Current Plots Discussion: Actually Today's Episode

[hypnotoad]

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 But they did virtually nothing to redeem Ben and are now propping him to the high heavens, which always has the absolute opposite effect on me. Ben should not be whining about people not forgiving him, threatening people when he gets mad, making jokes about killing Will, being controlling with Ciara, treating Claire like shit, etc. if they intend for me to see him as so reformed that he is actually now the town hero that everyone has to love. That's just such bad writing that never works. I don't understand why the writers don't get it. I mean I do, they're willfully obtuse, but still!

Amen. Sorry but if I am supposed to believe the serial killer is cured or better because of therapy and medicine, then we should be seeing redemption. Redemption isn't propping him at every turn. Redemption isn't having Ciara tell the bad guys at the garage that her bf is the necktie killer. Redemption isn't having Ben threaten this person or that person because he's mad. Redemption isn't joking around about killing a man you've already murdered. Redemption actually takes time and effort. Neither of these are things Ron would bother with. So once again like with Kristen, we are left with characters just shouting about how Ben has changed. Like you, that never works with me. Never.

There are plenty of bad characters from soaps that I loved. The writers knew how to have them do bad things and yet keep the audience drawn to them. Roger Thorpe from Guiding Light was a rapist and generally a bad guy but he was complex and interesting. No matter what you wanted to see what he would do next. Think of Adam Chandler or Palmer Cortland on All My Children. Even Jack from this show who started out as a rapist and look where he's ended up.

And DisneyBoy I will agree with all you have written here but especially:

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This pisses me off so much because it's like the show's producers are telling us "as long as the guy on camera looks 'hot', he don't need no acting skills, no likeable characterization, and no personality.

The guy who 'plays' Ben cannot act at all. He cannot show emotion on screen. Sure he's good looking and has great abs. So what? He brings nothing to the table. I just don't care.

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I am so confused why there are posts telling us to just enjoy the show for what it is and to essentially, shut our mouths

Well that isn't going to happen with me because I watch this dreck and I'm going to express my views of that dreck!!

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I liked the aftermath explosion scenes, they put some money into it.

I suppose but I can't help thinking why didn't they just put some of that money into Eric and Nicole's wedding since that couple has actually been around for like a million years and their fans have been waiting for this for much longer. I'm not even an Eric/Nicole fan but man what a cheap arse wedding for such a long standing couple.

[TenaciousWarrior]

I still can’t stand Gabi. Run, Jake, run! He’s way too good for her.

I thought Sarah and Xander’s scenes were sweet. I love how devoted Xander is to her. 

[wurdalak]

Today Jake speculated that his former associates may have had something to do with the bombing, a plot point I had already seen as quite plausible. They would have the resources, money and skills to plant a bomb; I am not so sure about the dress and the ring though, small events which would have been below their radar. They do have motive to hold a grudge against Ben, Jake and Ciara for their involvement in the "where's the Dostoyevski?" caper. If I heard correctly, dumb Gabi poo-pooed the idea, which can only mean it is quite reasonable.

22 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

I doubt it.  Gabi is usually playing that role of making people work/more interesting.

I would say she usually contaminates them with her ugly character. She in dire need of redemption because of her recent actions and attitude, shrilly clamoring that Jake was her husband, bulldozing over any reasonable objection and even attempting to inject him with a serum without his consent. Not that her behaviour as a screeching shrew is anything new and it has been there from the start in the writing and in the performance, but it has reached a new level, which is why I dubbed her "Julie Jr. ". She also has done a lot of ridiculous posturing about being the best person to run diMera, but her best skill seems to be futilely attempting to twirl a non-existent mustache as she ruminates over brilliant schemes against her perceived enemies.

Pairing her with an ordinary bloke like Jake would be one way to try and prop her up in order to renew sympathy for her, until his diMera blood starts to take over.

18 hours ago, DisneyBoy said:

during his killing spree, we saw him methodically go about framing Chad and targeting his victims with a clear mind. He wasn't hallucinating, passing out, hearing voices or being reactionary. He knew what he was doing, and was doing it in cold blood. He seemed to not like killing Will, his friend who just happened to figure it out, but he strangled him anyway, went on to murder the completely innocent wetnurse at the cabin, and then gleefully take a newborn baby away from his parents, who were chained to a burning bed.

So....I don't know what one mental illness covers all that.

Being mentally ill is not equivalent to being devoid of shrewd intelligence and mental skills, which means Ben could have done all the methodical planning you describe while still being ill. Being cunning and mentally ill are not mutually exclusive conditions.

As for a specific diagnosis,  @SueB and @MsTree indicated that an extreme form of bipolar disorder would fit the bill and may even have been specifically mentioned on the show (I do not recall it myself).

It does not make him a hero, just someone who has gone through quite a lot because of a mental imbalance and did some apalling deeds, but appears to now be a functional person, with the caveat of maintaining his medical management regimen.

10 hours ago, SueB said:

It's NOT CURABLE.  It's controllable with meds and therapy. 

You are quite correct. We should not use the word "cured" too lightly in the context of mental illness; the underlying condition does not usually disappear but is most often managed, with medication and ongoing therapy, as I have said appears to be the case with Ben.

I am certain that I am not the only person here who has witnessed the dramatic consequences of some people stopping to take their medication, by accident or deliberately. In the case of Ben, he is written as if ongoing treatment is working, despite flare-ups of temper; that being said, such occurrences happen in people who are not mentally ill. Anger is not a surefire sign of relapse.

23 hours ago, DisneyBoy said:

That's how he ended up in Bayview and I don't see any signs that he shouldn't still be there. In fact, after murdering three people and nearly murdering three others he should be in prison for the rest of his life. Period.

Despite all the wonkiness int the Salem justice system (including recurring conflicts of interests and abuses of power by Hope, Rafe, Abe, etc, as well as violations of civil rights and police procedures like keeping a suspect handcuffed to a table for an unreasonable length of time), they seem to apply the same principle we do in cases of crimes committed while suffering from a mental illness: if the condition is treated and can be controlled through meds and therapy, the culprit can be reintegrated into society because they were not responsible for their actions at the time. To protect society, such an assessment must require multiple safeguards and counter-diagnostics; I say multiple because psychotherapy is far from an exact science (is it even a science?). If one does not agree with this matter of policy and believes, as many do in the real world, that such people should stay in the slammer for eternity, of course Ben does not then deserve to be a free man.

21 hours ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

That's up to the individual viewer. They don't have to apply real world morals and rules if they don't want to.

Obviously, and no one is proposing the contrary or suggesting that one approach should not be applied: you make one choice, I am making another one. I will stick with mine, just as others are of course free to do the same with yours. Expressing a dissenting opinion is not the same as proposing to shut down different points of view; let's leave that to the cancel culture movement.

23 hours ago, DisneyBoy said:

Because Eileen Davidson is a phenomenal actress with great chemistry and an ability to turn any line reading and scene into something entertaining and layered. And her character isn't an irredeemable piece of garbage

I do not share your high opinion of Davidson’s acting skills; she seems to belong to the permanently bemused school of acting. YMMV of course, because appreciation of an actor’s talent is a most subjective thing. I will agree though that she is somewhat better than Wilson.

18 hours ago, DisneyBoy said:

It's not enough to have a lot of money or be good looking, to be white, straight and have abs...as if that should entitle you to having carte blanche to do whatever you want with no consequences.

I feel that every time the "white privilege" argument is injected into a discussion these days, including applying it to a fictional character like Ben, we reach some sort of Godwin point that leaves me speechless.

Edited July 24, 2020 by wurdalak

[tribeca]

It’s a good thing that Ben and Ciara had all that sex since it looks like there will not be a honeymoon.   

[CanaryFan98]

9 minutes ago, tribeca said:

It’s a good thing that Ben and Ciara had all that sex since it looks like there will not be a honeymoon.   

In light of virus I'm glad all these couples who got love scenes had them because they probably won't be getting one anytime soon if it all at this rate. 

 

[Frozendiva]

The show spent a little money on the explosion to make it more realistic.

Doc sure snuck out of the church quickly. Not a hair on her head out of place.

Did like Xander being a hero of sorts. Wasn't thinking of himself and helped others. His redemption is slow. He was kind to people, cared how they were, cared about Sarah working to help all the victims.

Julie, shut up. Stop the braying. No, Lani's baby won't have any issues because it is loved. Yeah, right, tell that to a lot of people. Go away and leave Eli and Lani alone. If they want your help, they will ask. Lani came across as needy and unpleasant.

Allie, you are going to have to call your parents. They will find out that there was an explosion and that you were there.

Gabi and Jake were kinda cute today - at least she told him about all his brothers and sisters - 11 kids from Steffy? - that is a lot. He did mention that maybe the shady crime folks could have planted the bomb.

All that was left was Ben's shoe - how convenient the bomb only hit at a precise place and he vanished.

[SueB]

I also thought the show did a good job with trauma-vision.  People often aren’t able to hear or react from seconds to minutes until something snaps them out.  
 

Ciara looked appropriately tragic, I thought her insistence was realistic.
 

Marlena didn’t even have a smug.  
 

Im 1000% over Allie keeping things from Sami.  Strap on a spine and face your mother.  
 

Team Xarah!!  Oh that did my heart some good.

 

Finally, I enjoyed Gabe giving Jake the family history  There’s trust there and I like that.

 

 

Edited July 24, 2020 by SueB

[ByaNose]

I’m confused. Was Marlena in the church when the explosion went off? Everyone was tarred & feathered but she looked like she went to the spa before she got to the hospital. Also, how is it that she arrived after John?

[howmanywords]

I normally don't find VK all that great but damn if I didn't feel for Ciara today.  And I can't stand CIN but ugh. When Ciara asked Hope to pray with her 😥

Jake was so much like Stefan today especially wearing that dress shirt.

It just can't be said enough but Shut.Up.Julie. Holy hell that woman is obnoxious.

 

[Door County Cherry]

If you think another poster is telling you that you can't post something, report it using the little flag at the bottom of the post.  Please don't debate it in here.  

The only people who can tell you that you can't post something in here would be @scarynikki12 or myself and we'll do it with a nice yellow announcement post like this one. 

[boes]

1 hour ago, ByaNose said:

I’m confused. Was Marlena in the church when the explosion went off? Everyone was tarred & feathered but she looked like she went to the spa before she got to the hospital. Also, how is it that she arrived after John?

At the hospital, she told John that Will had taken her out of the church immediately after the explosion.

[bunnyblue]

1 hour ago, ByaNose said:

I’m confused. Was Marlena in the church when the explosion went off? Everyone was tarred & feathered but she looked like she went to the spa before she got to the hospital. Also, how is it that she arrived after John?

She was in the church at the time of the explosion, but according to Will he got her out offscreen before John even came to. Shawn said he too got Doug & Julie out, even before checking on Hope & Ciara. I think it was the show's way of getting the oldest actors off the damaged set and out of harms way. Can't be too careful with septuagenarians and nonagenarians. As to why Marlena looked rosy fresh at the hospital: I wouldn't be surprised if she did stop off at a spa to clean up and that's why she arrived after John.

[tribeca]

Doug was far away from the church sitting on park bench and had a bottle water. No wonder he is 95 years old.  He knows how to survive. 
 

[Sandman]

16 hours ago, Silver Raven said:

Julie is more concerned with her granddaughter in law than with her own granddaughter (well, step, but the relationship between Julie and Hope is more like mother and daughter).

Darling Julie is more concerned furious that Gabi was (a) present at the wedding, and (b) not crushed under some rubble, than she was concerned about her sister-stepdaughter or niece-grandchild or any member of her family. Her Gabi obsession is now truly unhealthy. (If it were anyone else, I might cut her some kind of a break, or even admit that she had a point, because of the whole remote-control murder app on Gabi's phone thing, but, ehhh. It's Julie, and she's filled with hatred and bile.)

[wurdalak]

Allie is faced with two unpleasant outcomes. Either she lets Lucas and Sami know and they then come over to the hospital and act as the hover parents they are, or she tries to keep the info from them as long as possible (forgetting there are news channels and the Internet in Salem), and then they come over to berate her for trying to shut them out, and then they will still hover annoyingly and probably even more so.

Allie should learn that being an adult requires sometimes to make the least negative choice. Of course, the real adults in the room are not giving her the best example since they approved her decision. But it seems the show likes to write the older characters as compliant idiots.

1 hour ago, Sandman said:

Her Gabi obsession is now truly unhealthy.

Julie is probably jealous of Gabi because she sees this young one as poised to take over her position as Salem's chief harpy.

Edited July 24, 2020 by wurdalak

[peachmangosteen]

10 hours ago, ByaNose said:

I’m confused. Was Marlena in the church when the explosion went off? Everyone was tarred & feathered but she looked like she went to the spa before she got to the hospital. Also, how is it that she arrived after John?

All the women (minus Ciara) that were involved in the explosion looked pristine afterwards, minus the tiny cut on Allie. Why couldn't they put some 'dirt' on them like they did the men lol?

14 hours ago, hypnotoad said:

I suppose but I can't help thinking why didn't they just put some of that money into Eric and Nicole's wedding since that couple has actually been around for like a million years and their fans have been waiting for this for much longer. I'm not even an Eric/Nicole fan but man what a cheap arse wedding for such a long standing couple.

Yea, it's really annoying that they spent so much on the wedding of a serial killer when they really half-assed the wedding of a long-standing couple like Eric and Nicole. It's gross honestly even if I, like you, don't give one shit about Eric/Nicole.

[Sandman]

36 minutes ago, wurdalak said:

Julie is probably jealous of Gabi because she sees this young one as poised to take over her position as Salem's chief harpy.

Which position Darling Julie is clearly prepared to defend to the death.

[sas616]

23 hours ago, Harmony233 said:

I agree I watch hollyoaks and there very serious about there mental health issues for example a character killed himself a few weeks ago because of depression and they had to spoil it weeks ahead of time because it might trigger someone in the audience and if there doing a self harm story etc they have to warn the audience at the beginning of the show and they also have a hotline to call for help after the show of anybody is experiencing these issues.

I remember when soaps used to do very serious stories that we could learn from these days the social issues they try to do is so bad.

Hollyoaks seems to always have at least one social issue story going.  Wasn't too fond of Kyle in the beginning, but came to love him.  Sorry to see him go.    And Coronation Street is doing an excellent job with its spousal abuse storyline right now.   The think I like about the UK soaps is that they have relatable characters, living relatable lives, dealing with real problems.  

 I don't understand why US soaps cannot be as realistic with their stories.  

[DisneyBoy]

15 hours ago, wurdalak said:

Being mentally ill is not equivalent to being devoid of shrewd intelligence and mental skills, which means Ben could have done all the methodical planning you describe while still being ill. Being cunning and mentally ill are not mutually exclusive conditions.

I do not share your high opinion of Davidson’s acting skills; she seems to belong to the permanently bemused school of acting. YMMV of course, because appreciation of an actor’s talent is a most subjective thing. I will agree though that she is somewhat better than Wilson.

I feel that every time the "white privilege" argument is injected into a discussion these days, including applying it to a fictional character like Ben, we reach some sort of Godwin point that leaves me speechless.

To respond in reverse order, we've been hearing a lot more lately about the personal beliefs of people on the show. A black woman who wrote for the series tweeted recently that she was forced to change a line of dialogue between Abe and Lexie, wherein he referred to Lexie as "the most beautiful woman in Salem", because three of the show's top white actresses objected to that kind of complement being paid to a woman of color. She went on to say that one of them apologized later on and the other claimed she bad been misinformed about the writer (whatever that means) but the third remained steadfast in her opinion. We've also been hearing a lot about how cast members' "religious views" have impacted the characters' trajectories on the show. For example, Missy Reeves and her support of Chick-fil-A's homophobia and her lack of comfort with gay characters like Will and Sonny.

To go back to the point about Ben, this is a character who is serial killer and in addition to that, not a very compelling on-screen presence. The actor would be fine if he was used minimally because he doesn't have much range, but instead he's positioned as the hero of the show with ample screen time. He was even brought back fairly quickly after being written as a terrible person during the 50th.

By comparison, Will is a gay character who was written into the background, murdered on screen by Ben and apparently unable to put any kind of fight up to defend himself (a gay person is too weak to fight back?). Following his murder, characters barely referenced him at all for weeks and months...remember how Lucas was only allowed to fall off the wagon and grieve for his son more than a year later, after breaking up with Bonnie (and a regime change BTS?) And sure, all the while Sonny was involved in a relationship with Paul, but the two rarely showed any affection to one another and had a perfunctory courtship, if that. On a soap that's pretty glaring.

After Will was killed off, it took a lot of fan support and pressure to get him back on the show, and yet that character's coming out storyline got the show a lot of positive press and several Emmy Awards. But Will is gay. So of course that meant he made people uncomfortable and was less desirable on the show, apparently, than the straight serial killer with the abs.

Ben was never far from the show after he was originally incarcerated. They brought him back to haunt Abigail and he was referenced continuously, and now he's been brought back and all of his victims have been forced to see him as a good guy and cheer him on. Will meanwhile has had his storylines altered and scenes dropped from episodes continually since his return. The character's most notable plotline this year has been his out-of-the-blue friendship with Ben, to the point where now he is his best man taking him out to a bachelor party. He can't have a love scene with his husband, be shown in an active parental role with his daughter or even shown at his job, but there sure is time to show him approving of Ben, his would-be murderer.

I do think there's a certain amount of privilege at play there. Is some of it white privilege? Yes. The writers on the show are willing to do all kinds of interesting things with the white characters. Black characters like Abe, Theo, Eli and Lani are written as generic good people and have very few character traits and almost no complex development. Eli's actually a good mirror to Ben because they both have abs, but the actor who plays Eli has a much bigger range. Unfortunately they seem to do nothing with him. The black characters on the show often feel like ciphers, I suspect because the writing staff is probably overwhelmingly white and they're afraid of stepping on any toes by making the black characters less than perfect. So they're all just generically good and in the background and permitted only to marry each other, blacks with blacks and whites with whites style. If Eli turned around and became a serial killer in some way, I sincerely doubt we would still be seeing him on the show five years later, reformed and positioned as a hero. The black characters are window dressing, the white characters are the leads. That seems to be the way of it.

Do I think there's a certain amount of straight privilege here? Yes. Will hasn't committed any crimes and it seems people BTS constantly want to shove him off the show. He isn't permitted to participate in love stories the way all the other characters on soaps do and are expected to, given the genre. He spent more time hugging his husband on camera and sitting awkwardly on the opposite side of a sofa with him than in bed with him the last eight years. By comparison we've seen straight couples spend only a couple of months together and get numerous love scenes. The message seems to be here that "gay" is controversial and upsetting to some viewers but "serial killer" isn't. And don't even get me started on the number of rapists that have been on the show, because I've obviously missed most of that history and every time someone references references it here, my jaw drops.

I just find that there's a lot going on behind the scenes of Days of Our Lives that must be impacting stories because the show still feels in many ways like it's stuck in the 80s when it doesn't have to be. There are occasional moments where things seem to have improved, like Gabi and Eli being a couple or Will getting a real love scene, but then it all jumps back to the status quo and certain characters, no matter how dumb the situation is, are given ample screen time and propped up in ways that seem suspicious.

I'm not trying to jump to extremes here, as much as voice how what I've been reading online and seen on screen has impacted my understanding of DAYS.

Bottom line: If it's completely unfathomable that the show would position a black gay serial killer as their hero, then you do have to admit that's because Ben is in a privileged position because of his race and sexual orientation.

...

Davidson does play bemused very well, but she also does passion, sympathy, lust....and rage and regret and panic very well too. Have you ever seen the "you owe me!" scene between her and Stefano from the mid-90s? It was the culmination of two years of storyline and watching her character have a meltdown and begin to process all of the horrible things she had done with her so-called father's encouragement was mesmerizing. If you ever come across some of her earliest scenes with John back during her first few years on the show, you'll see how human Kristen used to be. She was anything but boring and yet she was essentially a good girl character. She and John were extremely compelling.

I agree being cunning and mentally ill are not mutually exclusive. I'm not a lawyer, so I can't be a hundred percent certain of how things work here in the real world, but I don't think anyone can claim mental illness as a defense and avoid jail time if there's evidence that they knew what they were doing was wrong and that they had the time and the foresight to plan out exactly how they were doing it. We saw that Ben had both.

Also, Claire ended up spending more time in Bayview than Ben did. I realize the time jump factors into that, but still, that's what's been presented on the show and that is insanity to me. If Ben had gotten out of prison, say, ten years after the 50th, then even though that still wouldn't have been much time in the real world, considering the way soap time works, I would have felt that was fair. But we've never had much of a breather from Ben. It feels like he murdered these characters very recently, and all of the people of Salem should still have very open wounds regarding him, but now he's reformed and awesome and taking off his shirt. Yay?

Edited July 24, 2020 by DisneyBoy

[Damian]

Thank you so much for your wonderful post, DisneyBoy!

I personally find it baffling that Eli isn't the star of the show. Charismatic actor and legacy character, but nope. We're stuck with the first male mannequin from The Price is Right.

[ByaNose]

25 minutes ago, Damian said:

Thank you so much for your wonderful post, DisneyBoy!

I personally find it baffling that Eli isn't the star of the show. Charismatic actor and legacy character, but nope. We're stuck with the first male mannequin from The Price is Right.

But he was a good mannequin. I was actually surprised he gave up that easy gig. That said, he replaced an actor doing a bad job (at the beginning) and, really made the role of Ben into something. I didn’t care for any of it though. I think the last straw was when Ben asked Will to be his best man. I’m like, “WTF was that???????“. 

[Maelstrom]

22 hours ago, DanaMB said:

Not to be repetitive, but Julie is such a heinous bitch. 

No worries, this can't be repeated enough!

19 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

maybe try something different. Just a thought! 

Days writers: Diff...er..ent? We're not familiar with that word.

17 hours ago, hypnotoad said:

There are plenty of bad characters from soaps that I loved. The writers knew how to have them do bad things and yet keep the audience drawn to them. Roger Thorpe from Guiding Light was a rapist and generally a bad guy but he was complex and interesting. No matter what you wanted to see what he would do next. Think of Adam Chandler or Palmer Cortland on All My Children. Even Jack from this show who started out as a rapist and look where he's ended up.

I would add Todd from OLTL to that list, considering he was about as vile a character as you could imagine early on. They took several years to redeem him, over the course of a couple different storylines, and even afterwards he was never a hero by any stretch of the imagination, something he acknowledged more than anyone. Characters used to be allowed to embody many shades of grey, but these days (and Days is especially bad about this IMO) everyone is either good or bad, black or white, period. It's infuriating to watch.

Edited July 24, 2020 by Maelstrom

[Sandman]

18 minutes ago, Maelstrom said:

Characters used to be allowed to embody many shades of grey, but these days (and Days is especially bad about this IMO) everyone is either good or bad, black or white, period. It's infuriating to watch.

What's worse, once characters have been established -- or rather, declared -- to be good, they're constantly praised and described that way, regardless of how they actually behave. It absolutely is infuriating.

[kitmerlot1213]

I get that Ciara is traumatized but does she truly believe that Claire planted the bomb?  Like Claire said, and according to Ciara logic, Claire somehow assembled a bomb at her grandparents house where her former spy grandpop didn't notice what she was doing.  She then planted it at a church where she knew her dad, and most of her family would be, all because of how much she hates Ciara and wants to ruin her wedding.  It doesn't occur to the new Mrs. Weston that the families/friends of the loved ones Ben killed might want some type of revenge?  

And Ciara really showed her true nature with Claire--she doesn't just accuse Claire of the crime, but instead she sticks the knife in and says the cruelest things possible,   I do like how protective Shawn and Belle were when Ciara started screaming at Claire and Hope looked like she was having trouble with Ciara's actions.  Lastly, I loved how John stated that there was no way Claire could be blamed for the bomb--I guess he hasn't run into Ciara yet.

Edited July 24, 2020 by kitmerlot1213

[Maelstrom]

22 minutes ago, Sandman said:

What's worse, once characters have been established -- or rather, declared -- to be good, they're constantly praised and described that way, regardless of how they actually behave. It absolutely is infuriating.

Yes, yes, yes!! This is my main problem with this show these days.

[wurdalak]

The Salem brain must have been knocked out by the explosion: how could anyone suspect for even a picosecond Claire of all people of being the bomber? She would not possess the knowledge, skills or intelligence necessary to plan the whole thing and put it together so that the bomb would explode at precisely the right moment and produce the exact blast area to do damage without killing anyone, but allow Ben to be spirited away. Not to mention the time necessary to assemble and wire it all. The resources necessary would point more to people in the category of Orpheus or Clyde's associates and competitors in organized crime. Unless one of Salem's "respectable" citizens hired professionals to do the job.

[DaphneCat]

1 hour ago, kitmerlot1213 said:

I get that Ciara is traumatized but does she truly believe that Claire planted the bomb?  Like Claire said, and according to Ciara logic, Claire somehow assembled a bomb at her grandparents house where her former spy grandpop didn't notice what she was doing.  She then planted it at a church where she knew her dad, and most of her family would be, all because of how much she hates Ciara and wants to ruin her wedding.  It doesn't occur to the new Mrs. Weston that the families/friends of the loved ones Ben killed might want some type of revenge?  

And Ciara really showed her true nature with Claire--she doesn't just accuse Claire of the crime, but instead she sticks the knife in and says the cruelest things possible,   I do like how protective Shawn and Belle were when Ciara started screaming at Claire and Hope looked like she was having trouble with Ciara's actions.  Lastly, I loved how John stated that there was no way Claire could be blamed for the bomb--I guess he hasn't run into Ciara yet.

 

55 minutes ago, wurdalak said:

The Salem brain must have been knocked out by the explosion: how could anyone suspect for even a picosecond Claire of all people of being the bomber? She would not possess the knowledge, skills or intelligence necessary to plan the whole thing and put it together so that the bomb would explode at precisely the right moment and produce the exact blast area to do damage without killing anyone, but allow Ben to be spirited away. Not to mention the time necessary to assemble and wire it all. The resources necessary would point more to people in the category of Orpheus or Clyde's associates and competitors in organized crime. Unless one of Salem's "respectable" citizens hired professionals to do the job.

Yes, I really kind of wanted Claire to slap the bitch off Ciara.  And I don't actually think Belle, Shawn, or Hope were being particularly protective or supportive.  They basically just stood there with their mouths open and let Ciara say anything she wanted.  They really should have said something along the lines of "I know you're in shock and hurting but accusing Claire is beyond cruel."  And Claire (or possibly even her parents if they actually were trying to be supportive) REALLY should have pointed out that Ben is actually still a serial killer with a list of enemies as long as your arm.  Even though Ciara may believe he's changed that doesn't mean all his enemies simply go away.

[norcalgal]

3 hours ago, DisneyBoy said:

I do think there's a certain amount of privilege at play there. Is some of it white privilege? Yes. The writers on the show are willing to do all kinds of interesting things with the white characters. Black characters like Abe, Theo, Eli and Lani are written as generic good people and have very few character traits and almost no complex development. Eli's actually a good mirror to Ben because they both have abs, but the actor who plays Eli has a much bigger range. Unfortunately they seem to do nothing with him. The black characters on the show often feel like ciphers, I suspect because the writing staff is probably overwhelmingly white and they're afraid of stepping on any toes by making the black characters less than perfect. So they're all just generically good and in the background and permitted only to marry each other, blacks with blacks and whites with whites style. If Eli turned around and became a serial killer in some way, I sincerely doubt we would still be seeing him on the show five years later, reformed and positioned as a hero. The black characters are window dressing, the white characters are the leads. That seems to be the way of it.

Do I think there's a certain amount of straight privilege here? Yes. Will hasn't committed any crimes and it seems people BTS constantly want to shove him off the show. He isn't permitted to participate in love stories the way all the other characters on soaps do and are expected to, given the genre. He spent more time hugging his husband on camera and sitting awkwardly on the opposite side of a sofa with him than in bed with him the last eight years. By comparison we've seen straight couples spend only a couple of months together and get numerous love scenes. The message seems to be here that "gay" is controversial and upsetting to some viewers but "serial killer" isn't. And don't even get me started on the number of rapists that have been on the show, because I've obviously missed most of that history and every time someone references references it here, my jaw drops.

 

ITA to all this!!!  One of the reasons young people (under 25) don't watch much soap opera these days is because that demo is more open-minded and progressive than the storylines on soaps. The under 25 set grew up in a world that largely accepts the LQBTQ community, and is also accepting of bi-racial relationships. Oh well...

[Pearson80]

9 minutes ago, norcalgal said:

ITA to all this!!!  One of the reasons young people (under 25) don't watch much soap opera these days is because that demo is more open-minded and progressive than the storylines on soaps. The under 25 set grew up in a world that largely accepts the LQBTQ community, and is also accepting of bi-racial relationships. Oh well...

I also wanted to add that shows that are shown on cable and streamed on other platforms show the complexity of people of color and the LGBTQ community.  They are not just about their oppression, it is part of their identity but they are allowed to be human beings flawed and all. To be fair to Days, the show is run by too many people and that stifles creativity...I don't care for Ron but rumor has it that some of his stories have been changed and the suits at NBC are constantly trying to dictate storylines, in addition to Ken Corday and different producers on the show.  A writer should be able to realize their vision..

Edited July 24, 2020 by Pearson80

[Silver Raven]

Bryan Dattilo nailing it in his scene with Allie.

If Ciara thinks that Claire set the bomb, where does she think she has Ben?

 

[peachmangosteen]

43 minutes ago, Silver Raven said:

Bryan Dattilo nailing it in his scene with Allie.

Right! He was SO good! Ugh, give him a contract already, show!

ORK was also fantastic again today. I wish Claire had just one friend or person who truly believes her. Gwen doesn't count since imo it always came off like she wanted Claire to still be crazy for some reason and also she has apparently been taken out of the Claire story so she can fuck Jake for no reason.

Shawn, I think, said something about Ben having so many enemies in the town. Really? Name one! Because all I see is people practically falling all over themselves to tell everyone how awesome he is now. 

Ciara is awful. VK is always just so full of smugness that it's just impossible to ever feel anything but contempt for Ciara imo.

[Irlandesa]

I thought VK was actually good in the initial confrontation with Claire but yeah, then the smug crept back in.  I mean just a small change where she considers how messed up her logic is could go a long way before she fixates on Claire again because it just has to be her (the idea of an unknown is a scarier prospect).

I can kind of get why she might think it's Claire but her logic makes no sense.  She thinks this was because Claire was booted from the wedding?  Didn't that just take place about a day before the wedding?  So does she think Claire became this expert bomb builder in the day after she was booted from the wedding? 

And then knew Claire would be willing to risk her loved ones...risk that no one would step outside or open the doors in prep for the happy couple? 

And where does she think 100 lb Claire dragged a strong (if conscious) or dead weight (if not) man off to?

 

Edited July 24, 2020 by Irlandesa

[RunningMarket]

2 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

I thought VK was actually good in the initial confrontation with Claire but yeah, then the smug crept back in.  I mean just a small change where she considers how messed up her logic is could go a long way before she fixates on Claire again because it just has to be her (the idea of an unknown is a scarier prospect).

I can kind of get why she might think it's Claire but her logic makes no sense.  She thinks this was because Claire was booted from the wedding?  Didn't that just take place about a day before the wedding?  So does she think Claire became this expert bomb builder in the day after she was booted from the wedding? 

And then knew Claire would be willing to risk her loved ones...risk that no one would step outside or open the doors in prep for the happy couple? 

And where does she think 100 lb Claire dragged a strong (if conscious) or dead weight (if not) man off to?

 

It was the morning of the wedding, which makes your argument even stronger.

[enchantingmonkey]

Some good scenes at Marlena's penthouse.  I loved how each character was placed in an unenviable position, and especially how Belle and Shawn talking about Claire when they thought she was in another room really came back to bite them in the ass.  Ciara is being driven by raw emotion, so while I'll agree that there's little logic behind believing Claire planted the bomb, I also understand why she'd make those claims with such vitriol.  

The Allie and Lucas scenes were quite charming.  

At least Sami had one line about how she knew she was going about things all wrong in her conversation with Rafe.  They're laying it on a little thick with how they're all victims in the presence of Sami.  

That was first time I've watched an entire episode in weeks.  My Fast-Forward finger didn't know what to do with itself!  

[CanaryFan98]

The show manages to find its groove around this time of year then it quickly loses this momentum by the time October hits.

[tribeca]

Lumi little family ❤️
Allie is strange with her mom.  Know Sami can be a PIA but even when she just tried to be loving Allie moved away.  Kind of like a little kid who does not want a hug from her parents.  

[Frozendiva]

I understand that Ciara is running high on emotions - wedding day, the bomb going off, her husband missing and presumed dead, she's covered in soot - although rather strategically as her chest was nicely contoured with the black crap. Blaming Claire is a bit much. She is living with her grandparents and surely John or Doc would have noticed her new bomb-building hobby or unusual parcels coming to the door. However, she did disappear for a bit before the wedding so she really doesn't have an alibi. Claire may have spiked the drink, or somehow pocketed the ring. Getting nail polish on the dress would really take a lot of effort as the bottle is tiny. When one of my bottles leaked, maybe just a drop the size of a dime leaked out. Ciara went from understandable in terms of unimaginable grief and horror to smug. And then finding the hotel room all decked out and she is in her dirty dress and bloody bandage.

Claire may have helped out in terms of the bomb but she is not an ISA agent like Orpheus who would know how to rig something like that so no one is killed. That takes sophistication.

Perhaps someone can check out the Kidnap Kabin or the Horton cabin to see if Ben is stashed there. Or the Hideout Hotel or DiMera tunnels.

Allie sure doesn't want her mother anywhere near her. Lucas and Sami, of course, overreacted. Sami really doesn't get a vote as to who Allie chooses to adopt her child. She can give advice and that's it. Hopefully Allie has got a release from the bio dad so the adoption can take place.

[Pearson80]

1 hour ago, Frozendiva said:

Allie sure doesn't want her mother anywhere near her. Lucas and Sami, of course, overreacted. Sami really doesn't get a vote as to who Allie chooses to adopt her child. She can give advice and that's it. Hopefully Allie has got a release from the bio dad so the adoption can take place.

Why is Allie willing to give up her child to Rafe and not her parents.. Sami and Lucas would raise him or her, not to mention Kate.. Allie is just not sympathetic to me.. She is shrill entitled and nasty.. I did love Lucas coming to Sami's defense when speaking to her, Nobody knows Sami as well as him. Lumi just makes so damn sense, I wish Ron would give us Lumi fans some crumbs.. You have Lumily together, why not write some family scenes between Lumi, their kids,  granddaughter Arianna and unborn grandchild. Ron just sucks..

Edited July 25, 2020 by Pearson80

[DaphneCat]

1 hour ago, Frozendiva said:

Hopefully Allie has got a release from the bio dad so the adoption can take place.

Nope, she refuses to talk about the father.  This strikes me as a MAJOR anvil - he's going to show up.

[SueB]

I’m just over Sami being so ‘terrifying’ and then living up to the rep.  Unnecessary secrecy about Rafe is also the worst. 
 

I thought VK did a good job.  Shawn was an MVP. My heart hurt for Claire that she had to be the one to point out how unrealistic it would be for her to make and plant a bomb.  That morning she was in the wedding ... what, she ran to the Home Depot and picked up C4 at lunch?

[boes]

I don't know if VK has any talent or not.  That may be because of the crap storyline she's been stuck in ever since Show decided to sacrifice this character on the altar of mind-numbing mediocrity called Ben Weston, or she just may be a rotten actor.

In any case, she sure stunk today, hulking around in that wedding dress like she was going to suddenly turn green, bulk up and go on Salem rampage like the Hulk.  If she's not screeching "Ben" at the top of her lungs, sneering at people who don't light candles to his image, she's smugging her way through another scene with whoever is on the receiving end of her contempt that day.   

Of course Claire didn't build any bomb, but that sort of coherency is apparently beyond the granddaughter Victor thinks so highly of that he's put in a position of authority at Titan.  After her unhinged, ugly rant, I'm hoping Claire takes a bomb making class ASAP and plans something really special for Ciara's next event.  

It's sure not hard to tell that Julie and Ciara are related.  Just listen to the screeching.

If Ben was blown to smithereens, maybe Ciara can gather the parts and just make a new one?  

God, Ally, just shut up.  I guess it's been fine for your mother to finance your life and all your little rich girl foibles, but it's just the worst thing ever for her or anyone else to actually hold you liable for your choices.  

Edited July 25, 2020 by boes

[Rafael]

12 hours ago, Damian said:

Thank you so much for your wonderful post, DisneyBoy!

I personally find it baffling that Eli isn't the star of the show. Charismatic actor and legacy character, but nope. We're stuck with the first male mannequin from The Price is Right.

Also he is Brady 's peer as well . He should be at the forefront as the young leading man alongside Eric and Brady. Plus Eli is the living legacy of the show's most controversial pairing of David Banning and Valerie. 

[Rafael]

11 hours ago, kitmerlot1213 said:

.  It doesn't occur to the new Mrs. Weston that the families/friends of the loved ones Ben killed might want some type of revenge?  

 

Yeas, perhaps Serena's parents or siblings hired a hitman to kill ben. Or perhaps Wendy's offspring . Or God forbid ,Eve and Eduardo are itiching for some payback. .

Seriously cant stand this Ciara !!! Ugh !!!

[Rafael]

10 hours ago, Pearson80 said:

To be fair to Days, the show is run by too many people and that stifles creativity...I don't care for Ron but rumor has it that some of his stories have been changed and the suits at NBC are constantly trying to dictate storylines, in addition to Ken Corday and different producers on the show.  A writer should be able to realize their vision..

Ron is creative ? I dont think so . I Highly doubt the unaltered stories he wrote were groundbreaking .

Perhaps the suits can recognise what a whack writer he is and are trying to neutralise  his whack  ideas . Only G0d knows what they were.  

His vision? The guy has no shame plagiarising himself . And he plagiarises JER as well .  He aint got no vision . 

And he makes rubbish decisions like killing Bill Horton instead of finally letting Tommy Horton jr RIP ,A character who hasnt appeared since the early 1980s. The actor who played tommy died during the 1990s and the character is still inexplicably alive . You think the TIIC wrote this ? I doubt it . 

Lets not talk about the Diane Collville debacle and faux Rex Brady debacle and the groundbreaking story of Stefano now having 6 long lost kids .  Carlivati did all this . TIIC are at fault to a certain extent but its plainly obvious that the bulk of whack characterisations and storylines came straight outta his brain. 

I

 

[Rafael]

2 hours ago, Pearson80 said:

Why is Allie willing to give up her child to Rafe and not her parents.. Sami and Lucas would raise him or her, not to mention Kate.. Allie is just not sympathetic to me.. She is shrill entitled and nasty.. I did love Lucas coming to Sami's defense when speaking to her, Nobody knows Sami as well as him. Lumi just makes so damn sense, I wish Ron would give us Lumi fans some crumbs.. You have Lumily together, why not write some family scenes between Lumi, their kids,  granddaughter Arianna and unborn grandchild. Ron just sucks..

Allie's pregnancy storyline is just rubbish.

Yes  ,the only thing I like about it is that it includes Lucas and Sami interacting 

Il say it again , she should have been Eric and Nicole's surrogate .

Hell  , she could have even been Sonny and Will's Surrogate implanted with Sonny's sperm via IVF  and carried the baby to term . Both Sonny and Will would then have their own bio offspring and raise both Arianna and Sonny and Allie' s bio kid as siblings. But that might be abit much though. I dont know..

But i much rather prefer the Eric and Nicole route because it would have been super dramatic . Why? Sami hates Nicole and Nicole hates sami . Lucas used to be married to Nicole as well   .and Erics dad Roman once had a one night stand with nicole and he would be supporting Allie's decision to carry Eric and Nicoles son because "its about time I had a grandchild whose surname is Brady".

So much potential for drama . Not that Eric should know about his dad and Nicoles one night stand . 

Allie would be doing it for uncle Eric because he has been through hell and deserves some stability and fulfillment in life by raising a son. You know something like that .  Allie carries the baby boy to term and Eric names him Augustus John Brady after his dads ,John Black and Roman Augustus Brady. 

The boys nickname would be AJ when he grown up. There you have it. 

But hell nah ,Ron copied himself again and took the  " who is Jordan's baby daddy "storyline and applied it to Allie. 

Edited July 25, 2020 by Rafael

[katie9918]

Quite frankly, I’m not a fan of Julie and am different to Gabi, who Ron seems determined to keep shoving down our throats and who keeps doing the sam me shit and who keeps getting away with it for some reason.

 

And Gabi keeps targeting Lani and Eli for no good reason.

 

Gabi is a hypocrite.

Edited July 25, 2020 by katie9918

[peachmangosteen]

9 hours ago, DaphneCat said:

Nope, she refuses to talk about the father.  This strikes me as a MAJOR anvil - he's going to show up.

Or the writers just haven't decided who it is yet lol.

[boes]

9 hours ago, DaphneCat said:

Nope, she refuses to talk about the father.  This strikes me as a MAJOR anvil - he's going to show up.

 

47 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

Or the writers just haven't decided who it is yet lol.

I'm hoping it turns out to be Andre or someone equally ridiculous.  

[Katy M]

2 hours ago, boes said:

I'm hoping it turns out to be Andre or someone equally ridiculous. 

Lawrence Alamain?  Brandon Walker?  Sami's ex. Nicole's brother.  I'm liking it.  Phillip Kiriakis?  Just because.

[lb60]

I really could not take Ciara and Ben's shoe seriously on Friday. I thought everyone else did a good job, but I just wanted Ciara to STFU, take herself and Ben's shoe back to the Salem Inn, for a fabulous wedding night. 

I'm glad that Rafe turned Allie down, but someone really needs to address the fact that the father has RIGHTS! I agree with posters that have said they probably have no clue who the father is going to be. Stefano could use another kid, huh?

I'll show myself out.