S02.E04: Episode 4

[OnceSane]

Jared and Clare go on an adventurous date that includes bungee jumping. Back at the house, a new bachelor arrives with a date card and asks Tenley out. They go to a luxurious resort where they are serenaded by a mariachi band. Later, Clare lectures the entire cast before the cocktail party; and Jonathan and Mikey try to convince Juelia that Joe is playing her.

[pinkelephant3]

Wow Joe is such a douche. I don't remember him being that awful to kaitlyn

[sidekickgirl]

To expand on what Joshua said "I wish diarrhea on everyone there" because the show is so craptastic, why not make it literal.

I like Tenley and I just want her to find happiness so she can leave TV land. But she makes horrible choices.

Jonathan is not cut out for this. Juelia is an idiot. Joe is a special kind of asshole. I feel like an ass for being so wrapped up in this show.

Jared fell so many spots on the good list today. He took the easy road.... Grody. Ashley is ick.

Clare put her crazy panties on. Team Jade!

[BubblingKettle]

New guy Michael made me scream laugh with "I knew her name is Tenley, but I think it's Elevenly." That guy seems decent (again, I haven't watched the Bach/ette main shows in many years, so I don't know how he came off on there). But seriously -- WTH was Tenley thinking with her rose? 

 

Jared's conversation with Clare was a bit of a downer...the age difference wasn't for him. And then I was grossed out by his lunge-kiss with Ashley I. After Clare's verbal outburst, I have to give Jade some credit for delivering her opinion to Clare in a very level-headed way. 

 

The wildlife footage was terrific once again, with the snake-Joe connections. Joe's ease with manipulating others is really worrisome. I bet he is a dastardly boyfriend...I pity any women who might have gotten mixed up in his act IRL. And Jonathan completely lost the plot; what an extreme reaction he had to what was going on. 

[Armchair Critic]

Joe has to go!

 

So does Jared like Ashley now, or did he want a rose?

 

I was cringing for Clare there at the end... Awkward. 

 

And shut up Jade.

[leighdear]

Jade finally showed the snide side we got a glimpse of on Chris's season.  Pretty unwarranted.  

 

I feel bad for Clare, she just had no way to win in that situation. 

 

And Ashley I is just a waste of air, film and time.  She sucks incredibly bad and I hope she DOES die alone as she keeps whining.  Idiot. 

[Mabinogia]

If Ashley I and Joe both get their "happy ending" I will finally be able to be through with this show. I know this show sucks, I know it is a mysogonistic cesspool or crazy and asshattery but this is the first time I have ever actually hated watching. Joe going around manipulating everyone and getting everything he wants was making me so very angry.

[CindyBee]

Wow Joe is such a douche. I don't remember him being that awful to kaitlyn

 

Just the last five minutes he was on did his true personality was shown as when he was dumped and got very, very angry.  And remember, no one saw that side as only a couple of episodes had aired before they all went to Paradise.  

[wovenloaf]

My god, Joe was brutal. The way he dismantled Jonathon? Wow.

I really perked up when Clare started to lose it...! Wtf was that? Ha! I don't think she'll leave. The producers will get one of the guys to pretend he's not terrified of her and go say some Bachelor buzz words to her, just in time get her rose.

[CindyBee]

I really perked up when Clare started to lose it...! Wtf was that? Ha! I don't think she'll leave. The producers will get one of the guys to pretend he's not terrified of her and go say some Bachelor buzz words to her, just in time get her rose.

 

Yeah come on Clare, perk up.  Michael isn't that bad.   Or even Jonathan.   But Jared dumping her cause she is "old" really did a number on her.    

[Mu Shu]

That was weird.  Who knew Joe was an enforcer in the Cosa Nostra?     Poor google eyed  Jonathon practically shit his pants around him.

 

They really shouldn't have cast Juelia.    It's painfully obvious that no one is interested in her.

 

Clare may be 8 years older physically than Jared,  but she's a child emotionally.    I can't blame a 26 yo for not wanting to be with a 34yo.  That's a big age gap when you're still that young.    

[thesupremediva1]

I can't believe Tenley's rose choice. Seriously? That shocked me. Get some taste, woman.

I despise Ashley I. with the fire of a thousand Mexican suns. I'm a Jersey girl through and through. I promise, we are not all catty, orange bitches who age-shame and slut-shame every woman who might be getting attention. She might have a masters degree but she possesses the social skills of a middle schooler and the vocabulary of a preschooler. Lay off the bronzer! She reminds me of the mean girls from my hometown, always professing how wonderful they were and in a constant state of sheer disbelief at any man who didn't respond to their advances. Their response was never to work on themselves, only to tear someone else down. She makes my skin crawl.

And Jared! Nooooooo! I knew he'd be a disappointment the second time around. His icy demeanor and cruel dismissal of Claire - telling her she looked "good for her age" - totally turned me off. Anyone who would choose Ashley I. over Claire is a dumbass. Anyone who would go for Kardashley is a dumbass, period, IMO.

Joe is gross. His attitude is smarm personified. Poor Juelia, she just doesn't see it. He can go any time.

More Tanner, please! He must be the normal one and quite a catch - just doesn't make for good TV, so he gets less air time.

Oh Claire. You're much too awesome for these yahoos. Go find yourself sometime in the real world.

[DEL901]

No wonder Tenley is single.  OMG, her ability to read people!  (Although at least with multiple guys after her, she's not desperate Tenley from last week which was just plain sad)

 

As for Joe, yes there's a game aspect, but he just relishes manipulating everyone and putting them down.  I always wonder what kind of blowback IRL there is when someone acts like that.

 

As for Jade, as an earlier poster said, shut up Jade.

[JudyObscure]

Whew. 

Mikey calls Clare the w-word and talks nasty about her.

Ashley thinks Clare should pretend not to be happy because she's not happy.

Jared asks Clare out and then tells her she's too old.

Tenley has three choices and picks the worst one.

Joe is horrible to Juelia, Jonathan and Mikey.

Juelia left her baby to be on TV.

Jonathan cries like Ashley.

Clare lectures everyone for not falling in love with her. 

Jade lectures Clare because Jade hates women who try to get attention.

 

That leaves about three people to like.

[leighdear]

These people are almost making JJ & Carly look good.  And I am fighting that with every fiber of my being.  

[Mu Shu]

Juelia left her child to be on TV.    Twice.   

[FamilyVan]

Wow Joe is disgusting and a completely horrible person.  Yikes!  I am more upset about how he treated Jonathan than anything else.  Although everything he did was all pretty disgusting.

[Armchair Critic]

With Jonathan's eye popping and bragging about having twins before along with him totally wimping out with Joe, I know this is not PC but it is not helping to convince me he is straight.

[wonald]

I agree with those who say - STFU Jade!

That's gonna be you in 5 yrs. It's only a matter of time before Tanner kicks the trash to the curb. (Not that he is much of a prize himself but at least he is employed.)

[leighdear]

I'm not going to slam Juelia for leaving her kid for a few weeks.  She wasn't on Chris's season long, they were still in LA when she got booted in episode 4. And this show filmed for maybe 6 weeks?  Business professionals, performers and military moms leave their kids for stretches too, and most of those kids are just fine.  I'm not saying it was smart, but I doubt the kid is warped for life.  

Edited August 11, 2015 by leighdear

[Rainsong]

It is sharp practice indeed to offer two episodes per week and still leave a RC cliffhanger.

 

I'm squarely in the schadenfreude zone with Clare and her emotionally needy act and sense of entitlement since she first appeared on screen.  Jade vaulted up several levels in my book for her clear-eyed description of Clare's antics and for fearlessly upbraiding Clare at the RC.  Naturally, Clare had to make ANOTHER scene with an exasperated CH offering one of his shopworn phrases:  'Pull yourself together.'  He may as well have looked at his watch and tapped his foot but can you blame him?  Unfortunately for the guys, 7 roses for 9 of them becomes 6 roses if Clare can't or won't get a grip.  Jared could have been more tactful in giving her the brush-off.  But didn't we see these two have a breakfast-table kiss in the teaser reel from Ep 1?  As for Jared's other half, Ashley I remains hopeless at the basics, including her insistence on a running commentary during a mash session.

 

The Joe/Samantha/Juelia thing has been telegraphed and now openly tipped off with the preview video.  I can commend Joe for his choice of objective but his treatment of Juelia is and will be cruel.  I'm not sure it's 'emotional abuse,' to use Ashley S's phrase especially since that term is overused and misapplied these days but it is still rather cold and devious.  Joe is simply playing the game as others, male and female, have before him.  Frankly, I'm surprised Seemingly Sophisticated Sam would entertain Joe's advances but the evidence is undeniable.  Joe is probably the object of much hate, especially from female onlookers, but it must be said that he had three people - including two rivals - eating out of his hand, apologizing above and beyond the crime of a bit of gossip and he even managed to send Jonathan into floods of tears. Behind the aw-shucks demeanor is a poker player.

 

Tenley with a bit of a shocker but her body language was always a bit stiff around Michael (eg her reaction to the sudden kiss) and when she talked about butterflies (still) with Josh it was all but confirmed for the keen-eyed viewer.  I'm not sure why JJ would be surprised but perhaps he's just reacting to his dwindling chances to stay any way he can.

Edited August 11, 2015 by Rainsong

[KR Vermont]

I see I'm not the only one who thought "shut up, Jade" at her being "offended" by Clare's comments. Jade has a secure relationship with Tanner, why stomp on Clare wanting the same with someone. Maybe Jade and Tanner were just tired of Clare's drama and weeping (understandable). idk

[BusyOctober]

I haven't been a Bachelor/ette watcher in many years, but decided to watch this as a summer trashy palette cleanser since all my PBS shows ended. I missed Tenley's season and never saw her previous attempts on "Paradise". Is she related to Original Bachelorette Trista? They have the same "widdle baby" breathy voice. I'm having flash backs to Trista's kitten mewling " thank yeeeeeew" and "ooh! I wuv the color peeeeeenk!" Anyone over the age of 19 who still speaks like that needs to seek out a speech therapist. It is as annoying as that vocal fry BS.

These 20-something's must be in complete shock that the decrepit 30+ year old women are able to get down to the beach without their walkers. Or can feed themselves without their assisted living aides. Or can put on high heels without those brittle old bones snapping. My God, I bet they can hear those baby making wombs shriveling through the hacienda walls. Those old hags must sound like maracas with their dried up eggs rattling around in their ancient ovaries when they shuffle off to the Early Bird buffet at 4:30 every night.

[hypnotoad]

 

Claire - telling her she looked "good for her age" - totally turned me off. Anyone who would choose Ashley I.

 

Right? You'd think she was 100 years old the way he talked. But choosing Ashley over anyone is sheer madness. I was liking Jared right up until that nonsense.

 

 

Jade has a secure relationship with Tanner

 

Yeah it's a lot easier to putting someone on blast for her drama etc when you are the one in a secure position. I'm not saying most of the alleged drama isn't dumb or tiresome, just saying it's much easier to lecture someone when you have no worries during rose time.

Edited August 11, 2015 by hypnotoad

[CindyBee]

I'm sill perplexed on why Clare freaked out.  She was the one with the rose and had a semi decent choice in Michael standing right there without one.   Give him the rose and see how the next couple of days goes.  It made no sense at all to me for her to get all dramatic and in a way, I understand why Jade called her out.   I guess she was reeling still from Jared dumping her, after being so giddy after their date.  

[KR Vermont]

Didn't this franchise used to be more about romance? I liked the brief glimpses we saw between Jared and Clare on the boat and Michael and Tenley on their date...but we know how those ended with those couples, ouch.

What's up with the turnaround of Jared going after Ashley I, I don't buy that he would find her awkwardness or immaturity appealing whatsoever. Their lip lock was gross, and she again brought up Kaitlyn to him during an intimate moment. Smooth move. gah

What it must be like to be Joe and Mikey, feeling the need to bash heads in at the smallest slight. Do the producers think this is what most of tune in to see?

[betha]

Ashley I remains hopeless at the basics, including her insistence on a running commentary during a mash session.

What could be the worst thing to say to someone you are interested in the first time they kiss you?

"Wow, you did that just as good as you did with your ex-girlfriend! (whom you may not yet be over)"

The heck?? Yes, some self-reflection or maybe just watching these two shows might turn up some clues on why you have difficulty with men, Ashley.

That said, I can't dislike her, and I don't think she is a mean girl. She isn't manipulative. She's mean out of jealousy and insecurity, and she wears her heart on her sleeve, but she is genuine.

[MsPH]

I too wish we'd get to see more of the romance rather than just drama. Jade and Tanner seem like a solid item, yet we've seen barely any of their interaction apart from the short date last week. Same with Carly and Kirk, except they haven't even had a date. If the point is to find love then show people finding it!

 

I love Jared, but he really messed up telling Clare she's too old for him. I'm not sure if he knew her age before he asked her out, but then he was kissing her and holding her right from the get-go. Why lead her on like that? I think something else turned him off, like say Clare's dramatics, so he used the age difference as an excuse. Bad bad idea though. You can't bring up age to a woman like that, just awful. I guess he kissed Ashley so she'd give him a rose. Still gross.

 

Joe seems like a sociopath. I don't really mind him playing Juelia, since they all do stuff like that to survive a few more days and she's just delusional. But the way he made poor Jonathan tell Juelia how wrong he was and then went to comfort him when he was bawling his eyes over having betrayed him... I don't even know how he did it. He can be so cold! And the way he was talking about getting his brass knuckles? Scary! 

 

I for one am glad Jade spoke up. Clare did make some comment about the cast of last season being there for love and implied this season's cast wasn't. Her whole outburst was so ridiculously dramatic. Typical Clare. She really needs to find some other method of dating. 

[Wouldofshouldof]

Joe is very adept at changing who he is to interact with different people as the situation demands. Wait - isn't that a characteristic of a sociopath?

Joe seems like a sociopath.

Ah - you beat me to it!

[Madding crowd]

Jared knew Clare's age before he asked her out; what are you supposed to do when a guy asks you out, you go on the date and then he complains about your age. Jared really went down in my opinion this week. I don't believe for a minute he is interested in Ashley I. What the hell was with both Jonathan and Mikey going so overboard with the apologies to Joe? Actual sobbing?

 

I hope Clare stays on because she and Tenley are my favorite of the women right now. Jade and Carly seem dull and catty and I'm happy they found someone but they would be feeling exactly the same as Clare right now if they weren't paired up. Not interested in Joe and his stupid plots so I don't know what they can do to interest me for the next few weeks. One thing I liked about Bachelor Pad is the people had to participate in games etc, they couldn't just sit around for episodes doing nothing. 

[maryshelley]

 

That was weird.  Who knew Joe was an enforcer in the Cosa Nostra?

Ha!

 

I'm a Jersey girl through and through. I promise, we are not all catty, orange bitches...

I do not measure the residents of the great states of New Jersey or Kentucky by the actions of Ashley I or Joe, and I hope they will do us Texans the same courtesy when it comes to Erica Rose and Kalon. (Although I kind of love Erica Rose).

 

Anyone who would choose Ashley I. over Claire is a dumbass.

I don't think he really did choose Ashley I. over Clare. I think he was trying to extricate himself from Clare for whatever reason, and Ashley I. was the option that was left for getting a rose.

 

That said, I can't dislike her, and I don't think she is a mean girl. She isn't manipulative. She's mean out of jealousy and insecurity, and she wears her heart on her sleeve, but she is genuine.

My husband and I were saying something similar. Although she's said a few unkind things behind people's backs (like the "old ladies" comment) and she's shallow, there's a sweetness to her. I think she needs a good therapist to help her learn that if she focuses less on herself, and builds some resilience, she will become more appealing to others.

[CalamityBoPeep]

I love Jared, but he really messed up telling Clare she's too old for him. I'm not sure if he knew her age before he asked her out, but then he was kissing her and holding her right from the get-go. Why lead her on like that? I think something else turned him off, like say Clare's dramatics, so he used the age difference as an excuse. Bad bad idea though. You can't bring up age to a woman like that, just awful. I guess he kissed Ashley so she'd give him a rose. Still gross.

 

Thinking out loud here... stream of consciousness...

 

I've defended Jared so much, over the last couple of weeks, but this move just left me shaking my head.  Really, Jared?  Ok, so you took Clare on a date, she maybe got overly excited about it and overly invested in a relationship with you (I'm guessing that something in the conversation leading up to his "old" comment got him backpedaling in a hurry), but really???  Your next move is to go with the sure-thing Ashley I?  The one you just managed to get free of?  

 

I would have respected his strategy a lot more if he had made a play for one of the remaining women.  Probably not Tenley, since she already had 3 guys on her list.  Probably not Juleia (or however the hell she spells her name), since she couldn't even see the writing on the wall with Joe.  Ashley S, Carly and Jade are all solidly partnered up.... Oh, jeez.  I think that really does leave Clare and Ashley I for Jared to make a play for then, unless I've forgotten someone completely.  

 

Ok.  Reframing the criticism then... you couldn't have just waited 'til after the freaking rose ceremony to let Clare know that you weren't really on that page with her?  I really do wonder how the beginning of that conversation went.  If she was pushing him like she did whats-his-face last season, I guess it may be understandable that he tried to figure out a way out, and was spinning his wheels, trying to come up with something non-committal but encouraging enough to get a rose.  But her age???  She looks great for her age???  *head* *desk*.

 

Guess I ought to give him credit for realizing he totally f-ed that conversation up.  

 

Ashley I was the only option he had left.  But man, it made me feel gross.  Her tears are going to be epic when he tries to find a way out of that relationship again.  He'll probably just have to give it up as a hopeless case, at this point.

 

And Joe can just go leave now.  As ridiculous as Jonathan's earlier bragging was, he sure as hell didn't deserve that treatment.  I hope when he sees this episode, Jonathan decides never to accept anything Joe says as true, and dumps his "friendship" like the piece of crap Joe is.  Juleia is in for a world of hurt.  And I'm not sure I even care about that, because this is the one and only (and weirdly epic) time Mikey has ever made a lick of sense, and she just totally ignored his warning.  She really should have gone to the girls to get their takes after the warnings from Mikey and Jonathan, rather than heading over to Joe.  Ashley S. could have set her straight in a hurry.  

[LakeGal]

Maybe they should make them compete for the date cards.  It would give us some competitions to watch.  Plus those that really wanted to ask someone for a date could fight it out with others to get it.

[Village]

Combined with the fake "I love you" and the little tantrum he threw on Kaitlyn's season, Joe is exactly the douche I thought he was. I really don't understand where he gets off behaving the way he does, when he has so very little going for him looks and personality wise.

 

That being said, Juelia is pretty dumb. Joe isn't even that believable yet she's falling for his shtick hook, line, and sinker. Please stop looking for the father of your child on a show called "Bachelor In Paradise".

 

Jared wants all the cookies in the cookie jar. Jonathan, why are you weeping like your dog just died? Carly, when will you do something about your eyebrows? WHEN, CARLY?

[Armchair Critic]

Please don't tell me that Jared will not hook with anybody because he has Kaitlyn built up in his mind? I hope his still being hung up on her was for the benefit of the show when he was on Men Tell All.

[NikSac]

hee... so I'm only part way through the episode but I just got to Ashley S. saying "Juelia is being played right now <snip> Juelia is the one who left her daughter to come here to find love. That is not love."  I'm pretty sure Ashley didn't mean it the way I took it, but I couldn't agree more.  I don't even particularly like or dislike Juelia, I just think abandoning your daughter for weeks at a time to find "love" on a game show is questionable in terms of showing love for one's child. Again, probably not how Ashley meant it but it made me laugh. Ashley struck me as completely nuts on the original show, but now I think she's quietly brilliant.

[backformore]

Juelia left her child to be on TV.    Twice.   

worse yet, she left her child to fall for JOE!

 

I'm not going to slam Juelia for leaving her kid for a few weeks.  She wasn't on Chris's season long, they were still in LA when she got booted in episode 4. And this show filmed for maybe 6 weeks?  Business professionals, performers and military moms leave their kids for stretches too, and most of those kids are just fine.  I'm not saying it was smart, but I doubt the kid is warped for life.  

I couldn't disagree more.  Juelia's child is a toddler, and she already lost her father.   Six weeks in a toddler's life is HUGE -  a long time to be away from the only parent she has.   There is research in child development to support that it can mess with a child's sense of security and attachment.  the effects can be long-lasting.  Those toddler years are critical in terms of feeling safe and secure, and understanding how the world works, how relationships work.   Warped for life?  There's no certainty, but it IS a possibility. And there's no good reason.  Juelia could find better guys on a dating website, and wouldn't have to be away. 

[Padma]

I like Clare a lot, but I thought it was pretty gross to ask a guy to pick something out of your teeth on a first date. Ew. If that alone was a real turn-off I wouldn't blame him at all. (Unfortunately, I think it was all the others' talk about Clare being "old").

 

As for her "meltdown", I don't know why Jade et al found it so manipulative and contrived. I thought it was perfectly understandable. The one guy Clare really liked had just dumped her (apparently because of her age) and, looking around, she saw a lot of "young people" paired up already, no one available who interested her or (worse) was interested in her, and she felt old and like a loser. Bad feeling! I thought Jade's comment was really unsympathetic, especially under the circumstances that she -did- have someone.

 

Still, I don't know how she or Jonathan or Juelia could be surprised by this show. Few people are brought on it to "find love" courtesy of the producers. They're brought on for the conflict! drama! tension!  If someone actually forms a romantic relationship that's just an unexpected bonus.

 

Joe's such an awful person and I really hope that he gets back some humiliation of his own once Samantha shows up (although, frankly, I do think he's a real psycho so... probably nothing shames him). I feel bad for them, being taken in though. Jonathan still seemed very hurt on the aftershow.  Tasteless, racist "pimp" remark aside, he apparently thought they had a genuine friendship and now knows otherwise.

[threebluestars]

I love the fact that Ashley S. seems to have everyone's number. She has everyone pegged, but is telling no one - although I get the feeling she would if anyone asked her. It's like she's that one person that knows everything that's going on and no one realizes it lol.

 

I don't think Jared is into Ashley I. I think he isn't in to either of them, but felt like Ashley is a more secure bet for a rose, now and down the line.

[backformore]

Ashely I -  Good Lord!!!!!!!!  Kissing Jared, she comments that it's "the way you kissed Kaitlyn".    Then, after a kiss, she throws in "good job!" 

WTF is wrong with her???????

 

Claire's meltdown was bizarre.  

[chocolatine]

And shut up Jade.

 

Seriously. She sat right next to Joe as he told a group of people how he was playing Juelia and only interested in Samantha, yet she didn't say a peep to Juelia to spare her the humiliation. But Clare has a bizarre but otherwise harmless outburst and suddenly she's all righteous indignation? What a load of crap!

[Armchair Critic]

They know they screwed Clare by not sending her in with the originals because most of them paired up before she even got there. I would hate to see if they did that to someone like Carly, she would be going off! 

[Andromeda]

Joe is scary creepy. Soulless. Sociopath is a good description. Jonathan was bordering on pathetic with his groveling. How will he feel seeing he was right all along, and Joe was playing them all?

 

I felt bad for Clare, and Jade was mean. Yes, it was an emotional and not quite logical speech, but surely everyone there knew it wasn't directed at JADE of all people. And yes, why didn't she warn Juelia about Joe's true intentions?

 

Jared is such a child, no finesse at all. I'm not surprised he has clay feet after all. Stupid choice, running back to Ashley. I hope she gets her claws into him so deep, he can't shake her when he really wants to. I will laugh and have no sympathy. What a stupid unromantic first kiss with Ashley, too. Yuck. She was in mid-sentence, and there was no romance at all. How calculating can you get? (Well, if you're Joe, much worse!) And of course, Ashley didn't mind at all.

 

Also dumb for Tenley to pick Joshua -- new guy seemed like a catch (forgot his name). But I'm thinking he's a good deal smarter than Tenley and she feels more comfortable with Joshua.

 

My stupid DVR didn't tape the after show, but I'll get it on On Demand tomorrow. I need more Ashley S. and Carly!!

[Padma]

Note to Ashley: When a man you like kisses you for the first time, it might be good to not rear back in analytical sort of way and observe, "That was as good as you did it for (your last girlfriend)."

 

Another good idea? When he perseveres and kisses you a second time, don't rear back analytically again and, as if rewarding a dog who just learned to fetch a newspaper, praise him, "Good job!"  I don't hate her (like I did her sister) but for such a pretty girl she's so strangely awkward with her "game".

[Wings]

Jared stating that the age difference with Clare was a factor did not bother me. Perhaps that was a less hurtful excuse.  I think he was put off by her dramatics upon hearing about her history from others.  I am not sure he knew first hand.  And my fear will be confirmed next week; Jared was given a bonus to give Ashley a rose. I would not put that past TPTB.  They think we like the drama/tears she brings.  They are dead wrong. 

 

I also think Jade's speech at the RC was a set up. She is too quiet and reserved to have been driven to say that. 

 

Joe.  Ugh.  That topic has already been totally covered.  But wow, he is good.  

 

I enjoy Carly and KIrk's narration of the events.  Seems they made an agreement to stick together to stay on the show.  I sense no passion but rather a sweet friendship and smart move.

[pitchy]

I see I'm not the only one who thought "shut up, Jade" at her being "offended" by Clare's comments. Jade has a secure relationship with Tanner, why stomp on Clare wanting the same with someone. Maybe Jade and Tanner were just tired of Clare's drama and weeping (understandable). idk

 

Well, I thought it was entirely strange that when Clare felt disappointed and left out of couplings (again), she decided to rip the others for not being like participants last year, who were looking for real relationships, while this year's people were not.  I mean, what?

 

 Others are coupled up but they're not really looking for 'love' as she is ?   

 This seemed actually a little crazy to me, making Ashley S. seem entirely normal.  Why not just be unhappy (for good reasons -- Jared was unkind and sort of shocked me) without putting down the entire group for not being genuine the way last year's group was (which she had left in a huff when things weren't going well for her romantically ).

 

  People -will- respond to what was an attack on the rest of the group for not being there for 'love' compared to those in the previous season.  The expressions on everyone when she gave her long speech about their failings was sort of amusing except that I couldn't believe she was belittling the relationships of at least 4 of the couples.

 

 This is normally called "externalizing" in that she was blaming others for her current state.  It couldn't that something was missing with her or in the person she chose but that the whole group was bad and therefore it isn't something she feels she wants to continue.  This was a slam of the group.

[wonald]

I thought Jade was probably enabled by that douche, Tanner. You could hear him clearly saying "Someone wants attention!" when Clare walks off. Tanner probably has been dissing Clare to Jade all along and Jade probably spoke up for validation in Tanner's eyes. He still is gonna dump her tho. Two yrs is a long time to wait to cash in on a Neil Lane diamond ring.

[DEL901]

I'm not going to slam Juelia for leaving her kid for a few weeks.  She wasn't on Chris's season long, they were still in LA when she got booted in episode 4. And this show filmed for maybe 6 weeks?  Business professionals, performers and military moms leave their kids for stretches too, and most of those kids are just fine.  I'm not saying it was smart, but I doubt the kid is warped for life.  

Actually, if you come in day 1 and stay to the end, it is 20 days.  The Bachelor/ette is 42 days if you stay to the end.

[mertensia]

What unpleasant superficial people. Joe's sociopathic, Ashley I is Ms Narcissist, Clare and Tenley are vying for the Ms Insecurity crown, Mikey's won the dimness award and Juelia Ms But he Promised he loves me! Bewilderment.

This show really makes me miss "Love in the Wild" even more.

[Bugs Meany]

That said, I can't dislike [Ashley I.], and I don't think she is a mean girl. She isn't manipulative. She's mean out of jealousy and insecurity, and she wears her heart on her sleeve, but she is genuine.

 

Agreed. For some reason I like her so much more than I did on TB. Maybe from reading a few blog posts and watching some interviews she's done. She's transparent and, believe it or not, smart and self-aware. Dismissing her as crazy is a superficial reading.