (he should have been kind and had her stay home)   she was walking up steep steps to go into the plane and he didn't even hold her hand to help her  up make sure she diddn't slip or trip

Edited September 3, 2021 by sue450

[sue450]

On 8/9/2021 at 4:14 PM, Nysha said:

I don't think the victims were ever threatened with getting their heads shaved. I think Josh had to ask forgiveness at church for an unspecified sin against his sisters and they were required to forgive him, plus he had his head shaved and was sent away to dig a pond. 

this is from a witness  https://popculture.com/reality-tv/news/josh-duggar-allegedly-forced-shave-head-family-church-molestation-scandal/

Per the church member's account, Josh didn't want his head shaved. He reportedly said, "I really don't want to do that." ( from other things I read he was standing up there a long time and was crying) Church members allegedly presented Josh with an ultimatum. Eventually, he decided to have his head shaved. The source told Radar Online elders threatened Josh, telling him that if he didn't buzz of his hair, one of his victims would have to.

"To punish him into getting [his head shaved], they threatened her," the source said.

   I think he tired of standing up there and crying finally gave in to just get it over with and be done

 

Edited September 1, 2021 by sue450
added paragraph

[sue450]

On 8/10/2021 at 1:44 PM, Albanyguy said:

Austin seems stiff-necked and self-righteous, and I think he prides himself on being a hard-working man who lives up to his responsibilities. I suspect he's always had a great deal of contempt for Josh, not just for his sinfulness, but because Josh was a slug who sat around on his lazy ass all day.

austens family had a reality show (crazy8s  CORRECTED me austin and family were on A show they did not have their own show) at some point, the thing that stood out was that austen was NOT allowed to have a door on his bedroom (no privacy)    and a few years ago his parents had  mr Pearl as one of the speakers at their camp (mr pearl wrote that horrific book called "how to train up a child") where starting when the baby is about 7 months old  you  put them on a blanket and entice them with a toy placed off the blanket... when they try to crawl off to get it you hit them with pvc pipe (several children died from parents using the horrific abuse from this book)

Edited September 1, 2021 by sue450
fixed faxual error

[crazy8s]

Austin's family was on a show "World's Strictest Parents"  - they did not have a show of their own

[JoanArc]

Mr Duggar, you are sentenced to eight years in federal prison.

Quote

"I really don't want to do that."

 

[Albanyguy]

10 minutes ago, JoanArc said:

Mr Duggar, you are sentenced to eight years in federal prison.

"DADDY! Talk to him! Do something!""

Edited September 1, 2021 by Albanyguy

[sue450]

48 minutes ago, crazy8s said:

Austin's family was on a show "World's Strictest Parents"  - they did not have a show of their own

thanks crazy8s I fixed added  what you said to fix my  post......I try to be factual but I mess up once in a while

[MsJamieDornan]

4 hours ago, jennblevins said:

Honestly, I doubt any of them really care whether he’s legally innocent — even if his fingers clicked the button (or typed the text) that downloaded the CSA, the devil made him do it, so his soul is innocent regardless. (Excuse me while I go throw up.)

I agree. They will have an excuse for everything.

[CrazyInAlabama]

6 hours ago, Rabbittron said:

I want to see Smuggars face when he goes from court straight to jail. 

I'm hoping it's to a federal prison that is many miles from Arkansas, and very isolated. 

Edited September 1, 2021 by CrazyInAlabama

[RedDelicious]

I’ll take mood stabilizers for $400?

Answer, the Daily Double 😳

[iwantcookies]

I’d look the same if I had to be joyfully available to bad breath/it won’t take long JB.

[tvisme]

11 hours ago, JoanArc said:

They went with 7 year old pictures, as well

and even worse, the “smug shot.”

[MsJamieDornan]

5 hours ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

I'm hoping it's to a federal prison that is many miles from Arkansas, and very isolated. 

The Federal Bureau of Prisons incarcerates 153,248 federal prisoners across 37 states. These inmates are held in 127 stand-alone federal prisons, 68 satellite prison camps, and 12 private prisons.

 

 

The Federal Bureau of Prisons houses its prison population at institutions with five different security levels: Minimum, Low, Medium, High, and Administrative These prisons differ based on the populations they house, the format of inmate housing, security components of the prison and perimeter 

Quote

Mr Duggar, you are sentenced to eight years in federal prison.

Pray

[Rabbittron]

My mom hopes that he goes to the Englewood Colorado Federal prison located in Littleton Colorado because everytime she drives past it she says that she is going to yell hi Smuggar. 

[MsJamieDornan]

4 minutes ago, Rabbittron said:

My mom hopes that he goes to the Englewood Colorado Federal prison located in Littleton Colorado because everytime she drives past it she says that she is going to yell hi Smuggar.

Tell her to give him the middle finger also. Thanks

[Rabbittron]

I know my mom will yell hi Smuggar and knowing her will give the finger. Because everytime she drives by she screams Hi Subway guy.

[Tdoc72]

15 hours ago, Rabbittron said:

I want to see Smuggars face when he goes from court straight to jail. 

 Me too. Although somewhere in my deep black heart, I know I shouldn’t. But I do. 🤷🏻‍♀️

15 hours ago, JoanArc said:

They went with 7 year old pictures, as well

I hoping this means that JimBob got no $ for this article. Old pic and no interviews point to that. 

[ginger90]

Some possibilities  for Josh:

 

 FCI Seagoville (TX)

FCI Elkton (OH)

 FCI Englewood (CO)

FCI Petersburg (VA)

FCI Marianna (FL)

USP Marion (IL)

USP Tucson (AZ) (unlikely)

[MargeGunderson]

I’m having a hard time imagining Anna taking all 7 kids to visit Smuggar in jail. Although, I guess someone can fly them all there. 

[Westiepeach]

7 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

Some possibilities  for Josh:

 

 FCI Seagoville (TX)

FCI Elkton (OH)

 FCI Englewood (CO)

FCI Petersburg (VA)

FCI Marianna (FL)

USP Marion (IL)

USP Tucson (AZ) (unlikely)

I don't want him in Ohio. It's bad enough I have the Rods living less than 2 hours south of me.

[BucFan]

I don’t want him in Florida 👎

[ozziemom]

If Smuggar ends up in Florida then Pa Keller can go and minister him regularly. That would be an additional punishment. Plus Anna can live on the Keller compound with Nurthan and the other brother.