Current Plots Discussion: Actually Today's Episode

[Black Knight]

2 hours ago, DisneyBoy said:

I'm really surprised at how hard the show is pushing for Eric to forgive Nicole already. I thought they would drag this out for months with Nicole being dumped on.

Maybe they finally heard how tiresome it is to have Nicole perpetually on an Apology Tour, or AZ told them she can no longer cry for months on end, and decided to abbreviate this iteration of it.

[Silver Raven]

Nicole, please don't beg, it's not a good look on anybody.

I wish there would be a scene between Brady and Nicole where she tells him how squicky it is that he slept with Kristen when he thought it was her.

Sarah is worse than Nicole?  Because she dumped Rex?  Shall we talk about him cheating on her and having a baby with one of the other women?

[enchantingmonkey]

2 hours ago, Silver Raven said:

Sarah is worse than Nicole?  Because she dumped Rex?  Shall we talk about him cheating on her and having a baby with one of the other women?

But would you really expect Kate to be unbiased in anything that involved her children?  Unless she's the one doing the judging, of course.  

Speaking of Kate, why is she working at the Brady Pub?  Did they explain that while Jennifer was dreaming about those wacky Impeachment Hearings?  

Score a point for Brady.  I thought his explanation that Nicole lied about Mickey's paternity because of all the other obstacles that had gotten in the way of Eric and Nicole's true lurve story actually made sense.  I still think there was a good story in Sarah telling the truth, and Nicole having to watch Sarah and Eric bond over the baby's development and birth but that story probably didn't generate enough Shocking Spoilers™️ for Ron C.  

I enjoyed Gina having to pretend to be Hope and forced to deal with Jennifer's insufferable daughter and that pesky Rafe.  You just know they both leave a rotten taste in her mouth.  

Xander was super smart to play Eric's terms for an amicable custody arrangement for sympathy for himself and get a big, sloppy kiss out of Sarah.  I hope he learned a valuable lesson.  

[CanaryFan98]

20 hours ago, A.J. said:

That's happened twice that I can remember.  She vowed never to forgive him for accusing her of being a rapist.  And of course when he killed Daniel.    

Yes good point and I wish she brought this up when she fought with him.. I always notice that others encourage Eric to be angry and Nicole when she messes up but Nicole has to forgive Eric right away though... 

[CanaryFan98]

I do like Brady/Nicole's friendship and at one point I did enjoy them as a couple. However he'll never be her first choice so I rather they just stay friends. I do think they'll tease a hookup but it won't happen.

I do think this story falls flat for a variety of reasons but they dropped the ball in not involving more characters on screen for this reveal. Sure Roman/Marlena know but shouldn't they be dragging Sarah. Shouldn't someone bring up how Sarah could do this after how she handled Mickey not being her father... Nicole being a babynapper. Eric getting drunk and killing Daniel... I mean even the playing field by having an equal opportunity dragging here it makes the characters more human and likeable this way but having nobody drag Sarah for this and Nicole getting the brunt of this isn't that compelling.

[boes]

Salem, I hate to be the first to tell you, but it's not the 19th century anymore.  If you need to ease into this whole "modern 21st century world" thing by spending a little time in the 20th century first, go right ahead.  But please know that we're long past the day when biology is always the primary factor in determining family and we're also past the time when paternity trumps everything, including maternity.  In other words,

Judge ain't gonna give Eric full custody or even joint custody just to make up for Sarah not telling him that he's Mickey's father, doesn't work that way anymore, if it ever did.  Eric's sperm making it over the finish line doesn't legally obligate Sarah to do much of anything, though it would obligate Eric, at least financially, if she pursued things.  He can be angry, stomp his little feet, cry, whine and carry on all he wants, but there's nothing in the legal code about protecting Eric's feelings.

Take Xander out of the picture and it's pretty clear cut IMO that Sarah would get primary custody if Eric did put up a fuss.  He's the one with an addiction issue, he's the one who drove drunk and killed a man and he's the one who dated a woman with a penchant for elephant figurines stuffed with stolen diamonds.  Sarah, to my knowledge, just has piss poor taste in men.  

Poor baby Eric was pushing that stoller so fast I'm surprised Mickey didn't bounce right out.  It's a bit disconcerting to see Brady being the one talking sense to him, but there it is.  And it's a bit sad that Nicole is still so damaged that she thinks this stutterbarking wet blanket of a manbaby is the best she can do.  

Xander didn't do himself any favors, though, when his parting words to Sarah were about remembering to say the This Little Piggy poem to Mickey every night before her bath.  He better be careful or he's going to end up as wet as Eric.

What's with Marlena and her constant hoot owl calls now?   

One thing that Abigail should be grateful for - as long as Eric or Ciara are onscreen, she is no longer the most annoying Salem resident.

Edited December 6, 2019 by boes

[Frozendiva]

Eric, sure Nicole didn't tell you that Sarah's baby was yours. It was not her place to do so. You also know that Nicole is insecure about almost anything to do with you. Be mad at her, but direct your anger toward Sarah. She seems very happy with Xander as the baby's 'daddy' - so grow up, read your Bible to learn about forgiveness, work out shared custody. Whining at your age is not a good look. The fact is that Nicole can do a whole lot better than you and if Sarah wants your whining, Nicole will be glad to give you to her.

Kate must have a small fortune tucked away in order that she can wait tables at the Brady Pub. Surely Saxons or whatever new restaurant there is can use a well-heeled hostess.

Why is Jennifer still connected to the blood pressure thing? Shouldn't she be walking around by now so that she won't tie up a hospital bed?

Since when did Abigail become some sort of investigative reporter? She was doing a poor job at PR or whatever she did last. She could also go to the Spectator and look at the stories done on Jennifer's fall. Wouldn't Hope/Gina have taken out any evidence that could incriminate her? HoGina needs to worry more about Jennifer regaining her memory. And that people are starting to see that she hasn't been herself in a while. Only Kate noticed and said it wasn't unusual.

Sarah, you do have terrible taste in men, but the fact is that Salem men are on the terrible scale so it's a matter of what terrible on a scale of 1-10 you can tolerate.

[WendyCR72]

1 hour ago, boes said:

Judge ain't gonna give Eric full custody or even joint custody just to make up for Sarah not telling him that he's Mickey's father, doesn't work that way anymore, if it ever did.  Eric's sperm making it over the finish line doesn't legally obligate Sarah to do much of anything, though it would obligate Eric, at least financially, if she pursued things.  He can be angry, stomp his little feet, cry, whine and carry on all he wants, but there's nothing in the legal code about protecting Eric's feelings.

I want to agree. But soaps don't deal with reality well. Been around 13 or 14 YEARS now, but I still feel rage when thinking of the custody battle that GH had between Alexis and Ric over then-baby (now in her 20s, go figure! Ah, SORAS!) Molly. Ric chained a pregnant woman (granted, it was Carly) to a wall and other heinous shit...and he was awarded custody because - Alexis had CANCER.

See? Rage blackout!

I expect nothing better here. Still wish Mickey could be retconned as Xander's. I'll say it: Xander was a slimy homicidal kook, but I still like him more than Eric, who I am fast approaching HATE territory with. Bleah.

[TenaciousWarrior]

I enjoyed the Jennifer/Marlena scenes. I like it when 2 people who don’t normally interact share scenes. They were sweet.

[DisneyBoy]

2 hours ago, Frozendiva said:

Why is Jennifer still connected to the blood pressure thing?

Thank you! It was driving me crazy. I thought I was the only one who noticed LOL.

Sometimes I feel like the show is written by aliens who can only approximate what actually happens in relationships and at jobs and at places of business based on their very limited experience observing the human race.

[DaphneCat]

12 hours ago, boes said:

Salem, I hate to be the first to tell you, but it's not the 19th century anymore.  If you need to ease into this whole "modern 21st century world" thing by spending a little time in the 20th century first, go right ahead.  But please know that we're long past the day when biology is always the primary factor in determining family and we're also past the time when paternity trumps everything, including maternity.  In other words,

Judge ain't gonna give Eric full custody or even joint custody just to make up for Sarah not telling him that he's Mickey's father, doesn't work that way anymore, if it ever did.  Eric's sperm making it over the finish line doesn't legally obligate Sarah to do much of anything, though it would obligate Eric, at least financially, if she pursued things.  He can be angry, stomp his little feet, cry, whine and carry on all he wants, but there's nothing in the legal code about protecting Eric's feelings.

Take Xander out of the picture and it's pretty clear cut IMO that Sarah would get primary custody if Eric did put up a fuss.  He's the one with an addiction issue, he's the one who drove drunk and killed a man and he's the one who dated a woman with a penchant for elephant figurines stuffed with stolen diamonds.  Sarah, to my knowledge, just has piss poor taste in men.  

Poor baby Eric was pushing that stoller so fast I'm surprised Mickey didn't bounce right out.  It's a bit disconcerting to see Brady being the one talking sense to him, but there it is.  And it's a bit sad that Nicole is still so damaged that she thinks this stutterbarking wet blanket of a manbaby is the best she can do.  

Xander didn't do himself any favors, though, when his parting words to Sarah were about remembering to say the This Little Piggy poem to Mickey every night before her bath.  He better be careful or he's going to end up as wet as Eric.

What's with Marlena and her constant hoot owl calls now?   

One thing that Abigail should be grateful for - as long as Eric or Ciara are onscreen, she is no longer the most annoying Salem resident.

10 hours ago, Frozendiva said:

Eric, sure Nicole didn't tell you that Sarah's baby was yours. It was not her place to do so. You also know that Nicole is insecure about almost anything to do with you. Be mad at her, but direct your anger toward Sarah. She seems very happy with Xander as the baby's 'daddy' - so grow up, read your Bible to learn about forgiveness, work out shared custody. Whining at your age is not a good look. The fact is that Nicole can do a whole lot better than you and if Sarah wants your whining, Nicole will be glad to give you to her.

Kate must have a small fortune tucked away in order that she can wait tables at the Brady Pub. Surely Saxons or whatever new restaurant there is can use a well-heeled hostess.

Why is Jennifer still connected to the blood pressure thing? Shouldn't she be walking around by now so that she won't tie up a hospital bed?

Since when did Abigail become some sort of investigative reporter? She was doing a poor job at PR or whatever she did last. She could also go to the Spectator and look at the stories done on Jennifer's fall. Wouldn't Hope/Gina have taken out any evidence that could incriminate her? HoGina needs to worry more about Jennifer regaining her memory. And that people are starting to see that she hasn't been herself in a while. Only Kate noticed and said it wasn't unusual.

Sarah, you do have terrible taste in men, but the fact is that Salem men are on the terrible scale so it's a matter of what terrible on a scale of 1-10 you can tolerate.

I want to like both of these posts 1000 times.  They are REALLY ruining Eric's character (not that I ever really took to him - while he does have flashes of humanity he is generally either wallowing in misery or being ridiculously sanctimonious) with his demanding whining.  And WHY do all the women on this show act like they have no power over any man who throws a tantrum.  I want BOTH Nicole and Sarah to point out that Eric is an alcoholic who killed someone so while, yes, he CAN hope to be forgiven he doesn't actually have the moral high ground here.  But I guess, because he has the entire town of Salem kissing his butt and telling him what a GREAT guy he is, he'll never come to the realization that neither of these women need to grovel to him.

[kitmerlot1213]

Now that Baby Mickey is sick, I think I'm just going to have to deal with Sarah's not getting any consequences for deliberately keeping Eric from his daughter.  Just like Baby David's death meant that Lani received zero consequences for cheating on JJ and trying to pass off Eli's baby as his own, both of these women will be considered tragic heroines because of their suffering--the same goes for Kristin.

And I'm not saying Sarah and Lani should be dragged through the streets, tarred and feathered, but I would appreciate having one of their parents pull them aside and ask them what they were thinking--to my knowledge, we haven't really had a scene where Maggie asked Sarah about her actions and we all know Abe let Lani skate.  I'd just like some acknowledgement that they behaved cruelly to men they allegedly loved.

I am by no means pro-Eric but I do feel sorry that he was lied to pretty massively by his loved ones--that has to sting.

And just when I thought we escaped, JJ's now imagining Haley's ghost speaking to him--what joy.

[Retired at last]

I was never a fan of the "not her secret to tell" theory for why Nicole shouldn't have told Eric about the baby being his. Absolutely, Sarah should have told him. However, once it was apparent that she wasn't going to, there is NO WAY Nicole should have kept it a secret. Of course, her insecurities allowed her to keep quiet with her constant furrowed brow, but if I were with someone and found out that he had fathered a child, I would have told him! There is nothing that said that Eric would have to leave Nicole to go to Sarah to raise the baby - at least they haven't hinted at that. But, I am sure that Nicole will take him back when he comes back to her, because she is just that dumb.

[Sidney]

Are we suppose to think that something is going on between Mr. Shin and Gabi when she said, "That she's pretty good at getting what she wants from Mr. Shin." Good grief! Let's not go there.

[RachelKM]

Holy Hell, Chadwick is an entitled little shit.  "How does a member of security out rank the family?" WTF? It's a company jet you ass clown. It's not for the family's personal use and if your business is company business, you don't need to be sneaking under the CEO's nose. I'm sure TPTB plan to pretend Chadwick is somehow competent. But all I saw was an entitled brat feeling confident because daddy is behind him.

Also, seeing as Mr. Shin's sole motivation has been DE's bottom line, no time for sentimentality and 0 fucks about family loyalty (as indicated by his willingness to agree to an CEO that can help the company and meets the DiMera requirement by any plausible argument), the fact that he is on Gabi's side makes the comments about Gabi having ran the company into the ground seem more ridiculous than before. 

[Silver Raven]

They can't even bother to throw up establishing shots of Rome.

I see they've brought the new DiMera Enterprises logo from the digital show.

Eli goes to sit an a nondescript cafe instead of immediately checking in to his hotel?

Kristen retreated into a dark place?  Wasn't she already in a dark place?

Heh.  Eric's line got cut off by Kayla slamming the door.

Do Italian hotel room doors not lock?

Nice Friday ending.

[DanaMB]

Eric is an asshole. 

[peachmangosteen]

5 minutes ago, DanaMB said:

Eric is an asshole. 

I loled.

Ugh, Haley's ghost. I mean, I fast forwarded through it but still.

Another ugh to Xander's wooby face. I fast forward through the Sarah/Xander scenes but I still have to see his annoying face. 

I want Gabi to kill Chad tbh. He's worse than Abigail at this point imo.

[CanaryFan98]

5 hours ago, kitmerlot1213 said:

Now that Baby Mickey is sick, I think I'm just going to have to deal with Sarah's not getting any consequences for deliberately keeping Eric from his daughter.  Just like Baby David's death meant that Lani received zero consequences for cheating on JJ and trying to pass off Eli's baby as his own, both of these women will be considered tragic heroines because of their suffering--the same goes for Kristin.

And I'm not saying Sarah and Lani should be dragged through the streets, tarred and feathered, but I would appreciate having one of their parents pull them aside and ask them what they were thinking--to my knowledge, we haven't really had a scene where Maggie asked Sarah about her actions and we all know Abe let Lani skate.  I'd just like some acknowledgement that they behaved cruelly to men they allegedly loved.

I am by no means pro-Eric but I do feel sorry that he was lied to pretty massively by his loved ones--that has to sting.

And just when I thought we escaped, JJ's now imagining Haley's ghost speaking to him--what joy.

Lani didn't cheat on JJ they were never together he broke up with her after he shot Theo. Which is why her being upset over JJ/Gabi was laughable to me(for a variety of reasons but I digress) because even if he did have sex with her he wasn't in a relationship with someone else. Besides I think losing David was a major consequence of course I found his existence rather pointless for a quadrangle where none of the pairings involved  were fleshed out or even decent for the audience to care about... 

[CanaryFan98]

Well they did have Rome wallpaper though notice that?

I guess that's the best they could do with Rome...

Even though I think this should've been done when Paige died and I say this as someone that preferred JJ/Eve. I did like that JJ at least seemed a bit conflicted when Haley visited him usually the show tends to be have the characters kill etc and not think about it. Which makes murder inconsequential and takes away any dramatic impact.

I didn't care to hear Haley say JJ gets choked up over puppy videos.. he's a bigger sap than I thought and I already think the show  did a total 180 w/ the character when they neutered him.

[Fen Tiger]

Really dislike Chad and Abigail and will be pissed if he pushes Gabi out of DiMera. They need to go back to Paris.

[tribeca]

It was a nice having a Brady John scene.   Sometimes the show forgets they are related

[boes]

Show today pretty much just reminded me of other shows and movies.

When Marlena got her pickle puss on looking at baby Mickey, all I could think of was the Seinfeld episode with the ugly baby....

And then, those two laugh riots, those two saintly souls who are willing to forego anymore orgasms for God, ready to till that soil, plant those vegetables and apparently, break their vow of silence every freakin' second of every day reminded me of 

Nuns on the Run - 

Such a true vocation.....

The only moment of genuine horror I felt was when Haley appeared.  JJ, man, you gotta get yourself some better drugs, the ones you're on now are freaking you out!

I wonder if Baby Mickey got sick from breathing in all the noxious fumes of self-righteousness, bile and sexual frustration wafting off dear papa Fadda Eric.

[Frozendiva]

When in Rome, or what looked like part of the Horton Square mixed with the newly renovated club rooms at the Salem Inn....

I can see Eli hanging out at a café to wait til his room his ready. He may have arrived before official check-in time. How did JJ stowaway on the plane? No one noticed him? How did he get to Eli's hotel? Does he have any money?

Didn't like him talking to Ghost Haley. She isn't worth all this trouble, JJ.

Prospective sisters Kristen and Lani are doing their vows? Where are the other nuns and such? They just sit in the two bench chapel and that's it?

Eric has only spent a few hours with his daughter. How would he know that she has a fever and is sick?

Nice to see John and Brady acting like family.

Chad, take a few seats. The DiMera plane is not yours to go on impromptu holidays or whatever. Someone has to pay for the fuel and pilot and other costs.

[DaphneCat]

7 hours ago, RachelKM said:

Holy Hell, Chadwick is an entitled little shit.  "How does a member of security out rank the family?" WTF? It's a company jet you ass clown. It's not for the family's personal use and if your business is company business, you don't need to be sneaking under the CEO's nose. I'm sure TPTB plan to pretend Chadwick is somehow competent. But all I saw was an entitled brat feeling confident because daddy is behind him.

Also, seeing as Mr. Shin's sole motivation has been DE's bottom line, no time for sentimentality and 0 fucks about family loyalty (as indicated by his willingness to agree to an CEO that can help the company and meets the DiMera requirement by any plausible argument), the fact that he is on Gabi's side makes the comments about Gabi having ran the company into the ground seem more ridiculous than before. 

And Chad's big threat is he will tell everybody that Gabi was mean to his batshit crazy wife.  WHY did Gabi not mention that batshit crazy wife sent an innocent woman to prison for a murder SHE committed not to mention batshit crazy wife tried to murder several other people?

1 hour ago, boes said:

I wonder if Baby Mickey got sick from breathing in all the noxious fumes of self-righteousness, bile and sexual frustration wafting off dear papa Fadda Eric.

Kayla:  Your baby is really sick - we're going to keep her in the hospital.

Eric:  *Throws temper tantrum about the fact that Xander cares if said baby lives or dies - apparently doesn't give two shits about the baby.*

[Petunia13]

I’m now 100% Team Sander and am unapologetic about it. 

Chad needs to shut the fuck up. And he has some damn nerve throwing Ari and Will being imprisoned in Gabi’s face. Will even in jail is worth 10 of you Bro (despite his being undeservingly nice to your bitchmade ass) and Ari probably wouldn’t judge her mom because A she’s too young, B she doesn’t judge Will, C Gabi did the same or less worse than his greasy alien wife but didn’t claim mental illness so that’s that on that. His behavior is so smug and ugly now that he’s gotten that Failure stink on him. 

Nicole looked nice yesterday and today. She really pulls off her hairstyle and outfits. She’s like Kassie DP that they can rock edgy short hair and have bodies that won’t quit and are long legged as hell, 😩 jealous. 

I agree Kate and Roman have terrific chemistry. I’ve thought that for a very long time. 

[Lastwaltz]

11 hours ago, tribeca said:

It was a nice having a Brady John scene.   Sometimes the show forgets they are related

Yes! I normally daydream or check twitter when John is on, but there were a lot of nice moments between father and son. 

9 hours ago, boes said:

I wonder if Baby Mickey got sick from breathing in all the noxious fumes of self-righteousness, bile and sexual frustration wafting off dear papa Fadda Eric.

Boes, you made me spit out my coffee again, lol. Not loving How Ron uses babies this way in his plots. 

I think Casey Moss is doing a great job with JJ's heartache, grief, and anger, but like many have said, it feels false because we're not invested in JJ and Haley's big lovefest. I liked Paige a lot, and they had worked to overcome a lot of stuff (like, oh, his affair with her mother!) -- I think I cried for JJ back then a little bit. But this just feels like JJ had nothing else to do. I guess the great love stories are a thing of the past now. 

[Rafael]

I stIll say that Baby David's father should be a character cOnnected to the show's legacy. I remember suggesting that either Dougie Le Cleir (Hope's half brother) or Spencer Olsen (Hope and Julie's nephew) be revealed to be Jordan's babydaddy . 

But I thought about it again and I think it would be better if Evan turned out to be the babydaddy. 

It would have been extra epic if Evan was the son of Eugene Bradford and Calliope Jones -Bradford.

Evan  could have Easily showed up in Salem to claim his son David . Plus Eugene abd Calliope could have tagged along and had a mini reuinion with Marlena ,John and Roman . 

[CanaryFan98]

2 hours ago, Lastwaltz said:

I think Casey Moss is doing a great job with JJ's heartache, grief, and anger, but like many have said, it feels false because we're not invested in JJ and Haley's big lovefest. I liked Paige a lot, and they had worked to overcome a lot of stuff (like, oh, his affair with her mother!) -- I think I cried for JJ back then a little bit. But this just feels like JJ had nothing else to do. I guess the great love stories are a thing of the past now. 

This should've been done with Paige it would've made more sense but this show doesn't want people reminded that Benny Boy strangled her in her dorm shower via necktie....

He sadly has nothing else to do mostly because the show doesn't really care for him that much is obvious. The sad thing is I can think of a plenty of storylines for him but the writers don't care and you can't make them either. I don't really care if he has a great love story I just want him to be a decent character and he's not that either.

Spoiler

If this is the best they can write for JJ/Casey its for the best he's being written off the show no sense in keeping a character/actor you have no interest in writing for. 

[Skarzero]

Chad does it escape your mind that your precious can do no wrong Abigail threw the first punch when it came to Gabi? Does it escape the writers minds??? Abby messed with the wrong one and got handled not even to the extent she deserved (imo) Chabby really thinks that they have any thing to say about Gabi's misdeeds when they started in on her!! And Gabi should've kicked Chad in the nuts for bringing up Ari the way he did. What an asshole. 

I have an awful sneaking suspicion that DOOL is going to do to Gabi what Y&R has done to Phyllis and that is make her the narrative and other characters verbal punching bag, and be the only character held accountable, called out, punished, and socially hanged for her misdeeds. Meanwhile characters like Kate, Abitchgail, Chad, and Ben etc do some of the same shit or worse and zilch happens. I'm not having it Ron so don't you dare! I can stomach Y&R(finally after realizing they have no intentions to stop dragging Phyllis to make other characters look better) but don't you dare do that to my girl Gabi/Camila Banus!!! NOT HAVING IT! NOPE! 

[CanaryFan98]

Who's really been calling Gabi out and making her a punching bag? Sure there was Julie who she's apparently bonded with now. Abby/Gabi may have bitterness between them but really there's not much else going on between them there she's actually focused on her family drama(thank goodness).

Eli seems to have forgotten about Gabi doing all those things to Abby, hating Julie etc. as he has chosen to take up with her again and lose whatever brain cells he has in the process.

Jennifer never confronted her over what she did to Abby. Will/Sonny both of whom were close to Abby didn't seem to care either. JJ did and got mad at her after that they stopped interacting. List goes on.  Its been treated as an afterthought and when Eli/Lani inevitably reunite and Eli finds out what Gabi has done this will all be an afterthought as well..  I think Abby, Kate and others skate as well but Gabi has skated too. If the Hortons hate her its not as if she hasn't given them a reason to over the years.

[Skarzero]

35 minutes ago, CanaryFan98 said:

Who's really been calling Gabi out and making her a punching bag? Sure there was Julie who she's apparently bonded with now. Abby/Gabi may have bitterness between them but really there's not much else going on between them there she's actually focused on her family drama(thank goodness).

Eli seems to have forgotten about Gabi doing all those things to Abby, hating Julie etc. as he has chosen to take up with her again and lose whatever brain cells he has in the process.

Jennifer never confronted her over what she did to Abby. Will/Sonny both of whom were close to Abby didn't seem to care either. JJ did and got mad at her after that they stopped interacting. List goes on.  Its been treated as an afterthought and when Eli/Lani inevitably reunite and Eli finds out what Gabi has done this will all be an afterthought as well..  I think Abby, Kate and others skate as well but Gabi has skated too. If the Hortons hate her its not as if she hasn't given them a reason to over the years.

Oh yeah I know Gabi has skated by in the past/present, I was referring in the future. Things are fine now I just hope they stay that way. Hence I'm afraid they're going to make her out to be worse than everyone else. Not that they already have, I'm just paranoid that it's starting to look that way factoring in Chads talk with her and about her, but that's just Chad being his butthurt self lol. Plus Lani/Kristen of all people taking up against her things aren't looking to great, like I said I could be worried for nothing this is DOOL after all if Ben can have a mostly unencumbered life after strangling people then Gabi will probably be alright. Maybe. 

Edited December 7, 2019 by TeamGabi

[Petunia13]

Chad was 💯 wrong using Will’s incarceration against Gabi (dude was your friend and always kind to you and now you’re shaming him) and throwing if Gabi was arrested or jailed Ari would have no parents. Don’t use kids against people. And if he and Abby didn’t press charges that’s on them don’t back pedal now to black mail. I think enough time passed and all circumstantial evidence gone that it would be his word against hers.  It’s always the ones who don’t want their past misdeeds or partner’s thrown in their face doing it others. 

[SueB]

18 hours ago, Frozendiva said:

How did JJ stowaway on the plane? No one noticed him? How did he get to Eli's hotel? Does he have any money?

I think they've installed seat belts for the stowaways as they are pretty much on every freaking flight the plane takes.

Team Xarah all the way. 

Marlena.  He shot you.  Rather than coming off as being snooty to a guy worried about a baby, why not lead with "Xander, you shot me, Eric's mother.  That's a decent reason for Eric not to want you around his baby."  THAT would have been both snarky and accurate.  Instead it feels like Marlena is letting us know where Eric gets that self-righteous streak.  

Eric, your priorities are out of whack.  Baby first, bitch out Xander later.  And go to confession, your attitude about Nicole is so unworthy of a former priest.

Xander honey, I know you love Mickey. But her bio-dad is going to be an ass to the baby's Mom and the woman you love every time he sees you.  Avoid the drama, avoid being seen.  Sarah will sneak you into her boudoir and I bet she finds a way of letting you see the baby too; just on the DL.

JJ.  Dude.  You are so high you are seeing your dead ex-girlfriend.  You're in a foreign country and you decide to steal a gun.  This are all bad life choices.  

Lani, you should have come clean to Kayla about Gabi's app.  Kayla could have worked on the sly to get the app neutralized via the heart surgeon (go in and change out the pacemaker without changing out the leads -- the part that goes into the heart).  Do it on the sly under 'routine maintenance'.  SIMPLE.  And you are so not ready to become an insta-nun.  

Kristen, OTOH, stay with the convent.  I think this is your only hope. 

[Pearson80]

On 12/5/2019 at 10:17 PM, boes said:

Salem, I hate to be the first to tell you, but it's not the 19th century anymore.  If you need to ease into this whole "modern 21st century world" thing by spending a little time in the 20th century first, go right ahead.  But please know that we're long past the day when biology is always the primary factor in determining family and we're also past the time when paternity trumps everything, including maternity.  In other words,

Judge ain't gonna give Eric full custody or even joint custody just to make up for Sarah not telling him that he's Mickey's father, doesn't work that way anymore, if it ever did.  Eric's sperm making it over the finish line doesn't legally obligate Sarah to do much of anything, though it would obligate Eric, at least financially, if she pursued things.  He can be angry, stomp his little feet, cry, whine and carry on all he wants, but there's nothing in the legal code about protecting Eric's feelings.

Take Xander out of the picture and it's pretty clear cut IMO that Sarah would get primary custody if Eric did put up a fuss.  He's the one with an addiction issue, he's the one who drove drunk and killed a man and he's the one who dated a woman with a penchant for elephant figurines stuffed with stolen diamonds.  Sarah, to my knowledge, just has piss poor taste in men.  

Poor baby Eric was pushing that stoller so fast I'm surprised Mickey didn't bounce right out.  It's a bit disconcerting to see Brady being the one talking sense to him, but there it is.  And it's a bit sad that Nicole is still so damaged that she thinks this stutterbarking wet blanket of a manbaby is the best she can do.  

Xander didn't do himself any favors, though, when his parting words to Sarah were about remembering to say the This Little Piggy poem to Mickey every night before her bath.  He better be careful or he's going to end up as wet as Eric.

What's with Marlena and her constant hoot owl calls now?   

One thing that Abigail should be grateful for - as long as Eric or Ciara are onscreen, she is no longer the most annoying Salem resident.

Eric may be an annoying self-righteous evil monster to the board but he is still the father and everybody has to deal with that. He has rights to his own child and Sarah cannot erase him from Mackenzie's life just because she wants Xander to play daddy. It is disheartening how some women in real life use their kids as pawns against their own fathers. 

Mothers have rights and so do fathers, after all it takes a mother and a father to create a child. A judge would never take Mackenzie away from Sarah but they would never deny Eric his rights to raise her.  They would have to share custody and in some states Sarah cannot leave the state with Mackenzie without Eric's permission.  As parents, they are stuck with each other until Mackenzie turns 18. Even then, they would always interact with each other on some level as Mackenzie lives her own life away from her parents.  If Sarah did not want to have that lifetime bond with him, then she should have exercised her right to choose. 

Sarah is a doctor in her childbearing years and she knows that the female body is always looking to get pregnant and birth control is a tool that she can use to circumvent that. Sarah created this mess with her lies and now she has to deal with the fallout..I have no sympathy for her, I only care about an innocent baby who did not ask for this unnecessary drama so early in her life.

It is an unpopular opinion on this board to not hate Eric, but I cannot hate a parent fighting hard to be in his own baby's life. I may not agree with everything he is saying and doing but I understand the sentiment. You don't mess with somebody's child. From Eric's perspective, Sarah and Xander have done that by depriving him of his own child. I was team Lucas when Sami was playing games with Will. I was team Wilson when Nick was using Arianna against them with the tacit approval of Gabi. 

Edited December 8, 2019 by Pearson80

[CanaryFan98]

I agree with you Eric when it comes to Mackenzie isn't doing anything wrong here.  

I think a much bigger issue is how he seems to be giving the brunt of the blame to Nicole and Xander(who aren't faultless of course) and not so much Sarah(who caused it by her lies in the first place).  

[Pearson80]

3 hours ago, CanaryFan98 said:

I agree with you Eric when it comes to Mackenzie isn't doing anything wrong here.  

I think a much bigger issue is how he seems to be giving the brunt of the blame to Nicole and Xander(who aren't faultless of course) and not so much Sarah(who caused it by her lies in the first place).  

I think he is angry at Nicole for once again screwing him over. He should have known better to get involved with Nicole. I don't think Eric has ever been enough for Nicole. Not to mention, Eric has never looked at Nicole for who she is.

Nicole has a record of keeping people from their children. She stole Sydney from Sami. When Sami confronted her about that, her response was that Sami had 3 kids already while she had none. She gave Grace to Sami when she took Sydney, lying to her birth mother Mia who was a vulnerable teenager who found herself pregnant scared and alone. When Mia confronted her about her lies, she told her she at least held her daughter before she died. Not caring that Mia would have liked to have been with her daughter as her mother as she died.  She lied to EJ about his daughter dying when she miscarried her, depriving EJ the chance to mourn his daughter. She lied again about his unborn son by plotting with Rafe to raise him as his son. She also screwed Chad out of knowing his daughter with Mia before she died. Now she has kept silent about Mackenzie, depriving Eric the chance to experience her development from utero to birth. Nicole is who she is and she will never change. 

Eric is jealous that Xander a man he loathed got to experience what he could not. Not to mention, fathers tend to be very protective of their daughters. So there is that aspect that is fueling his rage. Xander did try to kill him and Nicole. He also tried to kill his mother and that caused not only anguish for him and his siblings. It provoked lots of anger and lashing out via his sisters. Remember how Sami and Belle were fighting, Belle was fighting with her dad.  Xander is dangerous and there is nothing he can do to stop him from being close to Mackenzie. So, he feels that he is failing as a dad. No parent wants to feel that they are failing their kids.

Edited December 8, 2019 by Pearson80

[boes]

Birth control isn't simply Sarah's responsibility, Fadda Eric could have put on a condom.  I'm sure they come in his size...... 

There never was any guarantee, even if Eric knew he was the father, that he would have been intimately involved in Sarah's pregnancy, the birth, or anything subsequent.  That would have been at Sarah's discretion - she's not a milk carton, she's a person with autonomy over her body.

And finally, he's such a whiny, self-centered putz and the last thing Sarah needed was taking care of TWO fussy infants.  

None of that makes Xander less of a sociopath, but then again, Xander being a sociopath doesn't make Eric any less of a wet putz.

[CanaryFan98]

28 minutes ago, Pearson80 said:

I think he is angry at Nicole for once again screwing him over. He should have known better to get involved with Nicole. I don't think Eric has ever been enough for Nicole. Not to mention, Eric has never looked at Nicole for who she is.

Nicole has a record of keeping people from their children. She stole Sydney from Sami. When Sami confronted her about that, her response was that Sami had 3 kids already while she had none. She gave Grace to Sami when she took Sydney, lying to her birth mother Mia who was a vulnerable teenager who found herself pregnant scared and alone. When Mia confronted her about her lies, she told her she at least held her daughter before she died. Not caring that Mia would have liked to have been with her daughter as her mother as she died.  She lied to EJ about his daughter dying when she miscarried her, depriving EJ the chance to mourn his daughter. She lied again about his unborn son by plotting with Rafe to raise him as his son. She also screwed Chad out of knowing his daughter with Mia before she died. Now she has kept silent about Mackenzie, depriving Eric the chance to experience her development from utero to birth. Nicole is who she is and she will never change. 

Eric is jealous that Xander a man he loathed got to experience what he could not. Not to mention, fathers tend to be very protective of their daughters. So there is that aspect that is fueling his rage. Xander did try to kill him and Nicole. He also tried to kill his mother and that caused not only anguish for him and his siblings. It provoked lots of anger and lashing out via his sisters. Remember how Sami and Belle were fighting, Belle was fighting with her dad.  Xander is dangerous and there is nothing he can do to stop him from being close to Mackenzie. So, he feels that he is failing as a dad. No parent wants to feel that they are failing their kids.

When it comes to Xander I actually don't think he's the bad guy and find him rather justified. 

Nicole OTOH as you said and I agree he doesn't really see her for who she truly is. I've always maintained Eric only wants the sanitized version of her not the true toxic version of her.  When it comes to Nicole I stopped feeling bad for him when it came to her after Greta. At that point he wasn't blind to who she was and if he's dumb enough to get involved with her after everything (which included kidnapping his own niece) he deserves what he gets tbh.

[KBrownie]

49 minutes ago, boes said:

There never was any guarantee, even if Eric knew he was the father, that he would have been intimately involved in Sarah's pregnancy, the birth, or anything subsequent.  That would have been at Sarah's discretion - she's not a milk carton, she's a person with autonomy over her body.

Anything subsequent the baby's birth really would NOT have been at Sarah's discretion alone.  As soon as that child was born and no longer a part of Sarah's body, if Sarah wasn't a lying liar who lies and Eric was rightfully and legally established as Makenzie's father, he would have had just as much discretion to what happened with her as Sarah.  

And speaking of bodily autonomy, it's interesting how there's not much issue with Xander's willingness to violate Sarah's autonomy over her body when he was going to help Kristen and Rolf take her baby from her womb without her consent.  Yeah, she considered an abortion, but she didn't agree for Kristen to take her kid from her womb. 

Hate Eric and/or like Xander all one wants, but this constant elevation of Xander as somehow better than Eric because of personality and the erasure of Xander's wrongdoings is perplexing to me.  Nothing Eric has ever done is worse than Xander, but somehow Xander is a better dad for Eric's child just because.  Being mopey, judgmental, self-righteous, or whatever else Eric is accused of being isn't a disqualifier from being a father.  As soon as Sarah decided to have her child, she needed to accept that she had to deal with Eric.  But she's such a simpering coward with no spine, she let Xander make it easy for her.  Her and Xander waxing poetic about how he's such a great dad when they deliberately kept Eric from being one is some next level hypocritical and delusional bullshit.  Is Sarah even aware of all that Xander's done?  If she is, someone should question her parenting skills for allowing someone like that to be a father figure to her child.  And yes "But Eric . . . ", but talk to me when Eric has deliberately set out to and actually did harm and torture anyone.  The show would do better to acknowledge all this rather than present it as Eric simply being jealous and petulant about Xander around his kid.  It's way more complicated than that and they know it.  

Edited December 8, 2019 by KBrownie

[WendyCR72]

4 hours ago, KBrownie said:

If she is, someone should question her parenting skills for allowing someone like that to be a father figure to her child.  And yes "But Eric . . . ", but...

For me alone, the "but..." does not matter. The fact is, Eric has ALSO done bad deeds. Maybe they were not intentional. But if we start assigning degrees of horribleness on this show? No one should breed.

And Eric is in love with a woman who abducted his own damned niece. I guess Eric is all about loyalty and family and truth...until he isn't.

Sarah had Eric's kid and kept it from him. Okay, that's not good. But next to some of the other shit that goes down on this show, I don't even count this in the top 50 of extreme offenses.

And Sarah having said kid does NOT mean Eric gets to control Sarah's every move. It's 2019. If he wants to be a controlling petulant ass? Let Sarah put HER foot down where Nicole is concerned. I bet Eric wouldn't like having the tables turned on him.

[KBrownie]

59 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

For me alone, the "but..." does not matter. The fact is, Eric has ALSO done bad deeds. Maybe they were not intentional. But if we start assigning degrees of horribleness on this show? No one should breed.

And Eric is in love with a woman who abducted his own damned niece. I guess Eric is all about loyalty and family and truth...until he isn't.

Sarah had Eric's kid and kept it from him. Okay, that's not good. But next to some of the other shit that goes down on this show, I don't even count this in the top 50 of extreme offenses.

And Sarah having said kid does NOT mean Eric gets to control Sarah's every move. It's 2019. If he wants to be a controlling petulant ass? Let Sarah put HER foot down where Nicole is concerned. I bet Eric wouldn't like having the tables turned on him.

Okay, so Eric is just as bad as everyone else.  So why is it okay for Xander to play daddy to someone else's kid and somehow Eric shouldn't get that opportunity in favor of Xander?  If they're the same, then Eric's actual biological tie to the child wins out and gives him certain rights that Xander, nor Sarah, get to arbitrarily decide to take away from him.

And how is Eric trying to control Sarah's every move?  He doesn't want the sociopath around his child.  The man who has on multiple occasions deliberately decided to harm and kill other people.  It ain't about Sarah.  And even if it were true Eric was trying to control Sarah, wasn't Xander doing the same when he tried to get rid of her link to Eric so he'd have a better chance with her when he let Kristen and Rolf try to take her baby from her womb?  If it's okay for Xander to do that and he's viable as a partner for Sarah and daddy to Mackenzie, then Eric should be cool if neither is any different than the other.

[Petunia13]

Eric would have to prove it in court that Xander would be abusive or dangerous to Mickey. And if Sarah had a good lawyer they’d throw his jail record, addiction, and Nicole in his face. 

Not saying it’s not possible Eric would win. My former stepfather’s second wife lost custody of her children because her first husband didn’t want him around them. She had to leave him, get an apartment, petition the courts with that proof and then only got weekend visitation. But I think these types of situations are rare and, if so, drawn out unless you get a very expensive shark. And Justin isn’t that and would probably defend Sarah since he’s a Kiriakis and all. 

[KBrownie]

10 minutes ago, Petunia13 said:

Eric would have to prove it in court that Xander would be abusive or dangerous to Mickey. And if Sarah had a good lawyer they’d throw his jail record, addiction, and Nicole in his face. 

Not saying it’s not possible Eric would win. My former stepfather’s second wife lost custody of her children because her first husband didn’t want him around them. She had to leave him, get an apartment, petition the courts with that proof and then only got weekend visitation. But I think these types of situations are rare and, if so, drawn out unless you get a very expensive shark. And Justin isn’t that and would probably defend Sarah since he’s a Kiriakis and all. 

Yes, but Eric is the child's father.  This is what separates him from Xander in this entire discussion.  Despite all the protests to the contrary, they are not the same.  Eric is Makenzie's father.  A father who was denied his child for no legitimate reason.  He has rights and most judges aren't going to sever a child from it's parent when the parent has shown no potential harm to the child, no matter what their past may be.  And as has been pointed out several times, no one is perfect.  NOTHING Eric has ever done disqualifies him from being a parent to his child.  And yeah, yeah, yeah, the same could be said about Xander.  But it's not his kid, is it?

Who is Xander in this whole thing?  He isn't married to Sarah.  Even if he was, it means nothing when it comes to Mackenzie as long as her father is in the picture.    He also participated in the coverup and lie about the child's paternity.  A judge might not look too fondly on that.  So did Sarah.  But she is the child's mother.  That carries the same weight as Eric being her father.  Xander is nothing that counts in this situation.  Not legally anyway.  So he should just step back and keep quiet when it comes to Eric.  If poor, little Sarah has to take a bit of heat so be it.  It's not his place.  

[Petunia13]

Uhh I didn’t say all or any or of that... I just said it’s hard to dictate who the parent of a child spends time w when they have shared custody. 

[DaphneCat]

1 hour ago, Petunia13 said:

Uhh I didn’t say all or any or of that... I just said it’s hard to dictate who the parent of a child spends time w when they have shared custody. 

This. I don't think anyone is saying Eric shouldn't spend time with Mackenzie.  I think people are saying that Eric doesn't get a say in who Sarah allows Mackenzie to spend time with as long as they aren't harming her.  Legally, Sarah could take Mackenzie to the prison for regularly scheduled visits with all the inmates.  (I'm NOT saying she would do this, I'm just taking it to the extreme.)  Otherwise, what's to prevent either of them from disallowing ANYBODY (except the other person) to spend time with Mackenzie.  

[peachmangosteen]

12 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

No one [on this show] should breed.

I mean, this lol.

[SueB]

Wow.  Kristen is really selling her conversion.  And it appears legit — or is she just that insane to tempt JJ, knowing he’s a good guy who won’t go through with it?   I tend to think it’s meant to be sincere.  First, JJ was barely holding it together.  The gun could have gone on easily.  Second, Kristen still is a bit delusional.  She claimed she never killed anyone - but she ORDERED IT a bunch of times.  Third, kneeling and closing her eyes was convincing.  Note: Under NO circumstances would an actual postulate (nun candidate) encourage anyone to take anyone’s life.  She’d be arguing for JJ to not damage his soul with murder, no matter how justified. 
 

JJ: telling Eli he sucks as a security guard.  Man has a point.  JJ is strung out on drugs and Eli didn’t catch him. 
 

Lani: At this point, with Julie and Gabi THOUSANDS of miles away, you could tell Eli the truth.   
 

Gabi: What the hell was that weird-ass non-confession confession about?  
 

Kate, Kate, Kate - you got some ‘splaining to do.  How did you know where Steven-O was at?  And do you hate Kayla that much? 
 

Chad - why didn’t you send a confident from the Paris office to Kristen?  It’s 2019, they could have FaceTimed you in directly.  
 

Abigail/Jen: I cannot wait til Gina/Hope is exposed. 
 

[CanaryFan98]

I think Kristen is lying but considering how Ron has made a mockery of.. everything she's "redeemed" you know like Ben where him being an SK is just "oopsies"

I won't lie I did LOL at JJ dragging Eli though.

Edited December 10, 2019 by CanaryFan98

[hypnotoad]

Quote

And how is Eric trying to control Sarah's every move?  He doesn't want the sociopath around his child.

Nicole is a sociopath too and I'll bet Eric won't have an issue having her near the baby.

Of course Eric should be raising his child ... IF it is his child. When has that really been established? But if he gets to say he doesn't want Xander near the baby, I think Sarah has as much right to insist Nicole can't be near the baby in case she decides to kidnap her.

In real life of course, I'd never want a dude like Xander around anyone. But on this show? Where practically every character has killed or tried to kill someone? Pffft I'll take Xander over whiny petulant Eric any day.

Steve seems more like Stefan Cassadine than Stefano DiMera.

I wish Princess Gina would go away and take Hope with her.