S11.E08: Week 7

[poopchute]

I swear to god, Chris H seemed to be telling Kaitlyn "you slept with two guys, there's other guys here you have to sleep with to make things even."

Yeah, everybody deserves "off camera time.

something IS off this season. I wonder what the story is, because there is a lot of editing, back-pedaling, secrets, deception, unspoken stuff.

Yeah, I'm not really sure I even understand what the show is trying to feed me here. I agree that there is something weird going on that we don't know about but I don't think I follow what the show's BS explanation is. What exactly is the reason for changing everything around?

I also think it's kind of bullshit that so many things were able to happen off camera. How is that even possible? Did she literally sneak off somewhere in the middle of the night? I guess I just figured there was always some producer or camera person creepily lurking around in case someone tried to get some ass in the middle of the night.

[Bugs Meany]

It didn't appear that either [JJ] or Joe could care less.

 

Yes! That was the nicest, least competitive 2-on-1 date ever. Absolutely no animosity; no talk from JJ or Joe about wanting to win or "send the other guy home." It looked like two friends hanging out with a girl for the afternoon: no stakes, not a competition.

 

Without Clint there, JJ turned out to be a really nice guy.

 

ETA: Well, there's the cheating. Hopefully it was a one-time thing. Anyway, I think his early edit was a failed effort to get more screentime as this season's villain. I liked his easygoing friendship with Joe, and his exit was completely free of bitterness. The show was an interesting experience for him, and now it was time to get back to his life.

Edited June 30, 2015 by Bugs Meany

[Irritable]

Regardless of all the scarf-clutching, cliff-teetering drama, it broke my heart when Cupcake said "people always find it easy to say goodbye to me, and I never see it coming".  There have been variations of that same sentiment spoken by various men and women when they have been cut loose throughout the run of these shows, and every single time it makes me very sad.  I don't think those words are for show, they sound painfully real to me. 

[JenE4]

As for the 6 hour overnight alone with Shawn vs. showering time, I get there's no way to really know with this wonky editing, but I get the impression that they both happened as separate events. I thought Shawn spent the night in Kaitlyn's room after their 1:1 date, then after a different date she thought it would be a "fun idea" to go visit Shawn and Ben...but really Shawn; Ben was there because he's the roommate. So she probably was laying in bed with Shawn that night but talking to them both, until Ben takes a shower and it's like finally we get 10 minutes of alone time. I can't remember the order of the dates, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was like 1) Shawn sleeps in Kaitlyn's room; 2) Kaitlyn sleeps in Shawn and Ben's room; 3) Nick sleeps in Kaitlyn's room; 4) Shawn goes to have a talk with Kaitlyn; 5) Shawn goes to have another talk with Kaitlyn, and to him it's "expected" that he sees her every night now. Wait. But I forgot that talk 2 with Kaitlyn (#5 above) she mentioned that final 2 will meet parents and Harrison didn't (supposedly) tell Kaitlyn that until like 3 days later. So which was filmed out of context? The hotel rooms seemed to match up, so it seemed to me that both were filmed on location. Maybe the other producers told Kaitlyn that they would make it easier to just sleep with the three guys she wants to sleep with a few days earlier but Harrison wasn't around to make an official on-camera proclamation.

[kazza]

If this was the Bachelor, and one of the women acted like Shawn, she would be sent home (under the guise of leaving on her own). Oh, wait, that was Britt.

 

Thankful we had relatively little of Nick this week. Though it still cracks me up how his eyes bugged out when Kaitlyn suggested they go back to her hotel room.

 

I can't get on the Jared bandwagon. Perfectly fun guy, but I don't buy for a minute he's into Kaitlyn.

 

JJ. Think it must stand for Justa Jerk. Cheated on his wife (who was either pregnant or just had a baby if their child is now 3) and feels the need to come clean about it on national TV.

 

Joe. The new holder of the "why am I still here" baton, ceremoniously handed over by Tanner.

 

Tanner. How little we knew of you, but it was all good. Don't be a stranger.

 

Ben H. If he isn't F1, just give him The Bachelor now.

 

Chris. Oh, Chris. Didn't see the cliff-crying coming at all. And why is it when guys cry they always refer to themselves by name?

 

Ben Z. 1st runner up for next season of The Bachelor, should Ben H not be able to fulfill his duties.

 

Kaitlyn. Wow. From all jokes and bawdy humor to crying, crying, crying. In her defense, this cannot be an easy situation for even the strongest characters. Still, I could have done without the "you're freeeeeaking me out" whining.

 

All in all, a meh episode.

[Bobcatkitten]

I think the only Bachelor candidates left in this bunch are Jared and Ben H. I don't see them casting a dentist who arrived in a cupcake and fell down crying as the Bachelor. And Ben Z. is just too boring. 

[JudyObscure]

I just hope Ben Z and Tanner got to have a fun night out in Dublin before going home.  They could even have told Cupcake he could go with if he stopped crying.

 

Every time Jared and Kaitlyn are together it's like two teens  hanging out and having fun.  I hope Kaitlyn doesn't sleep with him during her fast forward tour of  sexual exploration, because  he seems too emotionally young to be played with that way.  It's bad enough that she's practically turned Shawn into a "Dateline," story.

 

Who is this woman?  Remember all the flash backs to Chris Soules's  farming job and his friends and family?  We still don't know what she does for a living -- her mother is a dance teacher so I guess she took over the little kids as a substitute one time.  There have been rumors of hairdressing but all we've seen is an obsession with her own pony tail while breaking up with Cupcake.  Was she the one who didn't really have a hometown date with Chris because of crossing into Canada or something?  It's all so weird.

[Kimmature]

I also think it's kind of bullshit that so many things were able to happen off camera. How is that even possible? Did she literally sneak off somewhere in the middle of the night? I guess I just figured there was always some producer or camera person creepily lurking around in case someone tried to get some ass in the middle of the night.

It used to be more difficult to sneak away and get one on one time, but this season it seems like most of the drama is happening off-screen. Characters change off-screen in about 2 minutes apparently (Ian and Clint), she just walks down to chat with the boys when she wants to, and Shawn apparently gets unrestricted access to her bedroom when he needs some stroking (no pun intended).   It must be working for the producers though, as ratings have certainly picked up. As a watcher I'm finding it quite a turn-off... I'm not sure how it's more entertaining to watch Shawn whining than to see the group actually doing fun things for a change, or actually showing her developing relationships rather than just showing the kissing. 

 

I do like that they're doing the fantasy suites first- that seems a more realistic way of doing it than meeting the parents when you still barely know each other.  I mostly find hometowns entertaining because the families try so hard to pretend that it's in any way a normal visit, so I'm glad that they're cutting them down a bit.  

 

Cupcake's "crying" was pretty funny- he looked like one of my kids fake crying when they were younger.  And the producer standing on the edge of the cliff with him- what was she going to do if he jumped- try and grab him by his hair?  Loved Ben Z's Bachelor interview- I'd go for him if Ben H isn't interested, or even Jared if he shaves.  

 

I'm glad that this is almost done- at least we're getting closer to BIP!

[truthaboutluv]

At this point I have to believe SadGosling slept with Kaitlyn bc he is acting like such a drag, a Stage 5 Clinger and more pathetically insecure than any of the girls who have appeared on the Bachelor ever. And  EWW to Ben H saying he could tell something happened when he got out of the shower. I hope all sharp objects and Cliffs of Moher are removed when Shawn finds out she boned Nick.

 

This exactly. It's interesting reading some comments on social media about the show where Shawn is apparently a "real man, so hot, just so desperately in love with Kaitlyn he can't help it" and Nick the creepy, weird one and yet Shawn is the one who two weeks in a row is creeping me the hell out. I can absolutely believe that Kaitlyn had sex with Shawn in San Antonio, that somehow was not caught or shown by producers, and that she told him he is the one. That being said, Shawn is not a complete idiot as far as I can tell (or maybe he is) so he must have realized there was still a show to continue filming right? Unless he thought he was that special that she would demand the show end immediately because of him.

 

That said, I can accept that the pressure and weirdness of this show can play on your emotions and if he really believed her when she told him he was the one, that certain things would be hard to take. And so if this was all about him finding out about the sex with Nick I would be slightly less judgemental though still find him a litlte over the top. However, this whole meltdown and over the top drama and reaction all started from Kaitlyn simply giving Jared the group date rose. That was it.  So once again, I have to wonder if Shawn was so clueless as to think that because Kaitlyn said what she did to him, that she would give him every group date rose, not go on any one on one's anymore and basically just be all about him, all the time? Again, did he not grasp the concept of what show he was on?

 

I also disagree about Nick lying to Kaitlyn with regards to telling the other guys what happened. He didn't, far as I could see. Yes he used the words intimate and personal but his exact comment far as I remember, was that they just hung out all night on Kaitlyn's couch and talked about a lot of things and it felt really personal and intimate to have that time. Sure, Shawn likely jumped to the conclusion they had sex because he knows what happened with him and Kaitlyn when they shared some alone time together. But I don't think we can say Nick lied to Kaitlyn and told the guys what happened.

 

And speaking of, it's interesting we never saw this alone time with Shawn and Kaitlyn but he clearly told some of the guys about it as Joe is the one who brings up Kaitlyn hanging out with Shawn for hours as well, when Nick mentioned them spending hours hanging out. So it's funny Kaitlyn seemed worried about Nick talking when she clearly didn't consider and realize that Shawn would go tell the guys about their time together where she supposedly told him he was the one.

 

This season is definitely all kinds of messy and I agree with some that this whole twist of no four hometown dates and cutting the guys quickly down from 6 to 3 was likely because the producers were having trouble convincing some to stay and the whole season had gotten really messy. Like I can definitely see someone like Ben H. being unwilling to involve his family in the season when he realized how things were going with Kaitlyn. It will be very interesting to see what happens during the MTA.

Edited June 30, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[Bugs Meany]

Who is this woman?  Remember all the flash backs to Chris Soules's  farming job and his friends and family?  We still don't know what she does for a living

 

Kaitlyn has to be the least-employed Bachelorette ever. (I won't claim that Britt, waitress and church volunteer--which is nice, but not a job--would have been much different.) Ali and Andi left their careers for the show, but they did have real careers. Ashley was a dental student, Jillian an interior decorator and Desiree, while "just" a bridal store employee, was working toward what she wanted to do. Emily, who is thought of as living on her deceased fiancé's family's dime, was listed on Brad's season as an event planner at a children's hospital, which sounds like a cool job.

 

With Kaitlyn, however, they're not even pretending that she left anything behind.

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Why didn't Production lady offer Cupcake a hanky or tissue?

Cold man, So Cold.

Chick stood there like, dry it up buddy, it's freezing up here.

[TheFinalRose]

I blame this mess of a season on the producers and Chris Harrison relaxing the rules and allowing Kaitlyn to have off camera time with the guys and allowing her to invite Nick back to the room. It's like a family of naughty teenagers with permissive parents. Not only are the contestants a suspicious mess but the broadcast is all over the place leaving us viewers dazed and confused as to what we missed, what day/week it is, and where we are in the process. 

 

The show needs its structural bones of keeping the lead separated from the goons off camera and it's episode ending rose ceremony. Half the drama is happening away from the audience and happening too early in the process and they've just lost control. Kaitlyn of all people needs the rules to save her from herself. I really really really suspect this is the work of Chris Harrison who likes the changes simply because HE is bored with his job. 

 

And where is the naked guy running across the lawn????????????????????

 

 

[Pollock]

It was 9 hours (or 1h23) pretty horrible to watch. I feel down and I'm pretty sure I shouldn't be while watching this franchise. I should feel sarcasm pouring out of me and/or warm and fluffy. If I produced that show, I would have just wanted to free everybody, the Bachelorette and the men. Go. Sorry for this, enjoy Ireland, go drink Magners until you black out so that we can put you back in a plane and never talk how we got there in the first place,

[JudyObscure]

Why didn't Production lady offer Cupcake a hanky or tissue?

Cold man, So Cold.

Chick stood there like, dry it up buddy, it's freezing up here.

She is so much like me.





[seacliffsal]

It seems that there was a lot of producer activity to just keep the season going.  I think they had to work with most of the remaining men to keep them there and brandied about promises of BiP and even the lead role of the Bachelor.  It's probably the only way they kept the numbers that they did.  Even in previous seasons when it seemed like there was a clear favorite for F1 (and F2), the producers kept the schedule the same.  Also, the way Kaitlyn kept focusing on 'they're all contenders' leads me to believe that she got a good talking to by the producers as to the contract she signed, etc.  She is so not compelling to me and every single conversation is about her, her, her.  I think the men enjoyed going to Ireland, so at least they got that.  JJ and Jonathan seem like they each were satisfied with getting to Ireland so whoever stayed on the date or went was just fine with them.  Unlike others, I don't necessarily believe JJ's cheating story (oh I'm sure he cheated somehow), but as he wasn't invested in her there would be no reason to embarrass himself like that.  As others have stated, it provided a reason for her to let him go and for him to leave.  I think the producers realized during the season that they made a real mistake with their lead (and I don't think Britt would have been any better).

[MrsRafaelBarba]

She is so much like me.





 

        LOL!

 

        She was like NOPE, having NFTG.

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Still LMAO @ Shawn being called Sad and Busted Gosling.

 

 

 

 

PRICELESS!

[b2H]

As my husband and I were watching this mess, all we could think was:

 

You folks are in Ireland - a beautiful country with so many options - and you're wasting our time with 'As the Stomach Turns' soap opera crap.

 

Sadly, when the numbers for this ep are released, we'll find they're probably the highest for the season, but really...  the thrill is gone.  They need to wrap this up and get her gone.

[MakeMeLaugh]

I was thinking of CryingGosling too, especially when I saw his blue suit at the wait, was that a rose ceremony? in the middle of the show.

Now I'm thinking, thanks to all the comments in this thread, that the famous "off camera time" to which Chris Harrison refers was more than we know, with both Nick and Shawn, and possibly lots and lots of Guinness time, and all the other guys knew about it and demanded to the producers they get their own time, so the odd "we will cut it down to three guys asap so you can equal the off camera time" idea was born. Which makes no sense. Like Show says it wants a rewind but half the guys left get screwed in the not fun way.

I also think her apology to Chris Harrison re sleeping with Nick was very odd and I thought he seemed remarkably cold to her. I wonder if she was just out of control in Ireland being the "fun one."

Edited June 30, 2015 by MakeMeLaugh

[Padma]

Shawn's possessiveness is getting into creepy territory for me. No matter what she said or did to him, it's still The Bachelorette, i.e. there are going to be other guys there until the end. Dude needs to take a chill pill or three.

 

And getting physical with Shawn while Ben H is showering in what I assume is the en-suite bathroom? After last week's sleeping with Nick with the mic on and now this, I'm starting to wonder if Kaitlyn has an exhibitionist streak.

"Exhibitionist". That's the word I was trying to think of! I think that's exactly what she is, remembering the nude dive into the river on the camping date (so early on) with CS and all the women. There was no need for full nudity (lots of people wouldn't enjoy watching you dive naked into a river either, but that didn't stop her at all--if others were uncomfortable with it). I think she's crude, an exhibitionist and apparently pretty promiscuous, too (I use it not because she had sex with Shawn, but because when she had sex with Shawn she apparently lied to him about being "the One" and "in love", but either (1) lied and/or (2) didn't feel the same about him as soon as some other guy showed up that she could test drive and/or (3) she takes the phrase "I'm in love with you" very, very casually even when she can see that the man she's with doesn't, and is very serious about it.

 

ITA with those upthread who're amazed how little we know about Kaitlyn (or, for that matter, the guys). Really after all this time I can't remember ever hearing her talk about Canada, her life there, her family, any life experiences or interests that she has...zilch (and, no, she's obviously NOT a hairdresser or a dance teacher. What, exactly, -does- she do for a living?) And I've never seen her have much conversation with the men either, other than whatever sad backstory they've volunteered, I don't know anything about them either.

 

Maybe she's not just an exhibitionist, but also a narcissist. Ian was rude, but I can't honestly say that he was wrong (and since his speech came in San Antonio, I'll bet he knew full well about Shawn's "overnight" with her and (second event, imo) whatever happened in the room during Ben's shower--perhaps heard about it from Shawn's roommate Ben H (I'd talk about it, wouldn't you?) And then her reaction to Shawn coming over was, again, all about how inconvenient it was for her to have to deal with him and his feelings.

 

For all the s*it that Juan Pablo got for being disinterested in Andi (accd to her) after sex, or how his time with Clare--so meaningful to her--had the feeling of just another one night stand to him...I think Kaitlyn is acting ten times worse on her season. She just smiles more and is more articulate, but just as self-centered and vapid.

[LakeGal]

I did notice the birds they showed when we first saw the cliffs.  I remembered Kaitlyn's fear of birds.  I was waiting to have a bird fly at her and we would be treated to Kaitlyn running around hysterically in circles on the cliff with Cupcake chasing after her and the bird.  Now that would have been entertaining.  Instead Kaitlyn decides to dump Cupcake early and he cries into his scarf.  

 

I think Kaitlyn fell for Shawn early.  Everyone with the show saw it.  They brought Nick on to try and upset the happy couple. That gave them the Shawn vs Nick storyline.  The other guys had to be coaxed to stick around when they all knew they were not the one.  Some wanted to audition for the next Bachelor.  Others were just bored and wanted to leave. That is the only explanation for this mixed up editing.  

[CindyBee]

It seems that there was a lot of producer activity to just keep the season going.  I think they had to work with most of the remaining men to keep them there and brandied about promises of BiP and even the lead role of the Bachelor.  It's probably the only way they kept the numbers that they did. 

 

I agree that:

 

1. Plane tickets to Mexico to meet Jade and company were dangled in front of a bunch of the guys to keep them on the show; the fact that Tanner's good bye bit wasn't even shown probably means that they couldn't even get him to fake being sad.  He probably was like "see you in Mexico"!

 

2. Lots of off-camera talk to the Bens and probably Cupcake that you are in the running for the Bachelor to keep them from jumping ship too

 

And put me on the list that believes she totally slept with Shawn in San Antonio and that's why she's so freaked out that he'll find out about Nick.   What a freakin mess.

Edited June 30, 2015 by CindyBee

[CaughtOnTape]

Kaitlyn is a bitch.

 

Plain and simple.

 

Goes to Shawn to tell him he's the one and then when he develops expectations based on that information she pulls the "Whoa, whoa, whoa....we're not a couple!" bullshit.  Seriously?  

 

Spare me the crocodile tears, Hun.  Her "I live in the moment" shit is code for "I hurt people because I don't think before I speak" so she doesn't have to be held responsible for anything she does.  If I was Shawn after hearing her say that crap about giving him too much reassurance, I'd have gotten up and walked out.  OF COURSE he's confused and doesn't get why it is she's so affectionate towards other guys, she pretty much told him she'd chosen him.  

 

Ugh.....she's a moron and that pains me to say because I really liked her on Chris' season.

[leighdear]

Do we absolutely know the guys shared rooms in San Antonio?  If CryinGosling and Ben H. had adjoining rooms with a shared door, then Kaitlyn could have hooked up with CryinGosling in privacy after their date. The next day she chats with both of them with the door open as they get ready to leave for Ireland.  Ben goes to shower, Kaitlyn drops the "You're the One" on Shawn, then Ben comes back and sees the attitude change. 

 

I just don't get how else Kaitlyn could spend 6 hours on/in/under Shawn's bed in S.A.   

[StatMom]

Let's see if I've got this right. ... [a plausible explanation of what may be happening on this trainwreck of a show]

Thank you! I was also glad to hear that others had issues in following the storyline this season; I couldn't tell if it was just me. So many times I have shouted "WHAT is that all about? Why don't they show us all this?!?" The interviews that are out of order only confuse the issue more. Between this and Domer, I've been concerned that my brain is dissolving.

[ElectricCityy]

I really have to fault Kaitlyn for sneaking down to Busted!Gosling and Ben's room and claiming it was a "sweet gesture" when she really only wanted to visit Busted!Gosling. And then having sex with him or telling him he's the one once the coast was clear. What a user. Shame on her for putting Ben (another guy she is supposed to be dating) in that situation. She should've eliminated him when he gave her an out to do so. Why is she keeping this poor guy. I feel bad for him and Jared (who is also oblivious).

Edited June 30, 2015 by ElectricCityy

[slowpoked]

Whoever had reassurance, question/questioning, and/or hard/hardest as their buzz words for their drinking game last night, I hope y'all didn't have a bad hungover.

[Primetimer]

The Bachelorette crew continues to sully the green hills of Ireland. What parts, if any, are worth watching?

Read the story

[TiaLou]

I haven't watched any of this season until last night, when I managed about 15 minutes before turning off the TV.

 

My first impression of Kaitlyn during Chris's season was negative -- I really didn't like the raunchy act on the first evening. But then I came around to thinking that she was kind, relaxed, non-drama, and I thought she could pull off her own season pretty well.

 

But all the comments from y'all on this board have convinced me otherwise, and my brief foray into the pit last night was the nail in the coffin.

 

Poor Shawn is a meathead but dude deserved a little more from Kaitlyn -- I thought she was pretty cold to him.

 

I wonder if all this sort of off-camera stuff goes on *every* season, they just never show it to the viewers. It would make sense that there's a lot more visiting than we usually see, since they must get to know each other better than just spending time during the dates that are recorded. I guess TPTB figured they'd rip the curtain down for this season.

 

And they must HATE Kaitlyn. She is being portrayed in a terrible light.

[anony mouse]

There must have been a ton of crap from Kaitlyn behind the scenes to cause the show to throw out the entire framework of hometowns and the fantasy dates. Chris Harrison didn't seem too pleased with her.

If I were Nick, I also wouldn't be pleased with how she straight up said she expected him to run his mouth to the guys. You can see a flash of real emotion on his face there where you can tell he is upset, before he decides instead to reassure her. I would have put her on blast, particularly since it never seems to have occurred to her that Shawn might be running his mouth (and apparently has). I don't think Nick lied, but I think using intimate in both conversations would make it look that way until you see the context (it was an intimate conversation and date, very real, personal etc. vs I did not tell the guys we were intimate). Nick was trying to be less crass and used intimate for sex, where he previously used it as an adjective to describe their date.

Ben H gave her a very gentle opening to let him go, as he could see the writing on the wall and for whatever reason she didn't take it and decided to double down on them all "having potential." Not the brightest, is she? Even Cupcake had a few good points about her behavior before his overwrought audition to be the next Bachelor.

How many guys is it now who have said she's basically not there for the right reasons? Four? Five? This season sucks and not even in a funny way. I really wish they had picked Britt.

[FamilyVan]

I think Kaitlyn fell for Shawn early.  Everyone with the show saw it.  They brought Nick on to try and upset the happy couple. That gave them the Shawn vs Nick storyline.  The other guys had to be coaxed to stick around when they all knew they were not the one.  Some wanted to audition for the next Bachelor.  Others were just bored and wanted to leave. That is the only explanation for this mixed up editing.

 

 

Yes - this is exactly what I was thinking.

 

I think that Kaitlyn has been all about Shawn from the beginning, and the other guys know it.  She told him he was the one, and he blew it by saying this on camera.  These people should know that everything they say is being picked up by a mic or being filmed covertly.  You cannot hide, you cannot whisper.  You cannot send each other secret messages.  I think the "mistake" she made was spoiling the show and then she had to backtrack and say how she is really developing many relationships and falling in love with everyone per the script.  She covered this under the guise of "encouraging him" too much. But really she slipped up and nearly ruined the entire guise of the show.  The last time she was with Shawn in the hotel room she was like mouthing something to him and his expression registered that he heard it.  The other guys know what's up and that is why they are bailing like it's the Titanic and this is why they had to mix up the format.  Nick is there as an actor and is there to play a role so he will be the one to go along with being the F2 since no one else will and it's not fair to them.

[atlanticslide]

It seemed like Kaitlyn really liked Ben Z at first, and then nothing. I think the reason it is hard to follow her likes and dislikes for me is we don't see any of the usual cocktail party stuff with her having conversations with the various guys. It seems like weeks in between her actually having conversations with some of the guys (to us viewers of course, not IRL).

 

Yeah, that's definitely something that's lacking this season. Her whole time with Cupcake I kept thinking, "C'mon, dude, you've had no screentime! She is definitely leaving you behind on those cliffs," and then wondered what we've been missing of their time together that's convinced him that she was definitely going to come home to meet his family.

 

That said, while it's definitely been a weird season, I'm still really enjoying it, and I still like Kaitlyn, and Shawn, despite his melodrama - I like seeing someone actually calling out how weird this whole thing is and how difficult it really is to develop a relationship and have serious feelings for someone and have to watch them go out with other people and make polite conversation with a dozen other guys about their own relationships with her.

[ramble]

Whoever had reassurance, question/questioning, and/or hard/hardest as their buzz words for their drinking game last night, I hope y'all didn't have a bad hungover.

Add really to the list as well. I counted four reallys from Kait in one average length sentence. Now I'm going to be overly conscious when I use the word.

I can't believe how much I miss the cocktail parties. At least I miss the normal ones where the guys sell who they are & state their points for staying & you get to observe non-crying interactions. I agree with y'all that with the way this season has gone we know very little about anyone. I'm really, really over this season. I'm going to sing Almost Paradise in my head & make a countdown calendar for BIP.

[CalamityBoPeep]

This season is definitely all kinds of messy and I agree with some that this whole twist of no four hometown dates and cutting the guys quickly down from 6 to 3 was likely because the producers were having trouble convincing some to stay and the whole season had gotten really messy. Like I can definitely see someone like Ben H. being unwilling to involve his family in the season when he realized how things were going with Kaitlyn. It will be very interesting to see what happens during the MTA.

 

All I can come up with, to explain the weirdness, for myself, is that the producers must do a lot of behind the scenes prep work with the contestants somewhere around the final 6-8 point, to get ready for the standard 4 hometown dates.  I'll bet that gives each of the final 6, 7, or 8  some hope that it will be them, and you end up with things like Britt having a meltdown thinking about getting her family involved in this.

 

So, my fanwank is that the producers went to a lot of the guys saying "we need to come up with a plan for your potential hometown... no guarantees that it's you, but we need a plan." And 4 or 5 guys were all "oh, hell, no.  I'm not bringing my family into this mess... not going to happen."  At which point, the producers were left scrambling, and were stuck with just 2 potential family visits.  

I read somewhere that Kaitlyn's filming had to be delayed, like a week, during filming, right?  That probably happened right about this point in the filming.

 So, I imagine now that the producers had to figure out another plan in a hurry, and it took a little while.  "Ok, you won't involve your family... would you be willing to sleep with her, though?  Have a fantasy date?"  To which contestants are "Meh.... ok, sure. I could do that."

 

Which then leads to Chris Harrison's little "level the playing field" thing.  Subtext:  "Look, Kaitlyn, you've f-ed this season up so much, you owe us.  We had to promise you'll put out with the rest to get them to stay.  Pick your poison."

Honestly... that's kind of creepy, but it's all I've got.  

Now I need a shower.

Edited June 30, 2015 by CalamityBoPeep

[Alapaki]

There must have been a ton of crap from Kaitlyn behind the scenes to cause the show to throw out the entire framework of hometowns and the fantasy dates. Chris Harrison didn't seem too pleased with her.

 

 

I really agree with this.  When you think of the logistics and pre-planning that go into preparing four (presumably) separate film crews to film hometown dates at four separate locations (along with the attendant bullshit phony "family homes" we sometimes see and the manufactured socialization) there must have been something significant going on to force TPTB to completely rework the format.

 

And the sit-down with Chris was truly bizarre.  It was sort of like the bizarro-Juan Pablo-sitdown.  With Juan Pablo, Chris was chiding him for not telling anyone he loved them.  With Kaitlyn, he's chiding her for telling too many people.

 

And while I disdain the slut-shaming aspect of it, I kind of loved that Chris' response to Kaitlyn "confession" about being "intimate" with Nick was like "yeah, sleeping with that leprechaun was as mistake".  As if there's no scenario in which falling in love/lust and/or sleeping with Nick Viall is a good idea.  Heh!

 

My understanding (which may be based on nothing other than the jackasses in my head) was that the Lead is not allowed to tell anyone they "love them" before the FRC, where that's presented as some sort of big "reveal".  That's why we get such stilted language as "I think I might be falling in love with you", etc.  

 

So I'm surprised that they showed Shawn asking Kaitlyn point-blank whether she loved him.  Her reaction seemed to reinforce the fact that she's not allowed to answer that question.  Shawn put her in a no-win situation there.  But TPTB could've simply not aired that particular part of the conversation.  We've been shown that question asked by family members during hometown dates (usually by over-protective fathers . . . or Des' junkie brother).  But choosing to show that question coming from Shawn, and showing Kaitlyn's non-response, was I think one more attempt by TPTB to make Kaitlyn look bad.

 

Yep.  She really pissed in Fleiss & Co's cereal.

[Alison]

I would watch Ben Z as Bachelor any time. If Ben H isn't the final rose receiver, he too would be amazing--very cool, mature yet young, funny subtle (not knock knock joke funny), tall, so good looking, so well spoken.

I'm down with either Ben for Bachelor! They're both the same age, too - I noticed during Ben Z's departure speech, the chyron at the bottom of the screen said he was 26. Oooh, maybe we can have a Battle of the Bens! (Kidding...pay no mind, Fleiss and Co.)

 

Regardless of all the scarf-clutching, cliff-teetering drama, it broke my heart when Cupcake said "people always find it easy to say goodbye to me, and I never see it coming".  There have been variations of that same sentiment spoken by various men and women when they have been cut loose throughout the run of these shows, and every single time it makes me very sad.  I don't think those words are for show, they sound painfully real to me. 

That breakup scene was really hard for me to watch. It hit a little too close to home, as I recently went through a "didn't see it coming" breakup.

Granted, this is my first time watching any show in this franchise, but I think the change of format makes sense. Would you want to meet the loved ones of someone you were dating without having been intimate with them, or, in Bachelorette parlance, "spend off-camera time" with them? In all of my serious relationships, I've never met my SO's family or friends prior to us being intimate.

[bravofan27]

Kaitlyn is one horney bachelorette. Chris Harrison is really into this idea that the show is clean and innocent, so I think he is doing damage control now trying to clean it up after the drunken hook up. I did not understand what he meant by, "you will get off camera time with the guys" unless that was the fantasy suite stuff. I took the fantasy suite dates to be first because Chris does not want Kaitlyn screwing more people on camera, so this way she can fuck around privately. You know the only reason she feels guilty and sad is because the camera crew was there.

 

It's also awesome because I'm sure Nick was feeling on top of the game because he was the only one that slept with her. Now, everyone will sleep with her or have a clear shot at it. Hahahaha.

[Crumpet]

 

My understanding (which may be based on nothing other than the jackasses in my head) was that the Lead is not allowed to tell anyone they "love them" before the FRC, where that's presented as some sort of big "reveal".  That's why we get such stilted language as "I think I might be falling in love with you", etc.

 

Right, but we know leads find ways to get around this. Ashley and JP said that she told him she loved him first (off camera presumably, and before the FS) and Claire of course asked Juan Pablo if he loved her when she knew the helicopter would drown out their audio. So it's not strange to me that Kaitlyn is having off-camera conversations with the guys...but it is surprising that the aftermath of those conversations are getting so much air time! 

 

Shawn...LOL. Do him and Kaitlyn use the same shade of spray tan? His orange face matched her's, at least.

[saber5055]

Why didn't Production lady offer Cupcake a hanky or tissue?

 

 

Leave it to me to notice the details. Kaitlyn came up with a Kleenex which she used to stick the point of into the corners of her eyes while she was fake crying. But where was the hanky for Cupcake? Show likes to give us lots of audio of snot sucking.

 

Kimmel's crew must read here, because on last night's show he showed side-by-side photos of these people with the actors who would play them in The Bachelorette: The Movie. Kaitlyn was Megan Fox, then the guys were Ryan Gosling, Matt Damon and someone else I can't remember.

[MakeMeLaugh]

...

That breakup scene was really hard for me to watch. It hit a little too close to home, as I recently went through a "didn't see it coming" breakup.

:( sorry

Granted, this is my first time watching any show in this franchise, but I think the change of format makes sense. Would you want to meet the loved ones of someone you were dating without having been intimate with them, or, in Bachelorette parlance, "spend off-camera time" with them? In all of my serious relationships, I've never met my SO's family or friends prior to us being intimate.

Good point, and why would meeting the families affect the decision of who to take to the FS? And it's really sort of mean to the fourth family--like saying the men were all equal but then ugh, his family, I had to get rid of him as soon as I met them. Hurt feelings all around. I have to say I hate the meet the family dates any way--none of these people live with their families and many live far away from them, so they really aren't part of their lives. I would almost rather have meet the best friends dates.

[anony mouse]

New thought - if F2 is meet the families of the men, when do they meet Kaitlyn's family? Do they meet her family, or has she been such a train wreck they are writing that off as well?

[Alapaki]

Right, but we know leads find ways to get around this. Ashley and JP said that she told him she loved him first (off camera presumably, and before the FS) and Claire of course asked Juan Pablo if he loved her when she knew the helicopter would drown out their audio. So it's not strange to me that Kaitlyn is having off-camera conversations with the guys...but it is surprising that the aftermath of those conversations are getting so much air time!

 

 

Sure.  My point was that we haven't (that I can recall) seen on-camera a contestant put a Lead on the spot like that, and the Lead's fumbling inability to answer.  

 

I think TPTB assume that the majority of the audience is going to be Team Shawn.  So showing Kaitlyn refuse to say she loves him, combined with (apparently) driving him to apologize to her (after she slept with Nick [even though he was upset at something else]) seems calculated to get the audience pissed off at Kaitlyn.

[pitchy]

.../

On the one hand, Shawn is putting Kaitlyn in an impossible situation by seeming to demand something from her that she cannot possibly deliver within the constructs of the show.  On the other hand, if Kaitlyn really did tell Shawn he was F1, and wants him to just chill out until they get through the taping, she's certainly not making it easy for him.

 

Right, he's doing Britt's exclusive-group-rose logic, but at least he's not saying IN FRONT of Kaitlyn AND the others that he just does not want her to meet his family if she is still considering others.  

 

  Nevertheless, he was so ANNOYing, going up to her room each time (walking in Fellini-like endless corriders)  to demand he be treated as the Only one and to not hurt him by giving a group-rose to anyone else !

 

  What was said:  BOTH Shawn and Kaitlyn said in last night's show (but especially Shawn)  that what she said was "I THINK you're the one" and later she said she had felt pressure from his need for assurance and said that much, although she said she'd sincerely -thought- so at the time.  I felt she was right that if he "couldn't do this anymore" then he wasn't the one.  

 

  I think there are some danger signals there in his intense need for constant, never-ending reassurance about being TheOne in an episode of, for God's sake, The Bachelorette.

 

 

[Alapaki]

New thought - if F2 is meet the families of the men, when do they meet Kaitlyn's family? Do they meet her family, or has she been such a train wreck they are writing that off as well?

 

 

If they had any clue what was going on, my guess is that Kaitlyn's parents were busy "misplacing" their Passports.  

 

Granted, this is my first time watching any show in this franchise, but I think the change of format makes sense. Would you want to meet the loved ones of someone you were dating without having been intimate with them, or, in Bachelorette parlance, "spend off-camera time" with them? In all of my serious relationships, I've never met my SO's family or friends prior to us being intimate.

 

 

Because the very premise of this show is to present a "real journey to true love" (drink!) through a series of interactions that have absolutely nothing to do with truly falling in love.  

 

Four hometown dates increases the chance of awkward confrontations of the Lead by family members and tears/embarrassment for the contestant eliminated that week.  

 

Three Fantasy Suite contestants creates drama for the contestant who gets eliminated that week without making the Lead appear to be sleeping around too much (I know, that's subjective).

 

And, having the hometowns before the fantasy suites creates the implied subtext of parents (especially fathers of female contestants) meeting the Lead with knowledge of what is most likely going to occur "next week".

 

Frankly, while I'm sure there are various degrees of "intimacy" (up to and including, apparently, "fiance stuff") in the fantasy suite, most contestants and Leads have said that the main benefit of the fantasy suite is that it afforded them the (only) opportunity to speak freely, off-camera and off-microphone.  That, ostensibly, was Andi's big gripe about Juan Pablo: he had no interest in anything beyond the "intimacy" during the FS.  

 

I don't mind the "no rules" approach they've been implementing, given that we're shown the "rule breaking" so we know what's what.  But this season reminds me of how frustrating those Real Housewive's franchises became when entire seasons were devoted to feuds over something that occurred off-camera which no one was apparently allowed to discuss on-camera.

[Alapaki]

So, I imagine now that the producers had to figure out another plan in a hurry, and it took a little while.  "Ok, you won't involve your family... would you be willing to sleep with her, though?  Have a fantasy date?"  To which contestants are "Meh.... ok, sure. I could do that."

 

 

Heh!  Though I think their responses were more like "That depends, I don't have to be on top, do I?"

[Alapaki]

[truthaboutluv]

Sure.  My point was that we haven't (that I can recall) seen on-camera a contestant put a Lead on the spot like that, and the Lead's fumbling inability to answer.

 

Isn't that essentially what Britt tried to do to Chris, after he gave Kailtyn the group date rose? And Chris pretty much told her that she was putting him in an impossible and uncomfortable position which he didn't appreciate. Because the fact is these people sign up for this show, it's been on long enough, they have to have some idea of what they're getting into.

 

I think there are some danger signals there in his intense need for constant, never-ending reassurance about being TheOne in an episode of, for God's sake, The Bachelorette.

 

Seriously. Shawn came across as incredibly exhausting and whiny and the fact that he's still there and Kaitlyn did not get rid of him is all the proof that he's likely who she most wants. Because if she didn't, no way she would have kept him around with that constant griping and begging for reassurance he's doing which she admitted was getting to her.

[Andromeda]

Regardless of all the scarf-clutching, cliff-teetering drama, it broke my heart when Cupcake said "people always find it easy to say goodbye to me, and I never see it coming".  There have been variations of that same sentiment spoken by various men and women when they have been cut loose throughout the run of these shows, and every single time it makes me very sad.  I don't think those words are for show, they sound painfully real to me.

Me, too, but I can't imagine it lasts very long! I imagine dozens of women tried to contact Cupcake after seeing him on the show -- he seems like a catch to me.

[FireFoxy]

My God, this season is an even bigger mess than I thought. Kaitlyn is so in over her head it isn't funny. How the tides have turned. I knew it would be a matter of time before the audience turned on her. Heh!

 

Shawn is creepy as hell. Everyone giving Nick a hard time but Shawn is a Stage 55 clinger. Psycho.

 

Ben H. for The Bachelor!

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Sad Gosling

 

Busted Gosling

 

 

Crying Gosling

 

 

 

What's next, Whiny Gosling?

 

 

Stage Five Clinger Gosling?

 

You folks are cracking me up, Thank You!