Jessa, Ben and Their Brood: Making a (Diaper) Mountain out of a Mold House

[jcbrown]

20 hours ago, awaken said:

...The midwife does the initial postpartum examination and monitoring of mother and baby and don’t leave until they’re stable, have eaten, and peed. Midwives typically visit their home birth clients within 24 hrs after the birth, 3 days, 1 week, 2 weeks, and 6 weeks, and of course are on call for any other needs between appointments. It’s quite extensive, and individualized when done right. 

So we can assume this is not what the Duggars do, since they rarely do things right relating to childbirth.

10 hours ago, doodlebug said:

BTW, although many lay midwives will tell the parents that they will do the newborn exam, etc; they have NO TRAINING WHATSOEVER in newborn care or exams except for the few who've taken neonatal resuscitation classes which only cover emergency care (and ANYONE doing home births should have that certification at a minimum).  So, even if the lay midwife does examine the newborn, don't expect her to pick up significant heart murmurs or other issues; she knows not what she does.

Yes, I assume this is more Duggar speed.

[Barb23]

Have some questions for @doodlebug or anyone else who may know.

Since we assume Jessa had no or little prenatal care except what Jill could do, how does it work with the (?beta strep) test mom's are given close to birth?  I think it determines if the mom is to be given antibiotics during delivery if they are positive so the infection can't be transferred to the baby thru the birth canal.  So how does this affect things if Jessa or any of the non-prenatal care Duggar gals aren't tested & given antibiotics if necessary?

When I worked at the pediatrician's/primary care office, we would get calls from the hospital informing our doctors of a new birth with all the basic info (time, baby's weight,  etc) so the doctor could see the baby at the hospital.  This info included if mom was positive or negative for this test & how she was treated.  I don't remember that many positives. 

In my almost 15 years of working in this primary care office which included two pediatricians,  I don't remember any home births & maybe a dozen birthing center births where we agreed to see the newborn ASAP.  Not sure why.

[doodlebug]

11 hours ago, Barb23 said:

Have some questions for @doodlebug or anyone else who may know.

Since we assume Jessa had no or little prenatal care except what Jill could do, how does it work with the (?beta strep) test mom's are given close to birth?  I think it determines if the mom is to be given antibiotics during delivery if they are positive so the infection can't be transferred to the baby thru the birth canal.  So how does this affect things if Jessa or any of the non-prenatal care Duggar gals aren't tested & given antibiotics if necessary?

When I worked at the pediatrician's/primary care office, we would get calls from the hospital informing our doctors of a new birth with all the basic info (time, baby's weight,  etc) so the doctor could see the baby at the hospital.  This info included if mom was positive or negative for this test & how she was treated.  I don't remember that many positives. 

In my almost 15 years of working in this primary care office which included two pediatricians,  I don't remember any home births & maybe a dozen birthing center births where we agreed to see the newborn ASAP.  Not sure why.

There are some homebirth practitioners who have a relationship with a lab and can get the test results.  Since lay midwives are licensed in Arkansas, I presume they can order lab work and send the sample or the patient to the lab to get it done.  Labs will supply practitioners with culture tubes and the like, so it isn't outside the realm of possibility that they do test for GBS.  

As for how they get antibiotics while in labor, that is trickier.  Getting medications, even antibiotics for IV administration is really hard, it usually requires a consult to a homecare agency which wouldn't work for labor patients.  The regular pharmacy isn't going to pass out bags of antibiotics for home IV use.  I believe some homebirth providers managed to obtain oral ampicillin from sympathetic licenses practitioners and give that to their GBS positive patients in labor.  There's no research on oral meds for GBS prophylaxis, but lay midwives don't seem to care about research or evidence based practice anyway.

While I don't know for certain; I would suspect that most homebirth providers don't do GBS testing because they don't have the ability to give antibiotics anyway.  Don't ask, don't tell.  Then, if the baby gets sick, they can claim there was no way to know or that the kid caught the infection after the delivery.

About 25% of all pregnant women are colonized with Group B strep at delivery.  The risk of a full term baby contracting an infection from it is about 1 in 1000, but the infection can be devastating and lead to death or permanent neurologic injury while giving a couple of doses of penicillin in labor is very low risk for complications.  There has been research that shows that testing and treating colonized women is cost effective and saves lives.

[Absolom]

This is what the state regulation says the lay midwives in Arkansas are supposed to do:

Quote

303.03  ANTEPARTUM CONDITIONS REQUIRING CONSULTATION, REFERRAL OR TRANSFER OF CARE 
 
If any of the following antepartum conditions are identified, a physician/CNM consultation, referral or transfer is required and the client must be examined by a physician or CNM currently practicing obstetrics. ADH clinicians may accept referrals per ADH protocol.  A plan of care for the condition must be established, and execution of the plan must be documented.  Midwives caring for these clients shall submit additional required incident reports to ADH.  If a referral is not made or if the clinician advises against home delivery the client must be transferred immediately to a physician or CNM. 
 
 
1. A sudden decrease in fetal movement or kick count of less than 10 per hour after 27 weeks 6/7 days. 
 
2. Group B Strep Prophylaxis Indications. CDC approved Group B Strep intrapartum prophylaxis (per ADH approved guidelines) must be obtained for the clients listed below (A-D). Clients who refuse antibiotics will be transferred from midwifery care to a physician for hospital care unless a physician agrees to supervise the LLM care of the client. The plan of care agreed to by the physician and the LLM must be documented and submitted as an incident report to ADH.  
 
a. Clients who test positive for Group B Strep in the urinary tract at any time in the current pregnancy (regardless of repeated testing that is negative for Group B Strep).  Vaginal/rectal testing for Group B Strep is not indicated when the urine testing is positive for Group B Strep in the current pregnancy. 
 

 
 
34 
 
b. Clients who test positive for Group B Strep in the vagina or rectum at any time in the current pregnancy (regardless of repeated testing that is negative for Group B Strep). 
 
c. Clients with positive history of birth of an infant with early-onset Group B Strep disease. 
 
d. Clients with antepartum Group B Strep culture status that is unknown at the time of labor onset and: 
 
i. Temperature in labor (> 100.4 degrees F); or 
 
ii. Rupture of membranes > 16 hours (Refer to 305.01 Immediate Transport #12). Prophylactic antibiotics are indicated by 18 hours of ruptured membranes; or 
 
iii. Preterm labor (< 37 weeks 0/7 days of gestation) 

[doodlebug]

1 hour ago, Absolom said:

This is what the state regulation says the lay midwives in Arkansas are supposed to do:

Since it appears that the option that results in the fewest transfers of patients to other practitioners is not to do any testing at all, I suspect that that is the option most lay midwives choose in Arkansas.  It's my experience that lay midwives are loathe to recommend that their patients see other practitioners for any reason.  If a doctor or CNM is only involved when there is preterm labor (which presumably excludes homebirth anyway), prolonged rupture of membranes or a maternal fever; the vast majority of women who are positive for GBS but haven't been tested won't know the difference.  Unless they or their kid gets sick anyway.

[ginger90]

1 hour ago, Absolom said:

If any of the following antepartum conditions are identified

Key words.

[Barb23]

@doodlebug & @Absolom Thanks for the info.

8 hours ago, doodlebug said:

About 25% of all pregnant women are colonized with Group B strep at delivery.  The risk of a full term baby contracting an infection from it is about 1 in 1000, but the infection can be devastating and lead to death or permanent neurologic injury while giving a couple of doses of penicillin in labor is very low risk for complications.  There has been research that shows that testing and treating colonized women is cost effective and saves lives.

I read a home birth story that sadly ended up with the newborn dying because of a mixup with the Group B strep results. I don't remember exactly what happened except the mom had the test done but the positive results didn't either get to her midwife or for some reason the midwife got the results but the mom wasn't treated.  It was an uneventful birth & the couple put the baby down to sleep after the midwife left. Short time later they checked on the baby & realized she wasn't breathing.  They called 911 but there was nothing they could do, the baby had already died.  Somehow they traced it back to the mom not being treated for the infection. So sad considering how simple it is to treat the mom.

These Duggar gals sure like taking unnecessary chances. Do they even know this is a thing they should be tested for?  I guess I'm mainly referring to Jessa since she's the one whose prenatal care seems to be in question. 

Edited July 1, 2019 by Barb23

[Sew Sumi]

I could have sworn that Jill said she tested positive for group B strep when she was pregnant with Izzy. I remember an IV drip set up by the bed. 

Edited July 1, 2019 by Sew Sumi
Not texted!

[Barb23]

22 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

I could have sworn that Jill said she tested positive for group B strep when she was pregnant with Izzy. I remember an IV drip set up by the bed. 

I would hope if any of them knows about the test it would be Jill.

IIRC, she had the older midwife with Izzy. The one that practiced out of the Deliverance shack. 

All snarking aside, I'm glad she was tested and treated. 

[GeeGolly]

59 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

I could have sworn that Jill said she tested positive for group B strep when she was pregnant with Izzy. I remember an IV drip set up by the bed. 

I remember the IV too. Not sure if that was before or after her water broke and Jill saying she saw a meconium stain on her pad.

[Sew Sumi]

[mimionthebeach]

13 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

Okay, I'm ambivalent about the ubiquitous bows, but I do like that Ivy is not being swathed in girly pink stuff. 

[galaxychaser]

Like we can’t see it is a girl based on the yellow dress? I too hate the bows. 

Cute baby!

[NotthebadVictoria]

35 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

Bless her heart......

[GeeGolly]

So far Ivy seems a mix of Spurge and Henry.

[Sew Sumi]

6 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

So far Ivy seems a mix of Spurge and Henry.

Jill commented that Ivy favors Spurge.

[Snow Fairy]

She really doesn't need to copy Jinger with the bows.

Stupid bows

[BetyBee]

I did a doubletake when I saw that pic of Ivy.  My 2 month old twin granddaughters have that same dress.  They don't have any headwraps though.  So people have to guess their gender!

[Nysha]

I'm so glad my daughters didn't put my granddaughters in head wraps. The big bows, which my daughters didn't use either, I can live with. The head wraps are ugly, just plain ugly.

[doodlebug]

1 hour ago, Snow Fairy said:

She really doesn't need to copy Jinger with the bows.

Stupid bows

She looks like she has a head injury,  The outfit is otherwise cute and I'm glad Jessa seems to favor colors other than soft pastels and girly pinks for her.

[FizzyPuff]

2 hours ago, doodlebug said:

She looks like she has a head injury,  The outfit is otherwise cute and I'm glad Jessa seems to favor colors other than soft pastels and girly pinks for her.

Just you wait I bet she got loads of pink outfits lined up. 

[Churchhoney]

Is it just me or does that head thing look uncomfortable?

[graybrown bird]

Yes it does look uncomfortable.  Hot, for one thing.  My first thought:  that poor kid.

[Sew Sumi]

Jessa obviously employs the a/c at home. That poor thing would die of heatstroke in that outfit if outdoors for any amount of time. She'd be fine here; our high today was 75. But summer in AR? No fucking way.

[farmgal4]

On 6/30/2019 at 11:57 PM, Sew Sumi said:

I could have sworn that Jill said she tested positive for group B strep when she was pregnant with Izzy. I remember an IV drip set up by the bed. 

She did say that.

[MichaelaRae]

Ivy reminds me more of Henry, not sure why. But the ever-present bows/head wraps are driving me crazy. I have plenty of friends with infant girls right now and none of them are doing this. Is it because they (we) are ebul non-fundie types? Or just not trendy?

[Sew Sumi]

Jessa is certainly trendy amongst HER peers, ie. Sierra, the Taco chick. I doubt she really has any fucks to give for anyone else, including her 2.1M followers.

Edited July 4, 2019 by Sew Sumi

[GeeGolly]

I think Jinger and Jessa think the bows are cute, but I'm guessing there's some conscious or unconscious behaviors behind the girly-girl outfits.

There is still a non-Fundy culture out there that thinks parents make their kids gay by not keeping serious gender boundaries. Fundies practically brag about keeping these boundaries.

The Duggars are Fundy.

[lascuba]

I know a lot of people IRL (and I don't associate with fundies) who go nuts with the bows on baby girls, so while for the Duggars it could partly be a gender role thing, I think it's mostly just about what's in style and the general excitement of have a girl to dress up. (As the spinster aunt, I gotta say, it's so much more fun shopping for girls clothes. Though I promise I've never bought a hair bow.)

[lookeyloo]

As I've said before, some mothers just like bows.  My 16 year old granddaughter brought out bow frenzy in my non fundie, educated, employed, daughter in law when baby was born.  They live in the Pacific Northwest where back then nary a bow was to be found, even in Nordstrom.  I lived in a town in the deep south with an actual bow store.  Wall to wall bows of every size and color, and clip type.  I went there many times with an order from daughter in law and her friends who were fascinated with them and their little girls wore them too.  In our former town and here in another southern town, there are lots of bows on little girls.  And yes the wraps on babies.  Eventually the girls give them up themselves. Of course it is not for everyone.  And PS my granddaughter has a perfectly shaped beautiful head with a lot of long thick luscious hair that apparently all that "head foolery" didn't mess up.

[Dimi1]

I am a girly girl and love make up , scarves and put barrettes and clips in my hair...my daughter is not...always looks nice but plain and simple..I tried to put bows in her hair but once she was able to she took them out and threw them down...then along comes my grand daughter. I bought her bows and my daughter never really put them in her hair...lol..she probably tossed them out..about 3 months ago my granddaughter 3 1/2 announced she needed some bows ..so off we go to target and get one of every color..lol....I was thrilled . she like nail polish and lipstick too...lol....one thing I have noticed about jess's girl...she is dressing her in greens, reds, blues...I haven't seen any pink..nor pastels....

[Madtown]

3 pictures

[PradaKitty]

Look! Ivy has a head after all!

[Zella]

Is that Ben's side of the family?

[Jynnan tonnix]

8 minutes ago, Zella said:

Is that Ben's side of the family?

Ben's mom's, I'm guessing. Ben seems to have his grandfather's smile. He's got the remainders of a good looking guy around him!

That photo of - is it Spurge or Henry? It's hard to tell in that light - is adorable.

[GeeGolly]

Ivy has the same recessed pointy chin as Lissy,

[galaxychaser]

Ivy is a chunk! I love chunky babiez.

[madpsych78]

Great-grandmother Eaton looks really young to be a great-grandmother. I would have thought she was 50!

[GeeGolly]

3 minutes ago, madpsych78 said:

Great-grandmother Eaton looks really young to be a great-grandmother. I would have thought she was 50!

She does look good. She may be only in her 60s. I don't think Ben's mom is even 45 yet.

[Sew Sumi]

Maybe she's Guinn's step-mother?

[EmeraldGirl]

I just bought my soon to be granddaughter little Beatles onesies. The Duggar heads would explode.

[FizzyPuff]

On 7/7/2019 at 5:54 AM, EmeraldGirl said:

I just bought my soon to be granddaughter little Beatles onesies. The Duggar heads would explode.

Do you mean The Beatles the band or Beatles the car? Either one would make the duggar heads explode especially for a daughter. 

[PradaKitty]

BeATles is a band.

BeEtles  are the bugs or the Volkswagen. 

[ginger90]

5 pictures 

2 pictures 

[xwordfanatik]

Jessa's kids at least seem to eat better quality food than some of their cousins.  I attribute that to Ben.  

Canned everything seems to be all Jessa grew up with.  

Henry is adorable.  Even when he was grumpy baby, he was my favorite.

[Luvmy300zx]

It's good to see Jessa's kids wearing normal toddler swim clothes.

[irisheyes]

4 hours ago, Luvmy300zx said:

It's good to see Jessa's kids wearing normal toddler swim clothes.

Let’s see what happens when Ivy is old enough for a swimsuit. 

[Sew Sumi]

Jessa's latest FU INTERWEBZ!!11 post.

Yes, the message is good, until she invokes Possum Head at the very end.

[cmr2014]

26 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

Jessa's latest FU INTERWEBZ!!11 post.

Yes, the message is good, until she invokes Possum Head at the very end.

There's absolutely nothing wrong with this EXCEPT that she's lecturing us. If she had phrased this as something she was learning as a mother instead of a lesson for her fans it would have been fine.

[EmeraldGirl]

On 7/8/2019 at 8:20 AM, Puffin said:

Do you mean The Beatles the band or Beatles the car? Either one would make the duggar heads explode especially for a daughter. 

Oh yes, the band. Cute little Yellow Submarine, I Am The Walrus, etc. Too bad they don’t make Sexy Sadie, or anything else suggestive for the Duggars! Happiness is a Warm Gun would probably be up their alley. 

Edited July 10, 2019 by EmeraldGirl