Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[Chicklet]

I lost a thumb drive today, are any of you guys available?

[CofCinci]

I lost a thumb drive today, are any of you guys available?

After we find DB Cooper.

[OSM Mom]

And Jimmy Hoffa.

[asuwur]

I'm intrigued by the San Antonio entry on the plane's list....there are a few Christian based rehabs in that area....If he's not going to WallyWorld in Rockford perhaps he's going to a WallyWorld in San Antonio....Yes, there wasn't a return flight but there is more than one way to deposit a wayward Duggar!

Edited September 2, 2015 by asuwur

[cheatincheetos]

I'm intrigued by the San Antonio entry on the plane's list....there are a few Christian based rehabs in that area....If he's not going to WallyWorld in Rockford perhaps he's going to a WallyWorld in San Antonio....

He's looking for the basement in the Alamo.

[Sew Sumi]

I am thinking that maybe they originally filed a flight plan for San Antonio and forgot to change it until the flight plan for Rockford was filed. But I have no clue how that stuff works, so I could be totally off base here. It's interesting that even today it still remains on the flight list, but the italics have to mean....something! 

[Blondeone21]

I was at Walmart last night, no JD sightings.

I have to say that I am actually hoping Josh is not in Rockford. Rockford needs good publicity, not this crazy family connected to it.

I hope he either escaped or, for the sake of his wife and kids, is getting real help.

[JoanArc]

I think your next task is clear...

 

[Wellfleet]

There is a ministry in Paragould that focuses on rehabilitating men with addictions, Shepherds Fold. They have a small in house facility (maximum of 19 people). And it seems like their focus is on drugs, not sex addiction. And I can't find any link between SF's founder (Steve McCracken) and the Duggars. So that's probably a dead end. 

 

Unless there's also a drug addiction here that hasn't been revealed. This whole story is becoming very Twilight Zone, very Alfred Hitchcock Presents. I'm no longer sure of what I can believe/trust - and what I know to be bogus. Ordinarily I'd say that's just what Boob intended, but I honestly don't think he could concoct such a convoluted plot line...

Edited September 2, 2015 by Wellfleet

[Anne Elk]

Putting in my vote for "he's run off to be with Bristol Palin and their love child."

[cheatincheetos]

This whole story is becoming very Twilight Zone, very Alfred Hitchcock Presents. I'm no longer sure of what I can believe/trust - and what I know to be bogus. Ordinarily I'd say that's just what Boob intended, but I honestly don't think he could concoct such a convoluted plot line...

 

[JoanArc]

 

I'm no longer sure of what I can believe/trust - and what I know to be bogus.

[Lillybee]

I wonder if INTOUCH will be dropping another shoe tomorrow

[Defrauder]

Well if nothing else,  if Josh isn't at RU at least RU was exposed for what kind of a labor and pray camp they offer.   How interesting too that one of their pastors is serving 12 years in prison for sexually assaulting a minor.  Why do the Duggars know and support people like that?  

[CofCinci]

I wonder how much a paparazzi pic of Josh or Anna is worth today?

[Julia]

I would think for much the same reason as slaveowners only hung out with other slave owners. You either think that all human beings are people or you think that some of them are property. That kind of limits Jim Bob's social options. And we've pretty much seen that if he can slap a coat of paint on it, he doesn't think damage to human property hurts the resale value.

Besides, the man taught the boy who molested his five year old that God says sexual thoughts are the result of women asking for it. Why would his friends being rapists bother him?

[Zahdii]

I think it's possible that Josh was at the RU place that hosted the online sermon.  It's possible that RU thought it would be good publicity for them.  I'm pretty sure that they started to have second thoughts about the publicity being all good when a lot of people logged onto their online service and some of them used the chat feature to mock them.  (Not that I have a problem with that given what's come out about the place.)

 

Anyway, Josh could be hiding inside to avoid the paps, or he could have left voluntarily.  It could also be that RU simply quietly moved him to another of their facilities.  Can you imagine Josh being moved every time someone figured out where he was?  I wonder what his ego would make of that.

 

It'll be interesting to see if RU shuts down the chat function on the next online sermon.

[NextIteration]

Well if nothing else,  if Josh isn't at RU at least RU was exposed for what kind of a labor and pray camp they offer.   How interesting too that one of their pastors is serving 12 years in prison for sexually assaulting a minor.  Why do the Duggars know and support people like that?  

 

I've said it before an I'll say it again, these people are the worst perverts.

 

eta: I was under the impression that this was the only RU "inpatient" treatment facility.

Edited September 2, 2015 by NextIteration

[Jynnan tonnix]

Camp Scamafundie: We put the "Fun Dies" in "fundies"

They probably aren't the only ones...

 

By the way, I tend to skim a bit when reading here (there's just so much going on!), and invariably seem to read "Scamafundie" as "Schadenfreude"...too many of the same letters in the same order. Plus a very widespread emotion in the whole scheme of events.

[questionfear]

Mrs QF and I were discussing this last night, and we were wondering-if Anna blew from the Duggars and headed to a more mainstream Baptist church, would she be supported? 

[Julia]

Mrs QF and I were discussing this last night, and we were wondering-if Anna blew from the Duggars and headed to a more mainstream Baptist church, would she be supported? 

 

According to Derick, the Dillards already belong to one just down the road, and the SBC (which their minister runs) needs prominent converts pretty badly right now. I don't know if they'd stand for a divorce, but I think she would definitely be supported in becoming part of their congregation.

[Cherrio]

I wonder how much a paparazzi pic of Josh or Anna is worth today?

Not that much, unless they are at the Bunny Ranch having a 3 way party.

[Tabbygirl521]

Mrs QF and I were discussing this last night, and we were wondering-if Anna blew from the Duggars and headed to a more mainstream Baptist church, would she be supported?

For a split second, I wondered why Mrs Quiverfull was reading here...

I wish she was right about Anna escaping, but it just seems impossible. She seems so cut off from the world. Even that one supportive Keller brother had to try to reach her via Instagram. It almost seems like an abused-spouse situation, where she would have to lay her plans in secret - but is she ever alone long enough? Can she make private calls or go online to connect with resources? I know I'm speculating, but everything we know about this cult tells me that she is under way too much pressure and scrutiny.

Maybe John-David can help her get out, if it's really true that he has more or less blown this circus. He may be sympathetic. And he has a plane...

About Josh's disappearance - I wonder if he's had some kind of breakdown and is sobbing in a rubber room somewhere. The humiliation of having one's foibles right in the face of every shopper in America - can you even imagine? He has acted reprehensibly in so many ways, but he must still feel like highly publicized dog-doo. Not that he doesn't deserve it.

[yogi2014L]

Mrs QF and I were discussing this last night, and we were wondering-if Anna blew from the Duggars and headed to a more mainstream Baptist church, would she be supported? 

I would like to think so. The divorce rate is 50%, I am sure in a mainstream church you have plenty of people who have divorced and even remarried. I think the only people who think she should stay with him are Duggars and her parents, LOL. And possibly Jill R. 

 

, I would venture to guess even your regular old conservative christians would support her leaving his ass. Its the crazies from the cult who want her to stay

[leighdear]

Anyway, Josh could be hiding inside to avoid the paps, or he could have left voluntarily.  It could also be that RU simply quietly moved him to another of their facilities.  Can you imagine Josh being moved every time someone figured out where he was?  I wonder what his ego would make of that.

 

Isn't that what they did with Osama Bin Laden?  Because I can definitely see Josh thinking his importance would necessitate that kind of stealth.  *LOL*

[wovenloaf]

I would like to think so. The divorce rate is 50%, I am sure in a mainstream church you have plenty of people who have divorced and even remarried. I think the only people who think she should stay with him are Duggars and her parents, LOL. And possibly Jill R. 

 

, I would venture to guess even your regular old conservative christians would support her leaving his ass. Its the crazies from the cult who want her to stay

They would! I grew up in a regular old conservative Christian family, and I can't think of a single family member who would tell me I had to stay with a guy who cheated on me. With anybody! Much less with hookers! It was briefly discussed upthread somewhere, but getting a divorce because your spouse committed adultery isn't lumped in the same boat with other divorces. Actual christians (which I sure don't consider the Duggars to be) "permit" divorce for that reason, even where they wouldn't otherwise. So I don't think anyone at a normal baptist church would be shunning Anna. 

 

(edited to add that obviously I can't speak for all the christians ever, I'm just talking about my experience) =)

Edited September 2, 2015 by wovenloaf

[magpye29]

  JoanArc, how did you manage to find a photo of Mechelle with her eyes closed?  I thought they were frozen into that bug-eyed stare!

[galax-arena]

Re: whether mainstream churches would view Anna divorcing Josh as a sin, per a survey carried out by Christian group LifeWay:

 

 

Link to blog post on survey.

Edited September 2, 2015 by galax-arena

[Dianaofthehunt]

If only RU meant RU-486....

[Julia]

Re: whether mainstream churches would view Anna divorcing Josh as a sin, per a survey carried out by Christian group LifeWay:

 

 

Link to blog post on survey.

 

Lifeway is the PR arm of the SBC. I can't help but wonder if having the mother ship quiz you on doctrine wouldn't make pastors a bit more conservative in their answers than they might be otherwise.

[3girlsforus]

They would! I grew up in a regular old conservative Christian family, and I can't think of a single family member who would tell me I had to stay with a guy who cheated on me. With anybody! Much less with hookers! It was briefly discussed upthread somewhere, but getting a divorce because your spouse committed adultery isn't lumped in the same boat with other divorces. Actual christians (which I sure don't consider the Duggars to be) "permit" divorce for that reason, even where they wouldn't otherwise. So I don't think anyone at a normal baptist church would be shunning Anna. 

 

(edited to add that obviously I can't speak for all the christians ever, I'm just talking about my experience) =)

 

I agree - and not only do actual Christians "permit" divorce for this reason, so does the Bible. It explicitly states that divorce for sexual immorality is acceptable. I've always read that verse not only to mean it's acceptable but encouraged. 

Lifeway is the PR arm of the SBC. I can't help but wonder if having the mother ship quiz you on doctrine wouldn't make pastors a bit more conservative in their answers than they might be otherwise.

I'm sure it would. Also, is that chart supposed to say 'is a sin' or 'is NOT a sin'? I don't know anyone, Christian or 'among Americans' who consider it a sin to get divorced if you are being abused. 37% of Americans, which I'm assuming includes non-religious people, thinking it's wrong to leave an abusive spouse doesn't seem accurate to me at all.

[Cherrio]

I wonder if INTOUCH will be dropping another shoe tomorrow

flip flop

[galax-arena]

I can't help but wonder if having the mother ship quiz you on doctrine wouldn't make pastors a bit more conservative in their answers than they might be otherwise.

Well, what's surprising is that more laypeople apparently think divorce is a sin in certain situations than the pastors do. As the blog post mentions:

In a separate phone survey of 1,000 Protestant pastors, less than a third want to classify as sinful an individual divorcing their spouse for adultery (32 percent), abuse (28 percent), or abandonment (27 percent).

 

Pastors are more likely to call divorce a sin when a couple divorces over a pornography addiction (39 percent), and because the spouses no longer love another (61 percent).

 

In their views on divorce, Protestant church members are much more closely aligned with the average American than with their pastor. Virtually the same percentage of Protestants believes a divorce is sinful when it is over adultery (44 percent) or an end to their feelings of love (46 percent).

 

[snip]

 

"While most Protestant pastors view the sinfulness of divorce differently based on the reason for the divorce, this sensitivity is lost on their members,” said McConnell.

[Skittl1321]

I agree - and not only do actual Christians "permit" divorce for this reason, so does the Bible. It explicitly states that divorce for sexual immorality is acceptable. I've always read that verse not only to mean it's acceptable but encouraged. 

I'm sure it would. Also, is that chart supposed to say 'is a sin' or 'is NOT a sin'? I don't know anyone, Christian or 'among Americans' who consider it a sin to get divorced if you are being abused. 37% of Americans, which I'm assuming includes non-religious people, thinking it's wrong to leave an abusive spouse doesn't seem accurate to me at all.

Well, if you flipped the title to "is not a sin" then that would mean (assuming binary response) 63% think it is a sin to leave an abusive spouse; so I think the title is right.  But that 37% is crazy.

[DollEyes]

 

Well if nothing else, if Josh isn't at RU at least RU was exposed for what kind of labor and pray camp they offer. How interesting too that one of their pastors is serving 12 years in prison for sexually assaulting a minor. Why do the Duggars know and support people like that?

 

  Fundies be crazy.

Edited September 2, 2015 by DollEyes

[Julia]

Well, if you flipped the title to "is not a sin" then that would mean (assuming binary response) 63% think it is a sin to leave an abusive spouse; so I think the title is right.  But that 37% is crazy.

 

I think the question they think they're answering is "Is it a sin for you or your daughter to get a divorce if..." The answer to "Is it a sin for me or my daughter to get a divorce if..." might be pretty different. Given the divorce rate and all.

[CofCinci]

flip flop

More like drip drop, as in The Clap Josh most likely caught by having unprotected sex with prostitutes.

[MonicaM]

If she were my friend or sister or daughter, I'd encourage her to seek a legal separation with spousal and child support, even if she was determined to try and hold the marriage together.  Josh has broken the bonds of any covenant, and she needs to protect herself legally and economically NOW.  As an adult, she has the right to have money come directly to her, to be spent as she sees is best to take care of her family.  She does not need to depend on the "charity" of her in-laws and all the strings that come with any help they give her.  

 

[What In The]

Since Josh is now and probably will be unemployed, child support would be hard to come by no?

[HundFan]

According to ROL, Matt Valles, "who spent more than three months at [RU]," it's "'Jesus Jail.' They take your money, ID, cell phone, you can't watch television, read books or listen to any music except Christian music." Sounds like growing up in the TTH to me. 

 

ETA: This is only relevant, of course, if Josh actually is at RU in Rockford.

Edited September 2, 2015 by HundFan

[3girlsforus]

Imagine what is done when the cameras aren't around.

 

Jacob Rolof shares that he is being "fucked out of the money from the show that was my childhood."  I'd love for Josh and Anna to start bitching about money now too.

 

This could be a really interesting legal fight depending on how the TLC payments were set up. If it was all one bulk Duggar organization controlled by JB could Anna sue JB for money if she leaves Josh or would Josh be able to claim he only has whatever money is left from the FRC job even though he'll be getting a bunch from JB/TLC? I know the chances are that Josh had his own contract with TLC but if he didn't or if he's entitled to TLC monies from the earlier years that money would be part of Josh's assets in a divorce wouldn't they? I'm sure they don't have a prenup. 

[Julia]

Since Josh is now and probably will be unemployed, child support would be hard to come by no?

 

Josh was an adult for a fair amount of the time he appeared on the show. Adults have to be compensated for appearing on reality TV.

 

I'm pretty sure Jim Bob has his hands on Josh's funds, but a good lawyer could get them away for Anna.

[Readalot]

This could be a really interesting legal fight depending on how the TLC payments were set up. If it was all one bulk Duggar organization controlled by JB could Anna sue JB for money if she leaves Josh or would Josh be able to claim he only has whatever money is left from the FRC job even though he'll be getting a bunch from JB/TLC? I know the chances are that Josh had his own contract with TLC but if he didn't or if he's entitled to TLC monies from the earlier years that money would be part of Josh's assets in a divorce wouldn't they? I'm sure they don't have a prenup.

in the ending credits it would say something like Special Thanks Jim Bob and Michelle Duggar. Once Josh was married Josh and Anna Duggar were added. I hope that means they had their own contract. I didn't pay attention after Jessa and Jill were married though. - My mom was raises fundy, married a month after high school graduation. My dad cheated on her while she was pregnant with my sister (2nd child). She divorced with the support of most of the family and congregation. Later she did tell me she married to have sex. She expected me and my HS boyfriend to get married right after HS too! Hello, didn't you learn? I ended up marrying him but after I graduated college. Celebrating 25 years next week.

[Missy Vixen]

Putting in my vote for "he's run off to be with Bristol Palin and their love child."

Dear Baby Jesus:

I don't ask for much in this life. Well, I do, but let's not discuss that one right now. The thing I currently want most in the world (besides a Birkin bag and peace on earth) is the following. I know you are a miracle worker and my only hope. Please, please, PLEASE let this happen: A fling between Josh Duggar and Bristol Palin that resulted in a "blessing". I'd even take more than one "blessing". After all, the more the merrier at the TTH, right?

 

Shortly after this is discovered, I really want Anna Duggar to re-enact Angela Bassett's scene from Waiting to Exhale. You know the one. Imagine the barbecue that can be had via Smuggar's super-expensive, loaded and oh-so-manly truck! I'll even bring the stuff for S'mores.

 

I know you've gotten many requests from People, In Style, OK!, The Daily Fail and so many more, but I know you'll answer my prayers.

Love,

MV

[wovenloaf]

Since Josh is now and probably will be unemployed, child support would be hard to come by no?

The court typically bases the owed amount on your earning potential - so, for example, a person cannot avoid a child support obligation by quitting their job, because the amount would be based on what they could make if employed. Not sure how they'd deal with the fact that despite his previous job Josh isn't actually very employable going forward... But, legally speaking, "I can't pay because I got fired" isn't going to do much for a person trying to avoid paying. 

[JennDear77]

I wonder how much a paparazzi pic of Josh or Anna is worth today?

I have a friend who saw Anna at Target on Sunday. She took a pic but it's from the back. She had two sister nannies with her.

[Cherrio]

Josh was an adult for a fair amount of the time he appeared on the show. Adults have to be compensated for appearing on reality TV.

 

I'm pretty sure Jim Bob has his hands on Josh's funds, but a good lawyer could get them away for Anna.

Not all adults are compensated on reality tv. Only the cast members who have contracts are compensated. For instance, none of the husbands or children are paid on any Bravo shows.

        There are releases non compensated people have to sign too which I am sure makes it impossible to claim they are owed any money among other things like using the footage anyway they want to regardless of accuracy.

[Micks Picks]

Bummer she is surrounded by sister moms all the time.  I read elsewhere that Amy related a couple of weeks ago that Joy was staying with Anna prior to Joy going to El Salvadore or wherever with Jill for 2 weeks.  So no, doesn't look like she is left alone.  No time to think for herself, raise her own kids, be her own person.

[Fuzzysox]

I have a friend who saw Anna at Target on Sunday. She took a pic but it's from the back. She had two sister nannies with her.

They upgraded to Target? Never would have imaged she would diss Walmart.

[CofCinci]

I have a friend who saw Anna at Target on Sunday. She took a pic but it's from the back. She had two sister nannies with her.

Sister nannies = handlers. Girl can't even go to Target alone. Big difference from the freedom she most likely enjoyed in the DC suburbs.