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The Duggalos: Jinger and the Holy Goalie

frenchtoast

By frenchtoast
in Counting On

cm-soupsipper
Message added by cm-soupsipper,

Closure Notice: This Thread is now closed due to the name (and much of the posting within it). Please be mindful going forward by naming topics in a way that invites a healthy community conversation. If you name something for a cheap laugh, this thread may be closed later because it encourages discrimination and harm. 

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Spencer Hastings
Spencer Hastings

Tough crowd!  She's wearing modern shoes with closed toes, pants, and a shirt that literally calls back to her family's ridiculous rules and there are still 35 things wrong with what she's doing. 

Churchhoney
Churchhoney

That's okay. He's forgotten it a few times himself. 

GeeGolly
GeeGolly

My push presents after having my kids were my kids. 

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awaken

awaken

43 minutes ago, Rootbeer said:

He says he got the 'best gift ever' for Christmas.  So, she's knocked up?

No, he wouldn’t enjoy that gift because it might inconvenience him. He might have to get jinger some water during the night while she’s up feeding the baby, and that didn’t go over so well last time. 

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Zella

Zella

2 hours ago, awaken said:

He might have to get jinger some water during the night while she’s up feeding the baby, and that didn’t go over so well last time. 

Between that and the Would You Rather game and some other things, I really wonder how big of an asshole he is to her behind closed doors. Because those were incredibly assholish things to do to someone, and he did them in the open and seemed blindsided by the criticism. 

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sheshark

sheshark

53 minutes ago, Zella said:

Between that and the Would You Rather game and some other things, I really wonder how big of an asshole he is to her behind closed doors. Because those were incredibly assholish things to do to someone, and he did them in the open and seemed blindsided by the criticism. 

 Jeremy played “Who Would You Rather?”  Where are the answers?

Churchhoney

Churchhoney

(edited)
11 hours ago, Zella said:

Between that and the Would You Rather game and some other things, I really wonder how big of an asshole he is to her behind closed doors. Because those were incredibly assholish things to do to someone, and he did them in the open and seemed blindsided by the criticism. 

Seems clear that Jer chose The Master's Seminary (out of all the other ones he could have chosen) because he loved loved loved John MacArthur. And he clearly knew exactly what things old John stands for.

One of JM's top priorities, forever and today, has been his insistence on what women's place is. And if we want to hear just how much he insists on his view of this, in the 21st century, there are a lot of places where we can read or hear him rant about it. Jer doesn't advertise this -- I would guess because he's also trying like crazy to sell himself as a guy modern audiences will love.

But I think JM's views are probably quite instructive about Jer's own probable level of respect for women and what he really meant by saying Jingle was "meek," back in the day, when many people didn't think he meant anything by it at all. There's no way in hell Jer didn't know about and strongly embrace JM's feelings on this, because those views have always been such a huge part of MacArthur's "teachings." 

 Like here, for example. I would call JM's attitude and his way of expressing this kind of vicious toward women, actually. You could say it without the kind of actual anger or disdain or something that he displays -- but he's emotional about it -- 

 

Edited by Churchhoney
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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

24 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

Seems clear that Jer chose The Master's Seminary (out of all the other ones he could have chosen) because he loved loved loved John MacArthur. And he clearly knew exactly what things old John stands for.

One of JM's top priorities, forever and today, has been his insistence on what women's place is. And if we want to hear just how much he insists on his view of this, in the 21st century, there are a lot of places where we can read or hear him rant about it. Jer doesn't advertise this -- I would guess because he's also trying like crazy to sell himself as a guy modern audiences will love.

But I think JM's views are probably quite instructive about Jer's own probable level of respect for women and what he really meant by saying Jingle was "meek," back in the day, when many people didn't think he meant anything by it at all. There's no way in hell Jer didn't know about and strongly embrace JM's feelings on this, because those views have always been such a huge part of MacArthur's "teachings." 

 Like here, for example. I would call JM's attitude and his way of expressing this kind of vicious toward women, actually. You could say it without the kind of actual anger or disdain or something that he displays -- but he's emotional about it -- 

I actually think there's a high probability that Jeremy knew very little about JM. In the same way many voters know little about candidates. I think Jeremy was attracted to the school, and then JM, because of JM's notoriety. 

I mean Jeremy doesn't really seem like the kind of dude that does his homework so there's no reason to think he did with JM. The 'fame' of the name and the location was all that Jer needed to see.

I think if Jeremy was doing that game with a guy, I think its very likely he would have jumped in at any pause then too. 

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emmawoodhouse

emmawoodhouse

11 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

I actually think there's a high probability that Jeremy knew very little about JM. In the same way many voters know little about candidates. I think Jeremy was attracted to the school, and then JM, because of JM's notoriety. 

I mean Jeremy doesn't really seem like the kind of dude that does his homework so there's no reason to think he did with JM. The 'fame' of the name and the location was all that Jer needed to see.

I think if Jeremy was doing that game with a guy, I think its very likely he would have jumped in at any pause then too. 

Jeremy's church plant was a MacArthur church, so I believe that Jeremy knew full well who the man was and what he stood for long before he entered the seminary.

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Zella

Zella

(edited)
1 hour ago, emmawoodhouse said:

Jeremy's church plant was a MacArthur church, so I believe that Jeremy knew full well who the man was and what he stood for long before he entered the seminary.

He's also not shown himself to have any problems with MacArthur's theology now that he's attending. I've always believed Jeremy wants to be liked, so he just tries to downplay the more hateful aspect of his beliefs because he's aware they are a bad optics, not because he doesn't genuinely subscribe to them. Like the petition he signed back in 2018 but apparently tried to do on the DL. 

 

Edited by Zella
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charmed1

charmed1

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I imagine the majority of Jingle and Jer's conversations consist of, “OMG, you’ve never heard of ___?!; OMG, you’ve never seen___?!; OMG, you’ve never been to__?!” Jeremy strikes me as someone who most women his age would find annoying. Since she grew up in a cult, Jinger is someone he can feel cool and sophisticated with. 

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Zella

Zella

11 minutes ago, charmed1 said:

I imagine the majority of Jingle and Jer's conversations consist of, “OMG, you’ve never heard of ___?!; OMG, you’ve never seen___?!; OMG, you’ve never been to__?!” Jeremy strikes me as someone who most women his age would find annoying. Since she grew up in a cult, Jinger is someone he can feel cool and sophisticated with. 

Yes! I do think that is a lot of her appeal for him, and I feel like that's probably true of any of the more worldly in-laws. There's a reason they didn't pursue more educated women. 

And I've met some incredibly homeschooled people wherein I wanted to scream some variation of that at them when they don't know that, like, Sherlock Holmes is from books. "There are books?!" I had a fundie coworker literally ask me that, and I wanted to roll my eyes back into my head so far. 

But I feel like the kinder, more effective way is to just meet them where they are and say enthusiastically "Yes! There are books, and they are so good! I liked this story and this one and that one" rather than "Oh my God you didn't know there were books?" 

One of the things that really put me off him in the "Would You Rather" wasn't even him being condescending about things she didn't know but just flat-out not respecting her preferences on things where there is no right answer. Like, how dare she have taste different from him. 

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emmawoodhouse

emmawoodhouse

Yup. Jinger I's now a "lover of all things classical" because Jeremy is. I wonder how much classical literature she's read? I doubt she's ventured into anything secular. She probably considers the writings of Spurgeon and other theologians to be "classical." I don't see much in her personal style or decor that screams classical either. 

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Zella

Zella

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(edited)
25 minutes ago, emmawoodhouse said:

Yup. Jinger I's now a "lover of all things classical" because Jeremy is.

I'm honestly not convinced that ol' Jeremy reads too much classical lit either. I think he said that when he was aiming for Hipster Pastor in his branding and it in no way reflects reality. 

Edited to add: I don't actually judge anyone for not liking classical things. I honestly got pretty burned out on classics as an English major. I still like a lot of them. I rarely read them now that I am left to my own devices for reading. I don't have a problem with Jinger or Jeremy not liking or not reading classical literature. I do have a problem with them claiming to like it merely to appear hoity toity on social media. 

Edited by Zella
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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

I had no idea Jeremy's Laredo church was one of McArthur's. And while I still don't think Jeremy knows all about Mac, what I don't get is why Jeremy is seen as all in, but Derick gets a pass on his beliefs.

Cross Church on marriage:

The marriage relationship models the way God relates to His people. A husband is to love his wife as Christ loved the church. He has the God-given responsibility to provide for, to protect, and to lead his family. A wife is to submit herself graciously to the servant leadership of her husband even as the church willingly submits to the headship of Christ. She, being in the image of God as is her husband and thus equal to him, has the God-given responsibility to respect her husband and to serve as his helper in managing the household and nurturing the next generation.

 

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LilJen

LilJen

21 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

Seems clear that Jer chose The Master's Seminary (out of all the other ones he could have chosen) because he loved loved loved John MacArthur. And he clearly knew exactly what things old John stands for.

One of JM's top priorities, forever and today, has been his insistence on what women's place is. And if we want to hear just how much he insists on his view of this, in the 21st century, there are a lot of places where we can read or hear him rant about it. Jer doesn't advertise this -- I would guess because he's also trying like crazy to sell himself as a guy modern audiences will love.

But I think JM's views are probably quite instructive about Jer's own probable level of respect for women and what he really meant by saying Jingle was "meek," back in the day, when many people didn't think he meant anything by it at all. There's no way in hell Jer didn't know about and strongly embrace JM's feelings on this, because those views have always been such a huge part of MacArthur's "teachings." 

 Like here, for example. I would call JM's attitude and his way of expressing this kind of vicious toward women, actually. You could say it without the kind of actual anger or disdain or something that he displays -- but he's emotional about it -- 

 

Wow, that MacArthur sermonizing is some SEVERELY AWFUL stuff. And I’m not exaggerating in a JillRod manner.

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Cinnabon

Cinnabon

6 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

I had no idea Jeremy's Laredo church was one of McArthur's. And while I still don't think Jeremy knows all about Mac, what I don't get is why Jeremy is seen as all in, but Derick gets a pass on his beliefs.

Cross Church on marriage:

The marriage relationship models the way God relates to His people. A husband is to love his wife as Christ loved the church. He has the God-given responsibility to provide for, to protect, and to lead his family. A wife is to submit herself graciously to the servant leadership of her husband even as the church willingly submits to the headship of Christ. She, being in the image of God as is her husband and thus equal to him, has the God-given responsibility to respect her husband and to serve as his helper in managing the household and nurturing the next generation.

 

You don’t think Jeremy knows all about Johnny Mac by now? And yes, the mainstream Baptist beliefs are also horrendous and hateful.

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sagittarius sue

sagittarius sue

(edited)
14 hours ago, Zella said:

I'm honestly not convinced that ol' Jeremy reads too much classical lit either. I think he said that when he was aiming for Hipster Pastor in his branding and it in no way reflects reality. 

Edited to add: I don't actually judge anyone for not liking classical things. I honestly got pretty burned out on classics as an English major. I still like a lot of them. I rarely read them now that I am left to my own devices for reading. I don't have a problem with Jinger or Jeremy not liking or not reading classical literature. I do have a problem with them claiming to like it merely to appear hoity toity on social media. 

I remember catching an episode where the gang was asked questions about what they knew about Shakespeare.  Of course there was the expected Duggar ignorance and joking about it.  I was really surprised by Jer's ignorance.  I would have expected something more from a college grad with all those books!  I think Bin did the best on the questions.  Jill and Derrick were no longer on the show at that time.

Edited by sagittarius sue
I used ignorance too many times.
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Cinnabon

Cinnabon

3 minutes ago, sagittarius sue said:

I remember catching an episode where the gang was asked questions about what they knew about Shakespeare.  Of course there was the expected Duggar ignorance and joking about their ignorance.  I was really surprised by Jer's ignorance.  I would have expected something more from a college grad with all those books!  I think Bin did the best on the questions.  Jill and Derrick were no longer on the show at that time.

I doubt Jeremy knows anything about classical literature, art, architecture, or anything else. They are both pathetic posers.

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sagittarius sue

sagittarius sue

I thought of Jeremy when I came across this in a article about a pastor at a mega-church, Venue Church in Chattanooga, TN;  (Tavner) Smith would regularly post to social media pictures of himself in designer sneakers and clothes. Sunday services included light shows and congregants would provide a standing ovation when he came on stage. Along with the campus security team, a special team of armed bodyguards would follow Smith around. https://news.yahoo.com/staff-members-venue-church-chattanooga-050100631.html

He's in the process of getting a divorce after an affair with a co-worker, claims of domestic abuse, staffers resigning but not him.

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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

1 hour ago, Cinnabon said:

You don’t think Jeremy knows all about Johnny Mac by now? And yes, the mainstream Baptist beliefs are also horrendous and hateful.

Oh yes, I think he knows much more about him now - or at least he should. My original point was I didn't think the nitty-gritty, slightly hidden details of Mac's belief were necessarily known by Jeremy, or why Jeremy chose that education program. I don't really see Jeremy thinking women should not have basic equals rights. Maybe within the church, but not in the global sense, any more than I think Derick thinks that. I also don't see Jeremy as any less supportive of Jinger than Derick is of Jill.

For the right, or not so right reasons, the Vuolos pulled their kids off SM. Derick slammed his inlaws for exploiting the Duggar 19, all the while making money off his own kids. I mean they recently posted a 10 part series of their vacation. Jill films her kids opening "Happy Mail" from complete strangers, etc.

I just don't see any significant difference between Jeremy and Derick, other than Derick spouts his hate to the masses and Jeremy preaches to the choir.

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Rootbeer

Rootbeer

(edited)
25 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Oh yes, I think he knows much more about him now - or at least he should. My original point was I didn't think the nitty-gritty, slightly hidden details of Mac's belief were necessarily known by Jeremy, or why Jeremy chose that education program. I don't really see Jeremy thinking women should not have basic equals rights. Maybe within the church, but not in the global sense, any more than I think Derick thinks that. I also don't see Jeremy as any less supportive of Jinger than Derick is of Jill.

I generally agree and I think that both of them feel that it is their job to 'educate' their wives as to the proper way to do things- their way.  While they might support a woman's right to vote, they would expect her to ask her husband who to vote for and to follow his choices rather than decide on her own.  Their wives are free to attend school, get degrees and even go to work; as long as they study a subject approved by their husband and only work if he allows it and it doesn't interfere with her duties at home.  They don't believe in slavery, per se, but they do believe, that, as men, they were born to rule their household just as their wives were born to serve them.  

Edited by Rootbeer
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AmosTheAardvark

AmosTheAardvark

4 minutes ago, Rootbeer said:

I generally agree and I think that both of them feel that it is their job to 'educate' their wives as to the proper way to do things- their way.  While they might support a woman's right to vote, they would expect her to ask her husband who to vote for and to follow his choices rather than decide on her own.  They don't believe in slavery, per se, but they do believe, that, as men, they were born to rule their household just as their wives were born to serve them.  

Lots of slavery in the Bible.

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satrunrose

satrunrose

I think both Jeremy and Jinger mostly want to be admired. I have few doubts that Jeremy wasn't on board with McArthur's views on women (because it takes out 50% of the competition). The thing is, I'm not sure it has much bearing on the Vuolos marriage because I haven't seen to many indications that Jinger has many ambitions beyond being the admired well-heeled wife of a fundie celeb. 

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Tdoc72

Tdoc72

On 12/26/2021 at 11:25 PM, emmawoodhouse said:

Yup. Jinger I's now a "lover of all things classical" because Jeremy is. I wonder how much classical literature she's read? I doubt she's ventured into anything secular. She probably considers the writings of Spurgeon and other theologians to be "classical." I don't see much in her personal style or decor that screams classical either. 

I don’t see her reading anything deeper than #sayingsofspurgeon. 

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Suzn

Suzn

21 hours ago, satrunrose said:

I think both Jeremy and Jinger mostly want to be admired. I have few doubts that Jeremy wasn't on board with McArthur's views on women (because it takes out 50% of the competition). The thing is, I'm not sure it has much bearing on the Vuolos marriage because I haven't seen to many indications that Jinger has many ambitions beyond being the admired well-heeled wife of a fundie celeb. 

I think this is right on the mark.  It appears that the things that Jinger would not be allowed are things she doesn't want.  She started out meek and stays that way.  She has the "prettiest" life of all of them and that may be all she wants.

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Kellyee

Kellyee

Quote

For the right, or not so right reasons, the Vuolos pulled their kids off SM. Derick slammed his inlaws for exploiting the Duggar 19, all the while making money off his own kids. I mean they recently posted a 10 part series of their vacation. Jill films her kids opening "Happy Mail" from complete strangers, etc.

There were some cruel comments made on social media and on here a while back about Felicity's physical appearance and how she favors the Vuolo side of the family. I think Jinger and Jeremy did the right thing pulling their kids' pictures off social media. The others should do the same. People don't seem to hold back, even when it comes to the children. They shouldn't be putting their kids out there for public scrutiny. The kids didn't sign up to be reality show stars or social media influencers. 

Jinger does look happy in her current life, and she and Jeremy appear to be doing pretty well. 

 

 

 

 

 

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Kellyee

Kellyee

Quote

“My parents are self-absorbed, superficial fools” #sayingsoffelicity

Say what you will, but I'm betting that Felicity will get to go to normal school. Likely a Christian private school, but still a school with an approved curriculum where someone will give her a real education. And that's Jeremy's influence. Jinger's children will escape the Duggar questionable homeschool life because of Jeremy. It will be interesting to see what Felicity and Israel end up doing with their lives compared to their Duggar cousins. 

 

 

 

 

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Fallacy

Fallacy

On 12/27/2021 at 3:09 PM, GeeGolly said:

Oh yes, I think he knows much more about him now - or at least he should. My original point was I didn't think the nitty-gritty, slightly hidden details of Mac's belief were necessarily known by Jeremy, or why Jeremy chose that education program. I don't really see Jeremy thinking women should not have basic equals rights. Maybe within the church, but not in the global sense, any more than I think Derick thinks that. I also don't see Jeremy as any less supportive of Jinger than Derick is of Jill.

For the right, or not so right reasons, the Vuolos pulled their kids off SM. Derick slammed his inlaws for exploiting the Duggar 19, all the while making money off his own kids. I mean they recently posted a 10 part series of their vacation. Jill films her kids opening "Happy Mail" from complete strangers, etc.

I just don't see any significant difference between Jeremy and Derick, other than Derick spouts his hate to the masses and Jeremy preaches to the choir.

I think Jeremy knew everything about Mac’s beliefs well before he entered the Masters Seminary. If you can find it, one of the episodes of Counting On shows Jinger and Jeremey in the Laredo apartment. She’s doing laundry and he’s “working” at home on his sermons. On his desk, you can see MacArthur materials, including a workbook and several books on his shelves. I’ve searched YouTube for the clip, but I can’t find it. I can tell you that it’s season 5, episode 2 of Counting On. Check the 10:47 mark and you will see the book “John MacArthur’s Fundamentals of Faith.” This book is show in connection with a series of books from the Bible that have MacArthur’s name on them.

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laurakaye

laurakaye

(edited)
2 hours ago, LilJen said:

“My parents are self-absorbed, superficial fools” #sayingsoffelicity

"I have more kicks than most of you will ever have, and I am still only a toddler." #sayingsoffelicity

"Datty and I would like a bowl of vegan, organic, dairy-free, plant-based mac and cheese for lunch, mommy.  Make sure the noodles are slightly al dente, and don't skimp on the hand-shredded cheese substitute like you did last time." #sayingsoffelicity

 

2 hours ago, Westiepeach said:

No one would be able to hear what she says because she is facing the wrong way...

🤣😂😅

Edited by laurakaye
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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

13 minutes ago, Fallacy said:

I think Jeremy knew everything about Mac’s beliefs well before he entered the Masters Seminary. If you can find it, one of the episodes of Counting On shows Jinger and Jeremey in the Laredo apartment. She’s doing laundry and he’s “working” at home on his sermons. On his desk, you can see MacArthur materials, including a workbook and several books on his shelves. I’ve searched YouTube for the clip, but I can’t find it. I can tell you that it’s season 5, episode 2 of Counting On. Check the 10:47 mark and you will see the book “John MacArthur’s Fundamentals of Faith.” This book is show in connection with a series of books from the Bible that have MacArthur’s name on them.

I'm going to guess that most of the books in Jeremy's office were touched once - when they were put on the shelf.

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Fallacy

Fallacy

(edited)
4 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

I'm going to guess that most of the books in Jeremy's office were touched once - when they were put on the shelf.

I wish I could take screen shots because in this case, he’s actively working with these books as he is taking notes. They’re not on a bookcase. The workbook is on his desk, and the Bible books are on a shelf that is part of his desk. I totally get what you are saying about Jeremy having collections of books that he never touches, but if you watch this clip, it’s pretty clear that he is using MacArthur’s materials to prepare his sermon. 
 

ETA: It stuck out to me because at that time, we knew nothing about his MacArthur or Calvinism beliefs, but looking back, it’s clear that he was into MacArthur long before he went to the Masters Seminary.

Edited by Fallacy
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SnapHappy

SnapHappy

(edited)

I imagine Jeremy had several personal interviews with not only MacArthur himself, but some of his minions, well before he was ever accepted into the program.  And he probably had to sign an NDA that would make Jim Bob green with envy.  

I have zero statistics to back it up, but I think their vetting process for students is rigorous and lengthy.  They don't want washouts to go back into the general public and leak their proprietary God stuff, so they make it not only difficult to get in, but probably equally difficult to get out.  Withdrawals in only extreme circumstances, I'd think.  

Like the Mafia, if you're in, you're in for life.  And I think that's just fine with Jeremy & Jinger, at least for now. 

 

Edited by SnapHappy
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cm-soupsipper
Message added by cm-soupsipper,

Closure Notice: This Thread is now closed due to the name (and much of the posting within it). Please be mindful going forward by naming topics in a way that invites a healthy community conversation. If you name something for a cheap laugh, this thread may be closed later because it encourages discrimination and harm. 

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