After Paradise

[pitchy]

Oh my gosh I hate that blonde woman, whose name I haven't bothered to learn, for attacking Samantha that much. So freakin' (tm Carly) what if Samantha had been semi-friends with Jublia on their season? At least half of these people knew each other before Paradise so what does that mean? Late comers have to back away from any "relationship" that's already been established for two whole days? The nasty blonde woman would not let up! Not to mention Chris Harrison had told her to stay away and she came back and proved exactly why Samantha had been afraid of her. These bullies are making me feel really sorry for Sam, she didn't kill Jublia's baby, you losers! Someone should have backed that witch right off the set.

 

One doesn't have to feel sorry for Juelia to see that almost everything that comes out of Sam's mouth is a lie.  People don't go on vacationS together unless they are friends, and she even denied they're friends.  She said if she had known what Joe/Juelia dynamic was she wouldn't have gone after him.  Blarney.  She wouldn't listen.  It's not incumbent on her to NOT try to snag him anyway but she shouldn't pretend she wished she'd known and then she would have acted differently.

 That BOOK of over 600 text messages was a beautiful indicator of the quality of truth out of that woman's head.  "A few text messages."  

 

  I can't stand that blond co-host either, but she spoke for me -- not that Samantha HAD to be like her and stay away from a friend's love-interest but that she denied EVERYthing about the circumstances in ORDER to go after him (and then held him culpable alone for the 'drama').

 

 She came on, knowing he had told others they had almost 700 text messages ("and some phone calls" -- which she denied but I now believe Joe more than I believe her) and yet still tried to get the audience to believe she was bewildered and sort of victimized by circumstances because they had only traded a few text messages.  Faced with the book, she then had to 'admit' her error in lying about it (not knowing there would be proof like this being shown).

   

  She comes off incredibly cold until she has reason to feel sad for herself (as she did at the end when exposed).

 

  Sad that even the bartender was bewitched by her.

Edited September 1, 2015 by pitchy

[call me ishmael]

Even though I still don't really care for Samantha I have to agree with this. I found myself getting very irritated with that Jenny what ever her name is lady. I mean really whatever happened to polite manners. She wouldn't even let her speak for goodness sake. Rude ass woman. You know what's ironic though. She probably thought she was speaking for everybody and they would think she was some bad ass woman for giving Samantha the third degree like that but in my book she actually probably gained sympathy for Samantha with the rude way she treated her. They need to get rid of this woman and put her behind the wall permanently!

I think that the co-host only has two modes: super sympathetic and attack. She really is silly. Last week she was telling Joe that she believed Samantha and that it was all his fault.

[pitchy]

I'm starting to really wonder about Jared. There just appears to be nothing there.

Samantha really? Making the co host leave? Surprised she didn't pull her tissue, sniff sniff, trick. A www Chris she was mean, boo boo, make her leave. Whatever.

Super duper pleased that I didn't have to see Kris Jenner. I have zero tolerance for all things Kardashian.

[The editor keeps erasing my line feed after the quoted post, and I remember the moderators don't like seeing the resulting single-space, so this is my third try at separating the comment from the quote.]

Jared was being asked to laugh along with the others -at- Ashley I, and he wasn't comfortable about that.  I actually like that.  Didn't do the Hang with the Cool Kids thing that this crowd is.

 

Samantha.  Right.  She clearly is used to having things her way, and that demand was amazing and I was disappointed in Chris H that he allowed it except that he then pulled one over on Samantha by not having Jenny truly leave.  Sam wants to tell her story without anyone having a chance or time to rebut her series of lies.  This gal lives in a world she creates and believes that her reality will be everyone else's also and they'll see it her way (as long as no one is there to argue with her).

 

Am with you on Kardashian too.  I've never watched the show because the magazine and newspaper stories are such a turn off.  The Celebration of no-talent.

I did think this After Hours show was lively but felt sorry for the gal who took Kris Jenner's place, since she was so uncomfortable and felt she had to entertain.

Edited September 1, 2015 by pitchy

[Jodio]

If Samantha's antics on the show tonight didn't expose her as the ultimate drama queen and liar, I don't know what will. They should have told her that if she didn't want to be on the same stage as the idiot co-host, then she could go home. Bitch would have changed her tune really quickly to get on tv. Also, I'm pretty sure that all her magical powers came from her alien blue contact lenses because she wasn't wearing them tonight and she wasn't bewitching anyone. I wish they would have called her out on her lie about being friends with Jueblia by showing "proof of vacation" and then played the prolonged footage of the hot tub hand job. With the volume turned way up and big ole closed captioning, to make sure that nothing was missed by the audience. And then spent the rest of the episode asking her things like "what exactly were you doing to Joe when he said 'yeah, right there?'" How do you feel now about giving that redneck asshole a handy on national tv?

 

When Kris Kartrashian was talking about her allergic reaction, I really wish they would have shown a pic of when her lip was freakishly swollen in the Dominican Republic episode. Just because that was awesome.

 

Kardashley's outfit was horrific and Jerod is so boring that zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz..........

[ramble]

I want a copy of the Book of Text Message Truth. I think it should become a Bachelor Nation sacred text & be displayed under glass in the mansion.

Jared managed to still be boring on this show. I did however appreciate that he didn't join in the mean girl laughing at Ashley I. I'll take off a few snooze points just for that.

Chris, the grown ass man, is retiring? Say it ain't so! I've always enjoyed him & his weird ability to get girls to drop their drawers. He also has usually seemed sort of in on the joke which I like. Can't he become a Bachelor Emeritus? Keep his name on the letterhead & he's free to show up at functions as he so chooses.

[Andromeda]

I really, really don't like having these cast members on as guests. I spend all my time trying to read between the lines and figure out whether they're still with X or broken up with Y or whatnot. It veers too close to spoiler territory. We can't really ask Jared what he thinks of Ashley NOW, because he can't tell us. I did notice they ignored each other at the end when the all the guests came out, but that might have been by design, so as not to spoil us. Ashley's outfit was horrific -- she kept adjusting the gaping boob straps to make sure there wasn't a nip slip, and her butt actually looked big in the thin white fabric. A fashion misstep this time, Ashley.

 

Samantha...ugh, I HATED that they allowed her to kick off the other host. WTH was that all about!? Excuse me, but no. It wasn't funny, or kosher, or proper or right. It's her show, too, isn't it? Isn't she the co-host? Why does Samantha get the kid-glove treatment? Samantha is so trying to rehab her image, and I just am so over the Sam/Joe/Juelzia drama, I don't care.

 

But why didn't anyone ask her about why she so suddenly dumped Joe in favor of Dan?! That's just as cold as all the text-message lying drama.

Edited September 1, 2015 by Andromeda

[pitchy]

I am sorry that Chris B is retiring from the franchise, because I've always found him entertaining.  He strikes me as a good guy with a big heart.  His hometown visit was one of my all time favorites.  Loved his nice, warm, supportive family.

 

Chris B made his bad rep with Bachelor Pad when he bedded two and tried to get another one while saying very disrespectful things about them (something about turning in a convertible for a better model) while the gals were into him and believing of course he was into them.

 

  He has an engaging smile, but when drunk he is one sour, dark guy, and it's sad because he actually IS attractive.  But his schtick was cynicism and a kind of gloating over his conquests and openly enjoying fooling them.

 

  I did enjoy his weird time with Elyse (sp?) and it was interesting to hear him say that she was a great ("wonderful"?) gal and then implied that she had let him go.  Interesting since she seemed to be into making him as comfy as possible (like a baby).  I'd hoped that one would work out for him.

ADDED LATER:  The gal he treated badly was Jaime.

Chris has released a long statement about his retirement from reality TV and in it he apologizes to Jaime.  (And everyone else.)  Interesting read !

 http://www.rantnow.com/2015/08/31/no-bs-with-bukowski-my-retirement-letter-from-the-bachelor-franchise-and-my-apology/

Edited September 1, 2015 by pitchy

[Kbilly]

Ashley I had the smoothest chest I've ever seen--it was like the fake skin fabric in an ice-skating costume! Knowing her, she probably has chest foundation or something! The pantsuit was horribly unflattering for her butt. Jared and Ashley were really ignoring each other I couldn't tell if that was not to tip us off or if it's just that awkward between them.

 

Jaclyn's line about the "Jobless Dad Athletic Trainer Convention" was so mean and accurate.

 

I don't know if Jared's snobby, dull, or a complete space cadet.

 

It's so weird how he doesn't react to things. Like complete straight face, no breaking.

[MsTree]

Whether Samantha was right or wrong, guilty or not, she should have been allowed to speak without interruption. If you're a co-host, you allow your guest to "get it all out" and THEN you can "attack". Sam knew Jenny was going to attack her the second she uttered one word, so I don't blame Sam for asking her to leave. It was obvious that's all Sam wanted was the courtesy of telling her side without interruption...because Sam had no problem with Jenny coming back to cross examine her after that.

[pitchy]

Whether Samantha was right or wrong, guilty or not, she should have been allowed to speak without interruption. If you're a co-host, you allow your guest to "get it all out" and THEN you can "attack". Sam knew Jenny was going to attack her the second she uttered one word, so I don't blame Sam for asking her to leave. It was obvious that's all Sam wanted was the courtesy of telling her side without interruption...because Sam had no problem with Jenny coming back to cross examine her after that.

 

 

If so, ALL Samantha had to do was say she wanted to be able to finish her statement before being questioned.  NOT demand that a co-host leave.  That was ludicrous.

 

  She 'allowed' Jenny back on because she was now visible to the world and always wants to look like the non-drama good person.

[JudyObscure]

I want a copy of the Book of Text Message Truth. I think it should become a Bachelor Nation sacred text & be displayed under glass in the mansion.

Ramble, will you accept this rose?

To me the thing with Samantha is not whether or not she's lying, because who knows? Jublia was telling everyone how hard Joe pursued her one day after he asked the crowd who would go on a date with him and she had to volunteer twice before he admitted to hearing her. On the other hand they may have actually been besties and Sam doesn't even know what that means. She is truly a dim bulb who can go an entire season without speaking and then this time, when she does speak, rarely make sense. She and Dan ("Ashley was projecting last night") would make a good partnership, using words and ideas they don't understand. So yeah, Sam is dumb and self-centered and maybe a liar, too. But...

What makes me mad is the way the show has used her. I think a lot of what happened

was producer manipulated whether Sam was aware of it or not. Starting with sending her picture and phone number to every guy and then bringing her in late when all of them would be "wifed up." I'm sure she was encouraged if not ordered to go right in and use her date card on Joe, then the show got to give us endless footage of the crying Juelia and the group outrage. I imagine she has had tons of hate mail since she got home, after all she made the widowed single mother cry!

So, I expect when Harrison called to ask her to be on After Paradise she said, no way, she was done with show business and she knew she couldn't hold her own with articulate Jenny. So CH would have promised that Jenny just wouldn't be on the set during her interview, just as Jenny wasn't there when Nick was on. Then, to Sam's surprise, CH makes a big deal of it, telling Jenny she had to leave in front of everyone and next, double crossing Sam by letting Jenny come back in, guns firing. Jenny then proceeds to over talk and dominate a woman who is only half as smart and already hated by the fans.

I always watch this trash fest feeling like everyone involved knew what they were getting in to but not so much now. That bullying set-up plus Jared's admirable refusal to take part in laughing at Ashley made me feel a little ashamed of myself for being a part of the audience.

[yorklee2]

Ramble, will you accept this rose?

To me the thing with Samantha is not whether or not she's lying, because who knows? Jublia was telling everyone how hard Joe pursued her one day after he asked the crowd who would go on a date with him and she had to volunteer twice before he admitted to hearing her. On the other hand they may have actually been besties and Sam doesn't even know what that means. She is truly a dim bulb who can go an entire season without speaking and then this time, when she does speak, rarely make sense. She and Dan ("Ashley was projecting last night") would make a good partnership, using words and ideas they don't understand. So yeah, Sam is dumb and self-centered and maybe a liar, too. But...

What makes me mad is the way the show has used her. I think a lot of what happened

was producer manipulated whether Sam was aware of it or not. Starting with sending her picture and phone number to every guy and then bringing her in late when all of them would be "wifed up." I'm sure she was encouraged if not ordered to go right in and use her date card on Joe, then the show got to give us endless footage of the crying Juelia and the group outrage. I imagine she has had tons of hate mail since she got home, after all she made the widowed single mother cry!

So, I expect when Harrison called to ask her to be on After Paradise she said, no way, she was done with show business and she knew she couldn't hold her own with articulate Jenny. So CH would have promised that Jenny just wouldn't be on the set during her interview, just as Jenny wasn't there when Nick was on. Then, to Sam's surprise, CH makes a big deal of it, telling Jenny she had to leave in front of everyone and next, double crossing Sam by letting Jenny come back in, guns firing. Jenny then proceeds to over talk and dominate a woman who is only half as smart and already hated by the fans.

I always watch this trash fest feeling like everyone involved knew what they were getting in to but not so much now. That bullying set-up plus Jared's admirable refusal to take part in laughing at Ashley made me feel a little ashamed of myself for being a part of the audience

Again I have to agree with you Judy. Yes Samantha is a manipulative, self-centered woman who deserved to be questioned for her actions but not in the way the co-host did it. I agree that with the way this show works at least a part of this Sam/Joe/Juelia drama had to be producer driven. When Chris told the co-host she had to leave at Samantha's request my first thought was, "you've got to be kidding me, she really is delusional that she thinks she deserves this special treatment" I understand the co-host wanted to get in the tough questions but she should have allowed Samantha to have her say and then asked her next question. I'm sure many people liked the way she dove in to Samantha like that but I feel she would have been more effective if she had just used common manners. Her approach in my opinion had the opposite effect of what she was trying to achieve. I was waiting any minute for them to bring in the bonfire and the stake. At any rate I'm really over this done to death Sam/Joe/Juelia drama. A little drama is interesting too much is overkill.

Edited September 1, 2015 by yorklee2

[Bugs Meany]

If so, ALL Samantha had to do was say she wanted to be able to finish her statement before being questioned.  NOT demand that a co-host leave.  That was ludicrous.

 

I recall(?) that on a previous episode CH said something to the effect of "let him/her finish" and Jenny interpreted that as "Cut them off 5 words later than you usually do." She would never have let Sam finish a statement.

[yorklee2]

Interesting article I found on Wetpaint with Ashley I upset about the show's editing. She confirms what we already knew about how the show does "selective" editing and clears up some questions about her giving Jared her rose after he had told her he wasn't into her. If anyone would like to read it here's the link.

 

http://www.wetpaint.com/ashley-iaconetti-jared-haibon-bachelor-in-paradise-letter-1437031/

 

Also read another article where she states on her twitter page the outcome of the fantasy suite date but don't want to post spoilers for those who would rather wait. But I will say that I was pleased with the outcome.

Edited September 1, 2015 by yorklee2

[saber5055]

I can only stand to watch this show in small parts, but the parts I did catch ... wow. When that gigantic white BUTT came onto the set and filled my tv screen, I was all like WHAT? Who the freak? And it turned out to be AshleyI! But (heh) when she turned around and revealed her reveal front, I was even more like WHAT? She kept pulling on it like she didn't trust the 500 rolls of double-sided tape wardrobe had to use to get it to stay put and not do a Miley Cyrus on live tv. 

 

Then I caught some of Chris B's retirement speech. Yeah, it went long and I didn't listen to the entire thing, but the one item that caught my attention, because it applies to EVERYONE on this franchise:

 

"I WAS ADDICTED TO REALITY TV."

 

And that pretty much sums it all up for me, and even explains why single moms repeatedly come on this show.

Edited September 1, 2015 by saber5055

[CindyBee]

Then I caught some of Chris B's retirement speech. Yeah, it went long and I didn't listen to the entire thing, but the one item that caught my attention, because it applies to EVERYONE on this franchise:

 

"I WAS ADDICTED TO REALITY TV."

 

And that pretty much sums it all up for me, and even explains why single moms repeatedly come on this show.

 

I love that Chris B finally admitted what we've known all along, that once you get a taste of "fame" you are addicted to it and are willing to do just about anything to get back on TeeVee.  See Nick Viall as exhibit #1.  Clare as #2 and so on.

 

Maybe now that he is "retired", he'll find a nice girl and settle down.  Nah, no chance at that as he's already probably trolling Reality Steve's site, waiting for Steve to release the names/pics of Ben's ladies and will be ready to pounce once they get elminted come October/November.

[Padma]

Personally, I never have seen any appeal to Chris B so hasta la vista, glad to see you go! (Only I don't actually believe he'll go.)

 

Wasn't much of a Jerod fan on this season, but I had new respect for him last night for not mocking Ashley I for her letter--such an easy easy thing to do. I would personally be creeped out (then irritated) to have someone that delusional and obsessed with me, but he seems to have handled it very well, even patiently. Probably a nice guy, just unsuited to the role BiP wants him to fill (Ashley I , on the other hand, is perfect for it.)

[leighdear]

I posted a link to Chris B's "retirement" explanation over in  the media thread. 

[Phoenix]

Every time I see Chris, I remember him running on the beach towards the ocean with some girl (on one of the past Bachelorette or Bachelor Pad shows) and what an unappealing sight that was to see.  He was so uncoordinated and odd looking with his arms askew... and with such a strange non-athletic gait going on.   

[Alapaki]

I love that Chris B finally admitted what we've known all along, that once you get a taste of "fame" you are addicted to it and are willing to do just about anything to get back on TeeVee.  See Nick Viall as exhibit #1.  Clare as #2 and so on.

 

 

I assume that was written for them by the show, as part of the general "let's start shitting on the contestants" shift in the franchise.

 

I think the reason I don't care for Chris Harrison anymore has finally crystallized for me, thanks to this show.

 

I think originally Chris H. tended to hold himself above the contestants.  He was on the show, but not of the show.  And on the rare occasions when he actually poked fun at the contestants for thinking they're still the "cool kids", it was in the snarky way that we might do here.

 

But somewhere along the line, I think Chris H. started getting high on his own supply.  I think that now he feels that he's one of the cool kids and when he's making fun of them now it's because he simply thinks he's the coolest one of all.

[backformore]

What makes me mad is the way the show has used her. I think a lot of what happened

was producer manipulated whether Sam was aware of it or not. Starting with sending her picture and phone number to every guy and then bringing her in late when all of them would be "wifed up." I'm sure she was encouraged if not ordered to go right in and use her date card on Joe, then the show got to give us endless footage of the crying Juelia and the group outrage. I imagine she has had tons of hate mail since she got home, after all she made the widowed single mother cry!

 

Yeah, And I think the concept needs to be re-worked.   New people coming in have the choice of A) picking one of the left-over people who the others don't want, whether or not you're interested in them, or B) asking someone you are interested on a date, even though someone else has "claimed"  them, and risk being seen as a heartless, evil manipulator.  

I wish that they had MORE "dates", but that some dates were shorter - not all-day excursions, but a trip to a restaurant or attraction for a few hours.  AND that they played some sort of game of chance to see who went on a date with whom - having it be more random.  Several dates can happen at the same time, instead of one long date, and the rest of the people sitting around waiting to hear about it.  The show the way it is, ends up being kind of boring.  Too many "couples"  from the start, and the people who are in a couple don't DARE think about other possibilities, so they never venture outside their comfort zone.  

Edited September 1, 2015 by backformore

[Kbilly]

I assume that was written for them by the show, as part of the general "let's start shitting on the contestants" shift in the franchise.

 

Totally agree, no way Chris wrote what he said. The worst example of the shitting on the contestants was Mikey. They cast this galoot and then poke fun at how awful he is, while he's sitting there. That was mean spirited. After Paradise has made me sympathetic for almost everyone---except Joolia.

[Ketzel]

These bullies are making me feel really sorry for Sam, she didn't kill Jublia's baby, you losers!

Am I officially going to hell when my reaction to this comment was "Hey, and even if she did, Jublia wouldn't have noticed until no one was there when she arrived for her on-camera Skype appointment?" I am, aren't I?

[Mu Shu]

Personally, I never have seen any appeal to Chris B so hasta la vista, glad to see you go! (Only I don't actually believe he'll go.)

 

Wasn't much of a Jerod fan on this season, but I had new respect for him last night for not mocking Ashley I for her letter--such an easy easy thing to do. I would personally be creeped out (then irritated) to have someone that delusional and obsessed with me, but he seems to have handled it very well, even patiently. Probably a nice guy, just unsuited to the role BiP wants him to fill (Ashley I , on the other hand, is perfect for it.)

Not only is he uncomfortable and trying not to be a dick to Ashley, some 45 yo "superfan"  dithers on about how she's never "shipped" anyone as hard as he and Ashley.    There's nothing worse than not wanting to be with someone, and having outsider carpetbaggers pressure you to get with them.    Ugh.     Why do there have to be superfans?   Can't the show just have annoying past people, like even Britt on instead? 

 

I figured they  would show Jared as an ass eventually, and am pleasantly surprised to find they have nothing on him.   He really is a nice guy who seems humble and low drama. 

 

When you're 59 like Jaclyn is, it's never a good idea to go with gray hair.   Very aging.   Glad this fugly, rehearsed hag came on late and won't be busting my TV screen on a weekly basis.    Bitchy and cute is fun, but bitchy, bitter, and having a face like Sarah Jessica Parker after getting kicked in the face by a horse is another.

[MsPH]

Every time I see Chris, I remember him running on the beach towards the ocean with some girl (on one of the past Bachelorette or Bachelor Pad shows) and what an unappealing sight that was to see.  He was so uncoordinated and odd looking with his arms askew... and with such a strange non-athletic gait going on.   

 

Yes, he walks and runs like a toddler. Strange. I think he just has very short limbs compared to his torso. Can't say I'll miss him one bit!

 

This episode was so weird! So many guests, Kris Jenner making excuses for her hangover, Samantha blackmailing CH, Joe's book of texts (Classic!), Chris B.'s nth apology and speech, stuffed raccoon... I liked how even CH was like "WTH are we doing?".

 

Jared is a sweetheart. I love how he's unwilling to make fun of Ashley. Take that, bullies!

 

Samantha is so fake. I don't send that many texts in a year, let alone 3 weeks, but for her it was "a few". She also kept saying how everyone does it, but if they did, she wouldn't have needed to lie about it in the first place. So over their boring drama.

[call me ishmael]

Ramble, will you accept this rose?

To me the thing with Samantha is not whether or not she's lying, because who knows? Jublia was telling everyone how hard Joe pursued her one day after he asked the crowd who would go on a date with him and she had to volunteer twice before he admitted to hearing her. On the other hand they may have actually been besties and Sam doesn't even know what that means. She is truly a dim bulb who can go an entire season without speaking and then this time, when she does speak, rarely make sense. She and Dan ("Ashley was projecting last night") would make a good partnership, using words and ideas they don't understand. So yeah, Sam is dumb and self-centered and maybe a liar, too. But...

What makes me mad is the way the show has used her. I think a lot of what happened

was producer manipulated whether Sam was aware of it or not. Starting with sending her picture and phone number to every guy and then bringing her in late when all of them would be "wifed up." I'm sure she was encouraged if not ordered to go right in and use her date card on Joe, then the show got to give us endless footage of the crying Juelia and the group outrage. I imagine she has had tons of hate mail since she got home, after all she made the widowed single mother cry!

 

I have no doubt that much of this is producer driven--they clearly try to figure out who the different people want to be with (I wouldn't say meet since everyone in bachelor world seems to know each other) and then try to figure out the best schedule for causing the most trouble (I'm surprised they sent Mackenzie in before Cassandra because if they had sent C in Dan would have realized that he had the best conversations with her even though he hadn't talked with her).

 

But I wouldn't get carried away with Samantha being "used" or made to do things.  I doubt that they told her she should tell Juelia that she didn't want to hear what she had to say about Joe, or what to do with Joe in the hot tub, or to claim that 600 texts were a couple, or to keep blaming everyone else for drama, and I doubt they told her to dump Joe after a chat with Dan (although I am sure they were happy about that).  I think that Samantha thought she was the star of the show and could get away with whatever she wanted.

 

I do wonder why people forget that they are going in front of cameras, being handed a huge amount of alcohol and then being edited for the purposes of Fliess and company.  But that seems true of people on all of these reality shows.  

[backformore]

GOOD LORD!!!!!   This whole thing should be a fun tropical escape, summer camp for adults, light and fun, beach, volleyball, fruity cocktails.   Instead, we get tears, backstabbing, gossip, and then on the "After"  show, an endless parade of people apologizing for their bad behavior!  Where's the fun in that?

[MsTree]

If so, ALL Samantha had to do was say she wanted to be able to finish her statement before being questioned.  NOT demand that a co-host leave.  That was ludicrous

 

As Bugs implied up thread, I seriously doubt it. Jenny was foaming at the mouth with the mere mention of Sam's name. Her rabid anticipation was akin to every View co-host who never let ANYONE finish a thought, never mind a complete sentence and explanation!

[leighdear]

TMZ had photos of Kris Jenner at a restaurant the day after she bowed out of this show, and had no puffiness from "an insect bite".  They said she lied & had some kind of lip filler disaster, so she cancelled.  Now that sounds more like it!  *LOL*

[JudyObscure]

That "insect bite," description was suspicious wasn't it?  Usually you see the little perpetrator and say, "spider bite," or "mosquito bite."  I think she didn't want to sit next to Ashley and have everyone notice that Ashley was prettier.  Then again, maybe she caught the Jennaphobia going around.  I'll bet Nick refused to be on the same set with Jenny for fear that she would bring up the old "fiancé-stuff" with Andi, thing or tell him his bracelets look girly.  They may end up with just Chris Harrison and Jenny sitting there snarking at video clips.

[Adeejay]

When you're 59 like Jaclyn is, it's never a good idea to go with gray hair.   Very aging.   Glad this fugly, rehearsed hag came on late and won't be busting my TV screen on a weekly basis.    Bitchy and cute is fun, but bitchy, bitter, and having a face like Sarah Jessica Parker after getting kicked in the face by a horse is another.

 

I was surprised to see Jaclyn on BIP, because two years ago when I saw her at Gia's funeral service, she was arm-in-arm with attorney Craig from Ali's season.  Based on her smug demeanor, I thought she had sealed the deal.

[Wings]

I just watched the latest episode this morning.  Samantha is a bold faced liar.   Jacklyn looks hard with a personality to match.  Ugh.  

 

Funny. Jaclyn was not going to relinquish her seat on the couch (closest to CH) for Ashley I. .  Good move by Ashley, she just backed up to sit down forcing her to move over!  Loved that!

 

Jared is a stellar guy.  I am interested to see how he handles his fantasy suite date.  He will be kind and Ashley will be a mess with yet another 'not right chemistry' talk.  

[OldWiseOne]

I noticed the jockeying for the prime seating also wings, well played Kardashley!

 

Another idea, have them fill out personality profiles that are then computer matched so they are initially paired sight unseen.  After a date (dinner or attraction), they are challenged to describe the person by five or so traits that have nothing to do with appearance.  The ones that win have first choice in the next round.

I really like this idea, maybe they could get eHarmony to sponsor a segment.

 

I think Samantha made the right choice, once Jenny came back Sam couldn't finish a sentence. I also had to wonder if Jenny even watches this show, after her statement about how no woman should ask a guy out if she knows another woman has been out with him / is interested in him. By those standards there would be no dates at all after the first episode.

[Padma]

I also had to wonder if Jenny even watches this show, after her statement about how no woman should ask a guy out if she knows another woman has been out with him / is interested in him. By those standards there would be no dates at all after the first episode.

That really made no sense at all in terms of this show. For it to be fun, everyone involved should feel free to go wherever "the right chemistry (or a fun opportunity to date)" leads them. If no one interesting new shows up, then stay with whomever you know. If someone interests you and its mutual, why -wouldn't- you pursue dating and a possible relationship? It's a hot and randy summer camp!   

 

I don't like Samantha and I thought her and Joe lying about their previous communication was strange. Own it,you two. And the whole "girl code"... huh? I'm positive that the phrase "girl code" never came up even once when producers were coming up with the idea for this show. "Girl code" in real life is a very nice thing. It has no place on a cheesy show like this where everyone knows from the beginning it's like playing "White Elephant" with people--and swapping partners until you find someone you really like. Any other approach and it becomes safe but boring.

 

That's what I think Clare's speech about last season's people trying on various relationships--not just strategically pairing up from the beginning--was about.  I also think it would be so much better to have everyone start out together and get winnowed down week by week. It's actually boring to have them bring on attractive people and the newcomer is stuck with only one or two choices. You can see how smug Jade & Tanner and Kirk and Carly are to be paired up---and the idea that "Jarod is taken" just because someone wants to be a couple with him is ridiculous.  (That said, I do think he accepted Ashley's date invite mainly to get away from Jaclyn).

[DEL901]

Since this has played out on screen, this isn't a spoiler..

 

Reality Steve posted a screen cap when Joe showed the text message from Samantha to the camera.  The show talked about the two where she said something like "Do whatever you can to stay" and "Don't get all wifed up".  There was a third message in that sequence that was never mentioned by Joe:  "But it's okay if you do, LOL".

 

Totally changes the meaning of the exchange and, even though she's a liar, puts me on her side in text-gate.

Edited September 5, 2015 by DEL901

[saber5055]

 I saw that TMZ episode where Jenner was busted for the lie about why she couldn't be on AP. They had photographs of her the day before and the day after, and there was nothing wrong with her face. The TMZers SAID it probably was a botox gone wrong, but IMO she bailed because ... she could. Maybe AP wasn't going to pay her enough or whatever. What? She might give credibility to BIP with her appearance? Yeah, there's that to consider as well, as hysterical as that might sound.

[Cecily]

Since this has played out on screen, this isn't a spoiler..

 

Reality Steve posted a screen cap when Joe showed the text message from Samantha to the camera.  The show talked about the two where she said something like "Do whatever you can to stay" and "Don't get all wifed up".  There was a third message in that sequence that was never mentioned by Joe:  "But it's okay if you do, LOL".

 

Totally changes the meaning of the exchange and, even though she's a liar, puts me on her side in text-gate.

 

I'm willing to give Samantha the benefit of the doubt concerning the text.

How Joe read it: "Do whatever you can to stay on the show, I don't care what, so we can meet. But don't get too close with the person you use to get to stay."

How Samantha meant it: "Do whatever you can to stay on the show, I don't care what, so we can meet. I hope you don't fall for someone else in the process, but if you do, that's okay."

 

Where she went wrong was refusing to listen to Juelia's story and sticking to her lies about not talking with Joe before the show. I see why people think she's a manipulator, but honestly I don't think she's all bad. Kind of sneaky, but not in the "OMG, what a witch!" departement.

[wonald]

I dont think editing made her dump Joe on his birthday nor made her continue to act shifty to this very day. That is all on her. She may not be the all-powerful Puppet master but she lacks empathy and compassion at the very least.

 

#UndertheJoeSpell

#AlwaystheVictim

[leighdear]

I don't think Samantha is terribly bright, and has maybe used her looks to "accomplish" things.  I don't think she's evil, but I do think things just spiraled out of control, then snowballed.  She had no idea how to handle any of it gracefully or graciously, so she retreated into confusion mode.  

[saber5055]

Who knows what TPTB told Samantha when she was asked to be on this show. She got not one word of dialogue or any screen time during Chris's season so, basically, she was a non-entity. If she wanted to be a reality tv star, she needed to "make her mark" on BIP.

 

It appears to be working.

[Padma]

I thought Joe was obnoxious and Samantha was cold and calculating, but I didn't really see anything wrong with being in touch ahead of the show and having a plan. I would be very surprised if some of the others hadn't planned a coordinated strategy ahead of time, too. There's no rule against it, so why not?  It makes sense, whether you're genuinely attracted or nto.

 

I thought what JOE did was wrong--lying outright to Juelia esp. when she's obviously a little messed up from her husband's suicide. But for Samantha to date Joe? (shrug).

 

What I -didn't- like about Samantha was the way she listened when Juelia and the others talked with her. Not an ounce of interest or empathy. More like, "WTH, why are you bothering me with this?" I think she tried for rehab on BiP (including the "death threats"--good idea, Kaitlyn II) but she's not smart enough to do it. (Funny she took out the green contacts for her re-do. Without them, and with her hair cut, she looked like Andi, but not as pretty. Not the dazzling vamp we had grown to expect in "Paradise".)

[call me ishmael]

I thought Joe was obnoxious and Samantha was cold and calculating, but I didn't really see anything wrong with being in touch ahead of the show and having a plan. I would be very surprised if some of the others hadn't planned a coordinated strategy ahead of time, too. There's no rule against it, so why not?  It makes sense, whether you're genuinely attracted or nto.

 

I thought what JOE did was wrong--lying outright to Juelia esp. when she's obviously a little messed up from her husband's suicide. But for Samantha to date Joe? (shrug).

 

What I -didn't- like about Samantha was the way she listened when Juelia and the others talked with her. Not an ounce of interest or empathy. More like, "WTH, why are you bothering me with this?" I think she tried for rehab on BiP (including the "death threats"--good idea, Kaitlyn II) but she's not smart enough to do it. (Funny she took out the green contacts for her re-do. Without them, and with her hair cut, she looked like Andi, but not as pretty. Not the dazzling vamp we had grown to expect in "Paradise".)

I think that the problem Samantha had was not the pre-planning but the conversations you mention and then the lying about the pre-planning. That is what did her in. And although she tried to claim on AP that she just got confused the shot of her basically telling Joe to lie was not helpful. On the other hand, IF there really was a scene where she checked with Juelia that they didn't show as she claimed then she got screwed by the producers. The problem is is that it is hard to tell who to believe given Juelia's tendency to exaggerate and Samantha's tendency to deny anything ever happened because she HATES DRAMA!

[Armchair Critic]

Surprise, surprise Sean and Catherine are on there. Those two would go to the opening of an envelope for this franchise.

[Shelby]

I hope The Bachelor never subjects us to Jenny Mollen again. She's awful and unwatchable.

THAT'S Miss America??? What an unremarkable woman.

[nutty1]

I thought the ending was hysterical, I love that this show makes fun of itself. And the captions under the people on After Paradise - "Not Miss America". "Bachelor Royalty".

[Armchair Critic]

Awww... Jonathan and Cassandra are so cute together

[dbell1]

I never again want to hear She Who Shall Not Be Named speak, interrupt, or screech. Go back to pie boy and leave my freaking screen.

[Armchair Critic]

That other blonde is as bad as Jenny, her jokes are falling flat

Carly you decided to go on the show knowing you would miss your brother's wedding, don't blame that on Kirk.

[ElectricCityy]

That other blonde is as bad as Jenny, her jokes are falling flat

Carly you decided to go on the show knowing you would miss your brother's wedding, don't blame that on Kirk.

Carly's gotta blame someone other than herself for that dumb ass decision. 

[Armchair Critic]

I knew Carly would be bitter and any explanation he gave wouldn't be good enough, but at least she said at the end he was a good guy. I hate to see his reputation ruined over it, even though he should have spoken up sooner to her.

Did Sean and Catherine even say anything?